Shipping Something to the MOON!!!!
SKOoOTA
Ascot Vale,Australia.Registered User regular
Ascot Vale,Australia.Registered User regular
Created a PA Pinny Shipping discussion thread as we started Hijacking the Blind Box thread a little and felt this needed to be raised on it's own.
BackStory: A discussion started on the price PA charge for shipping blind boxes and Multiple pins to Australia. On bulk orders the Shipping works out to be triple the price a parcel of the same size and weight would normally cost from the USA and other merchants.
(ThinkGeek offered Free international shipping on all orders over $150 during the past Christmas period despite the size and weight of the package, If Penny Arcade even had half decent shipping costs than my money would have gone there instead).
I mentioned that I raised this issue by email with PA Customer service and was a little disappointed with their reply;
I emailed PA Customer Service about this same issue and got a pretty Piss Weak reply (below) to be honest. I can understand a bit of a mark up 'Because it's like shipping to the Moon' but triple the amount that it costs to send a package like that from anywhere else in the USA is just flaming ridiculous.
(You can contact PA customer support through this email and let them know how you feel customerservice@penny-arcade.com)
"Dear Scott
The shipping charges are estimated by the website using a system that doesn't scale very well. If you order one set of pins the shop has the correct weight for that set and shipping materials for shipping that one set. If you order two sets the shop thinks you have ordered two sets and the shipping materials weight is doubled. This continues to scale up quickly the more items you order. Unfortunately there isn't much we can do to alleviate the issue without losing money on orders for single items. Hopefully that helps to elucidate the shipping charges.
Enthusiastically, Penny Arcade Merchandise Customer Service"
From this discussion it was raised that there are other issues members are finding with the checkout system and not being able to process multiple discount codes;
"The shipping costs need to be calculated using a more accurate algorithm that better reflects how things are parcelled up and priced. Easy to write but difficult to implement.
Same with the discount codes. If I buy 5 items and have 5 "Free item" codes, it should be possible to get them shipped together rather than individually.
Both of these require large alterations to the code. But they aren't virgin territory, they have been done before."
"I don't think "it's kind of hard work" is a good excuse for over charging your loyal customers?
It is a constant sore point every time I have to shop at the PA Store and for an organisation that has made so many amazing strides for Aus fans, it is particularly odd that they seem unwilling to even entertain the idea of fixing this. Something needs to change at some point, it just can't go on with this rate and with the Aus dollar ever slipping, this is getting worse and worse."
"Oh yeah, I understand why there is a problem and that effort will be required to fix it, but the attitude shown in that email is what bugs me.
To me it reads like "Yeah, we know there is a problem, but you chumps keep spending money anyway so why bother fixing it lol"
Not good enough at all, and it definitely leaves a sour taste in the mouth. I mean, there are still a stack of pins in the store I need, but haven't bothered buying yet because I know I will get stung for postage..."
"It's not just that it's hard work. It's hard to get right and easy to get wrong. If I were told they had been working on it for a while but it kept screwing up, I could believe it. And undertaking that work means time and expense for what could be a handful of edge cases is probably not high on the priority list. Not saying it shouldn't be done. Just don't sharpen the pitchfork just yet.
The main site got an overhaul, but the store stayed the same. I'd be surprised if it wasn't on the 2015 to-do list. It's due."
"Over charging your customers isn't a low priority item and if it is viewed this way, it would be disappointing. PA has been more candid about far less, their silence leads to dissatisfaction.
There's no pitchforks, this is rather civil critique I think, considering I'm still making orders despite my grievances"
"Yeah, the store needs a bunch of changes real bad -- with shipping being the number one. It takes a commitment of resources -- but it's not like they're going to be building their own e-commerce platform from scratch here. There are a number of very good, very reliable platforms out there that can support the kind of advanced shipping rules they need to arrive at accurate cost calculations -- that take into account both the size and weight of individual products, the cost of shipping materials needed, and allows for special rules to be put in place for awkward items. The work required would mostly be about integrating and styling the new platform, and data entry for all the inventory.
The Australia situation sounds like a very bitter pill to swallow, but even here in the U.S. it could certainly be better. I am intimately familiar with how much USPS shipping costs, and it's clownshoes that going from one half ounce pin to three half ounce pins more than doubles the shipping cost the store calculates.
I understand that the extra profit from the inflated shipping costs may be baked into their business model -- and that fixing them may result in them needing to raise prices to maintain the same numbers -- but the way it is setup currently just has the Australians subsidizing us Yanks, which hardly seems fair."
"So after this many years they can't work out a system that calculates package contents weight and shipping material weights separately? What garbage. Also, their actual shipping costs will consequently be much less than what has been quoted and charged, so what are they doing with the extra cash? Straight into the old back pocket huh? Australia tax strikes again.
Might just leave this here, seems a tad hypocritical all of a sudden.."
BackStory: A discussion started on the price PA charge for shipping blind boxes and Multiple pins to Australia. On bulk orders the Shipping works out to be triple the price a parcel of the same size and weight would normally cost from the USA and other merchants.
(ThinkGeek offered Free international shipping on all orders over $150 during the past Christmas period despite the size and weight of the package, If Penny Arcade even had half decent shipping costs than my money would have gone there instead).
I mentioned that I raised this issue by email with PA Customer service and was a little disappointed with their reply;
I emailed PA Customer Service about this same issue and got a pretty Piss Weak reply (below) to be honest. I can understand a bit of a mark up 'Because it's like shipping to the Moon' but triple the amount that it costs to send a package like that from anywhere else in the USA is just flaming ridiculous.
(You can contact PA customer support through this email and let them know how you feel customerservice@penny-arcade.com)
"Dear Scott
The shipping charges are estimated by the website using a system that doesn't scale very well. If you order one set of pins the shop has the correct weight for that set and shipping materials for shipping that one set. If you order two sets the shop thinks you have ordered two sets and the shipping materials weight is doubled. This continues to scale up quickly the more items you order. Unfortunately there isn't much we can do to alleviate the issue without losing money on orders for single items. Hopefully that helps to elucidate the shipping charges.
Enthusiastically, Penny Arcade Merchandise Customer Service"
From this discussion it was raised that there are other issues members are finding with the checkout system and not being able to process multiple discount codes;
"The shipping costs need to be calculated using a more accurate algorithm that better reflects how things are parcelled up and priced. Easy to write but difficult to implement.
Same with the discount codes. If I buy 5 items and have 5 "Free item" codes, it should be possible to get them shipped together rather than individually.
Both of these require large alterations to the code. But they aren't virgin territory, they have been done before."
"I don't think "it's kind of hard work" is a good excuse for over charging your loyal customers?
It is a constant sore point every time I have to shop at the PA Store and for an organisation that has made so many amazing strides for Aus fans, it is particularly odd that they seem unwilling to even entertain the idea of fixing this. Something needs to change at some point, it just can't go on with this rate and with the Aus dollar ever slipping, this is getting worse and worse."
"Oh yeah, I understand why there is a problem and that effort will be required to fix it, but the attitude shown in that email is what bugs me.
To me it reads like "Yeah, we know there is a problem, but you chumps keep spending money anyway so why bother fixing it lol"
Not good enough at all, and it definitely leaves a sour taste in the mouth. I mean, there are still a stack of pins in the store I need, but haven't bothered buying yet because I know I will get stung for postage..."
"It's not just that it's hard work. It's hard to get right and easy to get wrong. If I were told they had been working on it for a while but it kept screwing up, I could believe it. And undertaking that work means time and expense for what could be a handful of edge cases is probably not high on the priority list. Not saying it shouldn't be done. Just don't sharpen the pitchfork just yet.
The main site got an overhaul, but the store stayed the same. I'd be surprised if it wasn't on the 2015 to-do list. It's due."
"Over charging your customers isn't a low priority item and if it is viewed this way, it would be disappointing. PA has been more candid about far less, their silence leads to dissatisfaction.
There's no pitchforks, this is rather civil critique I think, considering I'm still making orders despite my grievances"
"Yeah, the store needs a bunch of changes real bad -- with shipping being the number one. It takes a commitment of resources -- but it's not like they're going to be building their own e-commerce platform from scratch here. There are a number of very good, very reliable platforms out there that can support the kind of advanced shipping rules they need to arrive at accurate cost calculations -- that take into account both the size and weight of individual products, the cost of shipping materials needed, and allows for special rules to be put in place for awkward items. The work required would mostly be about integrating and styling the new platform, and data entry for all the inventory.
The Australia situation sounds like a very bitter pill to swallow, but even here in the U.S. it could certainly be better. I am intimately familiar with how much USPS shipping costs, and it's clownshoes that going from one half ounce pin to three half ounce pins more than doubles the shipping cost the store calculates.
I understand that the extra profit from the inflated shipping costs may be baked into their business model -- and that fixing them may result in them needing to raise prices to maintain the same numbers -- but the way it is setup currently just has the Australians subsidizing us Yanks, which hardly seems fair."
"So after this many years they can't work out a system that calculates package contents weight and shipping material weights separately? What garbage. Also, their actual shipping costs will consequently be much less than what has been quoted and charged, so what are they doing with the extra cash? Straight into the old back pocket huh? Australia tax strikes again.
Might just leave this here, seems a tad hypocritical all of a sudden.."
SKOoOTA on
+3
Posts
I re-sent an Email back to PA Customer Service to advise how I felt about this issue and their previous response;
"PA customer service,
This issue with your website system needs to be addressed and fixed or you're just going to loose customers from Australia, myself included. I know that 2 out of 3 Aussies I speak to about this issue refuse to spend that kind of money on shipping and therefore don't make purchases at all. I can understand a bit of a mark up or even double what the same package size and weight would normally cost from the USA, but to be charged OVER TRIPLE what it costs is just plain rude. How many other orders are PA loosing out on from Australia because customers feel the shipping costs are just a plain rip off and it's a form of daylight robbery at its finest?
It seriously is tarnishing the Penny Arcade and PAX brand which you guys are trying so hard to build within Australia.
Regards Skooota."
So I guess I hop around with regards to how I feel about shipping prices? No, I still don't like them. I'm not sure how I feel. It sucks when you have to dump orders you're excited about because the fees are ridiculous and you're low on cash around Christmas, though.
[/br]https://www.pinnypals.com/pals/misskass
I understand it's in place to cover their asses in case something goes against them, but it's totally unfair especially for everyone international when there's new pin sets popping up multiple times a year.
Trade me pins! - https://pinnypals.com/pals/TheAggroCraig
I was pretty cheesed off when I read the email above though, the fact that they know there is a problem and haven't done anything is spit in the eye of their antipodean customers.
Only a mere 136 pins to go!
Shipping costs might go down, but manufacturing costs would be much higher, which would mean higher retail costs in the first place. Like most consumer goods, I can flip over a Pinny Arcade pin and see "Made in China" printed on the back of the card. There is good reason for this, as manufacturing consumer goods is much cheaper in Asia than in Australia (or indeed the USA) due to lower wages and conditions etc. Something that probably WOULD make shipping cheaper would be if they were to establish a warehouse and webstore in Australia, similar to what Cards Against Humanity have done.
That said, I doubt that will happen, as I doubt the market for PA goods is large enough in Australia to make it economically feasible. Shipping is always going to be costly, but when prices are artificially raised due to a poor inventory management system I am liable to get snarky.
Only a mere 136 pins to go!
Only a mere 136 pins to go!
customerservice@penny-arcade.com
I know shipping to Aus is frightful, from across the board of companies, some even refuse it outright. But I had hoped that PA would be a part of the solution, not the problem. Especially when all we want is to give them money.
And that reply.. just not on. Actually their customer service kinda sucks. My last order (the $120 dollar one without conversion) got held up in the Xmas rush, approved for a change in shipping address, but still sent to Texas instead of to the change. That wasn't the issue though, it was the full week and of emails going to CS going through the website filling in forms with the order number, trying to find out if it had actually GONE to Texas or not or where it was, as tracking stated nothing, and just silence. No reply. I ended up having to email Brian directly, who handled it aces and it arrived Xmas eve. But sheesh! I was stressed beyond belief about it for a week beforehand, and had to buy a backup gift for my partner, possibly the biggest deep crow fan you'll ever meet.
I do however feel confident that if it was viable we would have a distribution center here. Maybe in a few years, maybe it's on their radar I don't know. But what I do know is that I don't want to spend $40+ on a shirt worth $20. And I won't, so I don't, and that's sad.
I often look at the things in the Penny Arcade store and wish to buy them, but every time I add things to the cart the shipping cost sends me running for the hills! I'm an avid pin collector, and I shudder every time they release new sets online because I know the shipping is about to burn a hole in my wallet, but there's nothing I can do but swallow it if I want those badges.
I went and looked up my last two orders, and here's what I paid:
1x Pinny Arcade 2014 Weedonwantcha Campers Pin - Weedonwantcha Campers Pins for $14.99 each
1x Pinny Arcade 2014 Sketch Set - Sketch Pins for $29.99 each
1x 11" x 17" Comic Print on 12" x 18" Premium Cardstock - 11x17 for $9.99 each
- 2009-12-30: Resomolutions
1x Special Edition Redraw of the First Penny Arcade Comic Print - First Strip Redraw Print for $9.99 each
Subtotal : $64.96 USD
Shipping : $26.76 USD
Total : $91.72 USD
One set of pins, a single, and a poster tube. $27 shipping.
And my most recent order was:
1x Pinny Arcade Halloween 2014 Pin Set - Halloween Pin Set 2014 for $29.99 each
1x Pinny Arcade Christmas 2014 Pin Set - Christmas Pin Set 2014 for $29.99 each
Subtotal : $59.98 USD
Shipping : $19.29 USD
Total : $79.27 USD
$20 for shipping?! That's just ridiculous; they barely weigh a thing and were packaged in a thin bag!
It's sad when the shipping cost actually makes me dread having to purchase from the PA store. I'd definitely buy more if shipping weren't such a raw deal.
But the least you could do is maybe email out a discount code or gift card that would offset the cost of the shipping you DON'T deserve to be paying. Just because the system is broken and charging you extra for each item isn't the customers fault.
My Digital Pin Lanyard
Anytime I tried to ship it cost my $30-50, which always made me standoffish. I do agree that the shipping there is a bit crazy, but most shipping from the US to AUS is kind of crazy.
With that said, at PAX AUS I talked to Brian and he said that they were working on their shipping costs and he was excited for next year if they could work out the deal he was working on exspecially for Australia shipping.
Also, I agree that customer service email isn't the greatest, but at the same time, no matter what they said would have appeased anyone. If they were to say 'we didn't know', then everyone here would have cried BS. In my mind at least they admitted that they knew, though they definitely could have used better wording.
The real kick in the pants is when they release a LE pin a week or two before they/we know there's going to another set (eg a holiday set), but we can't wait to combine the order because the LE pin won't be there in a week. I feel like this has happened at least twice now (?).
Pinny Pals Lanyard
It's not just Australia that gets the shipping shaft, Canada does as well. Maybe not to as high of a degree, but it often adds a considerable amount.
I think the shipping is decided by the cost of the item, not the weight, which is a super old school way to determine shipping costs and punishes people that spend more.
It cost $6.55 to ship with the USPS.
That was for 3 pins.
It would be great if the store could do a low cost, pin only shipping option.
My Pin Lanyard
[/br]https://www.pinnypals.com/pals/misskass
The pins I sent to US for this trade cost less than $6 or less. (This above pic is the price on the envelop for the pins I received)
It was in the bubble padded type bag, and the pins were wrapped in bubble wrap inside that.
It was classed as letter size.
My Pin Lanyard
I'm working on finishing up my comprehensive pin shipping guide (I posted an early excerpt in a different thread), but I'm afraid I still don't know all the proper details about the Australia side. Is there no way to bypass the counter for you guys? Here, we can pay for and print a postage label at home; and then either drop a letter/parcel into a public box or have it picked up at home out of our mailboxes.
If there was a way to cut out the counter workers, then you could just package a pin in a way to protect it from the sorting machine and ship it as a letter -- which should be hella-cheap. IIRC @Aussie Ben got a pin to me in this way for about $3.25 AUD
http://pinmash.info - Two pins enter, one pins leaves... then the other pin leaves with a lower Elo rating
Well, you could just buy the bubble mailer and the appropriate amount of stamps, and drop it in the mailbox...
Only a mere 136 pins to go!
Add Two pieces of cardboard around the pin as well and that should protect it from the sorting machine.
You can have it shipped "as a letter", if it is a small padded bag, my PO automatically does this, I've never asked for it they generally just want you to get the cheapest price.
http://pinmash.info - Head-To-Head battle of pins! Choose the most desirable.
http://pinnywise.com - iOS pin collection tracking app.
----
My Delicious Pins For Trade
Couldn't you fill out the customs form at home though like we do?
This is what sounds super frustrating for you guys -- it seems like it all depends on the mood of the counter worker on the day you get in there.
http://pinmash.info - Two pins enter, one pins leaves... then the other pin leaves with a lower Elo rating
We can print our own postage labels for parcels through a parcel service (I don't know what it's called, my dad uses it) but the cheapest label is $7.20, as it's generally expected to be used on boxes. Alternatively, we can just buy postage stamps, but the concern then is calculating exact postage to the area of the US we want to send it, and dealing with the customs forms we're expected to fill out. I went to the post office just to bypass the hassle of trying to figure everything out, and got stiffed at the counter. I think next time I'll try using their automated machines, and then downgrade to doing the whole damn thing by myself if the price ridiculousness comes up again.
Edit: yo, @Geth, what's the consensus doing around these parts?
[/br]https://www.pinnypals.com/pals/misskass
Possibly, I've not asked but they always ask me for photo ID and then put a sticker on my package marking that. I'm honestly not 100% on the rules, seems there are online dispatch options, perhaps if you verify an account etc. I think I'll ask next time I'm up there, my guys are pretty friendly, I post a lot of pins hehe
The bottom of the customs forms I fill out very specifically say in bold at the bottom "CAN NOT BE LODGED IN POST OFFICE BOX", possibly that's just because it's a type of form that is human verified, could still be some online verification.
I've only been hit once for $14 single pin, I don't know what happened there, I was too rushed to question it. Generally I can send up to 3 pins before I break the "letter" option, typically under $5.
http://pinmash.info - Head-To-Head battle of pins! Choose the most desirable.
http://pinnywise.com - iOS pin collection tracking app.
----
My Delicious Pins For Trade
Also, to be considered a letter, it must meet these following guidelines:
"To be considered a letter, your item must:
•weigh less than 500g
•contain flexible items
•have a rectangular shape
•be no larger than a B4 envelope (260mm x 360mm x 20mm)
•be no thicker than 20mm "
As long as you are within these guidelines you are able to mail directly via a post box. :-)
Only a mere 136 pins to go!
Only a mere 136 pins to go!
That said, I wish you could get a shipping quote without having to fill out a whole order... Hey, I've got to have something to complain about!
Only a mere 136 pins to go!
Pinny Pals Lanyard
Can anyone else test previous orders and confirm this. I would like to send Brian and the Customer Service team a thank you note if this is true. As Listening to customers complaints and actually doing something about it is a rare quality that most businesses wouldn't even entertain these days. Hopefully this thread hasn't fallen on death ears after all.
Did you get tracking? I find the bulk of my $20-25 cost is usually in the tracking
[X]PAXsouth 2015
[X]PAXaus 2015
[?]PAXeast 2016 ???
Nah, no tracking. I figure the odds of something going missing are usually pretty remote. If I am unlucky, the amount of money I save in not using tracking means I should be able to make things right for my trade partner.
Only a mere 136 pins to go!
themoreyouknow.jpg
Pinny Pals Lanyard
PAX_Skeletor helped me with that one.
if it's only one pin, just get a PB1 padded bag, it's the smallest one I think, only costs $1.05.
I know for a fact that is the right bag, I went to the counter and the lady said what are you sending, I showed her the pin, and she said the bag was fine for it.
if the post office charged you more for postage for the same thing I sent, I would use a different post office.
Pinny Pals Lanyard
I like test pins. ^^