[Bloodborne] Woeful sanity, have audience with cosmos

Mego Thor

Finally beat Father G Money last nite!

Does Insight start coming more frequently now? Should I hoard those points or splurge for Father's armor set that just opened up? Is there a way to see from the shop how the items for sale compare to what you already have equipped?

jimb213

Mego Thor wrote: »

Finally beat Father G Money last nite!

Does Insight start coming more frequently now? Should I hoard those points or splurge for Father's armor set that just opened up? Is there a way to see from the shop how the items for sale compare to what you already have equipped?

By most accounts, you'll eventually be swimming in insight. I've beaten two more bosses after Father G and done lots of exploring and some coop and the first level of the first chalice dungeon, and I have something like 22 or 25 insight, with some madman's in inventory (and I bought some of father g's set with insight, otherwise I'd probably have around 30).

I'd say getting to 10 (which you have) to get the insight shop fountain in the dream and enabling coop/pvp is the most important thing for insight (as someone progressing slowly through the game I don't know specifically what's in store for later in the game regarding insight)

Really it depends on if (game mechanic spoilers, but no plot or details on the mechanic)

you want things to start changing sooner rather than later. 15 insight is the first threshold where some things become different

Unco-ordinated

Spectrum wrote: »

Cilla Black wrote: »

Spectrum wrote: »

Too much bragging in previous posts/nostalgia for older games. Nothing in Dark Souls was particularly difficult except for bosses with tailcuts, because they forced you to play different ways and not kill the boss in the process of trying for the cut.

If you're doing better in Bloodborne, it's because you've had entire games worth of experience beneath your belt now and the bosses all have various mechanics which make them easier. Imagine if every large boss back in DS you could stagger like a bitch like Iron Golem, which you can more or less do to everything here.

What are you trying to say here?

Dark Souls wasn't terribly difficulty... but Bloodborne is even less so?

Not really sure what that has to do with nostalgia

I'm saying that I feel that people that think that Dark Souls had harder bosses aren't taking into account all the factors. Bloodborne's bosses are probably on par, once you account for experience in the Souls system.

There's a lot of nostalgia for Artorius and Manus as being leagues more difficult or something.

In other words, your hardest Souls game was probably your first one.

Mego Thor

jimb213 wrote: »

Mego Thor wrote: »

Finally beat Father G Money last nite!

Does Insight start coming more frequently now? Should I hoard those points or splurge for Father's armor set that just opened up? Is there a way to see from the shop how the items for sale compare to what you already have equipped?

By most accounts, you'll eventually be swimming in insight. I've beaten two more bosses after Father G and done lots of exploring and some coop and the first level of the first chalice dungeon, and I have something like 22 or 25 insight, with some madman's in inventory (and I bought some of father g's set with insight, otherwise I'd probably have around 30).

I'd say getting to 10 (which you have) to get the insight shop fountain in the dream and enabling coop/pvp is the most important thing for insight (as someone progressing slowly through the game I don't know specifically what's in store for later in the game regarding insight)

Really it depends on if (game mechanic spoilers, but no plot or details on the mechanic)

you want things to start changing sooner rather than later. 15 insight is the first threshold where some things become different

Thanks. Maybe for now I'll just get the small resonant bell and try out some coop.

Elendil

welp now i can't beat that boss ever

elevator to reach it is completely fucked

Elendil

yeah so first things first: do not use a hunter's mark on a elevator it fucks it up

i did not do this

also do not fall into an elevator and die such that your corpse hits the pressure plate

this also fucks it up!

BranniganSepp

Now that I'm done with my first playthrough, I can finally check out all the stuff I'm curious about. I missed quite a lot, it seems. Definitely will have to start a new game tonight.

Joshmvii

CaptainNemo wrote: »

It wouldn't be so bad if all those pigs and shadows weren't in the way.

You talking about getting back to Wet Nurse? There's an elevator that is next to the Mergo's Loft: Middle lantern that takes you right up. You know how Yharnam is standing there staring at the building initially? Instead of running to the building she's looking at you just run to her left instead and activate the elevator. You don't need to run past the pigs/shadows, though you can also just run right past them if it came to that.

But yeah, use the shortcut.

Also, for the most part MWN uses the slow windup sweep attack that will knock you up in the air or the combo that pokes a bunch of times with all the arms. In my experience beating that fight on NG and NG+ you just want to bait one of those attacks, then run behind it and get in some hits. It's not even about dodging through attacks like most bosses. Just bait, back off while the attack happens, then run in for your free damage.

Ragnar Dragonfyre

Mego Thor wrote: »

Finally beat Father G Money last nite!

Does Insight start coming more frequently now? Should I hoard those points or splurge for Father's armor set that just opened up? Is there a way to see from the shop how the items for sale compare to what you already have equipped?

On the armor set...

You need at least the chestpiece otherwise a certain NPC won't talk to you. I lucked out and discovered this since I was already wearing the Father G set when I found the NPC.

I'd recommend the whole set. You'll need the poison resist for the next area.

Joshmvii

programjunkie wrote: »

Corp.Shephard wrote: »

Frei wrote: »

Corp.Shephard wrote: »

snip

I dunno, this just sounds like a thinly veiled brag post. "I one shot all the bosses you guys had a hard time with, and only had a hard time early on because I was just warming up."

Different people seem to find different bosses difficult. Like, some people swear Darkbeast was insane, and some say they killed him with little issue. A lot of it's down to the player and what they're personally good at fighting/adapting to (or not good at). I think that's more of a sign that the bosses are varied and well-made, in general, because experiences vary so much in terms of difficulty from player to player.

Yeah the last lines of the post are pretty pretentious. ... and the first lines. I dunno man. That was my experience. The hardest part of the game was the beginning for me and the tail end. It was slightly disappointing. That's all I really meant. To be honest this doesn't even differ from most souls games. They're usually pretty hard at first. Then you get a grip with the controls, you find the right weapons, get some upgrades, and then most bosses become very manageable.

I don't mean to pass judgement on other players. I also think that Ludwig's + Quality build trivializes a lot of bosses because of the flexibility of the sword and the raw damage it puts out. The game was much harder with the threaded cane. Was that because the threaded cane was my first weapon and I was learning bosses with it? Or is Ludwigs too strong? I think personally think it is both.

Darkbeast is a good example of a boss that could create a lot of different perspectives too. I never saw him in my first playthrough. Completely missed him. On my second playthrough I stumbled into him after doing Rom. I outleveled him and had a lot of experience with the game. I found him very easy as I did huge chunks of his health with each swing. However he could be your second boss fight depending on how the game plays out! He would be terrifying at such a low level. Like you say playstyle and weapon choice make huge differences as well. I was shocked when my friend told me he beat the non-secret final boss in one attempt. He watched me stream the battle so he had a little knowledge of the fight going it... but doing it in one attempt? Crazy!

Yet he did all of the extra content I missed. I missed the Choir. I missed Darkbeast. I missed Cainhurst. I missed a lot on my first playthrough. Extra levels make a huge deal in Bloodborne. I think it is very easy to "outlevel" bosses because vitality and the regain system feed off of each other to make player characters very durable in this game.

Threaded cane is super weak early on. Definitely the least powerful of the starting weapons till later, perhaps always. In my experience, quality Ludwigs is one of the strongest builds available. It's just so powerful and versatile, particularly if you specialize slightly in STR for the cannon, which just murders bosses.

dispatch.o wrote: »

I really think people need to mention their level when they talk about how easy a certain boss was. If you go into a boss fight in this game having farmed even a small amount, or perhaps go into the boss fights in different order you may not be showing off knowledge of the boss or difficulty of it so much as the fact in Bloodborne, even more so than past souls games you can outlevel the content incredibly easily.

I like trying to get through things at as low a level as I can manage. It seems like some of the attacks in Bloodborne really feel unavoidable though, and it's kind of disappointing. There are bosses who heal and if you do not have numbing mist there is no actual way to beat them other than "level up, hit harder" that I can find. Even still, I could not beat Vicar as a starting level Waste of Skin because it took so long to get her low that the numb would wear off and she'd heal.

I wouldn't entirely say that. Cleric Beast and Witch are huge standouts for easy bosses. In the case of Cleric Beast, that's good design, because the first boss should be the easiest, and Witch is a fun sort of easy.

I do agree that with BSB, in particular, it matters a huge amount if you walk in with a +3 weapon, or a +6 weapon and 10 more levels, the latter of which is very, very achievable without any special work at all.

I'd say Rom is difficult because you can't outlevel him, outside of massive chalice delving, and it's pretty luck based. Also the worst boss in the Souls series (IMHO worse than Bed, but I'll accept a tie), which is too bad because I like his lore.

Posts like this are exactly why boss difficulty is pointless to discuss across people. Because nearly everybody will have different difficulties with different bosses. There are only 2 bosses in all of Bloodborne that took me more than 3 attempts at the most. Most bosses I killed on the first or second attempt.

Those 2 bosses: Cleric Beast, and Ebrietas. I don't find Cleric Beast hard at all now, having beaten it in one shot on NG+ and on new characters I've made, but initially it gave me fits for no good reason. I'd mess up dodging, the camera is wonky, etc. It probably took me a dozen or more attempts to get it down. Then I killed Father G on the 2nd or 3rd attempt, BSB on the 2nd, Vicar on the first, etc. Ebrietas is imo the hardest boss in the game, it took me 10+ attempts to get her too. But I'm sure some find her easy too.

And Rom to me is like Witch of Hemwick. Basically impossible to fail, with pretty much the only thing I've ever been hit by fighting him in NG, NG+, and on 3 different characters being the icicle rain, which doesn't even do anything except make me use a healing vial.

Edit: Make that 3 bosses. I forgot I tried doing Darkbeast Paarl at like SL 20 after having done Cleric Beast/Father G/BSB, and got wrecked about 12 times before deciding I'd come back to him later. He's basically a challenge boss at that SL because his melee will 2 shot you and his explosion will do 95% of your health, and your attacks don't do enough damage to stagger him, which is what makes him so easy. When I came back to fight him after having done 3 or 4 more bosses I killed him on the first try. Hell, if I had waited until you go to Unseen Village in the main story to fight him he'd have felt like a regular enemy.

Joshmvii

Cobell wrote: »

Joshmvii wrote: »

So has anybody found any echo farming that's better than the Mergo's loft: middle leading up to the boss there? I accidentally found on NG that if I killed the first 3 shadow guys, visceral the pig, then run past the first 2 pigs and past the group of shadow guys, the pigs/shadows will fight each other and you can clean it up after for a ton of free echoes.

It was like 85k on NG while wearing all 3 +echo runes, and it's over 300k per run on NG+. Right now I'm in the process of filling out some levels on NG+ so it's nice to have a solid farming spot such as this, just wondering if anybody had found anything better.

How long does it take to get that many blood echoes?

If I need them, I do the Lecture Hall (1st floor) myself (though I haven't gotten to NG yet). It's just under 15k souls (with no rune buffs) to go in clear the hall in the immediate large auditorium and then returning to the Hunter's Dream. The load times to the Lecture Hall and the Hunter's Dream are both incredibly short as they are small maps. It takes roughly about 3-4 minutes to run in, kill everything, and zone out and back in.

The mobs in there have a decent drop rate of bullets and sedatives.

The Lecture hall is the first good echo farm you find, but it's nowhere near as good as the one I described. On your first NG, with all 3 echo runes, you're looking at about 85k echoes per run, and it takes maybe 3 minutes, probably a little less if you're fast. I was filling out my NG+ build last night and got 2.2 million echoes in about 30 minutes here.

Also, if you're doing any of this type of farming, use a bold hunter's mark to go back to the lantern and respawn the enemies. It saves you much more time when compared to running back to the lantern, going back to hunter's dream, then back to the level again. Doing it that way you spend more time on load screens than actually farming.

Ragnar Dragonfyre

Elendil wrote: »

yeah so first things first: do not use a hunter's mark on a elevator it fucks it up

i did not do this

also do not fall into an elevator and die such that your corpse hits the pressure plate

this also fucks it up!

Huh...

Every elevator I've encountered thus far has a lever at the top and bottom to summon it, should you fuck up.

I'll have to be more wary of elevators in the future if this is the case.

Elendil

Ragnar Dragonfyre wrote: »

Elendil wrote: »

yeah so first things first: do not use a hunter's mark on a elevator it fucks it up

i did not do this

also do not fall into an elevator and die such that your corpse hits the pressure plate

this also fucks it up!

Huh...

Every elevator I've encountered thus far has a lever at the top and bottom to summon it, should you fuck up.

I'll have to be more wary of elevators in the future if this is the case.

It isn't a matter of there not being an accessible switch; it just stops working

I was able to pull the switch, but the elevator no longer responds. Even falling to the bottom onto the plate doesn't do anything

Joshmvii

So having beaten NG+ now on my first character to get all 3 ending trophies(just forced a cloud upload of my save prior to the decision so I could get the other 2 endings without doing another full run through), I have to say NG+ was a little disappointing. There wasn't anything different about it at all other than higher HP/damage.

I had hoped for at least some new enemies or some bosses to have new tricks, but oh well.

Also, re: Insight, I think people should realize that there's very very little that changes with high insight. At first people were thinking it was a black world tendency type thing where the game got more difficult, but it really doesn't.

This is the entire list of what changes with insight:

Higher insight lowers your beasthood and reduces frenzy resist.

At some amount of insight, you start to see messengers on levers that open gates. I dunno if it's supposed to help you see them or what.

1 Insight - The doll comes to life and you get your first gifts
10 - Bath messenger shop becomes available
15 - The dudes with white masks in cathedral ward gain some new attacks. Lamp guys get projectiles, Scythe guy weapon powers up, Guys who hold the big wooden cross weapons cause frenzy now. In Hemwick the mobs that spawn during the witch boss fight will spawn prior to the boss fight in the area.
20 - You can hear Amelia's prayer continue through the fight with her.
40 - Lesser Amygdala in the Cathedral Ward become visible, though this happens when you beat Rom anyway.

I have to wonder if there was supposed to be more and they ran out of time to do something with it, or if it was specifically intended that only the cathedral ward and the immediately surrounding area that have insight related changes.

Fawst

@Elendil
Stupid question, but did you try restarting the PS4 instead of using suspend? It may be a system memory thing.

Ragnar Dragonfyre

Elendil wrote: »

Ragnar Dragonfyre wrote: »

Elendil wrote: »

yeah so first things first: do not use a hunter's mark on a elevator it fucks it up

i did not do this

also do not fall into an elevator and die such that your corpse hits the pressure plate

this also fucks it up!

Huh...

Every elevator I've encountered thus far has a lever at the top and bottom to summon it, should you fuck up.

I'll have to be more wary of elevators in the future if this is the case.

It isn't a matter of there not being an accessible switch; it just stops working

I was able to pull the switch, but the elevator no longer responds. Even falling to the bottom onto the plate doesn't do anything

Yikes.

Hopefully they patch that bug. I'm sorry it afflicted you but thanks for the heads up!

SyphonBlue

Joshmvii wrote: »

So having beaten NG+ now on my first character to get all 3 ending trophies(just forced a cloud upload of my save prior to the decision so I could get the other 2 endings without doing another full run through), I have to say NG+ was a little disappointing. There wasn't anything different about it at all other than higher HP/damage.

I had hoped for at least some new enemies or some bosses to have new tricks, but oh well.

Also, re: Insight, I think people should realize that there's very very little that changes with high insight. At first people were thinking it was a black world tendency type thing where the game got more difficult, but it really doesn't.

This is the entire list of what changes with insight:

Higher insight lowers your beasthood and reduces frenzy resist.

At some amount of insight, you start to see messengers on levers that open gates. I dunno if it's supposed to help you see them or what.

1 Insight - The doll comes to life and you get your first gifts
10 - Bath messenger shop becomes available
15 - The dudes with white masks in cathedral ward gain some new attacks. Lamp guys get projectiles, Scythe guy weapon powers up, Guys who hold the big wooden cross weapons cause frenzy now. In Hemwick the mobs that spawn during the witch boss fight will spawn prior to the boss fight in the area.
20 - You can hear Amelia's prayer continue through the fight with her.
40 - Lesser Amygdala in the Cathedral Ward become visible, though this happens when you beat Rom anyway.

I have to wonder if there was supposed to be more and they ran out of time to do something with it, or if it was specifically intended that only the cathedral ward and the immediately surrounding area that have insight related changes.

I'm sure there's more than this, we just don't know it yet.

Elendil

Fawst wrote: »

Elendil
Stupid question, but did you try restarting the PS4 instead of using suspend? It may be a system memory thing.

I'll try it later, but from what I've read there's no fix for it, period. Needs a patch.

To clarify, said elevator is before a boss in Upper Cathedral Ward.

Fawst

Oh wow, yeah... you're not surviving that fall.

azith28

Elendil wrote: »

yeah so first things first: do not use a hunter's mark on a elevator it fucks it up

i did not do this

also do not fall into an elevator and die such that your corpse hits the pressure plate

this also fucks it up!

Did you apply the patch? I read that it was suppose to fix that bug.

Cilla Black

Spectrum wrote: »

Cilla Black wrote: »

Spectrum wrote: »

Too much bragging in previous posts/nostalgia for older games. Nothing in Dark Souls was particularly difficult except for bosses with tailcuts, because they forced you to play different ways and not kill the boss in the process of trying for the cut.

If you're doing better in Bloodborne, it's because you've had entire games worth of experience beneath your belt now and the bosses all have various mechanics which make them easier. Imagine if every large boss back in DS you could stagger like a bitch like Iron Golem, which you can more or less do to everything here.

What are you trying to say here?

Dark Souls wasn't terribly difficulty... but Bloodborne is even less so?

Not really sure what that has to do with nostalgia

I'm saying that I feel that people that think that Dark Souls had harder bosses aren't taking into account all the factors. Bloodborne's bosses are probably on par, once you account for experience in the Souls system.

There's a lot of nostalgia for Artorius and Manus as being leagues more difficult or something.

Was anyone really talking about Artorias and Manus being more difficult? They're just better, imo. Well, Artorias at any rate. I actually think Manus is a pretty shit boss tbh.

Cilla Black

Joshmvii wrote: »

Cobell wrote: »

Joshmvii wrote: »

So has anybody found any echo farming that's better than the Mergo's loft: middle leading up to the boss there? I accidentally found on NG that if I killed the first 3 shadow guys, visceral the pig, then run past the first 2 pigs and past the group of shadow guys, the pigs/shadows will fight each other and you can clean it up after for a ton of free echoes.

It was like 85k on NG while wearing all 3 +echo runes, and it's over 300k per run on NG+. Right now I'm in the process of filling out some levels on NG+ so it's nice to have a solid farming spot such as this, just wondering if anybody had found anything better.

How long does it take to get that many blood echoes?

If I need them, I do the Lecture Hall (1st floor) myself (though I haven't gotten to NG yet). It's just under 15k souls (with no rune buffs) to go in clear the hall in the immediate large auditorium and then returning to the Hunter's Dream. The load times to the Lecture Hall and the Hunter's Dream are both incredibly short as they are small maps. It takes roughly about 3-4 minutes to run in, kill everything, and zone out and back in.

The mobs in there have a decent drop rate of bullets and sedatives.

The Lecture hall is the first good echo farm you find, but it's nowhere near as good as the one I described. On your first NG, with all 3 echo runes, you're looking at about 85k echoes per run, and it takes maybe 3 minutes, probably a little less if you're fast. I was filling out my NG+ build last night and got 2.2 million echoes in about 30 minutes here.

Also, if you're doing any of this type of farming, use a bold hunter's mark to go back to the lantern and respawn the enemies. It saves you much more time when compared to running back to the lantern, going back to hunter's dream, then back to the level again. Doing it that way you spend more time on load screens than actually farming.

The best farm point anyone that I'm aware of has found is Isz Chalice level 3, the first room. It's pretty easy to rack up 145k in about 3 minutes, 180k in about 5 if you kill the enemies in the side rooms.

BranniganSepp

Upon extensive research, I may have missed 5 optional bosses and one or two optional areas. Oh boy.

Spaffy

Mergo's Wet Nurse coolest looking boss of all time

Spectrum

Cilla Black wrote: »

Spectrum wrote: »

Cilla Black wrote: »

Spectrum wrote: »

Too much bragging in previous posts/nostalgia for older games. Nothing in Dark Souls was particularly difficult except for bosses with tailcuts, because they forced you to play different ways and not kill the boss in the process of trying for the cut.

If you're doing better in Bloodborne, it's because you've had entire games worth of experience beneath your belt now and the bosses all have various mechanics which make them easier. Imagine if every large boss back in DS you could stagger like a bitch like Iron Golem, which you can more or less do to everything here.

What are you trying to say here?

Dark Souls wasn't terribly difficulty... but Bloodborne is even less so?

Not really sure what that has to do with nostalgia

I'm saying that I feel that people that think that Dark Souls had harder bosses aren't taking into account all the factors. Bloodborne's bosses are probably on par, once you account for experience in the Souls system.

There's a lot of nostalgia for Artorius and Manus as being leagues more difficult or something.

Was anyone really talking about Artorias and Manus being more difficult? They're just better, imo. Well, Artorias at any rate. I actually think Manus is a pretty shit boss tbh.

Yes.

Joshmvii wrote: »

Transporter wrote: »

I got semi-bottomed last page, but TL;DR the bosses in Bloodborne are so much better than the boss design in Demon/Dark Souls it's not even funny and not even a fair comparison.

Because the tools Bloodborne give you are vastly superior to the tools you have in Dark Souls, and any boss from Dark Souls/Dark Souls 2 with the Bloodborne combat engine would be JOKE.

I think you're overestimating the differences in the engines. If you play Dark Souls with the DWGR, you're damn near as mobile as you are with dash steps in Bloodborne. And Artorias is still a fucking man no matter what.

No boss in Bloodborne had shit like Artorias' branching combos where you didn't know if he was going to triple flip on you or not. They all telegraph everything they do pretty clearly, and IMO don't have many surprises to offer.

I can agree you can't directly compare the two, but you can most definitely compare the level of challenge they give you in their respective games, and that's all I was really doing.

Hell, they straight up gave Cleric Beast some of Manus' attack combos and gap closers. I loved the homage.

Joshmvii wrote: »

Boss difficulty discussion are largely pointless because of how different everybody's experiences are, but I have to say I definitely disagree that the fights you describe are anywhere close to Artorias or Manus. Both of those bosses, especially Artorias, have a level of unpredictability in their movesets that is just not matched in the fights you mention, IMO.

Suneater

I wish all the NPC hunters were more like mega man bosses. So they each have unique outfits and weapons and when you kill them you take them from their still bleeding corpses. I don't want to buy from a fountain, I want to cut the arm off that Gatling gun guy and wear the stake driver.

BranniganSepp

I guess the apt name for my first playthrough of Bloodborne is *Innocent Playthrough*. It is now my pleasure to engage with the *Undressed Bloodborne*, and get to know every nook and cranny of all her precious ugliness. The unseen will be seen, the unfelt will be felt. I'm shitting my pants in fearful anticipation of the terror and the despair that is most certainly to be visited upon me.

Viskod

Spaffy wrote: »

Mergo's Wet Nurse coolest looking boss of all time

My vote would have to go to Ebrietas, Daughter of the Cosmos. For both best appearance and best name and best location and best hidden thing to find at the end of the best area.

She's the best.

Spaffy

Viskod wrote: »

Spaffy wrote: »

Mergo's Wet Nurse coolest looking boss of all time

My vote would have to go to Ebrietas, Daughter of the Cosmos. For both best appearance and best name and best location and best hidden thing to find at the end of the best area.

She's the best.

But she's so grosssss. Granted on the cool name though. Most of these bosses are still the best take on the 'Eldritch Horror' angle I've yet seen and I genuinely love nearly all of them. But wet nurse 4 lyfe on looks and feel for me.

Joshmvii

Cilla Black wrote: »

Joshmvii wrote: »

Cobell wrote: »

Joshmvii wrote: »

So has anybody found any echo farming that's better than the Mergo's loft: middle leading up to the boss there? I accidentally found on NG that if I killed the first 3 shadow guys, visceral the pig, then run past the first 2 pigs and past the group of shadow guys, the pigs/shadows will fight each other and you can clean it up after for a ton of free echoes.

It was like 85k on NG while wearing all 3 +echo runes, and it's over 300k per run on NG+. Right now I'm in the process of filling out some levels on NG+ so it's nice to have a solid farming spot such as this, just wondering if anybody had found anything better.

How long does it take to get that many blood echoes?

If I need them, I do the Lecture Hall (1st floor) myself (though I haven't gotten to NG yet). It's just under 15k souls (with no rune buffs) to go in clear the hall in the immediate large auditorium and then returning to the Hunter's Dream. The load times to the Lecture Hall and the Hunter's Dream are both incredibly short as they are small maps. It takes roughly about 3-4 minutes to run in, kill everything, and zone out and back in.

The mobs in there have a decent drop rate of bullets and sedatives.

The Lecture hall is the first good echo farm you find, but it's nowhere near as good as the one I described. On your first NG, with all 3 echo runes, you're looking at about 85k echoes per run, and it takes maybe 3 minutes, probably a little less if you're fast. I was filling out my NG+ build last night and got 2.2 million echoes in about 30 minutes here.

Also, if you're doing any of this type of farming, use a bold hunter's mark to go back to the lantern and respawn the enemies. It saves you much more time when compared to running back to the lantern, going back to hunter's dream, then back to the level again. Doing it that way you spend more time on load screens than actually farming.

The best farm point anyone that I'm aware of has found is Isz Chalice level 3, the first room. It's pretty easy to rack up 145k in about 3 minutes, 180k in about 5 if you kill the enemies in the side rooms.

I guess if you're on your first NG cycle that's the best, but that doesn't sound like it compared to the 300k per 3ish minutes of the Mergo's loft on NG+. Definitely better than the 80kish you get on NG doing that run though.

Joshmvii

Spectrum wrote: »

Cilla Black wrote: »

Spectrum wrote: »

Cilla Black wrote: »

Spectrum wrote: »

Too much bragging in previous posts/nostalgia for older games. Nothing in Dark Souls was particularly difficult except for bosses with tailcuts, because they forced you to play different ways and not kill the boss in the process of trying for the cut.

If you're doing better in Bloodborne, it's because you've had entire games worth of experience beneath your belt now and the bosses all have various mechanics which make them easier. Imagine if every large boss back in DS you could stagger like a bitch like Iron Golem, which you can more or less do to everything here.

What are you trying to say here?

Dark Souls wasn't terribly difficulty... but Bloodborne is even less so?

Not really sure what that has to do with nostalgia

I'm saying that I feel that people that think that Dark Souls had harder bosses aren't taking into account all the factors. Bloodborne's bosses are probably on par, once you account for experience in the Souls system.

There's a lot of nostalgia for Artorius and Manus as being leagues more difficult or something.

Was anyone really talking about Artorias and Manus being more difficult? They're just better, imo. Well, Artorias at any rate. I actually think Manus is a pretty shit boss tbh.

Yes.

Joshmvii wrote: »

Transporter wrote: »

I got semi-bottomed last page, but TL;DR the bosses in Bloodborne are so much better than the boss design in Demon/Dark Souls it's not even funny and not even a fair comparison.

Because the tools Bloodborne give you are vastly superior to the tools you have in Dark Souls, and any boss from Dark Souls/Dark Souls 2 with the Bloodborne combat engine would be JOKE.

I think you're overestimating the differences in the engines. If you play Dark Souls with the DWGR, you're damn near as mobile as you are with dash steps in Bloodborne. And Artorias is still a fucking man no matter what.

No boss in Bloodborne had shit like Artorias' branching combos where you didn't know if he was going to triple flip on you or not. They all telegraph everything they do pretty clearly, and IMO don't have many surprises to offer.

I can agree you can't directly compare the two, but you can most definitely compare the level of challenge they give you in their respective games, and that's all I was really doing.

Hell, they straight up gave Cleric Beast some of Manus' attack combos and gap closers. I loved the homage.

Joshmvii wrote: »

Boss difficulty discussion are largely pointless because of how different everybody's experiences are, but I have to say I definitely disagree that the fights you describe are anywhere close to Artorias or Manus. Both of those bosses, especially Artorias, have a level of unpredictability in their movesets that is just not matched in the fights you mention, IMO.

I 100% stand by Artorias and Fume Knight being harder than anything in Bloodborne, and it's not just because of experience. That's not a criticism of Bloodborne, it's just my personal experience. And as we've all pointed out, everybody's difficulty varies in these games. Some people have trouble with bosses that other people find crazy easy, etc.

Joshmvii

E: DotC is the most horrifying boss in the entire game if you really take a look at what she looks like. She was also the most challenging for me, and related to lore that I find crazy interesting so she's probably my favorite of all of Bloodborne's bosses.

Mego Thor

Regarding the Red Jeweled Brooch...

I gave it back to the kid in the window. It seemed like the right thing to do.

DHS Odium

Just started last night. I heard beforehand how difficult this was, but I guess since I'm a Souls veteran it hasn't been too hard. I accidentally skipped the Cleric Beast and found my way deeper than I probably should have, but I got some great items, including a few of the Madman's Knowledge so I was able to level up before even having to face the boss. Brought the Cleric Beast down the first time, and when I can play tonight I'll go after Father G.

Numi

So I get the final boss of the defiled chalice down to about 10% and the damn thing manages to clip straight through the wall/ceiling and just sits there out of range shooting lasers at me. Which I guess goes well with how shitty the dungeon was, even in terms of horrible chalice dungeons this one stood out.

Fawst

Mego Thor wrote: »

Regarding the Red Jeweled Brooch...

I gave it back to the kid in the window. It seemed like the right thing to do.

You monster.

Beef Avenger

Mego Thor wrote: »

Regarding the Red Jeweled Brooch...

I gave it back to the kid in the window. It seemed like the right thing to do.

spoiler

good job now she's going to die

double spoiler

well she was going to die either way

Voranth

Getting really close to the end of the game (and I don't want it to end!) so I've been playing chalice dungeons and helping randoms with bosses with the resonant bell.

I want to like the chalice dungeons but they're just so...lifeless. Nothing really happens in them. There isn't even any music except for boss fights! Also I thought the different chalices were supposed to have different tile sets but I ran a Hintertomb chalice and it looked exactly the same as a Pthumeru chalice? There were one or two unique rooms but that was it. I still find the combat in the game amazing so I'll play a few more at least. Maybe I'll warm up to them.

On the other hand being summoned into boss fights is loads of fun! Decent blood echos too. I think this game needs some sort of co-op boss rush mode.

Beef Avenger

I've been enjoying chalice dungeons but they're definitely the kind of content that I do while watching media on another monitor, unlike the main game where I want to get immersed in the world

SyphonBlue

DHS Odium wrote: »

Just started last night. I heard beforehand how difficult this was, but I guess since I'm a Souls veteran it hasn't been too hard. I accidentally skipped the Cleric Beast and found my way deeper than I probably should have, but I got some great items, including a few of the Madman's Knowledge so I was able to level up before even having to face the boss. Brought the Cleric Beast down the first time, and when I can play tonight I'll go after Father G.

Cleric is fairly easy. The main difficulty is he has a ton of HP and you're very weak. Father G is quite a bit harder, mostly due to the environment and the subsequent getting caught up on it.