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[WOW] Luke 8:30: "What is thy name ? And he said, Legion."

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Posts

  • OldSlackerOldSlacker Registered User regular
    Opty wrote: »
    The problem is the game is a decade old and the content pipeline for it was designed back then, when the concept of rapid iteration was a pipe dream. They constantly allude to bottlenecks that mean they can't just throw more devs and artists at the problem to get things done faster. What they'd need to do is a full systems overhaul so they can eliminate those bottlenecks but after Cata they're pretty gunshy about doing a bunch of work to fix something that doesn't directly apply to endlevel engagement even though if they actually fixed this it'd help massively for every expansion down the road.

    speaking of which, from the engineering roundtable that wasn't streamed:
    The WoW representative described a picture that makes the rounds at the office describing WoW: a trash can, with an iron on it (plugged in and running), with a coffee pot on top, with spaghetti and water in the coffee pot. "Problem solved!"
    It's actually ramen.
    kJDiwyG.jpg


  • reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    I can only assume the trash can is a metaphor for Warlods.

  • MadicanMadican No face Registered User regular
    Javen wrote: »
    Brainleech wrote: »
    Javen wrote: »
    No more dual specs, I guess. You just have access to everything from go.

    ?

    All classes will have access to all specs. No more having to pick two

    I'm betting they're taking a page from FFXI/XIV and making it so changing your weapon changes your spec.

  • I needed anime to post.I needed anime to post. boom Registered User regular
    Madican wrote: »
    Javen wrote: »
    Brainleech wrote: »
    Javen wrote: »
    No more dual specs, I guess. You just have access to everything from go.

    ?

    All classes will have access to all specs. No more having to pick two

    I'm betting they're taking a page from FFXI/XIV and making it so changing your weapon changes your spec.

    probably not, since lowbies don't have artifacts

    liEt3nH.png
  • JavenJaven Registered User regular
    Madican wrote: »
    Javen wrote: »
    Brainleech wrote: »
    Javen wrote: »
    No more dual specs, I guess. You just have access to everything from go.

    ?

    All classes will have access to all specs. No more having to pick two

    I'm betting they're taking a page from FFXI/XIV and making it so changing your weapon changes your spec.

    Nah I bet it'll be like it is today, just with all spec icons on the right hand side. They still want you to be able to change weapons on the fly, even in combat

  • reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    edited November 2015
    I'd imagine it'll be like Hunter pets, where you go to the spec selection screen and then hit the "activate" button on whichever spec you want.

    edit: Some new news about class changes and mechanics: http://www.wowhead.com/news=249804/darkmoon-faire-community-amphitheatre-lore-systems-class-changes (scroll down to Day 2)

    Some good stuff
    Windwalker: Storm, Earth, and Fire question
    • Still good but it's a little too low on single target damage - we just buffed that but it's not one of the stars
    • There will be a new Storm, Earth, and Fire - right now it's cumbersome, you cant really know what it's about by looking at the button
    • New: its a toggle like Blade Flurry, when it's on you split, when it's off you are one
    • They have semi AI, they know to attack different target than you
    • Downside is less control but upside is it will always be doing something useful
    Artifacts: easy to level for 2 specs?
    • The further you are behind, the easier it is to catch up most of the way
    • Maintaining off specs is more difficult but not impossible - you'll be very slightly behind on the 2nd spec
    • But for those very far behind, the traits are cheaper to get although you'll be doing the same activities
    • Hopefully you won't want to change specs with the new class fantasy fulfillment!
    Moonkin updates:
    • There have been multiple failures - so we said let's revamp it entirely
    • Core problem with moonkin is the whole spec is a bar cycle on your UI
    • You are playing the UI game - that's done
    • Now there are builders and spenders with diff strengths and weaknesses and reasons to use them.
    • Moonkin still have fantasy of being a Druid that calls down power of the stars.

    Moonkin changes seems to imply that Eclipse is finally gone and done. Good riddance, that whole mechanic has been terrible ever since they introduced it in Wrath.

    reVerse on
    GethCorp.Shephard
  • Eat it You Nasty Pig.Eat it You Nasty Pig. tell homeland security 'we are the bomb'Registered User regular
    yesssssss fuck eclipse

    this really is the last datapoint I need to convince me to retire my shaman and just main druid

    NREqxl5.jpg
    hold your head high soldier, it ain't over yet
    that's why we call it the struggle, you're supposed to sweat
  • MadicanMadican No face Registered User regular
    Madican wrote: »
    Javen wrote: »
    Brainleech wrote: »
    Javen wrote: »
    No more dual specs, I guess. You just have access to everything from go.

    ?

    All classes will have access to all specs. No more having to pick two

    I'm betting they're taking a page from FFXI/XIV and making it so changing your weapon changes your spec.

    probably not, since lowbies don't have artifacts

    I didn't say artifacts.

  • I needed anime to post.I needed anime to post. boom Registered User regular
    Madican wrote: »
    Madican wrote: »
    Javen wrote: »
    Brainleech wrote: »
    Javen wrote: »
    No more dual specs, I guess. You just have access to everything from go.

    ?

    All classes will have access to all specs. No more having to pick two

    I'm betting they're taking a page from FFXI/XIV and making it so changing your weapon changes your spec.

    probably not, since lowbies don't have artifacts

    I didn't say artifacts.

    weapons are not spec-specific prior to artifacts tho

    liEt3nH.png
  • MarathonMarathon Registered User regular
    Unless you could assign a weapon to a spec or something, but you would have to do that far too often while leveling. They would have to start all new characters with an heirloom weapon or something. Which, might not be the worst idea since you're looking down the barrel of 110 levels when you start now.

  • reVersereVerse Attack and Dethrone God Registered User regular
    How would this system react to a Death Knight equipping a two-handed mace, or a rogue equipping a mace or an axe? How would it know the difference between fire and frost mage, brewmaster and mistweaver, or holy and disc, or any warlock spec, which all use a staff?

  • Corp.ShephardCorp.Shephard Registered User regular
    edited November 2015
    The class changes and balance details are encouraging! It's great to have them really focus on classes this expansion.

    Discipline priest being outlined as a 30% dps/70% healer is interesting. I'll take any change over what we have now. Strength through static and boring game-play.

    Hm.

    With the removal of Aspect of the Fox and Amplify Magic mid-way through this expansion I really thought they were working against hybridization and unique niche powers as they were seen as unfair. However with the new Discipline concept they clearly don't mind niche hybridization. Furthermore they talk about diversifying utility spells in the druid section: Feral and Guardian druids get exclusive access to stampeding roar, Balance gets innervate, and Restoration will get something that overcharges their mark of the wild for a cooldown. How are these really different than Aspect of the Fox and Amplify Magic? Strange reversal on their part, but I like it.

    S'always a little annoying to hear about these now as it just gets me itching. It's clear the expansion is little under a year off though...

    Corp.Shephard on
    Geth
  • BrainleechBrainleech 機知に富んだコメントはここにあります Registered User regular
    Turambar wrote: »
    Brainleech wrote: »
    Really I like loitering in cities for the social stuff
    not hanging out in my garrison
    I do hope the class halls are a social thing since the realm I am on is rather dead

    not joking, I believe more than 80% of my playtime in vanilla was hanging out in Ironforge

    There was a belt on a wall to the south of the bank area I used to hang out on my rogue on when flying came in Cata they removed it
    I was sad
    The top of huts near the bank in Org was where I hung out for years

  • OptyOpty Registered User regular
    Opty wrote: »
    The problem is the game is a decade old and the content pipeline for it was designed back then, when the concept of rapid iteration was a pipe dream. They constantly allude to bottlenecks that mean they can't just throw more devs and artists at the problem to get things done faster. What they'd need to do is a full systems overhaul so they can eliminate those bottlenecks but after Cata they're pretty gunshy about doing a bunch of work to fix something that doesn't directly apply to endlevel engagement even though if they actually fixed this it'd help massively for every expansion down the road.

    speaking of which, from the engineering roundtable that wasn't streamed:
    The WoW representative described a picture that makes the rounds at the office describing WoW: a trash can, with an iron on it (plugged in and running), with a coffee pot on top, with spaghetti and water in the coffee pot. "Problem solved!"
    It's actually ramen.
    kJDiwyG.jpg


    After reading through the mmo champ summary of the engineering panel it's pretty clear things are even worse than I imagined.

    FairchildCarpyHalfmexcrimsoncoyote
  • Kai_SanKai_San Commonly known as Klineshrike! Registered User regular
    Major Glyphs gone? I know they seem to be adding a little more pominent customization back but I would not be surprised if it is not as good as it sounds on paper. Meanwhile, more oversimplifying.

    They might as well just get rid of glyphs and inscription entirely because they just don't seem to like it.

  • FairchildFairchild Rabbit used short words that were easy to understand, like "Hello Pooh, how about Lunch ?" Registered User regular
    Opty wrote: »
    Opty wrote: »
    The problem is the game is a decade old and the content pipeline for it was designed back then, when the concept of rapid iteration was a pipe dream. They constantly allude to bottlenecks that mean they can't just throw more devs and artists at the problem to get things done faster. What they'd need to do is a full systems overhaul so they can eliminate those bottlenecks but after Cata they're pretty gunshy about doing a bunch of work to fix something that doesn't directly apply to endlevel engagement even though if they actually fixed this it'd help massively for every expansion down the road.

    speaking of which, from the engineering roundtable that wasn't streamed:
    The WoW representative described a picture that makes the rounds at the office describing WoW: a trash can, with an iron on it (plugged in and running), with a coffee pot on top, with spaghetti and water in the coffee pot. "Problem solved!"
    It's actually ramen.
    kJDiwyG.jpg


    After reading through the mmo champ summary of the engineering panel it's pretty clear things are even worse than I imagined.

    Here's a link to it: http://www.mmo-champion.com/content/5262-Engineering-Community-Amphitheater-Discussion

    Sounds pretty bad, a 10-year old engine with lots of static coding that needs to be painstakingly searched and fixed before implementing even minor changes.

  • PMAversPMAvers Registered User regular
    What we need is for the Legion to win this expansion, blow everything up, and give them a excuse to start fresh with a new client.

    persona4celestia.jpg
    COME FORTH, AMATERASU! - Switch Friend Code SW-5465-2458-5696 - Twitch
    HalfmexcrimsoncoyoteSmrtnikArthil
  • BobbleBobble Registered User regular
    Bobble wrote: »
    reVerse wrote: »
    People who have played the demo are reporting that everything is shared tag. No more competing for tagging mobs.

    Excellent. If they overhaul the resource gathering stuff to be personally phased like GW2, I think I'd go slap money on a pre-order immediately (still probably getting Legion, but that'd be a huge 'good job, Blizz' for me).

    Welp, they did, so I did.

  • Kai_SanKai_San Commonly known as Klineshrike! Registered User regular
    That was a really good read and actually makes their engineering people seem like a really awesome place to work.

    But oh my god, I cannot believe someone hasn't convinced them to put all this effort into just moving on to a new game. I bet they could find a way to move all information into a WoW2 essentially in less time than it takes to update a single aspect of the current game. Yikes.

    FairchildcrimsoncoyoteHalfmex
  • FairchildFairchild Rabbit used short words that were easy to understand, like "Hello Pooh, how about Lunch ?" Registered User regular
    Kai_San wrote: »
    That was a really good read and actually makes their engineering people seem like a really awesome place to work.

    But oh my god, I cannot believe someone hasn't convinced them to put all this effort into just moving on to a new game. I bet they could find a way to move all information into a WoW2 essentially in less time than it takes to update a single aspect of the current game. Yikes.

    Word. You would think that at some point SOMEBODY with a corner office would have decided, "We are killing ourselves trying to drag along all of this outdated code, time to start from scratch".

  • HalfmexHalfmex I mock your value system You also appear foolish in the eyes of othersRegistered User regular
    This is exactly what I've been saying forever - the fact that they're still using this bastardized Frankenstein of an engine (which admittedly they've managed to get far more life out of than I'm sure even they expected) instead of even something off the shelf like UE5 or something is just flabbergasting. They addressed that during the talk by saying essentially "we'd rather use our old busted-ass custom engine than learn something else from scratch" but man, there has to have been a point at which it made sense financially. How much time have they had to spend rejigging old code to fit some new idea or scrapping a cool idea because the old engine simply wouldn't support it? Meanwhile newer games with less experienced developers are just showing off these ridiculous new games and making WoW look like WoW made EQ look when it launched.

    FairchildArthilKai_San
  • RoeRoe Always to the East Registered User regular
    Fairchild wrote: »
    Kai_San wrote: »
    That was a really good read and actually makes their engineering people seem like a really awesome place to work.

    But oh my god, I cannot believe someone hasn't convinced them to put all this effort into just moving on to a new game. I bet they could find a way to move all information into a WoW2 essentially in less time than it takes to update a single aspect of the current game. Yikes.

    Word. You would think that at some point SOMEBODY with a corner office would have decided, "We are killing ourselves trying to drag along all of this outdated code, time to start from scratch".

    Between Warlords model and turf remake, and cataclysm's changes to vanilla, WoW pretty much is remade. We're just so used to the content by now that we don't realize how much of it's been redone.

    oHw5R0V.jpg
    MegaPureiboi
  • crimsoncoyotecrimsoncoyote Registered User regular
    That's just the stuff we can see, though.

    It sounds like they fight constantly with legacy code written during or before 2004

    Arthil
  • RoeRoe Always to the East Registered User regular
    That's just the stuff we can see, though.

    It sounds like they fight constantly with legacy code written during or before 2004

    There's no way they're using legacy code with the number of updates WoW has been through.

    oHw5R0V.jpg
  • Grape ApeGrape Ape Registered User regular
    Roe wrote: »
    That's just the stuff we can see, though.

    It sounds like they fight constantly with legacy code written during or before 2004

    There's no way they're using legacy code with the number of updates WoW has been through.

    I think this is turning into an argument of terminology. Code doesn't need to be, strictly speaking, legacy code for it to be the equivalent of a gordian knot.
    The fact that the WoW dev team has been working with a 10+ year old code base essentially guarantees that there are some parts that are much more sound than others, and the parts that are less sound are likely way less sound.

    Honestly I think that any promises of <year turnaround on major content patches sounds like a marketing promise that engineering not only couldn't possibly keep, but would laugh at anyone who suggested it. Over time, content patches will tend to deliver less and take more time, and WoW has done exactly that.

    crimsoncoyoteDelphinidaes
  • ArthilArthil Registered User regular
    Yeah trying to suggest they aren't using legacy code when they've said, flat out, they can't logistically increase the base 16 slot bag/remove it/make it replaceable because it could just absolutely break all the UI.

    PSN: Honishimo Steam UPlay: Arthil
    Bobble
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    Haven't seen you guys mention this yet - draw distance in Legion will be 3x further. Not sure whether that's for Legion zones or the whole world

    Mugsley
  • LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    Haven't seen you guys mention this yet - draw distance in Legion will be 3x further. Not sure whether that's for Legion zones or the whole world

    Previous draw distance increases have been worldwide.

  • LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    My rogues are pretty salty.

    PMAvers
  • HalfmexHalfmex I mock your value system You also appear foolish in the eyes of othersRegistered User regular
    While I'm happy for the rogues who play Combat, as an Assassination player I'm dreading reading what I'm fairly confident will be "No Major Changes". Frost DKs are apparently identical to their live counterparts with (thus far at least) no changes planned, which sucks for them. Not that every spec needs an overhaul, but when some specs are getting rebuilt from the ground up, having others not even get a fresh coat of paint is pretty disappointing. Assassination rogues have been one of the most simplistic, rote playstyles in the game simply because it involves (especially since WoD) all of two to three buttons. Arms warriors are in the same boat.

    The devs went too far with the ability prune in WoD and if the overpruned specs don't at least get some flavor or variety back in the specs it will be, as they say in polite society, pretty fuckin' shitty.

    Geth
  • I needed anime to post.I needed anime to post. boom Registered User regular
  • drunkenpandarendrunkenpandaren Slapping all the goblin ham In the top laneRegistered User regular
    I miss playing my wack a mole arms Warrior.

    Origin: HaxtonWasHere
    Steam: pandas_gota_gun
  • Grape ApeGrape Ape Registered User regular

    They sure do bandy about "core fantasy" a lot for some pretty generic archetypes.

    Lorahalo
  • drunkenpandarendrunkenpandaren Slapping all the goblin ham In the top laneRegistered User regular
    Wing Clip is back with a vengeance. Also, I always have missed playing my White Lion from WAR.

    Origin: HaxtonWasHere
    Steam: pandas_gota_gun
    ArthilTransporterShadowfire
  • ZythonZython Registered User regular

    Survival gets Mongoose Bite. I just saved you several minutes.

    Switch: SW-3245-5421-8042 | 3DS Friend Code: 4854-6465-0299 | PSN: Zaithon
    Steam: pazython
  • InfamyDeferredInfamyDeferred Registered User regular
    Marksman gets Explosive shot and Lock and Load. Glad to see one of the more fun procs in the game not disappear.

  • LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    Superficially, the hunter changes look nice.

    Halfmex
  • NobodyNobody Registered User regular
    Laceration

    35 Focus, Melee Range, Instant, 10 sec cooldown
    Tear a wound in the target, dealing heavy damage over 12 sec.
    Developer Comment: We promise it will do good damage!

    Hah!

    HalfmexBobble
  • PMAversPMAvers Registered User regular
    The return of Raptor Strike!

    persona4celestia.jpg
    COME FORTH, AMATERASU! - Switch Friend Code SW-5465-2458-5696 - Twitch
This discussion has been closed.