admanbunionize your workplaceSeattle, WARegistered Userregular
If what you mean is that you only do 60g quests and reroll all 40s until your quest log fills up then sure, but unless you're a real lucky fucker there's no way you only do 40g quests.
And the addition of 50g quests will very likely still increase your overall gold income.
If what you mean is that you only do 60g quests and reroll all 40s until your quest log fills up then sure, but unless you're a real lucky fucker there's no way you only do 40g quests.
And the addition of 50g quests will very likely still increase your overall gold income.
I mean like at least 75% of the time I am only doing 60g+ quests or the pack quest.
If what you mean is that you only do 60g quests and reroll all 40s until your quest log fills up then sure, but unless you're a real lucky fucker there's no way you only do 40g quests.
And the addition of 50g quests will very likely still increase your overall gold income.
I mean like at least 75% of the time I am only doing 60g+ quests or the pack quest.
That still sounds pretty lucky, but it's believable.
Regardless, you'll still make more gold with these 50g quests in the pool.
The odds of getting any particular quest aren't equal, guys.
They aren't? I thought they are.
No. That's why you get way more 40g quests than 60g quests, and why Total Victory is very rare.
But there are more 40g quests than 60g quests.
And Total Victory is (or feels) rare because it's one of 26 (currently) possible quests. If quests are all equally likely and you never reroll quests you'll get it on average about once a month.
+1
admanbunionize your workplaceSeattle, WARegistered Userregular
I'm not arguing that it was fair, I'm just saying that even in that situation Trump had a way to play that could've won the game, failed to do that, and was punished for it. Too much of the narrative surrounding Patron consists of "well, there was nothing I/they could do" when it's objectively false.
nah man, i'm not arguing that there are better plays or perhaps decks that can be built to stop it.
I'm saying blizzard has stated one of their goals is to prevent OTK combos - they don't like them and feel they go against the nature of the game. What I witnessed is reliable OTK combo that puts the past ones to shame. Being able to deal 50 damage with 10 mana is bonkers levels of efficiency.
Anyone done the pre-order? I guess it comes out to a buck a pack so it seems like a no brainer if you're into any of the cards on display.
A lot of people have done it.
+4
Idx86Long days and pleasant nights.Registered Userregular
I have 1600'ish gold on hand and will continue to hoard gold until release. I also plan on buying another $10 worth of packs to get started. I'm sure we'll get a free Arena run as well when it debuts.
2008, 2012, 2014 D&D "Rare With No Sauce" League Fantasy Football Champion!
Ok honestly for a long time I have felt that every quest is equally likely. edit: but I guess I'm wrong. See below.
Right now there are 26 quests.
15 are worth 40g
9 are worth 60g
2 are worth 100g or equivalent (total victory and spectate)
If quests are equally likely then the expected value of a single quest is 51.54g. So adding ten 50g quests would slightly reduce the average quest reward (to 51.11g, to be precise).
A simple expected value analysis reveals that if you are attempting to maximize your gold intake over time it will still make sense to reroll anything that isn't a 60g or better quest after taking care of all 60g and 100g quests you currently have active. If you reroll a 50g quest with no other quest active you will only have a 31% chance of getting something better-in fact you will have a higher chance of trading down than trading up-but the rewards for trading up are large enough to make it worth it over time.
It's impossible to reroll a quest into itself or into any other currently active quests.
If you have no other active quests:
-Right now the odds of trading up on a quest you'd want to reroll (40g quests only) are 11/25 = 44%.
-After adding these 50g quests, the odds of trading up on a quest you'd want to reroll will be 60% if you reroll a 40g quest, or 31% if you reroll a 50g quest. Weighting these odds by the odds of encountering a 40g or 50g quest to begin with, if you commit to rerolling any 40 or 50g quest, the odds of trading up are 49%, which isn't bad, but of course a significant percentage of that time you're trading up from a 40g quest to a still-below-average 50g quest.
Again all of this analysis is predicated on the idea that every quest is equally likely to appear.
So, again, assuming 50g quests are reducing your chance of getting 40g quests rather then your chance of getting 60g quests, you'll get more gold.
This is the first I've heard of this. I'm looking into it now. Edit: Ok, having done the stats, assuming there is no limit to the number of times you could theoretically roll any given quest in a day, that data pretty conclusively destroys the hypothesis that the quests are equally distributed. (This was back when there were 25 quests, only one of which was worth 100g. This data is enough to reject the hypothesis that the probability of the 100g quest was 1/25, the probability of a 60g quest was 9/25, and the probability of a 40g test was 15/25.)
So, again, assuming 50g quests are reducing your chance of getting 40g quests rather then your chance of getting 60g quests, you'll get more gold.
I believe there's also a limit to how often you're allowed to get the 100g quest (once a week?), although you'd have to be pretty lucky to get it even that often. At least now that the inifinite reroll bug is fixed.
0
admanbunionize your workplaceSeattle, WARegistered Userregular
I'm saying blizzard has stated one of their goals is to prevent OTK combos - they don't like them and feel they go against the nature of the game. What I witnessed is reliable OTK combo that puts the past ones to shame. Being able to deal 50 damage with 10 mana is bonkers levels of efficiency.
If Blizzard wants to inhibit the consistent existence of OTK combos, they're going to need to drastically rethink their game. Selective mulligans, no hand disruption, and small deck size (with redundant parts) all heavily contribute to the efficacy of such decks. And of course (in this particular circumstance) Warrior has some of the most efficient card draw to boot.
I'm sure deck size is an untouchable design choice, but they really should consider some form of hand disruption, though I feel they've made statements saying that's not an element they want in the game.
Ragnaros is probably the best arena card in the game. If you dislike RNG, KT is also very strong but requires you to be at least even going into his turn. Since your turn 7 will probably be 5 drop + hero power I'm not sure you can guarantee the value.
Ragnaros is probably the best arena card in the game. If you dislike RNG, KT is also very strong but requires you to be at least even going into his turn. Since your turn 7 will probably be 5 drop + hero power I'm not sure you can guarantee the value.
I mean, I agree that Rag the best choice here, imo it's very close with Ony.
But I don't know if he is even in the top 10 for all arena cards. For legendaries, I'd pick Tirion, Neptulon, Boom, MalGanis and Sylvanas over him. Maybe Voljin, too
Non legendaries are harder to compare because you never get the draft choice, but there are cards like Flamestrike, Highmane or Fire Elemental just off the top of my head.
If you want to defer to "experts", then in the Heartharena tier list Rag is the 6th best card for Priest, tied with Baron Geddon:
#1: Boom (130)
#2: Cabal Shadow Priest (120, but second pick has lower value)
#3: Voljin, Ony, Deathwing (100)
#6: Rag, Geddon (92)
Never have I seen the foot in the door phenomenon utilized to bring me to the point of despair as in this game.
I can't quit now! not after all of this effort I've spent, not after all of this time!
Innkeeper: "well ya know what ya must do lad! spend money! spend all yer' fuckin' money!"
League of Legends: DingusSquatfurd
B.net: Squatfurd#1814
God, but then what card will I get rid of? My Southsea Deckhand? Oh sure, he probably has no place in a mech rogue deck, but I love his "haHA!" so much. Ah, you've saved me from so many face hunters and started so many combos, good buddy. But I think it's time for you to go until I can create a pirate deck. . . .but then who will be surprised when I play you?
I need a moment.
Southsea Deckhand is a pretty common one-of in Oil Rogue. Not an auto-include, but he's arguably the best and most reliable Oil target in the game. He was pretty central to my Pirate Rogue right after GvG hit, which was basically proto-Oil Rogue before Oil Rogue was a thing.
Yup he's a pretty fun little combo card if you're sitting on the oil/flurry.
It depends on whether your average quest gives more or less than 50g
I would think it would be less than 50g (which makes it good)
this actually makes the "standard" win 3 quests worth 60, and the 60 gold quests are worth 76.67 gold. So its actually making it more valued to do these shorter and more mobile friendly quests. I think blizzard is at the point of recognizing just how popular the game is on phone; and are trying to find a new sweet spot for increasing gold earned versus the time placed into it. Allowing your hardcore pc players to continue to make gold at a rate that's better than a casual; while allowing casual players who only log on to do quests to basically hit 2 quests in a row and have a pack; or they'll be able to do 2 quests and win a handful of games to get into the arena.
VO_TIRION_INTRO_02 - Prepare yourself, for a day of the most impressive jousting, eye-popping sideshows, and the mightiest combat you've ever encountered! VO_TIRION_INTRO_02.wav
VO_TIRION_INTRO_03 - Which of our valiant knights will be named Champion today?
Maybe it's just an intro to the special brawl, maybe something else?
VO_TIRION_INTRO_02 - Prepare yourself, for a day of the most impressive jousting, eye-popping sideshows, and the mightiest combat you've ever encountered! VO_TIRION_INTRO_02.wav
VO_TIRION_INTRO_03 - Which of our valiant knights will be named Champion today?
Maybe it's just an intro to the special brawl, maybe something else?
Maybe its what is said when a joust occurs?
Stercus, Stercus, Stercus, Morituri Sum
0
lwt1973King of ThievesSyndicationRegistered Userregular
Co-op mode?
VO_HRW_TEST_00 – I will cleanse you both of the Curse of Flesh!
VO_HRW_TEST_01 – Well done! You’ve defeated the boss together.\n\nBoth players win!
VO_HRW_TEST_02 – Defeat Gearmaster Mechazod together to win!
VO_HRW_TEST_ABILITY_03 – Damaging all other characters.
VO_HRW_TEST_ABILITY_05 – Dealing damage to both heroes.
"He's sulking in his tent like Achilles! It's the Iliad?...from Homer?! READ A BOOK!!" -Handy
So, I've been playing around with this deck I saw on reddit (with Emperor Thurissan and a second Loot Hoarder subbed in for Dr. Boom and Bloodmage Thalnos, respectively, because I don't have either of them). The win condition is some minion on the board (typically Stranglethorn Tiger) and/or Arcane Golem + Windfury + any combination of Rockbiter, Abusive Sergeant, and Flametongue Totem. Crackle as needed.
I'm pretty sure I need to rename this deck "Math Shaman", or perhaps "Shamath", because every turn once you get the first couple of combo pieces is "Can I kill him yet? How about next turn?". I just got a ridiculous win where I burst for 28 damage, exact lethal:
1) Stealthed Stranglethorn Tiger and Amani Berserker (from Piloted Shredder) on the board.
2) Drop Flametongue Totem between them, Abusive Sergeant and Windfury on the tiger, attack with both => 2*(5 + 2 + 2) + (2 + 2) = 22 damage
3) Drop Arcane Golem next to the totem, go for the face => 6 damage
total) 8 mana, 28 damage; exact mana I had, exact health they had
It took me so long to figure out the play that the rope actually started burning by the time I started laying out the combo; I wasn't sure that my golem would come through. And I even miscounted the damage! In my rush, my mental math came out 2 points short, and I thought I'd have to Crackle him the next turn. I kind of feel bad about the play, but they Unstable Portaled TWO Iron Juggernauts, so whatever.
The hardest part so far is determining when it's necessary to use up combo pieces as removal. They dropped a Mechwarper on turn 2, and I felt completely justified in Rockbitering it, but sometimes it's less clear. I used a windfuried tiger the other day to take out a taunt and some minor threat; it meant exposing my tiger to removal, but I needed the taunt gone, and I felt like the "minor threat" could grow to be a bigger issue.
0
3cl1ps3I will build a labyrinth to house the cheeseRegistered Userregular
edited August 2015
The Living Roots tokens are the cutest thing in the world.
In game already? I thought they came at the end of the season?
You can't open them, but you have your max ranked rank and the correspondong chest in your quest log. This means, I think, that your current rank is now recorded and even if you fall you will still get the reward.
Posts
And the addition of 50g quests will very likely still increase your overall gold income.
I mean like at least 75% of the time I am only doing 60g+ quests or the pack quest.
That still sounds pretty lucky, but it's believable.
Regardless, you'll still make more gold with these 50g quests in the pool.
But there are more 40g quests than 60g quests.
And Total Victory is (or feels) rare because it's one of 26 (currently) possible quests. If quests are all equally likely and you never reroll quests you'll get it on average about once a month.
So, again, assuming 50g quests are reducing your chance of getting 40g quests rather then your chance of getting 60g quests, you'll get more gold.
nah man, i'm not arguing that there are better plays or perhaps decks that can be built to stop it.
I'm saying blizzard has stated one of their goals is to prevent OTK combos - they don't like them and feel they go against the nature of the game. What I witnessed is reliable OTK combo that puts the past ones to shame. Being able to deal 50 damage with 10 mana is bonkers levels of efficiency.
A lot of people have done it.
2008, 2012, 2014 D&D "Rare With No Sauce" League Fantasy Football Champion!
Right now there are 26 quests.
15 are worth 40g
9 are worth 60g
2 are worth 100g or equivalent (total victory and spectate)
If quests are equally likely then the expected value of a single quest is 51.54g. So adding ten 50g quests would slightly reduce the average quest reward (to 51.11g, to be precise).
A simple expected value analysis reveals that if you are attempting to maximize your gold intake over time it will still make sense to reroll anything that isn't a 60g or better quest after taking care of all 60g and 100g quests you currently have active. If you reroll a 50g quest with no other quest active you will only have a 31% chance of getting something better-in fact you will have a higher chance of trading down than trading up-but the rewards for trading up are large enough to make it worth it over time.
It's impossible to reroll a quest into itself or into any other currently active quests.
If you have no other active quests:
-Right now the odds of trading up on a quest you'd want to reroll (40g quests only) are 11/25 = 44%.
-After adding these 50g quests, the odds of trading up on a quest you'd want to reroll will be 60% if you reroll a 40g quest, or 31% if you reroll a 50g quest. Weighting these odds by the odds of encountering a 40g or 50g quest to begin with, if you commit to rerolling any 40 or 50g quest, the odds of trading up are 49%, which isn't bad, but of course a significant percentage of that time you're trading up from a 40g quest to a still-below-average 50g quest.
Again all of this analysis is predicated on the idea that every quest is equally likely to appear.
This is the first I've heard of this. I'm looking into it now. Edit: Ok, having done the stats, assuming there is no limit to the number of times you could theoretically roll any given quest in a day, that data pretty conclusively destroys the hypothesis that the quests are equally distributed. (This was back when there were 25 quests, only one of which was worth 100g. This data is enough to reject the hypothesis that the probability of the 100g quest was 1/25, the probability of a 60g quest was 9/25, and the probability of a 40g test was 15/25.)
I believe there's also a limit to how often you're allowed to get the 100g quest (once a week?), although you'd have to be pretty lucky to get it even that often. At least now that the inifinite reroll bug is fixed.
I did it, and I'm saving gold for it.
TGT would have to really shit the bed for it to not be worth it (relative to buying Hearthstone cards in general, obviously).
BLING BLING!
If Blizzard wants to inhibit the consistent existence of OTK combos, they're going to need to drastically rethink their game. Selective mulligans, no hand disruption, and small deck size (with redundant parts) all heavily contribute to the efficacy of such decks. And of course (in this particular circumstance) Warrior has some of the most efficient card draw to boot.
I'm sure deck size is an untouchable design choice, but they really should consider some form of hand disruption, though I feel they've made statements saying that's not an element they want in the game.
There's no way waiting to have all 60's is faster than just waiting to have any 3. Unless you're lucky enough you should be buying lotto tickets.
What should I take?
I mean, I agree that Rag the best choice here, imo it's very close with Ony.
But I don't know if he is even in the top 10 for all arena cards. For legendaries, I'd pick Tirion, Neptulon, Boom, MalGanis and Sylvanas over him. Maybe Voljin, too
Non legendaries are harder to compare because you never get the draft choice, but there are cards like Flamestrike, Highmane or Fire Elemental just off the top of my head.
If you want to defer to "experts", then in the Heartharena tier list Rag is the 6th best card for Priest, tied with Baron Geddon:
#1: Boom (130)
#2: Cabal Shadow Priest (120, but second pick has lower value)
#3: Voljin, Ony, Deathwing (100)
#6: Rag, Geddon (92)
I can't quit now! not after all of this effort I've spent, not after all of this time!
Innkeeper: "well ya know what ya must do lad! spend money! spend all yer' fuckin' money!"
B.net: Squatfurd#1814
Yup he's a pretty fun little combo card if you're sitting on the oil/flurry.
this actually makes the "standard" win 3 quests worth 60, and the 60 gold quests are worth 76.67 gold. So its actually making it more valued to do these shorter and more mobile friendly quests. I think blizzard is at the point of recognizing just how popular the game is on phone; and are trying to find a new sweet spot for increasing gold earned versus the time placed into it. Allowing your hardcore pc players to continue to make gold at a rate that's better than a casual; while allowing casual players who only log on to do quests to basically hit 2 quests in a row and have a pack; or they'll be able to do 2 quests and win a handful of games to get into the arena.
http://www.hearthpwn.com/news/1011-the-grand-tournament-patch-animated-cards
I am curious about this:
Maybe it's just an intro to the special brawl, maybe something else?
Maybe its what is said when a joust occurs?
VO_HRW_TEST_00 – I will cleanse you both of the Curse of Flesh!
VO_HRW_TEST_01 – Well done! You’ve defeated the boss together.\n\nBoth players win!
VO_HRW_TEST_02 – Defeat Gearmaster Mechazod together to win!
VO_HRW_TEST_ABILITY_03 – Damaging all other characters.
VO_HRW_TEST_ABILITY_05 – Dealing damage to both heroes.
I'm pretty sure I need to rename this deck "Math Shaman", or perhaps "Shamath", because every turn once you get the first couple of combo pieces is "Can I kill him yet? How about next turn?". I just got a ridiculous win where I burst for 28 damage, exact lethal:
1) Stealthed Stranglethorn Tiger and Amani Berserker (from Piloted Shredder) on the board.
2) Drop Flametongue Totem between them, Abusive Sergeant and Windfury on the tiger, attack with both => 2*(5 + 2 + 2) + (2 + 2) = 22 damage
3) Drop Arcane Golem next to the totem, go for the face => 6 damage
total) 8 mana, 28 damage; exact mana I had, exact health they had
It took me so long to figure out the play that the rope actually started burning by the time I started laying out the combo; I wasn't sure that my golem would come through. And I even miscounted the damage! In my rush, my mental math came out 2 points short, and I thought I'd have to Crackle him the next turn. I kind of feel bad about the play, but they Unstable Portaled TWO Iron Juggernauts, so whatever.
The hardest part so far is determining when it's necessary to use up combo pieces as removal. They dropped a Mechwarper on turn 2, and I felt completely justified in Rockbitering it, but sometimes it's less clear. I used a windfuried tiger the other day to take out a taunt and some minor threat; it meant exposing my tiger to removal, but I needed the taunt gone, and I felt like the "minor threat" could grow to be a bigger issue.
The Living Roots tokens are the cutest thing in the world.
hey maybe you could relax a little
TGT preview in Brawl tomorrow, and it's probably being fully released next week
Patience is hard
In game already? I thought they came at the end of the season?
You can't open them, but you have your max ranked rank and the correspondong chest in your quest log. This means, I think, that your current rank is now recorded and even if you fall you will still get the reward.