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[WARMACHINE & HORDES] 1+1=Cyriss is calculating... calculating... seven! And you're dead.

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Posts

  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    Dedwrekka wrote: »
    Nobody wrote: »
    Apparently in the Primecast it's mentioned that Magnus is back in blue, and Leto is gone.

    The only Merc caster who got an epic version gets removed. Boooooo

    To be fair its rumored that we're trading Caine + the B13th (Caine3) for that >.>

  • PMAversPMAvers Registered User regular
    Actually, now that I'm thinking about it, I wonder what Jack Marshals are going to do now.

    Because they're kind of unnecessary now? I mean, why would you hand a expensive jack to one for a pseudo-focus when you could give it to your warcaster's battle-group for a REAL focus?

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  • DedwrekkaDedwrekka What Would Nyarlathotep Do? Registered User regular
    PMAvers wrote: »
    Actually, now that I'm thinking about it, I wonder what Jack Marshals are going to do now.

    Because they're kind of unnecessary now? I mean, why would you hand a expensive jack to one for a pseudo-focus when you could give it to your warcaster's battle-group for a REAL focus?

    Unless they change the focus stats on Mercs pretty heavily I'd say because I don't have a lot of high focus casters, I have jack marshals with pretty good abilities and I want another jack?

  • admanbadmanb unionize your workplace Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited April 2016
    PMAvers wrote: »
    Actually, now that I'm thinking about it, I wonder what Jack Marshals are going to do now.

    Because they're kind of unnecessary now? I mean, why would you hand a expensive jack to one for a pseudo-focus when you could give it to your warcaster's battle-group for a REAL focus?

    JMs are so bad right now you could give them HUGE buffs and it wouldn't break anything, so hopefully that's what they do.

    admanb on
    NobodyRainfall
  • PMAversPMAvers Registered User regular
    But marshals are generally squishy, and once they go down they're not getting anything. I could see maybe them moving in a direction like Targ, and have Jacks in the main battlegroup that are near a Marshal still count as being in control for purposes of Power Up. And then maybe have some abilities that they can use on friendly jacks like Thor's Tune Up for bonuses.

    Slightly related, it would be nice if they finally take the opportunity to decouple focus pools from spell-casting accuracy. So you can have bigger focus pools to allocate with but not having to worry about everyone automatically being a spell assassin.

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  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    TheBigEasy wrote: »
    Bunch of new stuff announced in the latest Primecast:

    - universal pre-measuring
    - no more command checks, no more terror
    - point system nearly doubled
    - about 28-30 WJ/WB points per caster
    - warjacks get 1 focus just for being in CTRL
    - 'locks can get a fury per round for a dead warbeast
    - gargossals got a little more powerful, but also more expensive pts wise (Conquest will cost about 4x a Juggernaut)
    - new Hordes faction at L&L 2017, was already designed from the ground up in the new edition

    Holy crap you mean I might actually be able to run multiple of what makes the game unique without screwing myself over!

    Yes please!

  • UreshiiAkumaUreshiiAkuma Registered User regular
    "We feel that there already existed the necessary mechanics in Mk 2 for a savvy player to pre-measure, so allowing it officially is not much of a change. We have come to believe that eyeballing spatial relations should not be a required skill to play WARMACHINE and HORDES."

    This makes me very happy.

    TheBigEasyNobodyRainfallHeffling
  • TheBigEasyTheBigEasy Registered User regular
    Yes, I don't understand the whole "Oh my god, pre-measuring is bad for the game" narrative either. We used every opportunity we had and every trick there was to premeasure things. Now we can officially do it. It will help the game and especially new players.

    Echo
  • PMAversPMAvers Registered User regular
    I maintain that the phrase "weaponized trigonometry" is amazing.

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    NobodyUreshiiAkumakaortiEcho
  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    admanb wrote: »
    PMAvers wrote: »
    Actually, now that I'm thinking about it, I wonder what Jack Marshals are going to do now.

    Because they're kind of unnecessary now? I mean, why would you hand a expensive jack to one for a pseudo-focus when you could give it to your warcaster's battle-group for a REAL focus?

    JMs are so bad right now you could give them HUGE buffs and it wouldn't break anything, so hopefully that's what they do.

    I think the only serious JMs I see anymore are Gun Mages, and that's because the rune shots on certain jacks are amazing.

  • ArchArch Neat-o, mosquito! Registered User regular
    Nobody wrote: »
    admanb wrote: »
    PMAvers wrote: »
    Actually, now that I'm thinking about it, I wonder what Jack Marshals are going to do now.

    Because they're kind of unnecessary now? I mean, why would you hand a expensive jack to one for a pseudo-focus when you could give it to your warcaster's battle-group for a REAL focus?

    JMs are so bad right now you could give them HUGE buffs and it wouldn't break anything, so hopefully that's what they do.

    I think the only serious JMs I see anymore are Gun Mages, and that's because the rune shots on certain jacks are amazing.

    And Thor's Drive was pretty nasty

    One thing I hadn't considered, and I do hope they accomplish is removing, as PMAvers said, the linkage between focus and spell accuracy.

    Dedwrekka
  • 3lwap03lwap0 Registered User regular
    If the new warcaster(s) is PVC, then I haz a sad. :( Just not a good system for models, as it wiggles so much sags etc.,

    I wonder if they'll offer the kits as clones from PVC? You get a battle box, and don't want to use PVC warjacks, so go and buy the metal or metal/resin/plastic ones. It's a preplexing thing - I would have to have to buy the same jack twice due to quality (and there will be a noticeable difference i'm sure).

  • DedwrekkaDedwrekka What Would Nyarlathotep Do? Registered User regular
    Can't imagine I'm the only Rhulic player to get tingles at the idea of 28 Warjack Points and a free focus for every jack in range.

    Something about 9 gun bunnies at low points makes me happy.

    PMAvers
  • CorporateLogoCorporateLogo The toilet knows how I feelRegistered User regular
    Don't worry, they'll nerf or remove Focus Efficient for the new edition

    Do not have a cow, mortal.

    c9PXgFo.jpg
  • ArchArch Neat-o, mosquito! Registered User regular
    Dedwrekka wrote: »
    Can't imagine I'm the only Rhulic player to get tingles at the idea of 28 Warjack Points and a free focus for every jack in range.

    Something about 9 gun bunnies at low points makes me happy.

    They'll probably remove it....but I'm also getting rid of my Rhul during my move

    If the rules are good enough, though, I could see me getting back at least my favorite units (Durgen, tons of bunnies, and bashers)

  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    That "no premeasure" thread is full of gold.

    Statement:
    "Premeasuring takes all the skill out of the game!"

    Reply:
    "Um, I know for a fact you only play 8 or 10 focus casters."

  • see317see317 Registered User regular
    edited April 2016
    Saw this pop up on my Facebook (huh, it actually is good for something beyond discovering you're related to a bunch of racist dickbags... who knew?)

    Anyways, looks like Power Up doesn't work for Convergence or Cephalyx players. But they get other tricks to play with...

    http://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?248938-4-13-Insider-and-Warjack-Equivalents&p=3466626&viewfull=1#post3466626
    To Colorado Warmachine
    Just now ·
    Fear, not Convergence and Cephalyx players:
    "I just wanted to jump in here because I feel like I should have addressed these questions in my Insider. My apologies for neglecting to explain the changes to monstrosities and vectors. Not being warjacks, Cephalyx monstrosities do not benefit from Power Up. Instead, a monstrosity gains 1 focus point each time it suffers damage as a result of a continuous effect or from an attack (whether made by a friendly model or an enemy). And instead of having these focus points removed during the Maintenance Phase, monstrosities retain their focus points until they have been spent.
    Likewise, Power Up does not affect the vectors of the Convergence of Cyriss (which are actually considered warjacks in the new edition, albeit warjacks without a cortex). Instead they rely on Focus Induction to keep the focus flowing. Focus Induction now simply states: “When a Convergence warjack spends a focus point during its activation, you can give a focus point to another Convergence warjack if the two are in the same battlegroup and are within 6˝ of one another.” That’s it. So, one warjack can spend all of its focus to fill up the next warjack and so on until the same 3 focus points have flowed through every warjack in your battlegroup."

    see317 on
    PMAversDedwrekka
  • PMAversPMAvers Registered User regular
    Also from that thread:
    "Allocation" is now clearly defined as the focus points a warcaster gives to the warjacks in his battlegroup during the Control Phase after resolving Power Up. At any other time the warjack is "gaining focus", not being "allocated focus".
    Three is the cap for monstrosities (and virtually all warjacks).

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  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    PMAvers wrote: »
    Also from that thread:
    "Allocation" is now clearly defined as the focus points a warcaster gives to the warjacks in his battlegroup during the Control Phase after resolving Power Up. At any other time the warjack is "gaining focus", not being "allocated focus".
    Three is the cap for monstrosities (and virtually all warjacks).

    That has some interesting implications if power booster and the various accumulators (Stormclad etc) remain the same.

  • admanbadmanb unionize your workplace Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited April 2016
    Power Booster would be borderline-unusuable, so I'm betting that one will change.

    admanb on
  • PMAversPMAvers Registered User regular
    Nobody wrote: »
    PMAvers wrote: »
    Also from that thread:
    "Allocation" is now clearly defined as the focus points a warcaster gives to the warjacks in his battlegroup during the Control Phase after resolving Power Up. At any other time the warjack is "gaining focus", not being "allocated focus".
    Three is the cap for monstrosities (and virtually all warjacks).

    That has some interesting implications if power booster and the various accumulators (Stormclad etc) remain the same.

    In regards to it:
    I don't want to get to granular just now, but I will say that we reworked every spell, special rule, and feat in the game with the current ruleset in mind.

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  • TheBigEasyTheBigEasy Registered User regular
    Nobody wrote: »
    That "no premeasure" thread is full of gold.

    Statement:
    "Premeasuring takes all the skill out of the game!"

    Reply:
    "Um, I know for a fact you only play 8 or 10 focus casters."

    The best is the general belief that they might be able to change PP's stance and take pre-measuring out of the game again.

  • admanbadmanb unionize your workplace Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    This book that is definitely already finalized and may have already been sent to the printers can totally be completely changed from the ground up, right?

  • HefflingHeffling No Pic EverRegistered User regular
    see317 wrote: »
    Saw this pop up on my Facebook (huh, it actually is good for something beyond discovering you're related to a bunch of racist dickbags... who knew?)

    Anyways, looks like Power Up doesn't work for Convergence or Cephalyx players. But they get other tricks to play with...

    http://privateerpressforums.com/showthread.php?248938-4-13-Insider-and-Warjack-Equivalents&p=3466626&viewfull=1#post3466626
    To Colorado Warmachine
    Just now ·
    Fear, not Convergence and Cephalyx players:
    "I just wanted to jump in here because I feel like I should have addressed these questions in my Insider. My apologies for neglecting to explain the changes to monstrosities and vectors. Not being warjacks, Cephalyx monstrosities do not benefit from Power Up. Instead, a monstrosity gains 1 focus point each time it suffers damage as a result of a continuous effect or from an attack (whether made by a friendly model or an enemy). And instead of having these focus points removed during the Maintenance Phase, monstrosities retain their focus points until they have been spent.
    Likewise, Power Up does not affect the vectors of the Convergence of Cyriss (which are actually considered warjacks in the new edition, albeit warjacks without a cortex). Instead they rely on Focus Induction to keep the focus flowing. Focus Induction now simply states: “When a Convergence warjack spends a focus point during its activation, you can give a focus point to another Convergence warjack if the two are in the same battlegroup and are within 6˝ of one another.” That’s it. So, one warjack can spend all of its focus to fill up the next warjack and so on until the same 3 focus points have flowed through every warjack in your battlegroup."

    This level of detail seems to go straight against the stated goal of simplification.

    Like, the engineer in me loves it. But it's not simple at all.

  • admanbadmanb unionize your workplace Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    Faction-wide mechanics are always going to be exceptions.

    Dedwrekka
  • PMAversPMAvers Registered User regular
    Also almost like they don't have a CoC or Merc battle box for this reason?

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  • DedwrekkaDedwrekka What Would Nyarlathotep Do? Registered User regular
    edited April 2016
    PMAvers wrote: »
    Also almost like they don't have a CoC or Merc battle box for this reason?

    CoC probably isn't going to get a new battlebotx for a while, and I'm not expecting Cephalyx to get one until a while after even that.

    Dedwrekka on
  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    I was surprised to hear that they are adding pre-measuring to Warmachine just because in my head Warmachine is "the game where you lose because you moved a model half an inch too far forward or backwards on accident" but I mean, that's also not a particularly fun way to win or lose a game, and everyone did everything in their power to pre-measure as much as they could anyway.

    It's a good change, just not one that I expected.

  • PMAversPMAvers Registered User regular
    Oh hell yes, apparently Repair is no longer a skill check. You just have to roll to see how much you repair.

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    Nobody
  • ArchArch Neat-o, mosquito! Registered User regular
    Where are you guys seeing all this new info??? I guess I should trawl the forums more?

    Also ughhh I love that change to cephalyx. Kinda makes me more likely to pick up the Cryx box because there's a lot of overlap between the two

  • NorgothNorgoth cardiffRegistered User regular
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I was surprised to hear that they are adding pre-measuring to Warmachine just because in my head Warmachine is "the game where you lose because you moved a model half an inch too far forward or backwards on accident" but I mean, that's also not a particularly fun way to win or lose a game, and everyone did everything in their power to pre-measure as much as they could anyway.

    It's a good change, just not one that I expected.

    Thing is, this will still be the case in tournaments. Playing on the clock means you can't premeasure everything, it just isn't feasible so your still going to mess up and pay for it, but now when something really matters you can be 100% on it.

    Which is how it works now really with control ranges and what not. It just isn't as easily abusable by experienced players. Beating newer players at tournaments because I can measure the objective control radius and add it my control range and know from thier checking kill box that there exactly in kill range is just so unfair feeling when your on the other end of it.

  • admanbadmanb unionize your workplace Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    Norgoth wrote: »
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I was surprised to hear that they are adding pre-measuring to Warmachine just because in my head Warmachine is "the game where you lose because you moved a model half an inch too far forward or backwards on accident" but I mean, that's also not a particularly fun way to win or lose a game, and everyone did everything in their power to pre-measure as much as they could anyway.

    It's a good change, just not one that I expected.

    Thing is, this will still be the case in tournaments. Playing on the clock means you can't premeasure everything, it just isn't feasible so your still going to mess up and pay for it, but now when something really matters you can be 100% on it.

    Which is how it works now really with control ranges and what not. It just isn't as easily abusable by experienced players. Beating newer players at tournaments because I can measure the objective control radius and add it my control range and know from thier checking kill box that there exactly in kill range is just so unfair feeling when your on the other end of it.

    Or measuring out turn 1 and 2 threat ranges based on the total size of the board. It's not hard, but you either know how to do it or you don't.

  • PMAversPMAvers Registered User regular
    So it sounds like the j-man warcasters and lesser warlocks will also have access to Power Up and Soul Bind, which'll be interesting.

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  • JJ Rabbit GangmemberRegistered User regular
    What are those new starters made of? Same stuff as usual?

  • TheBigEasyTheBigEasy Registered User regular
    J wrote: »
    What are those new starters made of? Same stuff as usual?

    Warcaster, 3 Warjacks/beasts, stat cards, dice, playing mat, basic training guide, rulebook, token.

    If you are asking for the material - they said its the same material they used for the MK II plastic starter kits.

  • JJ Rabbit GangmemberRegistered User regular
    Material yeah.
    That's unfortunate.

    Dr_Keenbean
  • EchoEcho ski-bap ba-dapModerator mod
    ...and grats to @Mago for the RT from Privateer Press! Thought that looked familiar when it popped up in my feed...

  • PMAversPMAvers Registered User regular
    Personally, I'm okay with the materials for the new battle boxes because the price on them actually went down ($39 instead of $49), and there's more stuff in them compared to before.

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  • TheBigEasyTheBigEasy Registered User regular
    PMAvers wrote: »
    Personally, I'm okay with the materials for the new battle boxes because the price on them actually went down ($39 instead of $49), and there's more stuff in them compared to before.

    Yes, they really lowered the barrier of entry for new players. Which is a very good thing.

    Echo
  • JJ Rabbit GangmemberRegistered User regular
    The price is okay. I would probably be alright with the existing plastic on the warjacks. But it is not at all suitable for human sized ( and detailed ) pieces. Like the casters.

    EchoCorporateLogoDr_Keenbean
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