What's the deal with all the "broken promises" chatter I keep seeing, did they change plans for something?
They announced some stuff, and then made changes. Basically, entitled whiners who haven't even played the alpha/beta doing what they do best on the internet.
I think he was asking about what specifically people where whining about. I can't think of anything off the top of my head they've really gone back on recently. Garrisons were toned down somewhat from their obviously over ambitious announcement but they still sound good to me.
Thats... really big news. I wonder who's going to fill his shoes.
0
reVerseAttack and Dethrone GodRegistered Userregular
The Blizzard community is ultimately the reason why we come to work every day
Hey guys, I think I figured out why he's leaving.
+5
HalfmexI mock your value systemYou also appear foolish in the eyes of othersRegistered Userregular
Hm, that's interesting. Rob was reportedly brought back to be the lead designer on WoD so this news is a bit of a shock. That's not a decision one makes lightly.
I'm more curious than ever to know what's going on there at Blizzard.
So I thought AV was a long wait for Alliance at 90? Most of my queues were 4-6 minutes last night, and all of them were wins.
Of course, now I'm one of those guys who is running around with two 522 PVP daggers that are enchanted, with a bunch of blues and greens otherwise :rotate:
0
SkwigelfPassed out in a cloud of farts and cigarette smoke.Registered Userregular
So I thought AV was a long wait for Alliance at 90? Most of my queues were 4-6 minutes last night, and all of them were wins.
Of course, now I'm one of those guys who is running around with two 522 PVP daggers that are enchanted, with a bunch of blues and greens otherwise :rotate:
AV and Isle of Conquest are, from what I've seen, the only BGs where Alliance dominates. Most Alliance specifically queue for those two BGs and get in in under 5 minutes, while Horde just random queues and sits in 10-20 minute queues.
The gold bar is the win ratio. AV and IoC are both around 75-85% Alliance. Strand of the Ancients is the only one that Horde regularly dominates, while the rest are around 55-60% Horde
Oh I was aware that it was a heavy ally win battleground, I was just under the impression that alliance had a 20 min wait in the battleground as most horde avoid it like the plague as soon as they figure out blacklisting
Which made the forum peasants grab their torches and pitchforks and prompting blizzard to issue a more fleshed out statement and apparently this is totally unacceptable because something something karabor and the black temple. The capitals aren't going to be in the ashran pvp zone but instead adjacent to them, so we can get our race war on when we have had a few and realize dwarves do not deserve to live.
Yeah I'm not sure there are any actual gameplay ramifications to this change, it's all just lolore. I admit, I do prefer the faction hubs not being right next door, but there's definitely some disconnect that's cause a downright irrational amount of backlash.
HalfmexI mock your value systemYou also appear foolish in the eyes of othersRegistered Userregular
Well I mean let's be fair here - the devs have done an, some would say, unreasonable (or at the very least uncharacteristic) amount of revisions/backtracking in this expansion compared to those previous. I mean yes, in Wrath there was the famously-advertised-then-dropped Dance Studio, then in Cataclysm there was the Path of the Titans, so that stuff does happen. In WoD though, there's been a number of things that were talked about in Blizzcon that have either been scrapped, re-worked or delayed. The decision to move the faction hubs to Ashran (which seems to be the major focal point of this expansion for the devs - they're heavily incentivizing it) would probably have been fine on its own, but the fact that the hubs themselves seem like very poor replacements (heavily re-used assets of what appears at least at the moment to be versions of the Krasarang Wilds holds) for what was described as being these huge, shrine-like cities that we'd get to occupy as faction hubs. The capital cities thing I think wouldn't have even been that big a deal had it not come on the heels of things like the not being able to place/move garrisons, garrisons size/scope being reduced from the original design, the Heirloom tab being pushed to sometime post-6.0 and the ping-ponging decision of "will we/won't we and when" of flying in the new content that has gotten a number of people on edge. Add to that the bizarre pace at which development seems to be moving since Blizzcon last November and it at least makes sense to me why some people might be a bit annoyed.
I don't agree with all the doomsaying and the pitchforking, but I can sympathize with the disappointment.
I'm fully expecting Ashran to be a bust, by the way. There has never been a real PvP epiphany in the game that has fixed many of the issues with it, especially in regards to open world PvP. In PvE, at least they'll have good ideas and then get rid of them for stupid reasons. PvP hasn't even had that much luck.
When it comes to world pvp blizzard is very much a junkie chasing that first high. World pvp was awesome the first few days or perhaps weeks of vanilla when leveling brought your undergeared ass into conflict with the people on the other side that were in the same miserable state and every interaction turned into trying to shank them before they shanked you while still trying to quest. That whole thing died about 30 seconds after the first person hit 60 and figured they might as well start griefing people in STV. On the other hand, if the timeless isle is anything to go by then blizzard considers the STV days to be the truest incarnation of world pvp.
The problem is that historically they've said very little about expansion content until late into development where everything was already finalized. They've backed themselves into a corner this time around because it's taken them so long to get started on the new expansion and the players have been starved of new content.
Also, is there some secret reason why people in the resto shaman forum in icy veins say to use conductivity ever for anything?
0
FairchildRabbit used short words that were easy to understand, like "Hello Pooh, how about Lunch ?"Registered Userregular
They've backed themselves into a corner this time around because it's taken them so long to get started on the new expansion and the players have been starved of new content.
I wonder if this is the cause or the result of the heavy turnover they've had amongst the ranks of WOW developers.
The problem is that historically they've said very little about expansion content until late into development where everything was already finalized. They've backed themselves into a corner this time around because it's taken them so long to get started on the new expansion and the players have been starved of new content.
See, this is the part that I wonder about specifically, because, to hear them tell it back at Blizzcon last November, they were further along then than they were with MoP when that was announced at the previous 'con. It really seems like there was some kind of major shake-up mid-development, maybe due to the turnover within the ranks of the devs or conflicting design decisions or what have you, but it's pretty evident that something's gone off the rails from the original plan.
Well I mean let's be fair here - the devs have done an, some would say, unreasonable (or at the very least uncharacteristic) amount of revisions/backtracking in this expansion compared to those previous. I mean yes, in Wrath there was the famously-advertised-then-dropped Dance Studio, then in Cataclysm there was the Path of the Titans, so that stuff does happen. In WoD though, there's been a number of things that were talked about in Blizzcon that have either been scrapped, re-worked or delayed. The decision to move the faction hubs to Ashran (which seems to be the major focal point of this expansion for the devs - they're heavily incentivizing it) would probably have been fine on its own, but the fact that the hubs themselves seem like very poor replacements (heavily re-used assets of what appears at least at the moment to be versions of the Krasarang Wilds holds) for what was described as being these huge, shrine-like cities that we'd get to occupy as faction hubs. The capital cities thing I think wouldn't have even been that big a deal had it not come on the heels of things like the not being able to place/move garrisons, garrisons size/scope being reduced from the original design, the Heirloom tab being pushed to sometime post-6.0 and the ping-ponging decision of "will we/won't we and when" of flying in the new content that has gotten a number of people on edge. Add to that the bizarre pace at which development seems to be moving since Blizzcon last November and it at least makes sense to me why some people might be a bit annoyed.
I don't agree with all the doomsaying and the pitchforking, but I can sympathize with the disappointment.
Yeah, there is certainly no lack of things to get on edge about their decisions with WoD, but the city thing seems like it's a hill not worth fighting over. I don't even care about reused assets as thematically you expect Horde and Alliance bases to have a general style; so why not carry it over here too?
I mean, the placement of the capitols is almost an arbitrary thing, really; with 15m hearthstone cooldowns and half dozen other ways to get to them, it's not like most people will be using the front door anyway. If they actually do get around to adding flying in WoD then maybe it'll matter somewhat more; but it's not as if having your factions city on the far side of the world is any better for anything except pure aesthetics.
And I actually support their decision to remove the so-called 'choices' from the Garrisons as you're questing. It seemed relatively arbitrary and likely a headache for them to balance the garrison features around; there would always be a 'right' and 'wrong' choice (and afaik the choice is still there but it will only be for whatever little thing you have personally in that zone; the garrisons themselves are not dictated anymore by it). It's a similar argument to what they're doing with guild leveling...when those 'perks' are damn near universal the 'choice' becomes completely irrelevant and it was wasted development time and actually actively going against the player if they made the 'wrong' choice (or were in a small guild, whatever).
It's not as if they need to homogenize everything to make it so players don't 'mess up'; but it's just a matter of whether or not those choices were actually choices to begin with, and if not, does it matter if they're there?
I'm cool with all that stuff, whatever. I'll save my flipping the fuck out energy for the LFR nonsense ass shit hell they're doing. :P
I actually like that they kind of handwave the whole garrison thing (at least in horde side) by being all "hey! it's the same goblin who designed orgrimmar! So of course it's gonna look the same!'
The problem is that historically they've said very little about expansion content until late into development where everything was already finalized. They've backed themselves into a corner this time around because it's taken them so long to get started on the new expansion and the players have been starved of new content.
See, this is the part that I wonder about specifically, because, to hear them tell it backlie to us at Blizzcon last November, they were further along then than they were with MoP when that was announced at the previous 'con. It really seems like there was some kind of major shake-up mid-developmentthey hadn't done any development at all, maybe due to the turnover within the ranks of the devs or conflicting design decisions or what have you, but it's pretty evident that something's gone off the rails from the original plan.
Yay, our heroic malk kill is reproducible. Only two tries to kill him for the second time; we only died the first time because my MT derp'd his cooldowns in blood rage.
The problem is that historically they've said very little about expansion content until late into development where everything was already finalized. They've backed themselves into a corner this time around because it's taken them so long to get started on the new expansion and the players have been starved of new content.
See, this is the part that I wonder about specifically, because, to hear them tell it backlie to us at Blizzcon last November, they were further along then than they were with MoP when that was announced at the previous 'con. It really seems like there was some kind of major shake-up mid-developmentthey hadn't done any development at all, maybe due to the turnover within the ranks of the devs or conflicting design decisions or what have you, but it's pretty evident that something's gone off the rails from the original plan.
FTFY
You're one of the people we've been talking about. Acting like Blizz has "lied" to you is bullshit, if they hadn't been working on the game at that point then there definitely wouldn't be a Beta right now.
PvP for my DK's cloak was surprisingly productive. Silvershard was a 1-shot. Kotmogu took about 5 attempts due to lack of queue turnover (Allies had a RBG team that was farming kills).
The problem is that historically they've said very little about expansion content until late into development where everything was already finalized. They've backed themselves into a corner this time around because it's taken them so long to get started on the new expansion and the players have been starved of new content.
See, this is the part that I wonder about specifically, because, to hear them tell it backlie to us at Blizzcon last November, they were further along then than they were with MoP when that was announced at the previous 'con. It really seems like there was some kind of major shake-up mid-developmentthey hadn't done any development at all, maybe due to the turnover within the ranks of the devs or conflicting design decisions or what have you, but it's pretty evident that something's gone off the rails from the original plan.
FTFY
You're one of the people we've been talking about. Acting like Blizz has "lied" to you is bullshit, if they hadn't been working on the game at that point then there definitely wouldn't be a Beta right now.
My comment was somewhat tongue in cheek; I'm not upset or angry at them, although I do think that the content gap between SoO and WoD is going to be too large.
I do think blizzard lied about how long they had been working on warlords when they made the announcement back at blizzcon. I think were working on it, but not for as long as they were implying they had been. When wrath was announced way back when they released a lot of information along with the announcement--the kind of info they usually release like zone previews, dev diaries, lore and whatnot. In WoD's case info and screenshots were scarce until much later. Much of what they have announced has changed. (Which is fine with me, things change in development. Hell, things change with every patch.) Sure, things changed between wrath's announcement and it's launch, but less of it did. Being earlier into the dev cycle than they were with previous announcements would explain why so much has changed, and why other things are still up in the air. My hypothesis is that Vivendi didn't want Blizzard focusing it's resources on WoW anymore, and that Blizz disagreed with that decision (which is probably why they took the major risk of buying themselves back). They made the WoD announcement because they had to. Wildstar and ESO were finally coming out of development, guilds were already finishing up SoO, and they were in their post-expansion subscriber bleed.
The problem is that historically they've said very little about expansion content until late into development where everything was already finalized. They've backed themselves into a corner this time around because it's taken them so long to get started on the new expansion and the players have been starved of new content.
See, this is the part that I wonder about specifically, beoruse, to hear them tell it backlie to us at Blizzcon last November, they were further along then than they were with MoP when that was announced at the previous 'con. It really seems like there was some kind of major shake-up mid-developmentthey hadn't done any development at all, maybe due to the turnover within the ranks of the devs or conflicting design decisions or what have you, but it's pretty evident that something's gone off the rails from the original plan.
FTFY
You're one of the people we've been talking about. Acting like Blizz has "lied" to you is bullshit, if they hadn't been working on the game at that point then there definitely wouldn't be a Beta right now.
My comment was somewhat tongue in cheek; I'm not upset or angry at them, although I do think that the content gap between SoO and WoD is going to be too large.
I do think blizzard lied about how long they had been working on warlords when they made the announcement back at blizzcon. I think were working on it, but not for as long as they were implying they had been. When wrath was announced way back when they released a lot of information along with the announcement--the kind of info they usually release like zone previews, dev diaries, lore and whatnot. In WoD's case info and screenshots were scarce until much later. Much of what they have announced has changed. (Which is fine with me, things change in development. Hell, things change with every patch.) Sure, things changed between wrath's announcement and it's launch, but less of it did. Being earlier into the dev cycle than they were with previous announcements would explain why so much has changed, and why other things are still up in the air. My hypothesis is that Vivendi didn't want Blizzard focusing it's resources on WoW anymore, and that Blizz disagreed with that decision (which is probably why they took the major risk of buying themselves back). They made the WoD announcement because they had to. Wildstar and ESO were finally coming out of development, guilds were already finishing up SoO, and they were in their post-expansion subscriber bleed.
I disagree. Why would they lie? I think they were where they said they were, then in like December or January some major internal shakeup happened, titan was canceled, a bunch of devs from that flooded wow, designs considered finished and maybe even finished resources were scraped or changed, and a bunch of high level longtimers have started quitting over it.
I think it's really muddy waters to try and decipher office politics and career decisions based on the development path for a video game, unless something so nuclear happens that it bleeds into mainstream news, like what happened with 38 Studios.
Many of the people leaving have been with Blizzard, or even just WoW, for over a decade. Most are still young with likely the best parts of their careers stilll ahead of them. Blizzard is a great studio that is pretty amazing in a lot of ways, but while they have polish down to a science, they aren't exactly cutting edge anymore or looking to make huge announcements at gaming conventions and press releases. They seem perfectly happy making their games and cultivating the esports genre, which might not be someones cup of tea a dozen years later.
The problem is that historically they've said very little about expansion content until late into development where everything was already finalized. They've backed themselves into a corner this time around because it's taken them so long to get started on the new expansion and the players have been starved of new content.
See, this is the part that I wonder about specifically, beoruse, to hear them tell it backlie to us at Blizzcon last November, they were further along then than they were with MoP when that was announced at the previous 'con. It really seems like there was some kind of major shake-up mid-developmentthey hadn't done any development at all, maybe due to the turnover within the ranks of the devs or conflicting design decisions or what have you, but it's pretty evident that something's gone off the rails from the original plan.
FTFY
You're one of the people we've been talking about. Acting like Blizz has "lied" to you is bullshit, if they hadn't been working on the game at that point then there definitely wouldn't be a Beta right now.
My comment was somewhat tongue in cheek; I'm not upset or angry at them, although I do think that the content gap between SoO and WoD is going to be too large.
I do think blizzard lied about how long they had been working on warlords when they made the announcement back at blizzcon. I think were working on it, but not for as long as they were implying they had been. When wrath was announced way back when they released a lot of information along with the announcement--the kind of info they usually release like zone previews, dev diaries, lore and whatnot. In WoD's case info and screenshots were scarce until much later. Much of what they have announced has changed. (Which is fine with me, things change in development. Hell, things change with every patch.) Sure, things changed between wrath's announcement and it's launch, but less of it did. Being earlier into the dev cycle than they were with previous announcements would explain why so much has changed, and why other things are still up in the air. My hypothesis is that Vivendi didn't want Blizzard focusing it's resources on WoW anymore, and that Blizz disagreed with that decision (which is probably why they took the major risk of buying themselves back). They made the WoD announcement because they had to. Wildstar and ESO were finally coming out of development, guilds were already finishing up SoO, and they were in their post-expansion subscriber bleed.
I disagree. Why would they lie? I think they were where they said they were, then in like December or January some major internal shakeup happened, titan was canceled, a bunch of devs from that flooded wow, designs considered finished and maybe even finished resources were scraped or changed, and a bunch of high level longtimers have started quitting over it.
That could be true too, but if that were the case then why did they put out so little info when they announced WoD? I mean, wrath and cata had whole websites devoted to zones and lore and class abilities.
The problem is that historically they've said very little about expansion content until late into development where everything was already finalized. They've backed themselves into a corner this time around because it's taken them so long to get started on the new expansion and the players have been starved of new content.
See, this is the part that I wonder about specifically, beoruse, to hear them tell it backlie to us at Blizzcon last November, they were further along then than they were with MoP when that was announced at the previous 'con. It really seems like there was some kind of major shake-up mid-developmentthey hadn't done any development at all, maybe due to the turnover within the ranks of the devs or conflicting design decisions or what have you, but it's pretty evident that something's gone off the rails from the original plan.
FTFY
You're one of the people we've been talking about. Acting like Blizz has "lied" to you is bullshit, if they hadn't been working on the game at that point then there definitely wouldn't be a Beta right now.
My comment was somewhat tongue in cheek; I'm not upset or angry at them, although I do think that the content gap between SoO and WoD is going to be too large.
I do think blizzard lied about how long they had been working on warlords when they made the announcement back at blizzcon. I think were working on it, but not for as long as they were implying they had been. When wrath was announced way back when they released a lot of information along with the announcement--the kind of info they usually release like zone previews, dev diaries, lore and whatnot. In WoD's case info and screenshots were scarce until much later. Much of what they have announced has changed. (Which is fine with me, things change in development. Hell, things change with every patch.) Sure, things changed between wrath's announcement and it's launch, but less of it did. Being earlier into the dev cycle than they were with previous announcements would explain why so much has changed, and why other things are still up in the air. My hypothesis is that Vivendi didn't want Blizzard focusing it's resources on WoW anymore, and that Blizz disagreed with that decision (which is probably why they took the major risk of buying themselves back). They made the WoD announcement because they had to. Wildstar and ESO were finally coming out of development, guilds were already finishing up SoO, and they were in their post-expansion subscriber bleed.
I disagree. Why would they lie? I think they were where they said they were, then in like December or January some major internal shakeup happened, titan was canceled, a bunch of devs from that flooded wow, designs considered finished and maybe even finished resources were scraped or changed, and a bunch of high level longtimers have started quitting over it.
That could be true too, but if that were the case then why did they put out so little info when they announced WoD? I mean, wrath and cata had whole websites devoted to zones and lore and class abilities.
Posts
They announced some stuff, and then made changes. Basically, entitled whiners who haven't even played the alpha/beta doing what they do best on the internet.
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
rob pardo's leaving
Hey guys, I think I figured out why he's leaving.
I'm more curious than ever to know what's going on there at Blizzard.
Of course, now I'm one of those guys who is running around with two 522 PVP daggers that are enchanted, with a bunch of blues and greens otherwise :rotate:
AV and Isle of Conquest are, from what I've seen, the only BGs where Alliance dominates. Most Alliance specifically queue for those two BGs and get in in under 5 minutes, while Horde just random queues and sits in 10-20 minute queues.
The gold bar is the win ratio. AV and IoC are both around 75-85% Alliance. Strand of the Ancients is the only one that Horde regularly dominates, while the rest are around 55-60% Horde
I'm confused; the faction cities are going to be in the pvp zone? I think I must have missed that announcement.
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
Which made the forum peasants grab their torches and pitchforks and prompting blizzard to issue a more fleshed out statement and apparently this is totally unacceptable because something something karabor and the black temple. The capitals aren't going to be in the ashran pvp zone but instead adjacent to them, so we can get our race war on when we have had a few and realize dwarves do not deserve to live.
I think it has to do with changing the faction hubs.
Edit: Well, then.
Steam: pazython
I don't agree with all the doomsaying and the pitchforking, but I can sympathize with the disappointment.
Also, is there some secret reason why people in the resto shaman forum in icy veins say to use conductivity ever for anything?
I wonder if this is the cause or the result of the heavy turnover they've had amongst the ranks of WOW developers.
Yeah, there is certainly no lack of things to get on edge about their decisions with WoD, but the city thing seems like it's a hill not worth fighting over. I don't even care about reused assets as thematically you expect Horde and Alliance bases to have a general style; so why not carry it over here too?
I mean, the placement of the capitols is almost an arbitrary thing, really; with 15m hearthstone cooldowns and half dozen other ways to get to them, it's not like most people will be using the front door anyway. If they actually do get around to adding flying in WoD then maybe it'll matter somewhat more; but it's not as if having your factions city on the far side of the world is any better for anything except pure aesthetics.
And I actually support their decision to remove the so-called 'choices' from the Garrisons as you're questing. It seemed relatively arbitrary and likely a headache for them to balance the garrison features around; there would always be a 'right' and 'wrong' choice (and afaik the choice is still there but it will only be for whatever little thing you have personally in that zone; the garrisons themselves are not dictated anymore by it). It's a similar argument to what they're doing with guild leveling...when those 'perks' are damn near universal the 'choice' becomes completely irrelevant and it was wasted development time and actually actively going against the player if they made the 'wrong' choice (or were in a small guild, whatever).
It's not as if they need to homogenize everything to make it so players don't 'mess up'; but it's just a matter of whether or not those choices were actually choices to begin with, and if not, does it matter if they're there?
I'm cool with all that stuff, whatever. I'll save my flipping the fuck out energy for the LFR nonsense ass shit hell they're doing. :P
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
FTFY
*dies of cute*
You're one of the people we've been talking about. Acting like Blizz has "lied" to you is bullshit, if they hadn't been working on the game at that point then there definitely wouldn't be a Beta right now.
There better be some special animation for them if you get them near the molten kitten.
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
Theorycrafting. I also forgot to do stuff around the lvl 60 talents and Astral Communion but I purposefully didn't bother with AoE stuff.
My comment was somewhat tongue in cheek; I'm not upset or angry at them, although I do think that the content gap between SoO and WoD is going to be too large.
I do think blizzard lied about how long they had been working on warlords when they made the announcement back at blizzcon. I think were working on it, but not for as long as they were implying they had been. When wrath was announced way back when they released a lot of information along with the announcement--the kind of info they usually release like zone previews, dev diaries, lore and whatnot. In WoD's case info and screenshots were scarce until much later. Much of what they have announced has changed. (Which is fine with me, things change in development. Hell, things change with every patch.) Sure, things changed between wrath's announcement and it's launch, but less of it did. Being earlier into the dev cycle than they were with previous announcements would explain why so much has changed, and why other things are still up in the air. My hypothesis is that Vivendi didn't want Blizzard focusing it's resources on WoW anymore, and that Blizz disagreed with that decision (which is probably why they took the major risk of buying themselves back). They made the WoD announcement because they had to. Wildstar and ESO were finally coming out of development, guilds were already finishing up SoO, and they were in their post-expansion subscriber bleed.
Because damn it, that might just be the first thing I buy theree.
Why don't you just make a level 100 premade on the pvp server?
I disagree. Why would they lie? I think they were where they said they were, then in like December or January some major internal shakeup happened, titan was canceled, a bunch of devs from that flooded wow, designs considered finished and maybe even finished resources were scraped or changed, and a bunch of high level longtimers have started quitting over it.
Everyone's heart melts instantly.
Many of the people leaving have been with Blizzard, or even just WoW, for over a decade. Most are still young with likely the best parts of their careers stilll ahead of them. Blizzard is a great studio that is pretty amazing in a lot of ways, but while they have polish down to a science, they aren't exactly cutting edge anymore or looking to make huge announcements at gaming conventions and press releases. They seem perfectly happy making their games and cultivating the esports genre, which might not be someones cup of tea a dozen years later.
That could be true too, but if that were the case then why did they put out so little info when they announced WoD? I mean, wrath and cata had whole websites devoted to zones and lore and class abilities.
?