Brainiac 8Don't call me Shirley...Registered Userregular
edited July 2014
My original response would be that 'Because they'd have to pay Konami for it'...but then a couple days ago we found out that Nintendo paid Ubisoft for the privilege of making a Rayman trophy...for some reason....so basically I don't even know any more.
My original response would be that 'Because they'd have to pay Konomi for it'...but then a couple days ago we found out that Nintendo paid Ubisoft for the privilege of making a Rayman trophy...for some reason....so basically I don't even know any more.
Do we know that? I could see Ubisoft asking them to put something in the game since it's great advertising.
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Yeah, I think my home run contest record still belongs to Roy. Roy is baller. /no bias
Looking at Lucina, I wonder how or if they're going to differentiate old clones like Ganondorf and Falco/Wolf though, since Sakurai mentioned he doesn't want too many clones. I think Dorf, Falco and Wolf are different enough; some of their specials, tilts and aerials have completely different properties than their counterpart. He probably doesn't want to piss off the smash community too much either. We'll know soon enough!
This is Sakurai you're talking about right
Hey, he removed tripping (I think) and he added final destinations to everything, so he must care!
More than those I'd say the biggest nod to the community is keeping the gc controllers usable. But still he has a strange relationship with the long-term crowd.
It's really more a matter of him trying to appeal to the long-term crowd and the more casual crowd at the same time.
Personally I think he's doing a great job of keeping things balanced this time around with the whole for fun/for glory thing, but I get the feeling that as long as he's still throwing in crazy crap for more casual players the hardcore will never be 100% satisfied.
If the fundamentals were good the hardcore crowd wouldn't care how much crazy crap was in it. Even if brawl didn't have tripping it would still not be held at near the same high regard as melee because of a variety of game system changes that promote defensive, unexciting matches at a high level.
Eh, the fundamentals were good enough for pretty much everyone who doesn't participate in fighting tournaments.
This is what kills me, no one playing casually really cares or notices how much landing lag there is, or if horizontal momentum is preserved when jumping, etc - so I feel like you might as well make these aspects in such a way that they can be appreciated by the only ones who would care to begin with
And it does have a bit of impact on less hardcore fans as well - there's a growing sentiment of "man I hope Smash 4 is good enough that it'll put an end to melee at these tournaments I'm so sick of watching it". Some people interpret this as the melee players just being extremely stuck in their ways, but if the new system isn't even comparable at a high level why would they switch? It's a common joke that high level players play fox only, no items, final destination, but from their point of view it's everyone else playing a boring game without options when the system is restrictive.
Roy was awesome. His charge move was so strong he hurt himself doing it. Fuck practicality, that's cooool.
I'm not crazy about all the Fire Emblem reps. It's neat, but they all feel a little samey. Want another swordfighter, how about Isaac from Golden Sun? Or a rep from Shin Megami Tensei?
Marth/Lucina, Ike, and Robin play about as differently as it's possible for them to play given their fighting styles in their respective games. I mean, Robin is even a magic user.
In no way are they samey, outside of Lucina being a clone
I'm just bummed there's so much Fire Emblem representation when there's so many things getting no love.
Like how Sony Smash Bros had 2 versions of Cole from inFamous (which played differently) but no Crash Bandicoot, Lara Croft or Cloud Strife. It's cool your license allows for more than one rep, but at the expense of having a wider variety? Ehhhh.
But the most requested characters from people complaining seem to be from Golden Sun. AKA, more guys with swords. Only from a franchise with 3 installments instead of 13 (or 14, depending if you count the download only title), crappy sales for the (further back) most recent installment, and, well...
Golden Sun sucks.
Plenty of variety. No reason to ignore a franchise suddenly jumping a few tiers in popularity.
Haha, like how good a game is matters. Just look at Fire Emblem. They have two characters from Awakening.
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chiasaur11Never doubt a raccoon.Do you think it's trademarked?Registered Userregular
Roy was awesome. His charge move was so strong he hurt himself doing it. Fuck practicality, that's cooool.
I'm not crazy about all the Fire Emblem reps. It's neat, but they all feel a little samey. Want another swordfighter, how about Isaac from Golden Sun? Or a rep from Shin Megami Tensei?
Marth/Lucina, Ike, and Robin play about as differently as it's possible for them to play given their fighting styles in their respective games. I mean, Robin is even a magic user.
In no way are they samey, outside of Lucina being a clone
I'm just bummed there's so much Fire Emblem representation when there's so many things getting no love.
Like how Sony Smash Bros had 2 versions of Cole from inFamous (which played differently) but no Crash Bandicoot, Lara Croft or Cloud Strife. It's cool your license allows for more than one rep, but at the expense of having a wider variety? Ehhhh.
But the most requested characters from people complaining seem to be from Golden Sun. AKA, more guys with swords. Only from a franchise with 3 installments instead of 13 (or 14, depending if you count the download only title), crappy sales for the (further back) most recent installment, and, well...
Golden Sun sucks.
Plenty of variety. No reason to ignore a franchise suddenly jumping a few tiers in popularity.
Haha, like how good a game is matters. Just look at Fire Emblem. They have two characters from Awakening.
Roy was awesome. His charge move was so strong he hurt himself doing it. Fuck practicality, that's cooool.
I'm not crazy about all the Fire Emblem reps. It's neat, but they all feel a little samey. Want another swordfighter, how about Isaac from Golden Sun? Or a rep from Shin Megami Tensei?
Marth/Lucina, Ike, and Robin play about as differently as it's possible for them to play given their fighting styles in their respective games. I mean, Robin is even a magic user.
In no way are they samey, outside of Lucina being a clone
I'm just bummed there's so much Fire Emblem representation when there's so many things getting no love.
Like how Sony Smash Bros had 2 versions of Cole from inFamous (which played differently) but no Crash Bandicoot, Lara Croft or Cloud Strife. It's cool your license allows for more than one rep, but at the expense of having a wider variety? Ehhhh.
But the most requested characters from people complaining seem to be from Golden Sun. AKA, more guys with swords. Only from a franchise with 3 installments instead of 13 (or 14, depending if you count the download only title), crappy sales for the (further back) most recent installment, and, well...
Golden Sun sucks.
Plenty of variety. No reason to ignore a franchise suddenly jumping a few tiers in popularity.
Haha, like how good a game is matters. Just look at Fire Emblem. They have two characters from Awakening.
Was awakening not very well received? I've been picking up that it was Super Good?
Roy was awesome. His charge move was so strong he hurt himself doing it. Fuck practicality, that's cooool.
I'm not crazy about all the Fire Emblem reps. It's neat, but they all feel a little samey. Want another swordfighter, how about Isaac from Golden Sun? Or a rep from Shin Megami Tensei?
Marth/Lucina, Ike, and Robin play about as differently as it's possible for them to play given their fighting styles in their respective games. I mean, Robin is even a magic user.
In no way are they samey, outside of Lucina being a clone
I'm just bummed there's so much Fire Emblem representation when there's so many things getting no love.
Like how Sony Smash Bros had 2 versions of Cole from inFamous (which played differently) but no Crash Bandicoot, Lara Croft or Cloud Strife. It's cool your license allows for more than one rep, but at the expense of having a wider variety? Ehhhh.
But the most requested characters from people complaining seem to be from Golden Sun. AKA, more guys with swords. Only from a franchise with 3 installments instead of 13 (or 14, depending if you count the download only title), crappy sales for the (further back) most recent installment, and, well...
Golden Sun sucks.
Plenty of variety. No reason to ignore a franchise suddenly jumping a few tiers in popularity.
Haha, like how good a game is matters. Just look at Fire Emblem. They have two characters from Awakening.
Was awakening not very well received? I've been picking up that it was Super Good?
It was. Fantastic sales, great reviews, massive fandom love. (Mind, with some grumbling about weak map design in the second half from some of the longer term fans, but generally it was liked there too.) It's quite literally the game that saved the franchise.
Awakening is okay. I guess. Still, if Sakurai had massive balls he would have invited Sigurd, Hector and/or Ephraim. Sigurd because it's a classic, unlike Awakening, and Hector and Ephraim because of the potentially different move sets. Instead he chose flavour of the month.
My original response would be that 'Because they'd have to pay Konomi for it'...but then a couple days ago we found out that Nintendo paid Ubisoft for the privilege of making a Rayman trophy...for some reason....so basically I don't even know any more.
Ubisoft paid nintendo. This is advertising for them.
I have a podcast now. It's about video games and anime!Find it here.
My original response would be that 'Because they'd have to pay Konomi for it'...but then a couple days ago we found out that Nintendo paid Ubisoft for the privilege of making a Rayman trophy...for some reason....so basically I don't even know any more.
Ubisoft paid nintendo. This is advertising for them.
Traditionally what happens in cases like this is that the maker of the product pays the holder of the IP they're borrowing, either a flat fee or a percentage of the profits.
Though it's possible things have been reversed (it does in certain situations, generally when a powerful party wants to give a struggling party a break), I'd be surprised Ubisoft saw this as a source of advertising considering they're the ones who just said they're not releasing a finished Wii U game until the console sells more. So my money's on Nintendo paying Ubisoft.
But we'll never know for sure until Sakurai pipes up on how the hell Rayman wound up in there to begin with.
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Brainiac 8Don't call me Shirley...Registered Userregular
Fire Emblem Awakening was easily the best game in the series for me. Great story and characters. Fantastic maps most of the time with some weaker ones during the second half.
I cannot say too much about Golden Sun. I didn't like the DS one very much but have been told by fans of the series that it was the weakest game in the series. I haven't played the earlier ones though, I bought the first game on VC and just haven't gotten around to playing it yet. Hopefully soon.
Roy was awesome. His charge move was so strong he hurt himself doing it. Fuck practicality, that's cooool.
I'm not crazy about all the Fire Emblem reps. It's neat, but they all feel a little samey. Want another swordfighter, how about Isaac from Golden Sun? Or a rep from Shin Megami Tensei?
Marth/Lucina, Ike, and Robin play about as differently as it's possible for them to play given their fighting styles in their respective games. I mean, Robin is even a magic user.
In no way are they samey, outside of Lucina being a clone
I'm just bummed there's so much Fire Emblem representation when there's so many things getting no love.
Like how Sony Smash Bros had 2 versions of Cole from inFamous (which played differently) but no Crash Bandicoot, Lara Croft or Cloud Strife. It's cool your license allows for more than one rep, but at the expense of having a wider variety? Ehhhh.
But the most requested characters from people complaining seem to be from Golden Sun. AKA, more guys with swords. Only from a franchise with 3 installments instead of 13 (or 14, depending if you count the download only title), crappy sales for the (further back) most recent installment, and, well...
Golden Sun sucks.
Plenty of variety. No reason to ignore a franchise suddenly jumping a few tiers in popularity.
Much of that recent popularity came from Marth and Roy's appearance in Melee introducing Fire Emblem to the West. Why not give other series the same chance? Maybe the last Golden Sun game would've performed better if that series had a bigger appearance in Brawl. If not Golden Sun, how about Advance Wars with a dozen games over its twenty year history and only an assist trophy and a few stickers to show for it?
Additionally, one of the reasons Isaac is so often requested is because he can do a lot more than just swing a sword around. He's got so many different telekinetic, earth and plant-based abilities that he wouldn't need his weapon for more than a handful of basic attacks. Why bother with a sword when you can pound someone with a psychic fist, launch boulders, raise stone spires, summon thorny vines and tear the earth asunder? Heck, he doesn't even use his sword in Brawl.
My original response would be that 'Because they'd have to pay Konomi for it'...but then a couple days ago we found out that Nintendo paid Ubisoft for the privilege of making a Rayman trophy...for some reason....so basically I don't even know any more.
Ubisoft paid nintendo. This is advertising for them.
Traditionally what happens in cases like this is that the maker of the product pays the holder of the IP they're borrowing, either a flat fee or a percentage of the profits.
Though it's possible things have been reversed (it does in certain situations, generally when a powerful party wants to give a struggling party a break), I'd be surprised Ubisoft saw this as a source of advertising considering they're the ones who just said they're not releasing a finished Wii U game until the console sells more. So my money's on Nintendo paying Ubisoft.
But we'll never know for sure until Sakurai pipes up on how the hell Rayman wound up in there to begin with.
Unless they're waiting until a certain Ubisoft character is announced for Smash Bros before announcing the game.
No the president of Ubisoft wants to compete with EA and part of that is shitting on Nintendo by holding nine fucking games back from retail and saying the wiiu has no games
I have a podcast now. It's about video games and anime!Find it here.
Call me a non-believer but Advanced Wars still seems pretty shakey.
Most of the new newcomers have recent games backing them at least. Pac-man is a notable exception but he's pretty much an exception in every regard.
Even Brawl was marked mostly by newcomers who came from recent games, right? Pit is a bit of an exception there. I'm pretty sure Kid Icarus: Uprising was after Brawl.
Advanced Wars hasn't had a new game since early DS days and that game diverged from the normal cast which makes picking a "main character" even harder.
I'd be pretty pumped about seeing an Advanced Wars character in Smash but I think it's real unlikely.
Pretty much the only hope I have for it is we have this Like New, Slighty Used abandoned moveset from snake that some other soldier-type character could pick up
Looking at the revealed character list... every single newcomer has been in a game released after Brawl. And if you include the F-Zero minigame from Nintendoland, you can extend that to every veteran as well.
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Nintendo Network ID - PirateLuigi 3DS: 3136-6586-7691
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I'd say that 95% of characters for a Smash have to either be from a recent game or be an iconic character from a influenital game/series from the past.
The history of Advanced Wars is pretty bad for that. I'm not sure where you're getting 12 games from but I am guessing you're bringing in the history of Famicom Wars and maybe Battalion Wars (was that intelligent systems...?). Those games don't really share anything with Advanced Wars other than gameplay though so it makes actually picking out a character even tougher.
I'd say you're probably more likely to get a character from Days of Ruin at this point right? That game actually had a protagonist. Even then you don't even play Will for most of the campaign. He does fight in the final mission at least.
It's just such a tough series to bring a character from that doesn't have any limelight from a recent game. I think if a recent game or product sells well enough then they're basically good to go. Awakening sold excellently so we've got this update. Wii Fit trainer is hilarious but it's the power of the Wii Fit that actually bought that pair in. The new Animal Crossing was pretty huge from what I understand.
While I would love for there to be a "Pit" to rise from Advanced Wars and then spurn a brand new game I dunno who it could possibly be.
Looking at the revealed character list... every single newcomer has been in a game released after Brawl. And if you include the F-Zero minigame from Nintendoland, you can extend that to every veteran as well.
Looking at the revealed character list... every single newcomer has been in a game released after Brawl. And if you include the F-Zero minigame from Nintendoland, you can extend that to every veteran as well.
Looking at the revealed character list... every single newcomer has been in a game released after Brawl. And if you include the F-Zero minigame from Nintendoland, you can extend that to every veteran as well.
I would actually like to see a Fire Emblem villain make it to Smash. The Black Knight might be the best candidate, since he's essentially Main Character power level. Eclipse as a final smash would be radical as shit.
Yeah. Sure. The sword is what literally anyone asking for a Golden Sun character cares about.
God knows it cant be the enthralling character of Issac.
Well, obviously my first choice would be Sveta, not Isaac, both in terms of character and abilities.
But Isaac's still got his share of sweet moves. Earthquakes, stalactite drops, bramble growth, fiery air dives, giant psychic hands, summons, and the occasional exploding giant swords.
Personality wise, you're right. Isaac and Matthew and to an extent Felix are pretty much interchangeable. They've got that Mother-style rotating protagonist silence thing going on, without the charm of parody.
Roy was awesome. His charge move was so strong he hurt himself doing it. Fuck practicality, that's cooool.
I'm not crazy about all the Fire Emblem reps. It's neat, but they all feel a little samey. Want another swordfighter, how about Isaac from Golden Sun? Or a rep from Shin Megami Tensei?
Final Smash is eating other combatants for their magnetite-rich flesh.
Advance Wars is a continuation of the Wars series. In Japan it was named after the system (Famicom Wars, Super Famicom Wars, Game Boy Wars, etc). I guess they didn't think Americans were smart enough to make a connection between Advance Wars and DS Wars, so the Advance name stuck. So yes, it a series with a long history, but similar to Fire Emblem that history is mostly Japan-only.
Advance Wars is a continuation of the Wars series. In Japan it was named after the system (Famicom Wars, Super Famicom Wars, Game Boy Wars, etc). I guess they didn't think Americans were smart enough to make a connection between Advance Wars and DS Wars, so the Advance name stuck. So yes, it a series with a long history, but similar to Fire Emblem that history is mostly Japan-only.
Roy was awesome. His charge move was so strong he hurt himself doing it. Fuck practicality, that's cooool.
I'm not crazy about all the Fire Emblem reps. It's neat, but they all feel a little samey. Want another swordfighter, how about Isaac from Golden Sun? Or a rep from Shin Megami Tensei?
Marth/Lucina, Ike, and Robin play about as differently as it's possible for them to play given their fighting styles in their respective games. I mean, Robin is even a magic user.
In no way are they samey, outside of Lucina being a clone
I'm just bummed there's so much Fire Emblem representation when there's so many things getting no love.
Like how Sony Smash Bros had 2 versions of Cole from inFamous (which played differently) but no Crash Bandicoot, Lara Croft or Cloud Strife. It's cool your license allows for more than one rep, but at the expense of having a wider variety? Ehhhh.
But the most requested characters from people complaining seem to be from Golden Sun. AKA, more guys with swords. Only from a franchise with 3 installments instead of 13 (or 14, depending if you count the download only title), crappy sales for the (further back) most recent installment, and, well...
Golden Sun sucks.
Plenty of variety. No reason to ignore a franchise suddenly jumping a few tiers in popularity.
Much of that recent popularity came from Marth and Roy's appearance in Melee introducing Fire Emblem to the West. Why not give other series the same chance? Maybe the last Golden Sun game would've performed better if that series had a bigger appearance in Brawl. If not Golden Sun, how about Advance Wars with a dozen games over its twenty year history and only an assist trophy and a few stickers to show for it?
Additionally, one of the reasons Isaac is so often requested is because he can do a lot more than just swing a sword around. He's got so many different telekinetic, earth and plant-based abilities that he wouldn't need his weapon for more than a handful of basic attacks. Why bother with a sword when you can pound someone with a psychic fist, launch boulders, raise stone spires, summon thorny vines and tear the earth asunder? Heck, he doesn't even use his sword in Brawl.
Isaac's sword is only a handle attached to the sun.
I would like to see a few assist trophies based on AW COs. Have the CO appear and use their CO power, like Sami using Double Time to increase ground speed and basic attack power for the person who summoned her. The 4 AW games we got over the GBA/DS are good enough (in quantity and quality) that it really should get a bit more representation in items and trophies at least.
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I really wish I could actually catch the Japan Time Podcast when it actually runs, because it seems like every single episode that happens after something dynamic (like the Robin/Lucina/Captain Falcon reveal), they manage to spend ten minutes arguing about something that gets explained the very next day and it's infuriating to sit through. (The issue in question is "Lucina is totally an alternate costume for Marth, you guys".)
My favorite musical instrument is the air-raid siren.
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Do we know that? I could see Ubisoft asking them to put something in the game since it's great advertising.
Nintendo Network ID - PirateLuigi 3DS: 3136-6586-7691
G&T Grass Type Pokemon Gym Leader, In-Game Name: Dan
This is what kills me, no one playing casually really cares or notices how much landing lag there is, or if horizontal momentum is preserved when jumping, etc - so I feel like you might as well make these aspects in such a way that they can be appreciated by the only ones who would care to begin with
And it does have a bit of impact on less hardcore fans as well - there's a growing sentiment of "man I hope Smash 4 is good enough that it'll put an end to melee at these tournaments I'm so sick of watching it". Some people interpret this as the melee players just being extremely stuck in their ways, but if the new system isn't even comparable at a high level why would they switch? It's a common joke that high level players play fox only, no items, final destination, but from their point of view it's everyone else playing a boring game without options when the system is restrictive.
Haha, like how good a game is matters. Just look at Fire Emblem. They have two characters from Awakening.
One of the best games of 2013, yes.
Thanks for demonstrating my point so succinctly.
Why I fear the ocean.
Was awakening not very well received? I've been picking up that it was Super Good?
It was. Fantastic sales, great reviews, massive fandom love. (Mind, with some grumbling about weak map design in the second half from some of the longer term fans, but generally it was liked there too.) It's quite literally the game that saved the franchise.
Chen just has Bad Fire Emblem Opinions.
Why I fear the ocean.
Ubisoft paid nintendo. This is advertising for them.
Traditionally what happens in cases like this is that the maker of the product pays the holder of the IP they're borrowing, either a flat fee or a percentage of the profits.
Though it's possible things have been reversed (it does in certain situations, generally when a powerful party wants to give a struggling party a break), I'd be surprised Ubisoft saw this as a source of advertising considering they're the ones who just said they're not releasing a finished Wii U game until the console sells more. So my money's on Nintendo paying Ubisoft.
But we'll never know for sure until Sakurai pipes up on how the hell Rayman wound up in there to begin with.
I cannot say too much about Golden Sun. I didn't like the DS one very much but have been told by fans of the series that it was the weakest game in the series. I haven't played the earlier ones though, I bought the first game on VC and just haven't gotten around to playing it yet. Hopefully soon.
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Much of that recent popularity came from Marth and Roy's appearance in Melee introducing Fire Emblem to the West. Why not give other series the same chance? Maybe the last Golden Sun game would've performed better if that series had a bigger appearance in Brawl. If not Golden Sun, how about Advance Wars with a dozen games over its twenty year history and only an assist trophy and a few stickers to show for it?
Additionally, one of the reasons Isaac is so often requested is because he can do a lot more than just swing a sword around. He's got so many different telekinetic, earth and plant-based abilities that he wouldn't need his weapon for more than a handful of basic attacks. Why bother with a sword when you can pound someone with a psychic fist, launch boulders, raise stone spires, summon thorny vines and tear the earth asunder? Heck, he doesn't even use his sword in Brawl.
Unless they're waiting until a certain Ubisoft character is announced for Smash Bros before announcing the game.
Eh? BG&E2 WiiU exclusive? Eh?
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Most of the new newcomers have recent games backing them at least. Pac-man is a notable exception but he's pretty much an exception in every regard.
Even Brawl was marked mostly by newcomers who came from recent games, right? Pit is a bit of an exception there. I'm pretty sure Kid Icarus: Uprising was after Brawl.
Advanced Wars hasn't had a new game since early DS days and that game diverged from the normal cast which makes picking a "main character" even harder.
I'd be pretty pumped about seeing an Advanced Wars character in Smash but I think it's real unlikely.
Nintendo Network ID - PirateLuigi 3DS: 3136-6586-7691
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The history of Advanced Wars is pretty bad for that. I'm not sure where you're getting 12 games from but I am guessing you're bringing in the history of Famicom Wars and maybe Battalion Wars (was that intelligent systems...?). Those games don't really share anything with Advanced Wars other than gameplay though so it makes actually picking out a character even tougher.
I'd say you're probably more likely to get a character from Days of Ruin at this point right? That game actually had a protagonist. Even then you don't even play Will for most of the campaign. He does fight in the final mission at least.
It's just such a tough series to bring a character from that doesn't have any limelight from a recent game. I think if a recent game or product sells well enough then they're basically good to go. Awakening sold excellently so we've got this update. Wii Fit trainer is hilarious but it's the power of the Wii Fit that actually bought that pair in. The new Animal Crossing was pretty huge from what I understand.
While I would love for there to be a "Pit" to rise from Advanced Wars and then spurn a brand new game I dunno who it could possibly be.
God knows it cant be the enthralling character of Issac.
Not Mega Man.
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Mega Man 9 and 10 came after Brawl.
Also that shitty MMX iOS port.
Oh, you're right. I thought 9/10 were pre-Brawl
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Well, obviously my first choice would be Sveta, not Isaac, both in terms of character and abilities.
But Isaac's still got his share of sweet moves. Earthquakes, stalactite drops, bramble growth, fiery air dives, giant psychic hands, summons, and the occasional exploding giant swords.
Personality wise, you're right. Isaac and Matthew and to an extent Felix are pretty much interchangeable. They've got that Mother-style rotating protagonist silence thing going on, without the charm of parody.
Final Smash is eating other combatants for their magnetite-rich flesh.
I never knew that, interesting!
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Isaac's sword is only a handle attached to the sun.
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Pretty sure that's considered a spinoff