It's not even clear whether the shooter was trying to target the cops or protesters right now, trying to determine a motive is just not possible. I hope the cops find whoever did it and charge them with the appropriate crimes. I also hope that the DoJ continues to rip apart the racist local PDs in Ferguson and the surrounding suburbs.
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Metzger MeisterIt Gets Worsebefore it gets any better.Registered Userregular
The fact that one of the cops in question got shot in the goddamn head and survived is nothing short of a miracle, really. Like, damn. Dude had someone watching out for him that day.
It's not even clear whether the shooter was trying to target the cops or protesters right now, trying to determine a motive is just not possible. I hope the cops find whoever did it and charge them with the appropriate crimes. I also hope that the DoJ continues to rip apart the racist local PDs in Ferguson and the surrounding suburbs.
It's not even clear whether the shooter was trying to target the cops or protesters right now, trying to determine a motive is just not possible. I hope the cops find whoever did it and charge them with the appropriate crimes. I also hope that the DoJ continues to rip apart the racist local PDs in Ferguson and the surrounding suburbs.
Attempted murder would be the only crime, right?
Assorted felonies may also be attached based on the lawfulness of the weapons in question. Also in this given context shooting at these two officers is basically domestic terrorism.
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It's not even clear whether the shooter was trying to target the cops or protesters right now, trying to determine a motive is just not possible. I hope the cops find whoever did it and charge them with the appropriate crimes. I also hope that the DoJ continues to rip apart the racist local PDs in Ferguson and the surrounding suburbs.
Attempted murder would be the only crime, right?
Assault (with a weapon ), unlawful use of a firearm, reckless endangering, etc
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SummaryJudgmentGrab the hottest iron you can find, stride in the Tower’s front doorRegistered Userregular
edited March 2015
EDIT: Wrong thread, hilariously.
SummaryJudgment on
Some days Blue wonders why anyone ever bothered making numbers so small; other days she supposes even infinity needs to start somewhere.
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Captain Marcusnow arrives the hour of actionRegistered Userregular
Assault (with a weapon ), unlawful use of a firearm, reckless endangering, etc
They charged the suspect with 2 counts of assault and 1 count of firing a weapon from a vehicle. Suspect admits firing shots but says the police weren't his target.
Assault (with a weapon ), unlawful use of a firearm, reckless endangering, etc
They charged the suspect with 2 counts of assault and 1 count of firing a weapon from a vehicle. Suspect admits firing shots but says the police weren't his target.
I'm astonished they aren't going for attempted murder.
I know 1st Degree Assault is 'assault with a deadly weapon', but in the case of a firearm being fired recklessly into a crowd, one would think they'd be going for the higher charge here.
Edit: My only guess is they're having trouble justifying motive and / or attempted murder can't be used when the victim is not specifically knowingly singled out by the perpetrator. Attempted manslaughter? Not sure if that's a thing.
Did he deserve to die? No. But did Darren Wilson shoot him for no reason? Again, no. Did the Justice Department later find that Ferguson’s police force was a cesspool of racism, incompetence and corruption? Yes. But did any of that mean that Wilson killed Brown in cold blood or that Brown was shot because he was black? No and no.
Here's what he doesn't understand: when liberals talk about Ferguson, they are talking about Ferguson, not just Brown. There are lots of news stories about black people shot by white police officers; what made the story explode was the militarized police (over)response to the protests. Brown isn't much more of a symbol than Ambassador Stevens; the symbology is that Ferguson's racist, corrupt, incompetent cesspool of a police force are a microcosm for American law enforcement, just as the Benghazi attack symbolizes Obama's foreign policy failings to right-wingers. The difference is that, when the federal government looked into both, they found nothing on Benghazi (omg personal email accounts!), whereas with Ferguson the verdict was, "Yep, this town's police are exactly as racist and awful as you thought, if not more so."
Is it super annoying when people talk like that? Yes.
The best part of awful conservative types is the constant reliance on strawman logic.
Especially the comparison to Benghazi. Does the mean a conservative just admitted to the Benghazi scandal being overblown for what it really was?
Also I just got through the first paragraph in that article and I swear to Christ its like the dude read his Facebook news feed and then wrote his opinion on a nuanced subject like he had any fucking idea what was going on. God damn do conservatives just want to look out of touch or what's up guys?
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User name Alazull on Steam, PSN, Nintenders, Epic, etc.
"The justice department didn't find sufficient cause to charge a hate crime here" does not translate to, "this death wasn't unavoidable and ultimately another death somewhat casually caused by law enforcement, where the facts line up to plausibly not make it murder even though in a different town with different skin colors it wouldn't have played out this way."
So, this is a thing that happened. It seems that some older white man got attacked by three younger African-Americans because he didn't want to talk about what is going on in Ferguson and about Brown in particular. They have video of them attacking him unprovoked, but it sounds like there just has to be more to it than that, right? People can't seriously be doing this.
So, this is a thing that happened. It seems that some older white man got attacked by three younger African-Americans because he didn't want to talk about what is going on in Ferguson and about Brown in particular. They have video of them attacking him unprovoked, but it sounds like there just has to be more to it than that, right? People can't seriously be doing this.
Edit: Stupid autocorrect
Even if they are this one time, it doesn't invalidate the larger lessons that Ferguson taught
These stories are just really zoomed-in on isolated incidents, because if you zoom out and look at the big picture you can see what is actually a systemic issue
Basically it's a distraction from something that affects people every day, to people without any recourse
Because it's easier to point to an unprovoked attack on one old white dude and say, "This is bad!" than it is to address the racism, discrimination and daily marginalization of black people on a huge scale
I'm not saying that I think that old white dude got what he deserved, I'm saying, "So where is the sympathy and the efforts to fix what happens to black people across America every day, and why does this warrant a huge story when black people are killed by racist cops all the time and it's completely ignored?"
I'm not sure where you are getting that it invalidates anything. I don't think that in anyway... I'm just aghast that this is going on. This is not the way to go about getting change or being looked at differently. It sadly feeds into the racist views about African-American people that they don't deserve to be treated the same way. These bad apples will be looked at when the whole is nothing like this. Sadly, I see the people who go around stating that not all cops are bad (missing the entire point) using this as an excuse for the treatment to continue. Also, as I did mention, I don't think we are getting the full story here either.
Edit: In my mind, I just can't see anyone doing anything on this level without some type of provocation. I know it goes on, but just can't relate to why it does.
I'm not sure where you are getting that it invalidates anything. I don't think that in anyway... I'm just aghast that this is going on. This is not the way to go about getting change or being looked at differently. It sadly feeds into the racist views about African-American people that they don't deserve to be treated the same way. These bad apples will be looked at when the whole is nothing like this. Sadly, I see the people who go around stating that not all cops are bad (missing the entire point) using this as an excuse for the treatment to continue. Also, as I did mention, I don't think we are getting the full story here either.
Edit: In my mind, I just can't see anyone doing anything on this level without some type of provocation. I know it goes on, but just can't relate to why it does.
So, this is a thing that happened. It seems that some older white man got attacked by three younger African-Americans because he didn't want to talk about what is going on in Ferguson and about Brown in particular. They have video of them attacking him unprovoked, but it sounds like there just has to be more to it than that, right? People can't seriously be doing this.
Edit: Stupid autocorrect
Probably had more to do with them being a group of teenage boys going around the train asking to use other people's phones. That's most likely a scam and I think we all know that. The Brown thing just sounds like a distraction that they might have thought would later excuse their barbarism.
there have definitely been plainclothes police mixing in with the Ferguson protests here in Seattle
I think that's actually a pretty standard police procedure
Generally speaking though, I'd imagine that plainclothes cops mixing in with protesters are there to try to calm things, or at least act as a brake on escalation from within (maybe a little "Hey, buddy, let's not start throwing glass bottles, huh?") or just getting information about the protest and leaders, as opposed to opening fire on the police from within the protest.
Granted, I'm not a cop, so I can't be sure if that's SOP or not.
Hell, when I worked security at a mall we'd have someone wander over to hang out among any good sized protests that formed in the area.
Of course, it wasn't remotely about influencing anything. Just getting the pulse of things from the inside, in case it seemed to be going badly, so we'd have even a little forewarning to lock down before things might get ugly.
The only 'ugly' protest I recall working was G20 some years back, and even that wasn't really all that big a deal for us, our people, and the members of the public who we tried to protect when things started getting heated. I recall seeing the news, wandering into work, and then spent a little time shepherding people with children over a couple blocks to where they could safely get a cab. Having a few people helping out that weren't wearing a uniform was useful that day. Also helped while making pizza runs to feed the small army we had on staff for those days.
So much pizza.
Anyways, to come back to the original point, merely gathering information from within is also a possibility. Though that's from a Canadian perspective (not that our forces are full of saints), I can respect that it may carry a more sinister undercurrent for US forces.
Forar on
First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
Contextualizing that to total population, Ferguson's 2010 census pop is 21,203. 28.7% of that was under the age of 18, which excludes roughly 6000 from the voting pool. We're five years off of the census, so these numbers are very inexact. A turnout of 4000 on 15000 eligible voters is 26%. How many of the adult population is ineligible due to having their voting rights restricted? Not really possible to say, but I kind of bet that given Ferguson's racist justice system problem that there's a lot of people who are disenfranchised.
I know specifically to what you refer, and one of the major problems Ferguson had is that its majority population of minorities was severely under-represented in local elected office.
But they are not a minority in ferguson. They were very much treated like one. Not to say minorities should be treated unfairly anywhere here either.
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Attempted murder would be the only crime, right?
Assorted felonies may also be attached based on the lawfulness of the weapons in question. Also in this given context shooting at these two officers is basically domestic terrorism.
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Ferguson had outstanding arrest warrants for 16,000 people:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/nathan-robinson/the-shocking-finding-from-the-doj-ferguson_b_6858388.html
The town only has 21,000 people.
So it wasn't profiling when they just stopped random people and arrested them!
Assault (with a weapon ), unlawful use of a firearm, reckless endangering, etc
They charged the suspect with 2 counts of assault and 1 count of firing a weapon from a vehicle. Suspect admits firing shots but says the police weren't his target.
I'm astonished they aren't going for attempted murder.
I know 1st Degree Assault is 'assault with a deadly weapon', but in the case of a firearm being fired recklessly into a crowd, one would think they'd be going for the higher charge here.
Edit: My only guess is they're having trouble justifying motive and / or attempted murder can't be used when the victim is not specifically knowingly singled out by the perpetrator. Attempted manslaughter? Not sure if that's a thing.
MWO: Adamski
I'm sure it would have been different if the cops had actually died, but as it is the police aren't going to punish him for a freak accident.
Richard Cohen can go fuck himself.
Here's what he doesn't understand: when liberals talk about Ferguson, they are talking about Ferguson, not just Brown. There are lots of news stories about black people shot by white police officers; what made the story explode was the militarized police (over)response to the protests. Brown isn't much more of a symbol than Ambassador Stevens; the symbology is that Ferguson's racist, corrupt, incompetent cesspool of a police force are a microcosm for American law enforcement, just as the Benghazi attack symbolizes Obama's foreign policy failings to right-wingers. The difference is that, when the federal government looked into both, they found nothing on Benghazi (omg personal email accounts!), whereas with Ferguson the verdict was, "Yep, this town's police are exactly as racist and awful as you thought, if not more so."
The best part of awful conservative types is the constant reliance on strawman logic.
Especially the comparison to Benghazi. Does the mean a conservative just admitted to the Benghazi scandal being overblown for what it really was?
Also I just got through the first paragraph in that article and I swear to Christ its like the dude read his Facebook news feed and then wrote his opinion on a nuanced subject like he had any fucking idea what was going on. God damn do conservatives just want to look out of touch or what's up guys?
Edit: Stupid autocorrect
Even if they are this one time, it doesn't invalidate the larger lessons that Ferguson taught
These stories are just really zoomed-in on isolated incidents, because if you zoom out and look at the big picture you can see what is actually a systemic issue
Because it's easier to point to an unprovoked attack on one old white dude and say, "This is bad!" than it is to address the racism, discrimination and daily marginalization of black people on a huge scale
I'm not saying that I think that old white dude got what he deserved, I'm saying, "So where is the sympathy and the efforts to fix what happens to black people across America every day, and why does this warrant a huge story when black people are killed by racist cops all the time and it's completely ignored?"
Anywho. That video is disgusting. The attack, the passenger reaction.etc
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Edit: In my mind, I just can't see anyone doing anything on this level without some type of provocation. I know it goes on, but just can't relate to why it does.
Steam - Talon Valdez :Blizz - Talonious#1860 : Xbox Live & LoL - Talonious Monk @TaloniousMonk Hail Satan
Some people just want to watch the world burn.
Probably had more to do with them being a group of teenage boys going around the train asking to use other people's phones. That's most likely a scam and I think we all know that. The Brown thing just sounds like a distraction that they might have thought would later excuse their barbarism.
Hell, when I worked security at a mall we'd have someone wander over to hang out among any good sized protests that formed in the area.
Of course, it wasn't remotely about influencing anything. Just getting the pulse of things from the inside, in case it seemed to be going badly, so we'd have even a little forewarning to lock down before things might get ugly.
The only 'ugly' protest I recall working was G20 some years back, and even that wasn't really all that big a deal for us, our people, and the members of the public who we tried to protect when things started getting heated. I recall seeing the news, wandering into work, and then spent a little time shepherding people with children over a couple blocks to where they could safely get a cab. Having a few people helping out that weren't wearing a uniform was useful that day. Also helped while making pizza runs to feed the small army we had on staff for those days.
So much pizza.
Anyways, to come back to the original point, merely gathering information from within is also a possibility. Though that's from a Canadian perspective (not that our forces are full of saints), I can respect that it may carry a more sinister undercurrent for US forces.
Contextualizing that to total population, Ferguson's 2010 census pop is 21,203. 28.7% of that was under the age of 18, which excludes roughly 6000 from the voting pool. We're five years off of the census, so these numbers are very inexact. A turnout of 4000 on 15000 eligible voters is 26%. How many of the adult population is ineligible due to having their voting rights restricted? Not really possible to say, but I kind of bet that given Ferguson's racist justice system problem that there's a lot of people who are disenfranchised.
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
In the wonderful world of racial dynamics math doesn't strictly apply.
In the wonderful world of racial dynamics math doesn't strictly apply.
I...uh...hmmm
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
:bro:
But they are not a minority in ferguson. They were very much treated like one. Not to say minorities should be treated unfairly anywhere here either.
67% of the city of Ferguson is of a racial minority according to national statistics, you pedantic goose.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helots