I'm having a really hard time deciding whether I like playing with kbam or an xbone controller more. Guard mode is much better on the controller but I'm way better at quickly switching block/attack directions with the mouse
Vanguard is a class type that encompasses the Raider, the Warden and the Kensei. Basically all the classes that come unlocked are Vanguards.
Right. Sorry.
Posting tired.
"now I've got this mental image of caucuses as cafeteria tables in prison, and new congressmen having to beat someone up on inauguration day." - Raiden333
Can't seem to join an online game. Just hangs forever. Anyone else?
1v1 seems to have doubled in queue time for me, everything else is okay. I wish dominion queue time would have changed instead, 1v1 is 100% the only fun/working part of this game and dominion seems like it'll remain a mess through release.
finally got into a duel and my screen decided to keep the blurring from the options menu (maybe? dunno what else it could be) on the screen during the fight, so...working might have been too generous
so hey, im guessing Vanguard is the name of another hero. is that the shield and spear valkyrie from the vikings? or a completely new hero?
because I have a contract that says do 5 elimiations as a Vanguard
@NotoriusBEN Vanguard is a type of class, all three heroes you have recruited from the beginning (Kensei, Raider, and Warden) are Vanguards. The other classes are Heavy, (Conqueror, Warlord, and Shugoki) Assassin, (Peacekeeper, Berserker, and Orochi) and Hybrid. (Lawbringer, Nobushi, and Valkyrie)
"Learn to guardbreak" or "Don't get grabbed" is a terrible excuse to justify how bullshit some grabs are, like the Peacekeeper stab. A guardbreak attempt has almost zero risk, yet the timing is not easy at all to pin down. Guardbreak spammers are usually top of the leaderboard for a reason.
They also need to rework healing skills and reviving, Elimination matches are incredibly stupid because of this.
Yeah, guard break seemed pretty broken in the last beta too.
I think they need to widen the window to counter it. Its smaller than the parry window, which should demonstably be more difficult due to how open it leaves you if you mess up
The balance on many elements of the combat feels way off, the sense of risk vs reward on many actions feels way off.
The longer I play the more the game boils down to raw mechanics and I just don't think the game actually works, at least not for my tastes.
I feel pretty comfortable saying the game just doesn't come together at all. it's closest in 1v1s, but even there the order of the day is guardbreak spam into your preferred free and safe damage, which gets absurd depending on the class. when you add more people on each side it turns into a game of backstabbing and running away to farm buffs, heal or find friends to come zerg down a straggler. I hate to sound trite but there isn't a whole lot of honor or weight to it as a whole.
that said, I'm seeing lots of people who seem to just adore it so maybe I just can't see past my own complaints.
Put in an hour or so, went ahead and cancelled my pre-order. Maybe it will be a fantastic game someday, but instead of feeling weighty the combat feels like it's underwater and the game interface is shit with a mouse/keyboard.
I at least require that if you release a game on the platform I purchase it on, the fucking menus work.
Yeah, guard break seemed pretty broken in the last beta too.
I think they need to widen the window to counter it. Its smaller than the parry window, which should demonstably be more difficult due to how open it leaves you if you mess up
I had some thoughts forming on this game until the guard break escape tutorial. The timing is so short that it is borderline impossible for me. I just shut it off on the spot, because there's no way that won't render the entire game unplayable to me.
The timing to counter a guard break is actually super strange, and oddly late for how you feel it should be. It's not when you see the icon, it's when they touch you. I find double tapping seems to generally handle it.
Deflecting attacks (not parrying) is so fucking hard to do against real people. Like, against the bot that slams the same attack a few times in a row, its grand. But players who attack the same instant they change direction: it feels impossible. Like, the button for dodge on my controller is used by the same thumb that changes my guard direction. Cannot be done.
Deflecting attacks (not parrying) is so fucking hard to do against real people. Like, against the bot that slams the same attack a few times in a row, its grand. But players who attack the same instant they change direction: it feels impossible. Like, the button for dodge on my controller is used by the same thumb that changes my guard direction. Cannot be done.
Deflect does not care about guard direction. It is the direction you are dodging.
Deflecting attacks (not parrying) is so fucking hard to do against real people. Like, against the bot that slams the same attack a few times in a row, its grand. But players who attack the same instant they change direction: it feels impossible. Like, the button for dodge on my controller is used by the same thumb that changes my guard direction. Cannot be done.
Deflect does not care about guard direction. It is the direction you are dodging.
To specify. You dodge in to an attack as it lands, causing a deflect.
Deflecting attacks (not parrying) is so fucking hard to do against real people. Like, against the bot that slams the same attack a few times in a row, its grand. But players who attack the same instant they change direction: it feels impossible. Like, the button for dodge on my controller is used by the same thumb that changes my guard direction. Cannot be done.
Deflect does not care about guard direction. It is the direction you are dodging.
To specify. You dodge in to an attack as it lands, causing a deflect.
Yeah if anything deflecting feels way too easy in my opinion.
As the Orochi for example I basically never use standard blocks. Against attacks from the side I dodge directly at them. Time it too early on accident and you still usually get a successful dodge and a free punish, time it late enough and you get the deflect and the guaranteed punish. Against overheads you can still just dodge to the side and punish.
My defense seems more solid as an Orochi than as an actual shield class.
I understand the need for something like them to discourage turtling, but they are very easy to start, relatively difficult to defend against, and have very little penalty for failing
Any match near a pit basically becomes a match not about health, but just about who can get their grab off first.
Obviously this is my first day playing, and I really like some aspects of the 1v1 games, I think the fight animation is great and the relatively slower paced mindgame aspect is a cool approach
But certain mechanics seem so completely unfun that I just can't see myself forcing my way through learning how to exploit them myself.
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
I understand the need for something like them to discourage turtling, but they are very easy to start, relatively difficult to defend against, and have very little penalty for failing
Any match near a pit basically becomes a match not about health, but just about who can get their grab off first.
Obviously this is my first day playing, and I really like some aspects of the 1v1 games, I think the fight animation is great and the relatively slower paced mindgame aspect is a cool approach
But certain mechanics seem so completely unfun that I just can't see myself forcing my way through learning how to exploit them myself.
Against an Orochi or a Peacekeeper they love the guard breaks and most spam them forever. You can normally light attack punish them with proper timing though.
But as someone who uses shield classes all the time, it's really hard to get through that defense otherwise.
Probably the worst feeling class to play against in the game is a good conqueror. Block into Heavy into shield bash into heavy into shield bash etc and you never get to do anything.
Yeah, I played this a bit last night; the beginner's tutorial, then a few matches against bots, then a few with Hermano and Angry. I seemed to be killing more people by the end of the evening, but I'm not sure that was down to me getting better or anything, but most likely because I'm fighting other people who are also new to the game.
That said, I was quite proud in one fight, where it was 2vs3. 2 of the other guys were attacking me, but I managed to do a significant amount of blocking (as the Vanguard Knight), and held them up long enough for my team mate to come behind them and cause them to panic and run away.
I didn't realise there was another tutorial, so I'll hopefully get a chance to try that tonight and learn a few more things, such as cancelling hard strikes.
Redcoat-13 on
PSN Fleety2009
0
AxenMy avatar is Excalibur.Yes, the sword.Registered Userregular
edited February 2017
As a guard break spamming Peacekeeper I do have to say a few things.
We're gonna guard break. . . a lot. It is like 80% of our damage.
Nobushi are my kryptonite. People with shields coming in second.
When you start getting stabbed you can block the shivs. I've no clue how, but a few people have been able to block all three of my shivs before. I was probably as surprised as they were.
Don't let me get close to you. Some classes might not have a choice (nature of the beast and all), but most have weapons with reach. What I mean is many classes can strike me long before I get close enough to guard break.
As far as countering a guard break, eh I dunno. I don't think it is as nearly as hard as people convince themselves it is. I've been countered plenty of times. Hell I remember one particularly annoying duel where the guy countered every damn one of my guard breaks. It was disheartening.
As mentioned before, punish us with light attacks. A heavy attack usually gets you three shivs to the gut.
If a Peacekeeper misses a guard break, capitalize on it. Depending on what class you are we might have just handed you victory.
Charging in at us like a madman can be really effective, provided you know your move sets. If you come in all button mashey you're gonna get three shivs to the gut.
I foresee the Lawbringer being another thorn in my side.
Axen on
A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
I dunno about blocking the stabs. I do know the game will let you grab if dodging actually puts the opponent passed range, but won't deal any damage. My backstepping orochi had thid happen a few times fighting peacekeepers. The stabs dealt no damage.
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AxenMy avatar is Excalibur.Yes, the sword.Registered Userregular
Only once have I had all three blocked, but once in awhile it'll be Stab (damage) KLINK (no damage) Stab (damage). Or any combination.
I've no clue what triggers it, but I know it can trigger for all three or just two or just one. In any order.
A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
I almost exclusively use light attacks with my Conqueror since I'm pretty sure they nerfed him: two heavy attacks and a shield bash will drain my stamina. The shield bash is powerful but it uses almost half the stamina bar.
Maybe I should stop using him, because his light attacks aren't quick enough to stop most guardbreaks and he doesn't have any other cheese like the popular classes seem to have now. Dodging is also useless for the Conqueror.
Anyone on xbone want to play sets with me? I'm so lonely...
Hiryu Zerotwo
Sev: Your gameplay is the most heavily yomi based around. Usually you look for characters that allow you to force guessing situations for big dmg. Even if the guess is mathematically nowhere near in your favor lol. You're happiest when you have either a 50/50, 33/33/33 or even a 75/25 situation to go crazy with. And you will take big risks to force those situations to come up.
0
FaranguI am a beardy manWith a beardy planRegistered Userregular
Parrying a Raider as a Kensei is completely safe for the Raider. I parryed this guy about 6 times last night, and I couldn't get a followup even with lights.
Man, whoever said it was rough having guard break as a A/square on a controller definitely wasn't wrong! I can never get my thumb off the joystick quick enough. Also the timing on guard break counter seems reeeaaal funky, I was having a hard time managing it even in the tutorial.
Parrying a Raider as a Kensei is completely safe for the Raider. I parryed this guy about 6 times last night, and I couldn't get a followup even with lights.
I am not sure how class or matchup dependent it is but standard parries seem... bad? Maybe it's just on who I've been playing but the animations are long enough and push the enemy back far enough that following seemed always blockable. At which point why do I risk parrying an attack outside of stopping a berserker chain, I guess.
Exceptions for the shield classes with their light parries with garaunteed follow ups. But overall deflect dodging seems far superior.
Parrying a Raider as a Kensei is completely safe for the Raider. I parryed this guy about 6 times last night, and I couldn't get a followup even with lights.
I am not sure how class or matchup dependent it is but standard parries seem... bad? Maybe it's just on who I've been playing but the animations are long enough and push the enemy back far enough that following seemed always blockable. At which point why do I risk parrying an attack outside of stopping a berserker chain, I guess.
Exceptions for the shield classes with their light parries with garaunteed follow ups. But overall deflect dodging seems far superior.
It doubles the stamina drain for the block and can push them closer to a wall. Which is a huge advantage for most classes.
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Right. Sorry.
Posting tired.
1v1 seems to have doubled in queue time for me, everything else is okay. I wish dominion queue time would have changed instead, 1v1 is 100% the only fun/working part of this game and dominion seems like it'll remain a mess through release.
finally got into a duel and my screen decided to keep the blurring from the options menu (maybe? dunno what else it could be) on the screen during the fight, so...working might have been too generous
Game seems cool but it has alot of bloat
Chicago Megagame group
Watch me struggle to learn streaming! Point and laugh!
@NotoriusBEN Vanguard is a type of class, all three heroes you have recruited from the beginning (Kensei, Raider, and Warden) are Vanguards. The other classes are Heavy, (Conqueror, Warlord, and Shugoki) Assassin, (Peacekeeper, Berserker, and Orochi) and Hybrid. (Lawbringer, Nobushi, and Valkyrie)
They also need to rework healing skills and reviving, Elimination matches are incredibly stupid because of this.
I think they need to widen the window to counter it. Its smaller than the parry window, which should demonstably be more difficult due to how open it leaves you if you mess up
The balance on many elements of the combat feels way off, the sense of risk vs reward on many actions feels way off.
The longer I play the more the game boils down to raw mechanics and I just don't think the game actually works, at least not for my tastes.
I feel pretty comfortable saying the game just doesn't come together at all. it's closest in 1v1s, but even there the order of the day is guardbreak spam into your preferred free and safe damage, which gets absurd depending on the class. when you add more people on each side it turns into a game of backstabbing and running away to farm buffs, heal or find friends to come zerg down a straggler. I hate to sound trite but there isn't a whole lot of honor or weight to it as a whole.
that said, I'm seeing lots of people who seem to just adore it so maybe I just can't see past my own complaints.
I at least require that if you release a game on the platform I purchase it on, the fucking menus work.
Deflecting attacks (not parrying) is so fucking hard to do against real people. Like, against the bot that slams the same attack a few times in a row, its grand. But players who attack the same instant they change direction: it feels impossible. Like, the button for dodge on my controller is used by the same thumb that changes my guard direction. Cannot be done.
Deflect does not care about guard direction. It is the direction you are dodging.
Beating the hell out of them with light attacks, mostly. The interrupt isn't practical at all though, no.
White FC: 0819 3350 1787
To specify. You dodge in to an attack as it lands, causing a deflect.
Mind is blown
As the Orochi for example I basically never use standard blocks. Against attacks from the side I dodge directly at them. Time it too early on accident and you still usually get a successful dodge and a free punish, time it late enough and you get the deflect and the guaranteed punish. Against overheads you can still just dodge to the side and punish.
My defense seems more solid as an Orochi than as an actual shield class.
I understand the need for something like them to discourage turtling, but they are very easy to start, relatively difficult to defend against, and have very little penalty for failing
Any match near a pit basically becomes a match not about health, but just about who can get their grab off first.
Obviously this is my first day playing, and I really like some aspects of the 1v1 games, I think the fight animation is great and the relatively slower paced mindgame aspect is a cool approach
But certain mechanics seem so completely unfun that I just can't see myself forcing my way through learning how to exploit them myself.
Against an Orochi or a Peacekeeper they love the guard breaks and most spam them forever. You can normally light attack punish them with proper timing though.
But as someone who uses shield classes all the time, it's really hard to get through that defense otherwise.
Probably the worst feeling class to play against in the game is a good conqueror. Block into Heavy into shield bash into heavy into shield bash etc and you never get to do anything.
That said, I was quite proud in one fight, where it was 2vs3. 2 of the other guys were attacking me, but I managed to do a significant amount of blocking (as the Vanguard Knight), and held them up long enough for my team mate to come behind them and cause them to panic and run away.
I didn't realise there was another tutorial, so I'll hopefully get a chance to try that tonight and learn a few more things, such as cancelling hard strikes.
We're gonna guard break. . . a lot. It is like 80% of our damage.
Nobushi are my kryptonite. People with shields coming in second.
When you start getting stabbed you can block the shivs. I've no clue how, but a few people have been able to block all three of my shivs before. I was probably as surprised as they were.
Don't let me get close to you. Some classes might not have a choice (nature of the beast and all), but most have weapons with reach. What I mean is many classes can strike me long before I get close enough to guard break.
As far as countering a guard break, eh I dunno. I don't think it is as nearly as hard as people convince themselves it is. I've been countered plenty of times. Hell I remember one particularly annoying duel where the guy countered every damn one of my guard breaks. It was disheartening.
As mentioned before, punish us with light attacks. A heavy attack usually gets you three shivs to the gut.
If a Peacekeeper misses a guard break, capitalize on it. Depending on what class you are we might have just handed you victory.
Charging in at us like a madman can be really effective, provided you know your move sets. If you come in all button mashey you're gonna get three shivs to the gut.
I foresee the Lawbringer being another thorn in my side.
I've no clue what triggers it, but I know it can trigger for all three or just two or just one. In any order.
Ive managed to break out after one stab, but I'm not sure how. The orochi guard break double hit is much worse to me
The three stabs aren't guaranteed. It requires the keeper to input them so if they muff it you won't eat all three
Maybe I should stop using him, because his light attacks aren't quick enough to stop most guardbreaks and he doesn't have any other cheese like the popular classes seem to have now. Dodging is also useless for the Conqueror.
Hiryu Zerotwo
Chicago Megagame group
Watch me struggle to learn streaming! Point and laugh!
http://steamcommunity.com/id/pablocampy
I am not sure how class or matchup dependent it is but standard parries seem... bad? Maybe it's just on who I've been playing but the animations are long enough and push the enemy back far enough that following seemed always blockable. At which point why do I risk parrying an attack outside of stopping a berserker chain, I guess.
Exceptions for the shield classes with their light parries with garaunteed follow ups. But overall deflect dodging seems far superior.
It doubles the stamina drain for the block and can push them closer to a wall. Which is a huge advantage for most classes.