If I say something like "Euro-style board games" they won't know what I'm talking about, and if I describe them as "more complex board games" it risks the person instantly thinking what I'm talking about is overly complicated and inaccessible.
So? Let them. Then have them try a game and they understand.
If someone believes a game will be overly complicated and inaccessible before they even hear the first word of rules explanation, it will be to him or her. People can easily convince themselves they can't do something, and it's a difficult thing to overcome. Better to not have them think it in the first place.
Are there any new board games made in the classic style that have broad appeal? My kids play Disney Princess Pop-Up, but I don't see a whole lot of mass appeal stuff next to old standbys like Candyland and Sorry!.
yeah, the kids section in the FLGS my friend owns has a lot like that. Most of it is terrible but there are some standouts. I remember when my boy was younger we quite liked The Magic Labyrinth.
You set up a maze on a grid which gets hidden below the board. Each piece has a magnet in the bottom which holds a metal marble. If you try to move your piece across one of the invisible maze walls your marble drops and rolls out. So it's kind of a memory game of figuring out where the walls are.
The "standard" Suburbia strategy is to get income above 10 as soon as possible in the first third or first half of the game, and then switch gears to max your reputation with the B and C tiles. That's the advice I always give beginners, because you can really end up hamstrung if you don't have adequate funds in the last half of the game and don't have a plan to get more money.
That said, the game can get substantially more interesting when you can find ways to deviate from this basic strategy: for example, a well-placed lake with a 2x Waterfront Realty can get you $24 in a single turn (and then a 2x on the lake can get you another $24 next turn!); you can also try to go all out on Residential tiles, which tend to be less expensive than other tiles (especially if you have Homeowners' Association) and almost entirely ignore Business and Industry entirely; etc.
Yeah, that happened to my wife. She shot ahead early on, but then got stuck with no income for a good 1/3 of the game towards the end.
I tried to go residential, grabbing the homeowners association and later on the stadium, and then my wife and friend took all the housing projects and retirement villages before I could snag them. I think we ended up short on greens as well from the shuffled mix, so that didn't help things.
Definitely something I could get into a lot, and my friend said he enjoyed it (helped I'm sure by winning) and wanted to play again. Glad I was able to get that trade!
If you guys liked Suburbia definitely look into picking up Suburbia Inc asap. It's one of the few really great boardgame expansions imo. Not so much 5*, though.
I looked into it, and it may be something I stick on a birthday (June) or Christmas list so they have something easy to pick up. I doubt I'll get more than a handful of games in before June, so it should be ok. Unless is it something that gets hard to find? I know Suburbia was for a while, but it seems they've got it sorted out now.
Edit: Though it's $19 on amazon right now, which seems pretty good looking at camelcamelcamel.
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HedgethornAssociate Professor of Historical Hobby HorsesIn the Lions' DenRegistered Userregular
What word or how do you guys refer to the games we play in comparison to well known things like monopoly and sorry?
Like a craft beer to a budweiser? Is there a term that fits for board games?
Edit: artisanal? Would that convey the style difference? Sounds ridiculous saying it out loud.
I don't care much for the term, but I've heard "designer board games" used to mark those games which credit the game designer on the box. (And this almost perfectly marks the split between hobbyist and mass-market games.)
HedgethornAssociate Professor of Historical Hobby HorsesIn the Lions' DenRegistered Userregular
I don't like the term because it draws the distinction between mass-market and hobbyist games in an unhelpful and unprincipled way. That the designer's name is in the box isn't what makes modern strategy games unique; Monopoly wouldn't suddenly become a hobbyist's game if they put Charles Darrow's name on the box.
I have intro'd people with, "remember monopoly and clue? well think about what they would be like if they were clever and fun instead of 3 hour slugfests that make you hate your family!"
The "standard" Suburbia strategy is to get income above 10 as soon as possible in the first third or first half of the game, and then switch gears to max your reputation with the B and C tiles. That's the advice I always give beginners, because you can really end up hamstrung if you don't have adequate funds in the last half of the game and don't have a plan to get more money.
That said, the game can get substantially more interesting when you can find ways to deviate from this basic strategy: for example, a well-placed lake with a 2x Waterfront Realty can get you $24 in a single turn (and then a 2x on the lake can get you another $24 next turn!); you can also try to go all out on Residential tiles, which tend to be less expensive than other tiles (especially if you have Homeowners' Association) and almost entirely ignore Business and Industry entirely; etc.
Yeah, that happened to my wife. She shot ahead early on, but then got stuck with no income for a good 1/3 of the game towards the end.
I tried to go residential, grabbing the homeowners association and later on the stadium, and then my wife and friend took all the housing projects and retirement villages before I could snag them. I think we ended up short on greens as well from the shuffled mix, so that didn't help things.
Definitely something I could get into a lot, and my friend said he enjoyed it (helped I'm sure by winning) and wanted to play again. Glad I was able to get that trade!
If you guys liked Suburbia definitely look into picking up Suburbia Inc asap. It's one of the few really great boardgame expansions imo. Not so much 5*, though.
I looked into it, and it may be something I stick on a birthday (June) or Christmas list so they have something easy to pick up. I doubt I'll get more than a handful of games in before June, so it should be ok. Unless is it something that gets hard to find? I know Suburbia was for a while, but it seems they've got it sorted out now.
Edit: Though it's $19 on amazon right now, which seems pretty good looking at camelcamelcamel.
its not going to be hard to find i dont think, but it doesnt add complexity and it makes a great game that much better. the borders and some of the tiles really add a ton to the game. its not like youre going to not have fun without it, but it really is a great expansion is all.
I think modern board game is a good way to put it. It's simple, it's true, and it usually does a good job of intriguing someone and not alienating them.
Designer boardgame or artisanal boardgame or euro boardgame all come off as too pretentious, too elite, too exclusionary for my tastes.
If I say something like "Euro-style board games" they won't know what I'm talking about, and if I describe them as "more complex board games" it risks the person instantly thinking what I'm talking about is overly complicated and inaccessible.
So? Let them. Then have them try a game and they understand.
It's easier to get them to try the game if I make it sound like something they'll enjoy doing.
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AstaerethIn the belly of the beastRegistered Userregular
I prefer using American to Ameritrash. To me American games are, as opposed to Euros, more interested in theme and simulation than elegance and minimalism. I expect an American game to have appealing art, (often) narrative elements, lots of pieces, more randomness (dice rolling), more different mechanics. Ameritrash as a term implies that these sorts of designs are automatically bad or kind of plebian, but they're not. There are great American games and terrible Euro style games, they're just preferences. Although I admit that bad Euro games just end up boring, while bad American games tend to be unplayably overcomplicated.
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CaptainPeacockBoard Game HoarderTop o' the LakeRegistered Userregular
I've always envisioned it thusly:
Euro = Rules first, Theme second
American = Theme first, Rules second
I also use the phrase "designer boardgame", to show that an actual person designed it rather that it just being the result of a corporate design team with dollar signs for eyes.
Cluck cluck, gibber gibber, my old man's a mushroom, etc.
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BrodyThe WatchThe First ShoreRegistered Userregular
I just call them board games, and if someone groans and says "But Monopoly was a board game." I respond with "Board games made by people who thought Monopoly was bad."
"I will write your name in the ruin of them. I will paint you across history in the color of their blood."
Modern sounds like a good descriptor all around then. They're not games you remember from being a kid, and are designed with modern ideas as a result of not liking those games from childhood. :-)
Are there any new board games made in the classic style that have broad appeal? My kids play Disney Princess Pop-Up, but I don't see a whole lot of mass appeal stuff next to old standbys like Candyland and Sorry!.
Not quite what you're looking for, but Sorry! Sliders is an amazing mass-market title.
My game arrived at its destination today, and got my positive feedback! It's a rare occurrence for me, but I love how nicely BGG makes trading.
Also, Bezier won't replace my Suburbia box, not that I'm surprised. Got it neatly taken care of with some packing tape.
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jergarmarhollow man crewgoes pew pew pewRegistered Userregular
I use the term "modern board games", if only to preserve my analogy while explaining the hobby, that Risk and Clue are like flip phones. Sure, everybody had one and they were great for their day, but now technology has advanced a lot and now we have smart phones. Most people who have tried them greatly prefer them. So let me show you Coup/Red7/TTR/Augustus/Bohnanza/Dominion (depending on circumstances).
When I was a child, I had a fever... My BoardGameGeek profile
Battle.net: TheGerm#1430 (Hearthstone, Destiny 2)
Are there any new board games made in the classic style that have broad appeal? My kids play Disney Princess Pop-Up, but I don't see a whole lot of mass appeal stuff next to old standbys like Candyland and Sorry!.
Not quite what you're looking for, but Sorry! Sliders is an amazing mass-market title.
Are there any new board games made in the classic style that have broad appeal? My kids play Disney Princess Pop-Up, but I don't see a whole lot of mass appeal stuff next to old standbys like Candyland and Sorry!.
Pandemic and Catan are what come to mind immediately. They are sold at pretty much every big box retailer that sells classic boardgames. Maybe not what you're looking for though?
If I say something like "Euro-style board games" they won't know what I'm talking about, and if I describe them as "more complex board games" it risks the person instantly thinking what I'm talking about is overly complicated and inaccessible.
So? Let them. Then have them try a game and they understand.
If someone believes a game will be overly complicated and inaccessible before they even hear the first word of rules explanation, it will be to him or her.
Are there any new board games made in the classic style that have broad appeal? My kids play Disney Princess Pop-Up, but I don't see a whole lot of mass appeal stuff next to old standbys like Candyland and Sorry!.
How old are your kids? There are quite a few great new board games out for the young'ns.
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mysticjuicer[he/him] I'm a muscle wizardand I cast P U N C HRegistered Userregular
It's less that I'm looking for stuff for them (last weekend, with help and taking out the red cards, they played a game of Machi Koro and loved it) - just that looking through stores all of the "everybody has played these" games are the same as when I was a kid.
Though it had not occurred to me that Catan, Ticket to Ride, and Pandemic have that sort of market penetration. Cool!
I quite like the base mechanic (those deduction grid puzzles) and throwing in the social aspect just means it's a race to pick up every scrap of possible info from every other players turn, whilst trying to be as guarded with your info as possible.
And then when you have a page of paper trying to deduce what player one showed to player two, you go up to the envelope and guess wildly wrong or guess correct and then reveal your horrid web of chicken scratchings.
Are there other deduction games that place you under such pressure unto breaking point, that so result in hilarity?
I quite like the base mechanic (those deduction grid puzzles) and throwing in the social aspect just means it's a race to pick up every scrap of possible info from every other players turn, whilst trying to be as guarded with your info as possible.
And then when you have a page of paper trying to deduce what player one showed to player two, you go up to the envelope and guess wildly wrong or guess correct and then reveal your horrid web of chicken scratchings.
Are there other deduction games that place you under such pressure unto breaking point, that so result in hilarity?
Alchemists has a very similar deduction problem and can absolutely result in this type of hilarity and there is a solid worker placement mechanic underneath it as well!
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BrodyThe WatchThe First ShoreRegistered Userregular
I quite like the base mechanic (those deduction grid puzzles) and throwing in the social aspect just means it's a race to pick up every scrap of possible info from every other players turn, whilst trying to be as guarded with your info as possible.
And then when you have a page of paper trying to deduce what player one showed to player two, you go up to the envelope and guess wildly wrong or guess correct and then reveal your horrid web of chicken scratchings.
Are there other deduction games that place you under such pressure unto breaking point, that so result in hilarity?
Sherlock Holmes, Consulting Detective has got some stunning reviews.
"I will write your name in the ruin of them. I will paint you across history in the color of their blood."
I played Caverna last night. It was fun! Although, I'm a little concerned about its setup being nearly the same every time, in the sense that the game could be possibly 'solved' and people just follow the same strategy every time.
Now to try and get this copy of Terra Mystica on the table. I've played against the AI a few times to learn the rules, but I wonder what it's like in person.
Now to try and get this copy of Terra Mystica on the table. I've played against the AI a few times to learn the rules, but I wonder what it's like in person.
Terra Mystica is great fun. Very long, but very satisfying puzzle to solve, imo.
I quite like the base mechanic (those deduction grid puzzles) and throwing in the social aspect just means it's a race to pick up every scrap of possible info from every other players turn, whilst trying to be as guarded with your info as possible.
And then when you have a page of paper trying to deduce what player one showed to player two, you go up to the envelope and guess wildly wrong or guess correct and then reveal your horrid web of chicken scratchings.
Are there other deduction games that place you under such pressure unto breaking point, that so result in hilarity?
What is wrong with Clue
1) Roll-to-move
2) Moving the suspect pawn to room when a player makes a guess is brutal. you can end up stuck in room X when you need to be in room Y. And then you roll a string of 1's (see above) and then you get pulled back to the fucking room X again by some clueless dipshit who hasn't been paying the slightest bit of attention.
3) Roll-to-move
I played Caverna last night. It was fun! Although, I'm a little concerned about its setup being nearly the same every time, in the sense that the game could be possibly 'solved' and people just follow the same strategy every time.
Now to try and get this copy of Terra Mystica on the table. I've played against the AI a few times to learn the rules, but I wonder what it's like in person.
Different action availability for different player counts alleviates your concern a bit. But, I don't think you should be worried about this.
I don't know, the game may theoretically be solvable but the number of permutations of opponent action selection would render this impossible for practical purposes. It's as solid a worker placement game you'll find that has taken me down different avenues to victory pretty much every time I've played.
I played Caverna last night. It was fun! Although, I'm a little concerned about its setup being nearly the same every time, in the sense that the game could be possibly 'solved' and people just follow the same strategy every time.
Now to try and get this copy of Terra Mystica on the table. I've played against the AI a few times to learn the rules, but I wonder what it's like in person.
Different action availability for different player counts alleviates your concern a bit. But, I don't think you should be worried about this.
I don't know, the game may theoretically be solvable but the number of permutations of opponent action selection would render this impossible for practical purposes. It's as solid a worker placement game you'll find that has taken me down different avenues to victory pretty much every time I've played.
The unpredictability of the latter harvests combined with the usual Agricola semi-random new action each round should keep it from being truly solvable for a given player count.
I played Caverna last night. It was fun! Although, I'm a little concerned about its setup being nearly the same every time, in the sense that the game could be possibly 'solved' and people just follow the same strategy every time.
Now to try and get this copy of Terra Mystica on the table. I've played against the AI a few times to learn the rules, but I wonder what it's like in person.
Different action availability for different player counts alleviates your concern a bit. But, I don't think you should be worried about this.
I don't know, the game may theoretically be solvable but the number of permutations of opponent action selection would render this impossible for practical purposes. It's as solid a worker placement game you'll find that has taken me down different avenues to victory pretty much every time I've played.
The unpredictability of the latter harvests combined with the usual Agricola semi-random new action each round should keep it from being truly solvable for a given player count.
I've been able to pursue the same strategy every single time I've played Caverna. I've basically had to force myself to pursue otherwise to keep the game interesting for myself. This is something I've never had to do with Agricola because of the cards. I will certainly not claim to have solved Caverna, not by a long shot, but each play feels very same-y.
I played Caverna last night. It was fun! Although, I'm a little concerned about its setup being nearly the same every time, in the sense that the game could be possibly 'solved' and people just follow the same strategy every time.
Now to try and get this copy of Terra Mystica on the table. I've played against the AI a few times to learn the rules, but I wonder what it's like in person.
Different action availability for different player counts alleviates your concern a bit. But, I don't think you should be worried about this.
I don't know, the game may theoretically be solvable but the number of permutations of opponent action selection would render this impossible for practical purposes. It's as solid a worker placement game you'll find that has taken me down different avenues to victory pretty much every time I've played.
The unpredictability of the latter harvests combined with the usual Agricola semi-random new action each round should keep it from being truly solvable for a given player count.
I've been able to pursue the same strategy every single time I've played Caverna. I've basically had to force myself to pursue otherwise to keep the game interesting for myself. This is something I've never had to do with Agricola because of the cards. I will certainly not claim to have solved Caverna, not by a long shot, but each play feels very same-y.
I'm guessing that means you're going heavy weapons and expeditions? If you keep doing that and doing well I think part of the blame rests on the shoulders of your opponents. As I understand it (and have experienced), if only one player is going down that path they are going to dominate; conversely, if only one player is NOT going down that path then they have the advantage.
That said, yeah without the cards it does have a lot less variance than Agricola. But that's mostly because with the cards Agricola has a TON of variance. It's not really a fair comparison.
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If someone believes a game will be overly complicated and inaccessible before they even hear the first word of rules explanation, it will be to him or her. People can easily convince themselves they can't do something, and it's a difficult thing to overcome. Better to not have them think it in the first place.
yeah, the kids section in the FLGS my friend owns has a lot like that. Most of it is terrible but there are some standouts. I remember when my boy was younger we quite liked The Magic Labyrinth.
You set up a maze on a grid which gets hidden below the board. Each piece has a magnet in the bottom which holds a metal marble. If you try to move your piece across one of the invisible maze walls your marble drops and rolls out. So it's kind of a memory game of figuring out where the walls are.
I looked into it, and it may be something I stick on a birthday (June) or Christmas list so they have something easy to pick up. I doubt I'll get more than a handful of games in before June, so it should be ok. Unless is it something that gets hard to find? I know Suburbia was for a while, but it seems they've got it sorted out now.
Edit: Though it's $19 on amazon right now, which seems pretty good looking at camelcamelcamel.
I don't care much for the term, but I've heard "designer board games" used to mark those games which credit the game designer on the box. (And this almost perfectly marks the split between hobbyist and mass-market games.)
That's the word that I couldn't think of earlier though, designer. I think it's probably the one I've heard the most.
Nintendo ID: Pastalonius
Smite\LoL:Gremlidin \ WoW & Overwatch & Hots: Gremlidin#1734
3ds: 3282-2248-0453
its not going to be hard to find i dont think, but it doesnt add complexity and it makes a great game that much better. the borders and some of the tiles really add a ton to the game. its not like youre going to not have fun without it, but it really is a great expansion is all.
Designer boardgame or artisanal boardgame or euro boardgame all come off as too pretentious, too elite, too exclusionary for my tastes.
It's easier to get them to try the game if I make it sound like something they'll enjoy doing.
Euro = Rules first, Theme second
American = Theme first, Rules second
I also use the phrase "designer boardgame", to show that an actual person designed it rather that it just being the result of a corporate design team with dollar signs for eyes.
The Monster Baru Cormorant - Seth Dickinson
Steam: Korvalain
Modern sounds like a good descriptor all around then. They're not games you remember from being a kid, and are designed with modern ideas as a result of not liking those games from childhood. :-)
Switch: nin.codes/roldford
Not quite what you're looking for, but Sorry! Sliders is an amazing mass-market title.
Also, Bezier won't replace my Suburbia box, not that I'm surprised. Got it neatly taken care of with some packing tape.
My BoardGameGeek profile
Battle.net: TheGerm#1430 (Hearthstone, Destiny 2)
Pandemic and Catan are what come to mind immediately. They are sold at pretty much every big box retailer that sells classic boardgames. Maybe not what you're looking for though?
Nah.
How old are your kids? There are quite a few great new board games out for the young'ns.
"...Newman!"
Though it had not occurred to me that Catan, Ticket to Ride, and Pandemic have that sort of market penetration. Cool!
I quite like the base mechanic (those deduction grid puzzles) and throwing in the social aspect just means it's a race to pick up every scrap of possible info from every other players turn, whilst trying to be as guarded with your info as possible.
And then when you have a page of paper trying to deduce what player one showed to player two, you go up to the envelope and guess wildly wrong or guess correct and then reveal your horrid web of chicken scratchings.
Are there other deduction games that place you under such pressure unto breaking point, that so result in hilarity?
Alchemists has a very similar deduction problem and can absolutely result in this type of hilarity and there is a solid worker placement mechanic underneath it as well!
Sherlock Holmes, Consulting Detective has got some stunning reviews.
The Monster Baru Cormorant - Seth Dickinson
Steam: Korvalain
Now to try and get this copy of Terra Mystica on the table. I've played against the AI a few times to learn the rules, but I wonder what it's like in person.
Nintendo ID: Pastalonius
Smite\LoL:Gremlidin \ WoW & Overwatch & Hots: Gremlidin#1734
3ds: 3282-2248-0453
Terra Mystica is great fun. Very long, but very satisfying puzzle to solve, imo.
What is wrong with Clue
1) Roll-to-move
2) Moving the suspect pawn to room when a player makes a guess is brutal. you can end up stuck in room X when you need to be in room Y. And then you roll a string of 1's (see above) and then you get pulled back to the fucking room X again by some clueless dipshit who hasn't been paying the slightest bit of attention.
3) Roll-to-move
The rest of the game is fine.
I made a game, it has penguins in it. It's pay what you like on Gumroad.
Currently Ebaying Nothing at all but I might do in the future.
Different action availability for different player counts alleviates your concern a bit. But, I don't think you should be worried about this.
I don't know, the game may theoretically be solvable but the number of permutations of opponent action selection would render this impossible for practical purposes. It's as solid a worker placement game you'll find that has taken me down different avenues to victory pretty much every time I've played.
The unpredictability of the latter harvests combined with the usual Agricola semi-random new action each round should keep it from being truly solvable for a given player count.
I've been able to pursue the same strategy every single time I've played Caverna. I've basically had to force myself to pursue otherwise to keep the game interesting for myself. This is something I've never had to do with Agricola because of the cards. I will certainly not claim to have solved Caverna, not by a long shot, but each play feels very same-y.
That's definitely an interesting way to play it. So essentially it's just guesses for each turn and players show a card if they can disprove it?
I'm guessing that means you're going heavy weapons and expeditions? If you keep doing that and doing well I think part of the blame rests on the shoulders of your opponents. As I understand it (and have experienced), if only one player is going down that path they are going to dominate; conversely, if only one player is NOT going down that path then they have the advantage.
That said, yeah without the cards it does have a lot less variance than Agricola. But that's mostly because with the cards Agricola has a TON of variance. It's not really a fair comparison.
Yea, becomes boiled down to figuring out what others know and trying to deny info to others