After hitting 60 and having the gear progression explained to me...I've learned I really don't like this game's gear progression. Most games will let you skip a good chunk of the early and maybe even middle area of the post-game gear grind and you can just start getting some of the 'okay' stuff immediately. I've never seen a game actually force you, through a random number check literally built into the game itself, to go through basically every single stage of the gear progression in the exact order they want you to experience it in.
It makes sense, when I look back at how they locked earlier progression behind story mode cutscenes, or how you have to do a dozen steps of padding to upgrade your weapon because they want you to look at all the patch content they made. I understand how they could decide to do it like this, I just think it's incredibly dumb and has made the game less fun in every instance that they've forced it upon me. I went from being really excited to not really sure I even want to play my level 60 job anymore, because now I have even more content to grind through, in the specific order and at the exact rate they want through arbitrary caps on what you can get per day/week, before I can even think about setting up my equipment how I want, or actually get to do anything with the guild.
After hitting 60 and having the gear progression explained to me...I've learned I really don't like this game's gear progression. Most games will let you skip a good chunk of the early and maybe even middle area of the post-game gear grind and you can just start getting some of the 'okay' stuff immediately. I've never seen a game actually force you, through a random number check literally built into the game itself, to go through basically every single stage of the gear progression in the exact order they want you to experience it in.
It makes sense, when I look back at how they locked earlier progression behind story mode cutscenes, or how you have to do a dozen steps of padding to upgrade your weapon because they want you to look at all the patch content they made. I understand how they could decide to do it like this, I just think it's incredibly dumb and has made the game less fun in every instance that they've forced it upon me. I went from being really excited to not really sure I even want to play my level 60 job anymore, because now I have even more content to grind through, in the specific order and at the exact rate they want through arbitrary caps on what you can get per day/week, before I can even think about setting up my equipment how I want, or actually get to do anything with the guild.
Since pretty much every post you make here is about what you DON'T like about the game, I'm curious, is there anything you DO like about it? It seems like you genuinely just don't enjoy playing the game and it looks like you might be forcing yourself to do so, which would be really strange. My guess is that you must actually like something about it if you keep playing, so i'm curious to know what parts of the game you enjoy.
NNID: delphinidaes Official PA Forums FFXIV:ARR Free Company <GHOST> gitl.enjin.com Join us on Sargatanas!
For MMOs in general I like quests where you kill some stuff and then get a reward that's good equipment. Or dungeons (that aren't too long) with fun encounters where you get useful loot.
I like the Monk class a lot, I like hand-to-hand classes in games where other classes use weapons (sad that you can't just use your fits in this game, but oh well). I also really like systems where you cycle through things, so the Monk skills are great for me.
I like the parts of the game where you get to use these skills to just attack things and get stuff for it. So when the game just lets me do that I'm having a ton of fun. I actually like the story and a lot of the characters, it just presents them in the worst pay possible.
For MMOs in general I like quests where you kill some stuff and then get a reward that's good equipment. Or dungeons (that aren't too long) with fun encounters where you get useful loot.
I like the Monk class a lot, I like hand-to-hand classes in games where other classes use weapons (sad that you can't just use your fits in this game, but oh well). I also really like systems where you cycle through things, so the Monk skills are great for me.
I like the parts of the game where you get to use these skills to just attack things and get stuff for it. So when the game just lets me do that I'm having a ton of fun. I actually like the story and a lot of the characters, it just presents them in the worst pay possible.
What specifically about the progression bothers you? The fact that certain dungeons are locked behind a higher item level?
I think you are in luck since you love the base combat and moment to moment interactions in FFXIV. You can do the roulettes and, over time get the currency to upgrade the stuff you want.
Or is it that it doesn't all come at once, or that you can't throw copious amounts of time at it to rush through the progression?
The fact that they literally lock you out of content because you haven't watched their cutscenes yet, or you don't have an arbitrary number high enough yet.
I don't want my ride to be locked at their speed. I have to do everything exactly when and how they want me to, and I don't like it. I'm not going to enjoy the ride because it's completely on their terms. I don't know, I'd rather be driving my own shitty car the way I want to drive it to where I want to go than sit on a slow moving train passing scenery I don't care about and stopping at places that don't interest me.
I'd rather have a real live person tell me, "Hey, you need X amount of HP to survive this attack so you can't do Y dungeon until your stats are that high." Instead of the game itself literally being hardcoded to not let me even walk into a dungeon until I have a random number high enough. As far as I can see I could be wearing all gear for the completely wrong class, but as long as it says 170 on it, I'm good. That's silly.
When I've hit max level in other games it's usually a big accomplishment that gets both me and others excited. It's usually immediately followed by people laying out how many dungeons/raids I can go to with them now, and being happy to have another person to run with. People usually want to immediately go do these things. Hitting max level here, I was immediately told by everyone still awake in chat to basically still not bother them for another 4-5 months (I believe I was told to buy a mostly full set of items that each take three weeks to unlock, hard limit by the game itself, before I would be allowed to do anything).
0
Just_Bri_ThanksSeething with ragefrom a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPAregular
edited December 2015
You can skip the gear progression for a good chunk of the content. All the gear in the level 50 dungeons has been obsoleted, and you can completely skip the formerly top tier gear from the crystal tower.
I have no doubt that the same thing will happen to the current top tier gear come next expansion.
Just_Bri_Thanks on
...and when you are done with that; take a folding
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
Hitting max level here, I was immediately told by everyone still awake in chat to basically still not bother them for another 4-5 months (I believe I was told to buy a mostly full set of items that each take three weeks to unlock, hard limit by the game itself, before I would be allowed to do anything).
I could see where that would be frustrating, particularly if they actually used those words, wow.
You can skip the gear progression for a good chunk of the content. All the gear in the level 50 dungeons has been obsoleted, and you can completely skip the formerly top tier gear from the crystal tower.
I have no doubt that the same thing will happen to the current top tier gear come next expansion.
You can skip the 50 endgame stuff, sure (I haven't done any of the 50 raids I guess). But you can't skip the 50-60 progression, or skip any steps in the 60 endgame progression.
Hitting max level here, I was immediately told by everyone still awake in chat to basically still not bother them for another 4-5 months (I believe I was told to buy a mostly full set of items that each take three weeks to unlock, hard limit by the game itself, before I would be allowed to do anything).
I could see where that would be frustrating, particularly if they actually used those words, wow.
Well I was told I needed to have X number. Then I was told X number gear only comes with whatever item set, which has a weekly cap. Then I was told how many pieces I needed and how many each piece costs in comparison to the weekly cap. And then I got really sad, stumbled into watching yet another 20 minute cutscene plus 20 minutes of credits. I just let it play in the background while I had a snack, wasn't really in the mood to play any more after that string of events.
The fact that they literally lock you out of content because you haven't watched their cutscenes yet, or you don't have an arbitrary number high enough yet.
I don't want my ride to be locked at their speed. I have to do everything exactly when and how they want me to, and I don't like it. I'm not going to enjoy the ride because it's completely on their terms. I don't know, I'd rather be driving my own shitty car the way I want to drive it to where I want to go than sit on a slow moving train passing scenery I don't care about and stopping at places that don't interest me.
I'd rather have a real live person tell me, "Hey, you need X amount of HP to survive this attack so you can't do Y dungeon until your stats are that high." Instead of the game itself literally being hardcoded to not let me even walk into a dungeon until I have a random number high enough. As far as I can see I could be wearing all gear for the completely wrong class, but as long as it says 170 on it, I'm good. That's silly.
When I've hit max level in other games it's usually a big accomplishment that gets both me and others excited. It's usually immediately followed by people laying out how many dungeons/raids I can go to with them now, and being happy to have another person to run with. People usually want to immediately go do these things. Hitting max level here, I was immediately told by everyone still awake in chat to basically still not bother them for another 4-5 months (I believe I was told to buy a mostly full set of items that each take three weeks to unlock, hard limit by the game itself, before I would be allowed to do anything).
That's not what we said.
Right now, you have a gear set at ilevel 145, which gets you into the Tier 1 60 dungeons. If you can get a full set of Asuran (upgraded Law) gear, that would put you at i180, which means you can run any content (the highest cap is i179.) Even a full set of base Law gear is i170, opening the door to Alexander and the Tier 2 60 dungeons, which drop i185 gear.
So, your first step is to get your Law (and then Asuran) weapon. Law weapons are 560 tomes, with the Doman Whetstone you need for upgrade being either 390 Centurio Seals, or 900 law. I'd recommend law for this, because Centurio seals can be used to get esoteric gear upgrades. With your first time bonuses on the dungeons, you should be able to get your law weapon pretty quick. In addition, the 160 gear you get from Tier 1 will boost your ilevel, and if you upgrade some Law gear to Asuran, it can counterbalance a piece of i160 gear.
Alternatively, if you can get the items together, there are a number of craters in the company that can make you Sky Pirate gear, which is i185. That would allow you to skip ahead as well.
We recommend saving esoterics for your weapon because your weapon is the best upgrade you can make. However, if you want to try to get a step ahead, a week's worth of esoterics can get you a belt or accessory, which would be i200. That would also give you a big edge as well.
The reason the game uses ilevel so heavily is because PUGing plays a much bigger role here. So instead of checking all your stats independently, the game says you have to be at a specific gearing level.
CorehealerThe ApothecaryThe softer edge of the universe.Registered Userregular
What exactly are you feeling you are being prevented from doing by not having a means to bypass the current gear progression? All that waits at the end of the line right now is Alexander Savage and Thordan Extreme, which are both ball busters (in a good way for experienced players). Getting to them is supposed to be a time and learning commitment like many things in games and MMOs.
What exactly do you feel you get from the game when you feel like you should have the ability to bypass these cutscenes and gear number requirements? Is the journey not as important as the destination because you don't find the journey enjoyable and would rather get whatever it is you think you want from the ending?
Do you think it would be fair to others to walk into a new higher difficulty dungeon without the minimum gear number (iLevel) requirement for said dungeon and, regardless of your own skill level, have a harder time contributing to the group's ability to complete the dungeon and therefore their fun?
I am struggling to understand the issues here and get the impression you just don't really like the game itself and how it's gameplay, which like all FF games is heavily narrative and RPG gear driven and not quite as non-linear as, say, a sandbox game, is done and how that seems to be preventing you from getting to your idea of fun. And that's fine, you don't enjoy it, you are entitled to your opinion.
To that I would say, give PvP and crafting and other quests beyond just what you think is important to the endgame like completion of the MSQ and doing all the requisite dungeons a try in order to avoid burning out on just one of the facets of this game's design. Otherwise I don't know what to tell you.
The fact that they literally lock you out of content because you haven't watched their cutscenes yet, or you don't have an arbitrary number high enough yet.
I don't want my ride to be locked at their speed. I have to do everything exactly when and how they want me to, and I don't like it. I'm not going to enjoy the ride because it's completely on their terms. I don't know, I'd rather be driving my own shitty car the way I want to drive it to where I want to go than sit on a slow moving train passing scenery I don't care about and stopping at places that don't interest me.
I'd rather have a real live person tell me, "Hey, you need X amount of HP to survive this attack so you can't do Y dungeon until your stats are that high." Instead of the game itself literally being hardcoded to not let me even walk into a dungeon until I have a random number high enough. As far as I can see I could be wearing all gear for the completely wrong class, but as long as it says 170 on it, I'm good. That's silly.
When I've hit max level in other games it's usually a big accomplishment that gets both me and others excited. It's usually immediately followed by people laying out how many dungeons/raids I can go to with them now, and being happy to have another person to run with. People usually want to immediately go do these things. Hitting max level here, I was immediately told by everyone still awake in chat to basically still not bother them for another 4-5 months (I believe I was told to buy a mostly full set of items that each take three weeks to unlock, hard limit by the game itself, before I would be allowed to do anything).
Well you can't equip the gear for the wrong class outside of accessories so that method doesn't really work.
The problem with your method is that players jump into content they are not geared for, and then get upset that the game isn't telling them they aren't geared for it. They ALSO get upset when other players tell them "Hey you need X amount of HP to survive this attack" which is how it used to be until they implemented minimum ilvls in more things.
By having a minimum ilvl you are at least guaranteeing that the requisite level of stats are there to theortically beat the goal, even if the accessories are not for the right job.
It's not arbitrary at all, it's a result of too many players wanting to "drive their own shitty car how they want to drive it" which made it stupidly frustrating to do any content since other players could only make up the difference so much, and if you got enough players with that mentality in your run it was literally impossible to continue.
Hell even WITH ilvl requirements you still get players with that mentality, just with how they play their Job instead, but at least with a bare minimum of gear you have a much better chance of completing the objective even if they are just mashing one button.
Your problem is that you hit lvl 60 a fair bit behind the curve, but before patch 3.2 where a lot of the restrictions will be removed. It's unfortunate but it's already been 5 months since Heavensward came out. In patch 3.2 you won't be restricted to only one piece of loot from Voidark, or 450 Eso tomes a week, and the new dungeons that come out will likely have ilvl 190 or 200 gear in them. It will be a fresh new tier of gear and you'll be be able to catch up must faster. Right now however you are still restricted just like everyone else, but without the benefit of having been playing the game at level 60 for months now.
This should help illustrate the current gear path:
Fresh 60:
Hit ilvl 145 with white items from vendors and gear from Library
Run Fractal/Neverreap for ilvl 160 gear and Tomes of Law
ilvl 170:
Run Pharaoh Sirius (Hard)/SMA for ilvl 185 gear and Tomes of Law/Eso
Run Alexander (Normal) for tokens you can turn in for ilvl 190 gear
ilvl 175:
Run Voidark each week for ilvl 200 gear and token to upgrade Eso gear to ilvl 210
ilvl 179:
Run Diadem for a chance at ilvl 210 gear with decent stats.
Run daily roulette for Law/Eso
Spend Law on ilvl 170 gear and upgrade it to ilvl 180 with upgrade items obtained via Law or Hunt seals
Spend Eso on ilvl 200 gear and upgrade it to ilvl 210 with upgrade items obtained via Voidark or Hunt seals.
Keep in mind when patch 3.0 came out the only thing people could do at endgame was farm up dungeons and collect Law. Max ilvl at that time was ilvl 180.
Then they unlocked Alexander (Normal) and you could start obtaining ilvl 190 gear, but you could only get one token from each boss per week. (This restriction has been removed)
Then they unlocked Alexander (Savage) and implemented Esoteric tomes which allowed people to start obtaining ilvl 200 and 210 gear. You can only kill each Savage boss once a week though and you are capped at 450 Eso tomes each week.
Then patch 3.1 came out and they added Void Ark and removed the Alexander (Normal) restrictions. This gave a new way to get ilvl 200 and other ways to upgrade to ilvl 210. This also added Diadem for another way to get ilvl 210.
So what you are looking for really is patch 3.2 to level the playing field again and let you start working on the new gear tier fresh. You are right at the back end of the current grind which is why you have quite a bit to do to catch up, but aren't quite at the point where they make it easier to do so just yet.
NNID: delphinidaes Official PA Forums FFXIV:ARR Free Company <GHOST> gitl.enjin.com Join us on Sargatanas!
+2
CorehealerThe ApothecaryThe softer edge of the universe.Registered Userregular
Past the law stuff a lot of us did immediately post expansion drop, the gear and alt job leveling grinds get significantly easier, especially as you get more jobs to 60 and can do the endgame stuff with more job variety/all the roulettes unlocked.
I think the real issue is less on what the developers have designed then in the presentation of everything and just how much there is to do to get caught up at points, which always necessitates catch up mechanics/quests/whatever to get people up to speed in more ways then one. And I imagine we will see more of that as Heavensward progresses and in future expansions but that they are still determining the best means to convey story and gear catch ups without ruining certain elements of the game or preventing people who want to see things fully the chance to do so or give too much away up front.
And that's the thing - you have 95% of the game unlocked. Right now, the only things that are blocked to you are the newest dungeons, Alex Normal, Void Ark, Diadem, and Alex Savage and Thordan EX, which are the current endgame with serious mechanics.
I do have to comment on the quick remark he made about UI in the beginning "A lot of your time will be spent staring at HP bars." For anyone new to healing - Yes the health bars are super important to be aware of, but use them like you use the gauges in a car. Glance at them frequently, keep them in your peripheral, but keep your eyes forward. It kind of leads to a comment he makes later about how "you can't really predict when a group member will make a mistake." If you keep your eyes on the battlefield, you totally can. It'll look something like this. If someone decides to stand up next to the tank, their health is probably going to get chunked by a cleave. You can have a heal casting when someone doesn't move out of an AoE fast enough. You can have a swiftcast/rez ready for the guy that doesn't dodge the one shot mechanic.
There's so many visual cues to what's going on, a lot of the time it's easier to pay attention to the boss/mob/environment animations than cast bars.
Actually when healing I move my party HP bars to just off-center of my screen so I don't have to worry about missing them.
Bought a couple of rings to get my overall iLevel up to 145 and unlocked Fractal. I hear that one is pretty fast, and I'm not really a fan of the Vanu, so I'll likely just grind that one for Law, a little bit of Eso, and gear.
I also unlocked Ravana EX and Bismarck EX, as well as Void Ark. I want Redbill's airship.
PSN/XBL/Nintendo/Origin/Steam: Nightslyr 3DS: 1607-1682-2948 Switch: SW-3515-0057-3813 FF XIV: Q'vehn Tia
Bought a couple of rings to get my overall iLevel up to 145 and unlocked Fractal. I hear that one is pretty fast, and I'm not really a fan of the Vanu, so I'll likely just grind that one for Law, a little bit of Eso, and gear.
I also unlocked Ravana EX and Bismarck EX, as well as Void Ark. I want Redbill's airship.
Get Neverreap unlocked and done so you can have the level 60 roulette which gives you daily bonus of law and esos.
That is a good explanation of what you can buy when, but at the end it still winds up with you having to wait for the game to allow you to have something. I don't like that it is imposing these artificial limits to make me go through the game at a certain pace. I have to run a very specific number of dungeons to get the points to buy equipment that will unlock the requirements they decided to impose. Then I have to spend a very specific amount of time collecting more points to get the next level of gear, where I notice they seem to have set the numbers just perfectly to stretch out how many weeks you need to grind, where you can't quite get what you want in 'just' two weeks.
What exactly are you feeling you are being prevented from doing by not having a means to bypass the current gear progression? All that waits at the end of the line right now is Alexander Savage and Thordan Extreme, which are both ball busters (in a good way for experienced players). Getting to them is supposed to be a time and learning commitment like many things in games and MMOs.
What exactly do you feel you get from the game when you feel like you should have the ability to bypass these cutscenes and gear number requirements? Is the journey not as important as the destination because you don't find the journey enjoyable and would rather get whatever it is you think you want from the ending?
Do you think it would be fair to others to walk into a new higher difficulty dungeon without the minimum gear number (iLevel) requirement for said dungeon and, regardless of your own skill level, have a harder time contributing to the group's ability to complete the dungeon and therefore their fun?
I am struggling to understand the issues here and get the impression you just don't really like the game itself and how it's gameplay, which like all FF games is heavily narrative and RPG gear driven and not quite as non-linear as, say, a sandbox game, is done and how that seems to be preventing you from getting to your idea of fun. And that's fine, you don't enjoy it, you are entitled to your opinion.
To that I would say, give PvP and crafting and other quests beyond just what you think is important to the endgame like completion of the MSQ and doing all the requisite dungeons a try in order to avoid burning out on just one of the facets of this game's design. Otherwise I don't know what to tell you.
I just want to do them in the order I want, spending how much time I want at the pace I want. I can't just skip the story and grind up to 60, because they lock locations and dungeons behind story cutscenes. I can't get deep into the story when I want because I have to stop in the middle to do a dungeon or trial. I have to do it exactly how they want me to do it, and I really don't like being forced to do this. I like the journey, the story and dungeons and quests, but I don't want to do it at the very specific pacing in a strict order like the want me to.
Most games like this, as soon as I hit max level, I would immediately go into a dungeon or raid and be almost fully geared at like 3/4 of whatever the current max is. No unlocking the dungeon or raid through a story. Most games have dungeons that actually drop items instead of just acculturating points. You either get the class equipment or a token to turn in for it. You roll or it's handed out. And if you're freshly maxed level you usually get an immediate set of decent gear after a quick set of runs. Because people (and the game itself) want you to quickly have decent gear to do the actual endgame content.
I don't like PvP. I tried crafting, and I'm interested, but I don't want to do it right now.
The problem with your method is that players jump into content they are not geared for, and then get upset that the game isn't telling them they aren't geared for it. They ALSO get upset when other players tell them "Hey you need X amount of HP to survive this attack" which is how it used to be until they implemented minimum ilvls in more things.
I would rather do it and fail and/or have a real human tell me I need better gear than have the game's code just say I don't deserve to see the dungeon yet. Most groups/guilds tend to wind up with ludicrously well geared people, usually the top tank/healer/damage, which can tip the scales so far they can take basically anyone willing to learn through 'normal' endgame content, to gear them up and train them for actual final endgame stuff. If I'm okay to good at the game I'll survive and get the gear to do actually difficult content. If I'm dumb and don't learn they'll either fail or drop me. The way this game is, as long as I just have one random number high enough for the game to allow it, I'm in there.
And that's the thing - you have 95% of the game unlocked. Right now, the only things that are blocked to you are the newest dungeons, Alex Normal, Void Ark, Diadem, and Alex Savage and Thordan EX, which are the current endgame with serious mechanics.
Yet these are then the only things that actually matter, because they're the only things groups are looking to do, the only things players ever want to do or bother setting up, or want to dedicate time to teaching people or helping people with. Any equipment I get below the next to last tier is functionally useless because it's just a placeholder that is on the block to be replaced, because it's just there to unlock the thing that will then unlock the thing I want to do with people.
I appreciate that you would rather have to fail and have a real human tell you, but that's not very fair to the other people who also have to fail just because you would prefer it that way. Which is why there are minimum ilvls. It sets a standard "you must be this high to ride" so you know in advance and you don't have groups constantly failing just because one dude would prefer it that way in the group.
NNID: delphinidaes Official PA Forums FFXIV:ARR Free Company <GHOST> gitl.enjin.com Join us on Sargatanas!
Yet you could have an experienced player on a new character that can't even look at a dungeon because one random number isn't high enough, but you could have someone who barely knows how to play yet has time and/or money with a character that bought some crafted gear and they could queue up in seconds.
Yet you could have an experienced player on a new character that can't even look at a dungeon because one random number isn't high enough, but you could have someone who barely knows how to play yet has time and/or money with a character that bought some crafted gear and they could queue up in seconds.
The skill is irrelevant, the person with the gear meets the minimum stats needed to theoretically defeat the content. Even at sub par skill the discrepancy won't necessarily be as large as say someone who is hot shit (or thinks they are) but goes in there in vastly inferior gear.
I think the bigger issue here is you seem to just want to do whatever you want regardless of how it impacts the other people playing the game.
Delphinidaes on
NNID: delphinidaes Official PA Forums FFXIV:ARR Free Company <GHOST> gitl.enjin.com Join us on Sargatanas!
+2
Just_Bri_ThanksSeething with ragefrom a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPAregular
... but at the end it still winds up with you having to wait for the game to allow you to have something. I don't like that it is imposing these artificial limits to make me go through the game at a certain pace.
Just like... every other game? If you want the best of everything with no effort involved go play a single player game and use a cheat code.
...and when you are done with that; take a folding
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
Yet you could have an experienced player on a new character that can't even look at a dungeon because one random number isn't high enough, but you could have someone who barely knows how to play yet has time and/or money with a character that bought some crafted gear and they could queue up in seconds.
The skill is irrelevant, the person with the gear meets the minimum stats needed to theoretically defeat the content. Even at sub par skill the discrepancy won't necessarily be as large as say someone who is hot shit (or thinks they are) but goes in there in vastly inferior gear.
I think the bigger issue here is you seem to just want to do whatever you want regardless of how it impacts the other people playing the game.
So you would say that the theoretical best healer (player) who has ever played who happens to be at 169/170 on that particular healer character should not be allowed to enter that dungeon? Even if every single other character in that group had, for example, the best possible gear in the game? And/or are also the theoretical best players ever?
I would like to play the game how I would like to play it, yes. I don't want a machine that only cares about numbers and if something is checked off or not to decide what I can do or when I can do it. A person can look at your gear and say, you're a little low, but you should be okay if you watch out for X. A person can recommend a new skill to use or where to pick up new gear. The machine can only spit out yes or no.
... but at the end it still winds up with you having to wait for the game to allow you to have something. I don't like that it is imposing these artificial limits to make me go through the game at a certain pace.
Just like... every other game? If you want the best of everything with no effort involved go play a single player game and use a cheat code.
Does every other multiplayer game have hard limits on when you can play each stage or other piece of content, and also limit how often you can play and how many rewards you can get? I don't know, does Call of Duty require you to play three weeks of Capture the Flag before it unlocks Team Deathmatch for you?
0
Just_Bri_ThanksSeething with ragefrom a handbasket.Registered User, ClubPAregular
edited December 2015
Call of duty isn't a good example to support your point when you are talking about locked content.
Hey uh, there's 4 free days of this huh? I've been sorta wanting to poke my head back in for a while. I do not have the latest expansion, is that still 40 bucks? I was near the level cap last time but 2-3 levels away on whatever class I had, but this was near launch. Of the rehaul that is.
Have they overhauled stuff a great deal since then? Will I be able to do much without the expansion? Definitely gonna try out the 4 days. PA guild active?
Hey uh, there's 4 free days of this huh? I've been sorta wanting to poke my head back in for a while. I do not have the latest expansion, is that still 40 bucks? I was near the level cap last time but 2-3 levels away on whatever class I had, but this was near launch. Of the rehaul that is.
Have they overhauled stuff a great deal since then? Will I be able to do much without the expansion? Definitely gonna try out the 4 days. PA guild active?
They add new content and Quality of Life patches every 3-4 months, as well as minor patches in between that.
Suffice to say a LOT has changed and there is a LOT to do, even without the expansion, certainly enough for 4 days worth of checking it out
The PA FC is very much active (We are actually one of the largest FC's on the server) and we'd be more than happy to invite you back in to chat and catch up on stuff or answer any questions about what may be different (note: a lot is different)
NNID: delphinidaes Official PA Forums FFXIV:ARR Free Company <GHOST> gitl.enjin.com Join us on Sargatanas!
Okay cool, thanks! Will definitely check it out for a few days. At least, once I figure out how to log back in. Apparently I had a security token set up but no longer have that app. Or that phone, even. Sent an email ticket to support as I have no idea what the "Emergency Removal Password" might be. Here's hoping.
Okay cool, thanks! Will definitely check it out for a few days. At least, once I figure out how to log back in. Apparently I had a security token set up but no longer have that app. Or that phone, even. Sent an email ticket to support as I have no idea what the "Emergency Removal Password" might be. Here's hoping.
I believe it's the 12 character code they give you when you set up the authenticator that they recommend you keep somewhere for whenever you have this sort of situation or get a new phone. But who knows how long ago now you got that.
Support should hopefully be able to give you the old one after security questions or help you with a new one.
Run daily roulette for Law/Eso
Spend Law on ilvl 170 gear and upgrade it to ilvl 180 with upgrade items obtained via Law or Hunt seals
Spend Eso on ilvl 200 gear and upgrade it to ilvl 210 with upgrade items obtained via Voidark or Hunt seals.
What are Hunt seals and how do you get them? I tried going to the Hunt board in Ishgard but there's no quests on it or near it or anything.
Run daily roulette for Law/Eso
Spend Law on ilvl 170 gear and upgrade it to ilvl 180 with upgrade items obtained via Law or Hunt seals
Spend Eso on ilvl 200 gear and upgrade it to ilvl 210 with upgrade items obtained via Voidark or Hunt seals.
What are Hunt seals and how do you get them? I tried going to the Hunt board in Ishgard but there's no quests on it or near it or anything.
There are enemies that spawn at intervals in each Heavensward Zone, they show up in three different Ranks:
B Rank: These spawn 5 seconds after being killed but only give you Seals if they are your weekly target.
A Rank: These spawn every 4-5 hours and award 40 Centurio Seals, 30 Poetics, and 10 Law
S Rank: These spawn every 3 days or so once a specific condition has been fulfilled (it varies with each S Rank), they award 100 Centurio Seals, 100 Poetics and 3 Law
Centurio Seals can be used to purchase upgrade components in the following manner:
500: Clan Mark Log (Used to purchase Eso gear upgrade items)
395: Doman Whetstone (Upgrades Law Weapon)
300: Doman Urushi (Upgrade Law Armor)
150: Raw Doman Urushi (Upgrade Law Accessory/Belt)
B ranks can be soloed easily
A Ranks need typically at least a party to defeat
S Ranks need a LOT of people to kill them.
There are also Daily marks you can do to go around and kill random marked monsters in the zones to get a bit of seals. You unlock these via a quest chain but I forget where it originates.
Delphinidaes on
NNID: delphinidaes Official PA Forums FFXIV:ARR Free Company <GHOST> gitl.enjin.com Join us on Sargatanas!
Does every other multiplayer game have hard limits on when you can play each stage or other piece of content, and also limit how often you can play and how many rewards you can get? I don't know, does Call of Duty require you to play three weeks of Capture the Flag before it unlocks Team Deathmatch for you?
Many MP games do, in fact, have gating. As was pointed out, CoD games routinely lock access to higher level MP content behind the rank system (which is geared to have a time dimension.) The three major MOBAs on the market (LoL, DOTA 2, HOTS) require players to reach a certain level to get full access to multiplayer, as well as having a matching system that only puts players of relatively similar level together.
Content in this game is regularly tuned to assume that all people participating will have a base stat level of the minimum item level. As people have pointed out, a player who has weaker gear will put pressure on the other party members to have to perform more optimally to succeed. If you run leveling roulette regularly, you'll see this happen a LOT in the sub-50 dungeons, as those dungeons have level and not ilevel restrictions, so it's not uncommon at all to see a player that's level 40 in level 20 gear. And yes, it makes a noticeable difference.
The big thing to realize is that i179 may seem like a huge gulf at the moment, but it really isn't. i170 is doable with a few days of running roulettes for tomes (once you hit 60, all the major roulettes - Trial, Leveling, Level 60 - give bonus law tomes), and then you can get the i185 gear from the expert dungeons. Plus, your first class is always the hardest to gear - any future classes benefit from the ability to accrue gear on your main, becoming much easier to bootstrap.
How do you tell what rank they are? How do you get a weekly target? You can only earn points once a week unless you happen to stumble onto the monster? How do you know it is going to give you points?
And I don't play any of those games, so I guess that's why I don't know. I have not seen that type of automatic in-game locking in any game I've played, as far as I remember.
I can't run the level 50 or 60 Roulette, and the game won't tell me why that is. It just has ??? listed.
Posts
It makes sense, when I look back at how they locked earlier progression behind story mode cutscenes, or how you have to do a dozen steps of padding to upgrade your weapon because they want you to look at all the patch content they made. I understand how they could decide to do it like this, I just think it's incredibly dumb and has made the game less fun in every instance that they've forced it upon me. I went from being really excited to not really sure I even want to play my level 60 job anymore, because now I have even more content to grind through, in the specific order and at the exact rate they want through arbitrary caps on what you can get per day/week, before I can even think about setting up my equipment how I want, or actually get to do anything with the guild.
Since pretty much every post you make here is about what you DON'T like about the game, I'm curious, is there anything you DO like about it? It seems like you genuinely just don't enjoy playing the game and it looks like you might be forcing yourself to do so, which would be really strange. My guess is that you must actually like something about it if you keep playing, so i'm curious to know what parts of the game you enjoy.
Official PA Forums FFXIV:ARR Free Company <GHOST> gitl.enjin.com Join us on Sargatanas!
I like the Monk class a lot, I like hand-to-hand classes in games where other classes use weapons (sad that you can't just use your fits in this game, but oh well). I also really like systems where you cycle through things, so the Monk skills are great for me.
I like the parts of the game where you get to use these skills to just attack things and get stuff for it. So when the game just lets me do that I'm having a ton of fun. I actually like the story and a lot of the characters, it just presents them in the worst pay possible.
What specifically about the progression bothers you? The fact that certain dungeons are locked behind a higher item level?
I think you are in luck since you love the base combat and moment to moment interactions in FFXIV. You can do the roulettes and, over time get the currency to upgrade the stuff you want.
Or is it that it doesn't all come at once, or that you can't throw copious amounts of time at it to rush through the progression?
You'll get there, just enjoy the ride.
Also, didn't they add an "emperor's new clothes" style item to glamour onto fists so you could bare-knuckle recently?
They did. The Lalafell glamour vendor in Rev Toll sells it for 10k.
I don't want my ride to be locked at their speed. I have to do everything exactly when and how they want me to, and I don't like it. I'm not going to enjoy the ride because it's completely on their terms. I don't know, I'd rather be driving my own shitty car the way I want to drive it to where I want to go than sit on a slow moving train passing scenery I don't care about and stopping at places that don't interest me.
I'd rather have a real live person tell me, "Hey, you need X amount of HP to survive this attack so you can't do Y dungeon until your stats are that high." Instead of the game itself literally being hardcoded to not let me even walk into a dungeon until I have a random number high enough. As far as I can see I could be wearing all gear for the completely wrong class, but as long as it says 170 on it, I'm good. That's silly.
When I've hit max level in other games it's usually a big accomplishment that gets both me and others excited. It's usually immediately followed by people laying out how many dungeons/raids I can go to with them now, and being happy to have another person to run with. People usually want to immediately go do these things. Hitting max level here, I was immediately told by everyone still awake in chat to basically still not bother them for another 4-5 months (I believe I was told to buy a mostly full set of items that each take three weeks to unlock, hard limit by the game itself, before I would be allowed to do anything).
I have no doubt that the same thing will happen to the current top tier gear come next expansion.
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
I could see where that would be frustrating, particularly if they actually used those words, wow.
You can skip the 50 endgame stuff, sure (I haven't done any of the 50 raids I guess). But you can't skip the 50-60 progression, or skip any steps in the 60 endgame progression.
Well I was told I needed to have X number. Then I was told X number gear only comes with whatever item set, which has a weekly cap. Then I was told how many pieces I needed and how many each piece costs in comparison to the weekly cap. And then I got really sad, stumbled into watching yet another 20 minute cutscene plus 20 minutes of credits. I just let it play in the background while I had a snack, wasn't really in the mood to play any more after that string of events.
That's not what we said.
Right now, you have a gear set at ilevel 145, which gets you into the Tier 1 60 dungeons. If you can get a full set of Asuran (upgraded Law) gear, that would put you at i180, which means you can run any content (the highest cap is i179.) Even a full set of base Law gear is i170, opening the door to Alexander and the Tier 2 60 dungeons, which drop i185 gear.
So, your first step is to get your Law (and then Asuran) weapon. Law weapons are 560 tomes, with the Doman Whetstone you need for upgrade being either 390 Centurio Seals, or 900 law. I'd recommend law for this, because Centurio seals can be used to get esoteric gear upgrades. With your first time bonuses on the dungeons, you should be able to get your law weapon pretty quick. In addition, the 160 gear you get from Tier 1 will boost your ilevel, and if you upgrade some Law gear to Asuran, it can counterbalance a piece of i160 gear.
Alternatively, if you can get the items together, there are a number of craters in the company that can make you Sky Pirate gear, which is i185. That would allow you to skip ahead as well.
We recommend saving esoterics for your weapon because your weapon is the best upgrade you can make. However, if you want to try to get a step ahead, a week's worth of esoterics can get you a belt or accessory, which would be i200. That would also give you a big edge as well.
The reason the game uses ilevel so heavily is because PUGing plays a much bigger role here. So instead of checking all your stats independently, the game says you have to be at a specific gearing level.
What exactly do you feel you get from the game when you feel like you should have the ability to bypass these cutscenes and gear number requirements? Is the journey not as important as the destination because you don't find the journey enjoyable and would rather get whatever it is you think you want from the ending?
Do you think it would be fair to others to walk into a new higher difficulty dungeon without the minimum gear number (iLevel) requirement for said dungeon and, regardless of your own skill level, have a harder time contributing to the group's ability to complete the dungeon and therefore their fun?
I am struggling to understand the issues here and get the impression you just don't really like the game itself and how it's gameplay, which like all FF games is heavily narrative and RPG gear driven and not quite as non-linear as, say, a sandbox game, is done and how that seems to be preventing you from getting to your idea of fun. And that's fine, you don't enjoy it, you are entitled to your opinion.
To that I would say, give PvP and crafting and other quests beyond just what you think is important to the endgame like completion of the MSQ and doing all the requisite dungeons a try in order to avoid burning out on just one of the facets of this game's design. Otherwise I don't know what to tell you.
Well you can't equip the gear for the wrong class outside of accessories so that method doesn't really work.
The problem with your method is that players jump into content they are not geared for, and then get upset that the game isn't telling them they aren't geared for it. They ALSO get upset when other players tell them "Hey you need X amount of HP to survive this attack" which is how it used to be until they implemented minimum ilvls in more things.
By having a minimum ilvl you are at least guaranteeing that the requisite level of stats are there to theortically beat the goal, even if the accessories are not for the right job.
It's not arbitrary at all, it's a result of too many players wanting to "drive their own shitty car how they want to drive it" which made it stupidly frustrating to do any content since other players could only make up the difference so much, and if you got enough players with that mentality in your run it was literally impossible to continue.
Hell even WITH ilvl requirements you still get players with that mentality, just with how they play their Job instead, but at least with a bare minimum of gear you have a much better chance of completing the objective even if they are just mashing one button.
Your problem is that you hit lvl 60 a fair bit behind the curve, but before patch 3.2 where a lot of the restrictions will be removed. It's unfortunate but it's already been 5 months since Heavensward came out. In patch 3.2 you won't be restricted to only one piece of loot from Voidark, or 450 Eso tomes a week, and the new dungeons that come out will likely have ilvl 190 or 200 gear in them. It will be a fresh new tier of gear and you'll be be able to catch up must faster. Right now however you are still restricted just like everyone else, but without the benefit of having been playing the game at level 60 for months now.
This should help illustrate the current gear path:
Fresh 60:
Hit ilvl 145 with white items from vendors and gear from Library
Run Fractal/Neverreap for ilvl 160 gear and Tomes of Law
ilvl 170:
Run Pharaoh Sirius (Hard)/SMA for ilvl 185 gear and Tomes of Law/Eso
Run Alexander (Normal) for tokens you can turn in for ilvl 190 gear
ilvl 175:
Run Voidark each week for ilvl 200 gear and token to upgrade Eso gear to ilvl 210
ilvl 179:
Run Diadem for a chance at ilvl 210 gear with decent stats.
Run daily roulette for Law/Eso
Spend Law on ilvl 170 gear and upgrade it to ilvl 180 with upgrade items obtained via Law or Hunt seals
Spend Eso on ilvl 200 gear and upgrade it to ilvl 210 with upgrade items obtained via Voidark or Hunt seals.
Keep in mind when patch 3.0 came out the only thing people could do at endgame was farm up dungeons and collect Law. Max ilvl at that time was ilvl 180.
Then they unlocked Alexander (Normal) and you could start obtaining ilvl 190 gear, but you could only get one token from each boss per week. (This restriction has been removed)
Then they unlocked Alexander (Savage) and implemented Esoteric tomes which allowed people to start obtaining ilvl 200 and 210 gear. You can only kill each Savage boss once a week though and you are capped at 450 Eso tomes each week.
Then patch 3.1 came out and they added Void Ark and removed the Alexander (Normal) restrictions. This gave a new way to get ilvl 200 and other ways to upgrade to ilvl 210. This also added Diadem for another way to get ilvl 210.
So what you are looking for really is patch 3.2 to level the playing field again and let you start working on the new gear tier fresh. You are right at the back end of the current grind which is why you have quite a bit to do to catch up, but aren't quite at the point where they make it easier to do so just yet.
Official PA Forums FFXIV:ARR Free Company <GHOST> gitl.enjin.com Join us on Sargatanas!
I think the real issue is less on what the developers have designed then in the presentation of everything and just how much there is to do to get caught up at points, which always necessitates catch up mechanics/quests/whatever to get people up to speed in more ways then one. And I imagine we will see more of that as Heavensward progresses and in future expansions but that they are still determining the best means to convey story and gear catch ups without ruining certain elements of the game or preventing people who want to see things fully the chance to do so or give too much away up front.
Actually when healing I move my party HP bars to just off-center of my screen so I don't have to worry about missing them.
I also unlocked Ravana EX and Bismarck EX, as well as Void Ark. I want Redbill's airship.
Switch: SW-3515-0057-3813 FF XIV: Q'vehn Tia
Get Neverreap unlocked and done so you can have the level 60 roulette which gives you daily bonus of law and esos.
Official PA Forums FFXIV:ARR Free Company <GHOST> gitl.enjin.com Join us on Sargatanas!
I just want to do them in the order I want, spending how much time I want at the pace I want. I can't just skip the story and grind up to 60, because they lock locations and dungeons behind story cutscenes. I can't get deep into the story when I want because I have to stop in the middle to do a dungeon or trial. I have to do it exactly how they want me to do it, and I really don't like being forced to do this. I like the journey, the story and dungeons and quests, but I don't want to do it at the very specific pacing in a strict order like the want me to.
Most games like this, as soon as I hit max level, I would immediately go into a dungeon or raid and be almost fully geared at like 3/4 of whatever the current max is. No unlocking the dungeon or raid through a story. Most games have dungeons that actually drop items instead of just acculturating points. You either get the class equipment or a token to turn in for it. You roll or it's handed out. And if you're freshly maxed level you usually get an immediate set of decent gear after a quick set of runs. Because people (and the game itself) want you to quickly have decent gear to do the actual endgame content.
I don't like PvP. I tried crafting, and I'm interested, but I don't want to do it right now.
I would rather do it and fail and/or have a real human tell me I need better gear than have the game's code just say I don't deserve to see the dungeon yet. Most groups/guilds tend to wind up with ludicrously well geared people, usually the top tank/healer/damage, which can tip the scales so far they can take basically anyone willing to learn through 'normal' endgame content, to gear them up and train them for actual final endgame stuff. If I'm okay to good at the game I'll survive and get the gear to do actually difficult content. If I'm dumb and don't learn they'll either fail or drop me. The way this game is, as long as I just have one random number high enough for the game to allow it, I'm in there.
Yet these are then the only things that actually matter, because they're the only things groups are looking to do, the only things players ever want to do or bother setting up, or want to dedicate time to teaching people or helping people with. Any equipment I get below the next to last tier is functionally useless because it's just a placeholder that is on the block to be replaced, because it's just there to unlock the thing that will then unlock the thing I want to do with people.
Official PA Forums FFXIV:ARR Free Company <GHOST> gitl.enjin.com Join us on Sargatanas!
The skill is irrelevant, the person with the gear meets the minimum stats needed to theoretically defeat the content. Even at sub par skill the discrepancy won't necessarily be as large as say someone who is hot shit (or thinks they are) but goes in there in vastly inferior gear.
I think the bigger issue here is you seem to just want to do whatever you want regardless of how it impacts the other people playing the game.
Official PA Forums FFXIV:ARR Free Company <GHOST> gitl.enjin.com Join us on Sargatanas!
Just like... every other game? If you want the best of everything with no effort involved go play a single player game and use a cheat code.
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
So you would say that the theoretical best healer (player) who has ever played who happens to be at 169/170 on that particular healer character should not be allowed to enter that dungeon? Even if every single other character in that group had, for example, the best possible gear in the game? And/or are also the theoretical best players ever?
I would like to play the game how I would like to play it, yes. I don't want a machine that only cares about numbers and if something is checked off or not to decide what I can do or when I can do it. A person can look at your gear and say, you're a little low, but you should be okay if you watch out for X. A person can recommend a new skill to use or where to pick up new gear. The machine can only spit out yes or no.
Does every other multiplayer game have hard limits on when you can play each stage or other piece of content, and also limit how often you can play and how many rewards you can get? I don't know, does Call of Duty require you to play three weeks of Capture the Flag before it unlocks Team Deathmatch for you?
http://callofduty.wikia.com/wiki/Call_of_Duty_4:_Modern_Warfare/Ranks
http://www.gamefaqs.com/xbox360/944199-call-of-duty-world-at-war/answers/79237-how-do-i-unlock-zombie-mode
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
Okay?
http://www.videogamesblogger.com/2014/11/02/call-of-duty-advanced-warfare-how-to-unlock-zombies-mode.htm
The point is that Call of Duty gates a lot of content behind other content. Using it as an example doesn't support your point.
chair to Creation and then suplex the Void.
Have they overhauled stuff a great deal since then? Will I be able to do much without the expansion? Definitely gonna try out the 4 days. PA guild active?
SniperGuyGaming on PSN / SniperGuy710 on Xbone Live
They add new content and Quality of Life patches every 3-4 months, as well as minor patches in between that.
Suffice to say a LOT has changed and there is a LOT to do, even without the expansion, certainly enough for 4 days worth of checking it out
The PA FC is very much active (We are actually one of the largest FC's on the server) and we'd be more than happy to invite you back in to chat and catch up on stuff or answer any questions about what may be different (note: a lot is different)
Official PA Forums FFXIV:ARR Free Company <GHOST> gitl.enjin.com Join us on Sargatanas!
SniperGuyGaming on PSN / SniperGuy710 on Xbone Live
Support should hopefully be able to give you the old one after security questions or help you with a new one.
What are Hunt seals and how do you get them? I tried going to the Hunt board in Ishgard but there's no quests on it or near it or anything.
There are enemies that spawn at intervals in each Heavensward Zone, they show up in three different Ranks:
B Rank: These spawn 5 seconds after being killed but only give you Seals if they are your weekly target.
A Rank: These spawn every 4-5 hours and award 40 Centurio Seals, 30 Poetics, and 10 Law
S Rank: These spawn every 3 days or so once a specific condition has been fulfilled (it varies with each S Rank), they award 100 Centurio Seals, 100 Poetics and 3 Law
Centurio Seals can be used to purchase upgrade components in the following manner:
500: Clan Mark Log (Used to purchase Eso gear upgrade items)
395: Doman Whetstone (Upgrades Law Weapon)
300: Doman Urushi (Upgrade Law Armor)
150: Raw Doman Urushi (Upgrade Law Accessory/Belt)
B ranks can be soloed easily
A Ranks need typically at least a party to defeat
S Ranks need a LOT of people to kill them.
There are also Daily marks you can do to go around and kill random marked monsters in the zones to get a bit of seals. You unlock these via a quest chain but I forget where it originates.
Official PA Forums FFXIV:ARR Free Company <GHOST> gitl.enjin.com Join us on Sargatanas!
Many MP games do, in fact, have gating. As was pointed out, CoD games routinely lock access to higher level MP content behind the rank system (which is geared to have a time dimension.) The three major MOBAs on the market (LoL, DOTA 2, HOTS) require players to reach a certain level to get full access to multiplayer, as well as having a matching system that only puts players of relatively similar level together.
Content in this game is regularly tuned to assume that all people participating will have a base stat level of the minimum item level. As people have pointed out, a player who has weaker gear will put pressure on the other party members to have to perform more optimally to succeed. If you run leveling roulette regularly, you'll see this happen a LOT in the sub-50 dungeons, as those dungeons have level and not ilevel restrictions, so it's not uncommon at all to see a player that's level 40 in level 20 gear. And yes, it makes a noticeable difference.
The big thing to realize is that i179 may seem like a huge gulf at the moment, but it really isn't. i170 is doable with a few days of running roulettes for tomes (once you hit 60, all the major roulettes - Trial, Leveling, Level 60 - give bonus law tomes), and then you can get the i185 gear from the expert dungeons. Plus, your first class is always the hardest to gear - any future classes benefit from the ability to accrue gear on your main, becoming much easier to bootstrap.
And I don't play any of those games, so I guess that's why I don't know. I have not seen that type of automatic in-game locking in any game I've played, as far as I remember.
I can't run the level 50 or 60 Roulette, and the game won't tell me why that is. It just has ??? listed.