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[DC Comics]: Crisis on Infinite #Rebirths

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Posts

  • SorceSorce Not ThereRegistered User regular
    edited May 2016
    Inverse interviews Geoff Johns about Rebirth.
    Johns believes, correctly, that the core message of Watchmen was grossly misunderstood and manipulated in decades following its release. The comic, Johns believes, was a warning not to become disillusioned with the values that have defined DC from the beginning: justice, legacies, epic storytelling, love. Watchmen was not an instruction manual for writing contemporary hero comics.

    Sorce on
    sig.gif
    jdarksunOptimusZedThorn413Devlin_Dragonus
  • Linespider5Linespider5 ALL HAIL KING KILLMONGER Registered User regular
    Not sure how I feel about this.

  • vagrant_windsvagrant_winds Overworked Mysterious Eldritch Horror Hunter XX Registered User regular
    /co/ keeps talking about how this ties into Multiversity and is having insane Hypercrisis theories. It's /popcorn worthy.

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  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    /co/ keeps talking about how this ties into Multiversity and is having insane Hypercrisis theories. It's /popcorn worthy.

    Oh man, DC needs to stop doing this whenever they have a universal reboot. It just confuses everyone.

  • ArmorocArmoroc Registered User regular
    /co/ keeps talking about how this ties into Multiversity and is having insane Hypercrisis theories. It's /popcorn worthy.

    I've never heard of this /co/and its hypercrisis.... I'll go and take a peak at what it's about

  • DouglasDangerDouglasDanger PennsylvaniaRegistered User regular
    Armoroc wrote: »
    /co/ keeps talking about how this ties into Multiversity and is having insane Hypercrisis theories. It's /popcorn worthy.

    I've never heard of this /co/and its hypercrisis.... I'll go and take a peak at what it's about

    /co is part of 4 Chan fyi

  • Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    /co/ is a shithole, I would not recommend visiting.

    jdarksunUltimateInfernoDasUberEdwardfrandelgearslip
  • WiseManTobesWiseManTobes Registered User regular
    Armoroc wrote: »
    /co/ keeps talking about how this ties into Multiversity and is having insane Hypercrisis theories. It's /popcorn worthy.

    I've never heard of this /co/and its hypercrisis.... I'll go and take a peak at what it's about

    hqdefault.jpg

    Steam! Battlenet:Wisemantobes#1508
  • RansRans Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    So far I seem to be in the minority that (Rebirth spoilers):
    Dr. Manhattan is the cause of it all is dumb and that bringing Watchmen into it is typical Johns not able to keep his hands off any of the toys. It's his typical "write subtlety with a hammer" approach. "Let's restore hope and optimism to the DCU by fighting a literal avatar of pessimism and grimdarkness!!!" Can't we just write better stories that celebrate hope and optimism? Why the insistence on having a (poorly disguised) meta commentary?

    Anyway.

    Superman talk:
    This preview from Newsarama spoils completely the end of Superman #52 and the beginning of the new Superman series by Tomasi. http://www.newsarama.com/29418-superman-52-leads-into-a-new-status-quo-for-rebirth.html

    It's implied that there is a mystery here. Why, if the new 52 is NOT a parallel reality to the Pre-Flashpoint universe but is actually the pre-Flashpoint universe that's just been mucked with by a time-stealing Dr. Manhattan - why are there two Supermen? How can pre-flashpoint Superman exist separately from new 52 Superman? Tomasi says they'll ask those questions. So there may be more to the death of New 52 Superman than just clearing the deck for pre-flashpoint Superman.

    Doesn't change my opinion, though. I'm still ending my Superman collection with Superman #52 and just continuing on with the GL stuff. Reducing my monthly DC spending from something like ~$37 a month to ~$12 a month. Appreciative towards DC for providing this jumping off point so I can buy more Image comics. :)

    Rans on
    Linespider5jkylefultonRorshach Kringle
  • SorceSorce Not ThereRegistered User regular
    Rans wrote: »
    So far I seem to be in the minority that (Rebirth spoilers):
    Dr. Manhattan is the cause of it all is dumb and that bringing Watchmen into it is typical Johns not able to keep his hands off any of the toys. It's his typical "write subtlety with a hammer" approach. "Let's restore hope and optimism to the DCU by fighting a literal avatar of pessimism and grimdarkness!!!" Can't we just write better stories that celebrate hope and optimism? Why the insistence on having a (poorly disguised) meta commentary?
    Because it's probably more of a swipe at Didio/Harras than just getting everyone off the grimdark. He's trying to prove to them that hope and happiness works as an idea in comics instead of what they've been doubling down on.

    sig.gif
  • vagrant_windsvagrant_winds Overworked Mysterious Eldritch Horror Hunter XX Registered User regular
    Sorce wrote: »
    Rans wrote: »
    So far I seem to be in the minority that (Rebirth spoilers):
    Dr. Manhattan is the cause of it all is dumb and that bringing Watchmen into it is typical Johns not able to keep his hands off any of the toys. It's his typical "write subtlety with a hammer" approach. "Let's restore hope and optimism to the DCU by fighting a literal avatar of pessimism and grimdarkness!!!" Can't we just write better stories that celebrate hope and optimism? Why the insistence on having a (poorly disguised) meta commentary?
    Because it's probably more of a swipe at Didio/Harras than just getting everyone off the grimdark. He's trying to prove to them that hope and happiness works as an idea in comics instead of what they've been doubling down on.

    It also directly goes along...
    The exact same meta commentary from Multiversity (Morrison).

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  • SorceSorce Not ThereRegistered User regular
    I'm just glad Rucka's back at DC, even if it's just for 12 issues. Even more glad that those 12 issues are on Wonder Woman.

    sig.gif
    vagrant_winds
  • Doctor DetroitDoctor Detroit Registered User regular
    Rans wrote: »
    So far I seem to be in the minority that (Rebirth spoilers):
    Dr. Manhattan is the cause of it all is dumb and that bringing Watchmen into it is typical Johns not able to keep his hands off any of the toys. It's his typical "write subtlety with a hammer" approach. "Let's restore hope and optimism to the DCU by fighting a literal avatar of pessimism and grimdarkness!!!" Can't we just write better stories that celebrate hope and optimism? Why the insistence on having a (poorly disguised) meta commentary?

    Um, doesn't that pretty much describe what Morrison was trying to do with Darkseid and Final Crisis?



  • lionheart_mlionheart_m Registered User regular
    Sorce wrote: »
    Rans wrote: »
    So far I seem to be in the minority that (Rebirth spoilers):
    Dr. Manhattan is the cause of it all is dumb and that bringing Watchmen into it is typical Johns not able to keep his hands off any of the toys. It's his typical "write subtlety with a hammer" approach. "Let's restore hope and optimism to the DCU by fighting a literal avatar of pessimism and grimdarkness!!!" Can't we just write better stories that celebrate hope and optimism? Why the insistence on having a (poorly disguised) meta commentary?
    Because it's probably more of a swipe at Didio/Harras than just getting everyone off the grimdark. He's trying to prove to them that hope and happiness works as an idea in comics instead of what they've been doubling down on.

    It also directly goes along...
    The exact same meta commentary from Multiversity (Morrison).

    Um...could you spoil Multiversity @vagrant_winds ??? :)

    3DS: 5069-4122-2826 / WiiU: Lionheart-m / PSN: lionheart_m / Steam: lionheart_jg
  • vagrant_windsvagrant_winds Overworked Mysterious Eldritch Horror Hunter XX Registered User regular
    Sorce wrote: »
    Rans wrote: »
    So far I seem to be in the minority that (Rebirth spoilers):
    Dr. Manhattan is the cause of it all is dumb and that bringing Watchmen into it is typical Johns not able to keep his hands off any of the toys. It's his typical "write subtlety with a hammer" approach. "Let's restore hope and optimism to the DCU by fighting a literal avatar of pessimism and grimdarkness!!!" Can't we just write better stories that celebrate hope and optimism? Why the insistence on having a (poorly disguised) meta commentary?
    Because it's probably more of a swipe at Didio/Harras than just getting everyone off the grimdark. He's trying to prove to them that hope and happiness works as an idea in comics instead of what they've been doubling down on.

    It also directly goes along...
    The exact same meta commentary from Multiversity (Morrison).

    Um...could you spoil Multiversity @vagrant_winds ??? :)

    Nah. It's literally one of the single best comics that DC has put out during their 'New52' era. You should read it. :D

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    Armoroc
  • lionheart_mlionheart_m Registered User regular
    But but...9 issues! I need a Comixology sale....

    3DS: 5069-4122-2826 / WiiU: Lionheart-m / PSN: lionheart_m / Steam: lionheart_jg
    Armorocvagrant_winds
  • glithertglithert Registered User regular
    But but...9 issues! I need a Comixology sale....

    What you need is to read Multiversity.

    Real talk though it's amazing

    Armorocvagrant_winds
  • ArmorocArmoroc Registered User regular
    But but...9 issues! I need a Comixology sale....

    Once you read it.... you are gonna want more... just read it and cherish what you get.

    vagrant_winds
  • vagrant_windsvagrant_winds Overworked Mysterious Eldritch Horror Hunter XX Registered User regular
    But but...9 issues! I need a Comixology sale....

    Well, the other best things in the New52 (Fully IMO) are Azzarello's Wonder Woman (26 issues), Morrison's Action Comics (13 issues) and Snyder/Tynion IV's Batman & Robin Forever (26 issues).

    So 9 issues and a guidebook isn't so bad!

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  • AspectVoidAspectVoid Registered User regular
    I read Rebirth.
    It really nailed the emotional impact of Wally and his return, so that's good. But there was a huge chunk of "Sigh, Geoff Johns" through a large portion of it that annoyed me. I'm leaning toward it being a wash.

    PSN|AspectVoid
  • vagrant_windsvagrant_winds Overworked Mysterious Eldritch Horror Hunter XX Registered User regular
    I legitimately got all teary eyed when reading Rebirth.

    This is what superheroes are about: saving people.

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    Devlin_Dragonus
  • RansRans Registered User regular
    Yo, whatever about Rebirth. Who wants to talk about Omega Men? It just kept getting better and better all the way to the end. Great, fantastic, delightfully complicated Kyle Rayner story. And it was a Kyle Rayner story. Who he is and what he's been through mattered. You couldn't have just plugged any Lantern in as the lead - the outcome of the story would have had to have been different.

  • vagrant_windsvagrant_winds Overworked Mysterious Eldritch Horror Hunter XX Registered User regular
    Rans wrote: »
    Yo, whatever about Rebirth. Who wants to talk about Omega Men? It just kept getting better and better all the way to the end. Great, fantastic, delightfully complicated Kyle Rayner story. And it was a Kyle Rayner story. Who he is and what he's been through mattered. You couldn't have just plugged any Lantern in as the lead - the outcome of the story would have had to have been different.

    Haven't read the final issue yet, but you have me hyped.

    // Steam: VWinds // PSN: vagrant_winds //
    // Switch: SW-5306-0651-6424 //
  • DasUberEdwardDasUberEdward Registered User regular
    Am I missing a thing worth not missing or is it a thing that I can just check out a few sentences of in summary at a later date because it'll be glossed over?

    steam_sig.png
  • TexiKenTexiKen Dammit! That fish really got me!Registered User regular
    If you have connection to the old times, the good years of 2011 and before, it's a nice shot of hope for DC.

    I keep using this as my go to response to the comic but it's an alcoholic admitting they have a problem and looking to fix it. It opens up the door for the old stuff to come back better than you expect and the reveal actually works here. There's some WTFness where they clearly just cleaned the slate from all the teases of the first year of DCnU but overall I am excited for DC again.

    Killing off Pandora was straight up admitting they made a mistake there. Did they ever introduce Lady Luck who was plastered on the JL roster poster in the early months of DCnU?

    I get a feeling they might retcon what we think is regular Superman and family into not being regular Superman, if only to make way for everyone remembering their old selves. It also makes sense since they didn't have Wally gravitate to Superman at all, even though it should have been the same guy he's known, putting him just below Barry and Linda (and the Linda scene was heartbreaking). Barry and Wally's scene was equally happy and the moment the book sold me on it.

    The JSA thing was a nice reveal, and Ryan Choi's reappearance was nice to see, and just the legacy acknowledgements. Plus the reverse legacy of Ted Kord reappearing to be Jaime's sidekick almost was a neat touch.

    No idea what happened with Darkseid and really don't care, he's been done to death.

    The running theory that this darkness is some game/experiment being played between Ozymandias and Dr. Manhattan has potential and a clear out for this, both in bringing back the lost time and keeping what they want, and could even just be a new stand-in for Anti-Monitor.

    I will say Deadshot's new Suicide Squad costume looks super stupid, like someone mocking Lee's old 90's armor and guns SHIELD/Image designs.



    Superman #52 also ended well, a good sendoff to everyone close to Superman and recognizing while he did "die" this is comics so it's not super serious and even everyone thinks that way too.

    Armoroc
  • DasUberEdwardDasUberEdward Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    That's pretty much when I was reading comics regularly.

    Let's pop back into the fold.

    (some of the art looks wonderful.)

    DasUberEdward on
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  • UnbrokenEvaUnbrokenEva HIGH ON THE WIRE BUT I WON'T TRIP ITRegistered User regular
    Sorce wrote: »
    Inverse interviews Geoff Johns about Rebirth.
    Johns believes, correctly, that the core message of Watchmen was grossly misunderstood and manipulated in decades following its release. The comic, Johns believes, was a warning not to become disillusioned with the values that have defined DC from the beginning: justice, legacies, epic storytelling, love. Watchmen was not an instruction manual for writing contemporary hero comics.

    What makes this really interesting to me is that The Original Author of the characters behind Rebirth feels largely the same way
    Alan Moore wrote:
    I don’t think that the world needs that many brooding psychopathic avengers. I don’t know that we need any. It was a disappointment to me, how Watchmen was absorbed into the mainstream. It had originally been meant as an indication of what people could do that was new. I’d originally thought that with works like Watchmen and Marvelman, I’d be able to say, “Look, this is what you can do with these stale old concepts. You can turn them on their heads. You can really wake them up. Don’t be so limited in your thinking. Use your imagination.” And, I was naively hoping that there’d be a rush of fresh and original work by people coming up with their own. But, as I said, it was meant to be something that would liberate comics. Instead, it became this massive stumbling block that comics can’t even really seem to get around to this day. They’ve lost a lot of their original innocence, and they can’t get that back. And, they’re stuck, it seems, in this kind of depressive ghetto of grimness and psychosis. I’m not too proud of being the author of that regrettable trend.

    Sorcelionheart_mShadowenInvectivus
  • MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    So I read Rebirth after some hype online.

    I haven't really been too invested in comics since, lets say about when 52 was going on, which I liked a lot, but it turned to crap after. I stopped reading stuff entirely a few years ago when it became apparent that neither DC nor Marvel was interested in a decent online delivery system. (In my book, not as expensive as paper books, and not 6 months behind)

    I liked it. But someone needs to explain one thing to me.
    What the hell is up with baby Darkseid.

    MuddBudd on
    There's no plan, there's no race to be run
    The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
  • darkmayodarkmayo Registered User regular
    MuddBudd wrote: »
    So I read Rebirth after some hype online.

    I haven't really been too invested in comics since, lets say about when 52 was going on, which I liked a lot, but it turned to crap after. I stopped reading stuff entirely a few years ago when it became apparent that neither DC nor Marvel was interested in a decent online delivery system. (In my book, not as expensive as paper books, and not 6 months behind)

    I liked it. But someone needs to explain one thing to me.
    What the hell is up with baby Darkseid.
    They are priming the pumps for a spin off done by Jim Henson's Creature Shop.. New Gods Babies.

    Switch SW-6182-1526-0041
  • Mr.SunshineMr.Sunshine Registered User regular
    Fearghaill wrote: »
    Sorce wrote: »
    Inverse interviews Geoff Johns about Rebirth.
    Johns believes, correctly, that the core message of Watchmen was grossly misunderstood and manipulated in decades following its release. The comic, Johns believes, was a warning not to become disillusioned with the values that have defined DC from the beginning: justice, legacies, epic storytelling, love. Watchmen was not an instruction manual for writing contemporary hero comics.

    What makes this really interesting to me is that The Original Author of the characters behind Rebirth feels largely the same way
    Alan Moore wrote:
    I don’t think that the world needs that many brooding psychopathic avengers. I don’t know that we need any. It was a disappointment to me, how Watchmen was absorbed into the mainstream. It had originally been meant as an indication of what people could do that was new. I’d originally thought that with works like Watchmen and Marvelman, I’d be able to say, “Look, this is what you can do with these stale old concepts. You can turn them on their heads. You can really wake them up. Don’t be so limited in your thinking. Use your imagination.” And, I was naively hoping that there’d be a rush of fresh and original work by people coming up with their own. But, as I said, it was meant to be something that would liberate comics. Instead, it became this massive stumbling block that comics can’t even really seem to get around to this day. They’ve lost a lot of their original innocence, and they can’t get that back. And, they’re stuck, it seems, in this kind of depressive ghetto of grimness and psychosis. I’m not too proud of being the author of that regrettable trend.

    B-But DARKNESS, NO PARENTS! More adult... etc...

  • lunchbox12682lunchbox12682 MinnesotaRegistered User regular
    edited May 2016
    darkmayo wrote: »
    MuddBudd wrote: »
    So I read Rebirth after some hype online.

    I haven't really been too invested in comics since, lets say about when 52 was going on, which I liked a lot, but it turned to crap after. I stopped reading stuff entirely a few years ago when it became apparent that neither DC nor Marvel was interested in a decent online delivery system. (In my book, not as expensive as paper books, and not 6 months behind)

    I liked it. But someone needs to explain one thing to me.
    What the hell is up with baby Darkseid.
    They are priming the pumps for a spin off done by Jim Henson's Creature Shop.. New Gods Babies.
    I would watch the shit out of that!

    lunchbox12682 on
    Martini_Philosopher
  • lionheart_mlionheart_m Registered User regular
    Hmm...Superman Rebirth feels so skipable. I mean, it was cool seeing this Lana interact with old Supes but I feel like I should've held out for Action Comics.

    3DS: 5069-4122-2826 / WiiU: Lionheart-m / PSN: lionheart_m / Steam: lionheart_jg
  • TairuTairu Registered User regular
    edited June 2016
    I feel like Superman will be the better title of the two, though

    Tomasi/Gleason/Mahnke is a winning trio, i've already forgotten who is on Action Comics

    Tairu on
  • lionheart_mlionheart_m Registered User regular
    You're probably right. I do want to pick both issues and then decide which one I'll stick with. I still have Batman Rebirth in front of me but I *gasp* I just want to see what CW2 is about.

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  • TexiKenTexiKen Dammit! That fish really got me!Registered User regular
    Supes Rebirth was fine but nothing to make it stand out in a Rebirth way, outside of the nice touch with the pillars of the Fortress of Solitude.

    Mahnke's flashback pages of our Superman fighting Doomsday were really great.

    Tairulionheart_m
  • lionheart_mlionheart_m Registered User regular
    I think Batman Rebirth was better. But man, after DC Rebirth 1 these issues feel so short :P

    3DS: 5069-4122-2826 / WiiU: Lionheart-m / PSN: lionheart_m / Steam: lionheart_jg
    TexiKen
  • lionheart_mlionheart_m Registered User regular
    There's something about Jurgens' writing I can't quite place but it's instantly recognizable. Definitely looking forward to Action 958 (in two weeks!).

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    TexiKenArmoroc
  • vagrant_windsvagrant_winds Overworked Mysterious Eldritch Horror Hunter XX Registered User regular
    You know, after reading Action, I'm with Lex on this one. New52 Lex has been trying to be a better person since Forever Evil.

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    TexiKenArmoroc
  • TexiKenTexiKen Dammit! That fish really got me!Registered User regular
    Action 957 was good, and Jurgens has a good handle on story structure which makes it accessible (identifies people, and because he's an artist himself he lets the artist do his own storytelling along with the words for basically twice the information, such as the whole scene of Clark getting ready to don the suit).

    And I agree Lex is actually right here, but our Clark can't accept it and screws up his maiden appearance in public. That's a nice way to introduce him here; he has answers, we know he's the bomb diggity, but how do you get that across without being a super jerk instead of the hero he knows he is?

    As for the ending:
    nice use of Jurgens to connect old Doomsday to go with his most notable story, but I guess this is going to lead into the whole Watchmen pulling the strings overarching plot. If the idea as mentioned in Rebirth is they cut out ten years, the outside anomalies like realSuperman need to be dealt with things picked from their old world, and that if someone like Clark and Wally know the truth, they have this clipboard of villains/events to push into this new world. That's maybe spitballing the whole thing and I still don't know if they would actually plan it out that long or intelligently.

    Zircher's art was always good (and him being here makes me think of Luthor as Zemo from the Nicieza/Zircher Thunderbolts run), so I'm actually looking forward to the next issue.

    vagrant_windslionheart_mArmoroc
  • TexiKenTexiKen Dammit! That fish really got me!Registered User regular
    Superman #1 was interesting. It looks like the story here is going to mainly be from Jon's POV and how you try and live in your dad's shadow, with your own powers and that responsibility. It does have a death in it which is kind of ugh but I trust Tomasi to build on it more, particularly with how it ties into Jon learning his powers. But the last few pages are what made it work really. It's a little spotty compared to Action #957 in terms of trying to be all over the place with Jon and Clark (very light hints of it reflecting the Batman/Damian dynamic from Morrison's old arc), but I like the setup.

    Gleason's art is a little spotty in places but he has three pages that really stand out: The Superman splash page covering the history of the man to now (with the American flag to boot I really liked that), Saving the animals from the barnfire, and the spooky way heroes can look to a kid at night. I'll try and put up some pages for MTOW later.

    lionheart_m
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