I got the Pale Jiangshi outfit from Mushin's Tower today which is nice! Apparently summoner's heal and cat taunt are both broken. I didn't notice the heal cause I don't usually take much damage and I thought the taunt was made to be more in line with the tooltip since it now drops hate immediately at 8 seconds instead of lasting through 10-12 seconds(and the recast timer) but boy there are a bunch of unhappy summoners in faction chat and on the official forums about the bugs and not having complete easy mode (still easy mode <.<)
I started doing tag team dailies after the patch since I need zen beans for sunflower skill and I don't know why I was skipping them, they're pretty fun and I enjoy spectating.
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Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
I realized a thing about pvp today for me. I love PVP in this game and it is still one of the primary factors in why I want to play it. I just happened to also enjoy the PVE more than I thought and I do need to keep my char up to par in PVE to keep everything unlocked for PVP.
But like, the best way I can describe going about doing pvp is like getting into a sorta cold pool. There is this fear and worry about it being rough and hard to handle at first but you know once you go in in a little bit you are fine and never wanna stop. For some reason that is how PVP is with me. I keep being wary of going in because of reasons I don't even know, but whenever I do it takes up my whole night. Maybe that is one of the reasons? Also the work needed to go back over my whole skill setup for pvp. Like last night I wanted to do it, but after getting involved in all the new PVE I never got around to it.
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Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
I have been trying to figure out what is going on with the whole soulshield situation now and well... soulshields are needlessly convoluted and there is almost no reliable source of information on them. And the people who do know how they work talk about them like there IS a good source of information and people should just KNOW.
Apparently they get 2 stats (a primary and secondary) and in the case of dungeon shields, the primary and base HP (base hp is its own thing btw, but can ALSO be either primary or secondary) have 3 randomly rolled values and the secondary has 2 randomly rolled values from 3 randomly rolled possible stats.
What is worse, is if HP is a primary or secondary, it simply adds to the hp on the shield. Which means it would have a possibility of 9 different values. The only way to know this is if the shield has only 1 other stat.
On top of all this making it incredibly hard to get a "good" roll on a soulshield, it appears that the better rolls are much rarer in general. Something that seems to be surprising to people and thus maybe unique to our region? Yay.
I opened a few doubles of my Endless SS pieces last night and they came up identical. So I had to research because I was certain they could have different outcomes. Glad I figured this out 4 hours later through scouring the trash bins of the internet
Since different values don't stack, I usually wait til I have a few to open them, I'm not 100% at all but I think when you sort, the one on the right is higher primary value.
Watching the weekly stream from earlier today. They confirmed that the dev team is working on fixes for the master loot issue but will take a bit since the problem is unique to our region, no one abuses the system in the other regions. Basically the same questions from previous weeks. No warlock til they announce it, sooner than other regions and not 6 months - 1 year down the line.
Been playing this game a fair bit recently, and getting close to 45.
Tried pvp for the first time today as a force master and was kinda of overwhelmed. How the heck do I beat assassins and blade dancers? And is there a specific way to see when a KFM is countering? And I guess, just general pvp tips if someone here has experience. It was fun as hell, but really confusing. Getting stunlocked 100% by a blade dancer had me wondering wtf I was missing.
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Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
First, FM is hands down the most intense PVP there is really. Also second worst class ATM (though not bad, just at the bottom of the totem pole) only above BM, which happens to be their hardest matchup so that makes it feel even worse. That being said, it CAN be a noob killer at the lowest levels.
BD and Des you have to be patient more than any other class. PVP is all about patience anyway - you dont just throw out damage willy nilly. You find the right time, and do a chunk of damage, then hold back BD and Des teach you this because they can spin and deflect most of your shit. Both their spins spec to deflect for the first 0.5 seconds of the spin (which seems to last roughly a second, so about the first half). So you have to wait for the spin, and cast a little late. Also they cannot be Stunned Dazed or Knocked back during the ENTIRE spin. Knockdowns work... which FM has a significant lack of. But force grip also works, so that is a good go to. Also, spins use focus (though they recover it when they deflect) so you can starve them by kiting. BD will throw a spinning blade at you occasionally when you do this because it gives them focus recovery for 8 seconds on a 9 second CD. If you can see it coming, you can avoid it (spec your 1 down the left side to block projectiles and time it well, otherwise sidestep it). This is also a good time to attempt to land something on them since they need to do some of the animation before they spin again, so you can easilly land a frost palm or even choose to do a stun then. Des are easier to kite, not only cause their focus regen is worst without that ranged option, but because their leap is VERY telegraphed.
Outside of that, with assassins and KFM, you have to expect GOOD ones to time their counter based on seeing the balls of light going toward them. If they just throw it out, you can spec snowball (ice X) to break guard. Its the middle line. If you go 4 points deep it prevents more guard for 6 seconds if you manage to break it. On those classes, this allows you to go ham. This is especially important on BM though, because they can guard EVERYTHING and their guard can be specced to deflect in the beginning like the spins. Cept guard costs no focus, and it has a short CD, and still blocks things after the deflect period. BM is rough. They also have tons of movement abilities, which comes to the next thing.
Chill prevents charge skills. Which is almost everything that can stop you from kiting them. You want this. But, when you have 2 stacks of chill on them and hit them with a chill again it goes away and becomes frozen. This doesn't prevent charges and can be removed by everyones backdash. Smart players know this, and the second you frozen them they backdash, so you cannot add a new chill because they are immune and then immediately charge you. Usually said charge is a CC or is followed so soon by a CC you are now getting combod. Bad. ALWAYS follow a new source of chill that will freeze them with 1. So they hit at the same time (well the 1 nearly immediately after). If it is a DES or a BD that is spinning, then do not frozen them at all unless they are not spinning. If the class you are fighting is doing a good job of preventing you from getting that stun off, you can use force grip. Force grip into Drain drops them at your feet with a very brief period where you can hit them and they cannot act. So you drain then as soon as you can act frost palm and 1 at the same time. They need to have 2 chill to do that though. If a class is giving you a hard time getting those sources of chill in, speccing ice Z down the left makes it chill through defenses. Long CD, but it can be another option along with force grip to land it. Also, you can spec snowball X down the right to prevent offensive defense for 4 seconds. That is any deflection skills like spin. That can give you an opening as well.
Outside of that, you need to learn what your damage combo is. I still can't do it right. But it would be when their tab is down 3 (3 should be specced into the stun) -> rmb lmb x rmb lmb 1 rmb lmb 1 TAB (specced to launch CCed targets) z (specced to launch CCed after 3 seconds) rmb 4 (aerial grip) 1 to drop them just as the Z goes off -> spam F until they fall. Obviously you can do any amount of that as well (tab can come after you land any 1 stun, if you just need to get some damage in). If you pull it all off with good ping, its a considerable amount of damage.
Yes, just got a FM as my 5th placement. Fairly sure there was some lag though, but that damage output was absurd (the lag just makes it nearly impossible to land things since short 1-2 sec CDs are over and you're getting slugged before you can follow up. It's really annoying to have Searing Palm miss because of lag)
This is compared to my 2nd placement, where I think he might have been the one suffering the lag - the second round I annihilated him and he couldn't do much (somehow I still ended at 80% even though I basically just charged into him, slammed him into the wall, and then held him there with chain CC while I tore him up)
SpectrumArcher of InfernoChaldea Rec RoomRegistered Userregular
edited February 2016
Still got worked over by a BD. The matches were vaguely competitive but eventually too many free opportunities to spin-stun and welp.
Also got literally shit on by a Summoner within 20 seconds in both matches, not sure what I'm supposed to be doing there. Picked up cat, slept cat, was already down to 1/3 life, summoner soloed me down or had cat wake back up and murder me anyway.
I, uh, feel good about dumpstering another FM in a mirror match at least?
Here's a stupid basic question--what am I supposed to be doing as FM against those bird type bosses that take off periodically and bombard whoever has aggro with feathers? On my end the incoming marker is so fast that it's practically impossible to dash out of it and I can only Ice Block so often.
Spectrum on
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SpectrumArcher of InfernoChaldea Rec RoomRegistered Userregular
Well, good night for costumes at least. Dark Sandstorm dropped and also managed to win on the Old Stratus Empire Armor. Probably overbid on that one but oh well, it's only money.
+1
Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
FM can shit all over summoner as long as they aren't pitch perfect.
It is the one match up where you throw out all the normal PVP mentalities and kind of just go ham. Even when I was watching Madoshi (pretty much the top FM in US) he would refer to it as "pve time"
So you take burn build damage, though you need your tab escape to work on grabs. It is worth it to take the ice block that has the long cd but heals for way more, cause the match shouldn't go longer than 1 min anyway. Then make sure you take 3 point into either divine veil (if you have em you could try going 4 down the left, sitting in your shield and healing for insane amounts).
Summoners have one answer and its petals. I dunno the name, but flower petals float around them for a little while making them immune to ranged (kind of like veil). When that is down burn them and spam 2 and fireball. Try not to catch the cat but if you do, burn his ass too. The summoner will likely panic and make him curl.
I switched to this strat and absolutely demolished summoners. It is actually quite cute when you see them start to panic the first round and literally crumble.
Summoners are the one class I currently change up my build for. I actually drop the ice guard on KFM to take the super-heal grapple; which lets me recover anything I lose exploding the cat (because I can heal 20% of my max HP each time I get a grab).
FM can shit all over summoner as long as they aren't pitch perfect.
It is the one match up where you throw out all the normal PVP mentalities and kind of just go ham. Even when I was watching Madoshi (pretty much the top FM in US) he would refer to it as "pve time"
So you take burn build damage, though you need your tab escape to work on grabs. It is worth it to take the ice block that has the long cd but heals for way more, cause the match shouldn't go longer than 1 min anyway. Then make sure you take 3 point into either divine veil (if you have em you could try going 4 down the left, sitting in your shield and healing for insane amounts).
Summoners have one answer and its petals. I dunno the name, but flower petals float around them for a little while making them immune to ranged (kind of like veil). When that is down burn them and spam 2 and fireball. Try not to catch the cat but if you do, burn his ass too. The summoner will likely panic and make him curl.
I switched to this strat and absolutely demolished summoners. It is actually quite cute when you see them start to panic the first round and literally crumble.
Summoners are the one class I currently change up my build for. I actually drop the ice guard on KFM to take the super-heal grapple; which lets me recover anything I lose exploding the cat (because I can heal 20% of my max HP each time I get a grab).
Hrm. Okay, I'll give that a shot. What happened to me was I got catrushed and CCd and literally by the time I escaped and slept the cat, I was already mostly dead. I'm not sure burn build would have helped me in that particular encounter.
So I got my assassin to 21 and Blackram Narrows last night, now I just need to cross my fingers that it won't take 50+ runs to get my dagger this time!
Levelling feels much faster when I'm not dicking around with stabbing Crimsons and obsessing over the wheel outfits.
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Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
FM can shit all over summoner as long as they aren't pitch perfect.
It is the one match up where you throw out all the normal PVP mentalities and kind of just go ham. Even when I was watching Madoshi (pretty much the top FM in US) he would refer to it as "pve time"
So you take burn build damage, though you need your tab escape to work on grabs. It is worth it to take the ice block that has the long cd but heals for way more, cause the match shouldn't go longer than 1 min anyway. Then make sure you take 3 point into either divine veil (if you have em you could try going 4 down the left, sitting in your shield and healing for insane amounts).
Summoners have one answer and its petals. I dunno the name, but flower petals float around them for a little while making them immune to ranged (kind of like veil). When that is down burn them and spam 2 and fireball. Try not to catch the cat but if you do, burn his ass too. The summoner will likely panic and make him curl.
I switched to this strat and absolutely demolished summoners. It is actually quite cute when you see them start to panic the first round and literally crumble.
Summoners are the one class I currently change up my build for. I actually drop the ice guard on KFM to take the super-heal grapple; which lets me recover anything I lose exploding the cat (because I can heal 20% of my max HP each time I get a grab).
Hrm. Okay, I'll give that a shot. What happened to me was I got catrushed and CCd and literally by the time I escaped and slept the cat, I was already mostly dead. I'm not sure burn build would have helped me in that particular encounter.
There should be no way you can be killed that fast if you escape the cat grab. The second the cat is on top of you, tab and you are immune to damage.
Also like I said, divine veil prevents almost all the damage summoners do. The rest is the cat and you should tab out of his big damage like I said.
I have been blown up by a summoner before too, but it was because I didn't use veil or get out of cat grab. Otherwise their damage should not be a huge issue.
Yeah... some outfits are not worth obsessing over. I just did a couple runs/day when getting Pugilist - grab the daily, run it, enter cross server dungeons to do one, exit, run the reset dungeon, repeat.
It took almost as long to run out as it did to clear it at 40+ :P
SpectrumArcher of InfernoChaldea Rec RoomRegistered Userregular
Had a better run doing my dailies today, at least. 3-0 in 1s and 3s today. Close match against a BM and then crushed two Sins. Then had a tough match with two pretty heavy teammates who didn't tag quickly, then dropped that group and got partied with a Summoner and BD who pretty easily carried for two victories.
3s are interesting. I don't particularly like FM as a Lead right now but I think they're a pretty killer assist. Stun into Inferno into Meteor Shower is pretty respectable burst.
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Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
IS anyone interested in throwing down some 3v3 tonight to at least get the quest done? I haven't done it in so long.
@Kai_San thanks for the tips, helped a fair bit. Still feel confused as hell, but seems like this is a game that will need practice to even get decent at.
Hit 20, trying to get a Blight weapon to upgrade my Hongmoon sword. Starting to feel this game is not for me, fun as the combat can be. I have better stuff to do with my time than wait for RNG in 2016.
That said, it is a free game and I could buy one of the special keys as they are quite cheap, but I wonder how often is this situation going to come up. It appears the later keys are much pricier.
Hit 20, trying to get a Blight weapon to upgrade my Hongmoon sword. Starting to feel this game is not for me, fun as the combat can be. I have better stuff to do with my time than wait for RNG in 2016.
That said, it is a free game and I could buy one of the special keys as they are quite cheap, but I wonder how often is this situation going to come up. It appears the later keys are much pricier.
All your advancement is subject to the RNG, sad to say. I've had the worst luck with Blackram Narrows, but if you run the missions with smaller groups/with the clan then you're more likely to get what you need as well.
I just bought the keys most of the time, late game anyways. I was super lucky while leveling and got most of the weapons easily. When I hit 45 I was pretty much the same, didnt have time for all that and bought 3 keys. Now I've got the weapon for the next 2 upgrades but that wont be for quite some time.
And 7th floor Mushin is a joke for Des, was almost disappointing. Oh well, easy loot and gold from now on.
"If a cherry pie filled cape is wrong, I don't want to be right.
I'm dead serious."
Okay, someone please explain to me the 3RF thing for KFM. I'm trying to figure out what actual moves this combo uses and/or what points need to be spent where.
Okay, someone please explain to me the 3RF thing for KFM. I'm trying to figure out what actual moves this combo uses and/or what points need to be spent where.
Take Leg Sweep and unlock Shin Kick. This is the 3 part.
R is an alternate input for LMB. Conveniently, it's right between 3 and F.
On Cyclone Kick, take either the second or third branch (so it's instant cooldown). This is your F.
Then, when an enemy is in any valid state for Shin Kick (solo, this means stun or daze, but someone else grabbing them works too), you hit 3, R, F in quick succession. This will do Shin Kick, cancel into a regular punch, and then cancel into Cyclone Kick. Basically you fire a bunch of attacks really fast, and as long as they're in a stun/daze you can keep spamming it out (or as long as you have focus, depending on if you went with Searing Kick or not). Then when the CC is about to wear off you have a lot of options to go into (realistically, you're only going to get 1 or 2 cycles) since Cyclone Kick leads into a ton of shit... though Smite (AKA Shoryuken) is high on the priority list as another CC that lets you beat on them for a bit (launches are easily chained on KFM, you can take it into grapple...).
Also of note is that Shin Kick leads into Searing Palm, and 3RF goes off fast enough that it's still up afterwards. Doing 3RFXF (to searing>smite), then the full air combo is exactly 5 hits (1 for smite, 3 mid-air, 1 slam)... and you can skill Searing Palm to stun after 5 hits (though honestly you may be better off landing instead of doing the second hit and using it as a window for 2 or 4 or both)... and guess what stun leads to? 3RF!
Basically, KFM has a lot of ways to get into it, and a lot of ways to come out of it, and it does good damage with minimal resources, so it's just their bread and butter when comboing a poor bastard.
I mean, to be honest... KFM after the last patch is just straight up dial-a-combo.
From dodge, the following is 100% CC-locked:
Dodge>Triple Kick>3RF3RF>RMB launch>LMB air combo>fall>Tremor>3RF3RF>Searing Palm>Smite>LMB air combo>Fall>Tiger Strike (procs stun)>Hellfire Kick (hits too hard not to fire here)>3RF3RF>Rising Dragon (MORE STUNS)>3RF3RF>Flurry (whatever? I guess traited for daze, so you can...)>3RF...
You'll probably have a second Searing Palm in there towards the end if you went Searing Kick? Although I'm not entirely sure it works right with Searing due to it being a 3-hit move instead of 1 - it may add too much delay for the normal 3RF spam fire (the main difference is that it rebuilds focus instead of spending it though), or at least too slow to get a second round during a 2-sec stun (speaking of which, that combo assumes Rising Dragon and Tremor are both skilled enough to have 2 sec of stun).
The fun part is that any lag and you'll drop that combo, too - KFM does poorly with lag since they really need to hit short CC windows to keep linking things (for instance - deliberately not using the second air combo hit so you fall down first, giving you a half second to get into animation of another hit before they can do anything).
Also note that none of that combo uses knockdowns... which sadly KFM doesn't get to make great use of in PvP due to turning Grapple into Ice Guard (which is also really helpful for dungeons, or turn it into a monster damage buff skill...). I do go back to Grapple t3 s2 (the heal on hit one) for summoners though, because getting back 20% HP off basically any CC is a godsend and cats can't avoid CC worth a damn.
But it's worth remembering that not only can you backstep into smite (this is important on FM - break freeze with backstep and immediately launch them), you eventually get a LMB move off backstep that's a lunge into knockdown (basically smite except knockdown instead of launch). For bosses this is great - you can SS>LMB>3 to get two knockdowns on them in an instant to interrupt things. And of course knockdown leads nicely into one of your stuns to start the 3RF gravy train.
Okay, someone please explain to me the 3RF thing for KFM. I'm trying to figure out what actual moves this combo uses and/or what points need to be spent where.
Take Leg Sweep and unlock Shin Kick. This is the 3 part.
R is an alternate input for LMB. Conveniently, it's right between 3 and F.
On Cyclone Kick, take either the second or third branch (so it's instant cooldown). This is your F.
Then, when an enemy is in any valid state for Shin Kick (solo, this means stun or daze, but someone else grabbing them works too), you hit 3, R, F in quick succession. This will do Shin Kick, cancel into a regular punch, and then cancel into Cyclone Kick. Basically you fire a bunch of attacks really fast, and as long as they're in a stun/daze you can keep spamming it out (or as long as you have focus, depending on if you went with Searing Kick or not). Then when the CC is about to wear off you have a lot of options to go into (realistically, you're only going to get 1 or 2 cycles) since Cyclone Kick leads into a ton of shit... though Smite (AKA Shoryuken) is high on the priority list as another CC that lets you beat on them for a bit (launches are easily chained on KFM, you can take it into grapple...).
Also of note is that Shin Kick leads into Searing Palm, and 3RF goes off fast enough that it's still up afterwards. Doing 3RFXF (to searing>smite), then the full air combo is exactly 5 hits (1 for smite, 3 mid-air, 1 slam)... and you can skill Searing Palm to stun after 5 hits (though honestly you may be better off landing instead of doing the second hit and using it as a window for 2 or 4 or both)... and guess what stun leads to? 3RF!
Basically, KFM has a lot of ways to get into it, and a lot of ways to come out of it, and it does good damage with minimal resources, so it's just their bread and butter when comboing a poor bastard.
I mean, to be honest... KFM after the last patch is just straight up dial-a-combo.
From dodge, the following is 100% CC-locked:
Dodge>Triple Kick>3RF3RF>RMB launch>LMB air combo>fall>Tremor>3RF3RF>Searing Palm>Smite>LMB air combo>Fall>Tiger Strike (procs stun)>Hellfire Kick (hits too hard not to fire here)>3RF3RF>Rising Dragon (MORE STUNS)>3RF3RF>Flurry (whatever? I guess traited for daze, so you can...)>3RF...
You'll probably have a second Searing Palm in there towards the end if you went Searing Kick? Although I'm not entirely sure it works right with Searing due to it being a 3-hit move instead of 1 - it may add too much delay for the normal 3RF spam fire (the main difference is that it rebuilds focus instead of spending it though), or at least too slow to get a second round during a 2-sec stun (speaking of which, that combo assumes Rising Dragon and Tremor are both skilled enough to have 2 sec of stun).
The fun part is that any lag and you'll drop that combo, too - KFM does poorly with lag since they really need to hit short CC windows to keep linking things (for instance - deliberately not using the second air combo hit so you fall down first, giving you a half second to get into animation of another hit before they can do anything).
Also note that none of that combo uses knockdowns... which sadly KFM doesn't get to make great use of in PvP due to turning Grapple into Ice Guard (which is also really helpful for dungeons, or turn it into a monster damage buff skill...). I do go back to Grapple t3 s2 (the heal on hit one) for summoners though, because getting back 20% HP off basically any CC is a godsend and cats can't avoid CC worth a damn.
But it's worth remembering that not only can you backstep into smite (this is important on FM - break freeze with backstep and immediately launch them), you eventually get a LMB move off backstep that's a lunge into knockdown (basically smite except knockdown instead of launch). For bosses this is great - you can SS>LMB>3 to get two knockdowns on them in an instant to interrupt things. And of course knockdown leads nicely into one of your stuns to start the 3RF gravy train.
THANK YOU. This made so much more sense than what I was trying to do. /bow_formal
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SpectrumArcher of InfernoChaldea Rec RoomRegistered Userregular
Posts
...Oh god I will probably have to wait the 7 day deletion time.
I started doing tag team dailies after the patch since I need zen beans for sunflower skill and I don't know why I was skipping them, they're pretty fun and I enjoy spectating.
But like, the best way I can describe going about doing pvp is like getting into a sorta cold pool. There is this fear and worry about it being rough and hard to handle at first but you know once you go in in a little bit you are fine and never wanna stop. For some reason that is how PVP is with me. I keep being wary of going in because of reasons I don't even know, but whenever I do it takes up my whole night. Maybe that is one of the reasons? Also the work needed to go back over my whole skill setup for pvp. Like last night I wanted to do it, but after getting involved in all the new PVE I never got around to it.
Apparently they get 2 stats (a primary and secondary) and in the case of dungeon shields, the primary and base HP (base hp is its own thing btw, but can ALSO be either primary or secondary) have 3 randomly rolled values and the secondary has 2 randomly rolled values from 3 randomly rolled possible stats.
What is worse, is if HP is a primary or secondary, it simply adds to the hp on the shield. Which means it would have a possibility of 9 different values. The only way to know this is if the shield has only 1 other stat.
On top of all this making it incredibly hard to get a "good" roll on a soulshield, it appears that the better rolls are much rarer in general. Something that seems to be surprising to people and thus maybe unique to our region? Yay.
I opened a few doubles of my Endless SS pieces last night and they came up identical. So I had to research because I was certain they could have different outcomes. Glad I figured this out 4 hours later through scouring the trash bins of the internet
Tried pvp for the first time today as a force master and was kinda of overwhelmed. How the heck do I beat assassins and blade dancers? And is there a specific way to see when a KFM is countering? And I guess, just general pvp tips if someone here has experience. It was fun as hell, but really confusing. Getting stunlocked 100% by a blade dancer had me wondering wtf I was missing.
BD and Des you have to be patient more than any other class. PVP is all about patience anyway - you dont just throw out damage willy nilly. You find the right time, and do a chunk of damage, then hold back BD and Des teach you this because they can spin and deflect most of your shit. Both their spins spec to deflect for the first 0.5 seconds of the spin (which seems to last roughly a second, so about the first half). So you have to wait for the spin, and cast a little late. Also they cannot be Stunned Dazed or Knocked back during the ENTIRE spin. Knockdowns work... which FM has a significant lack of. But force grip also works, so that is a good go to. Also, spins use focus (though they recover it when they deflect) so you can starve them by kiting. BD will throw a spinning blade at you occasionally when you do this because it gives them focus recovery for 8 seconds on a 9 second CD. If you can see it coming, you can avoid it (spec your 1 down the left side to block projectiles and time it well, otherwise sidestep it). This is also a good time to attempt to land something on them since they need to do some of the animation before they spin again, so you can easilly land a frost palm or even choose to do a stun then. Des are easier to kite, not only cause their focus regen is worst without that ranged option, but because their leap is VERY telegraphed.
Outside of that, with assassins and KFM, you have to expect GOOD ones to time their counter based on seeing the balls of light going toward them. If they just throw it out, you can spec snowball (ice X) to break guard. Its the middle line. If you go 4 points deep it prevents more guard for 6 seconds if you manage to break it. On those classes, this allows you to go ham. This is especially important on BM though, because they can guard EVERYTHING and their guard can be specced to deflect in the beginning like the spins. Cept guard costs no focus, and it has a short CD, and still blocks things after the deflect period. BM is rough. They also have tons of movement abilities, which comes to the next thing.
Chill prevents charge skills. Which is almost everything that can stop you from kiting them. You want this. But, when you have 2 stacks of chill on them and hit them with a chill again it goes away and becomes frozen. This doesn't prevent charges and can be removed by everyones backdash. Smart players know this, and the second you frozen them they backdash, so you cannot add a new chill because they are immune and then immediately charge you. Usually said charge is a CC or is followed so soon by a CC you are now getting combod. Bad. ALWAYS follow a new source of chill that will freeze them with 1. So they hit at the same time (well the 1 nearly immediately after). If it is a DES or a BD that is spinning, then do not frozen them at all unless they are not spinning. If the class you are fighting is doing a good job of preventing you from getting that stun off, you can use force grip. Force grip into Drain drops them at your feet with a very brief period where you can hit them and they cannot act. So you drain then as soon as you can act frost palm and 1 at the same time. They need to have 2 chill to do that though. If a class is giving you a hard time getting those sources of chill in, speccing ice Z down the left makes it chill through defenses. Long CD, but it can be another option along with force grip to land it. Also, you can spec snowball X down the right to prevent offensive defense for 4 seconds. That is any deflection skills like spin. That can give you an opening as well.
Outside of that, you need to learn what your damage combo is. I still can't do it right. But it would be when their tab is down 3 (3 should be specced into the stun) -> rmb lmb x rmb lmb 1 rmb lmb 1 TAB (specced to launch CCed targets) z (specced to launch CCed after 3 seconds) rmb 4 (aerial grip) 1 to drop them just as the Z goes off -> spam F until they fall. Obviously you can do any amount of that as well (tab can come after you land any 1 stun, if you just need to get some damage in). If you pull it all off with good ping, its a considerable amount of damage.
Thats most of the basics I think.
while he's sexy, is he sexy enough for the title Captain Dreamboat?
I'm having a hell of a time as Des, just nothing but KFM and BD, I can't do shit.
I'm dead serious."
Everything else should still be true though.
And fuck junghado, I almost got him, but still I seem to have WAY more trouble with him just in general than any videos of FM I saw.
This is compared to my 2nd placement, where I think he might have been the one suffering the lag - the second round I annihilated him and he couldn't do much (somehow I still ended at 80% even though I basically just charged into him, slammed him into the wall, and then held him there with chain CC while I tore him up)
3DS: 0473-8507-2652
Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
PSN: AbEntropy
Also got literally shit on by a Summoner within 20 seconds in both matches, not sure what I'm supposed to be doing there. Picked up cat, slept cat, was already down to 1/3 life, summoner soloed me down or had cat wake back up and murder me anyway.
I, uh, feel good about dumpstering another FM in a mirror match at least?
Requoting also:
It is the one match up where you throw out all the normal PVP mentalities and kind of just go ham. Even when I was watching Madoshi (pretty much the top FM in US) he would refer to it as "pve time"
So you take burn build damage, though you need your tab escape to work on grabs. It is worth it to take the ice block that has the long cd but heals for way more, cause the match shouldn't go longer than 1 min anyway. Then make sure you take 3 point into either divine veil (if you have em you could try going 4 down the left, sitting in your shield and healing for insane amounts).
Summoners have one answer and its petals. I dunno the name, but flower petals float around them for a little while making them immune to ranged (kind of like veil). When that is down burn them and spam 2 and fireball. Try not to catch the cat but if you do, burn his ass too. The summoner will likely panic and make him curl.
I switched to this strat and absolutely demolished summoners. It is actually quite cute when you see them start to panic the first round and literally crumble.
3DS: 0473-8507-2652
Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
PSN: AbEntropy
Hrm. Okay, I'll give that a shot. What happened to me was I got catrushed and CCd and literally by the time I escaped and slept the cat, I was already mostly dead. I'm not sure burn build would have helped me in that particular encounter.
Levelling feels much faster when I'm not dicking around with stabbing Crimsons and obsessing over the wheel outfits.
There should be no way you can be killed that fast if you escape the cat grab. The second the cat is on top of you, tab and you are immune to damage.
Also like I said, divine veil prevents almost all the damage summoners do. The rest is the cat and you should tab out of his big damage like I said.
I have been blown up by a summoner before too, but it was because I didn't use veil or get out of cat grab. Otherwise their damage should not be a huge issue.
It took almost as long to run out as it did to clear it at 40+ :P
3DS: 0473-8507-2652
Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
PSN: AbEntropy
3s are interesting. I don't particularly like FM as a Lead right now but I think they're a pretty killer assist. Stun into Inferno into Meteor Shower is pretty respectable burst.
Me! I want my Gold back.
// Switch: SW-5306-0651-6424 //
// Switch: SW-5306-0651-6424 //
Why would they not go double Summoner + Force Master, Destroyer, or Blade Master for the fantastic interrupt combos?
// Switch: SW-5306-0651-6424 //
That said, it is a free game and I could buy one of the special keys as they are quite cheap, but I wonder how often is this situation going to come up. It appears the later keys are much pricier.
Steam (Ansatz) || GW2 officer (Ansatz.6498)
All your advancement is subject to the RNG, sad to say. I've had the worst luck with Blackram Narrows, but if you run the missions with smaller groups/with the clan then you're more likely to get what you need as well.
And 7th floor Mushin is a joke for Des, was almost disappointing. Oh well, easy loot and gold from now on.
I'm dead serious."
Take Leg Sweep and unlock Shin Kick. This is the 3 part.
R is an alternate input for LMB. Conveniently, it's right between 3 and F.
On Cyclone Kick, take either the second or third branch (so it's instant cooldown). This is your F.
Then, when an enemy is in any valid state for Shin Kick (solo, this means stun or daze, but someone else grabbing them works too), you hit 3, R, F in quick succession. This will do Shin Kick, cancel into a regular punch, and then cancel into Cyclone Kick. Basically you fire a bunch of attacks really fast, and as long as they're in a stun/daze you can keep spamming it out (or as long as you have focus, depending on if you went with Searing Kick or not). Then when the CC is about to wear off you have a lot of options to go into (realistically, you're only going to get 1 or 2 cycles) since Cyclone Kick leads into a ton of shit... though Smite (AKA Shoryuken) is high on the priority list as another CC that lets you beat on them for a bit (launches are easily chained on KFM, you can take it into grapple...).
Also of note is that Shin Kick leads into Searing Palm, and 3RF goes off fast enough that it's still up afterwards. Doing 3RFXF (to searing>smite), then the full air combo is exactly 5 hits (1 for smite, 3 mid-air, 1 slam)... and you can skill Searing Palm to stun after 5 hits (though honestly you may be better off landing instead of doing the second hit and using it as a window for 2 or 4 or both)... and guess what stun leads to? 3RF!
Basically, KFM has a lot of ways to get into it, and a lot of ways to come out of it, and it does good damage with minimal resources, so it's just their bread and butter when comboing a poor bastard.
I mean, to be honest... KFM after the last patch is just straight up dial-a-combo.
From dodge, the following is 100% CC-locked:
Dodge>Triple Kick>3RF3RF>RMB launch>LMB air combo>fall>Tremor>3RF3RF>Searing Palm>Smite>LMB air combo>Fall>Tiger Strike (procs stun)>Hellfire Kick (hits too hard not to fire here)>3RF3RF>Rising Dragon (MORE STUNS)>3RF3RF>Flurry (whatever? I guess traited for daze, so you can...)>3RF...
You'll probably have a second Searing Palm in there towards the end if you went Searing Kick? Although I'm not entirely sure it works right with Searing due to it being a 3-hit move instead of 1 - it may add too much delay for the normal 3RF spam fire (the main difference is that it rebuilds focus instead of spending it though), or at least too slow to get a second round during a 2-sec stun (speaking of which, that combo assumes Rising Dragon and Tremor are both skilled enough to have 2 sec of stun).
The fun part is that any lag and you'll drop that combo, too - KFM does poorly with lag since they really need to hit short CC windows to keep linking things (for instance - deliberately not using the second air combo hit so you fall down first, giving you a half second to get into animation of another hit before they can do anything).
Also note that none of that combo uses knockdowns... which sadly KFM doesn't get to make great use of in PvP due to turning Grapple into Ice Guard (which is also really helpful for dungeons, or turn it into a monster damage buff skill...). I do go back to Grapple t3 s2 (the heal on hit one) for summoners though, because getting back 20% HP off basically any CC is a godsend and cats can't avoid CC worth a damn.
But it's worth remembering that not only can you backstep into smite (this is important on FM - break freeze with backstep and immediately launch them), you eventually get a LMB move off backstep that's a lunge into knockdown (basically smite except knockdown instead of launch). For bosses this is great - you can SS>LMB>3 to get two knockdowns on them in an instant to interrupt things. And of course knockdown leads nicely into one of your stuns to start the 3RF gravy train.
3DS: 0473-8507-2652
Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
PSN: AbEntropy
edit: For the record, was 44 FM at the time. Ended up swapping over to a very defensive Ice Rain build and using Impact to block projectiles.
THANK YOU. This made so much more sense than what I was trying to do. /bow_formal
Really? I swear that place was rated as a Solo Expert dungeon.