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Guild Wars "Hard Mode"

PhoticsPhotics Registered User regular
edited April 2007 in Games and Technology
I've been playing Guild Wars for over three years. I lead one of the oldest (if not THE oldest) guild in Guild Wars. At one point, we were 1000 players strong. (There would have been more, but there's a hardcap on Guilds / Alliances.) We held Cavalon for three weeks. I was an alpha tester / beta tester. I create Guild Wars video guides. But even with even all that, I lost to a Grawl.

A GRAWL! O_o

Hard Mode is INSANE! No really, it's crazy.

Do you remember the Great Northern Wall? That's the first Ascalon map after the Searing. I used to solo that map, kill all the Charr, then head back to the gate. Not on hardmode... even with a 33% run skill, the Charr caught up to me... and KILLED ME.

What do you think of Hard Mode?

If you haven't heard about Hard Mode, you can read about it here... http://www.guildwars.com/gameplay/hardmode/

Michael Garofalo - App Developer and author of [URL="http://photics.com/books/gamesalad-textbook]The Unofficial GameSalad Textbook[/URL]
Photics on

Posts

  • BloodKnight2kBloodKnight2k Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Who wait where?

    BloodKnight2k on
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    Writer of Chronicles of Garas (A dark tech fantasy webcomic)
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  • PhoticsPhotics Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    I edited the post to make more sense. I hit the wrong key, then enter. I heard the Internet Explorer "click" noise, then it posted my message before I finished it.

    Photics on
    Michael Garofalo - App Developer and author of [URL="http://photics.com/books/gamesalad-textbook]The Unofficial GameSalad Textbook[/URL]
  • StormyWatersStormyWaters Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    I'm extremely amused that they made loot scale to party size, something I recommended last August with no real intent besides screwing with pvers.

    StormyWaters on
  • RookRook Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    It's kinda sucked me back in a bit, as there's some new titles to be earnt. All that's really changed is they've made the level of the baddies higher and given them more skills and faster attacks etc. It's still fairly formulaic in that once you've found the right build/team you're good to go. Still the Vanquisher title (Kill all the enemies on every mapspace) must be mine.

    Annoyingly, they still haven't really sorted out loot in my opinion. The special locked chests that you can find still contain purples (IMO, they should have ditched purple a long time ago, and kept it green and gold).

    I haven't played in a while but there have been some other nice new additions that people who don't play might have missed. Storage space quadrupled. Pet commands and some new tournament rules and shit that I've not really payed any attention to. Although sadly, a lot of this stuff are changes that should have been made a year ago, if not from the getgo.

    Rook on
  • HarshLanguageHarshLanguage Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Rook wrote: »
    Although sadly, a lot of this stuff are changes that should have been made a year ago, if not from the getgo.

    Still, you've got to admit it's cool they're still adding significant stuff to the game, even after announcing the last installment of GW1. Hard Mode is a major addition, and they keep putting in more things that players have requested (more storage, pet commands, templates, etc).

    Still missing an auction-house type feature, though.

    HarshLanguage on
    QSwearing_trans_smooth_small.gif
    > turn on light

    Good start to the day. Pity it's going to be the worst one of your life. The light is now on.
  • RookRook Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Rook wrote: »
    Although sadly, a lot of this stuff are changes that should have been made a year ago, if not from the getgo.

    Still, you've got to admit it's cool they're still adding significant stuff to the game, even after announcing the last installment of GW1. Hard Mode is a major addition, and they keep putting in more things that players have requested (more storage, pet commands, templates, etc).

    Still missing an auction-house type feature, though.

    I'm really not trying to bash the game. I still love it, but I just don't quite have the time that I think the game really needs to get the most out of it. I'm still kinda annoyed that basically the really strong section of the game, the PvP is basically inaccesible for any sort of casual play. That was something they really should have sorted out in factions but outside of Random Arena, if you just want to pick up and go then there really isn't that much there for you. The same thing goes with the auction house actually, I really don't have the time to go sell the stuff I'm picking up, and I shouldn't have to try and make that time just so I can go buy some shiney armour.

    I should probably point out Nightfall: Collectors Edition £17.99 delivered.

    Rook on
  • PhoticsPhotics Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Heh... I'm feeling a lot of love for Guild Wars. <3

    Photics on
    Michael Garofalo - App Developer and author of [URL="http://photics.com/books/gamesalad-textbook]The Unofficial GameSalad Textbook[/URL]
  • GeodGeod swim, swim, hungryRegistered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Yeah, I've been starting to get sucked back into it as well... The alpha burnt me out and I stopped a few months after release, but I'm getting interested again.

    Geod on
  • HarshLanguageHarshLanguage Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Well, being able to step away from GW when you want to/need to, without worrying about wasting money on subscription fees or hassling with a cancellation, is one of its strengths. I haven't played much in the last month or so, because I got a bit burned out and GuildWiki's in a bit of an upheaval, so I turned to Titan Quest and other games.

    Re: casual PVP... I've found AB to be a great outlet for that. I know a lot of "real" PVPers who scoff at it, but its not designed for them. You get PVP experience but in a PVE wrapper. But I think I see your point - for someone who's not interested in PVE, but doesn't want to get too into hardcore PVP, there are very limited options.

    I need to get back to GW and finally finish Factions. Doing some of the Factions missions again in hard mode is a scary prospect (but fun... a challenge is always good).

    HarshLanguage on
    QSwearing_trans_smooth_small.gif
    > turn on light

    Good start to the day. Pity it's going to be the worst one of your life. The light is now on.
  • citizen059citizen059 hello my name is citizen I'm from the InternetRegistered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Hard Mode is awesome.

    I've gotten through Great Northern Wall, I get owned so hard at Fort Ranik.

    citizen059 on
  • SerpentSerpent Sometimes Vancouver, BC, sometimes Brisbane, QLDRegistered User regular
    edited April 2007
    pretty sure guild wars is not 3 years old...

    Serpent on
  • ZekZek Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Guild Wars is a game that I always found very appealing conceptually. Extremely low level cap? Heavy focus on PvP? PvP characters created at level cap? It's like they read my mind and turned it into an MMO.

    But then they went and made the gameplay crappy and boring. :(

    Zek on
  • SePh1r0tHSePh1r0tH Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    I got owned at Great Northern Wall lol, its a lot of fun though.

    SePh1r0tH on
    FC.jpg
  • RookRook Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Serpent wrote: »
    pretty sure guild wars is not 3 years old...

    It pretty much is in a lot of respects. The world preview event was in oct 2004, whilst the e3 for everyone build was back in apirl 2004. Since the WPE they had beta weekends at the end of every month up to launch I think.

    Rook on
  • XinramXinram Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Oh man, I never even completed the Ring of Fire Islands missions on normal mode (didn't even try). And I got owned a lot throughout the whole PvE campaign. Got some small successes in Random Arenas and the Rollerbeetle Racing stuff but basically I suck at GW.

    This does not seem like my kind of thing at all..

    Xinram on
  • AiranAiran Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    In a previous GW thread, I stated that I didn't like the game at all, despite loving the alpha/beta to bits. Fast forward a week later, I borrowed an account and have since become hooked on the PvP parts (though I only touch RA and TA since I don't have Nightfall).
    Rook wrote: »
    I should probably point out Nightfall: Collectors Edition £17.99 delivered.

    But this might change that.

    I've not tried out hard mode yet - I don't really like the PvE part much anyways.

    Airan on
    paDudSig.jpg
  • Ramen NoodleRamen Noodle whoa, god has a picture of me! Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    I still need to beat all the campaigns. I'm up to RoF on the first, about to choose side on Factions, and not even off Istan on Nightfall.

    Ramen Noodle on
  • DeadshotDeadshot Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Hard mode isn't hard, it just takes longer.

    Deadshot on
    o ok
  • PhoticsPhotics Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Serpent wrote: »
    pretty sure guild wars is not 3 years old...

    Guild Wars was officially released on April 28, 2005. I've been playing since February 2004. I find it amazing that I still enjoy the game. Running a fansite helps though. Sometimes, that aspect of Guild Wars is more fun than the game itself. HA!
    citizen059 wrote: »
    Hard Mode is awesome.

    I've gotten through Great Northern Wall, I get owned so hard at Fort Ranik.

    Oh man... Fort Ranik was terrible. I eventually beat it with Heroes. Here's my build...

    Photics - Elementalist / Mesmer
    CODE: OgVDIrqsC+uLwFrwFcIA

    Mark of Rodgort, Meteor, Meteor Shower, Fire Storm, Hex Breaker, Power Spike, Backfire, Res Signet.

    I was basically going for interrupts. I'd target the casters, then set them on fire with Mark of Rodgort and my fire wand. All my henchies use Fire Wands, so the Mark of Rodgort works well. I'd use a combination of Meteor Shower and Meteor to chain interrupt the casters... or I'd lead off with Backfire. It depends on how many enemies are in the blast area. I'm not sure why I used Fire Storm. Heh!

    Hex Breaker is crticital in stopping the Necromancer. They pretty much chain cast Life Siphon and some other Hex spell. That's when Backfire is really handy. Either way, I'm doing some pretty huge damage. It may not be the smartest of builds, but it's fun to play. I feel like I'm doing something when I interrupt the enemy and when I hit for triple-digit damage.


    Tahlkora and Dunkoro have the same skills...
    CODE: OwAT043A55uNT4IgEPSX8dqRAA

    Signet of Rejuvenation, Reversal of Fortune, Divine Boon, Healing Breee, Heal Other, Heven's Delight, Renew Life, Word of Healing

    These two heal... and they do a pretty good job at it.


    Acolyte Sousuke
    CODE: OgVDIbqsC0qKs5cRRKIA

    Aura of Restoration, Earthquake, Ward Against Melee, Cry of Frustration, Power Spike, Shatter Enchantment, Hex Breaker, Res Signet.

    Basically, this guy's my sidekick. Instead of Fire, he uses Earth. Ward Against Melee helps protect against the Charr Warriors. Earthquake is another interrupt spell. But even better are all of the domination based interrupts. The computer has flawless execution of interrupt skills. There are lots of slow casting Necros on the Fort Ranik map. Sousuke tears them up.


    Basically, I just went really slow. I'd wait for exhaustion to wear off, then I'd move forward. Another important thing to do is to keep the NPC allies alive. I had two Ascalon dudes with me, for almost the entire map. It helped out a lot. I would have wiped out completely, but the Ascalon Archer held his ground. It was amazing. A level 20 NPC was shooting holes in a level 26 Charr.

    Oh... and use the catapults to your advantage. There's a second one on the map. Just lure the enemies into the blast radius. It helps a lot with the last battle.

    Photics on
    Michael Garofalo - App Developer and author of [URL="http://photics.com/books/gamesalad-textbook]The Unofficial GameSalad Textbook[/URL]
  • StealthcStealthc Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    I found Hard Mode wasn't that hard, in fact I pretty much breezed through the Mission+Bonus of every mission up to The Wilds...

    Zoolander and I tried it, nothing like 8 scarabs using vampiric touch for 89 damage each...

    Just a matter of time before I figure out an awesome build for it though.

    Overall thouroughly enjoying revisiting old areas that are now at least level 20 content.

    Stealthc on
  • DeadshotDeadshot Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Cycle Can't Touch This with your heroes. :p

    Deadshot on
    o ok
  • ZoolanderZoolander Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    haha yeah

    Hard mode is quite fun - PvE feels fun again

    Zoolander on
  • LoneIgadzraLoneIgadzra Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Zek wrote: »
    Guild Wars is a game that I always found very appealing conceptually. Extremely low level cap? Heavy focus on PvP? PvP characters created at level cap? It's like they read my mind and turned it into an MMO.

    But then they went and made the gameplay crappy and boring. :(

    I always found it fun myself. It seems a lot better than all the other MMORPG's using the same control system. Much faster-paced and less frustrating than WoW, and pretty satisfying.

    LoneIgadzra on
  • RookRook Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    I'm kinda surprised that everyone seems to be going through prophecies again with Hard mode rather than just sticking to Nightfall. Although people are probably more familiar with those missions I'd personally rather never to have to face Prophecies again.

    Rook on
  • DroolDrool Science! AustinRegistered User regular
    edited April 2007
    I miss Guild Wars sometimes. Mostly all the good stomping we did. But I'm not sure I'll ever play it again. Mostly because every time I log in after an extended absence I feel like I have to relearn everything. The basic gameplay is the same, but they retool skill so much and add new stuff that it feels a bit overwhelming.

    I mostly miss how competitive the online play was, but playing shooters is basically the same thrill.

    Drool on
  • RookRook Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Drool wrote: »
    I miss Guild Wars sometimes. Mostly all the good stomping we did. But I'm not sure I'll ever play it again. Mostly because every time I log in after an extended absence I feel like I have to relearn everything. The basic gameplay is the same, but they retool skill so much and add new stuff that it feels a bit overwhelming.

    I mostly miss how competitive the online play was, but playing shooters is basically the same thrill.

    One of the problems with online play in both RPGs and RTS games is that the barrier to entry is so high, and it's not because of skill but a case of number crunching. At some point someone figures out the ideal way to do X+Y+Z and unless you copy it you miss out. FPS games never really feel like they have the same limitations because the individual skill factor becomes a lot more dominant.

    I'll be really interested to see how they cope with the PvP in GW2.

    Rook on
  • DroolDrool Science! AustinRegistered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Yeah this is especially true in GW what with all the different skill combos. And yeah I'm intrested to see what they do with GW2 as well. I feel kind of sad they are abandoning their original business model, but understand why they need to make a change. I really couldn't muster the intrest to play Nightfall beyond the trial.

    Arena Net is an awsome company, despite GW problems I think overall its an awsome game and enjoyed playing it.

    Drool on
  • DarmakDarmak RAGE vympyvvhyc vyctyvyRegistered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Rook wrote: »
    Drool wrote: »
    I miss Guild Wars sometimes. Mostly all the good stomping we did. But I'm not sure I'll ever play it again. Mostly because every time I log in after an extended absence I feel like I have to relearn everything. The basic gameplay is the same, but they retool skill so much and add new stuff that it feels a bit overwhelming.

    I mostly miss how competitive the online play was, but playing shooters is basically the same thrill.

    One of the problems with online play in both RPGs and RTS games is that the barrier to entry is so high, and it's not because of skill but a case of number crunching. At some point someone figures out the ideal way to do X+Y+Z and unless you copy it you miss out. FPS games never really feel like they have the same limitations because the individual skill factor becomes a lot more dominant.

    I'll be really interested to see how they cope with the PvP in GW2.

    That's pretty much the big reason I stopped playing. I knew that unless I sat down and did all the number crunching and all that then I would be useless in PvP, but there was no way in hell I was going to do all that shit. So I just stopped.

    [edit]Don't get me wrong, I love Guild Wars and everything, I just can't handle the stat and number crunching that is required to be effective in PvP.[/edit]

    Darmak on
    JtgVX0H.png
  • StormyWatersStormyWaters Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    The learning curve in GW to compete in high level PvP is the toughest of any game I've ever seen or heard of. It has great depth but it's extremely hard to learn and succeed in. Understanding why gimmicks work is really important even if you don't want to use them.

    StormyWaters on
  • ZoolanderZoolander Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Yeah, the huge number of skills (1100 and growing!) is a huge problem. I hope they keep the number of skills small in GW2 PvP.

    Zoolander on
  • StealthcStealthc Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Deadshot wrote: »
    Cycle Can't Touch This with your heroes. :p

    Can't Touch This is a horribly ineffective skill :P

    I'm enjoying playing through the prophecies campaign again since its been so long since I've been back there, while Nighfall feels stale at the moment.

    Stealthc on
  • AndorienAndorien Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Zoolander wrote: »
    Yeah, the huge number of skills (1100 and growing!) is a huge problem. I hope they keep the number of skills small in GW2 PvP.

    In the PC Gamer special, they recognized that the massive number of skills was dragging it down, so I think they're gonna at least think about it. Personally, I feel the number of skills afforded by Prophecies + Core to be about right.

    Andorien on
  • HarshLanguageHarshLanguage Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Andorien wrote: »
    Zoolander wrote: »
    Yeah, the huge number of skills (1100 and growing!) is a huge problem. I hope they keep the number of skills small in GW2 PvP.

    In the PC Gamer special, they recognized that the massive number of skills was dragging it down, so I think they're gonna at least think about it. Personally, I feel the number of skills afforded by Prophecies + Core to be about right.

    Yeah, they've mentioned the problems with the proliferation of skills, and professions, a number of times in public. They're definitely very aware of the issue. Haven't heard how they'll fix it for GW2, though. It does seem that any fix would limit what they can put in GW2 expansions, to smaller numbers of skills less frequently, perhaps. And I wouldn't expect GW2 to have as many professions.

    HarshLanguage on
    QSwearing_trans_smooth_small.gif
    > turn on light

    Good start to the day. Pity it's going to be the worst one of your life. The light is now on.
  • AxenAxen My avatar is Excalibur. Yes, the sword.Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Here is the Kotaku article on Guild Wars 2.
    Kotaku wrote:
    Guild Wars 2

    Since the game is essentially starting with a clean slate, Arena Net decided to make some pretty substantive changes to the game.

    First, and most importantly though, the game will remain subscription free.

    This time around the game will have a persistence world, one still set in Tyria, but now hundreds of years after the events that took place in the original Guild Wars.

    "The big new feature is a persistent world," Strain said. "I think Guild Wars has some very radical departures from typical role-playng. One of those was the instancing model.

    As each of the campaigns was released we took greater and greater pains to do that.
    On the other hand, there are things we missed out on, like the more organic type of community building where you wandering through the area and hook-up with other people."

    "In Guild Wars 2 we wanted to have the best of both worlds. We are retaining the strengths of instanced areas, but we are also integrating a persistenced world. We are not making a World of Warcraft clone here, we are not trying to do what other MMOs have done."

    Arena Net's new spin is sort of an amalgam of both instanced and massive environments, where instanced events can have domino effects on other parts of the world, or zone..

    Here's one example of this Strain used:

    You are wandering through the countryside and you see a dragon flying overhead. You and a group try to stave off the dragon. If you are successful the nearby town gives you a treasure.

    But if you don't drive off the dragon, the bridge will be destroyed. This will lead to a team of carpenters gathering at the bridge to try to fix it and then you will have to protect them from bandits.

    "The idea is that there will always be something going on in the world," Strain said.

    He said that there will be hundreds of these types of events that happen in the world, some daily, some hourly, some will be triggered by specific player actions.

    "That is what persistence allows us to do. That is the type of content and play experience that we can offer in Guild Wars 2 that we couldn't offer in Guild Wars."

    Another major change will be in the way the game handles player versus player.

    In Guild Wars 2, the same character you use in-game will be used for player-versus-player conflicts that will take place in the Mists, the place between the many worlds, aka servers, of this new Guild Wars. Despite having several worlds, the game uses a global database so you can instantly transfer between worlds, Strain said.

    And these inter-world battles in the Mists, which Strain says almost play like a large real-time strategy game, can have a real impact on the worlds.

    "By achieving victories in these battles there will be benefits to your world," Strain said. "Bonuses, advantages, maybe everyone gets increased energy regeneration or healing rate or enhanced loot drop rate."

    Strain says the world-versus-world match-ups will be shuffled every couple of weeks to make sure things stay fair.

    Every week or every two weeks we will shuffle who is matched up.

    Arena Net, it seems, is trying to tackle many of the biggest drawbacks most current massively multiplayer online games face. Chief among them is level capping. Why, once you top out, should you stick around in a game?

    Guild Wars 2 is trying to deal with that issue by using a system with a high level cap once that could be set to 100 or even boundless.

    "So there is not a level 20 cap," Strain said. "Either it will be a high level like 100 or unbounded, we haven't decided."
    Besides these significant changes to the game, Guild Wars 2 will also introduce plenty of smaller ones, like the ability for your characters to do things like jump, swim, even climb trees.

    The combat though, Strain says, will remain purely RPG

    "Our belief is that role players aren't playing a RPG because they want a twitch action," Strain said, "there is a difference between playing a game like an RPG and playing a game like God of War."

    Guild Wars 2 is expected to hit public beta next year, but now release date has yet been set.

    Sounds cool to me, though they still don't talk about how Skills might work.

    Axen on
    A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
  • AndorienAndorien Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    Axen wrote: »
    Here is the Kotaku article on Guild Wars 2.
    Kotaku wrote:
    snip

    Sounds cool to me, though they still don't talk about how Skills might work.

    If I were making it, I'd be tight lipped about it as well. The skill system is very very integral to the game, and even if they have some general idea of how to go about it, it really could change at a moment's notice. I bet they're waiting until they've got something more concrete.

    Andorien on
  • LoneIgadzraLoneIgadzra Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    So this is like a whole new separate game, as opposed to something integrated with the current "universe" then?

    I don't see why they'd uncap the level though. How would that possibly be balanced? I hate level-based stuff myself. It seems like a nonsensical way to run an MMO, because everyone wants to stand out and instead they just end up chasing ever higher levels, that predictably dictate combat outcome in a boring way.

    LoneIgadzra on
  • DarmakDarmak RAGE vympyvvhyc vyctyvyRegistered User regular
    edited April 2007
    So this is like a whole new separate game, as opposed to something integrated with the current "universe" then?

    Well, it's integrated with the "universe" in that it takes place in the same world, just much later.
    But it is an entirely separate game, yes.

    Darmak on
    JtgVX0H.png
  • HarshLanguageHarshLanguage Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    I don't see why they'd uncap the level though. How would that possibly be balanced? I hate level-based stuff myself. It seems like a nonsensical way to run an MMO, because everyone wants to stand out and instead they just end up chasing ever higher levels, that predictably dictate combat outcome in a boring way.

    It all depends on what benefits levels give you. GW currently has 2 types of levels: displayed levels 1-20 that each give you more HP, attribute points, and skill points; and then undisplayed 21-unbounded that just give you skill points. That second set is never mentioned or calculated as a level in-game.

    So, in GW2, as an example, they could easily have an unbounded or high level cap without wrecking balance if the levels are like that second type. Levels that give you more HP or attribute points or other significant benefits would cause a problem.

    HarshLanguage on
    QSwearing_trans_smooth_small.gif
    > turn on light

    Good start to the day. Pity it's going to be the worst one of your life. The light is now on.
  • RookRook Registered User regular
    edited April 2007
    I don't see why they'd uncap the level though. How would that possibly be balanced? I hate level-based stuff myself. It seems like a nonsensical way to run an MMO, because everyone wants to stand out and instead they just end up chasing ever higher levels, that predictably dictate combat outcome in a boring way.

    It all depends on what benefits levels give you. GW currently has 2 types of levels: displayed levels 1-20 that each give you more HP, attribute points, and skill points; and then undisplayed 21-unbounded that just give you skill points. That second set is never mentioned or calculated as a level in-game.

    So, in GW2, as an example, they could easily have an unbounded or high level cap without wrecking balance if the levels are like that second type. Levels that give you more HP or attribute points or other significant benefits would cause a problem.

    Also, for the competative PvP they did mention they would have a fixed level system. There's also a lot of ways you can have unlimited leveling and not mess up the balance too badly. E.g. having some sort of exponential decay on your returns for leveling up, and/or having equipment become more important, and just saving the new equipment for expansions or keeping level as an almost cosmetic thing. E.g. level 1000 and your armour is majestic, and your sword huge, whilst at level 10 you're still pretty much as good, you just look like a muppet. There's lots of room to play with there.

    Rook on
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