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Cities: Skylines 2 Now Available

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Posts

  • Jealous DevaJealous Deva Registered User regular
    syndalis wrote: »
    Triple p-p-post here - but another observation; if you are experiencing random crashes to desktop, and your player.log file, located in "{{USER}}\AppData\LocalLow\Collosal Order\Cities Skylines II" has the following line in it:
    Virtual texturing warning: W1003: Transcoded a tile but no space was left in GPU cache of type BC7 UNORM to accommodate it. This probably means that the GPU is too small for the requested data.
    

    Go into your GPU's control panel (Nvidia Control Panel, Radeon Adrenalin), and go to the game specific 3D settings and cap the frame rate to something. I set it to 60fps on my machine (4090) and even though I rarely stay pegged at the FPS, the fact that it doesn't ever try to overshoot that target means that the GPU isn't getting ahead of the game and leading to a unhandled situation where they flood the memory with shit.

    I think this is an unoptimized game, folks.

    Also, definitely turn on auto save. I have already lost a couple hours of work to the crashes... and also the lack of an undo feature makes it nice that I have 10 autosaves at 5 minute intervals giving me nearly an hour of walking things back if I don't like the direction I went.

    This is actually pretty decent advice in general. I have had a number of games where setting max fps to 60, 90, or 120 has tixed performance problems or instability.

  • HappylilElfHappylilElf Registered User regular
    I remember that being an issue a long time ago that was largely fixed because devs would put in built in fps limiters

    It seems like it's gotten worse over the last decade though. There's been multiple games were my choice was either manually limit the max fps or worry about the game crashing if I left it on a menu for too long.

    Like MW5 and Valheim both had this issue at one point iirc

  • -Loki--Loki- Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining. Registered User regular
    Limiting the FPS in PC games is a one way ticket to review bombing.

    A lot of people who game on PC see that kind of thing as a console limitation. Then piss and moan when unlocking the framerate leads to wildly inconsistent framerates.

  • HappylilElfHappylilElf Registered User regular
    edited November 2023
    -Loki- wrote: »
    Limiting the FPS in PC games is a one way ticket to review bombing.

    A lot of people who game on PC see that kind of thing as a console limitation. Then piss and moan when unlocking the framerate leads to wildly inconsistent framerates.

    Yeah but if completely unrestrained FPS leads to CPU/GPU overheating as both Valheim and MW5 did some kind of limit should probably be put in by the devs even if it's like 240fps or something.

    Like my GPU temp in Valheim was pushing close to 90℃ from sitting on the main menu until I hard limited it to 60fps because there was nothing telling it not to keep pushing FPS until the PC was about to overheat.

    HappylilElf on
  • -Loki--Loki- Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining. Registered User regular
    Oh I completely agree. I limit all my games to 120fps, even though I have a 144hz monitor.

    That's the point where I start losing the ability to notice a difference in how smooth it is, and beyond that heat generation starts making my fans crank to levels I find distracting. The worst offender is menus that seem to not abide by in game frame limiting, which is why I preset games in AMD Adrenaline to have a frame limit.

    But still, all you have to do is look at things like Mortal Kombat 1 (or was it 11?) or Forza Motorsport saying they'd be limiting framerates to 60 and see the usual PC crowd start the teeth gnashing.

    With something like Skylines 2, where they have admitted their goal is 30-60fps, they definitely should be presetting a limit to 60 even if they let you change it/completely unlock it.

  • InfamyDeferredInfamyDeferred Registered User regular
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  • JasconiusJasconius sword criminal mad onlineRegistered User regular
    the latest patch did weird things to my city and im just gonna sit back a bit and wait a patch or two while they sort out some of this weirdness

    traffic makes NO sense... and now in this patch all my mass transit is disappearing enroute, and im not sure what effect that actually has on... anything.

  • That_GuyThat_Guy I don't wanna be that guy Registered User regular
    Remember how broken dams were in CS1? They're just as broken in game 2. On a related note, did you know there is no way to manually trigger an evacuation? The death toll is catastrophic.
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  • MvrckMvrck Dwarven MountainhomeRegistered User regular
    Another hotfix patch, this time dealing with stray pets and garbage. Sounds like Incinerators and Recycling centers got majorly buffed in terms of trucks and what they can process, but power gen from incinerators MAY have been slightly nerfed? I haven't been able to find any actual hard #'s posted, I'll have to check when I get home in a few hours.

  • JasconiusJasconius sword criminal mad onlineRegistered User regular
    patch instantly made a major adjustment to my garbage. i personally wasnt having very many problems but the new status qo definitely makes more sense

    i didnt see it in the notes but im getting much better traffic behavior and parking lots are no longer giga magnets that fill up instantly no matter how many i place

    right now the only thing left i see really wrong in my city is placing a police HQ and a hospital seems to render regular building service totally moot, no matter how much crime is going on i basically only have a police copter running and i rarely see my jails tick up

    the only other ??? thing is like.. i seem to have basically infinite money, even though im only +60k per month i feel like i turn my head and look back and im up millions, with no city level ups involved. weird

  • JasconiusJasconius sword criminal mad onlineRegistered User regular
    ok theres a small issue with my subway but nobody seems to mind

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  • -Loki--Loki- Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining. Registered User regular
    So it's a submarineway?

  • StrikorStrikor Calibrations? Calibrations! Registered User regular
    Self-washing subway 10/10 would ride again

  • SyphonBlueSyphonBlue The studying beaver That beaver sure loves studying!Registered User regular
    Hmmm my city appears to have hit a bug. My low density residential is constantly maxed out. I spent all morning today building little suburbs around my city. Started off the day with 10,789 cims, ended with 10,794 cims and low residential still maxed out. Also my commercial zones all say not enough customers.

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    PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
  • That_GuyThat_Guy I don't wanna be that guy Registered User regular
    SyphonBlue wrote: »
    Hmmm my city appears to have hit a bug. My low density residential is constantly maxed out. I spent all morning today building little suburbs around my city. Started off the day with 10,789 cims, ended with 10,794 cims and low residential still maxed out. Also my commercial zones all say not enough customers.

    Yeah, that's been an ongoing problem with the game itself. Even if there's no demand for it, you can zone in medium or high density. Once you run out of open slots in your low density housing, the game will finally start building higher. The commercial zone thing is due to the game building too many of one type of building, say bookstores. If you keep bulldozing the problem buildings, eventually the game will build a different kind of business.

    I wouldn't expect this to be truly fixed in the foreseeable future The simulation is fundamentally broken. The only way they managed to put out a partially working game is though fudging the numbers behind the scenes. Goods aren't being transported around the city so buildings are programmed to use less of them. Buildings aren't putting out the right demand calls and even when they do, they aren't getting what they need. The simulation doesn't know what to build when you zone in an area. Goods aren't being properly exported. Chirpr is literally just spamming related nonsense at you, even when the game is paused. The economy is so dysfunctional that, even with massive "government subsidies" they still have to throw money at you that just isn't displayed in the UI. Even the way water and power move across the city is broken so there's a hidden "storage value" that each building gets.

    It's been immensely frustrating to discover all of this too.

  • MvrckMvrck Dwarven MountainhomeRegistered User regular
    SyphonBlue wrote: »
    Hmmm my city appears to have hit a bug. My low density residential is constantly maxed out. I spent all morning today building little suburbs around my city. Started off the day with 10,789 cims, ended with 10,794 cims and low residential still maxed out. Also my commercial zones all say not enough customers.

    A couple things - did the homes actually get built after you zoned them? Cims will move around to "better" homes, so you might be seeing them move out of mid density (or low rent high density if you have any) into low density and the medium density not get new folks moving in due to a lack of support/appeal for it vs low density.

    Second, low density is basically always in demand, forever no matter your city size. Everyone wants their own McMansion.

    If you have commercial demand but are lacking customers after the recent balance patches, it can be a few things:

    - A lack of ability for customers to easily reach the commercial areas in question. Either due to traffic, a lack of time, a lack of public transit, etc. Alternatively, poor placement - commercial should generally be placed on collectors and arterials, rarely off on its own little side streets.

    - High input good costs for that specific business type. Lower margins means they need more customers to stay profitable.

    Since cargo importing breaks mail currently, the best way to deal with that is just trying to build up some of the basic extraction resources in the supply chain. Your industrial zones will usually adjust over time to meet demand/supply.

    Eventually you'll hit a density curve where import prices via truck will *mostly* be offset by the switch to high density commercial and the transition to medium/high density residential/mass transit access providing enough people to overcome higher input pricing.

    - A lack of quality mail service. Your commercial businesses will also do remote/online orders and if they aren't getting good postal access they will suffer.

  • SyphonBlueSyphonBlue The studying beaver That beaver sure loves studying!Registered User regular
    Mvrck wrote: »
    SyphonBlue wrote: »
    Hmmm my city appears to have hit a bug. My low density residential is constantly maxed out. I spent all morning today building little suburbs around my city. Started off the day with 10,789 cims, ended with 10,794 cims and low residential still maxed out. Also my commercial zones all say not enough customers.

    A couple things - did the homes actually get built after you zoned them? Cims will move around to "better" homes, so you might be seeing them move out of mid density (or low rent high density if you have any) into low density and the medium density not get new folks moving in due to a lack of support/appeal for it vs low density.

    Second, low density is basically always in demand, forever no matter your city size. Everyone wants their own McMansion.

    If you have commercial demand but are lacking customers after the recent balance patches, it can be a few things:

    - A lack of ability for customers to easily reach the commercial areas in question. Either due to traffic, a lack of time, a lack of public transit, etc. Alternatively, poor placement - commercial should generally be placed on collectors and arterials, rarely off on its own little side streets.

    - High input good costs for that specific business type. Lower margins means they need more customers to stay profitable.

    Since cargo importing breaks mail currently, the best way to deal with that is just trying to build up some of the basic extraction resources in the supply chain. Your industrial zones will usually adjust over time to meet demand/supply.

    Eventually you'll hit a density curve where import prices via truck will *mostly* be offset by the switch to high density commercial and the transition to medium/high density residential/mass transit access providing enough people to overcome higher input pricing.

    - A lack of quality mail service. Your commercial businesses will also do remote/online orders and if they aren't getting good postal access they will suffer.

    They get built literally as soon as I plop them down. I can't keep up. I'm not losing medium residential buildings though either. My population is stuck, but low residential buildings keep going up, and the demand bar stays maxed.

    LxX6eco.jpg
    PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
  • FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited November 2023
    That_Guy wrote: »
    SyphonBlue wrote: »
    Hmmm my city appears to have hit a bug. My low density residential is constantly maxed out. I spent all morning today building little suburbs around my city. Started off the day with 10,789 cims, ended with 10,794 cims and low residential still maxed out. Also my commercial zones all say not enough customers.

    Yeah, that's been an ongoing problem with the game itself. Even if there's no demand for it, you can zone in medium or high density. Once you run out of open slots in your low density housing, the game will finally start building higher. The commercial zone thing is due to the game building too many of one type of building, say bookstores. If you keep bulldozing the problem buildings, eventually the game will build a different kind of business.

    I wouldn't expect this to be truly fixed in the foreseeable future The simulation is fundamentally broken. The only way they managed to put out a partially working game is though fudging the numbers behind the scenes. Goods aren't being transported around the city so buildings are programmed to use less of them. Buildings aren't putting out the right demand calls and even when they do, they aren't getting what they need. The simulation doesn't know what to build when you zone in an area. Goods aren't being properly exported. Chirpr is literally just spamming related nonsense at you, even when the game is paused. The economy is so dysfunctional that, even with massive "government subsidies" they still have to throw money at you that just isn't displayed in the UI. Even the way water and power move across the city is broken so there's a hidden "storage value" that each building gets.

    It's been immensely frustrating to discover all of this too.

    Guhh yeah I didn't want to speculate on this too early, but with the SimCity 2013 comparisons coming up, it was hard not to a bit.

    SimCity went through a similar I guess "disappointment progression". Okay it's always online, we hashed that out before release. If you buy it, you've accepted that to some degree. Game launches, servers catch fire. But it's so pretty and charming! They did a cool week long stream before the game came out, every day, and it looked fun. You get the game in your hands, it feels fun! But those damn servers, I can barely play.

    Okay servers finally get a little better, or you get a good 3-4 hours in before they crash again. Huh, some stuff is working weirdly. I send 5 firetrucks to help out my neighbor, but he never gets them. Yeah, probably the servers being wonky. My traffic is doing very odd things, some of my buildings aren't receiving power when they should, well probably the servers. They even said the servers handle a lot of the calculations (lol whoops), so it makes sense.

    People start investigating amidst all of this, find out the simulation is just super messed up. Maybe it's the servers? Okay no the servers are fixed now and all of this stuff is jacked up. Single player mode finally introduced, yeah the simulation is just deeply deeply flawed. People try to make some mods, fix some stuff, but not enough and it just is what it is. I spent weeks of playing off and on with friends thinking it was a good game just marred by its crazy server issues, but nope. Just took awhile for the fog of war to clear and it really was very deeply flawed all throughout.

    It's not exactly the same situation, but looking from afar at how incredibly technically flawed the game was at launch....yeah, just hard not to speculate. Everyone's focused on bad performance, well if the game commits so many very basic sins on the technical performance side, what's going on on the simulation side?

    That's very lame to hear that it actually is a lot deeper than just the bad performance.

    Fiatil on
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  • Jealous DevaJealous Deva Registered User regular
    Fiatil wrote: »
    That_Guy wrote: »
    SyphonBlue wrote: »
    Hmmm my city appears to have hit a bug. My low density residential is constantly maxed out. I spent all morning today building little suburbs around my city. Started off the day with 10,789 cims, ended with 10,794 cims and low residential still maxed out. Also my commercial zones all say not enough customers.

    Yeah, that's been an ongoing problem with the game itself. Even if there's no demand for it, you can zone in medium or high density. Once you run out of open slots in your low density housing, the game will finally start building higher. The commercial zone thing is due to the game building too many of one type of building, say bookstores. If you keep bulldozing the problem buildings, eventually the game will build a different kind of business.

    I wouldn't expect this to be truly fixed in the foreseeable future The simulation is fundamentally broken. The only way they managed to put out a partially working game is though fudging the numbers behind the scenes. Goods aren't being transported around the city so buildings are programmed to use less of them. Buildings aren't putting out the right demand calls and even when they do, they aren't getting what they need. The simulation doesn't know what to build when you zone in an area. Goods aren't being properly exported. Chirpr is literally just spamming related nonsense at you, even when the game is paused. The economy is so dysfunctional that, even with massive "government subsidies" they still have to throw money at you that just isn't displayed in the UI. Even the way water and power move across the city is broken so there's a hidden "storage value" that each building gets.

    It's been immensely frustrating to discover all of this too.

    Guhh yeah I didn't want to speculate on this too early, but with the SimCity 2013 comparisons coming up, it was hard not to a bit.

    SimCity went through a similar I guess "disappointment progression". Okay it's always online, we hashed that out before release. If you buy it, you've accepted that to some degree. Game launches, servers catch fire. But it's so pretty and charming! They did a cool week long stream before the game came out, every day, and it looked fun. You get the game in your hands, it feels fun! But those damn servers, I can barely play.

    Okay servers finally get a little better, or you get a good 3-4 hours in before they crash again. Huh, some stuff is working weirdly. I send 5 firetrucks to help out my neighbor, but he never gets them. Yeah, probably the servers being wonky. My traffic is doing very odd things, some of my buildings aren't receiving power when they should, well probably the servers. They even said the servers handle a lot of the calculations (lol whoops), so it makes sense.

    People start investigating amidst all of this, find out the simulation is just super messed up. Maybe it's the servers? Okay no the servers are fixed now and all of this stuff is jacked up. Single player mode finally introduced, yeah the simulation is just deeply deeply flawed. People try to make some mods, fix some stuff, but not enough and it just is what it is. I spent weeks of playing off and on with friends thinking it was a good game just marred by its crazy server issues, but nope. Just took awhile for the fog of war to clear and it really was very deeply flawed all throughout.

    It's not exactly the same situation, but looking from afar at how incredibly technically flawed the game was at launch....yeah, just hard not to speculate. Everyone's focused on bad performance, well if the game commits so many very basic sins on the technical performance side, what's going on on the simulation side?

    That's very lame to hear that it actually is a lot deeper than just the bad performance.

    Thats sad, simcity 2013 had a lot of great concepts that just didn’t work at all.

    I remember even playing a couple of years later there were flat out broken things like some of the big mega projects either not working at all of flat out breaking the game.

  • FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    Yeah it did an amazing job of capturing the old Maxis charm too. But just ultimately a very broken game sadly.

    It left me in a weird place in the genre where Cities Skylines is the more functional game, but felt a bit sterile by comparison and I hate that stupid bird. My brain just wants to combine the two games when I play Cities Skylines and so I wind up just booting up SimCity 4 half of the time instead.

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  • JasconiusJasconius sword criminal mad onlineRegistered User regular
    i dont think this is as broken as simcity 2013, simcity 2013 was straight up nonfunctional

    i think this engine works they just have the numbers done up weird

    the demand bars are really misleading because they seem to not simulate demand (???)

  • FiatilFiatil Registered User regular
    edited November 2023
    Jasconius wrote: »
    i dont think this is as broken as simcity 2013, simcity 2013 was straight up nonfunctional

    i think this engine works they just have the numbers done up weird

    the demand bars are really misleading because they seem to not simulate demand (???)

    Time will tell I guess! I'm only going off of That_Guy's comments and reading the thread. It sounds like he thinks the simulation issues are pretty deep and dire, and typically stuff like that is a matter of "it seems fine until you notice it". What he's explained, if true, is a deeper issue than would be solved by just tweaking some numbers.

    I'm comparing it to SimCity after the server fires died, basically viewing it against this if it didn't have any optimization issues. It's often a case of the deeper you dig the more issues you find.

    Ultimately SimCity 2013 is a functional game within what it does. It just...models traffic like the flow of water and other really weird stuff that makes it busted as a city simulator in a lot of ways. But if you zone stuff the right buildings pop up, it models taxes and property value and electricity and all of that.

    Fiatil on
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  • StrikorStrikor Calibrations? Calibrations! Registered User regular
    I don't think fire stations are working correctly. They never send more than 1 engine per incident no matter how bad it gets.

    There was an apartment fire so they send the one engine. While it is putting that out, the fire spreads to the building to the west. Unfortunately this is on a one-way street going east so it decides the only way to get there is to go around the block. Traffic happens because someone trying to turn left blocks the entire right-turn lane. Eventually the fire truck gets there just in time for the next building to catch fire. Once again, lone fire engine puts the first one out, decides to go around the block, and gets stuck in the same spot by another left-turn idiot. This repeats several times until the fire finally goes out on it's own.

    The final tally was 3 out of 6 apartment buildings burned down with about 80 dead. They never sent a second unit despite 3 buildings being on fire simultaneously and having plenty available. As a bonus, the resulting hearse army also caused a major gridlock.

  • SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    Strikor wrote: »
    The final tally was 3 out of 6 apartment buildings burned down with about 80 dead. They never sent a second unit despite 3 buildings being on fire simultaneously and having plenty available. As a bonus, the resulting hearse army also caused a major gridlock.

    Headlines read: "Adding insult to injury (and death)."

  • MvrckMvrck Dwarven MountainhomeRegistered User regular
    Fiatil wrote: »
    Jasconius wrote: »
    i dont think this is as broken as simcity 2013, simcity 2013 was straight up nonfunctional

    i think this engine works they just have the numbers done up weird

    the demand bars are really misleading because they seem to not simulate demand (???)

    Time will tell I guess! I'm only going off of That_Guy's comments and reading the thread. It sounds like he thinks the simulation issues are pretty deep and dire, and typically stuff like that is a matter of "it seems fine until you notice it". What he's explained, if true, is a deeper issue than would be solved by just tweaking some numbers.

    I'm comparing it to SimCity after the server fires died, basically viewing it against this if it didn't have any optimization issues. It's often a case of the deeper you dig the more issues you find.

    Ultimately SimCity 2013 is a functional game within what it does. It just...models traffic like the flow of water and other really weird stuff that makes it busted as a city simulator in a lot of ways. But if you zone stuff the right buildings pop up, it models taxes and property value and electricity and all of that.

    I'm going to disagree, with what I've seen, it almost certainly has underlying rules on demand and density in the simulation. My city is currently at ~235k and there are some pretty obvious things going on that didn't really appear at lower population scales.

    To start, I can't even get medium density residential to grow in most places on my main island on the Barrier Island map at this point, because the services are too good and land value is just too high. It's high density, a tiny bit of mixed use (and even this is just on the fringes), or nothing. Which, may or may not be balanced right (I personally would expect medium density to remain way more viable), but it definitely shows there's underlying decision making going on, vs "zone whatever the game will fill it in". Same thing with low density commercial. I can zone all I want, and the demand is there, but nothing will spawn unless I move far away from land value and services.

    My industry demand is basically next to nothing because I am forgoing doing most of the extraction resources and importing resources and goods from outside my city via truck. Thus most of my industry can't compete vs imports with my commercial zone businesses who just import finished goods, and I see waves of my industrial zone going out of business and abandoning, then new companies moving in and trying to set up only to eventually go out of business.

    If I lay down some cargo ports or cargo train stations for a bit (before they start eating all my mail and I have to delete them again), and the cost of importing goods drops, industrial demand and viability picks back up because they can get the raw and intermediate materials at a cheap enough price to compete and sell locally.

    Office demand is similarly cratered because of over zoning and the cost of importing electronics has stalled out most of those production chains. Even with 7-8% unemployment, I'm not getting new commercial spawning in without cheaper imports. When I do that, demand spikes back up.

  • That_GuyThat_Guy I don't wanna be that guy Registered User regular
    edited November 2023
    I feel the need to qualify a few of my previous statements before going on another little rant. In my mind, the foreseeable future is the next 2-3 months. With all the problems and the general slow pace of patching, I expect it to be at least 6 months before the simulation is in a state where they don't have to invisibly fudge the numbers to make it work.

    Another point I wanted to touch on are comparisons to SimCity 2013. Or rather the lack of comparison. All of SC2013's problems came from a lack of ambition and a desire to suck every last cent out of the playerbase. CS2 still wants to suck every last thin red cent out of our wallets (just look at the planned DLC) but it's main fumble was being too ambitious. We have to compare and contrast the underlying simulation to really get to the bottom of this statement.

    SC2013 didn't actually have an agent system. To be fair, netiehr did any of the previous games but for SC2013, we were all expecting it. Instead it had a "blob, pipe, and bucket simulation." Power (for example) was sent out in discrete blobs which filled up the power bucket in each building. The building would sip away at that bucket and would only complain when the bucket was empty. Sims were similarly blobs. A home would send out however many blobs of whatever education level it could generate. These blobs would go and fill up the nearest job site that has room in their bucket. If all the job sites were filled up for that day, whatever blobs it had left were put in the unemployed bucket. When a home's shopping bucket was low it would send out blobs to commercial sites. The commercial building would accept these blobs and convert them into "carrying goods blobs" to sent back to the nearest home. Everything else in the game worked like that too. Just blobs filling up buckets.

    Cities Skylines 2 is fully agent based. Each agent is assigned a name, home and job. They go to work, meet new people, have a chance of falling in love, getting married and living out their lives. Agents get sick, and die. They're as close to real people as a game like this can reasonably simulate. The problem is that the values they've assigned to the different systems don't actually result in a functional simulation. The game simply wasn't ready for release so the last couple of weeks were spent fudging all the numbers and building in massive margins for error. Even with all this the game still doesn't function. Once they figure out what values work best when assigned to the right functions, Cities Skylines 2 will be a pretty awesome (if expensive) Cimulation of a City.

    That_Guy on
  • That_GuyThat_Guy I don't wanna be that guy Registered User regular
    The developers pretty much confirmed that the game needed another 6 months. Mod support and the console releases have been delayed.

    The slowing of the patch schedule is especially worrying here. Almost feels like they're pulling most of the maintenance team from CS2. And if that's happening, the future of the game is in jeopardy. By all accounts the game has lost over 75% of its playerbase since release.

    https://www.ign.com/articles/cities-skylines-2-dev-delays-mod-support-slows-down-patch-releases-updates-console-release-date

  • CoinageCoinage Heaviside LayerRegistered User regular
    Paradox sux

  • MonwynMonwyn Apathy's a tragedy, and boredom is a crime. A little bit of everything, all of the time.Registered User regular
    edited November 2023
    That_Guy wrote: »
    The developers pretty much confirmed that the game needed another 6 months. Mod support and the console releases have been delayed.

    The slowing of the patch schedule is especially worrying here. Almost feels like they're pulling most of the maintenance team from CS2. And if that's happening, the future of the game is in jeopardy. By all accounts the game has lost over 75% of its playerbase since release.

    https://www.ign.com/articles/cities-skylines-2-dev-delays-mod-support-slows-down-patch-releases-updates-console-release-date

    I suspect that the maintenance team isn't truly pulled, just that it's hard some people resigned to getting the console versions out the door early Q1. Some of that work will probably transfer over to the PC versions.

    Without any kind of concrete schedule "less frequent" just means "not weekly or more," and doesn't strike me as a reason to think this is being left to die. CO basically doesn't make anything else unless I misremember, I sincerely doubt they're just going to shrug and move on.

    Monwyn on
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  • JasconiusJasconius sword criminal mad onlineRegistered User regular
    edited November 2023
    you generally dont want to be slamming out sensitive fixes to hundreds of thousands of users on a 2 week cadence. their build certification process alone is probably a full week...

    maintaining that breakneck pace would detract resources from tackling what many people perceive as much larger issues in the sim

    the *timing* on the other hand of making this announcement right after the steam refund window closes is... quite something, lol

    in any case i still think this game has a bright future

    Jasconius on
  • syndalissyndalis Getting Classy On the WallRegistered User, Loves Apple Products regular
    Probably tomorrow or friday I will have hit a level 20 city with all unlocks, and 250,000 people or so.

    Then, I am going to let this game rest for a bit. The nightmarish shit I had to do to make traffic work correctly due to lack of any kind of fine grain control (lanes - lanes as far as the eyes can see!)... gonna wait for things to simmer down.

    SW-4158-3990-6116
    Let's play Mario Kart or something...
  • SiliconStewSiliconStew Registered User regular
    syndalis wrote: »
    Probably tomorrow or friday I will have hit a level 20 city with all unlocks, and 250,000 people or so.

    Then, I am going to let this game rest for a bit. The nightmarish shit I had to do to make traffic work correctly due to lack of any kind of fine grain control (lanes - lanes as far as the eyes can see!)... gonna wait for things to simmer down.

    There's two big issues I've had with traffic. First is that traffic lights do not have protected left turns at all which leads to massive traffic jams at anything above mild traffic. And the second is the awful parking lot behavior. I can't figure out how Cims are deciding what parking spots to use but it certainly doesn't follow any logical pattern.

    Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
  • StrikorStrikor Calibrations? Calibrations! Registered User regular
    I tried a few traffic experiments in my last city and seemed to get positive results with them.

    - More side streets but disable streetlights, crosswalks (across the main road, the side street is fine), and left-turns to get on or off of them.
    - Pedestrian bridges or tunnels at every major intersection since the utter morons will stop traffic by completely ignoring the "don't walk" signs.
    - Disabling left-turns at especially busy intersections since, as mentioned, there is no dedicated turn signal.
    - Keep larger parking lots/garages away from intersections. I noticed everyone trying to leave one at the exact same time which caused a massive jam at the light. This gives them more chances to spread out or turn elsewhere.

    It's still a clusterfuck but not quite as bad.

  • -Loki--Loki- Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining. Registered User regular
    Strikor wrote: »
    - Pedestrian bridges or tunnels at every major intersection since the utter morons will stop traffic by completely ignoring the "don't walk" signs.

    In dunno this seems realistic for a sim.

  • JasconiusJasconius sword criminal mad onlineRegistered User regular
    traffic bizareness, demand issues, and my city being afflicted by what seems to be an infinite money glitch has me on pause

    i really dont know how i ended up with 90 zillion dollars but i could basically just grid out the entire map and spam buildings while also having 0 residential tax and full service budgets is...?

  • MvrckMvrck Dwarven MountainhomeRegistered User regular
    I practically eliminated non-business and outside taxi traffic in my city by nuking all street side parking and dedicated lots, plus providing super robust transit.

    Subways and trains for neighborhood connections, trams for neighborhood loops and busses for inter-neighborhood "filler" lines. One main city wide tram loop that has nearby neighborhood loop stops along the way and hooks into both transit centers.

    One transit center handles out of town busses, one trains to keep them more compact and mentally manageable.

    To keep the business traffic under control, pedestrian walkways/tunnels, round abouts (weirdly, traffic seems to flow better using SMALLER roundabouts than larger ones), and extreme use of asymmetric lanes at roundabouts mostly does the job.

    In my industrial sector proper, the asymmetric lanes always facilitate heavier flow on whatever path leads towards my arterials.

    Figure out what your main arterial routes are going to be, and then limit connections to them to your main collectors/right turns only to/from non-collectors.

    Try to avoid putting bus/tram stops just past intersections so if they back up they don't block the intersection cascading issues.

    There are maybe a half dozen lights in my whole city. And the ones that I do have are almost exclusively because it was easier to just have a light to manage pedestrian crossings a little than building bypasses for them.

  • syndalissyndalis Getting Classy On the WallRegistered User, Loves Apple Products regular
    Jasconius wrote: »
    traffic bizareness, demand issues, and my city being afflicted by what seems to be an infinite money glitch has me on pause

    i really dont know how i ended up with 90 zillion dollars but i could basically just grid out the entire map and spam buildings while also having 0 residential tax and full service budgets is...?

    So all you need to do is have an overabundance of services, combined with nontangible exports, and no matter what your budget is, you are gonna make bank.

    My city has a 20x surplus of code and a 5x surplus of electricity and no matter how bad my budget is, I make 5+ million per in game month. Literally cannot fail.

    SW-4158-3990-6116
    Let's play Mario Kart or something...
  • syndalissyndalis Getting Classy On the WallRegistered User, Loves Apple Products regular
    Alright, I made my lvl 20 city, and upon doing so a tornado ripped through my nicest residential area and killed a couple thousand people despite me having shelters, advanced warning systems, and excellent roads.

    Meanwhile trash keeps piling up despite me having excellent highway access to 10x the garbage facilities needed and more than enough trucks.

    Meanwhile, my train station is bugged by claiming it does not have enough power despite being right beside a transformer and me having a surplus of power so extreme that it allows me to make money despite subsidizing all of my businesses and residents through negative taxation.

    Meanwhile, there are a solid 10 achievements I know I should have but do not, because the game is broken. Out for a Spin, the tornado one, should have popped 10 times by now. Ash Trees? I get a forest fire 3-4 times a play session. Nothing. Multiple achievements like this, just sitting there unachievable.

    Yeah, time to stop and wait for the underpinnings of the game to get figured out. Each patch is fixing stuff, and breaking the mechanics of how my city was working before... not really enjoyable at the moment.

    SW-4158-3990-6116
    Let's play Mario Kart or something...
  • syndalissyndalis Getting Classy On the WallRegistered User, Loves Apple Products regular
    Well that lasted all of a day.

    I am back in, starting a new city and trying out a different, non-gridded concept where I have zero garbage, zero non-agricultural industry, and all green power.

    The game supports it well enough if you can build your external connections fast enough.

    SW-4158-3990-6116
    Let's play Mario Kart or something...
  • HappylilElfHappylilElf Registered User regular
    I thought maybe things had improved enough that I could give it a try.

    No, not at all, like hilariously so.

    On medium graphics the game literally freezes for a few seconds every time something starts to build. In a new city.

    Granted I'm not running a brand new high end PC (3070, Ryzen 5700X, 32GB DDR4 3200) but there is absolutely no excuse for it running this poorly on lowered graphics settings.

    I think I'm going to just uninstall and pretend this came out sometime next summer. Or maybe fall.

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