I really hate having to cast mages so often. I know it was a common complaint, and having experienced it first hand it seems like a valid one.
Maybe it was just me being a noob to Rathma builds but I barely had time to cast anything other than mages. Hard to fit in the time for a curse. Its more tedious than fun.
I think they need to increase the time that mages last. Making them permanent is not required, but they need to last longer. I shouldnt need to be in this continuous struggle to keep mages up.
Inarius at least lets you play. You aren't micromanaging an annoying mechanic the whole time.
With this revelation, my motivation to start S11 as wizard instead of necro just increased a bit. I do plan to primarily play necro, but starting with rathma seems like it could be a pain in the ass.
This season I want to spend some real time playing and actually push my character higher than I generally do when I (rarely) play seasonal. Kind of stuck between a Monk and WD, leaning towards Monk. I've traditionally never cared for WD, although I've also never played the Helltooth set (I seriously only have like 25 hours total on WD since vanilla launch) so it might be worth trying something fresh. I doubt it though. I'll probably be a Monk lol.
I'd have considered Necro if it wasn't Rathma. I don't hate the way the build plays like many seem to, but I don't really love it either. I may change my mind in the next couple of weeks, but I'm not sure. The more active summoner playstyle is one I enjoy. Hell, Dr. Doom in Marvel Heroes was a really active summoner and I enjoyed that, but something about Rathma isn't clicking. If I use the huge mages that eat all of your essence it makes casting Decrepify and Command Skeletons more annoying, and in my experience the big mages seem to do more damage than the archers.
Also the fact that Army of the Dead isn't even used in the build, and that the early set bonus includes NO damage bonus (only Army CD reduction) makes me feel like it could be a bit of a slog. I gathered up the Rathma set in standard by farming it with the Inarius set, so I didn't struggle for damage early on. You really don't get a nice damage boost until the 6p, and/or the Jesseth set is completed.
We'll see, I guess. I'll probably change my mind fifteen times before the season starts. Excited though. I'm looking to be a lot more active and focused this season.
If I play the season at all, I think I might do witch doctor. Helltooth is a pretty good build, and I've never played it with gargs before.
The problem I have with both the necro and monk sets this season is that they make you also chase a weapon set to be good... Which won't be provided for free. Dick move, imo.
Builds for any class usually do require a specific few weapons anyways so its not really that much different from anything else
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KlatuAussie Aussie AussieOi Oi OiRegistered Userregular
For helltooth gargs, not including the set which we get this season default, you want to chase:
Gloves: Tasker n Theo
Bracers: Lakumba's Ornament
Ring: Short mans finger
Ring: Compass
Amulet: travellers
Weapon: sacred harvester
Offhand: serpent or cat - i like the serpent better, but ppl swear by the cat *shrug*
Cube: Furnace, Mask of Jeram, RoRG
You're ok with base set, your insane survivability comes from weapon/bracers/serpent or weapon/bracers/cat though.
You're still going to be chasing certain things. HT gargs is fun though if you can handle the pets acting stupid at times
If I play the season at all, I think I might do witch doctor. Helltooth is a pretty good build, and I've never played it with gargs before.
The problem I have with both the necro and monk sets this season is that they make you also chase a weapon set to be good... Which won't be provided for free. Dick move, imo.
Needing the fists for the Monk is the one thing that makes me hesitate on the Monk as well.
I don't think it's a dick move, but it's certainly another layer of RNG to peel away.
For helltooth gargs, not including the set which we get this season default, you want to chase:
Gloves: Tasker n Theo
Bracers: Lakumba's Ornament
Ring: Short mans finger
Ring: Compass
Amulet: travellers
Weapon: sacred harvester
Offhand: serpent or cat - i like the serpent better, but ppl swear by the cat *shrug*
Cube: Furnace, Mask of Jeram, RoRG
You're ok with base set, your insane survivability comes from weapon/bracers/serpent or weapon/bracers/cat though.
You're still going to be chasing certain things. HT gargs is fun though if you can handle the pets acting stupid at times
Cat is essential to avoid one shots when pushing GRs. Serpent won't save you from the off-screen jump attacks at 80-90+.
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KlatuAussie Aussie AussieOi Oi OiRegistered Userregular
Lack of cat and love of serpent ... phrasing?... Could be why I never made it past GR93 last time I played HT Garg. That or always getting stuck with sewers levels...
I really hate having to cast mages so often. I know it was a common complaint, and having experienced it first hand it seems like a valid one.
Maybe it was just me being a noob to Rathma builds but I barely had time to cast anything other than mages. Hard to fit in the time for a curse. Its more tedious than fun.
I think they need to increase the time that mages last. Making them permanent is not required, but they need to last longer. I shouldnt need to be in this continuous struggle to keep mages up.
Inarius at least lets you play. You aren't micromanaging an annoying mechanic the whole time.
With this revelation, my motivation to start S11 as wizard instead of necro just increased a bit. I do plan to primarily play necro, but starting with rathma seems like it could be a pain in the ass.
I took that as their way of making a summoner not just stand around. but I didn't enjoy it at all.
(this was from beta but I remember that exact gameplay being a problem for me so I guess it hasn't changed)
I dont have a problem with blizzards design philosophy of wanting to have summoners have "active gameplay". Its a good goal to have.
They just need to dial back the frequency with which you need to cast mages. Not even eliminate having to cast every so often, just make it somewhat less frequent. Make them last a bit longer somehow, either through skill or item adjustments (i.e. make that ring more than 4 seconds).
Probably a stupid question, but I'm curious.
I'm going through the campaign again with a Necro, and I got the ring that doubles up your skeleton mage summons early on.
I'm just wondering do I eventually get the cube in the campaign, if so, when?
Cause I've kind of out leveled the stats on the ring, but I don't want to lose out on my skeleton mages by swapping it out for something with more than +20 int.
Probably a stupid question, but I'm curious.
I'm going through the campaign again with a Necro, and I got the ring that doubles up your skeleton mage summons early on.
I'm just wondering do I eventually get the cube in the campaign, if so, when?
Cause I've kind of out leveled the stats on the ring, but I don't want to lose out on my skeleton mages by swapping it out for something with more than +20 int.
Kanai's Cube is only available in Adventure mode. If you already have Kanai's cube unlocked, just hop your Necro over, do what you gotta, and go back to the quest you were on.
I kind of thought that would be the case.
Ah well. I'm trying to stick as close to a clean run as I can. Not assigning paragon levels, not using legendary gems.
Minor exception for the normal gems that I had in my stash, but other than that, I get what I get.
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Waffles or whateverPreviously known as, I shit you not, "Waffen"Registered Userregular
Been using this build for my Necromancer. Just cleared my first Grift 70! Wooo! Necro is fun. Only concern now is that now I'm fully kitted out with the build(s) I want, it's only downhill from this point forward
I dont have a problem with blizzards design philosophy of wanting to have summoners have "active gameplay". Its a good goal to have.
They just need to dial back the frequency with which you need to cast mages. Not even eliminate having to cast every so often, just make it somewhat less frequent. Make them last a bit longer somehow, either through skill or item adjustments (i.e. make that ring more than 4 seconds).
I think making a summoner have active gameplay is a good thing.
What I don't like, though, is having that active play be about constantly summoning temporary minions. Give them a good reason to do other things!
I mean, even in D2 as a necro doing harder things meant managing curses and corpse explosion or your skellies would get squashed.
Constantly resummoning minions is why I hated Torchlight 1/2 summoners so much.
This weeks challenge dungeon is shit IMO. If people wanted a good example of why no one plays single target builds, it's on full display with this dungeon. I get the impression they want you to sprint to every fucking mob, except it's really easy to get stuck on the shitty trash. Seriously, fuck the dev that picked this and I hope the fucker is never allowed to pick another dungeon because this is a shit experience.
The hotfix is in, and yeah... Wreath of Lightning and Mirenei go back in the stash. Inarius is still "fine," but not nearly the speedy tasmanian devil it was.
This Marked for Death-Frailty exploit has been a real saga
- Players abused it to get super high legendary gems, like 140+
- Community cries out for a fix
- Blizz hotfixes on friday but reverts it
- People continue to abuse it all weekend
- Hotfix hits on monday but community still upset
- Blizzard says "sorry dudes, we're going to have a double XP weekend and we rolled back the high gems to level 132."
- Now apparently people a circumventing the gem "fix" by rolling back their accounts to just before the hotfix, because apparently level 132 gems just aren't high enough :rotate:
The back and forth of player tricks vs developer response can be pretty amusing sometimes
This weeks challenge dungeon is shit IMO. If people wanted a good example of why no one plays single target builds, it's on full display with this dungeon. I get the impression they want you to sprint to every fucking mob, except it's really easy to get stuck on the shitty trash. Seriously, fuck the dev that picked this and I hope the fucker is never allowed to pick another dungeon because this is a shit experience.
I didn't think it was that bad. My guess is that most people don't go for that type of build, so they wanted to give something different. The easy way to play that build is to constantly spam the increased speed ability between mobs. Once you get a good amount near you, just hack and slash your way through it. I stupidly died in those rotating lasers, but was still able to beat the time. If you get stuck on trash, just clear a path in the direction you want to go and sprint away. Unfortunately, it seems like it depended a lot on luck of running the right direction.
It's definitely not a fun build, but totally doable. I just thought it was a very odd build that wouldn't get you very far in a season at all. It reminded me of a far less effective Crusader thorns build.
While I agree that being insensitive is an issue, so is being oversensitive.
So on PTR it was unclear if you could save a few pre-season Challenge Rift reward boxes for a fresh seasonal character, because the season was already going.
Blizz confirmed that any boxes earned outside of an active seasonal window will only be available to non-seasonal characters.
So if you've been saving, you can stop.
e: from what I've seen, you CAN cross softcore/hardcore though.
Waffles or whateverPreviously known as, I shit you not, "Waffen"Registered Userregular
How do you keep yourselves playing after getting your full set for your build? Game just gets really boring really quickly not being able to find upgrades.
Poor monster density is a Real Problem for the necromancer, almost whatever build you use. Either you run out of bone armor or corpses, or both. Sure, you can generate a few corpses, but not nearly as many as you need to take down biggies.
Poor monster density is a Real Problem for the necromancer, almost whatever build you use. Either you run out of bone armor or corpses, or both. Sure, you can generate a few corpses, but not nearly as many as you need to take down biggies.
"Kill Urzael" is like, the worst bounty for me.
there is a set of bracers that cause the golem to shed a corpse every second or so
How do you keep yourselves playing after getting your full set for your build? Game just gets really boring really quickly not being able to find upgrades.
Yeah, but you have to play a lot to really get to the point of no upgrades (and if you want to be real technical never- keep on leveling those gems!). Just getting the set is easy, now get primals!
And then multiple characters. Pushing Grfits.
I know a guy who just beat the campaign a few times and called it quits.
The change to the Rathma 6-piece is like manna from heaven. So much easier to keep up 4 mages rather than 10.
A lot of the high-end builds use Singularity mages, but I cannot stand using them (too much of your time is spent solely on regaining Essence for another summon). So I subbed in Archers, and they seem quite similar in output. Singularity mages excel a bit in single-target damage, but the Archers do just fine, and they're better on trash since you can have way more out at a time. With the change, I can summon 4 mages, then actually do something else, like Decrep, or Bone Armor. I dropped Army of the Dead for Bone Armor, because you're a bit too squishy with no additional layers of protection.
The clear speed with the new set bonus is great, I just need to remember to keep at least 4 mages up at all times, because I would sometimes forget to recast them, then wonder why everything's taking so long to kill. :P
The trick with singularity (for GRs at least) is to remember that they consume UP TO max essence, so you still have the option of spamming out some cheap ones for trash.
Then you replace the cheap ones with full cost mages.
Poor monster density is a Real Problem for the necromancer, almost whatever build you use. Either you run out of bone armor or corpses, or both. Sure, you can generate a few corpses, but not nearly as many as you need to take down biggies.
"Kill Urzael" is like, the worst bounty for me.
there is a set of bracers that cause the golem to shed a corpse every second or so
Yeah, like I said you can make a few against a single target. But also those gloves make a really irritating noise. *squish* *squish* *squish*
It's almost as bad as the fallen lunatic ring and the pig sticker.
Posts
I really hate having to cast mages so often. I know it was a common complaint, and having experienced it first hand it seems like a valid one.
Maybe it was just me being a noob to Rathma builds but I barely had time to cast anything other than mages. Hard to fit in the time for a curse. Its more tedious than fun.
I think they need to increase the time that mages last. Making them permanent is not required, but they need to last longer. I shouldnt need to be in this continuous struggle to keep mages up.
Inarius at least lets you play. You aren't micromanaging an annoying mechanic the whole time.
With this revelation, my motivation to start S11 as wizard instead of necro just increased a bit. I do plan to primarily play necro, but starting with rathma seems like it could be a pain in the ass.
I'd have considered Necro if it wasn't Rathma. I don't hate the way the build plays like many seem to, but I don't really love it either. I may change my mind in the next couple of weeks, but I'm not sure. The more active summoner playstyle is one I enjoy. Hell, Dr. Doom in Marvel Heroes was a really active summoner and I enjoyed that, but something about Rathma isn't clicking. If I use the huge mages that eat all of your essence it makes casting Decrepify and Command Skeletons more annoying, and in my experience the big mages seem to do more damage than the archers.
Also the fact that Army of the Dead isn't even used in the build, and that the early set bonus includes NO damage bonus (only Army CD reduction) makes me feel like it could be a bit of a slog. I gathered up the Rathma set in standard by farming it with the Inarius set, so I didn't struggle for damage early on. You really don't get a nice damage boost until the 6p, and/or the Jesseth set is completed.
We'll see, I guess. I'll probably change my mind fifteen times before the season starts. Excited though. I'm looking to be a lot more active and focused this season.
The problem I have with both the necro and monk sets this season is that they make you also chase a weapon set to be good... Which won't be provided for free. Dick move, imo.
Twitch: akThera
Steam: Thera
Gloves: Tasker n Theo
Bracers: Lakumba's Ornament
Ring: Short mans finger
Ring: Compass
Amulet: travellers
Weapon: sacred harvester
Offhand: serpent or cat - i like the serpent better, but ppl swear by the cat *shrug*
Cube: Furnace, Mask of Jeram, RoRG
You're ok with base set, your insane survivability comes from weapon/bracers/serpent or weapon/bracers/cat though.
You're still going to be chasing certain things. HT gargs is fun though if you can handle the pets acting stupid at times
Needing the fists for the Monk is the one thing that makes me hesitate on the Monk as well.
I don't think it's a dick move, but it's certainly another layer of RNG to peel away.
Necro should have no problem at all getting a useable weapon.
Cat is essential to avoid one shots when pushing GRs. Serpent won't save you from the off-screen jump attacks at 80-90+.
I took that as their way of making a summoner not just stand around. but I didn't enjoy it at all.
(this was from beta but I remember that exact gameplay being a problem for me so I guess it hasn't changed)
They just need to dial back the frequency with which you need to cast mages. Not even eliminate having to cast every so often, just make it somewhat less frequent. Make them last a bit longer somehow, either through skill or item adjustments (i.e. make that ring more than 4 seconds).
Maybe if where you clicked they exploded into existence and did some area damage.
I'm going through the campaign again with a Necro, and I got the ring that doubles up your skeleton mage summons early on.
I'm just wondering do I eventually get the cube in the campaign, if so, when?
Cause I've kind of out leveled the stats on the ring, but I don't want to lose out on my skeleton mages by swapping it out for something with more than +20 int.
Think the cube is only in Adventure...
Steam: betsuni7
Ah well. I'm trying to stick as close to a clean run as I can. Not assigning paragon levels, not using legendary gems.
Minor exception for the normal gems that I had in my stash, but other than that, I get what I get.
Been using this build for my Necromancer. Just cleared my first Grift 70! Wooo! Necro is fun. Only concern now is that now I'm fully kitted out with the build(s) I want, it's only downhill from this point forward
I think making a summoner have active gameplay is a good thing.
What I don't like, though, is having that active play be about constantly summoning temporary minions. Give them a good reason to do other things!
I mean, even in D2 as a necro doing harder things meant managing curses and corpse explosion or your skellies would get squashed.
Constantly resummoning minions is why I hated Torchlight 1/2 summoners so much.
battletag: Millin#1360
Nice chart to figure out how honest a news source is.
i mean yeah LoN but only two ancients i think? and one (shitty) attack ability?
its brutal
Rathma however is a lot more fun.
Twitch: akThera
Steam: Thera
- Players abused it to get super high legendary gems, like 140+
- Community cries out for a fix
- Blizz hotfixes on friday but reverts it
- People continue to abuse it all weekend
- Hotfix hits on monday but community still upset
- Blizzard says "sorry dudes, we're going to have a double XP weekend and we rolled back the high gems to level 132."
- Now apparently people a circumventing the gem "fix" by rolling back their accounts to just before the hotfix, because apparently level 132 gems just aren't high enough :rotate:
The back and forth of player tricks vs developer response can be pretty amusing sometimes
edit found a reddit post explaining how it worked and man its dumb how people used it but the interaction itself is actually really cool
It's definitely not a fun build, but totally doable. I just thought it was a very odd build that wouldn't get you very far in a season at all. It reminded me of a far less effective Crusader thorns build.
This is some sad knock off, unfortunately.
Blizz confirmed that any boxes earned outside of an active seasonal window will only be available to non-seasonal characters.
So if you've been saving, you can stop.
e: from what I've seen, you CAN cross softcore/hardcore though.
I can entertain myself for a week, maybe two around the start of a season and then it just dwindles
"Kill Urzael" is like, the worst bounty for me.
Twitch: akThera
Steam: Thera
there is a set of bracers that cause the golem to shed a corpse every second or so
Bravely Default / 3DS Friend Code = 3394-3571-1609
Yeah, but you have to play a lot to really get to the point of no upgrades (and if you want to be real technical never- keep on leveling those gems!). Just getting the set is easy, now get primals!
And then multiple characters. Pushing Grfits.
I know a guy who just beat the campaign a few times and called it quits.
Depends on what you want out of the game.
A lot of the high-end builds use Singularity mages, but I cannot stand using them (too much of your time is spent solely on regaining Essence for another summon). So I subbed in Archers, and they seem quite similar in output. Singularity mages excel a bit in single-target damage, but the Archers do just fine, and they're better on trash since you can have way more out at a time. With the change, I can summon 4 mages, then actually do something else, like Decrep, or Bone Armor. I dropped Army of the Dead for Bone Armor, because you're a bit too squishy with no additional layers of protection.
The clear speed with the new set bonus is great, I just need to remember to keep at least 4 mages up at all times, because I would sometimes forget to recast them, then wonder why everything's taking so long to kill. :P
Then you replace the cheap ones with full cost mages.
Yeah, like I said you can make a few against a single target. But also those gloves make a really irritating noise. *squish* *squish* *squish*
It's almost as bad as the fallen lunatic ring and the pig sticker.
Twitch: akThera
Steam: Thera
Makes goblins a surprise sometimes, but that could be a feature.