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i'm buff, i'm the stuff, and the wrestling thread just can't get enough!

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    wirehead26wirehead26 Registered User regular
    Even thinking more about it, it creates an incredible failsafe. You keep your most over #1 contender wrestler OUT of the rumble and give them another marquee match (avoiding Rumble takeovers by angry crowds). If the crowd responds better or the better story is the rumble winner, great! If not, you have a super hot #1 contender on hold. It seems like a real safe play.

    The Rumble is such an major part of the Mania build now I doubt they change it. Your idea is interesting though.

    I'M NOT FINISHED WITH YOU!!!
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    stevemarks44stevemarks44 Registered User regular
    Kilroy, reading between the lines of your post, one thing you don't highlight is the amount of outcomes we kind of already have figured out. Even Regins v Bryan got me amped up because I went into it going "are they actually going to put Bryan over Reigns?" When they didn't I was mad but I was surprised!

    I feel like so many of the Mania matches this year are culminations of events that have to end a certain way in an occam's razor sense. Reigns should topple Lesnar's reign. Cena should overcome Rusev for the USA. Wyatt should topple Taker to be the new face of fear. Sting should topple HHH and thus end the reign of the Authority.

    I feel like I'm just waiting to get through Mania because I already know what to expect going into the Raw afterwards.

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    wirehead26wirehead26 Registered User regular
    There is one surprise they still have up their sleeves; Plan B.

    I'M NOT FINISHED WITH YOU!!!
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    wirehead26wirehead26 Registered User regular
    Also, I'm not sure how Sting beating Hunter ends the Authority.

    I'M NOT FINISHED WITH YOU!!!
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    stevemarks44stevemarks44 Registered User regular
    wirehead26 wrote: »
    Even thinking more about it, it creates an incredible failsafe. You keep your most over #1 contender wrestler OUT of the rumble and give them another marquee match (avoiding Rumble takeovers by angry crowds). If the crowd responds better or the better story is the rumble winner, great! If not, you have a super hot #1 contender on hold. It seems like a real safe play.

    The Rumble is such an major part of the Mania build now I doubt they change it. Your idea is interesting though.

    I agree. It's a bit of a stretch, but two years in a row they've had an issue of the crowd hating the Rumble winner. They should probably start looking for failsafes should it happen again.

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    RadiusRadius Registered User regular
    Plan B(eaten by Randy Orton)

    Everyday we stray further from God's light
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    stevemarks44stevemarks44 Registered User regular
    wirehead26 wrote: »
    Also, I'm not sure how Sting beating Hunter ends the Authority.

    If Sting beating Hunter isn't at least the beginning of the end of the Authority storyline I'm not really sure what the point of Sting v HHH is.

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    wirehead26wirehead26 Registered User regular
    Kilroy, reading between the lines of your post, one thing you don't highlight is the amount of outcomes we kind of already have figured out. Even Regins v Bryan got me amped up because I went into it going "are they actually going to put Bryan over Reigns?" When they didn't I was mad but I was surprised!

    I feel like so many of the Mania matches this year are culminations of events that have to end a certain way in an occam's razor sense. Reigns should topple Lesnar's reign. Cena should overcome Rusev for the USA. Wyatt should topple Taker to be the new face of fear. Sting should topple HHH and thus end the reign of the Authority.

    I feel like I'm just waiting to get through Mania because I already know what to expect going into the Raw afterwards.

    In hindsight though, we all should have known Bryan was winning after he got his match with HHH.

    I'M NOT FINISHED WITH YOU!!!
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    KilroyKilroy timaeusTestified Registered User regular
    Radius wrote: »
    Plan B(eaten by Randy Orton)

    oh right I forgot about seth vs randy

    which I guess says a lot about how they've built that match

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    wirehead26wirehead26 Registered User regular
    Radius wrote: »
    Plan B(eaten by Randy Orton)

    Seth straddles the line between chickenshit and credible really well though. The beatdown last Raw was overlly long but he'll recover.

    I'M NOT FINISHED WITH YOU!!!
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    NiryaNirya Registered User regular
    I'm gonna let you guys in on a little secret. Come a bit closer so I can whisper it.
    All Mania builds since the move to the monthly PPV mode have been lackluster to varying degrees. This isn't a new occurrence.

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    KilroyKilroy timaeusTestified Registered User regular
    Kilroy, reading between the lines of your post, one thing you don't highlight is the amount of outcomes we kind of already have figured out. Even Regins v Bryan got me amped up because I went into it going "are they actually going to put Bryan over Reigns?" When they didn't I was mad but I was surprised!

    I feel like so many of the Mania matches this year are culminations of events that have to end a certain way in an occam's razor sense. Reigns should topple Lesnar's reign. Cena should overcome Rusev for the USA. Wyatt should topple Taker to be the new face of fear. Sting should topple HHH and thus end the reign of the Authority.

    I feel like I'm just waiting to get through Mania because I already know what to expect going into the Raw afterwards.

    yeah, that was something I was going to highlight but I felt like that post was long and complain-y enough already

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    RadiusRadius Registered User regular
    This Mania build could be worse, Bo Dallas could be getting a match.

    Everyday we stray further from God's light
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    crwthcrwth THAT'S IT Registered User regular
    TJAFI9ll.jpg

    woooo super early to this house show like way too early!

    EzUAYcn.png
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    NiryaNirya Registered User regular
    Radius wrote: »
    This Mania build could be worse, Bo Dallas could be getting a match.

    GO TO WRESTLE JAIL.

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    MagellMagell Detroit Machine Guns Fort MyersRegistered User regular
    Kilroy wrote: »
    facetious wrote: »
    And like, this discussion puts me in a weird place because I am the first to say "I don't need a storyline to love a technically great match".

    I just.. don't know how many of the matches will actually turn out, storylines aside. The ladder match and Cena/Rusev are the only matches I'm sure will be even good, let alone great. The others have potential, but still seem difficult to justify without proper builds. (And again, the title match is an exception because of the Rumble situation, etc. etc. But I still am far from certain it'll be a great match.)

    I don't need a storyline necessarily, but I need a reason to care. I need for there to be one person or team that I want to win and another person or team that I want to fucking lose. Or I need to want everyone to win so that there's tension in seeing who will come out on top

    I can get invested in an indie match between two dudes I've never seen before based soley on how they conduct themselves on the way to the ring

    but with 'mania card this year there isn't really a single match that I care about in any real way

    the tag title match is cesaro and tyson vs. some teams that I don't give a fuck about. I want cesaro and tyson to win, but I'm not burning with desire to see the usos or matadores lose

    I don't care about the andre the giant memorial over the top battle royal because it's a big pile of "creative has nothing for you and probably won't have anything for you if you win"

    The problem with the tag match is that you are rooting for the bad guys, that's why there's nobody you want to see lose. I agree with you because Team Uppercat is better than another Uso's title run and the other teams that don't matter in the match. But most people want to see Uppercat lose.

    The Andre battle royal is the worst for WWE, because they proved it doesn't matter who wins. It's a real bummer, because that could have been something important. I'd settle for them adding that it makes somebody #1 contender for the IC title as well or something like that.

    The problem with WWE's random matches is that they mean nothing. There are no standings for who gets shots at the belts. There's only one time there's a #1 contender announced and that's after the Royal Rumble.

    I cut your complaint about the ladder match out, but my problem with it, while I like ladder matches, is that why the fuck are they making it a ladder match. Because for some reason there was a ladder on the stage one night and Dolph climbed it? That makes less than zero sense. They have too many good wrestlers in there who don't need a ladder to make the match special and Dolph and Ambrose are going to do dumb fucking shit to themselves, because that's what they do and it's all going to be for nothing because the belt doesn't mean shit. You make it mean something the same way that NJPW has made their secondary titles mean something. Let good wrestlers go out there and have good 15-20 minute matches for the belt and prove that they are wrestlers who care about what they are doing and about winning.

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    never dienever die Registered User regular

    We don't need fake Sting teleporting into the ring or lightning to strike a rocking chair or an 8 person scramble to steal the IC belt.

    I'm not gonna argue against your other points but I dunno what you were expecting from Crow Sting (whose promos I've really liked), or how else would you expect the creepy, superantural cult leader to find the Phenom Prince of Darkness?

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    facetiousfacetious a wit so dry it shits sandRegistered User regular
    To be ENTIRELY fair, a ladder match does actually make some amount of sense with the ongoing gimmick of the belt constantly being 'stolen'.

    The ultimate goal of a ladder match is to be the first to grab the belt, and this time it actually does empirically make you champion.

    It's.. really dumb in a lot of ways, but does at least sort of have a storyline tie-in???

    "I am not young enough to know everything." - Oscar Wilde
    Real strong, facetious.

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    MagellMagell Detroit Machine Guns Fort MyersRegistered User regular
    Or they could do a strap match or cage match so nobody can escape unless they've won the belt.

    Now I'm imagining like eight wrestlers connected by a leather strap to a metal ring and trying to figure out the logistics of it and I'm sad it won't happen.

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    never dienever die Registered User regular
    edited March 2015
    Also, in contrast to other people:

    I'm pumped for the Ladder match (lack of coherent story reasons aside) as it will be a good match, and honestly the story doesn't need to be more in-depth than I want the IC belt for me.

    Sting vs HHH is awesome to me because its Sting in the WWE (finally) and I doubt professionals like HHH and Sting will let it be a bad match.

    Bray vs Taker is awesome because I've wanted it since Bray exploded onto the main programming.

    Rusev vs Cena should be good, just like the last fight.

    Reigns vs Lesnar will hopefully be good, and is honestly probably Reign's sink or swim moment. We've seen Lesnar have good matches before, so I believe Lesnar is competent at telling a story in the ring. If this match sinks, its going to be on Reign's head, and will probably be a huge setback on his career, if not completely destroy it. Reigns is being given a huge opportunity, and I'm interested to see what he does with it.


    Edit:

    I will agree with everyone that Fast Lane was bad as a PPV, and felt very much like a holding pattern for most of the feuds. I really want another Elimination Chamber match, and hope it comes back at least next year.

    never die on
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    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    when someone says the build is bad, saying other builds were worse is bad for several reasons. one, we know how it turned out which colors our perception. two, we're not sitting through it right now so we can't actually recall if it was tedious or what.

    three, and this is the big one

    'nuh uh it's been worse' is a horrible defense of a product, even if it seems like a reasonable response to calling it the worst ever.

    it's bad and people are often hyperbolic. whether it's the worst or not can't ever be decided and even if it could for an individual, if they could somehow live each build at once to decide, we'd never all agree.

    but it's not been a great build for several reasons (HUUUUGE participants not being present, reigns being out at a critical juncture for telling his personal story, etc. etc. etc.)

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    THEPAIN73THEPAIN73 Shiny. Real shiny.Registered User regular
    crwth wrote: »
    [img]http:/ /i.imgur.com/TJAFI9ll.jpg[/img]

    woooo super early to this house show like way too early!

    You better get a photo with Sasha.

    I can't think of anything I could love more than a photo of crwth and Sasha Banks.

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    BlankZoeBlankZoe Registered User regular
    The 3 WWE storylines I care about the most right now:
    Miz/Mizdow
    Goldust/Stardust
    Ambrose/Rollins

    One is being used as part of the cluster fuck Battle Royal

    One is seemingly being dropped or shoved into a cluster fuck Ladder Match

    And the third was white hot before being dropped like a rock and basically ignored since then

    CYpGAPn.png
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    crwthcrwth THAT'S IT Registered User regular
    THEPAIN73 wrote: »
    crwth wrote: »
    [img]http:/ /i.imgur.com/TJAFI9ll.jpg[/img]

    woooo super early to this house show like way too early!

    You better get a photo with Sasha.

    I can't think of anything I could love more than a photo of crwth and Sasha Banks.
    im going to try to see if the womens title can fit in my beard

    EzUAYcn.png
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    VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    cool thoughts from Lance Storm on part of why the crowd rejected Reigns

    from a month and a half ago apparently so you all may have read/heard this already but here

    http://www.cagesideseats.com/wwe/2015/3/13/8208773/wwe-heel-owner-characters-to-blame-for-fan-backlash-against-roman-reigns

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    NiryaNirya Registered User regular
    My new, totally-not-about-the-Young-Bucks OP is ready to go.

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    3DS: 2981-5304-3227
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    David_TDavid_T A fashion yes-man is no good to me. Copenhagen, DenmarkRegistered User regular
    The WWE would probably do well to introduce a face authority figure. Someone who represents the shareholders or something, someone who can represent the WWE against the Authority.

    13iepvv6o8ip.png
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    WeedLordVegetaWeedLordVegeta Registered User regular
    Nirya wrote: »
    My new, totally-not-about-the-Young-Bucks OP is ready to go.
    Hul(lis) Horse: if you make a young bucks thread the podcast is over
    Hul(lis) Horse: and i'm not posting in the thread until the next one
    Nirya:

    Nirya: THIS IS GOING IN AS WELL
    Hul(lis) Horse: alright! see you in a couple of months

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    NiryaNirya Registered User regular
    Please stop spoiling my OP.

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    RadiusRadius Registered User regular
    it will have to wait until the thread after next because I've already built the greatest OP of all time around the greatest Intercontinental Champion of all time The Honky Tonk Man.

    Everyday we stray further from God's light
    Steam Switch FC: 2799-7909-4852
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    wirehead26wirehead26 Registered User regular
    Kilroy, reading between the lines of your post, one thing you don't highlight is the amount of outcomes we kind of already have figured out. Even Regins v Bryan got me amped up because I went into it going "are they actually going to put Bryan over Reigns?" When they didn't I was mad but I was surprised!

    I feel like so many of the Mania matches this year are culminations of events that have to end a certain way in an occam's razor sense. Reigns should topple Lesnar's reign. Cena should overcome Rusev for the USA. Wyatt should topple Taker to be the new face of fear. Sting should topple HHH and thus end the reign of the Authority.

    I feel like I'm just waiting to get through Mania because I already know what to expect going into the Raw afterwards.

    I think I made this comparison before but Mania 31 feels to me like a modern day Marvel or DC "event" miniseries comic. A lot of sound and fury signifying nothing (although IMO I still think it could end up good) and an overall empty experience with the aftermath stories being the things to look forward to.

    Blank knows what I'm talking about.

    I'M NOT FINISHED WITH YOU!!!
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    BlankZoeBlankZoe Registered User regular
    Thinking about it

    Man Reigns' hernia fucked everything up for Roman huh

    He and Seth would have had a pretty good, although likely not as good as the Ambrose feud, storyline and Roman would have gotten to be kind of an asshole good guy because Seth deserves it and he would have probably gotten fairly over

    Then whoops Dean Ambrose comes in and is a goddamn lightning rod who the fans lose their minds over so when Roman takes back his upper card role (especially since he kind of displaced Bryan on the upper card too) he looks like a total chump

    CYpGAPn.png
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    NiryaNirya Registered User regular
    Here is a preview of my other OP:

    Sign1_zpsigbw5zbs.png

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    wirehead26wirehead26 Registered User regular
    Blankzilla wrote: »
    Thinking about it

    Man Reigns' hernia fucked everything up for Roman huh

    He and Seth would have had a pretty good, although likely not as good as the Ambrose feud, storyline and Roman would have gotten to be kind of an asshole good guy because Seth deserves it and he would have probably gotten fairly over

    Then whoops Dean Ambrose comes in and is a goddamn lightning rod who the fans lose their minds over so when Roman takes back his upper card role (especially since he kind of displaced Bryan on the upper card too) he looks like a total chump

    Bryan and Roman's injuries completely fucked up the narrative.

    I'M NOT FINISHED WITH YOU!!!
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    wirehead26wirehead26 Registered User regular
    But Roman can recover so long as Vince is willing to turn him heel.

    I'M NOT FINISHED WITH YOU!!!
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    BlankZoeBlankZoe Registered User regular
    wirehead26 wrote: »
    Kilroy, reading between the lines of your post, one thing you don't highlight is the amount of outcomes we kind of already have figured out. Even Regins v Bryan got me amped up because I went into it going "are they actually going to put Bryan over Reigns?" When they didn't I was mad but I was surprised!

    I feel like so many of the Mania matches this year are culminations of events that have to end a certain way in an occam's razor sense. Reigns should topple Lesnar's reign. Cena should overcome Rusev for the USA. Wyatt should topple Taker to be the new face of fear. Sting should topple HHH and thus end the reign of the Authority.

    I feel like I'm just waiting to get through Mania because I already know what to expect going into the Raw afterwards.

    I think I made this comparison before but Mania 31 feels to me like a modern day Marvel or DC "event" miniseries comic. A lot of sound and fury signifying nothing (although IMO I still think it could end up good) and an overall empty experience with the aftermath stories being the things to look forward to.

    Blank knows what I'm talking about.
    If you're saying Wrestlemania feels like Original Sin but it should be Infinity then yes I agree

    But at least it isn't Age of Ultron

    CYpGAPn.png
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    wirehead26wirehead26 Registered User regular
    Blankzilla wrote: »
    wirehead26 wrote: »
    Kilroy, reading between the lines of your post, one thing you don't highlight is the amount of outcomes we kind of already have figured out. Even Regins v Bryan got me amped up because I went into it going "are they actually going to put Bryan over Reigns?" When they didn't I was mad but I was surprised!

    I feel like so many of the Mania matches this year are culminations of events that have to end a certain way in an occam's razor sense. Reigns should topple Lesnar's reign. Cena should overcome Rusev for the USA. Wyatt should topple Taker to be the new face of fear. Sting should topple HHH and thus end the reign of the Authority.

    I feel like I'm just waiting to get through Mania because I already know what to expect going into the Raw afterwards.

    I think I made this comparison before but Mania 31 feels to me like a modern day Marvel or DC "event" miniseries comic. A lot of sound and fury signifying nothing (although IMO I still think it could end up good) and an overall empty experience with the aftermath stories being the things to look forward to.

    Blank knows what I'm talking about.
    If you're saying Wrestlemania feels like Original Sin but it should be Infinity then yes I agree

    But at least it isn't Age of Ultron

    Better comparison is Mania 31 = Avengers vs X-Men while hopefully the shows after Mania = Marvel NOW!

    I'M NOT FINISHED WITH YOU!!!
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    wirehead26wirehead26 Registered User regular
    DodgeBlan wrote: »
    if you go by viewership it's the worst mania build in a long while

    I'm assuming Vince cares more about Network subscribers.

    I'M NOT FINISHED WITH YOU!!!
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    stevemarks44stevemarks44 Registered User regular
    never die wrote: »

    We don't need fake Sting teleporting into the ring or lightning to strike a rocking chair or an 8 person scramble to steal the IC belt.

    I'm not gonna argue against your other points but I dunno what you were expecting from Crow Sting (whose promos I've really liked), or how else would you expect the creepy, superantural cult leader to find the Phenom Prince of Darkness?

    I didn't say those were bad, I'm just saying we dont NEED that level of theatrics when you are just focusing on building a match between two guys that you want to see wrestle each other.

    To be honest I loved the Undertaker lighting thing because it was so Attitude Era-y and that's what I grew up loving.

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    wirehead26wirehead26 Registered User regular
    never die wrote: »

    We don't need fake Sting teleporting into the ring or lightning to strike a rocking chair or an 8 person scramble to steal the IC belt.

    I'm not gonna argue against your other points but I dunno what you were expecting from Crow Sting (whose promos I've really liked), or how else would you expect the creepy, superantural cult leader to find the Phenom Prince of Darkness?

    I didn't say those were bad, I'm just saying we dont NEED that level of theatrics when you are just focusing on building a match between two guys that you want to see wrestle each other.

    To be honest I loved the Undertaker lighting thing because it was so Attitude Era-y and that's what I grew up loving.

    Lightning was cheesy fun.

    I'M NOT FINISHED WITH YOU!!!
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