They should've just not even bothered with the Kickstarter.
I assume they thought it was a done deal based on the MN9 excitement, of course that came out of PAX Prime, not some random anime expo in the middle of june/july
Looks like they're just going ahead anyway, full funding revealed
Announcement:
Hello everyone!
We have some very important and happy news for you today!
It's official: “RED ASH: The KalKanon Incident” is a GO for full development, along with ports to PlayStation 4 AND Xbox One!
We know this is sudden news. Are you surprised? How have we decided to develop the game before the Kickstarter campaign finishes? Well, that’s thanks to the support of FUZE Entertainment, who we’ll introduce now.
FUZE Entertainment Co., Ltd. is a Chinese digital entertainment company engaged in production of console hardware as well as sales of console games.
FUZE is based around Chinese game industry pioneer Wang Feng, and was co-founded with partners Huawei, NVIDIA, and Microsoft Xbox.
FUZE has established partnerships with major console game publishers to bring AAA titles to the Chinese market, and have made it their mission to bring the highest quality game experiences to gamers around the world.
Website: www.fuzegame.tv
We said it before: we have been working very hard behind-the-scenes for RED ASH! Alongside our Kickstarter campaign, we’ve been in negotiations with hardware makers and development partners, keeping your feedback and comments in mind. We hoped by introducing the world setting, art documents, creators involved, our latest prototype, and more, we could convey the charm of RED ASH. And it seems like that work has paid off with FUZE Entertainment deciding to join your ranks as backers, in a major way!
What happens to RED ASH now?
(1)
First off, the contribution of FUZE is a done deal. We can officially confirm that "The KalKanon Incident” will be developed to completion, with the initial goals for game content (8 hours), along with ports to BOTH PlayStation 4 and Xbox One!
(2)
The rights to RED ASH will be retained by comcept. We're excited to find such a great partner in FUZE who believes in our vision in its pure form. In addition, comcept will retain rights to creative discretion and decisions in game development.
What happens to Kickstarter?
The Kickstarter campaign is going 100% towards more content! Consider your pledge a contribution to stretch goals from here on out.
Exactly what are those stretch goals? We're sorry to say that will have to wait a little while longer! Like we said, we're very busy with many behind-the-scenes things over here, and we apologize if you feel left in the dark. As you can see, the things we have brewing that are keeping us occupied are BIG, and all for the purpose of getting you RED ASH in its biggest, bestest form. That's the reason we're less communicative than we'd like to be!
We know we’re in the final days of our campaign, but we’d like to ask fans to continue their support of RED ASH! Your money is going towards 100% content now, so please look forward to the revised "stretch goals"!
That wraps up the announcement!
Finally, we’d like to say, today’s announcement was made possible by everyone’s voices supporting RED ASH on Twitter, blogs, and other places. We’d like to thank our backers from the bottom of our hearts. We see all the work you're doing, pounding the pavement to get the word out, and we're overwhelmed by the support. We know the tide is against us, and it's you all that have kept us afloat. We're also beyond the ability to express our gratitude to HYDE for creating such amazing 3D models and a prototype in such a short time. We’re looking forward to working together more!
That’s all for today’s update.
Though... can they do that? I thought you were required to give kickstarter money back if not funded?
Well that is certainly an interesting turn of events.
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+1
Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
They should've just not even bothered with the Kickstarter.
I am like 99% sure they saw the kickstarter was not happening and maybe used it instead as a pitch to this company. I assume they didn't want to go this route if they could help it, since it leaves them beholden to a publisher.
Hmm. I'm pleased that the game is happening for sure. I think a re-up of Legends-ish gameplay is very worthy. Even better, it'll be on Xbox One so I can play this game once it exists. But as far as the Kickstarter... I still don't know. Mystery stretch goals? What about paying up for the full game? The way I read the announcement, only the prologue is a done deal with their Chinese Sugar Daddy.
0
MaddocI'm Bobbin Threadbare, are you my mother?Registered Userregular
This kickstarter has been the goddamn craziest thing
I feel like everything they did after the first week hurt the campaign more than it helped, and now this
I'm reminded of this article I read in Polygon's opinion section. "Big indies" like Comcept, Playtonic, and Inti Creates (in the context of Bloodstained) rarely get their full funding from Kickstarter. It's almost entirely a combination ad campaign and investment pitch. (Which, in the article's extended analysis, is bad for actual indies because it puts false expectations of what it actually costs to make a game, should a "real" indie (as in "does not have professional investors behind it) actually try to fully fund through Kickstarter.)
My favorite musical instrument is the air-raid siren.
I'm reminded of this article I read in Polygon's opinion section. "Big indies" like Comcept, Playtonic, and Inti Creates (in the context of Bloodstained) rarely get their full funding from Kickstarter. It's almost entirely a combination ad campaign and investment pitch. (Which, in the article's extended analysis, is bad for actual indies because it puts false expectations of what it actually costs to make a game, should a "real" indie (as in "does not have professional investors behind it) actually try to fully fund through Kickstarter.)
On the flip side, a game like Dragon's Crown only had a budget of $1million. Though Vanillaware added truckloads of post-release content for free after it became their best seller in company history, probably with some of the funds from those sales.
I'm reminded of this article I read in Polygon's opinion section. "Big indies" like Comcept, Playtonic, and Inti Creates (in the context of Bloodstained) rarely get their full funding from Kickstarter. It's almost entirely a combination ad campaign and investment pitch. (Which, in the article's extended analysis, is bad for actual indies because it puts false expectations of what it actually costs to make a game, should a "real" indie (as in "does not have professional investors behind it) actually try to fully fund through Kickstarter.)
I saw that article... it came off as very much "The game I only half-disclosed I'm kickstarting is not getting funded, and I'm salty about it."
Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
I think the whole thing looks shady.
Set up a kickstarter at a questionable time, it fails, then suddenly hey look there is funding anyway.
I dunno, that really, really doesn't feel right. Especially the whole "but what you did pledge will go to extras!" even though its not a funded kickstarter. On the one hand, if the game is being released, then I would think most people have no issue with that. But on the other hand, I think its deceiving to know you wont have to pay if it isn't funded only to have to pay anyway?
This whole kickstarter being so out there now is just an ugly, ugly thing.
Set up a kickstarter at a questionable time, it fails, then suddenly hey look there is funding anyway.
I dunno, that really, really doesn't feel right. Especially the whole "but what you did pledge will go to extras!" even though its not a funded kickstarter. On the one hand, if the game is being released, then I would think most people have no issue with that. But on the other hand, I think its deceiving to know you wont have to pay if it isn't funded only to have to pay anyway?
This whole kickstarter being so out there now is just an ugly, ugly thing.
As far as "I don't want them to have my money anymore" the backers can always pull out right now, upon reading that. No actual money is committed until the thing is funded. Which it won't be unless 1) this announcement is EXTREMELY exciting to the community and they double they support up till now in 3 days or 2) their sugar daddy in China makes up the difference. In the latter case, people have the 3 days to decide that's shady and take back their pledge.
+1
Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
considering how they have handled everything, and the fact this isn't their first KS, I think they know how money isn't committed until it's funded. They HAVE to know something is going to fun it, but I think they will hang back a few days to see if normal people do it first.
I'm reminded of this article I read in Polygon's opinion section. "Big indies" like Comcept, Playtonic, and Inti Creates (in the context of Bloodstained) rarely get their full funding from Kickstarter. It's almost entirely a combination ad campaign and investment pitch. (Which, in the article's extended analysis, is bad for actual indies because it puts false expectations of what it actually costs to make a game, should a "real" indie (as in "does not have professional investors behind it) actually try to fully fund through Kickstarter.)
Inticreates and Playtonic were very upfront about having private backers from the beginning . The kickstarters were essentially advertising and a way to pad the budget a bit
I have a podcast now. It's about video games and anime!Find it here.
My only issue with it is that I'm not big on "polygon platformers". Growing up on the NES+ sprite style platformers, I've always found the polygon ones to be janky and ugly - and most importantly because polygons almost never age as well. I think every MMX game after X5(excluding the pre-rendered shitwork) is horrible looking for example.
As such I find MM9's backgrounds to be rather sterile - maybe that's a product of their budget, but if that's the case I feel they could have made a more vibrant world if they went with spritework. Long term I think it's a misstep in design choice.
0
Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
edited July 2015
From the latest update (which just says "more info on stretch goals coming soon"):
And standard Kickstarter rules apply -- if we don't reach $800,000, the extra content won't get funded, and no one will be charged anything.
So wait, what? Why bother pretending with stretch goals then? There is no way in hell you will fund and anyone who donated is not being charged. I'm so confused.
Edit: You know what, I wonder if they are preparing a new Kickstarter and that's why they haven't been able to reveal the stretch goals. Leave this one open in case hell freezes over, then relaunch with a waaaaaaay lower initial goal purely centered around making the game better. Plus then they aren't really dicking around people who donated under different promises but maybe didn't see this announcement to cancel their pledge. *shrug*
Though honestly if they do this, please wait a couple months after MN9 is out. I suspect they'd have so much more goodwill at that point and it doesn't cost them anything to lose a few months since they can still build the base, already paid-for game during that time.
They could also have something real to show at that point which would be a better sell. (Though I suspect regardless they'd lose at least half the already earned funds if they have to start over)
BRIAN BLESSEDMaybe you aren't SPEAKING LOUDLY ENOUGHHHRegistered Userregular
My guess is that the transparency is because everyone keeps making assumptions as to the reasons why X is like Y or why they're trying to run a Kickstarter when Z isn't out yet.
0
Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
I mean, we already knew that if it doesn't hit 800k nothing would fund
That is how kickstarter works
That was implicit from day 1
Yeah, but they were acting like they didn't know that :P
I want to say they just misspoke - I'm sure they knew they wouldn't get to keep the money if it wasn't funded, just that if it was this is what it will be used for.
Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
edited July 2015
It's kind of a shame the anime is going to end up getting so close but probably won't make it. I'd like to see that funded. I've actually enjoyed their updates... they are kind of goofy and weird but the kickstarter has at least been run a bit better than the game's... it's a shame there is a lot less interest.
Can't post the link since I'm mobile, but yesterday's total for the Kickstarter was negative $2,000.
So, uh. Case study on what not to do on Kickstarter?
Not surprising - they had to know it would happen. Kickstarter was a lost cause anyways. Wonder why people bothered to cancel though, it will just fail and they won't be charged anyways.
What I would do:
-On the last day, post an update. Start it with a flimsy "we are still hopeful!" thing, then go into what happens when it fails
-Retire the kickstarter and make the prologue campaign. Somehow collect information on anyone who donated for later. (Not sure the best way to do this, maybe voluntary "if you'd be interested in the future" thing)
-Relaunch kickstarter after prologue is released for the rest of the game.
-Offer special bonus rewards to anyone who tried to support their first kickstarter (cheaper reward tiers, an extra bonus something - physical or digital... Something to encourage people to donate again)
-Hire freaking FanGamer to run the new one.
Can't post the link since I'm mobile, but yesterday's total for the Kickstarter was negative $2,000.
So, uh. Case study on what not to do on Kickstarter?
Not surprising - they had to know it would happen. Kickstarter was a lost cause anyways. Wonder why people bothered to cancel though, it will just fail and they won't be charged anyways.
What I would do:
-On the last day, post an update. Start it with a flimsy "we are still hopeful!" thing, then go into what happens when it fails
-Retire the kickstarter and make the prologue campaign. Somehow collect information on anyone who donated for later. (Not sure the best way to do this, maybe voluntary "if you'd be interested in the future" thing)
-Relaunch kickstarter after prologue is released for the rest of the game.
-Offer special bonus rewards to anyone who tried to support their first kickstarter (cheaper reward tiers, an extra bonus something - physical or digital... Something to encourage people to donate again)
-Hire freaking FanGamer to run the new one.
Well they released an update this morning detailing what the new stretch goals would be. It seems Fuze is funding all the meat of the game for the entire prolgue set including all the side stuff.
The kickstarter stuff (if it's funded, which it very likely won't be) will go toward a challenge mode, a new playable character, and a village reconstruction system.
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0
Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
I saw that but didn't quite understand it. So they are making all the stretch goals basically? That's kind of nice actually.
Eh, that article doesn't really say anything new. For all we know, there was some miscommunication that caused sites to list a delay when one wasn't planned. And last I saw they were confirming the delay was wrong on the official MN9 forums. So *shrug* - I mean, maybe it's delayed but I'll wait for something more concrete.
Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
If it is delayed, that last line in the article about them not informing backers is not only valid, but the outright lie of it not being delayed would make things even worse.
It would be REALLY ugly if this turns out true. And this is sad for something that turned out so promising. I originally thought this was going to scratch that Megaman itch when it was first announced but now that it is almost out I pretty much just feel like letting it go by like anything else MM related since MM10 came.
That's just someone from the forums? Also tons of games says they are not being delayed when they are.
It's a mod from the backer only forums, not just a random guy. I really doubt @Raiden333 (and all the people posting like this all over the web) is going to post "I was wrong to label them with such harsh terms over an unconfirmed rumor" if the game comes out on time.
That's just someone from the forums? Also tons of games says they are not being delayed when they are.
It's a mod from the backer only forums, not just a random guy. I really doubt @Raiden333 (and all the people posting like this all over the web) is going to post "I was wrong to label them with such harsh terms over an unconfirmed rumor" if the game comes out on time.
Considering the stakes, challenge accepted.
Edit: But if I win, you have to do all my chores for a WEEK!
Posts
I assume they thought it was a done deal based on the MN9 excitement, of course that came out of PAX Prime, not some random anime expo in the middle of june/july
Well that is certainly an interesting turn of events.
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I am like 99% sure they saw the kickstarter was not happening and maybe used it instead as a pitch to this company. I assume they didn't want to go this route if they could help it, since it leaves them beholden to a publisher.
I feel like everything they did after the first week hurt the campaign more than it helped, and now this
it's totally bizarre
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On the flip side, a game like Dragon's Crown only had a budget of $1million. Though Vanillaware added truckloads of post-release content for free after it became their best seller in company history, probably with some of the funds from those sales.
// Switch: SW-5306-0651-6424 //
Ah this didn't even occur to me. That would be the easy way, though it tends to "look shady."
Edit:
I saw that article... it came off as very much "The game I only half-disclosed I'm kickstarting is not getting funded, and I'm salty about it."
Set up a kickstarter at a questionable time, it fails, then suddenly hey look there is funding anyway.
I dunno, that really, really doesn't feel right. Especially the whole "but what you did pledge will go to extras!" even though its not a funded kickstarter. On the one hand, if the game is being released, then I would think most people have no issue with that. But on the other hand, I think its deceiving to know you wont have to pay if it isn't funded only to have to pay anyway?
This whole kickstarter being so out there now is just an ugly, ugly thing.
As far as "I don't want them to have my money anymore" the backers can always pull out right now, upon reading that. No actual money is committed until the thing is funded. Which it won't be unless 1) this announcement is EXTREMELY exciting to the community and they double they support up till now in 3 days or 2) their sugar daddy in China makes up the difference. In the latter case, people have the 3 days to decide that's shady and take back their pledge.
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PM Me if you add me!
Inticreates and Playtonic were very upfront about having private backers from the beginning . The kickstarters were essentially advertising and a way to pad the budget a bit
Kotaku has an article on Red Ash today that also links this video, saying that it "looks rough" with no elaboration. Looks neat to me, though.
As such I find MM9's backgrounds to be rather sterile - maybe that's a product of their budget, but if that's the case I feel they could have made a more vibrant world if they went with spritework. Long term I think it's a misstep in design choice.
So wait, what? Why bother pretending with stretch goals then? There is no way in hell you will fund and anyone who donated is not being charged. I'm so confused.
Edit: You know what, I wonder if they are preparing a new Kickstarter and that's why they haven't been able to reveal the stretch goals. Leave this one open in case hell freezes over, then relaunch with a waaaaaaay lower initial goal purely centered around making the game better. Plus then they aren't really dicking around people who donated under different promises but maybe didn't see this announcement to cancel their pledge. *shrug*
Though honestly if they do this, please wait a couple months after MN9 is out. I suspect they'd have so much more goodwill at that point and it doesn't cost them anything to lose a few months since they can still build the base, already paid-for game during that time.
They could also have something real to show at that point which would be a better sell. (Though I suspect regardless they'd lose at least half the already earned funds if they have to start over)
That is how kickstarter works
That was implicit from day 1
Yeah, but they were acting like they didn't know that :P
I want to say they just misspoke - I'm sure they knew they wouldn't get to keep the money if it wasn't funded, just that if it was this is what it will be used for.
So, uh. Case study on what not to do on Kickstarter?
Not surprising - they had to know it would happen. Kickstarter was a lost cause anyways. Wonder why people bothered to cancel though, it will just fail and they won't be charged anyways.
What I would do:
-On the last day, post an update. Start it with a flimsy "we are still hopeful!" thing, then go into what happens when it fails
-Retire the kickstarter and make the prologue campaign. Somehow collect information on anyone who donated for later. (Not sure the best way to do this, maybe voluntary "if you'd be interested in the future" thing)
-Relaunch kickstarter after prologue is released for the rest of the game.
-Offer special bonus rewards to anyone who tried to support their first kickstarter (cheaper reward tiers, an extra bonus something - physical or digital... Something to encourage people to donate again)
-Hire freaking FanGamer to run the new one.
Well they released an update this morning detailing what the new stretch goals would be. It seems Fuze is funding all the meat of the game for the entire prolgue set including all the side stuff.
The kickstarter stuff (if it's funded, which it very likely won't be) will go toward a challenge mode, a new playable character, and a village reconstruction system.
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PM Me if you add me!
But they'll announce more TV series, movies, comic book tie-ins, and a theatrical play in the meantime.
// Switch: SW-5306-0651-6424 //
Eh, that article doesn't really say anything new. For all we know, there was some miscommunication that caused sites to list a delay when one wasn't planned. And last I saw they were confirming the delay was wrong on the official MN9 forums. So *shrug* - I mean, maybe it's delayed but I'll wait for something more concrete.
It would be REALLY ugly if this turns out true. And this is sad for something that turned out so promising. I originally thought this was going to scratch that Megaman itch when it was first announced but now that it is almost out I pretty much just feel like letting it go by like anything else MM related since MM10 came.
I fucking knew it.
Glad I never gave these shysters a single dime.
Square Enix (the North American distributor) still has it listed for September this year.
Switch (JeffConser): SW-3353-5433-5137 Wii U: Skeldare - 3DS: 1848-1663-9345
PM Me if you add me!
It's a mod from the backer only forums, not just a random guy. I really doubt @Raiden333 (and all the people posting like this all over the web) is going to post "I was wrong to label them with such harsh terms over an unconfirmed rumor" if the game comes out on time.
Considering the stakes, challenge accepted.
Edit: But if I win, you have to do all my chores for a WEEK!