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[DOTA 2] Still Blaming Supports

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Posts

  • VishNubVishNub Registered User regular
    Yilias wrote: »
    The Moonshards change seems the opposite to me. People will have Enigma or another flash farm support grabbing Moonshards for their OD.

    That's a good point...

    It is only the eaten moon shard, though, so that's a pretty poor value.

    Steam = VishnuOwnz
    Dota2 = Glitchmo
  • mtsmts Registered User regular
    interesting, its only like 6 minutes in, but it seems like LGD is running a support monkey king vs. vg

    camo_sig.png
  • KoopahTroopahKoopahTroopah The koopas, the troopas. Philadelphia, PARegistered User regular
    I broke my non-playing streak of 2-3 months last night. I played Ogre Support and did pretty well (7/1/7 by mid game), but we lost because Alchemist went unchecked except for the one or two times I ganked him.

    Of course our carry Luna who farmed for 25-30 minutes with nothing to show for it blamed the rest of the team, so yeah. Business as usual I guess.

    mctrbhK.gif
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  • JutranjoJutranjo Registered User regular
  • madspookymadspooky San Antonio, TXRegistered User regular
    So I just went back to playing after an extended break and from what I understand there is a "soft" region-lock now? It's completely terrible. I understand this game will be eventually filled with non-English speakers queuing for English but after 4 games I was the only person (on both teams) that actually spoke English. Seems kinda like a shitty solution for Southerners :(

  • JakorianJakorian Registered User regular
    Quick update dota2.com/news/updates/28351/

    7.04:
    ====

    * Hurricane Pike recipe increased from 250 to 500
    * Silver Edge recipe increased from 300 to 500
    * Ghost Scepter cooldown reduced from 25 to 20
    * Sange and Yasha proc chance increased from 35% to 40%
    * Heaven's Halberd cooldown reduced from 22 to 18
    * Slippers of Agility are no longer available in the Side Shop

    * Centaur: Stampede Scepter damage reduction reduced from 50% to 40%
    * Monkey King: Primal Spring slow rescaled from 40/50/60/70% to 30/45/60/75%
    * Monkey King: Spring winding up sound effect can be heard by nearby enemies
    * Magnus: Base attack time increased from 1.7 to 1.8
    * Magnus: Reverse Polarity cooldown increased from 120/110/100 to 120
    * Abaddon: Strength gain reduced from 2.7 to 2.5
    * Abaddon: Mist Coil projectile speed reduced from 2000 to 1600
    * Lifestealer: Base damage reduced by 2
    * Keeper of the Light: Base damage reduced from 43-57 to 43-50
    * Brewmaster: Drunken Brawler cooldown reduced from 16/14/12/10 to 13/12/11/10
    * Nature's Prophet: Level 10 Talent increased from +225 Health to +250
    * Nature's Prophet: Level 15 Talent changed from +35 Movement Speed to +4 Treants Summoned
    * Razor: Level 20 Talent increased from +30 Attack Speed to +40
    * Razor: Level 20 Talent increased from +275 Health to +325
    * Death Prophet: Level 10 Talent increased from +10% Magic Resistance to +12%
    * Death Prophet: Exorcism spirit damage increased from 55 to 58
    * Queen of Pain: Shadow Strike cast point reduced from 0.452 to 0.4
    * Phoenix: Level 15 Talent increased from +120 Gold/Min to 150
    * Phoenix: Level 15 Talent increased from +50 Fire Spirits DPS to +65
    * Kunkka: Level 10 Talent increased from +25 Damage to +30
    * Kunkka: Level 15 Talent increased from +20 Movement Speed to +30
    * Lycan: Base strength increased by 3
    * Arc Warden: Strength gain increased from 2.3 to 2.7
    * Lone Druid: Level 15 Talent increased from +30 Spirit Bear Damage to +50
    * Ancient Apparition: Cold Feet manacost reduced from 150 to 125
    * Broodmother: Insatiable Hunger lifesteal increased from 60/90/120% to 60/100/140%
    * Broodmother: Insatiable Hunger damage increased from 60/90/120 to 60/100/140
    * Bristleback: Quill Spray AoE increased from 625 to 650
    * Puck: Base damage increased by 3
    * Lich: Chain Frost cooldown reduced from 120/90/60 to 100/80/60

  • MelksterMelkster Registered User regular
    Phew, some good games going on.



    Universe makes me want to get good at Puck.

  • MusicoolMusicool Registered User regular
    edited April 5
    In this game I had to go carry tree. Or felt I did. Tusk didn't want to build carry and I was worried that against Meepo trusting our lategame to a fat tinker and Zeus might not work out (I dunno). So I gave carry tree a go. Wanted to go aghs for farm, but I got the feeling it wasn't going to come farm the money back fast enough before Meepo ran over us. So I went SnY into BKB, then Bloodthorne for the damage and PA. Probably should have gone MKB... Also my biggest throw was buying BF after we were megacreeped but before I had bb to spare. I felt it might let us push out waves faster and kill Meepo, but I could already do the second, and I really needed that bb...

    I could have also gone an early blademail, but I felt like it wouldn't be that effective against the Meeps, and Sniper and PA would be mobile enough to ignore me during the duration. I dunno about that call either though.

    Still, it's fun making silly comps and builds work in DOTA.

    Musicool on
    Burtletoy wrote: »
    I disagree completely.
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  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Labyrinths are awesome!Registered User regular


    Everything here is 100% accurate.

    XBL: R3clipse
    Steam: BIRD BIRD KILL IT
    Battle.net: Eclipse#1200
    MusicoolKoopahTroopahvalianceForarAsh-Housewaresdanx
  • SpaffySpaffy Fuck the Zero Registered User regular
    yo that Juggernaut arcana is the Kim Jong ILLEST

    ALRIGHT FINE I GOT AN AVATAR
    Steam: adamjnet
  • JakorianJakorian Registered User regular
    7.05

    Not a huge patch but treant is in captains mode, some cool changes to tranquils and a nerf to the brewmaster cheese strat.

  • VishNubVishNub Registered User regular
    edited April 10
    Jakorian wrote: »
    7.05

    Not a huge patch but treant is in captains mode, some cool changes to tranquils and a nerf to the brewmaster cheese strat.

    Lina and alch also got pretty big nerds.

    edit: I didn't see the tranquil boots change on my first look.

    I get windlace on pretty much every support, so that's nice to open up the options a bit.

    VishNub on
    Steam = VishnuOwnz
    Dota2 = Glitchmo
  • MusicoolMusicool Registered User regular
    edited April 11
    Yeah I don't know how I feel about the new Tranquil's. On the one hand, the buildup makes a lot more sense. And more movement speed is nice. On the other, no armour? Bugger.

    Musicool on
    Burtletoy wrote: »
    I disagree completely.
    unbelievablejugsphp.png
  • MusicoolMusicool Registered User regular
    edited April 15
    Guys I got to play a level 25 Dazz with 1 second cd on Poison Touch. The Dream is real. Permastunning all day err day. Or, like, the final teamfight. And we lost because we forgot about bottom lane pushing in, but ehhhh, it was fun.

    Also, Dazz really struggles to help heroes that dive like two screens past him for kills. I probably needed a blink or some shit just to keep up with our Spec and MK.

    Musicool on
    Burtletoy wrote: »
    I disagree completely.
    unbelievablejugsphp.png
  • VishNubVishNub Registered User regular
    Musicool wrote: »
    Guys I got to play a level 25 Dazz with 1 second cd on Poison Touch. The Dream is real. Permastunning all day err day. Or, like, the final teamfight. And we lost because we forgot about bottom lane pushing in, but ehhhh, it was fun.

    Also, Dazz really struggles to help heroes that dive like two screens past him for kills. I probably needed a blink or some shit just to keep up with our Spec and MK.

    Blink/Aether lens there, yeah. But it's probably not your fault.

    Currently in the midst of an 0-6 streak. Sigh.

    Steam = VishnuOwnz
    Dota2 = Glitchmo
  • SLyMSLyM Registered User regular
    I tried out puck for the first time yesterday because my least played queue actually popped, fully expecting to feed profusely. Went 20-4-20, bought 3 moon shards for my team without the 420 gold perk and we still lost.

    I say that like it wasn't my fault but I fucked up basically every single teamfight because I had so many buttons oh my god.

    Blink in, silence, oops I should have used veil first, ultimate, orb, shit I forgot I have shiva's, use that. Oh god I got silenced, euls myself until it goes away and then phase. Wait 3 seconds then blink out, phew.

    Wait, when did I get those two kills? Presumably around the same time their phantom lancer got his 4.

    Steam Starcraft SLeague of Legends
  • übergeekübergeek Registered User regular
    Well, so much for me ever caring about ranked.

    camo_sig.png
  • BlazeFireBlazeFire Registered User regular
    übergeek wrote: »
    Well, so much for me ever caring about ranked.

    Was there a change or patch I missed?

  • FoomyFoomy Registered User regular
    BlazeFire wrote: »
    übergeek wrote: »
    Well, so much for me ever caring about ranked.

    Was there a change or patch I missed?

    http://blog.dota2.com/2017/04/matchmaking-update/

    Steam Profile: FoomyFooms
  • milskimilski You will be honoured Registered User regular
    übergeek wrote: »
    Well, so much for me ever caring about ranked.

    Is your complaint about solo queue (which is kinda dumb but understandable) or the phone number thing (which you should absolutely already have linked for 2fa?)

    The void roars. A thousand thousand cores of light whelm you, sear you, expose you. You render your evidence.
  • KoopahTroopahKoopahTroopah The koopas, the troopas. Philadelphia, PARegistered User regular
    Requiring a phone number for ranked play is super dumb, but understandable why they're doing it. Smurfs are a big problem in Dota.

    mctrbhK.gif
    Steam - Battle.net - Koopah089 - PSN - KoopahTroopah - Smash Bros WiiU
  • milskimilski You will be honoured Registered User regular
    Requiring a phone number for ranked play is super dumb, but understandable why they're doing it. Smurfs are a big problem in Dota.

    I mean... it's not really dumb? 2fa is an extremely good idea anyway, more and more businesses are going to phone backups rather than email backups for account recovery (since email has the exact same vulnerabilities, generally), and steam scams are still super prevalent so it makes sense to protect your Steam account.

    It's just a smart idea all around and the only reason it wasn't put in until now was because until recently, we didn't have four posts a day on the front page of /r/DotA2 pointing out how Wagamama was fucking up a bunch of 4k games for lulz.

    The void roars. A thousand thousand cores of light whelm you, sear you, expose you. You render your evidence.
  • KoopahTroopahKoopahTroopah The koopas, the troopas. Philadelphia, PARegistered User regular
    Adding more doors to play your game in general is just a bad idea, from a design perspective. You want the game to be as easy to play as possible, and there's already a lot of things keeping new players from playing. Requiring a phone number is just another thing.

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    Steam - Battle.net - Koopah089 - PSN - KoopahTroopah - Smash Bros WiiU
  • SpawnbrokerSpawnbroker Registered User regular
    The game is still as easy to play as ever, they just don't want people smurfing in ranked. You can still smurf in unranked.

    Battle.net: Spawnbroker#1471
    Steam: Spawnbroker
    Final Fantasy XIV: Spawn Broken
  • KoopahTroopahKoopahTroopah The koopas, the troopas. Philadelphia, PARegistered User regular
    The game is still as easy to play as ever

    I disagree completely. I think Dota is an incredibly hard game to play. Especially for new players. The new player experience is very poor, but not really because of Valve. The game is just very dense, and anyone who's been playing it for longer than I dunno, 50 matches, has developed the Dunning-Krugger effect from the rest of the community.
    they just don't want people smurfing in ranked.

    This I understand. Like I said, a huge problem, but isn't there a better way to go around this that doesn't require additional steps from the players? What about restricting by IP instead? Like if an account was logged in from IP address, they can't play ranked with a different account for like a week?

    mctrbhK.gif
    Steam - Battle.net - Koopah089 - PSN - KoopahTroopah - Smash Bros WiiU
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Labyrinths are awesome!Registered User regular
    The game is still as easy to play as ever

    I disagree completely. I think Dota is an incredibly hard game to play. Especially for new players. The new player experience is very poor, but not really because of Valve. The game is just very dense, and anyone who's been playing it for longer than I dunno, 50 matches, has developed the Dunning-Krugger effect from the rest of the community.
    they just don't want people smurfing in ranked.

    This I understand. Like I said, a huge problem, but isn't there a better way to go around this that doesn't require additional steps from the players? What about restricting by IP instead? Like if an account was logged in from IP address, they can't play ranked with a different account for like a week?

    IP is really easy to spoof.

    I think the phone number one is the best compromise between hard to spoof and onerous for the player. The real concern is people just using GoogleVoice to get around the system.

    XBL: R3clipse
    Steam: BIRD BIRD KILL IT
    Battle.net: Eclipse#1200
  • BlazeFireBlazeFire Registered User regular
    Valve has tested this, somewhat, with Prime Matchmaking in CSGO.

  • MelksterMelkster Registered User regular
    The game is still as easy to play as ever

    I disagree completely. I think Dota is an incredibly hard game to play. Especially for new players. The new player experience is very poor, but not really because of Valve. The game is just very dense, and anyone who's been playing it for longer than I dunno, 50 matches, has developed the Dunning-Krugger effect from the rest of the community.
    they just don't want people smurfing in ranked.

    This I understand. Like I said, a huge problem, but isn't there a better way to go around this that doesn't require additional steps from the players? What about restricting by IP instead? Like if an account was logged in from IP address, they can't play ranked with a different account for like a week?

    The IP restriction idea is not the way to go. There are plenty of legitimate reasons why different accounts might log in from the same IP address.

    I really like the phone number solution. This seems like a great move.

    milskiKristmas Kthulhuschuss
  • übergeekübergeek Registered User regular
    It's not going to work all that well. Tracfone, Net10, etc. are dime a dozen. If a smurf ever is caught, pay 10 bucks for another number and be on your merry way. The best part is you can tell some services where your "home" area is and it will give you the appropriate area code, so unless you have someone looking at an IP with all these different phone numbers you will lessen it a bit but you aren't going to stop them. It again comes down to not wanting to staff themselves in any way to do the work manually. It's been a while since I've played LoL but back then the IP method by itself didn't work very well either.

    camo_sig.png
    KoopahTroopah
  • BlazeFireBlazeFire Registered User regular
    Its not so much about smurfs as it is griefers, in my opinion. The update from Valve says as much.
    Players using multiple accounts create a negative matchmaking experience at all skill brackets, so our goal is to add just enough friction to this process that the number of players doing this will be noticeably reduced.

    milskiKoopahTroopah
  • milskimilski You will be honoured Registered User regular
    edited April 21
    übergeek wrote: »
    It's not going to work all that well. Tracfone, Net10, etc. are dime a dozen. If a smurf ever is caught, pay 10 bucks for another number and be on your merry way. The best part is you can tell some services where your "home" area is and it will give you the appropriate area code, so unless you have someone looking at an IP with all these different phone numbers you will lessen it a bit but you aren't going to stop them. It again comes down to not wanting to staff themselves in any way to do the work manually. It's been a while since I've played LoL but back then the IP method by itself didn't work very well either.

    The fundamental point of security is not to make it impossible to break the rules; that will always be possible. The point of security is to make it more onerous to do something than it's worth and to mitigate risk.

    The sub 1% of smurfs who will be dedicated enough to purchase multiple burner phones purely to keep smurfing are not the target. The targets are the hordes of smurfs who have 2-3 alts from playing with friends or whatever, and account buyers. Valve has implemented a system that is extremely little hassle for the vast majority of legitimate players, while making smurfing much more onerous (and with a physical cost). Additionally, they have made buying accounts require a phone number transfer and an additional cost, hurting the market there. That is enough to have a significant impact on smurfing, even if it isn't perfect.

    milski on
    The void roars. A thousand thousand cores of light whelm you, sear you, expose you. You render your evidence.
    TychoCelchuuuKristmas Kthulhu
  • milskimilski You will be honoured Registered User regular
    The game is still as easy to play as ever

    I disagree completely. I think Dota is an incredibly hard game to play. Especially for new players. The new player experience is very poor, but not really because of Valve. The game is just very dense, and anyone who's been playing it for longer than I dunno, 50 matches, has developed the Dunning-Krugger effect from the rest of the community.
    they just don't want people smurfing in ranked.

    This I understand. Like I said, a huge problem, but isn't there a better way to go around this that doesn't require additional steps from the players? What about restricting by IP instead? Like if an account was logged in from IP address, they can't play ranked with a different account for like a week?

    To reply to your first point: Spawn was clearly referring to DotA being easy to play in that it is easy to download the client, launch games, and run them. Adding ten keystrokes to that a single time is not a big hurdle. The problems with IP have been addressed.

    The void roars. A thousand thousand cores of light whelm you, sear you, expose you. You render your evidence.
    TychoCelchuuuKristmas Kthulhu
  • KoopahTroopahKoopahTroopah The koopas, the troopas. Philadelphia, PARegistered User regular
    edited April 21
    milski wrote: »
    The game is still as easy to play as ever

    I disagree completely. I think Dota is an incredibly hard game to play. Especially for new players. The new player experience is very poor, but not really because of Valve. The game is just very dense, and anyone who's been playing it for longer than I dunno, 50 matches, has developed the Dunning-Krugger effect from the rest of the community.
    they just don't want people smurfing in ranked.

    This I understand. Like I said, a huge problem, but isn't there a better way to go around this that doesn't require additional steps from the players? What about restricting by IP instead? Like if an account was logged in from IP address, they can't play ranked with a different account for like a week?

    To reply to your first point: Spawn was clearly referring to DotA being easy to play in that it is easy to download the client, launch games, and run them. Adding ten keystrokes to that a single time is not a big hurdle. The problems with IP have been addressed.
    milski wrote: »
    übergeek wrote: »
    It's not going to work all that well. Tracfone, Net10, etc. are dime a dozen. If a smurf ever is caught, pay 10 bucks for another number and be on your merry way. The best part is you can tell some services where your "home" area is and it will give you the appropriate area code, so unless you have someone looking at an IP with all these different phone numbers you will lessen it a bit but you aren't going to stop them. It again comes down to not wanting to staff themselves in any way to do the work manually. It's been a while since I've played LoL but back then the IP method by itself didn't work very well either.
    The sub 1% of smurfs who will be dedicated enough to purchase multiple burner phones purely to keep smurfing are not the target. The targets are the hordes of smurfs who have 2-3 alts from playing with friends or whatever, and account buyers. Valve has implemented a system that is extremely little hassle for the vast majority of legitimate players, while making smurfing much more onerous (and with a physical cost). Additionally, they have made buying accounts require a phone number transfer and an additional cost, hurting the market there. That is enough to have a significant impact on smurfing, even if it isn't perfect.

    Could this argument not be used for IP spoofing too? I dunno, seems silly. I don't care either way btw, I just think requiring the player to do more to play is dumb enough as it is.

    KoopahTroopah on
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  • MelksterMelkster Registered User regular
    Regarding the temporary phone number services you guys are talking about...

    I'm not sure technically how it would work, but Valve says that they're not going to allow you to use those services. You'll have to have a real phone number.

    > Online services that provide phone numbers are not allowed.

    KoopahTroopah
  • Corp.ShephardCorp.Shephard Registered User regular
    edited April 21
    You can't even try Ranked play until you have a level 20 account so this really has zero effect on the brand new player experience.

    They have their own herculean labours to undertake in order to break into this madness game.

    Corp.Shephard on
    KoopahTroopahTychoCelchuuuKristmas Kthulhumilski
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Labyrinths are awesome!Registered User regular
    Melkster wrote: »
    Regarding the temporary phone number services you guys are talking about...

    I'm not sure technically how it would work, but Valve says that they're not going to allow you to use those services. You'll have to have a real phone number.

    > Online services that provide phone numbers are not allowed.

    Oh. Cool!

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  • KoopahTroopahKoopahTroopah The koopas, the troopas. Philadelphia, PARegistered User regular
    You can't even try Ranked play until you have a level 20 account so this really has zero effect on the brand new player experience.

    They have their own herculean labours to undertake in order to break into this madness game.

    This is true. Fair enough.

    mctrbhK.gif
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  • danxdanx Registered User regular
    I might start playing again with proper solo queue. Getting stuck with parties of 4 + me, or facing a 4-5 stack with a bunch of randoms was happening way too often. I don't mind waiting longer for games.

    Could this argument not be used for IP spoofing too? I dunno, seems silly. I don't care either way btw, I just think requiring the player to do more to play is dumb enough as it is.

    The difference is IP spoofing is easier than obtaining a phone number especially since valve have banned online phone services. There are also legitimate reasons to use VPNs and IP addresses are not guaranteed unique for a user for any length of time though it is much more common these days for ISPs to continue giving users the same IP address unless certain conditions occur.

    They know they won't catch all smurfs but they can stop the more casual smurfs. Hard core smurfs are going to smurf regardless in the same way hard core pirates don't stop despite steam, itunes, netflix, etc.

  • BlazeFireBlazeFire Registered User regular
    Again, there needs to be a distinction between smurfs and people griefing with alts. I'm quite certain the intent is to minimize the effect of the latter.

  • milskimilski You will be honoured Registered User regular
    milski wrote: »
    The game is still as easy to play as ever

    I disagree completely. I think Dota is an incredibly hard game to play. Especially for new players. The new player experience is very poor, but not really because of Valve. The game is just very dense, and anyone who's been playing it for longer than I dunno, 50 matches, has developed the Dunning-Krugger effect from the rest of the community.
    they just don't want people smurfing in ranked.

    This I understand. Like I said, a huge problem, but isn't there a better way to go around this that doesn't require additional steps from the players? What about restricting by IP instead? Like if an account was logged in from IP address, they can't play ranked with a different account for like a week?

    To reply to your first point: Spawn was clearly referring to DotA being easy to play in that it is easy to download the client, launch games, and run them. Adding ten keystrokes to that a single time is not a big hurdle. The problems with IP have been addressed.
    milski wrote: »
    übergeek wrote: »
    It's not going to work all that well. Tracfone, Net10, etc. are dime a dozen. If a smurf ever is caught, pay 10 bucks for another number and be on your merry way. The best part is you can tell some services where your "home" area is and it will give you the appropriate area code, so unless you have someone looking at an IP with all these different phone numbers you will lessen it a bit but you aren't going to stop them. It again comes down to not wanting to staff themselves in any way to do the work manually. It's been a while since I've played LoL but back then the IP method by itself didn't work very well either.
    The sub 1% of smurfs who will be dedicated enough to purchase multiple burner phones purely to keep smurfing are not the target. The targets are the hordes of smurfs who have 2-3 alts from playing with friends or whatever, and account buyers. Valve has implemented a system that is extremely little hassle for the vast majority of legitimate players, while making smurfing much more onerous (and with a physical cost). Additionally, they have made buying accounts require a phone number transfer and an additional cost, hurting the market there. That is enough to have a significant impact on smurfing, even if it isn't perfect.

    Could this argument not be used for IP spoofing too? I dunno, seems silly. I don't care either way btw, I just think requiring the player to do more to play is dumb enough as it is.

    Money and not being able to set it up purely from a desktop are both massive filters to the burner phone idea that ip spoofing don't have.

    The void roars. A thousand thousand cores of light whelm you, sear you, expose you. You render your evidence.
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