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Warhammer: Vermintide 2 - Winds of Magic launching the 13th of August!

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    Skull2185Skull2185 Registered User regular
    What does it mean when a weapon has "Illusion" in purple letters under the weapon name?

    Also the "premium edition" content is kind of a rip off... The skins are beyond lame. Kerillian's is the same exact skin as her default, except her shirt and cape turn gray. Oooooh so premium!

    Everyone has a price. Throw enough gold around and someone will risk disintegration.
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    General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    "Illusion" just means that the weapon has an alternate weapon skin. Once you acquire a weapon with an illusion for the first time, then you can modify existing weapons in the crafting menu to make use of that illusion.

    We've been griping about the cosmetics problems since launch day. The bogenboxes only contain a small selection of hats, and a few recolors of existing items. Character skins are replaced with "blue" skins, and weapon skins are identical to the vanilla skins for red weapons except the glowy blue lights are replaced with glowy purple lights. Personally I think that the purple looks nice on many of the weapons, but it's still a cheap cop-out.

    As for hats, they're too fucking rare. One hat per 100-200 hours of gameplay rare. A lot of the hats are garbage too, like bardin's helmet that's the same as the normal helmet except with no eyebrows.

    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
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    Skull2185Skull2185 Registered User regular
    I got a sweet orange rarity Shadow Mask for Kerillian, but it's only usable for the shade class, which I dont have yet :/

    I'm also a little confused about Hero Power. I assume it's similar to Destiny's Light Level/Power Level. Recruit difficulty says highest obtainable Hero Power is 100, but I'm at 148. Should I bump it up to Veteran now? Also, is there any reason to go beyond Veteran if I'm not a masochist? 300 appears to be the max Hero Power which sounds obtainable through Veteran.

    Everyone has a price. Throw enough gold around and someone will risk disintegration.
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    General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    edited February 2019
    I think hero power's dumb. It's some stat that influences your damage and cleave potential. It's provided by both character levels and gear power. Max hero power is 600, with 300 of that provided by character levels and 300 by your gear. I wouldn't worry about hero power too much during your climb up to gear with 300 power. Until you hit the cap, IMO you usually get more value from the attributes on the gear. Like bonus stamina, or curse resistance. Orange gear provides extra traits depending on the item. For example I'm fond of using the trait that refunds one arrow when you land a headshot. To hasten the hero power grind, you want to open as many chests as you can. Then scrap all of the gear that you don't need. Use that gear to craft items, it doesn't matter what kind. Once you've used all of your scrap to make items, then break down the gear into scrap again to repeat the process. That's the quickest way to get your item power up.




    Recruit is IMO an extension of the tutorial system. You should immediately advance to veteran the moment that you know the game's controls. Both recruit and vet are really boring though, so I recommend advancing to champion as soon as possible or at the latest once you unlock the temp health talents for a character at level 20. Once you start getting through maps fairly consistently with never dying, and only needing to maybe consume 0-2 healing items per game (topping off before the finale doesn't count), then you can probably dip your foot into the next highest difficulty from wherever you're currently playing.

    The higher difficulties provide greater XP rewards, so you'll level up faster. Also you'll unlock better chests that are more likely to have higher rarity gear. You need to advance to champion to have any chance at all of getting red gear, and even then only from generals and emperor's chests. Legend mode has a higher chance of dropping reds, and even merchant vaults from legend have better odds of dropping a red than champion Emperor's chests. Reds are desirable because they always have perfect stats. For example, if you want a charm with +10% infantry and +10% chaos damage, then you only need to keep rolling until you get chaos and infantry on the charm. To achieve the same feat with an orange you would need to roll both chaos/infantry AND roll high damage numbers. One more thing about loot is that your character's level plays a role in what you get. Low level characters get lower rarity loot, while high level ones get higher rarity loot more often. IIRC you need to be level 25 to start finding reds in the appropriate chests. This means that it would be a bad idea in general to open high difficulty chests on a low level character.


    Some quick new player tips:
    *Enable character outlines if you haven't already
    *Map jump and dodge to distinct controls. Context sensitivity is asking for death.
    *Dodging sideways is generally safer than dodging backwards.

    Here's a link to the collection of steam workshop mods that I use. https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1621004820
    They generally improve the UI and add good quality of life features to the game. I have the mods listed in my load order. Notable changes are the following:
    *Numeric UI to put actual numbers on the interface so that you can see precisely how much life and how many bullets that your teammates have
    *a friendly fire tally for the end of match scoreboard (champion has friendly fire on ranged attacks, and legend has more punish friendly fire)
    *Notice key pickup to put a text notification in the chat window when somebody picks up the keys that are needed to access certain grims.
    *Parry indicator to show you precisely what the parry frames are for weapons with parry
    *Chat block, which makes your character block when you open up a text window or check a settings page.

    All of the above work on the official realm. The below mods are useful on the modded realm.
    *Creature spawner lets you spawn or delete mobs. useful for practicing against certain enemies/bosses within the safety of the keep. I like spawning makeshift patrols and fighting those solo. You can also run through a quick match while deleting mobs every few seconds to take a peaceful stroll through the maps and learn the locations of the books and practice the various jumping puzzles.
    *Show damage shows you how much damage that you're inflicting
    *Item spawner lets you spawn bombs and potions. I like using it in conjunction with creature spawner to practice seeing how efficiently I can dispatch a patrol if I am in possession of a bomb or a potion.

    General_Armchair on
    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
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    Skull2185Skull2185 Registered User regular
    Well I'm having fun on recruit, but I'm also playing offline with bots. Recruit tricked me into thinking the bots were surprisingly competent, but bumping it to Veteran was a mistake... we got wrecked. Well I got wrecked and the bots decided to not revive me. I think I'll just stick with the two lower difficulties anyway, if all I miss out on is the highest tier gear that I wont need anyway. I'll grind out recruit a little more before trying Veteran again.

    Everyone has a price. Throw enough gold around and someone will risk disintegration.
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    MrBodyMrBody Registered User regular
    The bots are better than 75% of online players you'll run into.

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    General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    edited February 2019
    The bots can take care of themselves. They pay attention to their surroundings, they don't chase circles, and they stick together rather than overextend. That places then in a league above at least 75% if not 80+% of the players even at legend difficulty. They are also more adept at dodge tanking Roger than at least 95% of the legend playerbase.

    They're not good enough to carry you if you fuck up, but if you can carry your own weight then they can take care of themselves and there is little that can seriously threaten you. They can be overwhelmed when fighting boss+horde or patrol+horde, but a lot of players suck at that too.

    The principal downside of bots over average players is that they're WORTHLESS against chaos spawns and will constantly get grabbed. That and the game will end once the last flesh and blood player dies, rather than survivors having an opportunity to advance through the level and potentially rescue respawned players.


    It's also important to remember that bots use the career, gear, and talents of the last time that the host played that character. So if you're a one trick pony who's only ever played elf, then your bots are zero hero power, zero talent characters. To that end one of the most powerful bots to have on your team by a ludicrous degree is ranger veteran Bardin with the bomb drop talent. The bots will pick up bombs and give you one if you have none. So in essence you can expect to have four bombs in your inventory almost all of the time. Statistically five or more if you take the bomb dupe trait on your trinket. That's enough boom to solve a lot of problems. Potion drop can be good too, but mostly to keep a shade fed with purple pots. In a vacuum I think that bombs are better.

    General_Armchair on
    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
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    General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    edited February 2019
    Skull2185 wrote: »
    Well I'm having fun on recruit, but I'm also playing offline with bots. Recruit tricked me into thinking the bots were surprisingly competent, but bumping it to Veteran was a mistake... we got wrecked. Well I got wrecked and the bots decided to not revive me. I think I'll just stick with the two lower difficulties anyway, if all I miss out on is the highest tier gear that I wont need anyway. I'll grind out recruit a little more before trying Veteran again.

    Keep at it. Learn the ropes and start playing with people. Learn where all of the books are since they boost your loot and XP by quite a bit. Try to advance to the harder difficulties. Nothing is more satisfying than snatching victory from the jaws of defeat after your teammates all take a dirt nap. Things get more comfortable once you have orange gear and your power level stops fluctuating at 600 Hero Power so that you can get a solid feel of precisely what is needed to kill off each specific foe.

    For example, when I'm playing Witch Hunter Captain, I know that the following is precisely what I need to do to kill each enemy on legend difficulty with my loadout (which is +10% chaos damage rapier, brace of pistols with +10% monster damage, and +10% chaos/+10% infantry charm)
    *Slave rats, clan rats, and fanatics will die to one light attack headshot or rapier sidearm bodyshot
    *Marauders with two light headshots, a partial charge stab headshot, or a bodyshot with my rapier sidearm
    *Stormvermin: Mark the target for the damage boost, and kill with a fully charged rapier stab headshot. If for whatever reason I wasn't able to mark the target first, a partial stab bodyshot or sidearm bodyshot will finish the job. If I need to pick them out of a horde in a hurry, then two brace of pistols shots will drop them when marked,
    *Maulers: Two sidearm bodyshots when marked will take them down, or a sidearm bodyshot and a fully charge heavy headshot when marked.
    *Chaos Warriors: Three fully charged headshots stabs will drop him.
    *Marauder with shield: Push-stab will knock away his guard, and a rapier sidearm bodyshot will drop him where he stands
    *Shield vermin: Push stab into sidearm will knock his guard away, and then it can be killed by marking him and delivering a full charge rapier headshot.
    *Chaos Berzerkers: At range, two BoP bodyshots or a single headshot will drop them. In melee a partial charge heavy headshot will kill marked ones. If one gets in my face, then WHC can indefinitely block their rapid attacks (WHC's eternal guard trait provides 100% block cost reduction from all "light" attacks within my block angle) and I can pick them off with two sidearm bodyshots. If they pause for their heavy attack, then I can back away safely and kill them.
    *Plague Monks: Same as zerkers, except I need a full charge headshot to kill them or three sidearm bodyshots.

    Against specials the BOP will kill gutter runners in one bodyshot, marked hookrats in one bodyshot, and marked everything else in two bodyshots. When marked, a headshot from the BoP will kill them all in one hit. If I need to conserve ammo, then my rapier sidearm can kill marked gutter runners with one bodyshot, and marked leeches with two body shots or one headshot.

    If a boss shows up, I can spike it with damage by marking it, using my ability, and mag dumping all 12 BoP rounds into it. I can usually inflict ~20-25% damage to the target depending on how many headshots and crits that I score. Between scrounger and the boosted crit rate, I'm usually refunded about half of my ammo. If I have any potion, then the tri-pot effect on my charm boosts my damage against the boss to a good 1/3 of its health and will recharge my ability again for another activation once I've managed to reload. Between the two salvos, I can pretty much expect to inflict 50% of the boss's health, which goes a long ways towards killing it if my teammates are putting out decent damage too. If I have boss aggro, then I know that I can fire my rapier sidearm while I'm blocking aggressive boss attacks with the rapier and that the sidearm bodyshots inflict comparable damage to a partial charge rapier stab bodyshot. I also know that firing my sidearm will reset my rapier's parry frames while I'm blocking, which can protect my stamina from getting dumpstered by the boss if I time it right.

    https://youtu.be/eEdr1urcWVk

    I'm extremely ashamed at us not taking the second grim in the first clip, but it was essentially just me and the shade duoing that map. Kruber spent more time dead than alive, while sienna was constantly getting downed and ended up consuming almost every health item that the team found because of it.

    https://youtu.be/sCyHl_9CYIE

    My form is a bit poor in this second clip. It was also before I saw the light of the dodge range talent instead of the +ammo capacity talent. I've gotten better at landing my headshots since then, and I practiced against chaos warriors a lot in the modded realm. Often times their attacks block their head hitbox by putting their shoulder hitbox in the way.


    WHC has quickly become one of my favorite classes by far. The +20% damage boost from marking targets benefits the entire team, and it's often enough to push people over breakpoints or assist with boss dps. The only problem is that the boost only lasts for 5 seconds, while the mark lasts for far longer. You've gotta keep refreshing it. The PBAOE knockback of his ability is absolutely superb for busting your team out of a sticky situation, and with practice you can kite bosses up near a ledge and knock them off of it for an instant kill by combining it with a second knockback like a bomb. He also acts as a superb team medic due to his talent that grants the whole team 3 temp health every time that you kill a markable enemy (it doesn't need to be marked). Legend is CRAWLING with specials and elites, so you're constantly handing out little chunks of HP. The total temp HP distributed over the course of a map can easily be in the hundreds, and the decay of temp health is delayed by a few seconds every time that you gain temp health. The end result is that instead of your team's temp health decaying away between hordes, everyone will stay mostly topped up. That goes a LONG way towards making sure that nobody is on death's door with dangerously low health. Also, although I think it's better for him to carry a pot to speed up boss kills, he's a safe enough character to be a satisfactory grim carrier.

    General_Armchair on
    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
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    RiboflavinRiboflavin Registered User regular
    First thanks for helping the new folks Armchair. It looks like you spent alot of time on that.

    Now, they are supposed to be announcing some new stuff in March. Woo Hoo!

    My advice is get all characters to 30 then specialize in the ones you like. I run Kreuber or Saltz with a splash of elf on the side.(My elf is terrible)

    In my opinion it is better to stack bonus's from different items than to be all over the place. I have an executioner sword that has a speed boost with a speed on crit with an accessory that increases speed. Figure out what you want and stack it. (There is a limit on some things so be aware) +crit, +crit chance, whatever. I recommend getting what you like and stacking it.

    Know what the purpose of the weapon you are using is. Read the description. You want to rend armor? Have wide sweeps for crowd control? Destroy Shields, know what your weapon is good at.

    Kreuber I like in this order...Halbard, Executioner Sword, I haven't found shields very useful but may be my playstyle.
    Saltz.... I like rapier,Axe and Falchion, morning star/ball and chain whatever it is.

    We recently started running Legend with about a 30%-40% success rate be aware that what works well on one difficulty may not on the next.

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    General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    Shields aren't useful at all and I highly recommend that everyone avoid them like the plague. The best defensive traits that a weapon can have are it reach, a combination of attack speed and cleave, its lethality, and it's dodge range. Shield weapons get a big fat F in every one of those categories.

    Special shout out to iron breakers. I know that the shields are thematic, but you're far better off leveraging your gromril armor by using very aggressive offensive weapons like the great axe, dual hammers, or the pickaxe. When you use your taunt, the least useful thing that you can possibly do is just hold block while waiting for your teammates to bail you out. The threatening attacks, namely overhead attacks from elite enemies, inflict damage in a cone shaped AOE. So even though they are aimed at you, they are still an extreme threat to any allies that are behind or adjacent to you. What you should do instead is split off from your team slightly and start going to town with a heavy offense. The taunt ability provides you with a substantial damage reduction boost that stacks with your innate damage reduction with a combined total of 80% damage reduction. If you use the barkskin necklace trait, then that remaining 20% damage gets further reduced by 40% while barkskin is active which should put you at an effective 88% damage reduction. So get in there, bust some heads, and be wary of when the taunt wears off so that you aren't caught out in a bad place when it expires.

    Another thing about those overheads. You should never ever try to pick up a downed player when an elite is threatening to attack. You may be safely blocking during the rez, but your teammate is vulnerable to the full force of the attack. Proceeding with the rez and eating that overhead is a good way to turn a downed player into a dead player. Rezing while stealthed is also a terrible idea since the enemies will stop directing their attacks at you and will direct them towards the downed player.

    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
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    KarozKaroz Registered User regular
    Shields being pointless really disappointed me in Vermintide 2.

    I always felt like a great defender when I sent a horde flying backwards giving us time to finish them off is suddenly a detriment.

    But it's far outweighed by the silliness of Power rating.

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    General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    edited February 2019
    They're just all around terrible. They lack the range and killing power of two handed weapons, but they also lack the speed and dodge agility of single handed weapons. Shield bashing is pretty garbage too. It doesn't really do anything against the big elite units, and all that knocking the trash back accomplishes nine times out of ten is to push them out of range of your allies attacks and back into the next wave of mooks to create a hyper stack that's an even bigger threat for your friends. It's just downright detrimental and the shield user is often more beneficial to their team when dead.



    But back to general newbie tips from my experience farming egend mode. You don't need to use meta weapons, but you do NEED to be able to handle both massed slave rat tides, groups of chaos warriors, and everything in between. If you struggle with killing armor, or with clearing hordes, then you've set yourself up to be a liability to your team when you're forced to face what you struggle against.

    For your ranged weapon, I highly recommend that you pick something that can delete special and elite units at range quickly. Clearing ambients and hordes with your melee weapon is part of the basic fundamentals, so you really don't want a ranged weapon that eschews elite/special killing power to prioritize mopping up hordes. Flamethrowers in particular are low value. At best those hazards deny your teammates beneficial temp health that they would have received by clearing the horde with melee, and at worst they obscure vision of unfazed elite armored units that are advancing on your team. It kinda sucks since flamethrowers are cool, but they're usually a waste of your ranged slot.


    I want to talk about patrols and bosses since those are what I normally see ending runs, particularly if a horde is thrown in as well. Behind the scenes, each map is divided into zones and each zone has either a boss trigger, a patrol route, both, or neither. If the zone has both a patrol route and a boss trigger, then the game will pick one and only one threat to populate that zone with. For example, if you're approaching the marketplace that contains the second tome in the "Screaming Bell" map and hear a patrol marching on the bridge overhead, then you can discern that a boss won't attack you within the market. It's very important to try to minimize horde+boss and horde+patrol scenarios. To that end, if you're fighting a horde then you want to avoid crossing over boss triggers since that might dump a boss onto your head in addition to the horde. If you don't know where the boss triggers are, then you should probably avoid advancing through the level while fighting off a horde. If you do have to fight a boss and horde, then you should treat the boss as the lowest priority target unless you have overwhelming boss DPS like in my first clip from the other day where a shade and I killed a rat ogre in ~4 seconds. The player who has boss aggro should focus on staying safe and kiting the boss around the area. Everyone else should focus on dealing with the horde and making certain that the horde doesn't reach the guy who has boss aggro. Pay attention to the boss so that you can see if it changes aggro. If you have things that can stagger a boss such as bombs or certain abilities, then you absolutely positively SHOULD NOT STAGGER THE BOSS as part of your DPS. Staggering the boss makes its animations hard to read and can lead to it swapping aggro to a player that may not be expecting it. Once the horde is taken care of, then three players should start DPSing the boss while the guy with aggro should focus on staying safe.

    Regarding patrols, the best way to prevent them from causing a wipe is to destroy them in a controlled setting. If you and your teammates are prepared to kill off a patrol and aren't busy dealing with a horde, then it's generally in your best interest to kill a patrol lest heavy fighting further ahead pins you down long enough for the patrol to circle back around. Bombs are the quickest way to defang a patrol, as seen in the below clip. A few bombs will reduce a patrol to a mere handful of survivors. That's one of the reasons that I think that ranger veteran Bardin is one of the best careers in the game to have as part of your legend party, since he turns the rare bomb resource into an extremely common resource. However if your team isn't equipped to quickly delete a patrol or your teammates aren't onboard with engaging the patrol, then you should just sidestep the patrol with them. It's usually better for a team to work in concert on a bad plan than it is to split your efforts for one or two guys to follow a good plan. When tossing a bomb at a patrol, you want to toss it behind the shielded units. The shields protect them and the guys behind them from the blast, so just toss it behind them for maximum effect.

    https://youtu.be/opRscNsXmKU
    In this clip our team is extremely well prepared to kill an SV patrol. I have a bomb and a strength pot, and am very confident at my ability to land headshots with my rapier. The Unchained had a crowbill, which is pretty much custom made for this scenario. Footknight kruber had an executioner sword, which is also good at killing SV. Also all of us have our abilities charged, except for the stupid elf who was wasting hers against trash the whole game to chase circles. Given a choice, I'd rather fight them in the clearing near the stairs behind us, but everyone else wanted to hide. It's easier just to go along with them, even though I knew that the house wouldn't keep them hidden from the patrol. (edit: One more anti-patrol tip. If you have both a strength potion and a bomb, then you can drink the potion to increase the damage of the bomb. This increases the damage enough to kill CWs within the blast radius, where normally a bomb will only soften them up. This is for legend though. On lower difficulties I think the bombs by itself might be enough to kill a CW).


    Some tips for fighting specific bosses.

    *Stormfiend: I'm actually not gonna write any tips for this guy since he's pretty much a free win. Don't fight him in narrow hallways I guess. He's kinda annoying when he climbs around the map like king-kong.

    *Bile Troll: Also an easy win IMO. He's not very aggressive and is basically just a big sack of HP. His big gimmick is health regeneration. He constantly regenerates health in small amounts, and enters a big regeneration phase once he gets down to 50% HP. Once he hits 50%, he falls to his knees, regains 50% temp HP, and starts kinda beating the ground. You have a few seconds to deplete this temp HP. If you fail to deplete the temp HP, then he stands up and the temp HP is converted to regular HP. The important thing is to avoid wasting your damage spikes until after he goes through that regeneration phase. Otherwise you risk him regenerating the damage from your spike. If you have boss aggro, the safest place to be is as close to him as possible. Dodge around to his sides when you see him readying an attack. Attacks with his hand can be blocked, but attacks with his axe will hit you for substantial chip damage through your block. He also has a vomit attack that you'll want to sidestep. You can abort the vomit attack by hitting him with a stagger as he readies himself to hurl. If you're in a narrow passageway where you don't have room to deal with the vomit that he spews, then it's probably a good idea to utilize a stagger to abort that attack.

    *Rat Ogre: This is the first boss that I consider to be a real threat. He has no special gimmick, but he's aggressive and has several attacks that can come out very fast. Most of his attacks can be safely blocked with one notable exception. If you get close in to his face, then he'll slam the ground and hurt you through your block. However this is also his Achilles heel. It's possible to dodge tank Roger in place by baiting that attack. I don't react to the ground pound so much as try to trigger it and then depend on him being predictable. You do this by getting in close to him and then dodging away. I'm reminded of the "hokey pokey" children's song (put your right foot, put your right foot out...). With practice you can squeeze attacks in against Roger while dodge tanking him, but initially you just want to play it safe and block after dodging away incase you failed to prompt a ground slam and he utilizes one of his other attacks instead.

    *Chaos Spawn: This boss is IMO the greatest threat that you can face. It is extremely aggressive and can kill people in moments. Like Roger, he has a ground slam and can be dodge tanked in place, but he's less predictable than Roger since he sometimes uses his other attacks instead. His other normal attack is a triple strike that drags him forward, and this will devastate anyone who fails to dodge or block it. The big threat however is that occasionally it will try to grab someone with his tentacle. Once grabbed, he will do one of two things. He'll either start slamming the area around him with the ensnared person, or he'll start eating the person to regenerate a TON of health. Both are VERY bad, but he will drop the grabbed player if you stagger him with something. It's usually in your best interest to keep your staggers in reserve so that you can force him to drop your allies if they get themselves grabbed. If you have aggro, I recommend keeping some distance to avoid prompting the ground pound and to doubly make sure that you don't get grabbed.

    One important tip about bosses is that they can inflict tons of friendly fire against their lesser comrades. So if you have boss aggro and are simultaneously getting hit by a horde, then it's possible to kill off the horde wave by kiting the boss into it. It's also possible to leverage certain specials against hordes. Sometimes it's best to kite the horde into harm's way of a flame rat, gunner rat, globadier, or blightstormer. Just something to keep in mind if the pressure on you is too intense for you to deliver enough attacks to clear the horde yourself.

    General_Armchair on
    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
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    FiendishrabbitFiendishrabbit Registered User regular
    They didn't mention if it will have Minotaur bosses. I hope so. A Gorebull guarding a chaos temple would be awesome.

    "The western world sips from a poisonous cocktail: Polarisation, populism, protectionism and post-truth"
    -Antje Jackelén, Archbishop of the Church of Sweden
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    General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    Beastmen should shake up the ideal breakpoints on a lot of weapons at least.

    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
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    RickRudeRickRude Registered User regular
    They're going all in on people enjoying these weaves by not adding many maps it seems.

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    Undead MonkeyUndead Monkey Anchorage, AKRegistered User regular
    edited February 2019
    RickRude wrote: »
    They're going all in on people enjoying these weaves by not adding many maps it seems.

    Well, these kinda sorta (can't say for sure, just to me) sound like rifts and greater rifts from Diablo 3, which are also existing map and tiles sets just reused and procedurally generated per instance.

    So reusing the same maps and shaking them up doesn't surprise me here.

    Undead Monkey on
    SteamID: Pudgestomp
    XBL: InvaderJims
    Bnet: Pudgestomp#11153
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    BloodySlothBloodySloth Registered User regular
    FatShark is a really small crew for what Vermintide is, so it makes sense that they'd want to try something like this to reduce the amount of new things they have to build. I think it's a really interesting idea, in any case. And I'm pumped to see the beastmen in action!

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    General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    RickRude wrote: »
    They're going all in on people enjoying these weaves by not adding many maps it seems.

    It would be less of an issue if they would release the map making tools so that the community could churn out maps.

    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
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    RiboflavinRiboflavin Registered User regular
    I suppose they won't be adding weapon properties specific to Beastmen? Will it be covered under Infantry? Chaos? I'm lore poor, do Beastmen count as Chaos creatures? Haven't seen a price but there is a high likelyhood of me getting this.

    Random ending will be fun and annoying as I am sure one will suck more than others. No fun getting wiped in the last event because you pulled the horrible black void. I'm looking at you Talisman.

    "Once the objective has been completed, a portal will open to an arena where players must survive a final showdown. Examples I was given included battling waves of enemies, or fighting against multiple bosses."

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    IblisIblis Registered User regular
    Beastmen are chaos-aligned. Originally there was a singular chaos army that got spread out into Warriors of Chaos, Beastmen, and Daemons.

    Steam Account, 3DS FC: 5129-1652-5160, Origin ID: DamusWolf
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    BethrynBethryn Unhappiness is Mandatory Registered User regular
    Anniversary update is out. There's a special level. It's good.

    ...and of course, as always, Kill Hitler.
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    Undead MonkeyUndead Monkey Anchorage, AKRegistered User regular
    And here I was trying to figure out what I am going to play after work tonight.

    Thank you for deciding for me, Fatshark.

    (and @Bethryn for bringing it to our attention :wink:)

    SteamID: Pudgestomp
    XBL: InvaderJims
    Bnet: Pudgestomp#11153
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    FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    SO I just started playing this game, and it seems as fun as the first.

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    General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    Be sure to queue up for the anniversary event to do the drunken pub crawl map and get the character portraits. IIRC it started on the 8th and is going on for 10 days.

    I did it on legend the other night. Let me tell you, scoring those rapier headshots as WHC is a lot harder when drunk.

    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
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    FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    edited March 2019
    That was like the 3rd map I played (first two:elven temple). It was pretty great.

    I am not quite sure which weapon sets I like yet, but my favorite characters are Fuegonasus and Saltzpyre

    Fencingsax on
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    General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    I just advise that you avoid the shield weapons (all of them) like the plague since they're pretty much all of the downsides of two hander weapons with none of the upsides. Shield bashing for "crowd control" generally just makes things worse on the harder difficulties since it will only knock the front line out of reach of your teammates attacks, and the knocked back frontline merges with the second line into a hyper stack that can't be completely cleaved through by your teammates. You'll end up creating a situation where eight or more enemies are occupying the same space, and then when someone attacks that blob their weapon will "get stuck" after passing through the third of fourth enemy and then the remainder will just stab you.


    Generally you want to pick a melee weapon that you can use to both take care of yourself in a horde, but you also want to be capable of killing storm vermin and chaos warriors on your own in melee. Ranged attacks are typically reserved for killing specials, berzerkers, and occasionally thinning a crowd of elite units before they enter melee range.

    If you can fulfill those requirements, then your weapon choice will be adequate. Beyond that comes the debate becomes whether or not something is optimal. But the shield weapons are never optimal because they're just leagues below the alternatives in every case.

    Also, when you get around to trying out Bardin's Ironbreaker career, don't fall for the noob trap of just turtling up and holding block when you taunt. That doesn't really do anything to help your team clear whatever mess prompted you to use your ult in the first place. IB has something like 80% damage reduction during his taunt, so that is the time when he should be unleashing an extremely aggressive offense to clean up whatever mess that he's faced with. Keep side dodging ofcourse to try to avoid the worst of the attacks, but kill as many of the enemies that you can.

    3DS Friend Code:
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    RiboflavinRiboflavin Registered User regular
    Finished the pub run and got my frames. Armchair, congrats to you for doing it on Legend, sheesh we struggled at... cough cough not Legend.

    The Drunk effect made me motion sick after awhile. I'll not be doing it again unless I have to.

    Fencingsax,I like Merc Krueber and Saltz.
    The Executioner Sword has an overhead that is great for headshots/elites and a swing which will devastate hordes. I also use the handgun to take out elites before I get up to them.
    I run increased speed to make the swing quicker and I took quicker ult cooldown for my top talent.
    On Legend I can fully heal during a horde and provide my friends with health via my ult.

    For Saltz I believe the meta is low health zealot but I like to run Double Shot Bounbty Hunter.
    I use the Rapier , it is fairly easy to headshot and decent during a horde. I have a crossbow that is plus chaos and plus armor, I think, and I can 1 shot storm vermin on Legend. I tend to focus on Elites and let the rest of my crew clean rabble. Chaos Warriors/storm vermin. I do struggle some with shield vermin, 1 on one is ok , any more than that is a struggle. Double Shot lets me one shot the Chaos Warriors and deal hefty damage to monsters.

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    General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    IIRC, the OHKO breakpoint for Storm vermin with the xbow is ~+40% damage. So for someone like Bardin you'd need a perfect charm and perfect xbow both setup with skaven/armor to get that OHKO body shot. Saltz has it a bit easier since IIRC all three of his careers get power boosting options. WHC has +20% damage against marked targets, BH has his free crits, and zealot gets bonus damage when low on true health.

    @Riboflavin If you're running rapier/xbow, then consider doing this to streamline how quickly that you can kill shield vermin:

    Hit them with a push attack and immediately follow it up with the rapier's sidearm attack (weapon special in your controls. The rapier is one of the only things in the game that uses this button) . Those three hits in rapid succession will quickly break open their guard. You're then free to attack them however you'd like. But if your xbow is indeed capable of hitting the OHKO breakpoint, then the easiest way to get the kill would be to hotswap to the xbow and delete the vulnerable shield vermin while you dodge away from his buddies.

    Three quick hits from most anything will disarm their guard. For careers with slow weapons, you can just push them a lot real fast and then hit them with a slow heavy attack. The rapier is just really good at breaking their guard since its push attack is so fast, only costs half stamina, and the sidearm attack comes out quickly after the push stab with the added benefit of not lowering your block while you do it.

    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
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    RiboflavinRiboflavin Registered User regular
    I should mention when I say I one shot storm vermin its with my crit. Otherwise I need a headshot. I haven't tried stab/shoot with the Shield vermin but I'll give it a go. I can face multiple regular storm vermin alone but more than 1 shield vermin eat me up. I can 1 shot chaos warriors with the xbow but again its with the 1 every 15 sec crit and has to be to the head. (Usually not too hard to do) When we face a many Chaos Warrior at once I try to Xbow 1, doubleshot another then engage a third. Usually this doesn't happen as my friends have killed the ones I couldn't shoot.
    Still I struggle with Legend but we're up to what I would call a 35-40% success rate which I don't think is too bad. I run a full set of red so everything is maxed

    I saw the Beastman DLC would have increased level cap. Does that mean power level? Because if so Legend is going to get easier quickly.

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    BloodySlothBloodySloth Registered User regular
    Man I'm super excited to see what the Beastmen have in store. Do we know if they're a full-fledged "faction" ala the Skaven and Chaos? Or are there just a few new troops to pepper into the Chaos forces you come across?

    Imagine if the bog standard Gors got a charge attack, instead of having to run up, stop, and swing. That could even open up shield weapons to being more useful, if, say, it gave you a bonus to protect against a running beastman headbutt or something. Hmmmmm.

    I recall a reveal article mentioning Ungors with bows, which if they appear in groups would be crazy and new. And the opportunities for Beastmen bosses could be fun... although it'd be hard to avoid any of them overlapping with existing monsters, I imagine. Like a Minotaur would be cool to see, but how different can they really make it feel to fight one versus a Rat Ogre or Chaos Spawn? The latter are even already associated with Beastmen. I wouldn't be terribly surprised if the DLC doesn't even have any new monster level enemies.

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    General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    edited March 2019
    Riboflavin wrote: »
    I saw the Beastman DLC would have increased level cap. Does that mean power level? Because if so Legend is going to get easier quickly.

    Yeah, legend will definitely be easier between the extra hero power and the extra talents. It's gonna shift up the breakpoints. For example, the brace of pistols currently needs ~11% bonus damage to kill a SV with two body shots. WHC can mark the target for +20%, but if you were using gear alone then you'd need to dedicate two stat slots to boost damage to skaven/armored. However the extra stats from another level or so will lower that requirement to 10% or less, so then you'll only need one of your gear stats to reach that break point.

    Speaking of breakpoints, there is a nice spreadsheet that can be used to find breakpoints. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1_KihiXcEb1nP355Nwj0aQ3SszKwqrzQ6ra63CWPQq4I/edit#gid=62597031

    FWIW, a vanilla xbow will kill SV with a critical hit. Also, I'm not seeing how you're one shoting CW's with the xbow since the since the xbow can't inflict enough damage to kill a legend CW in one hit. It looks like the most damage to CW's from a bounty hunter is inflicted by running 40 crit power, 10% chaos damage, 10% armor damage, and the crippling strike talent for 25% additional crit damage. All of that combined within the near range bracket adds up to 94.96 damage, which falls short of the 120 damage that must be inflicted to kill a CW. It still falls short even if off balance, Hunter, Barrage, or Shrapnel were in effect. All that I can think of is that your friends must be inflicting at least a little bit of damage before your land your headshot.

    Man I'm super excited to see what the Beastmen have in store. Do we know if they're a full-fledged "faction" ala the Skaven and Chaos?

    To my knowledge, we don't know yet. I'm kind of hoping that they're classified as Beastmen instead of getting lumped in with chaos.

    General_Armchair on
    3DS Friend Code:
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    RiboflavinRiboflavin Registered User regular
    "Also, I'm not seeing how you're one shoting CW's with the xbow since the since the xbow can't inflict enough damage to kill a legend CW in one hit."

    I am doing this. Maybe my buddies hit it 1st? This is possible. Sometimes it seems I just 1 shot them maybe I'm missing others shooting at them. I don't know but I have seem to have done it multiple times. I don't think my gear is min/maxxed because I am lazy. Next time I'm at home I'll get the stats on what I'm running and beg you to fix me. :-) Again, always with a crit. I usually never fire the xbow unless a crit is ready or a special pops up.

    I'm excited about the portal to random finales. I hope they are a little more creative than described.

    " Once the objective has been completed, a portal will open to an arena where players must survive a final showdown. Examples I was given included battling waves of enemies, or fighting against multiple bosses."

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    CornKingCornKing Registered User regular
    Does this game lose its luster or does it keep being entertaining [I know playing something too much will usually get boring].

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    MrBodyMrBody Registered User regular
    CornKing wrote: »
    Does this game lose its luster or does it keep being entertaining [I know playing something too much will usually get boring].

    I was a big fan of the original and played it to death.

    The sequel makes a lot of interesting gameplay additions, but I hate how they turned it into a grindfest where you quickly get left behind. I took a month long break shortly after release. After that, I was so far behind in levels that no one wanted to party up with me. And that was over a year ago. God knows how far behind the grind power curve I am now.

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    FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    I am having fun with this game, and I still haven't touched Bardin or Kruber

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    General_ArmchairGeneral_Armchair Registered User regular
    MrBody wrote: »
    CornKing wrote: »
    Does this game lose its luster or does it keep being entertaining [I know playing something too much will usually get boring].

    I was a big fan of the original and played it to death.

    The sequel makes a lot of interesting gameplay additions, but I hate how they turned it into a grindfest where you quickly get left behind. I took a month long break shortly after release. After that, I was so far behind in levels that no one wanted to party up with me. And that was over a year ago. God knows how far behind the grind power curve I am now.

    The power curve hasn't really moved since launch. Once you hit hero level 30 and 300 item power, then it all comes down to min-maxing the gear stats to chase breakpoints. Chasing red gear makes hitting breakpoints easier, but often a good roll on an orange is just as good 99% of the time. Gear wise the only things that changed are that it is no longer possible to roll a chaos/skaven charm, and that each character has weapons gated behind the ubersreik DLC. You can catch up with the weapons by buying ubersreik, and anecdotally I'll tell you that in the vast majority of cases you don't want a chaos/skaven charm and instead want either a chaos/infantry or skaven/armored charm.


    I fully agree with you though about the pointless grind. It's why my friends all quit. For example, one friend started playing Kruber. He reached level 20 something, but Kruber never really fully clicked for him. I think that he might enjoy Kerilian or Bardin more, but that would put him back at level 1 with no weapon unlocks and no talents, so he just doesn't play instead since he doesn't want to backtrack .


    But also fuck all those guys who refuse to run with you because of your level. If you're level 20 something or have 300 item power jewelery to equip then that is plenty to carry your own weight in legend, much less champion. The big loss is the temp health talent at level 20, but a natural bond necklace could replace that in a pinch on an alt. On the other side of the coin, the jerks that refused to group with you did you a favor since they were most likely shitters who were looking to be carried and you were better finding a new party.

    Although if you can work yourself up to queuing for legend, I'd recommend giving that a try. In my experience, champion difficulty has more people who have sticks up there asses and who will kick people who don't run min-maxed enough builds for their liking. But in legend fewer people care what you run. Or if they care, they're less likely to get worked up into a frenzy about it. Honestly I think that a decent sized chunk of the legend population outright hopes that undergeared/suboptimal teammates will faceplant so that they will get an opportunity to show off and be the big hero that solos the rat ogre or chaos patrol.


    I think that a lot of weapons are terrible, but the only piece of gear that was bad enough for me to kick people over was the pre-buff natural bond necklace. That thing was a noob trap that was worse than equipping nothing at all in the slot. But now that it's been buffed it is no longer a crippling liability to the team.
    CornKing wrote: »
    Does this game lose its luster or does it keep being entertaining [I know playing something too much will usually get boring].

    I think that the characters have different enough play styles that you can keep things fresh. WHC plays way different than slayer or shade or unchained, etc.
    Things have been better since last fall's balance patch that killed wigglemancy and the ranged meta.

    3DS Friend Code:
    Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
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    RiboflavinRiboflavin Registered User regular
    CornKing wrote: »
    Does this game lose its luster or does it keep being entertaining [I know playing something too much will usually get boring].

    I think if I played with randoms I would have quit by now. I play with a pool of about 5 other people and we only do private matches. We even quit doing quickplay.
    It's fun because i get to joke around and tell the same joke 100 times. It never gets old to call the elf the weightwatcher.

    So for me it depends on who you're playing with. The added shines like the ravaged art, event frames, and promise of beastmen have helped too.

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    BloodySlothBloodySloth Registered User regular
    Inside Warhammer: Vermintide 2's endgame expansion Winds of Magic

    Lots of information on how Weaves will work, and especially interesting to me are details on what the Beastmen are bringing to the table: (spoilered just in case you want to go in blind, I guess?)
    Sounds like Beastmen are their own third faction to fight alongside Nurgle' warriors and the Skaven. The basic badguys will be Gors, backed up by the smaller, spear-weilding Ungors with longer range poke attacks (and maybe some with ranged bows, which are still being tested) and Bestigors as their brawler, who do, in fact, get charge attacks that can knock you (and their friends) around. We're also getting at least one new Monster with the Minotaur, and instead of loner Specials, Beastmen get Standard Bearers, which show up alongside the standard enemies and will grant a variety of buffs to them.

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    BethrynBethryn Unhappiness is Mandatory Registered User regular
    They did actually change it so that you get full XP from Veteran and above now, and Vet chests scale up to 300, so you catch up quicker if you're lower level. It's also the case that you can craft weapons on a character you haven't played, and they'll use your highest acquired power.

    ...and of course, as always, Kill Hitler.
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