AuralynxDarkness is a perspectiveWatching the ego workRegistered Userregular
I'm increasingly sure my best chance at getting out of silver is to play mid every game, because my pool of mids is Xerath, Syndra, Lissandra, and Galio at the moment and pretty much all of them induce crazy behavior by the people who really, really want to bring an assassin to mid and kill me repeatedly.
Beat the tar out of a Fizz who might not ever have seen Galio last night. The laning phase that game:
"Hey, I am a gargoyle, come hit me?"
"Fish fish!"
"Lol nope, also say hi to my buddy Xin."
I'm increasingly sure my best chance at getting out of silver is to play mid every game, because my pool of mids is Xerath, Syndra, Lissandra, and Galio at the moment and pretty much all of them induce crazy behavior by the people who really, really want to bring an assassin to mid and kill me repeatedly.
Beat the tar out of a Fizz who might not ever have seen Galio last night. The laning phase that game:
"Hey, I am a gargoyle, come hit me?"
"Fish fish!"
"Lol nope, also say hi to my buddy Xin."
Galio's such a hard counter to Fizz, as long as your sidelanes dont feed him. The magic bleed is perfect for healing with Galio's shield.
I have started playing Jax top. I just feel like once he gets trinity force he is useful unless the other team stacks CC (which this is yolo queue so they rarely do). Last night I got counter-picked by Voli. Somehow I still ended the game 9-4 with ridiculous CS because loljax. Once I got trinity and botrk it was just hilarious in team fights. Especially since (it being yoloq) the other team would clump around my counterstrike.
Can someone spoil how group C&D played out for me? Been slowly trying to catch up, but the games seem all out of order on YouTube. I watched a later one than I thought, so I know how it ultimately shakes out minus the final game. But curious how the groups turned out. I would just to to the website, but I think playoffs have started, or whatever the next stage is called, so I don't want to get spoiled on that. Will eventually slowly catch up on youtube.
Watch Both C9 vs NJW games at from Sunday. Very excellent.
I cannot for the life of me understand why even at the highest levels, people don't rappel into ganks as Elise. How can anyone expect to land a stun by just trying to walk up at max range, particularly when the opponent has flash up?
What is not beneficial to having a ridiculously long gap close - blowing the opponent's flash very early on most likely - and having a point blank, or very close range stun to follow up with? The only argument I can see for not starting in spider form is perhaps a slight loss in damage by not getting the human form Q in at higher health, but that is SO negligible to a more reliable stun and the addition of your lane partner/s followup.
I just played a team builder with top lane Gnar against a Diamond Nunu that mains him. Ugh, what an unfun lane that was. He didn't have much kill potential, but I couldn't even hurt him. He got an early gank and pushed me out of lane, farmed a bunch, then bought a Thornmail first back. How much more unfun can a champion be? I am firmly with Talith on the Nunu debate now.
I cannot for the life of me understand why even at the highest levels, people don't rappel into ganks as Elise. How can anyone expect to land a stun by just trying to walk up at max range, particularly when the opponent has flash up?
What is not beneficial to having a ridiculously long gap close - blowing the opponent's flash very early on most likely - and having a point blank, or very close range stun to follow up with? The only argument I can see for not starting in spider form is perhaps a slight loss in damage by not getting the human form Q in at higher health, but that is SO negligible to a more reliable stun and the addition of your lane partner/s followup.
Rappel is just too useful to open with most of the time. Elise has the ability to chase a flash even if she doesn't have flash. Also, if she needs an escape and there are enemy minions behind her, she can rappel back to them after, say, a dive. Heck, if there are friendly minions and she has aggro she can drop it with rappel. Landing the long-range stun gives her the ability to gap close once, while getting the extra human form q in as a bonus, and then if they flash or have an escape ability, you can rappel to them after.
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AuralynxDarkness is a perspectiveWatching the ego workRegistered Userregular
I cannot for the life of me understand why even at the highest levels, people don't rappel into ganks as Elise. How can anyone expect to land a stun by just trying to walk up at max range, particularly when the opponent has flash up?
What is not beneficial to having a ridiculously long gap close - blowing the opponent's flash very early on most likely - and having a point blank, or very close range stun to follow up with? The only argument I can see for not starting in spider form is perhaps a slight loss in damage by not getting the human form Q in at higher health, but that is SO negligible to a more reliable stun and the addition of your lane partner/s followup.
Rappel is just too useful to open with most of the time. Elise has the ability to chase a flash even if she doesn't have flash. Also, if she needs an escape and there are enemy minions behind her, she can rappel back to them after, say, a dive. Heck, if there are friendly minions and she has aggro she can drop it with rappel. Landing the long-range stun gives her the ability to gap close once, while getting the extra human form q in as a bonus, and then if they flash or have an escape ability, you can rappel to them after.
Pretty much what Khavall said. Ideally, with Elise, you're walking into a lane where someone can warm them up for you positioning-wise. She sees pro play because she's phenomenally sticky if you get next to them with Rappel and the spider-form Q still available, not because Cocoon is so great.
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pyromaniac221this just might bean interestin YTRegistered Userregular
If the lane is pushed toward your tower, walking into lane in human form and saving rappel is fine. as long as you can save cocoon to layer with your laner's cc or if you can hold it until they burn flash or an escape or something. But if you're trying to brute force a gank in the midlane or something, opening with rappel is a great tactic to get them to blow flash early or to put yourself in a great cocoon position. You never really want to be trying to hit someone with a max range cocoon unless they're already stunned or immobilized.
Yasuo
Base HP lowered to 380 from 430
Base movement speed lowered to 340 from 350
Holy fucking ouch. That puts him at a tie for the 15th lowest health and means more than half the ranged roster and every single melee champion has more starting health.
So frequently when I'm moving around as a jungler and I see an opportunity to force a recall or put pressure on a lane I will step in. I know at the start that we are probably not going to get the kill unless the opposing player does something brainless. I'm aiming to force a summoner or push them out of the lane for a bit.
It is pretty often that my laner doesn't understand this and complains that I failed the gank because we didn't get the kill. I mean yeah the kill is optimal but if we force summoners or you get free farm for a while that is also a net gain for us.
I cannot for the life of me understand why even at the highest levels, people don't rappel into ganks as Elise. How can anyone expect to land a stun by just trying to walk up at max range, particularly when the opponent has flash up?
What is not beneficial to having a ridiculously long gap close - blowing the opponent's flash very early on most likely - and having a point blank, or very close range stun to follow up with? The only argument I can see for not starting in spider form is perhaps a slight loss in damage by not getting the human form Q in at higher health, but that is SO negligible to a more reliable stun and the addition of your lane partner/s followup.
To add to what has been said (particularly about not burning rappel early for it's incredible utility mid-fight), I would point out that using E and getting a flash out of it is a HUGE WIN. ~10 seconds CD vs 5 minutes? 100 times out of 100, yes.
Otherwise, you answered your own question: Elise as a human softens targets, maximizing her damage against high-health targets, and Spider form is best used on mid to low health targets. Rappelling into a fight negates her strengths unless the target is already low.
League of Legends: MichaelDominick; Blizzard(NA): MichaelD#11402; Steam ID: MichaelDominick
So, @Goumindong - You suggest a zero CDR/MP5 build for Viktor with only Lichbane and Perfect Hexcore for +750 mana, giving a total of 1890. I figured a bigger mana pool and some CDR to keep spamming Qs and get more lasers for chase/kite would be better?
Rylais as Core? I suppose it helps with chase/kite, but I think I'd rather have a Frozen Heart if they had an AD assassin mid, or a heavy AD comp. I dunno though, I'm Gold at best, so.
Yes.
Rylai is the best combination AP/Tank item in the game. Its 100 AP and 400 HP for 2900 gold. You could replace it with zhonya or DFG if you're buying late, but i think Rylai is better overall. This is both because the slow is useful on your Q, and E and R, but also because Viktor has the smallest health pool in the game for a champion which is expected to operate within 500 or so range besides Swain, Annie, and leblanc (Annie's Q,W are about 550 range vs 525 on Vik's auto) and so flat health is very good on him. Buying Rylai early also means that you get the most out of that 400 HP, which means you can actually survive long enough to Q auto someone.
The slow is icing on the cake. It will turn some E single hits into E double hits, it will mean extra ticks on your ult, and it will mean that your Q chase is super without having to buy the inefficient Q augment (and it also synergizes with the Q augment to make for hilarious chase). Even more important it means that you actually have a chance of landing open field lasers (Q them, laser them while they're slowed, catch up and auto them since they're slowed)
Moreover, CDR is a trap. For the vast majority of the game your damage is contained in E, not Q*. And more CDR doesn't tend to mean more E's both because its got a long CD but also because its got a highish mana cost and because hitting multiple lasers in a fight is unreliable due to the very long CD on the only ability you have that will keep people in place(besides Rylai slow) of gravity well. So more CDR does get you more theoretical DPS, but it doesn't get you more practical damage. Additionally you have to exchange the things which give you more practical damage (basically tank/damage) in order to achieve it and in order to get the theoretically higher consistent DPS you have to play better over a longer period of timing while also expending more mana.
*for instance from level 9 to 12 depending on your total AP, one double hit E does more damage than two Q-Auto combinations.
Edit: let's quantify the tank portion of rylai. If you don't have any other mr/armor/Hp items it's worth about 22% of your HP at level 18. Zhonyas armor is worth 26% effective DR over base assuming the enemy has no pen.
Earlier its a 40% boost of HP compared to a 37.5% increase armor I can't run the frozen heart numbers but I don't think they're going to be close.
But basically the HP on rylai is like the armor on zhonya but also for magic damage and doesn't get reduced by pen items.
Gotta say I love how people have started to play Xerath again, makes it so much fun to play Veigar!
Grass Grows,
Birds Fly,
'til there's Fire in the Sky...
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Lord_AsmodeusgoeticSobriquet:Here is your magical cryptic riddle-tumour: I AM A TIME MACHINERegistered Userregular
Has anyone noticed that Sion is now a Chaos Lord?
(by which I mean he has the same voice as one of the Chaos Lords from dawn of war, Bale maybe, or Carron?)
Capital is only the fruit of labor, and could never have existed if Labor had not first existed. Labor is superior to capital, and deserves much the higher consideration. - Lincoln
I've been playing Hecarim again lately, and boy oh boy is he nice and strong again.
Out of curiosity, how are you building him? Recently been using him when I get forced to jungle, and while I do love the amazing horse, he always feels kind of binary. If we're doing well, he's showing the enemy team where the lemonade is made, but if he falls behind you just waffle around trying to do stuff but just die.
COME FORTH, AMATERASU! - Switch Friend Code SW-5465-2458-5696 - Twitch
I've been playing Hecarim again lately, and boy oh boy is he nice and strong again.
Out of curiosity, how are you building him? Recently been using him when I get forced to jungle, and while I do love the amazing horse, he always feels kind of binary. If we're doing well, he's showing the enemy team where the lemonade is made, but if he falls behind you just waffle around trying to do stuff but just die.
I first item SotEL, it just does so much for you. After that, I get a Phage. Great synergy, health and damage and movespeed. Then you've got to figure out if you're ahead or behind. Have you been dying a lot? Does your team need more tankiness? Who's on their team?
If you can build damage, because you're ahead or your team is overly tanky, go Triforce before going tanky. If your team needs tankiness, build a belt->sunfire if their AD is the problem, or a kindlegem->visage if their AP is the problem. The more focused/bursty your team is, though, the more damage will help you over tankiness due to W.
If the game gets to your 5th item, buy a ghostblade because why not.
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YAAAAAAAAH!
Beat the tar out of a Fizz who might not ever have seen Galio last night. The laning phase that game:
"Hey, I am a gargoyle, come hit me?"
"Fish fish!"
"Lol nope, also say hi to my buddy Xin."
Galio's such a hard counter to Fizz, as long as your sidelanes dont feed him. The magic bleed is perfect for healing with Galio's shield.
Joe's Stream.
e: And I have also somehow become inactive in ranked despite my ranked activity.
Watch Both C9 vs NJW games at from Sunday. Very excellent.
What is not beneficial to having a ridiculously long gap close - blowing the opponent's flash very early on most likely - and having a point blank, or very close range stun to follow up with? The only argument I can see for not starting in spider form is perhaps a slight loss in damage by not getting the human form Q in at higher health, but that is SO negligible to a more reliable stun and the addition of your lane partner/s followup.
Ok my break from Ranked for a few days helped.
Rappel is just too useful to open with most of the time. Elise has the ability to chase a flash even if she doesn't have flash. Also, if she needs an escape and there are enemy minions behind her, she can rappel back to them after, say, a dive. Heck, if there are friendly minions and she has aggro she can drop it with rappel. Landing the long-range stun gives her the ability to gap close once, while getting the extra human form q in as a bonus, and then if they flash or have an escape ability, you can rappel to them after.
Pretty much what Khavall said. Ideally, with Elise, you're walking into a lane where someone can warm them up for you positioning-wise. She sees pro play because she's phenomenally sticky if you get next to them with Rappel and the spider-form Q still available, not because Cocoon is so great.
good.
GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOD
Maybe he won't be a permaban when he starts massively losing lanes.
It is pretty often that my laner doesn't understand this and complains that I failed the gank because we didn't get the kill. I mean yeah the kill is optimal but if we force summoners or you get free farm for a while that is also a net gain for us.
Look at the windmill!
This will be very common in the near future
Streaming 8PST on weeknights
Joe's Stream.
Streaming 8PST on weeknights
Birds Fly,
'til there's Fire in the Sky...
You know, I've been having an incredibly long lucky streak lately, I've been facing those situations, and we've been winning.
Stay positive, and use the mantra, "Don't worry, they'll throw".
Joe's Stream.
I'm just playing Garen so I auto win as long as I don't run into gnar or other ranged and darius.
Edit: + I'm chilling at the top of gold 1 so I can't be arsed to play promos atm =P
Birds Fly,
'til there's Fire in the Sky...
To add to what has been said (particularly about not burning rappel early for it's incredible utility mid-fight), I would point out that using E and getting a flash out of it is a HUGE WIN. ~10 seconds CD vs 5 minutes? 100 times out of 100, yes.
Otherwise, you answered your own question: Elise as a human softens targets, maximizing her damage against high-health targets, and Spider form is best used on mid to low health targets. Rappelling into a fight negates her strengths unless the target is already low.
Oh man kick that 1.5k veigar ult back at him so it deals 1.9 of his ap on himself xD
Birds Fly,
'til there's Fire in the Sky...
Yes.
Rylai is the best combination AP/Tank item in the game. Its 100 AP and 400 HP for 2900 gold. You could replace it with zhonya or DFG if you're buying late, but i think Rylai is better overall. This is both because the slow is useful on your Q, and E and R, but also because Viktor has the smallest health pool in the game for a champion which is expected to operate within 500 or so range besides Swain, Annie, and leblanc (Annie's Q,W are about 550 range vs 525 on Vik's auto) and so flat health is very good on him. Buying Rylai early also means that you get the most out of that 400 HP, which means you can actually survive long enough to Q auto someone.
The slow is icing on the cake. It will turn some E single hits into E double hits, it will mean extra ticks on your ult, and it will mean that your Q chase is super without having to buy the inefficient Q augment (and it also synergizes with the Q augment to make for hilarious chase). Even more important it means that you actually have a chance of landing open field lasers (Q them, laser them while they're slowed, catch up and auto them since they're slowed)
Moreover, CDR is a trap. For the vast majority of the game your damage is contained in E, not Q*. And more CDR doesn't tend to mean more E's both because its got a long CD but also because its got a highish mana cost and because hitting multiple lasers in a fight is unreliable due to the very long CD on the only ability you have that will keep people in place(besides Rylai slow) of gravity well. So more CDR does get you more theoretical DPS, but it doesn't get you more practical damage. Additionally you have to exchange the things which give you more practical damage (basically tank/damage) in order to achieve it and in order to get the theoretically higher consistent DPS you have to play better over a longer period of timing while also expending more mana.
*for instance from level 9 to 12 depending on your total AP, one double hit E does more damage than two Q-Auto combinations.
Edit: let's quantify the tank portion of rylai. If you don't have any other mr/armor/Hp items it's worth about 22% of your HP at level 18. Zhonyas armor is worth 26% effective DR over base assuming the enemy has no pen.
Earlier its a 40% boost of HP compared to a 37.5% increase armor I can't run the frozen heart numbers but I don't think they're going to be close.
But basically the HP on rylai is like the armor on zhonya but also for magic damage and doesn't get reduced by pen items.
And now I want a Arcade Braum skin, with his shield as a giant pinball bumper. Makes the ding ding ding ding sound as projectiles are blocked.
COME FORTH, AMATERASU! - Switch Friend Code SW-5465-2458-5696 - Twitch
Birds Fly,
'til there's Fire in the Sky...
(by which I mean he has the same voice as one of the Chaos Lords from dawn of war, Bale maybe, or Carron?)
I guess this is how they nerf him
Streaming 8PST on weeknights
Out of curiosity, how are you building him? Recently been using him when I get forced to jungle, and while I do love the amazing horse, he always feels kind of binary. If we're doing well, he's showing the enemy team where the lemonade is made, but if he falls behind you just waffle around trying to do stuff but just die.
COME FORTH, AMATERASU! - Switch Friend Code SW-5465-2458-5696 - Twitch
Braum is funny man, but Gnar is cute Yordle.
3DS: 0473-8507-2652
Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
PSN: AbEntropy
i believe he has the same voice actor as Dinobot, so whoever that is
I first item SotEL, it just does so much for you. After that, I get a Phage. Great synergy, health and damage and movespeed. Then you've got to figure out if you're ahead or behind. Have you been dying a lot? Does your team need more tankiness? Who's on their team?
If you can build damage, because you're ahead or your team is overly tanky, go Triforce before going tanky. If your team needs tankiness, build a belt->sunfire if their AD is the problem, or a kindlegem->visage if their AP is the problem. The more focused/bursty your team is, though, the more damage will help you over tankiness due to W.
If the game gets to your 5th item, buy a ghostblade because why not.