I finished up Iron Keep last night. The Old Iron King, The Smelter Demon, and then this morning the Pursuer round 2. Next up is the shaded woods. I have been leveling up my strength, even though I am playing a dexterity focused character at the moment. Since soul memory is irrelevant in NG+ I see no reason to set myself a level cap instead of just leveling all of my stats up.
I'm not a naked guy anymore!
I'm a naked guy with a dragon head!
If I fight anyone with heavy armor and a greatsword or up, bastard or up basically, it's an uphill battle the whole way. Hyper armor is a definite.
Mmm. Try jump attacks as your bread-and-butter punish for big sword guys. Not sure how effective it will actually be with a cestus but in theory you should be able to close the gap and get a consistent stagger?
Can't combo afterwards though. It does stagger but the ones I have trouble with are a dab hand on the rolling and never run themselves out of stamina.
I've had a couple of...I don't know to describe it.
Looney tunes style fights.
One mage who swapped to a dagger after I dodged all the spells, then spent forever turtling after I punished his swing. I just...kept following him as he backed away, not really doing anything, waiting for him to twitch. He kept backing away knowing if he twitched he'd die. He had a decent shield so I couldn't break it and he was moving backwards fast enough my guard break whiffed.
So I was just walking in front of his shield and he was backing away from me.
Eventually he accidentally ran himself back into the iron keep and into an obstruction, so I guard breaked him, the guy didn't dodge, it connected, and then it was all she wrote.
The funniest fight was with someone waaaaaay back on the bridge who immediately started casting clouds of stuff on me. I dodged out of it, kept dodging, not even knowing what it was. I was worried it was an equipment break.
Then I realised it was poison when I was nearly up to him. His last cast just as I reached him started the poison.
As I started punching him my eyes glanced up to my health bar to see how much damage it was doing, then quickly flicked back to him.
He was dead.
I...he...
40 vigor guys.
Seriously.
I have 50.
I have won so many fights with a tiny bit of health while naked.
Now imagine that with decent freaking armor and weapons.
As a guy with a pure STR/end build that swings around an ultra greatsword, it's funny how similar the experience is. Dumb opponents will sit there, let me guard break them or try to actually block my attacks. (dumb idea, I can mash out 5 of these R1s)
It gets interesting when people understand the matchup and then it's a dance. There is a lot of juking and back and forth spacing, I've chased down opponents shield to shield until they twitch, or get backed into a corner, guard crushed and die.
I'm thinking about upping my adaptability so I can recover faster from those giant swings, or is faster recovery not actually confirmed?
Hiryu02 on
Sev: Your gameplay is the most heavily yomi based around. Usually you look for characters that allow you to force guessing situations for big dmg. Even if the guess is mathematically nowhere near in your favor lol. You're happiest when you have either a 50/50, 33/33/33 or even a 75/25 situation to go crazy with. And you will take big risks to force those situations to come up.
I got myself a 100% magic, 85% dark, 93% all other elements besides physical (which is at ~75%) Rebel's Greatshield. I could make it 100% dark and bump down the magic, but magic is more common in PvP right now.
Once people have started to fully understand the guardbreak no one will use it anymore.
Just keep your distance and wait for the other guy to strike first. If he uses a guardbreak, that's 2 to 3 free hits, and it's really easy to see comming.
Greatshield slam is a better guardbreak more often than the weapon guardbreak.
Of course, you have to be using a greatshield, and it takes away your parry, but it's effective.
Once people have started to fully understand the guardbreak no one will use it anymore.
Just keep your distance and wait for the other guy to strike first. If he uses a guardbreak, that's 2 to 3 free hits, and it's really easy to see comming.
I don't really agree. As it is now, you can simply backpedal out of a guardbreak. Most of the time this is sufficient. This is where positioning/spacing and use of the environment come into play.
If I can tell that the opponent is expecting the guardbreak, I start to push him into corners or areas in which he can only roll one way. Then I can do one of two things.
I swing twice. First swing he dodges but he gets caught by the 2nd swing into staggerlock into death or 3/4 life.
Or I guard break. If I've already conditioned the opponent to expect the swing, a lot of times they will block. And eat the guardbreak.
Many times people will freeze and block, or roll if boxed into a corner.
The guard break is obvious, yes, but pvp is not that dis-similar to a fighting game. If I can control the corner in a fighting game, limit my opponents offense through spacing and footsies, even my most obvious attack can not always be avoided. It's basically just mindgames, after all.
Sev: Your gameplay is the most heavily yomi based around. Usually you look for characters that allow you to force guessing situations for big dmg. Even if the guess is mathematically nowhere near in your favor lol. You're happiest when you have either a 50/50, 33/33/33 or even a 75/25 situation to go crazy with. And you will take big risks to force those situations to come up.
Reading about your PvP experiences makes me wonder if no one parries in Ds2?
They seem even more powerful now in PvP when you can parry from the whole length of the weapon, and slightly less anticipatory then Ds1.
The parry window seems kinda strict and messing it up you're probably going to get stun locked for a while after that first hit.
but ripostes and backstabs are currently "super" deadly with a current exploit/glitch going around you can nearly double the damage they do, the riposte one is guaranteed on a riposte cause they cant move
Once people have started to fully understand the guardbreak no one will use it anymore.
Just keep your distance and wait for the other guy to strike first. If he uses a guardbreak, that's 2 to 3 free hits, and it's really easy to see comming.
I don't really agree. As it is now, you can simply backpedal out of a guardbreak. Most of the time this is sufficient. This is where positioning/spacing and use of the environment come into play.
If I can tell that the opponent is expecting the guardbreak, I start to push him into corners or areas in which he can only roll one way. Then I can do one of two things.
I swing twice. First swing he dodges but he gets caught by the 2nd swing into staggerlock into death or 3/4 life.
Or I guard break. If I've already conditioned the opponent to expect the swing, a lot of times they will block. And eat the guardbreak.
Many times people will freeze and block, or roll if boxed into a corner.
The guard break is obvious, yes, but pvp is not that dis-similar to a fighting game. If I can control the corner in a fighting game, limit my opponents offense through spacing and footsies, even my most obvious attack can not always be avoided. It's basically just mindgames, after all.
I have to assume you're playing against worse players than me. The players I'm pitted against don't let themselves get backed up against a corner.
Sirialisof the Halite Throne.Registered Userregular
edited March 2014
I had a dude keep running away from me and plinking his little throwing knives at me, fuck that I said and Flame Swathed him in the face for 900 damage.
It's so overpowered but when people keep trying to kill me at a distance, I feel justified in using it.
If you die when having summoned someone into your maze as a Ratbro, do you lose your humanity?
The damage calculation on Flame Swathe has to be super-fucked. I'm pretty sure it beats every other pyromancy, with the exception of maybe having some get hit by multiple pillars of Chaos Storm. It may be relatively easy to dodge, but so are most of the others, besides the surprise Forbidden Sun.
On a related note, I have no clue what they were thinking with the Dark Pyromancy Flame. I guess you can pair it with the Ring of Binding to some use, but it still seems a little weird that you have to die something like 10 times before it even matches the normal Pyromancy Flame.
You could just get cursed a bunch as well. Seems much quicker to me. Plus I think curse can bring you BELOW the threshold, which would power up the flame even more.
The damage calculation on Flame Swathe has to be super-fucked. I'm pretty sure it beats every other pyromancy, with the exception of maybe having some get hit by multiple pillars of Chaos Storm. It may be relatively easy to dodge, but so are most of the others, besides the surprise Forbidden Sun.
On a related note, I have no clue what they were thinking with the Dark Pyromancy Flame. I guess you can pair it with the Ring of Binding to some use, but it still seems a little weird that you have to die something like 10 times before it even matches the normal Pyromancy Flame.
It's quite a lot stronger at max hollowing, I think it matches it at around 5 deaths. I never bothered returning to human once I got the ring of binding, so it was a no-brainer for me. You can think of it as a ring slot that reduces your hp by 25% but increases your damage.
Once people have started to fully understand the guardbreak no one will use it anymore.
Just keep your distance and wait for the other guy to strike first. If he uses a guardbreak, that's 2 to 3 free hits, and it's really easy to see comming.
I don't really agree. As it is now, you can simply backpedal out of a guardbreak. Most of the time this is sufficient. This is where positioning/spacing and use of the environment come into play.
If I can tell that the opponent is expecting the guardbreak, I start to push him into corners or areas in which he can only roll one way. Then I can do one of two things.
I swing twice. First swing he dodges but he gets caught by the 2nd swing into staggerlock into death or 3/4 life.
Or I guard break. If I've already conditioned the opponent to expect the swing, a lot of times they will block. And eat the guardbreak.
Many times people will freeze and block, or roll if boxed into a corner.
The guard break is obvious, yes, but pvp is not that dis-similar to a fighting game. If I can control the corner in a fighting game, limit my opponents offense through spacing and footsies, even my most obvious attack can not always be avoided. It's basically just mindgames, after all.
I have to assume you're playing against worse players than me. The players I'm pitted against don't let themselves get backed up against a corner.
You fight on endless flat plains? You never bait rolls and then punish at the end of the recovery?
Sev: Your gameplay is the most heavily yomi based around. Usually you look for characters that allow you to force guessing situations for big dmg. Even if the guess is mathematically nowhere near in your favor lol. You're happiest when you have either a 50/50, 33/33/33 or even a 75/25 situation to go crazy with. And you will take big risks to force those situations to come up.
I have to say I don't really understand poise now. It doesn't stop you from flinching when getting hit, even against light weapons, and you'll still flinch getting hit mid-attack, too. Tested with shitloads of poise, including poise rings.
So, I don't know if it's bugged, if it was intended to do nothing, or if everyone using the Stone Ring in PvP just makes it useless. I can't imagine them meaning to have the Stone Ring invalidate all poise, though.
Yep, poise does nothing. It does not prevent you from being staggered while you are attacking. I have lots of poise and single R1 attacks stagger me the first time.
There is one thing poise might do - may prevent you from being staggered when you hit a shield. That happened to me all the time in DS1 but never DS2
Once people have started to fully understand the guardbreak no one will use it anymore.
Just keep your distance and wait for the other guy to strike first. If he uses a guardbreak, that's 2 to 3 free hits, and it's really easy to see comming.
I don't really agree. As it is now, you can simply backpedal out of a guardbreak. Most of the time this is sufficient. This is where positioning/spacing and use of the environment come into play.
If I can tell that the opponent is expecting the guardbreak, I start to push him into corners or areas in which he can only roll one way. Then I can do one of two things.
I swing twice. First swing he dodges but he gets caught by the 2nd swing into staggerlock into death or 3/4 life.
Or I guard break. If I've already conditioned the opponent to expect the swing, a lot of times they will block. And eat the guardbreak.
Many times people will freeze and block, or roll if boxed into a corner.
The guard break is obvious, yes, but pvp is not that dis-similar to a fighting game. If I can control the corner in a fighting game, limit my opponents offense through spacing and footsies, even my most obvious attack can not always be avoided. It's basically just mindgames, after all.
I have to assume you're playing against worse players than me. The players I'm pitted against don't let themselves get backed up against a corner.
You fight on endless flat plains? You never bait rolls and then punish at the end of the recovery?
Iron Keep bridge. I don't understand how you bait rolls. Yes, I hit people just after rolling sometimes since I'm using a Greatsword and they just can't roll far enough, but how would you bait rolls? It's not like you can fake attacks.
Stat distribution is such a big struggle in DS2. I just want a high Str build that hits like a truck, can take hits, and use all the heavy equipment, rolling be damned. That requires investing in Str, Vig, Vit, End, and some would say even some Adp. Feels like I'm spreading my souls a bit thin to cover all the bases...
+2
MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
I have to say I don't really understand poise now. It doesn't stop you from flinching when getting hit, even against light weapons, and you'll still flinch getting hit mid-attack, too. Tested with shitloads of poise, including poise rings.
So, I don't know if it's bugged, if it was intended to do nothing, or if everyone using the Stone Ring in PvP just makes it useless. I can't imagine them meaning to have the Stone Ring invalidate all poise, though.
Yep, poise does nothing. It does not prevent you from being staggered while you are attacking. I have lots of poise and single R1 attacks stagger me the first time.
There is one thing poise might do - may prevent you from being staggered when you hit a shield. That happened to me all the time in DS1 but never DS2
As an attacker of poisers, you are wrong.
Morninglord on
(PSN: Morninglord) (Steam: Morninglord) (WiiU: Morninglord22) I like to record and toss up a lot of random gaming videos here.
MorninglordI'm tired of being Batman,so today I'll be Owl.Registered Userregular
edited March 2014
I met a havels.
My fists couldn't do squat. Zero stagger, ever.
I do use the stone ring.
Caestus = dagger, btw.
Lowest poise damage.
Anyone who wants to use ridiculous dagger analogies? Don't worry, I'll be here to tell you how wrong you are.
The breakpoints are much higher than before, but they exist.
I also have a HUGE amount of trouble comboing high poisers. As in I can't.
Test was done with +0 weapons but we tested a bunch of them at +10 too and the values stayed the same as with +0.It seems weapon classes share poisebreaks, not all attacks were tested so there probably will be exceptions.The one taking the hits was just standing so i dont know if getting hit while rolling will change anything.They made the breakpoints REALLY high this time dunno how that will work out.The most poise we could get was 142 to 157.4, a lot of weapons broke that,so no idea how it goes from up there.I will be listing the values needed to withstand a hit.
Daggers 1hr1 36 2hr1 95
Reaper 1hr1 46 2hr1 122
Straight swords 1hr1 46 2hr1 122
Rapier 1hr1 53(lol) 2hr1 122
Curved swords 1hr1 46 2hr1 122
Clubs 1hr1 76 2hr1 141
Fist weapons 1hr1 35
Spears 1hr1 58 2hr1 broke 157.4
Lances 1hr1 105 2hr1 broke 142
Twinblade 1hr1 75 2hr1 broke 142
Great curved swords 1hr1 135 2hr1 broke 157.4
Katanas 1hr1 46 2hr1 122(fun fact 2hwdr1 broke 157,4 poise and comboed into r1 r1)
Greatswords, Halberds, Ultra greaswords, Great hammers broke 157,4 poise even with 1hr1
As for stone ring we tried it with two weapons but poisebreaks stayed the same.Also it seems that poise doesnt start to regenerate in pvp until it reaches 0, we waited 10 seconds after a single hit for poise to recover but it still didnt.
As far as adaptability goes having 10 or 38 didnt make a difference in when i could roll out of greasword stun as it was always after the second hit.(tried to roll earlier with different poise values as well but it didnt work either)
Poise is definitely still a functional defensive stat.
It's main function is to make you harder to stagger while in an animation. The difference between Dark Souls 1 and 2 is that now, you don't necessarily get to rely on poise to let you start an animation after getting hit. This is the tradeoff for being able to equip medium-heavy armor up to 75% load without much penalty. The old style of trying to just ignore your opponent's attacks and mash away doesn't work nearly as well. And you know what? Good fucking riddance.
Interesting bit about poise not regenerating until it hits zero. That is very good knowledge to have.
Posts
Back quarter.
You think he's any better?
Steam ID: 76561198021298113
Origin ID: SR71C_Blackbird
I just shrieked.
Edit: Nevermind. Solved
White Ring + Red Sign Soapstone!
MUHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAAHAHAHAHA!
// Switch: SW-5306-0651-6424 //
That sentence is pretty awesome.
We both just reached the same point in the game. Go us!
This shit is hard!
Dedicated PvPers prepared for PvP facing off against the likewise. And it's the only way to get Red Orbs till NG+ when you can buy them.
// Switch: SW-5306-0651-6424 //
PSN:Furlion
Do the other covenant rings give any stat bonuses?
// Switch: SW-5306-0651-6424 //
As a guy with a pure STR/end build that swings around an ultra greatsword, it's funny how similar the experience is. Dumb opponents will sit there, let me guard break them or try to actually block my attacks. (dumb idea, I can mash out 5 of these R1s)
It gets interesting when people understand the matchup and then it's a dance. There is a lot of juking and back and forth spacing, I've chased down opponents shield to shield until they twitch, or get backed into a corner, guard crushed and die.
I'm thinking about upping my adaptability so I can recover faster from those giant swings, or is faster recovery not actually confirmed?
What now casters? What now?
// Switch: SW-5306-0651-6424 //
Just keep your distance and wait for the other guy to strike first. If he uses a guardbreak, that's 2 to 3 free hits, and it's really easy to see comming.
Steam ID: 76561198021298113
Origin ID: SR71C_Blackbird
Of course, you have to be using a greatshield, and it takes away your parry, but it's effective.
// Switch: SW-5306-0651-6424 //
I don't really agree. As it is now, you can simply backpedal out of a guardbreak. Most of the time this is sufficient. This is where positioning/spacing and use of the environment come into play.
If I can tell that the opponent is expecting the guardbreak, I start to push him into corners or areas in which he can only roll one way. Then I can do one of two things.
I swing twice. First swing he dodges but he gets caught by the 2nd swing into staggerlock into death or 3/4 life.
Or I guard break. If I've already conditioned the opponent to expect the swing, a lot of times they will block. And eat the guardbreak.
Many times people will freeze and block, or roll if boxed into a corner.
The guard break is obvious, yes, but pvp is not that dis-similar to a fighting game. If I can control the corner in a fighting game, limit my opponents offense through spacing and footsies, even my most obvious attack can not always be avoided. It's basically just mindgames, after all.
They seem even more powerful now in PvP when you can parry from the whole length of the weapon, and slightly less anticipatory then Ds1.
but ripostes and backstabs are currently "super" deadly with a current exploit/glitch going around you can nearly double the damage they do, the riposte one is guaranteed on a riposte cause they cant move
I have to assume you're playing against worse players than me. The players I'm pitted against don't let themselves get backed up against a corner.
Steam ID: 76561198021298113
Origin ID: SR71C_Blackbird
It's so overpowered but when people keep trying to kill me at a distance, I feel justified in using it.
If you die when having summoned someone into your maze as a Ratbro, do you lose your humanity?
Ratbros have better poison
On a related note, I have no clue what they were thinking with the Dark Pyromancy Flame. I guess you can pair it with the Ring of Binding to some use, but it still seems a little weird that you have to die something like 10 times before it even matches the normal Pyromancy Flame.
It's quite a lot stronger at max hollowing, I think it matches it at around 5 deaths. I never bothered returning to human once I got the ring of binding, so it was a no-brainer for me. You can think of it as a ring slot that reduces your hp by 25% but increases your damage.
You fight on endless flat plains? You never bait rolls and then punish at the end of the recovery?
Yep, poise does nothing. It does not prevent you from being staggered while you are attacking. I have lots of poise and single R1 attacks stagger me the first time.
There is one thing poise might do - may prevent you from being staggered when you hit a shield. That happened to me all the time in DS1 but never DS2
PSN: Vorpallion Twitch: Vorpallion
Iron Keep bridge. I don't understand how you bait rolls. Yes, I hit people just after rolling sometimes since I'm using a Greatsword and they just can't roll far enough, but how would you bait rolls? It's not like you can fake attacks.
Steam ID: 76561198021298113
Origin ID: SR71C_Blackbird
As an attacker of poisers, you are wrong.
Steam ID: 76561198021298113
Origin ID: SR71C_Blackbird
My fists couldn't do squat. Zero stagger, ever.
I do use the stone ring.
Caestus = dagger, btw.
Lowest poise damage.
Anyone who wants to use ridiculous dagger analogies? Don't worry, I'll be here to tell you how wrong you are.
The breakpoints are much higher than before, but they exist.
I also have a HUGE amount of trouble comboing high poisers. As in I can't.
http://www.gamefaqs.com/boards/693331-dark-souls-ii/68822805?page=0
Fist two handed attacks do stun high poise but they're way too slow to use. I guess I should start trying against higher poise guys.
It's main function is to make you harder to stagger while in an animation. The difference between Dark Souls 1 and 2 is that now, you don't necessarily get to rely on poise to let you start an animation after getting hit. This is the tradeoff for being able to equip medium-heavy armor up to 75% load without much penalty. The old style of trying to just ignore your opponent's attacks and mash away doesn't work nearly as well. And you know what? Good fucking riddance.
Interesting bit about poise not regenerating until it hits zero. That is very good knowledge to have.