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Sid Meier's: Civilization Beyond Earth

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    OrphaneOrphane rivers of red that run to seaRegistered User regular
    edited March 2015
    Yeah they hit ectogenesis pod with a nuclear pilebunker.

    Some of the wonder changes were pretty good, mostly the whole "Wonders are just a giant pile of city stats" that made a lot of them outright bland and boring, but quite a few are still pretty so-so.

    Orphane on
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    Lord_AsmodeusLord_Asmodeus goeticSobriquet: Here is your magical cryptic riddle-tumour: I AM A TIME MACHINERegistered User regular
    http://www.civilization.com/en/games/civilization-beyond-earth-rising-tide/

    Colonize the Ocean: Build floating settlements and access natural resources hidden beneath the seas of the alien planet. Alien beasts with unique abilities inhabit the water and challenge the player in new ways. The ocean provides a fully replayable map, new gameplay mechanics and strategic possibilities for players to reign supreme on their new world.

    Dynamic Leader Traits: Players and AI Leaders alike unlock new Traits through gameplay and activate different combinations to respond to the changing world. These dynamic sets of Traits also provide benefits and add to the new Diplomacy system, governed by the new Fear and Respect attributes.

    New, Enhanced Diplomatic Options: Shape the diplomatic landscape by using political capital to upgrade your traits, change diplomatic relationships, and leverage the benefits of your allies’ traits.

    New Sponsors: Four new factions have been added to the game including Al Falah, nomad explorers descended from wealthy and resilient Middle Eastern states that possess a rich cultural and commercial heritage.

    New Artifact System: Collect and combine powerful relics to unlock new perks, unit upgrades, and buildings for your faction on the new world.

    New Hybrid Units: Affinities are competing visions for the future of humanity. By investing in multiple Affinities, rather than specializing in just one, players can unlock special hybrid Affinity units and upgrades.

    New Biomes: Two new world types have been added. Primordial worlds are rife in volcanic activity and the chaotic landscape of a world still forming. Frigid worlds have cooled in their great age, their surfaces covered with icy oceans and frozen tundra.

    Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if Labor had not first existed. Labor is superior to capital, and deserves much the higher consideration. - Lincoln
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    jdarksunjdarksun Struggler VARegistered User regular
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    WotanAnubisWotanAnubis Registered User regular
    jdarksun wrote: »
    That sounds like a step in the right direction.

    Ocean cities, better diplomacy and artifacts?

    It does start sounding more and more like Alpha Centauri, doesn't it?

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    DocshiftyDocshifty Registered User regular
    What's this? A Civ expansion that is going to reinvigorate the base game and make it a thousand times more interesting?

    Shocked, I tell you, shocked.

    Definitely gonna get it.

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    NipsNips He/Him Luxuriating in existential crisis.Registered User regular
    I love the crap out of Civ:BE, and am interested in the expansion to get back into it, but....isn't $30 pretty steep?

    I don't have the perspective of enduring Civ5 and all its expansions. It looks like that price point is typical?

    JXUBxMxP0QndjQUEnTwTxOkfKmx8kWNvuc-FUtbSz_23_DAhGKe7W9spFKLXAtkpTBqM8Dt6kQrv-rS69Hi3FheL3fays2xTeVUvWR7g5UyLHnFA0frGk1BC12GYdOSRn9lbaJB-uH0htiLPJMrc9cSRsIgk5Dx7jg9K8rJVfG43lkeAWxTgcolNscW9KO2UZjKT8GMbYAFgFvu2TaMoLH8LBA5p2pm6VNYRsQK3QGjCsze1TOv2yIbCazmDwCHmjiQxNDf6LHP35msyiXo3CxuWs9Y8DQvJjvj10kWaspRNlWHKjS5w9Y0KLuIkhQKOxgaDziG290v4zBmTi-i7OfDz-foqIqKzC9wTbn9i_uU87GRitmrNAJdzRRsaTW5VQu_XX_5gCN8XCoNyu5RWWVGTsjJuyezz1_NpFa903Uj2TnFqnL1wJ-RZiFAAd2Bdut-G1pdQtdQihsq2dx_BjtmtGC3KZRyylO1t2c12dhfb0rStq4v8pg46ciOcdtT_1qm85IgUmGd7AmgLxCFPb0xnxWZvr26G-oXSqrQdjKA1zNIInSowiHcbUO2O8S5LRJVR6vQiEg0fbGXw4vqJYEn917tnzHMh8r0xom8BLKMvoFDelk6wbEeNq8w8Eyu2ouGjEMIvvJcb2az2AKQ1uE_7gdatfKG2QdvfdSBRSc35MQ=w498-h80-no
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    jdarksunjdarksun Struggler VARegistered User regular
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    AldoAldo Hippo Hooray Registered User regular
    civ5's expansions are on sale often, but yeah they arent cheao in between discounts.

    I hope this BE expac is going to open up some proper diplomacy and a real possibility to get AI allies that dont fuck you over.

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    cptruggedcptrugged I think it has something to do with free will. Registered User regular
    Pretty jazzed about this. I think the bones of this game were solid. But it desperately needed an expansion. Those additions look like they're gonna be great.

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    General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    Water cities sound powerful. You could already create some impressive cities by terraforming the ocean tiles near coastal cities.

    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
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    JusticeforPlutoJusticeforPluto Registered User regular
    Yes yes yes!

    I already love Beyond Earth and am pumped to get more!

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    firewaterwordfirewaterword Satchitananda Pais Vasco to San FranciscoRegistered User regular
    Did they ever change how trade caravans worked? I played a few games at launch and then dropped off entirely. Wouldn't mind checking it out again once this expansion eventually goes on sale.

    Lokah Samastah Sukhino Bhavantu
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    GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Water cities sound powerful. You could already create some impressive cities by terraforming the ocean tiles near coastal cities.

    Terraforming is kind of weak really. It's not bad because often you have an excess of petroleum and so dropping some food/prod satellites isn't a bad idea. But in terms of overall power it takes too long to be an effective strategy, if you have shit land you have shit land. Build troops

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    WotanAnubisWotanAnubis Registered User regular
    Did they ever change how trade caravans worked? I played a few games at launch and then dropped off entirely. Wouldn't mind checking it out again once this expansion eventually goes on sale.

    They limited the number of trade routes a city can have (now the maximum number is largely dictated by a city's population size) and they auto-renew their trade routes until you explicitly tell a trade route not to renew after its current round.

    So they changed them a bit.

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    BobbleBobble Registered User regular
    Think they also reduced the yields on internal trade a bit.

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    firewaterwordfirewaterword Satchitananda Pais Vasco to San FranciscoRegistered User regular
    Did they ever change how trade caravans worked? I played a few games at launch and then dropped off entirely. Wouldn't mind checking it out again once this expansion eventually goes on sale.

    They limited the number of trade routes a city can have (now the maximum number is largely dictated by a city's population size) and they auto-renew their trade routes until you explicitly tell a trade route not to renew after its current round.

    So they changed them a bit.

    Neat. Having to renew the routes is more or less what made me stop playing after a while.

    Lokah Samastah Sukhino Bhavantu
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    GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Truthfully there are still too many

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    No Great NameNo Great Name FRAUD DETECTED Registered User regular
    Yay

    PSN: NoGreatName Steam:SirToons Twitch: SirToons
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    RethiusRethius Registered User regular
    I so want this expansion to be awesome. I think the feature I'm most excited about is additional leaders. The same neighbors got pretty stale in my games.

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    GlyphGlyph Registered User regular
    It doesn't matter if they're just as lifeless as the ones we have.

    Let's face it, Firaxis charged players for a glorified beta test.

    And now they want us to keep shelling out for content that should've been in the original game.

    Shameful. Absolutely shameful.

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    DocshiftyDocshifty Registered User regular
    Glyph wrote: »
    It doesn't matter if they're just as lifeless as the ones we have.

    Let's face it, Firaxis charged players for a glorified beta test.

    And now they want us to keep shelling out for content that should've been in the original game.

    Shameful. Absolutely shameful.

    If that's true of BE, then that's true of every Civ game past II. The method clearly works for them.

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    jdarksunjdarksun Struggler VARegistered User regular
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    JusticeforPlutoJusticeforPluto Registered User regular
    Yeah, I guess I never really got the complaints for BE. I know what Firaxis' strategy is. Base game, 2 or more big Xpacs for additional content, lots of little fun DLCs. BE launched with more content that Civ 5 did at launch, but then at launch everyone said 4 was better cause it had more content.

    Still, even with bare bones content I get 40 hours outta that game! And my computer died! I'd still be playing it if I could.

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    cB557cB557 voOOP Registered User regular
    I can't think of any other instance in which people would think "yeah, it's bad at release but after like, five expansions it'll be good" was acceptable for a game, much less SOP for a franchise.

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    Commander ZoomCommander Zoom Registered User regular
    Elder Scrolls? :/

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    DocshiftyDocshifty Registered User regular
    cB557 wrote: »
    I can't think of any other instance in which people would think "yeah, it's bad at release but after like, five expansions it'll be good" was acceptable for a game, much less SOP for a franchise.

    Didn't say it was bad. I don't think it is bad. I think it is mediocre, I got my fun out of it, and I'll get even more when the expansion comes out.

    The franchise isn't "Release bad game, then make awesome with expansions" but more "Release solid foundation, if light on content, then fill in with expansions"

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    AldoAldo Hippo Hooray Registered User regular
    Elder Scrolls? :/

    Sims?

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    cB557cB557 voOOP Registered User regular
    Docshifty wrote: »
    cB557 wrote: »
    I can't think of any other instance in which people would think "yeah, it's bad at release but after like, five expansions it'll be good" was acceptable for a game, much less SOP for a franchise.

    Didn't say it was bad. I don't think it is bad. I think it is mediocre, I got my fun out of it, and I'll get even more when the expansion comes out.

    The franchise isn't "Release bad game, then make awesome with expansions" but more "Release solid foundation, if light on content, then fill in with expansions"
    After spending sixty bucks, mediocrity starts to look pretty damn bad.

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    TerrendosTerrendos Decorative Monocle Registered User regular
    60 bucks is kind of a deal though, when you think about it. 20 years ago games cost 60 bucks when they first released, and they cost the same now. It's no wonder game companies are leaning so heavily on things like microtransactions and DLC and expansion packs, considering that games have only gotten more expensive to make and, after inflation, are as cheap/cheaper than ever.

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    DocshiftyDocshifty Registered User regular
    cB557 wrote: »
    Docshifty wrote: »
    cB557 wrote: »
    I can't think of any other instance in which people would think "yeah, it's bad at release but after like, five expansions it'll be good" was acceptable for a game, much less SOP for a franchise.

    Didn't say it was bad. I don't think it is bad. I think it is mediocre, I got my fun out of it, and I'll get even more when the expansion comes out.

    The franchise isn't "Release bad game, then make awesome with expansions" but more "Release solid foundation, if light on content, then fill in with expansions"
    After spending sixty bucks, mediocrity starts to look pretty damn bad.

    Fair enough point, though I'd counter that since 60 bucks is the accepted pricepoint for a new game, BE mediocrity is far better than many games with that tag.

    And unlike those games, BE has a near guarantee of improvement through expansions, since, as said, that's what Firaxis has done for a good fifteen years now.

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    jdarksunjdarksun Struggler VARegistered User regular
    And hey, you can play it, which puts it head and shoulders above the new Batman game.

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    GlyphGlyph Registered User regular
    edited June 2015
    Yeah, I guess I never really got the complaints for BE. I know what Firaxis' strategy is. Base game, 2 or more big Xpacs for additional content, lots of little fun DLCs. BE launched with more content that Civ 5 did at launch, but then at launch everyone said 4 was better cause it had more content.

    Still, even with bare bones content I get 40 hours outta that game! And my computer died! I'd still be playing it if I could.

    This would be forgivable if they were starting from scratch with a new engine... but they're not. They just took Civ 5 BNW and stripped it down so it actually feels more like an earlier version with a sci fi skin.

    And I don't mean "earlier version" as in like a previous installment of the civ franchise. I mean this literally feels like a "proof of concept" pilot game as a pitch for publishers, not something anyone should pay serious money for at retail.

    Everything from culture to city-states to wonders to diplomacy has been dumbed down with no payoff. No great persons, no unique buildings or units or eras to give you a sense of scale. Even the aliens are less fun than barbarians because they can mostly be avoided, and attacking them can actually incur a diplomatic penalty.

    Why would anyone approve of this?

    And why does the game feel so sterile and predictable? I'm on an alien world here, things aren't supposed to go exactly as planned, and mankind is supposedly being tested. There should be a whole mess of problems we need to deal with that keeps us on our toes, from aliens springing out of burrows within our borders to natural disasters and extreme weather conditions destroying some of our improvements (or at least the option to turn these on in the setup screen). Those features were available in SMAC, so why not here? How come taming the planet is as simple as paving cities and improvements over the landscape like I'm back on Earth? What's alien about ANY of this?

    Instead, I feel like I'm playing on a static world where nothing actually happens; it's just a backdrop to compete with other factions that also don't seem like they know what they're doing. It's like rather than exploring a living, breathing alien world, I've been put on a giant sound stage with cardboard cutouts of plants and resources and theme park animatronic aliens on rails.

    Docshifty wrote: »
    If that's true of BE, then that's true of every Civ game past II. The method clearly works for them.

    But that's NOT how it's been for every Civ game past 2. Not at all. SMAC, Civ 3 and 4 didn't need expansions to make them feel complete and the expansions actually changed little in the way of gameplay. It only really started with Civ 5, and even then they were trying something completely new with hexes and 1UPT so it was understandable. What's the excuse now? BE is such a reskin that the devs actually joked about the aliens capturing workers in earlier versions because they were still running off Civ 5 barbarian scripts. WHAT THE HELL.

    So now we have no more religions, luxuries, great persons, cultural victories, eras, unique buildings/units, world congresses, city-states, leader backdrops, strategic view, super weapons, citizens rioting when they're unhappy/unhealthy, chances to recover your workers when aliens nab them, and so on and so forth. And very little to take their place. Yay, an orbital layer I never use. Yay, a tech web that makes me miss the tech tree. And... and... excavation sites... I guess.

    And notice how workers stay the same "astronaut driving a forklift" throughout the entire game instead of changing their appearance with your affinity, even though in Civ 5 their model changes as you approach the modern era. Cities don't even show smoke after they've been attacked. They're just... blacker? Half the time I don't even think I see explosive effects.

    All minor things to be sure... but it really does add up in the end to show that a lot less care and attention to detail went into BE.

    Glyph on
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    schussschuss Registered User regular
    Docshifty wrote: »
    cB557 wrote: »
    Docshifty wrote: »
    cB557 wrote: »
    I can't think of any other instance in which people would think "yeah, it's bad at release but after like, five expansions it'll be good" was acceptable for a game, much less SOP for a franchise.

    Didn't say it was bad. I don't think it is bad. I think it is mediocre, I got my fun out of it, and I'll get even more when the expansion comes out.

    The franchise isn't "Release bad game, then make awesome with expansions" but more "Release solid foundation, if light on content, then fill in with expansions"
    After spending sixty bucks, mediocrity starts to look pretty damn bad.

    Fair enough point, though I'd counter that since 60 bucks is the accepted pricepoint for a new game, BE mediocrity is far better than many games with that tag.

    And unlike those games, BE has a near guarantee of improvement through expansions, since, as said, that's what Firaxis has done for a good fifteen years now.

    Yeah, it's really unfair to compare BE to the refinement of Civ Brave New World. That's a LOT of data that led to that, and they dismantled or changed some key systems. I think the one mote of truth in here is that the price point could come down, but the incremental approach coupled with starting small with some core systems is central to many successful software development projects. Putting too much in too early would potentially mask the influence or effectiveness of certain systems.
    Although I must also agree - they didn't go wild ENOUGH, as it's rare that you feel "unsafe", when really it should be all the damn time.

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    DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    They definitely did not capture any of the magic that was present in Alpha Centauri. That was a game that was making bold choices (that were also amazingly broken.)

    Nod. Get treat. PSN: Quippish
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    BeefersBeefers Registered User regular
    Glyph wrote: »
    But that's NOT how it's been for every Civ game past 2. Not at all. SMAC, Civ 3 and 4 didn't need expansions to make them feel complete and the expansions actually changed little in the way of gameplay. It only really started with Civ 5.
    ^This is simply untrue on many different levels.

    Honestly if you arent playing BE like a TBS Command&Conquer game you probably aren't going to like it. It does an amazing job of laying out streamlined and efficient combat systems that provides the most well balanced multiplayer effort for a Civ game yet (By a LARGE margin). Now if balance isn't your thing, and neither is multiplayer then there isn't really any reason to play this over Civ5. However if you and your friends are all a bunch of warmongers who like to duke it out over an afternoon then this is the best Civ by far in my experience. On the other hand when it comes to role playing a civilization in either single or multi, its probably best to look somewhere else in the franchise (likewise if you are looking for diversity of choices rather then weight of progression).

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    BasilBasil Registered User regular
    Someone throw in a "Slap in the face" so I can fill in this last box on my bingo card.

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    DarkewolfeDarkewolfe Registered User regular
    edited June 2015
    Basil wrote: »
    Someone throw in a "Slap in the face" so I can fill in this last box on my bingo card.

    Literally multiple Hitlers.

    Darkewolfe on
    What is this I don't even.
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    see317see317 Registered User regular
    Darkewolfe wrote: »
    Basil wrote: »
    Someone throw in a "Slap in the face" so I can fill in this last box on my bingo card.

    Literally multiple Hitlers.

    Are we measuring using Kilo-Hitlers yet?

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    GlyphGlyph Registered User regular
    schuss wrote: »
    Yeah, it's really unfair to compare BE to the refinement of Civ Brave New World.

    It really isn't. These aren't a bunch of amateur modders working out of a basement. They're a professional company with actual experience and resources and many of their missteps were remarkably short-sighted, such as adding more trade routes per city and with no way to put them on auto-renew until players complained about it. Also having super weapons linked to the intrigue system, so you're guaranteed to never be able to do this game's equivalent to dropping a nuke if the other faction just makes intrigue-mitigating buildings.
    Although I must also agree - they didn't go wild ENOUGH, as it's rare that you feel "unsafe", when really it should be all the damn time.

    Not only that but you actually feel safer than in Civ 5, with the aliens barely ever attacking and the other factions being so passive.
    Beefers wrote: »
    ^This is simply untrue on many different levels.

    Honestly if you arent playing BE like a TBS Command&Conquer game you probably aren't going to like it. It does an amazing job of laying out streamlined and efficient combat systems that provides the most well balanced multiplayer effort for a Civ game yet (By a LARGE margin). Now if balance isn't your thing, and neither is multiplayer then there isn't really any reason to play this over Civ5. However if you and your friends are all a bunch of warmongers who like to duke it out over an afternoon then this is the best Civ by far in my experience. On the other hand when it comes to role playing a civilization in either single or multi, its probably best to look somewhere else in the franchise (likewise if you are looking for diversity of choices rather then weight of progression).

    So in order to enjoy this game, I have to pretend it's NOT a sci-fi Civ game where the single-player experience should be every bit as fun as the multi-player gameplay?

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    BeefersBeefers Registered User regular
    edited June 2015
    Glyph wrote: »
    So in order to enjoy this game, I have to pretend it's NOT a sci-fi Civ game where the single-player experience should be every bit as fun as the multi-player gameplay?

    Yup, pretty much hits the nail on the head from my experience. Hence why I don't feel the hate is necessarily unjustified. There is a quality product somewhere in there, just not the product most people wanted.

    Beefers on
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