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The [chat] Who Circumnavigated Fairyland

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    IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator Mod Emeritus
    Bam, first schoolism class review http://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/comment/33377672/#Comment_33377672

    I finished watching all the videos yesterday. I've started sketching for the course but I haven't produced much that's worthy of getting crits on, I'm still working on the issues I can see immediately on my own. I'll probably stay in the class for about a month, working at my own versions of the assignments when I can and re watching the videos, but think that my thoughts there probably wont change.

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    gavindelgavindel The reason all your software is brokenRegistered User regular
    I've been thinking about my review of Watts the last couple days, and honestly don't think I can give an unbiased look. The entire project is too tied into my largely negative feelings about art right now. I'm not having fun doing these fundamentals, generally feel downer on the whole thing, and push forward mostly by sheer will. Then I submit an assignment to the Watts online and fail twice.

    At the same time, blindly drawing hasn't done jack (as my 262 "year of drawing 2013" pictures show), and the online school has structure in spades for everything from how to hold your pencil to how to angle your model shots. As much as some of the other forums I frequent crap on the Watts style as being sterile, you can always tell what you're looking at.

    Book - Royal road - Free! Seraphim === TTRPG - Wuxia - Free! Seln Alora
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    JarsJars Registered User regular
    it's amazing how thin the line between smiling and happy to psychotic is

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    IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator Mod Emeritus
    @gavindel I dont think you need to write an "unbiased" review. Someone may still gain insight from your experience.

    I imagine alot of people choose to try watts in a state of frustration, you are investing in your fundamentals, its not often easy.

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    miscellaneousinsanitymiscellaneousinsanity grass grows, birds fly, sun shines, and brother, i hurt peopleRegistered User regular
    glen keane!

    uc3ufTB.png
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    GrifterGrifter BermudaModerator mod
    Dude...this guy is insanely good.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MGbvhyTZXfs

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    m3nacem3nace Registered User regular
    You guys, Antonio Banderas is going to fashion school to bring back capes! Godspeed senor Banderas, godspeed.

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    IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator Mod Emeritus
    I somehow dont think capes are gone because no one has tried to bring them back, but maybe Im wrong.

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    m3nacem3nace Registered User regular
    edited September 2015
    We just need to see more people rocking them well, like this guy

    jaime-de-marichalar-acudio-del-brazo-de-una-amiga-gtres.jpg
    as opposed to, well
    30627f3ea19ca8375c565d1ce5a3131c.jpg
    edit: bonus, my spirit animal is this dude:
    tumblr_nult9g49UV1rtynt1o1_1280.jpg

    m3nace on
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    IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator Mod Emeritus
    I think that if its as classy as that, it's fair game already. There are kind of different levels of "in fashion" for me though. Like are normal people going to wear a cape as a coat, or is only "guy whose whole wardrobe consists of suits" going to wear it? There are womens coats that are more cloak/cape like
    https://www.pinterest.com/pin/494059021595557614/

    You still need to dress up reasonably to pull something like that off, but then people make sweater/poncho type ones that can still be worn with jeans:
    https://www.pinterest.com/pin/153052087308402445/

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    EncEnc A Fool with Compassion Pronouns: He, Him, HisRegistered User regular
    Iruka wrote: »
    I somehow dont think capes are gone because no one has tried to bring them back, but maybe Im wrong.

    I would wear a cape in a heartbeat.

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    IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator Mod Emeritus
    edited September 2015
    If that were entirely true you'd be wearing one now, You can totally buy a cape somewhere on the internet right this second

    Iruka on
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    m3nacem3nace Registered User regular
    edited September 2015
    I am the owner of two capes, one of which is made from the same pattern as Frodo's. I love wearing it, but won't walk around in the city with it. If I still lived in the countryside, I would rock the shit out of it on a daily basis. I think I need something more casual, like the ww1 capes:zz14_zps0a81ef7d.jpg[/URL]

    m3nace on
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    Angel_of_BaconAngel_of_Bacon Moderator Mod Emeritus
    Iruka wrote: »
    Like are normal people going to wear a cape as a coat, or is only "guy whose whole wardrobe consists of suits" going to wear it?

    Antonio Banderas is going to wear it and be able to get away with it, because he is Antonio Banderas.
    Women can also probably get away with it, because there is some value placed in women's fashion on unique and interesting styles.
    Non-Antonio Banderas men will not wear it and continue to perpetuate that the premise that the apex of male fashion is achieving maximum homogeny.

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    IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator Mod Emeritus
    Well, this is also heavily climate dependant. I mean, I've seen some men in cold cities with more fashionable and non-standard coat choices, but those aren't going to really fly in areas where outerwear is optional for 90% of the year. If you wear a coat a lot, you'll want it to be more interesting. Though the other extreme is when it gets to a certain level of cold as shit, you no longer care about what the coat looks like and design becomes utilitarian. Anyone who thinks their northface jacket looks good, for instance, probably lives in a city that's two shades too cold.

    That being said, apparently jeans are in noticeable decline thanks to yoga pants, so I'm sure anything is possible.

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    EncEnc A Fool with Compassion Pronouns: He, Him, HisRegistered User regular
    Enc wrote: »
    Iruka wrote: »
    I somehow dont think capes are gone because no one has tried to bring them back, but maybe Im wrong.

    I would wear a cape in a heartbeat.

    I live in Florida though. If I lived in a more temperate or cold environment you can believe I would have a victorian cape for winter.

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    FlayFlay Registered User regular
    edited September 2015
    I feel like you can start to break the fashion mould once you know the rules, and I can imagine how a guy could wear a cape and look pretty fine, but I can't find the right example. Women can definitely wear them and look pretty normal:

    sqiMi0v.jpg



    Tights can look bitchin though, if only I had the wardrobe to pull them off when I'm not out for a run.

    I9aYMDj.png

    Flay on
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    Angel_of_BaconAngel_of_Bacon Moderator Mod Emeritus
    edited September 2015
    Flay wrote: »
    I9aYMDj.png

    This is why watching your tangents is important people- I can't stop seeing orange guy's elbow as being in front of purple tights guy's butt, making orange guy look weirdly tiny.

    EDIT: Maaaan. As someone who has enjoyed a lot of the Metal Gear Solid games, it kinda bums me out that I keep finding new reasons to never ever play MGS5.
    First, I don't have a PS4. Eh, maybe it'll be fine on my PC.
    Then, Konami turns out to have an insane corporate culture that I don't want to support with my dollars. Eh, maybe wait until I can buy it used?
    Now I find out that it's full of really gross sexism with its mute bikini sniper character, that I also don't want to support.

    Why'd everyone behind this game have to turn out to be creeps and jerks. Why can't I just play a fun game for fun times without making the world a slightly shitter place in the process.

    Angel_of_Bacon on
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    MagicToasterMagicToaster JapanRegistered User regular
    I remember Kojima talking about that there was a practical reason why she was dressed like that. You'd find out when you play the game but he didn't want to give it away. I stared at the TV and thought, does this man actually believe this?

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    ChicoBlueChicoBlue Registered User regular
    Kojima has never depicted women well, so I don't know why anyone would even give that credence.

    Any "strong women" in the MGS games are pretty much Kate Beaton's Strong Female Characters, only not in any way satirical, because he is a 14 year old boy.

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    Angel_of_BaconAngel_of_Bacon Moderator Mod Emeritus
    edited September 2015
    I remember Kojima talking about that there was a practical reason why she was dressed like that. You'd find out when you play the game but he didn't want to give it away. I stared at the TV and thought, does this man actually believe this?

    The reason is that apparently having exposed skin gives her superpowers.
    And she breathes through her skin or something.
    So if she wears actual clothes, she suffocates.

    Kojima, this is not a documentary about someone with a rare skin condition that has to dress like that out of some kind of medical necessity.
    This is a bunch of bullshit you made up.
    That is the part that makes it gross.
    Jumping through hoops to try to justify it does not make it less gross, because again- you made all this shit up. You could have done anything, and you chose to do that.

    I think I'd have preferred it if he gave no explanation- it'd still be awful, but at least it wouldn't be awful and insult my intelligence by implying that I'm dumb enough to buy this shit for one second.
    ChicoBlue wrote: »
    Kojima has never depicted women well, so I don't know why anyone would even give that credence.

    Any "strong women" in the MGS games are pretty much Kate Beaton's Strong Female Characters, only not in any way satirical, because he is a 14 year old boy.

    I mean I agree- but for the first 2 games at least, the sexism was mostly on the 'standard for the industry' level (which is still terrible, don't get me wrong)- this is some next level shit out of like a Heavy Metal magazine or something.

    Angel_of_Bacon on
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    IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator Mod Emeritus
    MGS is one of those things that I sorta accepted I'm not going to understand, but I'll always feel like I missed a little part of game history. Then I hear about the plot, or hear someone attempt to explain the plot, and I'm not sure its that big of a deal that I missed that series entirely.

    I feel like I may enjoy it, if I look at the whole game and the process of developing it as some goofy, over the top, performance art that cost a few mil to make.

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    ProjeckProjeck Registered User regular
    MGS is absolutely problematic, but a genuine piece of art none the less. haven't played the new game, but MGS3 is greatest of all time.

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    Angel_of_BaconAngel_of_Bacon Moderator Mod Emeritus
    edited September 2015
    Iruka wrote: »
    MGS is one of those things that I sorta accepted I'm not going to understand, but I'll always feel like I missed a little part of game history. Then I hear about the plot, or hear someone attempt to explain the plot, and I'm not sure its that big of a deal that I missed that series entirely.

    I feel like I may enjoy it, if I look at the whole game and the process of developing it as some goofy, over the top, performance art that cost a few mil to make.

    Well yeah, that is kinda the appeal- it's a big blockbuster high-budget series, that is at the same time totally insaneo-balls nutso.

    So even though the controls are usually weird or backwards or there's cutscenes that are 3 hours long or portrays in all seriousness a hysterical lack of understanding of basic genetics or whatever, it has a lot of personality and fun goofiness that most other game franchises lack- which is why it's stuck around and kinda become part of pop culture, when so many other games that may have better mechanics and sounder logic proven out by committees of people, tend to slide right off the brain like a water in a teflon pan.

    I know from my own experience that often I, or someone else will make a comment like, "Wouldn't it be funny if we put __________ in the game?", and everyone will laugh for a few minutes, and then that idea will be forgotten about. Playing the MGS games, you get the feeling the response is, "Yes, that WOULD be awesome, go put it in the game right now." Alligator hat disguise? A ridiculous conversation about a snake-shaped spy gun? A boss fight where it tricks the player into thinking their TV is fucking up? Put that shit in there! You're not going to get that sort of thing from your Splinter Cells or Calls of Duties, or anything else that's got a similar budget. Half the fun is just looking at the screen in absolute bewilderment, and just shouting, "WHAT?!?!".

    Unfortunately this kind of wonderful lack of restraint also means that along with all those fun things, it also apparently means nobody's stepping in and saying "NO" in regards certain things, like the aforementioned mute nudity-powered bikini sniper, or spending 20 minutes of cutscene time on a small child that sucks at cooking eggs.

    If you don't want to play it, it's the kind of game you can probably enjoy just as much just sitting and watching someone else play, and have them show you all the goofy shit in it.

    Angel_of_Bacon on
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    tynictynic PICNIC BADASS Registered User, ClubPA regular
    20 minutes of cutscene time on a small child that sucks at cooking eggs.

    now THIS sounds like my kind of game.

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    IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator Mod Emeritus
    I gotta admit, that is intriguing

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    MagicToasterMagicToaster JapanRegistered User regular
    edited September 2015
    What if that was a mini game? You have to cook the eggs in order to nourish Snake.

    MagicToaster on
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    Angel_of_BaconAngel_of_Bacon Moderator Mod Emeritus
    What if that was a mini game? You have to cook the eggs in order to nourish Snake.

    That would be far too obvious and make too much sense for a MGS game.

    The actual mini-game of these cutscenes, of course, is being able to wheel around a tiny remote control bipedal robot around the interior of an airplane's cargo hold, and collect batteries/other objects. You can also just repeatedly slam it into the shins of all the characters whose dialogue you are ignoring at the moment if you so wish.

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    WassermeloneWassermelone Registered User regular
    Man, I've never come across a new artist that I've fallen in love with quicker:
    https://www.facebook.com/MrConcept-Art-918997474804759/timeline/?ref=ts

    Best new concept artist of the decade?/

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    tapeslingertapeslinger Space Unicorn Slush Ranger Social Justice Rebel ScumRegistered User regular
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    m3nacem3nace Registered User regular
    edited September 2015
    Just came up with one of those stories that basically write themselves, again. So far it's called "I would tell you but then I'd have to kill you."

    m3nace on
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    m3nacem3nace Registered User regular
    It features a James Bond type of guy who's been traumatized by all the Bond girls dying. I think maybe the idea originated sometime in this forum? It's been gestating for a while but it just clicked now.

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    FlayFlay Registered User regular
    edited September 2015
    If you want to catch up on MGS, this guy does a really good series that condenses the games as much as possible without abridging them. There's only so much mechanical weirdness they can capture though.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MeYbHWQrM9A

    For 5, you only need to know 3, Peace Walker and Ground Zeroes, but things will be more relevant if you see 1, 2 and 4 also.

    Flay on
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    gavindelgavindel The reason all your software is brokenRegistered User regular
    Man, I've never come across a new artist that I've fallen in love with quicker:
    https://www.facebook.com/MrConcept-Art-918997474804759/timeline/?ref=ts

    Best new concept artist of the decade?/

    I have completely missed the joke here. It left a contrail, and I contemplate the high silver crystals of their humor in confusion like Florida Man at Walmart.

    Book - Royal road - Free! Seraphim === TTRPG - Wuxia - Free! Seln Alora
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    KallistiKallisti Registered User regular
    Sons of liberty and Snake eater were my faves, after that it felt like it was starting to wallow in its own nonsense. Sons of liberty it was the sheer weirdness I loved, along with the graphics, and snake eater it was all the interesting boss battles, so many boss battles, one where you're just slowly walking down a river and all the people you've killed in the past come back to haunt you while you're swatting them away. The final battle in the game was really cool, really gorgeous. A lot of cool cinematic moments in that game, the 2 minute long climbing ladder scene comes to mind. That battle with The End was probly one of the best boss fights in gaming that I've played, a sniper fight, it was so goddamn hard, but very cool.

    While a part of me is use to and aware of the ridiculous manner women are treated from his previous games, another part of me says 'When will you stop treating women like disposable tissues?' I see this more as a reflection on Kojima and just how out of touch he is. It's awkward and uncomfortable, it's really not sexy whatsoever, it's almost like the characters in the game don't even understand why this is happening. The camera becomes this weird misogynistic asshole around her, it's like Creeper Simulator 2015, it's a poor and unnecessary addition to an already great game. It's a lot of fun. I've exclaimed 'holy shit' on a few different occasions. It's also very cooky and silly, it's gorgeous to look at, but there's a little bit of shit in there too.

    I'm really glad that this dialogue is happening though, I think if this were 1990 for example, media probly wouldn't bat an eyelash or say something along the lines of what did you expect? Or, what's the harm? Some kind of unacceptable tripe.

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    KallistiKallisti Registered User regular
    il_570xN.306028042.jpg

    I got a ww2 nurse's cape like this one last spring for a steal. I fully intend on wearing it this fall when it starts to get cooler. It's wool and super warm, heavy, comes down to my knees. I kinda want a beret too? But, we'll see.
    m3nace wrote: »
    I am the owner of two capes, one of which is made from the same pattern as Frodo's. I love wearing it, but won't walk around in the city with it. If I still lived in the countryside, I would rock the shit out of it on a daily basis. I think I need something more casual, like the ww1 capes:

    Totally, you should do it, fashion should be fun, rock that shit. Maybe something darker like navy would make it more casual too.

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    m3nacem3nace Registered User regular
    edited September 2015
    Digging through my diary can be a goldmine of sentences yet to be used in a novel:
    "Whenever he trips over something, my father's first thoughts are never of survival, but of insurance."

    m3nace on
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    WassermeloneWassermelone Registered User regular
    gavindel wrote: »
    Man, I've never come across a new artist that I've fallen in love with quicker:
    https://www.facebook.com/MrConcept-Art-918997474804759/timeline/?ref=ts

    Best new concept artist of the decade?/

    I have completely missed the joke here. It left a contrail, and I contemplate the high silver crystals of their humor in confusion like Florida Man at Walmart.

    Its poking fun at a concept art trend that consist almost entirely of photobashing, some color correction, and chromatic aberration :P

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    IrukaIruka Registered User, Moderator Mod Emeritus
    That facebook is amazing

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    JarsJars Registered User regular
    getting back into it after an *ahem* hiatus of playing video games refocusing. first bad habit I'm trying to break: drawing with my wrist instead of my arm

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