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My Little [Programming] Thread: Debugging is Magic

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Posts

  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    Alright, so this is going to be a really open ended question, but:

    What would be a really good programming language to make budgeting software in?

    Background: I've had this idea floating around in my head about budgeting software for a couple of years now. I've finally decided to try to do something about it. I've got a LITTLE background in Visual Basic, but that's pretty much the extent of my programming experience.

    I would want this to be a desktop application in the beginning, but the dream would be to eventually have it as a smart phone app as well. Are there any languages that scale well both ways?

    Don't take this as me being naive about the whole thing. I know I can't just walk into it and expect to have something thrown together over night. Heck, it would probably take years to put together what I have in mind. I just figured this would be a good place to start, to at least get some direction.

    @CoolTrainer‌

    Actually no, you should use C#.

    You should only use Java if you're targeting linux platforms, even then, meh, I'd stick with something like python over Java.

    Java is for weirdos, don't be a weirdo.

    Ladies.
    a5ehren
  • KakodaimonosKakodaimonos Registered User regular
    No, if he's looking at possibly doing a smartphone app later, Java is a better choice since you can move on to the Android platform with Java.

    C# leaves you just Windows phones and all 6 people who still use them.

    Delmain
  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    The android platform is pretty far removed from actual Java though, afaik.

    http://xamarin.com/android

    But there ya go.

    Ladies.
  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    Java wishes it could be what C# is.

    Ladies.
  • JasconiusJasconius sword criminal mad onlineRegistered User regular
    i don't really see how android is removed from Java

    in that Android is literally Android.jar running on Linux and you program most apps in Java

  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    Well I meant it's not your typical Java code. So moving from Java to Android Java is going to require a lot of rewrite either way.

    Ladies.
  • LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    Is there a desktop version of the Android Java?

  • a5ehrena5ehren AtlantaRegistered User regular
    LD50 wrote: »
    Is there a desktop version of the Android Java?

    The Android device emulator in the SDK, I'd assume.

  • LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    Well, I mean, the Android version of the base class library, without all the device/surface manager related stuff.

  • JasconiusJasconius sword criminal mad onlineRegistered User regular
    i made a twitter app for an android tablet a few years ago and I found it to be very java-y

  • Jimmy KingJimmy King Registered User regular
    The "it's not Java" thing is an odd argument. It's technically correct, but the argument is misunderstood.

    Last I attempted to pay any attention to it the argument was that it's not Java because it runs on the Dalvik VM which is a ground up clean room virtual machine and byte code implementation which just happens to expose the same API as Java. It's the same thing as saying code is not Python anymore just because you chose to run it on Jython or PyPy or Stackless Python (which is the closest example probably since Dalvik is stackless) rather than CPython. Android does not run Java as in it does not have an actual Java virtual machine, but you still write Java code to run on Android just like you still write Python code to run on Jython, Stackless Python, etc.

  • InfidelInfidel Heretic Registered User regular
    Right, what makes a language is not the implementation of it.

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    Delmain
  • Jimmy KingJimmy King Registered User regular
    If you look back through early Android stuff Google even talks quite a bit about how you write Java code and that's a good thing and was chosen because so many people already know Java. "It's not Java" is just a technicality that some engineer at Google came up with once Oracle started trying to sue Google over their use of Java.

  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    Well it also defeats the point of using Java if you're targeting a platform that uses a different set of APIs to display data, as well.

    Is it Java if you're just using the base language and not the APIs that you would use in the desktop environment (swing)? C# could probably pass for Java if you adhered to just the pure language constructs. Does that make C#, Java?

    tl;dr - Java :rotate:

    Ladies.
  • Jimmy KingJimmy King Registered User regular
    It's not a full implementation of the Java API, but neither are the alternative implementations of Python and Ruby full Python and Ruby implementations. They implement as much as possible, but leave some out which is not possible due to the goals of their specific vm. There are also plenty of other UI libs for Java which are not Swing, do not come distributed with the JVM, etc. but using them doesn't make your app any less Java and the libs themselves are not "not java"

    You still write Java syntax, import other java libs which have been compiled using Oracle's JDK and compile your own apps using Oracle's JDK, etc It's a targeted implementation of Java with a specific goal. "It doesn't run Java" is technicality which only matters to the people implementing the VMs themselves and the people involved with lawsuits over whether Google broke any rules with Android.

  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    YjCOL70.jpg

    Ladies.
  • Jimmy KingJimmy King Registered User regular
    I need to screen shot that so that my wife knows that I am sometimes correct.

    bowen
  • PhotonPhoton Registered User regular
    This is only tangentially related to programming, but I figured i'd throw it in here...

    I work in an increasingly noisy office, so wear headphones 90% of the time when programming.
    I'm bored of my current coding playlists, so curious .... what do you guys use for background noise?

    The kind of stuff I can listen to at work is often different to my usual preferences (mainly rock), primarily because tracks with lyrics seem quite distracting while working (I pay too much attention to it)...
    I've found things like old video game soundtracks often work out well for me but would love to get some new ideas :smile:

    PSN: photon_86
  • DelmainDelmain Registered User regular
    syndalis wrote: »
    Apple is a terrible company.
  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    Bach, Mozart, Beethoven.

    Classical music is really good for relaxing and actually helps with focus, apparently.

    Ladies.
  • RendRend Registered User regular
    The Bastion soundtrack is pretty much the best of the best.

    orthancstoneCokebotle
  • undergroundmonorailundergroundmonorail single-track subway Registered User regular
    Fall Out Boy, My Chemical Romance, Green Day, Billy Talent...
    i'm not in denial, i'm 100% aware that i have garbage taste in music

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  • EtheaEthea Registered User regular
    Photon wrote: »
    This is only tangentially related to programming, but I figured i'd throw it in here...

    I work in an increasingly noisy office, so wear headphones 90% of the time when programming.
    I'm bored of my current coding playlists, so curious .... what do you guys use for background noise?

    The kind of stuff I can listen to at work is often different to my usual preferences (mainly rock), primarily because tracks with lyrics seem quite distracting while working (I pay too much attention to it)...
    I've found things like old video game soundtracks often work out well for me but would love to get some new ideas :smile:

    Podcast: Music for Programming. http://musicforprogramming.net/

  • an_altan_alt Registered User regular
    I'm a fan of classical and darker electronica like electro-industrial at the office. It needs to have flow and not draw too much attention to itself.

    In an unrelated note, I really hate working with XML and terrible tools.

    Pony wrote:
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  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    Photon wrote: »
    This is only tangentially related to programming, but I figured i'd throw it in here...

    I work in an increasingly noisy office, so wear headphones 90% of the time when programming.
    I'm bored of my current coding playlists, so curious .... what do you guys use for background noise?

    The kind of stuff I can listen to at work is often different to my usual preferences (mainly rock), primarily because tracks with lyrics seem quite distracting while working (I pay too much attention to it)...
    I've found things like old video game soundtracks often work out well for me but would love to get some new ideas :smile:

    Vocaless trance/techno is the best for me. TRON: Legacy sountrack is amazing for programming.

    Also look up zircon. He's done a lot of video game soundtracks and he's really fun to listen to.

    LD50
  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    In other news I would KILL for some guidance with this project other than "here's a test script that's old and way out of date with old server names and old paths... so figure it out and call me when shit's broke!"

    And when I call when shit's broke I get no answer.

  • KakodaimonosKakodaimonos Registered User regular
    bowen wrote: »
    Well it also defeats the point of using Java if you're targeting a platform that uses a different set of APIs to display data, as well.

    Is it Java if you're just using the base language and not the APIs that you would use in the desktop environment (swing)? C# could probably pass for Java if you adhered to just the pure language constructs. Does that make C#, Java?

    tl;dr - Java :rotate:

    So what is WPF? It's not part of the ECMA C# standard. So all the WPF C# APIs and the Winforms C# APIs aren't really C#.

    Delmain
  • Jimmy KingJimmy King Registered User regular
    All metal all the time when writing code. Probably not what you want. Lots of Testament, Exodus, Lamb of God, etc.

    Maybe some guitar oriented stuff without lyrics like Steve Vai, Paul Gilbert, Joe Satriani, etc. might be what you're looking for? Rock without the singing.

  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    bowen wrote: »
    Well it also defeats the point of using Java if you're targeting a platform that uses a different set of APIs to display data, as well.

    Is it Java if you're just using the base language and not the APIs that you would use in the desktop environment (swing)? C# could probably pass for Java if you adhered to just the pure language constructs. Does that make C#, Java?

    tl;dr - Java :rotate:

    So what is WPF? It's not part of the ECMA C# standard. So all the WPF C# APIs and the Winforms C# APIs aren't really C#.

    Let's just boil it right down, ISO C is the light and everyone else is a dirty heathen.

    Ladies.
  • KakodaimonosKakodaimonos Registered User regular
    You misspelled Haskell.

    Lambdas are the light.

  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    You misspelled Haskell.

    Lambdas are the light.

    How does it feel to be the most terrible human being of the 21st century?

    Ladies.
  • InfidelInfidel Heretic Registered User regular
    Video game soundtracks are great because they are meant to be there and set a mood but are designed specifically to not be distracting. You're already on the correct path, maybe just branch out to some new ones? :)

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  • urahonkyurahonky Registered User regular
    Build a video game soundtrack station on Pandora. I added a bunch from Skyrim and it kept playing really good ambient music for programming.

  • MahnmutMahnmut Registered User regular
    Infidel wrote: »
    Video game soundtracks are great because they are meant to be there and set a mood but are designed specifically to not be distracting. You're already on the correct path, maybe just branch out to some new ones? :)

    Example: http://c418.bandcamp.com/album/minecraft-volume-alpha

    Steam/LoL: Jericho89
  • GnomeTankGnomeTank Registered User regular
    I listen to a lot of drum and bass, electro, drumstep, some dubstep and various other forms of heavy/dark electronic music when I code.

    Sagroth wrote: »
    Oh c'mon FyreWulff, no one's gonna pay to visit Uranus.
    Steam: Brainling, XBL / PSN: GnomeTank, NintendoID: Brainling, FF14: Zillius Rosh SFV: Brainling
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  • GnomeTankGnomeTank Registered User regular
    bowen wrote: »
    Well it also defeats the point of using Java if you're targeting a platform that uses a different set of APIs to display data, as well.

    Is it Java if you're just using the base language and not the APIs that you would use in the desktop environment (swing)? C# could probably pass for Java if you adhered to just the pure language constructs. Does that make C#, Java?

    tl;dr - Java :rotate:

    So what is WPF? It's not part of the ECMA C# standard. So all the WPF C# APIs and the Winforms C# APIs aren't really C#.

    They aren't C#. Those are .NET libraries that can be accessed from any CLR compliant language, which includes VB.NET, Managed C++, IronPython, IronRuby, F#, Boo and others.

    Not to be pedantic, but this example was terrible in refuting bowen's point (which I actually don't agree with), because WPF and WinForms AREN'T C#, they are .NET libraries that C# can access.

    Sagroth wrote: »
    Oh c'mon FyreWulff, no one's gonna pay to visit Uranus.
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  • ecco the dolphinecco the dolphin Registered User regular
    Here are some games that I think people in this thread will like.
    Spacechem
    bFMblGs.jpg

    This one's almost identical to The Codex of Alchemical Engineering, as far as I can tell, but I love Spacechem. I have no idea why that is.

    This game has you automating a factory. Molecules come in, you do something to them, molecules go out. Some levels have you hooking up multiple factories, forcing you to decide what the scope of each one should be. Other ones have you using these factories to power lasers to fight of space monsters (???).

    My favourite thing about this game is the fact that there are two tracks, honestly. It allows for a lot more efficiency when you have two arms moving around doing their job independently, but also demands that you know exactly what you're doing to keep them synced up.

    Unfortunately, this is the only game on the list that costs money to play, but it's absolutely worth it. It's available for all major operating systems, including Android and iOS.

    Oh man, this game.

    I don't think I can ever play it again.

    I sunk far too much time into it last year to come up this. (warning: long)

    Penny Arcade Developers at PADev.net.
    undergroundmonorail
  • NightslyrNightslyr Registered User regular
    (My)SQL question:

    I need to create a 1:many relationship between a page and images. The caveat is that there can only be 0-10 images per page. Is there a way for me to actually model that constraint in the table/relationship schema? Or am I just forced to take a count of how many things exist before saying "nope" if there are already 10 there?

    PSN/XBL/Nintendo/Origin/Steam: Nightslyr 3DS: 1607-1682-2948
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  • bowenbowen How you doin'? Registered User regular
    Nightslyr wrote: »
    (My)SQL question:

    I need to create a 1:many relationship between a page and images. The caveat is that there can only be 0-10 images per page. Is there a way for me to actually model that constraint in the table/relationship schema? Or am I just forced to take a count of how many things exist before saying "nope" if there are already 10 there?

    http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.5/en/triggers.html

    Once you hit 10 records with the same ID/relationship, fire off an exception or ignore it?

    Ladies.
    Nightslyr
  • NightslyrNightslyr Registered User regular
    bowen wrote: »
    Nightslyr wrote: »
    (My)SQL question:

    I need to create a 1:many relationship between a page and images. The caveat is that there can only be 0-10 images per page. Is there a way for me to actually model that constraint in the table/relationship schema? Or am I just forced to take a count of how many things exist before saying "nope" if there are already 10 there?

    http://dev.mysql.com/doc/refman/5.5/en/triggers.html

    Once you hit 10 records with the same ID/relationship, fire off an exception or ignore it?

    Turns out I can't use triggers since I'm using Doctrine. But, it turns out that Doctrine has an event model, so I can do a quick check on insert there. So, yay! :)

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    bowenPhasen
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