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[Metroid] The series so dead they resurrected it twice!

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  • Steel AngelSteel Angel Registered User regular
    They really need to put Super Metroid on the 3DS eShop.

    I enjoy what the Prime games did in terms of adding exploration to a first person perspective, but they never captured the speed and fluidity of motion and combat you got in the 2D games. I enjoyed my time with them but never finished a Prime game.

    Big Dookie wrote: »
    I found that tilting it doesn't work very well, and once I started jerking it, I got much better results.

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  • DarlanDarlan Registered User regular
    Zero Mission has a fair chance to show up on the esho soon. It's not too important to play it all in order, the story is not why you play these, but you'll want to play at least Super Metroid before Prime, the latter is best appreciated when you can see how elegant the transition from 2Dto 3D was.

  • KriegaffeKriegaffe Registered User regular
    Super Metroid is the place to start.

  • l_gl_g Registered User regular
    I picked up MPT on sale for the WiiU, but I'm finding that after a short session of it I'm getting a pretty severe motion sickness response to it... which is weird, because I've logged hundreds of hours in PC FPS games, including ones which are much twitchier. I'm wondering if part of it is due to me not being very good with the pointer controls, resulting in drunken camera work as I'm doing too much camera movement initially, followed by overcorrection of that initial camera movement.

    I do wish that the textures of the game got an HD upgrade, because on a 1080p the limits of the base texture resolution becomes a little glaring.

    Cole's Law: "Thinly sliced cabbage."
  • LBD_NytetraynLBD_Nytetrayn TorontoRegistered User regular
    They really need to put Super Metroid on the 3DS eShop.

    I enjoy what the Prime games did in terms of adding exploration to a first person perspective, but they never captured the speed and fluidity of motion and combat you got in the 2D games. I enjoyed my time with them but never finished a Prime game.

    They don't have any Super NES games on there, though...

    ...which, of course, means that a 3D Classics version would be a spectacular idea!

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  • DrezDrez Registered User regular
    Samus is baller.

    Switch: SW-7690-2320-9238Steam/PSN/Xbox: Drezdar
  • McFlynnMcFlynn Registered User regular
    I ended up buying then selling Zero Mission. It felt too linear to me. I'm not huge on sequence breaking but eh, I just didn't love it.

  • Maz-Maz- 飛べ Registered User regular
    http://nintendoeverything.com/rumor-details-emerge-about-cancelled-metroid-3ds-project/
    Back in December, there was talk about a cancelled Metroid project for 3DS. Not much was known about it at the time, but a few concrete details have since surfaced.

    The folks over at Unseen64 put up a new podcast on Patreon that shares a bit more on the mysterious Metroid project. It was made clear by the site’s Liam Robertson that this was an attempt to revive 2D Metroid on 3DS. Based on a rough prototype Robertson saw, the title was a tad faster than Super Metroid and Metroid Fusion.

    Gameplay was intended to offer players a 2.5D side-scrolling experience. It looked like regular Metroid, but with 3D depth.

    The project featured “a slightly different art style” than we’re accustomed to. As for Samus, she appeared to be “thinner” and “a bit more athletic”.

    Robertson saw a few things in a short, 30-second prototype video. Samus runs through a level and takes on on a few enemies before ultimately confronting a boss. The boss in question looks like Kraid.

    Unfortunately, we’re still unsure about which studio was behind the Metroid 3DS project. Robertson, however, said that it came from “a pretty popular western developer”. The unknown studio pitched its prototype to Nintendo, but the company did not want to proceed further. That’s because Nintendo wasn’t ready to move the franchise in the direction of a 2.5D side-scroller at the time (seemingly around 2012 or so). And that was the end of it!

    All of this information comes from one of Robertson’s contacts/sources, who he has been trying to protect – hence the lack of information until now. We’re still marking this post as a rumor like our original story, but keep in mind that Unseen64’s job is to unearth news and information regarding cancelled projects. They tend to know what they’re talking about!

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  • DrezDrez Registered User regular
    Drez wrote: »
    Samus is baller.

    See, this is a very clever joke. It's a pun because Samus is like super awesome big time now, which is one definition of baller, but she also literally transforms into a ball. It's an amazingly funny joke.

    Switch: SW-7690-2320-9238Steam/PSN/Xbox: Drezdar
  • DaveTheWaveDaveTheWave Registered User regular
    I liked it.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
  • RenzoRenzo Registered User regular
    The thing that ended up killing my drive to finish Prime 1 is all the chozo ghosts that show up as I'm trying to get the keys near the end of the game and the horrible alarm-y music that plays when they show up. They're not fun to fight, they're 100% annoying, and since I've been through all these areas before, the encounters just feel like dumb roadblocks that shouldn't even be there. I've only played through Prime 1 once because of this, which is a shame because I really like the rest of the game.

    I have a Prime 2 save at about 40% because of the aforementioned unnecessarily complex dark world/light world mechanic.

    Prime 3 on the other hand I think is great pretty much all the way through, and I've played it 3 times, which is kind of a lot for me.I enjoyed how much of the map was split up. It basically inserted warp points throughout the game, so while there is the trademark Metroid "backtracking but with new abilities", you don't have to retread areas you don't want to.

    Unpopular opinion alert: Super Metroid is a good game and a great place to start playing Metroid games. But once you finish it and move on to Metroid Prime Trilogy, Fusion, and Zero Mission, you'll see they're all better than Super Metroid. It can be tough to go back!

    That's my experience, anyway.

  • King RiptorKing Riptor Registered User regular
    The trick with chozo ghosts is 90% of the time you can just run past them.

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  • AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    Or flip on the xray visor and pop them with super missiles. They go down fast.

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  • RenzoRenzo Registered User regular
    Hmm. Maybe I'll give Prime 1 another go then.

  • MolybdenumMolybdenum Registered User regular
    Remember friends: You can run through a vast majority of Prime/Echoes rooms without shooting any more than is needed to open a door.

    Failing that, charge your ice/dark beam and hit the frozen/entangled enemy with a missile. The WomboCombo will take out all but the most obnoxious and intentionally difficult enemies.

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  • McFlynnMcFlynn Registered User regular
    Renzo wrote: »
    Hmm. Maybe I'll give Prime 1 another go then.

    Now that Im not twelve, I'm surprised how minor the chozo ghosts are. I haven't finished the game yet, but outside of one room that's really big and the chozo can fly out of xray range, they die a lot quicker than I remember.

    I think normal mode is easier in the trilogy.

  • AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    I believe they did turn down the difficulty for Prime 1 and 2 on the trilogy versions.

    cs6f034fsffl.jpg
  • jothkijothki Registered User regular
    McFlynn wrote: »
    I ended up buying then selling Zero Mission. It felt too linear to me. I'm not huge on sequence breaking but eh, I just didn't love it.

    Do you mean you don't like its style of designed sequence breaking, or what?

  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    Renzo wrote: »
    Unpopular opinion alert: Super Metroid is a good game and a great place to start playing Metroid games. But once you finish it and move on to Metroid Prime Trilogy, Fusion, and Zero Mission, you'll see they're all better than Super Metroid. It can be tough to go back!
    Eh, I don't know about "better". Fusion is honestly way too straightforward and simple for a Metroid game; I blasted through that game in no time at all when it came out. Not because it was bad, it was just simple on the scale of Metroid adventures. Zero Mission is definitely great and has a couple feature improvements over Super Metroid (such as the "Power Grip" so you can grab ledges), but Super Metroid still nails the atmosphere a good bit better.

    MP2 is iffy in a lot of spots, and to be honest, the travelling and other characters in MP3 butchers the isolated tension that is typical of the series. It's no longer you against a planet, it's you against whatever is in the immediate area, with an entire fleet buzzing around out there sending soldiers around to do things. It feels way more "level" oriented, as opposed to the organic exploration of MP1 and Super Metroid; the (brief) bits involving interacting with other characters are also super-bland. And as much as I appreciated playing a game which finally made a worthwhile use of the Wii controls instead of just having them as yet another "swing the controller instead of pressing a button" gimmicky system, I'd rather the game not have needed those because then playing it in the future requires some dumb hoops to jump through because the Wii controls clearly did not have legs.

  • McFlynnMcFlynn Registered User regular
    jothki wrote: »
    McFlynn wrote: »
    I ended up buying then selling Zero Mission. It felt too linear to me. I'm not huge on sequence breaking but eh, I just didn't love it.

    Do you mean you don't like its style of designed sequence breaking, or what?

    Well outside of getting missile expansions and stuff, Metroid games are pretty linear. You must do A, then B, then C. But most of them feel like you're exploring the planet naturally.

    Fusion obviously just tells you where to go, but whatever.

    Zero Mission doesn't hold your hand as much as Fusion but it doesn't give me the same feeling of natural exploration.

    I have no solid reasons for why I felt that way, but I did.

    The sequence breaking comment was just to acknowledge that yes I could sequence break to make the game feel more open, but I had no desire to do that in Zero Mission either.

  • GnomeTankGnomeTank What the what? Portland, OregonRegistered User regular
    They really need to put Super Metroid on the 3DS eShop.

    I enjoy what the Prime games did in terms of adding exploration to a first person perspective, but they never captured the speed and fluidity of motion and combat you got in the 2D games. I enjoyed my time with them but never finished a Prime game.

    Have to disagree with this. Once I got very, very good at Prime, I felt my motions were incredibly fluid and fast....but at least on the original GC version, the control layout worked against you. I ended up having to hold the controller in this crazy crab grip. The waggle only version of Metroid Prime (aka the trilogy) I agree, the waggle controls absolutely took away some of the speed and fluidity.

    Sagroth wrote: »
    Oh c'mon FyreWulff, no one's gonna pay to visit Uranus.
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  • GnomeTankGnomeTank What the what? Portland, OregonRegistered User regular
    McFlynn wrote: »
    Renzo wrote: »
    Hmm. Maybe I'll give Prime 1 another go then.

    Now that Im not twelve, I'm surprised how minor the chozo ghosts are. I haven't finished the game yet, but outside of one room that's really big and the chozo can fly out of xray range, they die a lot quicker than I remember.

    I think normal mode is easier in the trilogy.

    You are correct. Normal in the trilogy is easy, and hard is normal from the original MP1 and MP2.

    Sagroth wrote: »
    Oh c'mon FyreWulff, no one's gonna pay to visit Uranus.
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  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    Probably a leftover from the way the game originally was since it would've been pretty horrifically frustrating to have as much exploration required as Super Metroid, but with no map. Doubly so, considering the original version was basically the very first of its kind and nobody would've had any idea whatsoever that they should be doing things like blasting blocks and whatnot to progress.

  • Zerozaki IshikiZerozaki Ishiki Registered User regular
    I think Metroid Fusion is actually the perfect balance; you can explore, but you always have a clear directive on where you SHOULD be going next. Super Metroid I've tried twice; the first time I got hopelessly lost and couldn't figure out where I needed to go, the second time I hit a boss that looked like a chozo statue and appeared to take no damage from any of my attacks, so I gave up. It's a great game and really ahead of it's time, but I definitely don't mind have some clear directions.
    The Prime games are good but they really just need to have normal checkpoints on boss fights, since the run from the save room to the boss is so much more annoying in 3D.

  • italianranmaitalianranma Registered User regular
    I think Metroid Fusion is actually the perfect balance; you can explore, but you always have a clear directive on where you SHOULD be going next. Super Metroid I've tried twice; the first time I got hopelessly lost and couldn't figure out where I needed to go, the second time I hit a boss that looked like a chozo statue and appeared to take no damage from any of my attacks, so I gave up. It's a great game and really ahead of it's time, but I definitely don't mind have some clear directions.
    The Prime games are good but they really just need to have normal checkpoints on boss fights, since the run from the save room to the boss is so much more annoying in 3D.

    The standard boss strategy in all Metroid games is to first fire the beam cannon to see if that damages the enemy. If that doesn't work, switch to missiles, and then switch to bombs. If this still isn't working then you need to dodge about and wait for some sort of big attack and then when the boss stays still for a bit try that sequence again.

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  • Lavender GoomsLavender Gooms Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    edited February 2015
    Fusion's gameplay is pretty good, but its plot is incredibly stupid. Something that I think is pretty important about the best Metroid games is the isolation component, where it's just you exploring a planet full of baddies by yourself. Fusion's jabbering bore of a computer is the worst character in the games we're allowed to talk about, and honestly Samus' inner monologue isn't that interesting.

    Lavender Gooms on
  • Zerozaki IshikiZerozaki Ishiki Registered User regular
    True, but the game also scared the shit out of me twice, which isn't something I can say about any other game in the series.

  • DarlanDarlan Registered User regular
    edited February 2015
    Aistan wrote: »
    Fusion's gameplay is pretty good, but its plot is incredibly stupid. Something that I think is pretty important about the best Metroid games is the isolation component, where it's just you exploring a planet full of baddies by yourself. Fusion's jabbering bore of a computer is the worst character in the games we're allowed to talk about, and honestly Samus' inner monologue isn't that interesting.
    The same thing really drags down Prime 3 as well. It's hard to get really invested in a world when there's a bunch of ridiculous assholes in an elevator with you spouting lines like "Hey, of course we're going to win, we're the heroes right?"

    I'm physically, literally wincing here at the dialogue.

    Darlan on
  • KupiKupi Registered User regular
    Teenage me went through the entirety of the back half of Metroid Fusion with clenched teeth going into every room, because the SA-X could be fucking anywhere. I'm not sure I buy that having a command center / partner* removed the sense of isolation or dramatic tension at all.
    * One, I might add, who was physically helpless to support you in any meaningful way and was not, strictly speaking, on your side.

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  • Steel AngelSteel Angel Registered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    Fusion's gameplay is pretty good, but its plot is incredibly stupid. Something that I think is pretty important about the best Metroid games is the isolation component, where it's just you exploring a planet full of baddies by yourself. Fusion's jabbering bore of a computer is the worst character in the games we're allowed to talk about, and honestly Samus' inner monologue isn't that interesting.

    A disembodied AI isn't exactly the most social experience. Even with it, the fact that it couldn't help you directly while you were being hunted by X does play into the sense of isolation. He really wasn't done the best though and it often felt like it was just setup for pointing out the restricted areas were restricted.

    Big Dookie wrote: »
    I found that tilting it doesn't work very well, and once I started jerking it, I got much better results.

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  • Ninja Snarl PNinja Snarl P My helmet is my burden. Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered User regular
    My thing with the AI is this: if you took it out completely, the game would be better. As in, just deleting the AI bits from the game completely, with only the suit AI telling you things, would improve the game.

    Not that Fusion is bad, just that the AI stuff is kinda pointless.

  • RidleySariaRidleySaria AnaheimRegistered User regular
    It amuses me that our local AI agrees that the AI stuff is pointless.

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  • McFlynnMcFlynn Registered User regular
    I'm sure that's an ironic, "he'll be the first to go" kind of awesome.

  • FremFrem Registered User regular
    l_g wrote: »
    I picked up MPT on sale for the WiiU, but I'm finding that after a short session of it I'm getting a pretty severe motion sickness response to it... which is weird, because I've logged hundreds of hours in PC FPS games, including ones which are much twitchier. I'm wondering if part of it is due to me not being very good with the pointer controls, resulting in drunken camera work as I'm doing too much camera movement initially, followed by overcorrection of that initial camera movement.

    I do wish that the textures of the game got an HD upgrade, because on a 1080p the limits of the base texture resolution becomes a little glaring.

    I find that the narrower the field of view, the quicker motion sickness gets to me. Most PC games have a much wider FOV than Metroid Prime. You can't adjust that (in the Gamecube version, anyway), but there are a couple of other things that can help. Having a static object to focus on helps me a lot, so go to options -> Visor -> HUD Lag and turn it off. Another thing is to get as far back from the TV as possible and/or play it on a smaller screen. The more peripheral vision you have, the harder it'll be for motion sickness to kick in.

  • RidleySariaRidleySaria AnaheimRegistered User regular
    Bioshock on PC make me all kinds of queasy. No problems playing it on PS3.

    Anyone want to buy a slightly used copy of Bioshock on PC? :p

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  • McFlynnMcFlynn Registered User regular
    I played too much item hunting in Metroid Prime this weekend. I'm hearing the hidden item noise in real life now.

  • RidleySariaRidleySaria AnaheimRegistered User regular
    McFlynn wrote: »
    I played too much item hunting in Metroid Prime this weekend. I'm hearing the hidden item noise in real life now.

    After playing turn based games I get the sensation that real life is supposed to be turn based. I can't play video games before bed - I'll get the mechanics stuck in my head and it'll screw with my dreams.

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  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    Man, think about Bioshock games where you can explore the city. That would've been awesome.

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  • MolybdenumMolybdenum Registered User regular
    I think the ideal Metroidvania setup is a surprisingly tough balance to strike. Let's say you lay a game out such that wherever you go, whenever you go there, there's always something to do and always some things inaccessible until you unlock new abilities. That just means every time you unlock something, say powerbombs, you have to backtrack to evvvvvery area just to do the powerbomb-specific thing - and that's what ends up happening in Prime since the powerbombs are a late acquisition and you've already explored everything else you can reach.

    It would also be hard to design a smooth progression if players could get any number of items in any order, so you have to linearize things somewhat to make sure you get missiles pretty early and the charge beam basically first thing.

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