Avengers II: Age Of Ultron - Sequel Assemble! [Superheroes]

chiasaur11

wirehead26 wrote: »

Chincymcchilla wrote: »

I want to point out that people on my facebook are freaking about how awesome batman v superman looks

Do you calmly point out how wrong they are?

Yes.

Calmly.

I take a very restrained, businessman approach to these arguments. Like Wilson Fisk.

KingofMadCows

Goatmon wrote: »

One thing that kinda confuses me about that trailer

That Superman statue with the grafiti on it

Why is there a statue of Superman if everybody hates his guts?

Maybe there's a plaque underneath the statue that says "Never Again"

Undead Scottsman

JayKaos wrote: »

I've already had to swear not to discuss Man of Steel with any of my friends in person, and doubly so when alcohol is involved.

Yes, one of my buddies who doesn't read comics really liked it, and my brother, who read a lot of comics in the 80's and 90's, feels like it better represented "his" Superman, and that the classic idea of Superman wouldn't work in a film these days.

I've stopped arguing with them about it.

DouglasDanger

Goatmon wrote: »

One thing that kinda confuses me about that trailer

That Superman statue with the grafiti on it

Why is there a statue of Superman if everybody hates his guts?

Because it's shit

Solar

Thing is, I do think DC should try something different from Marvel

And I definitely think you can make a solemn, serious Superman movie which is very much at odds to the considerably lighter Marvel fare

I don't think the problems really lie there, I think it's more a case of the people making the movies specifically just doing a bad job. David Goyer is just a bad writer, Zack Snyder is a bad director. That's it, I think, more than any kind of core conceptual problem beyond that.

DouglasDanger

Which trade does one buy to begin with Remender's Captain America? Are the Flash Thompson is Venom trades still in print?

wirehead26

DouglasDanger wrote: »

Which trade does one buy to begin with Remender's Captain America? Are the Flash Thompson is Venom trades still in print?

Wait do you just want to read his Cap run or his other Marvel books.

DouglasDanger

Well, I want to read everything! But, just his Cap for starters

KingofMadCows

Goyer isn't just a bad writer and Snyder isn't just a bad director. Bad writers and directors can get better. Goyer and Snyder refuse to learn from their mistakes or even admit that they've made mistakes.

If you ever read/listen to interviews/commentaries with good writers/directors like Joss Whedon or Bruce Timm, they critique their own work, they talk about things they didn't like and how they could have done certain things better. Goyer and Snyder like to talk about how great their stuff is and how people who critique them just "don't get it."

wirehead26

DouglasDanger wrote: »

Well, I want to read everything! But, just his Cap for starters

Well he did 5 volumes of Cap starting with the Dimension Z arc. Just look at Remender's wiki page for the titles of all 5 volumes but sadly the last one doesn't come out in trade format till freaking August.

wirehead26

Actually I'll just post it here

Volume 1: Castaway in Dimension Z: Book 1 (hc, 136 pages, 2013, ISBN 0-7851-6826-5) collects:
"Castaway in Dimension Z" (with John Romita, Jr., in #1-5, 2013)

Volume 2: Castaway in Dimension Z: Book 2 (hc, 136 pages, 2013, ISBN 0-7851-6827-3) collects:
"Castaway in Dimension Z" (with John Romita, Jr., in #6-10, 2013)

Volume 3: Loose Nuke (hc, 136 pages, 2014, ISBN 0-7851-89510-3) collects:
"Loose Nuke" (with Carlos Pacheco and Nic Klein, in #11-15, 2014)

Volume 4: The Iron Nail (hc, 144 pages, 2014, ISBN 0-7851-8953-X) collects:
"The Iron Nail" (with Pascal Alixe and Nic Klein, in #16-21, 2014)

Volume 5: The Tomorrow Soldier (hc, 136 pages, 2015, ISBN 0-7851-8955-6) collects:
"The Tomorrow Soldier" (with Carlos Pacheco and Stuart Immonen, in #22-25, 2014)

Goatmon

Solar wrote: »

Thing is, I do think DC should try something different from Marvel

And I definitely think you can make a solemn, serious Superman movie which is very much at odds to the considerably lighter Marvel fare

I don't think the problems really lie there, I think it's more a case of the people making the movies specifically just doing a bad job. David Goyer is just a bad writer, Zack Snyder is a bad director. That's it, I think, more than any kind of core conceptual problem beyond that.

The Netflix Daredevil series is proof positive that you can have a dark serious superhero work turn out really good.

They just need people running it who aren't fucking terrible.

Maddoc

Well to learn from their mistakes, their mistakes would actually have to have a noticeable box office effect

Which sadly, it really hasn't, because Man of Steel did extremely well for itself

Batman v Superman I can practically guarantee will do even better

I happen to think Man of Steel was a fucking trashcan fire, but if it was a mistake it was an incredibly well received mistake that made them truckloads of money

These films are, evidently, what people want and it's probably important to remind ourselves of that occasionally

This also plays into the whole "Oh man I think I'll go hatewatch this thing" being fucking idiotic. Like, if you want to complain about these movies and then go see them opening weekend you are part of the "problem" you're complaining about.

PaperLuigi44

Sadly I overheard colleagues mocking criticisms of that BvS trailer, which they simplified to "It's too realistic."

DarkPrimus

Maddoc wrote: »

This also plays into the whole "Oh man I think I'll go hatewatch this thing" being fucking idiotic. Like, if you want to complain about these movies and then go see them opening weekend you are part of the "problem" you're complaining about.

Exactly.

UnbrokenEva

Maddoc wrote: »

Well to learn from their mistakes, their mistakes would actually have to have a noticeable box office effect

Which sadly, it really hasn't, because Man of Steel did extremely well for itself

Batman v Superman I can practically guarantee will do even better

I happen to think Man of Steel was a fucking trashcan fire, but if it was a mistake it was an incredibly well received mistake that made them truckloads of money

These films are, evidently, what people want and it's probably important to remind ourselves of that occasionally

This also plays into the whole "Oh man I think I'll go hatewatch this thing" being fucking idiotic. Like, if you want to complain about these movies and then go see them opening weekend you are part of the "problem" you're complaining about.

People keep saying that MoS was a massive success, but it wasn't. It did decently well, but by superhero movie standards it was likely a disappointment. Not only did it make less than the Nolan batfilms, in terms of dollars received compared to what they spent on production/marketing it would rank towards the bottom of Marvel's films.

Maddoc

It did better than the first Iron Man!

KingofMadCows

It also cost like $50 million more than the first Iron Man.

Javen

I watched part of the fight with Zod on youtube

Is Zod CGI? Cause he really looks it a lot of the time

UnbrokenEva

Zack Snyder never met a budget he couldn't overspend.

UnbrokenEva

Also the $140 million/ $225 million budget numbers (so $85 million more to make MoS, actually) are just production costs, movies these days often spend nearly as much on marketing, which further narrows the potential profits.

edit: confirmation from an article that came out before MoS. Variety estimated the marketing budget around $150 million, for a total of $375 million, and WB expected it to make well in excess of a billion dollars.
http://variety.com/2013/film/news/warner-bros-sets-bar-high-for-latest-and-priciest-incarnation-of-superman-1200493334/

Warner Bros. motion pictures group president Jeff Robinov went so far as to predict it will be the studio’s highest performer ever. That would mean the 3D movie, which cost about $225 million to produce and another $150 million to market and release around the globe, would have to top the $1.3 billion cume for “Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows: Part 2″ and the $1 billion-plus each earned by four other Warner releases, “The Dark Knight,” “The Dark Knight Rises,” “The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey” and “The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King.”

The potential business impact of a “Man of Steel” windfall could be profound for Warner Bros., which needs to build new franchises that can yield the kind of reliable profi ts that sprang from the now-retired “Harry Potter” movie series.

So yeah, at $668 million box office, Man of Steel was absolutely a disappointment based on what WB expected it to pull in.

Maddoc

I mean, it also made around that much more than Iron Man. (82 million more, from what I can find)

So if Man of Steel was not a commercial success, it sure does seem like Iron Man wasn't either.

Like, it didn't BLOW THE FUCKING LID OFF like Iron Man 3 or anything, but it did well for itself by any reasonable metric and nobody out there was viewing it as anything approaching a box office failure.

I know, it feels good to think that it did bad because it is a shit movie and deserved to do bad, but that just doesn't really line up.

UnbrokenEva

see the above quote I added. It made roughly half of what Warner Bros. was expecting it would.

Undead Scottsman

wirehead26 wrote: »

DouglasDanger wrote: »

Which trade does one buy to begin with Remender's Captain America? Are the Flash Thompson is Venom trades still in print?

Wait do you just want to read his Cap run or his other Marvel books.

Remenders Venom run is being recollected later this year. Otherwise it's a bit hodge podgy, with several issues only found in the Spider-Island trade.

KingofMadCows

Hollywood is dark and full of accounting "errors."

DouglasDanger

Thanks @wirehead26

Undead Scottsman

Undead Scottsman wrote: »

wirehead26 wrote: »

DouglasDanger wrote: »

Which trade does one buy to begin with Remender's Captain America? Are the Flash Thompson is Venom trades still in print?

Wait do you just want to read his Cap run or his other Marvel books.

Remenders Venom run is being recollected later this year. Otherwise it's a bit hodge podgy, with several issues only found in the Spider-Island trade.

Specifically

Venom vol. 1 by Remender
Spider-Island
Venom: Circle of Four
Venom: Savage Six

Or you can wait for June for the first half and August for the second half of Venom by Rick Remender: The Complete Collection

DouglasDanger

I saw that complete venom vol 1 thing and wish listed it 8-)

Bubby

Blankzilla wrote: »

A bunch more Sony Emails showed up on Wikileaks and whooboy

Kevin Fiege was asked to critique a cut of ASM 2 and had complaints with most of the major issues of the film that were evidently ignored:

There are too many story lines and we need to choose which ones we are focusing on and lift out the other ones, ie; could reduce father arc to just Roosevelt?



Could cut out plane crash and Richard destroying spiders and start on armored car – don’t start with Spider-Man….let the danger/stakes to NYC build first and then have Spider-Man enter the scene heroically.



Tone down Paul Giamatti performance, so he seems a bit more menacing and less cartoonish.



If you cut Richard from the opening and the plane crash maybe you could instead do Harry coming home and seeing Norman at the top of the movie as a cold open.



Really love Electro – feels like you may not need the scene in his apartment, which makes him seems completely crazy and hard to relate too.



Like the idea that eel goes in his mouth and instead of burrowing, you see it glow within him…



Need to set up the Power Plant earlier, visually.



Seems like the movie switches pov’s a lot…why are we in Max’s pov during the car chase, worth looking at this playing out from Spidey’s pov.



There could be a better way to reveal that Peter is missing graduation – maybe when you cut Gwen you cut to the wide shot?



Tiny note – don’t think Peter would lie to Gwen about sirens --- maybe he just downplays it…



Stan Lee Cameo – maybe need a little more emphasis on Peter here trying to get out of his costume and not be in seen…set up a little more the pressure of the principal getting closer and closer to calling his name.



Instead of seeing the ghost of Captain Stacy, can just here the voice in Peter’s head and maybe flash back to the last movie? Don’t think we should add Cap Stacy back into car chase.



There is too much back and forth with Peter and Gwen – can we recut the Dim Sum scene so that it doesn’t feel so repetitive of their break-up in the last movie – Can Peter be more honorable and definitive and less wishy-washy?



Why do we need a year to pass…



Harry story feels like the main plot of the movie – Peter should look into the past b/c of Harry – maybe find some photos of them together as kids…use obsession wall more to set up this part of his past not just what happened to parents.



Not sure what Peter learns at Roosevelt is entirely correct. We’re distracted by the idea that Peter became Spider-Man b/c of his father’s blood --- all this special back story with his super-scientist dad fights with the idea that Peter is normal kid from Queens who becomes the greatest super-hero in the world…



Andrew’s performance is all over the place…a lot of crying and then a lot of mania. Hard to track him emotionally sometimes. It undermines his reaction to Gwen’s death b/c he gets upset and emotional a lot.



Don’t like the idea that May tells Peter his parents were spies b/c two seconds later he finds out they are not and it again fights with the idea that he’s an ordinary kid.



Like the idea that May finds out he’s Spider-Man – finds his costume instead of just the rosemary harris wink-wink all the time.



Kind of like the morgue, but hate the dancing mortician – cliché.



Are you using VFX to show how Electro is travelling from one point to another (bursts of electricity).



Need to underscore capture of goblin…more sirens as you linger on the clock 1;21, 1:22 am (nice touch).



Surveillance scene should be about following Harry not Peter…no one should be following Peter.



Can Electro hum Itsy-Bitsy Spider before he plays it electronically…maybe we can use this again.



Maybe intercut the ending montage and hearing Gwen’s speech with someone going into special projects and revealing more easter eggs and see that the rhino case has been broke into and the suit is missing…great way to transition to rhino ending.



Don’t need Aunt May in the kitchen.



Spider-man needs to feel more directly responsible for preventing the planes from crashing.


Don’t show New Yorkers looting.

Before signing a deal with Marvel Sony was exploring having Spider-Man appear in either X-Men: Apocalypse or Fantastic Four

Spider-Woman was pitched as a "fierce, Twilight branded teenage girl movie"

Avi Arad is crazy and everyone at Sony knew it

Alan Fine told Sony that rebooting was a mistake because it writes off the original trilogy as something they need to ignore and redo. He also told Sony they were going way too dark with ASM and losing sight of what makes Spider-Man work.

There was a group of people dedicated to headhunting Marvel writers/directors the second they finish their "tour of duty" at Marvel

Andrew Garfield apparently tried to argue that Sinister Six would qualify as Amazing Spider-Man 3 for his contract so he should get the same payday he did for the other two films

He also decided to not attend a major Sony gala before the premiere of ASM 2 with about an hours notice. He "has a scruffy beard and wants to be left alone."

Feige is a very smart person and Garfield has already let fame go to his head.

KingofMadCows

It is interesting that Feige liked Electro. He was a very weak villain with a terrible motivation for turning evil. Although, the MCU only has two really good villains so far, so maybe I shouldn't be surprised.

Undead Scottsman

Electro was enjoyable to watch after he got his powers; he just needed better set-up.

gtrmp

Bubby wrote: »

Blankzilla wrote: »

A bunch more Sony Emails showed up on Wikileaks and whooboy

Kevin Fiege was asked to critique a cut of ASM 2 and had complaints with most of the major issues of the film that were evidently ignored:

There are too many story lines and we need to choose which ones we are focusing on and lift out the other ones, ie; could reduce father arc to just Roosevelt?



Could cut out plane crash and Richard destroying spiders and start on armored car – don’t start with Spider-Man….let the danger/stakes to NYC build first and then have Spider-Man enter the scene heroically.



Tone down Paul Giamatti performance, so he seems a bit more menacing and less cartoonish.



If you cut Richard from the opening and the plane crash maybe you could instead do Harry coming home and seeing Norman at the top of the movie as a cold open.



Really love Electro – feels like you may not need the scene in his apartment, which makes him seems completely crazy and hard to relate too.



Like the idea that eel goes in his mouth and instead of burrowing, you see it glow within him…



Need to set up the Power Plant earlier, visually.



Seems like the movie switches pov’s a lot…why are we in Max’s pov during the car chase, worth looking at this playing out from Spidey’s pov.



There could be a better way to reveal that Peter is missing graduation – maybe when you cut Gwen you cut to the wide shot?



Tiny note – don’t think Peter would lie to Gwen about sirens --- maybe he just downplays it…



Stan Lee Cameo – maybe need a little more emphasis on Peter here trying to get out of his costume and not be in seen…set up a little more the pressure of the principal getting closer and closer to calling his name.



Instead of seeing the ghost of Captain Stacy, can just here the voice in Peter’s head and maybe flash back to the last movie? Don’t think we should add Cap Stacy back into car chase.



There is too much back and forth with Peter and Gwen – can we recut the Dim Sum scene so that it doesn’t feel so repetitive of their break-up in the last movie – Can Peter be more honorable and definitive and less wishy-washy?



Why do we need a year to pass…



Harry story feels like the main plot of the movie – Peter should look into the past b/c of Harry – maybe find some photos of them together as kids…use obsession wall more to set up this part of his past not just what happened to parents.



Not sure what Peter learns at Roosevelt is entirely correct. We’re distracted by the idea that Peter became Spider-Man b/c of his father’s blood --- all this special back story with his super-scientist dad fights with the idea that Peter is normal kid from Queens who becomes the greatest super-hero in the world…



Andrew’s performance is all over the place…a lot of crying and then a lot of mania. Hard to track him emotionally sometimes. It undermines his reaction to Gwen’s death b/c he gets upset and emotional a lot.



Don’t like the idea that May tells Peter his parents were spies b/c two seconds later he finds out they are not and it again fights with the idea that he’s an ordinary kid.



Like the idea that May finds out he’s Spider-Man – finds his costume instead of just the rosemary harris wink-wink all the time.



Kind of like the morgue, but hate the dancing mortician – cliché.



Are you using VFX to show how Electro is travelling from one point to another (bursts of electricity).



Need to underscore capture of goblin…more sirens as you linger on the clock 1;21, 1:22 am (nice touch).



Surveillance scene should be about following Harry not Peter…no one should be following Peter.



Can Electro hum Itsy-Bitsy Spider before he plays it electronically…maybe we can use this again.



Maybe intercut the ending montage and hearing Gwen’s speech with someone going into special projects and revealing more easter eggs and see that the rhino case has been broke into and the suit is missing…great way to transition to rhino ending.



Don’t need Aunt May in the kitchen.



Spider-man needs to feel more directly responsible for preventing the planes from crashing.


Don’t show New Yorkers looting.

Before signing a deal with Marvel Sony was exploring having Spider-Man appear in either X-Men: Apocalypse or Fantastic Four

Spider-Woman was pitched as a "fierce, Twilight branded teenage girl movie"

Avi Arad is crazy and everyone at Sony knew it

Alan Fine told Sony that rebooting was a mistake because it writes off the original trilogy as something they need to ignore and redo. He also told Sony they were going way too dark with ASM and losing sight of what makes Spider-Man work.

There was a group of people dedicated to headhunting Marvel writers/directors the second they finish their "tour of duty" at Marvel

Andrew Garfield apparently tried to argue that Sinister Six would qualify as Amazing Spider-Man 3 for his contract so he should get the same payday he did for the other two films

He also decided to not attend a major Sony gala before the premiere of ASM 2 with about an hours notice. He "has a scruffy beard and wants to be left alone."

Feige is a very smart person and Garfield has already let fame go to his head.

He was entirely justified in trying to get paid for the movie that was going to spin off of the series he's headlining, and we don't know what the context to him doing a no-show for the "major Sony gala" was aside from the fact that it happened (was that even a press event for the Spider-Man movies, or was it a just a general Sony Pictures thing?)

KingofMadCows

Yeah, a lot of big executives are assholes who like to have celebrities show up at their parties just to parade around to impress people.

UnbrokenEva

Finally signed up for Unlimited, I'm really temped to start by rereading USM

UnbrokenEva

Actually no, Silver Surfer Requiem. It's the only thing in the top 10 of Geebs' poll I haven't read, and folks seem to feel pretty strongly about it.

Wyborn

Silver Surfer Requiem is the absolute best Silver Surfer story, full stop

I'm not sure how you'd make a better one

Dys

Is there a trade out for the recent awesome run of Moon Knight everyone here loved?

I've even wanting to read it but my knowledge of buying comics is tragically limited.

Centipede Damascus

Dys wrote: »

Is there a trade out for the recent awesome run of Moon Knight everyone here loved?

I've even wanting to read it but my knowledge of buying comics is tragically limited.

here ya go: http://amzn.com/0785154086

Undead Scottsman

Dys wrote: »

Is there a trade out for the recent awesome run of Moon Knight everyone here loved?

I've even wanting to read it but my knowledge of buying comics is tragically limited.

Moon Knight Volume 1: From the Dead
Moon Knight Volume 2: Blackout

GreasyKidsStuff

There most certainly is. First six issues with Ellis writing are collected in Moon Knight Vol 1