Definitely my favourite moment from the game was when I shot an arrow up to top lane where there was a 2v2 gank/countergank going on to try to turn the tide and ended up...
hitting the 50%-ish mid-lane malzahar completely by accident, whereupon our Vel'Koz just combo+ulted for the instant kill.
it is eminently frustrating to like a character and have people continually say in thread NO FUCK YOU THAT'S A BAD CHARACTER AND YOU'RE A BAD PERSON FOR LIKING THEM
it is a not minor component of why i stopped playing league
your post is completely indistinguishable from a fully sincere post
Like right now, I want to ask about Rengar, but I haven't really because there seems to be a lot of posters who hate him/playing against him and judging by the tone of previous posts on similar subjects I have hesitated because well, what Gnome said above.
Which is kind of disappointing, because I view PA discourse as being on a generally higher level than reddit or what have you. I want to say that when I posted a lot in the PA fighting game threads, there would be the occasional instance of "OMG you play that character? He's so cheap/he sucks/you suck etc". However this would be shut down almost every time by the other posters and even people who play that character will teach you to play vs him. I know I've taught a lot of people how to fight Abel in SF4, especially my own Abel. And a lot of people dislike Abel for his heavy reliance on mixups.
I know that it's meant in a lot of cases to be a joke here, or at least a disparaging jest, but it consistently happens and it's hard to tell if people are being funny or if they actually mean that you are a terrible person for playing that champion because it happens so often.
Hiryu02 on
Sev: Your gameplay is the most heavily yomi based around. Usually you look for characters that allow you to force guessing situations for big dmg. Even if the guess is mathematically nowhere near in your favor lol. You're happiest when you have either a 50/50, 33/33/33 or even a 75/25 situation to go crazy with. And you will take big risks to force those situations to come up.
0
Sir Landsharkresting shark faceRegistered Userregular
I think Ryan Choi is a rengar only main in case you want to dig up some of his twitch broadcasts
Please consider the environment before printing this post.
Like right now, I want to ask about Rengar, but I haven't really because there seems to be a lot of posters who hate him/playing against him and judging by the tone of previous posts on similar subjects I have hesitated because well, what Gnome said above.
You are a bad person for wanting to play cancer-cat.
What do you want to know? (I'm considering myself the expert jungle main, even though I don't play Rengar just a whole lot.) I've gotten better on jungle assassins, but that's still not really my playstyle. I remember you were wondering about the early clear being rough. Right now, you can jungle basically anyone by running tanky masteries, and it makes the clear a lot easier. (Biased because I like tankier people anyway.)
One of the nice things about Rengar is that he can be fairly flexible. You can go assassin "Hey your carry disappeared" Knife-cat, tanky "I'm just here to bola someone important and absorb panicked reactions when I jump in" Knife-cat, or somewhere in-between. Basically, once you get to 6, catch people whenever your ult is up--unless the enemy team is all clumping together, there's not a whole lot they can do. Have your team take advantage and you can take stuff they aren't defending.
Me elsewhere:
Steam, various fora: Ivellius
League of Legends: Doctor Ivellius
Twitch, probably another place or two I forget: LPIvellius
I think that Eve would be awesome with activated stealth. I mean, I love playing Twitch, so I'm a fan of activated stealth. Having her be seen until a while before she comes in. I mean, having her stealth be on a basic ability and be longer in duration than say Shaco.
Although now that I think about it, every damn character with stealth is straight terrifying to play against and such a pain in the ass.
I wonder if people think of me as a garbage person when I pick Twitch into lane.
I mean, except for the fact that Twitch is not great right now
"The only way to get rid of a temptation is to give into it." - Oscar Wilde
"We believe in the people and their 'wisdom' as if there was some special secret entrance to knowledge that barred to anyone who had ever learned anything." - Friedrich Nietzsche
it is eminently frustrating to like a character and have people continually say in thread NO FUCK YOU THAT'S A BAD CHARACTER AND YOU'RE A BAD PERSON FOR LIKING THEM
it is a not minor component of why i stopped playing league
your post is completely indistinguishable from a fully sincere post
I know that it's meant in a lot of cases to be a joke here, or at least a disparaging jest, but it consistently happens and it's hard to tell if people are being funny or if they actually mean that you are a terrible person for playing that champion because it happens so often.
It is always meant to be a joke. I assume? People here are generally adults and presumably do not actually judge others on their champ select, but do enjoy good-natured ribbing. If it's actually hurtful to you and to Evelynn Butt, maybe we can all try to tone it down?
...but I legit have no idea how to play Rengar, like every time I try I just feed uncontrollably and definitely do not delete people in the least, so. I'm missing something very fundamental about his mechanics.
I think that Eve would be awesome with activated stealth. I mean, I love playing Twitch, so I'm a fan of activated stealth. Having her be seen until a while before she comes in. I mean, having her stealth be on a basic ability and be longer in duration than say Shaco.
Although now that I think about it, every damn character with stealth is straight terrifying to play against and such a pain in the ass.
I wonder if people think of me as a garbage person when I pick Twitch into lane.
I mean, except for the fact that Twitch is not great right now
Twitch has a high winrate right now, even though he "feels" weak (to me, anyway.)
I think that Eve would be awesome with activated stealth. I mean, I love playing Twitch, so I'm a fan of activated stealth. Having her be seen until a while before she comes in. I mean, having her stealth be on a basic ability and be longer in duration than say Shaco.
Although now that I think about it, every damn character with stealth is straight terrifying to play against and such a pain in the ass.
I wonder if people think of me as a garbage person when I pick Twitch into lane.
I mean, except for the fact that Twitch is not great right now
Twitch has a high winrate right now, even though he "feels" weak (to me, anyway.)
Twitch does a ton of damage, he's just squishy. Usually when I play him I get a ton of kills but also have a ton of deaths...
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Red Raevynbecause I only take Bubble BathsRegistered Userregular
I wish there was no stealth in any PvP games (unless literally everyone has it) because it's frustrating to play against and they never truly balance the enormous advantage of invisibility with weakness-when-seen. When they try to, people complain about being too weak out of stealth (dur). However, I say if it is in the game play it and if it helps you win play it even more - there is no nobility in not playing "the OP." And honestly I like watching the montages of people really good with stealth and clones being infuriatingly unkillable as much as anyone else.
@credeiki Props on landing bubbles! I got fed up with 15 minutes of queue yesterday and went as support with free Nami; couldn't believe how many bubbles I missed haha. Didn't matter thankfully, as her teamfight presence is just bonkers.
(Just noticed my Ezreal ADC built Duskblade of Draktharr that game ... that seems kinda terrible for an ADC, isn't it?)
I wish there was no stealth in any PvP games (unless literally everyone has it) because it's frustrating to play against and they never truly balance the enormous advantage of invisibility with weakness-when-seen. When they try to, people complain about being too weak out of stealth (dur). However, I say if it is in the game play it and if it helps you win play it even more - there is no nobility in not playing "the OP." And honestly I like watching the montages of people really good with stealth and clones being infuriatingly unkillable as much as anyone else.
@credeiki Props on landing bubbles! I got fed up with 15 minutes of queue yesterday and went as support with free Nami; couldn't believe how many bubbles I missed haha. Didn't matter thankfully, as her teamfight presence is just bonkers.
(Just noticed my Ezreal ADC built Duskblade of Draktharr that game ... that seems kinda terrible for an ADC, isn't it?)
Yeah, the secret of Nami is that honestly you kinda don't need to land bubbles. Like, you need to at some elo, presumably, to pull your weight. But just healbouncing, speeding people up, slowing people down, initiating teamfights, using bubbles for 'zoning' (er even if you meant to hit them and miss, they can still keep people from walking towards your squishies) is absolutely enough.
I wish there was no stealth in any PvP games (unless literally everyone has it) because it's frustrating to play against and they never truly balance the enormous advantage of invisibility with weakness-when-seen. When they try to, people complain about being too weak out of stealth (dur). However, I say if it is in the game play it and if it helps you win play it even more - there is no nobility in not playing "the OP." And honestly I like watching the montages of people really good with stealth and clones being infuriatingly unkillable as much as anyone else.
@credeiki Props on landing bubbles! I got fed up with 15 minutes of queue yesterday and went as support with free Nami; couldn't believe how many bubbles I missed haha. Didn't matter thankfully, as her teamfight presence is just bonkers.
(Just noticed my Ezreal ADC built Duskblade of Draktharr that game ... that seems kinda terrible for an ADC, isn't it?)
Duskblade isn't that bad if you're not crit focused. It's got the highest possible AD and Armor Pen and move speed and it's cheaper than any other full AD option.
It's downside is that it has no lifesteal, crit, or defensive stats. That last part makes it hard to use for traditional ADs or ADs that will auto attack even a decent portion.
But Ezreals q doesn't crit and he likes to shift in for burst then get out again. So extra raw AD and pen is what he needs and the MS lets him kite better.
Now if he bought it first it's bad or if he bought it when the enemy had lots bonus armor instead of a LW item. But otherwise it's comps are maw/mercurial/ghost and its got more damage in general than all of them
I think that Eve would be awesome with activated stealth. I mean, I love playing Twitch, so I'm a fan of activated stealth. Having her be seen until a while before she comes in. I mean, having her stealth be on a basic ability and be longer in duration than say Shaco.
Although now that I think about it, every damn character with stealth is straight terrifying to play against and such a pain in the ass.
I wonder if people think of me as a garbage person when I pick Twitch into lane.
I mean, except for the fact that Twitch is not great right now
Twitch has a high winrate right now, even though he "feels" weak (to me, anyway.)
I have yet to see a Twitch not go absolutely crazy ever since the update.
What is the combo theory behind his leap combo from stealth? I know that the basic premise is to build 5 Fero, ult, leap then Empowered E for the snare then dump cooldowns when he lands. Is the ult effect of gaining Fero supposed to allow him to do an Empowered E, then end his cooldowns with a Empowered Q or E to finish the job or continue the snare?
Also, I have read that you can also Empowered Q before you leap to start the combo. Does this mean that the leap attack counts as an Empowered Q itself? Or is the leap attack going to activate separately and will be followed by the empowered Q?
Hiryu02 on
Sev: Your gameplay is the most heavily yomi based around. Usually you look for characters that allow you to force guessing situations for big dmg. Even if the guess is mathematically nowhere near in your favor lol. You're happiest when you have either a 50/50, 33/33/33 or even a 75/25 situation to go crazy with. And you will take big risks to force those situations to come up.
Ok, thanks. That does clarify it a bit. I thought the leap was its own little thing.
Sev: Your gameplay is the most heavily yomi based around. Usually you look for characters that allow you to force guessing situations for big dmg. Even if the guess is mathematically nowhere near in your favor lol. You're happiest when you have either a 50/50, 33/33/33 or even a 75/25 situation to go crazy with. And you will take big risks to force those situations to come up.
I think that Eve would be awesome with activated stealth. I mean, I love playing Twitch, so I'm a fan of activated stealth. Having her be seen until a while before she comes in. I mean, having her stealth be on a basic ability and be longer in duration than say Shaco.
Although now that I think about it, every damn character with stealth is straight terrifying to play against and such a pain in the ass.
I wonder if people think of me as a garbage person when I pick Twitch into lane.
I mean, except for the fact that Twitch is not great right now
Twitch has a high winrate right now, even though he "feels" weak (to me, anyway.)
I have yet to see a Twitch not go absolutely crazy ever since the update.
Oh I just supported some pretty fail Twitches. And then in my tuesday night game (which has its own special meta) my coworker sometimes picks Twitch and I have consistently obliterated him whenever he has done so. But I believe that Twitch is actually good and I just haven't had the occasion to experience that recently.
credeiki on
Steam, LoL: credeiki
0
Red Raevynbecause I only take Bubble BathsRegistered Userregular
Man I just had a rough game where a teammate was really mean.
I was trying Caitlyn for the first time and laning phase wasn't the best; then coming out of it I was behind in kills (though matching CS) and enemy TF was super duper fed. My support (plat border) was really mean, so I muted him; then later when other teammates were getting nasty I hit /ignore all. We were up 3 towers to 0 and even though enemies'd been securing dragons off big bot dives that went their way, I didn't think we were far behind in gold. We killed 3 of them while sieging top tier 2 (NOT including fed TF or their Rammus jg) and my teammates stupidly decide to go for baron. Of course it goes poorly and TF ults in for some kills and then they get Baron. So they're ahead (because TF and their MF are fed whereas I don't have kill gold) and have Baron, but they can't siege us; we're holding them off of our mid tier 2 and I'm thinking perfect, we wait out Baron buff and we're still in this. Enemies back off and then my whole team starts shoving down mid for their mid inhib turret. I'm thinking wth, and as my team passes river I ping the enemy MF who is in bot lane passing river, shoving with Baron buff. My team pings enemy mid inhib and keeps charging; I can't duel MF so I sigh inside and stick with team. Surprise surprise, they crush us in another teamfight so I finally say "They were ahead of us with Baron, why shove out instead of waiting out the buff safely?".
At that point I learn that apparently ignore all just toggles ignore, so previously muted people get unmuted. >_< Blitzcrank says "it was 4v5" (As if MF can't recall before we take turret?), I'm an idiot, I should shut the fuck up, that I have no place in this game, I'm mechanical garbage, etc. I said, "I'm just trying a new champion, you don't need to be a jerk. This isn't ranked." He just continues with You shouldn't play ADC, go back to bots and so on. I remuted him at that point.
I stopped playing ADC a few weeks ago because it was so frustrating to get annihilated by enemies, especially when behind. I know I'm not great and I had a lot of dumb mechanical mistakes. On the one hand I want to say "well this guy is plat, he probably knows more than me." But on the other hand, he never bought a sightstone, sweeper, or a single pink ward. He died just as much as me, and even though I died way more than I'm okay with, so many of my deaths were instances where the only way I could have survived would have been being completely out of the teamfight. My teammates all died nearly the same amount and weren't squishy ADCs, but they still mocked me in postgame chat. So if anyone wants to watch the replay at 16x speed, I'm kinda curious whether I was the terrible feeder that cost us the game or if I was just along for the ride contributing my 20% to the loss. match history replay.gg
Either way I probably won't go back to ADC again this season =\
0
Sir Landsharkresting shark faceRegistered Userregular
What is the combo theory behind his leap combo from stealth? I know that the basic premise is to build 5 Fero, ult, leap then Empowered E for the snare then dump cooldowns when he lands. Is the ult effect of gaining Fero supposed to allow him to do an Empowered E, then end his cooldowns with a Empowered Q or E to finish the job or continue the snare?
Also, I have read that you can also Empowered Q before you leap to start the combo. Does this mean that the leap attack counts as an Empowered Q itself? Or is the leap attack going to activate separately and will be followed by the empowered Q?
Back in Season 3 when I played a ton of Kha jungle I tried to pick up Rengar as well. Didn't click as well with me but in general if you have 5 Ferocity when you ult you will get back up to 5 almost immediately between your E-Q-W and the ult effect. In general I would think using the empowered E effect would be best both times. Allows for plenty of follow up damage.
Please consider the environment before printing this post.
That's a silly stance, given supports like Thresh, Fiddlesticks, Zyra, Morgana, etc.
e:
I mean seriously, Zyra and Eve are like pallet swapped models.
None of the characters you mention really have the visual design of a supportive character, aside from maybe Thresh. Zyra and Morgana in particular look more like murdery mages, which is... pretty much they role that they fill in bot lane anyways. They also both began life as mid laners; it took a few weeks for Zyra support to catch on and several years for Morg support to do so.
I get that your point is probably "Somebody who doesn't necessarily look like a support can still be run as a support", but for Eve that'd need a drastic overhaul of her kit as well and it really would feel like replacing her with a new character.
Just as a final aside, I've also seen enough support Shaco to know that if "stealth assassin" is problematic then turning it into "stealth support" won't make things much better.
Yeah, my point was those were all "supports" that had visual designs that don't indicate support, yet still were. As long as the visual design matches the abilities being tossed out (no unicorns coming from a dark mage), it is fine.
Yeah, if you were seriously turning her into a support, it would require a complete kit rework, which is what the comment sprang from.
Stealth could totally work on a support without being OP, it just requires the focus to be on utility rather than ability. Stealth with a detection range, trap/location based abilities requiring positioning.
Man I just had a rough game where a teammate was really mean.
I was trying Caitlyn for the first time and laning phase wasn't the best; then coming out of it I was behind in kills (though matching CS) and enemy TF was super duper fed. My support (plat border) was really mean, so I muted him; then later when other teammates were getting nasty I hit /ignore all. We were up 3 towers to 0 and even though enemies'd been securing dragons off big bot dives that went their way, I didn't think we were far behind in gold. We killed 3 of them while sieging top tier 2 (NOT including fed TF or their Rammus jg) and my teammates stupidly decide to go for baron. Of course it goes poorly and TF ults in for some kills and then they get Baron. So they're ahead (because TF and their MF are fed whereas I don't have kill gold) and have Baron, but they can't siege us; we're holding them off of our mid tier 2 and I'm thinking perfect, we wait out Baron buff and we're still in this. Enemies back off and then my whole team starts shoving down mid for their mid inhib turret. I'm thinking wth, and as my team passes river I ping the enemy MF who is in bot lane passing river, shoving with Baron buff. My team pings enemy mid inhib and keeps charging; I can't duel MF so I sigh inside and stick with team. Surprise surprise, they crush us in another teamfight so I finally say "They were ahead of us with Baron, why shove out instead of waiting out the buff safely?".
At that point I learn that apparently ignore all just toggles ignore, so previously muted people get unmuted. >_< Blitzcrank says "it was 4v5" (As if MF can't recall before we take turret?), I'm an idiot, I should shut the fuck up, that I have no place in this game, I'm mechanical garbage, etc. I said, "I'm just trying a new champion, you don't need to be a jerk. This isn't ranked." He just continues with You shouldn't play ADC, go back to bots and so on. I remuted him at that point.
I stopped playing ADC a few weeks ago because it was so frustrating to get annihilated by enemies, especially when behind. I know I'm not great and I had a lot of dumb mechanical mistakes. On the one hand I want to say "well this guy is plat, he probably knows more than me." But on the other hand, he never bought a sightstone, sweeper, or a single pink ward. He died just as much as me, and even though I died way more than I'm okay with, so many of my deaths were instances where the only way I could have survived would have been being completely out of the teamfight. My teammates all died nearly the same amount and weren't squishy ADCs, but they still mocked me in postgame chat. So if anyone wants to watch the replay at 16x speed, I'm kinda curious whether I was the terrible feeder that cost us the game or if I was just along for the ride contributing my 20% to the loss. match history replay.gg
Either way I probably won't go back to ADC again this season =\
Full AP Blitzcrank with no sightstone was trolling/fucking around. This is not your fault.
Also looks like your initial deaths weren't 2v2 but were TF ganks? Like, you can play safe and try to avoid the TF gank, but it happens; not like you were opting into losing 2v2s or anything. I'm not going to watch the replay or anything, but because your support was not taking his job seriously at all, and your mid let her opponent go unchecked, it's really hard to tell how much your personal skill was a factor.
aw, adc is so fun though...don't give up! Jhin is solid; his soundset always untilts me.
Fucking cannot wait for my friend to try out Jkin this week. Had him listen to some of his VA and he agreed that yes, this dude sounds amazing. "Places, everyone!"
Sev: Your gameplay is the most heavily yomi based around. Usually you look for characters that allow you to force guessing situations for big dmg. Even if the guess is mathematically nowhere near in your favor lol. You're happiest when you have either a 50/50, 33/33/33 or even a 75/25 situation to go crazy with. And you will take big risks to force those situations to come up.
What is the combo theory behind his leap combo from stealth? I know that the basic premise is to build 5 Fero, ult, leap then Empowered E for the snare then dump cooldowns when he lands. Is the ult effect of gaining Fero supposed to allow him to do an Empowered E, then end his cooldowns with a Empowered Q or E to finish the job or continue the snare?
Also, I have read that you can also Empowered Q before you leap to start the combo. Does this mean that the leap attack counts as an Empowered Q itself? Or is the leap attack going to activate separately and will be followed by the empowered Q?
These were sort of answered already, but the first one is basically yes. If you dump full Ferocity when you jump out of stealth, you'll get the Ferocity back from your ultimate ending. Depending on what's happened to your target, you can decide whether you need more knifing or them to sit still a minute longer (or, uh, you deleted the person and can get to knifing someone else).
If you leap while Q is up it triggers the Q, yes. If you're not worried about them moving away (say, Jhin or Kog'maw as your target) you'll probably be better served to just knife them a lot.
Me elsewhere:
Steam, various fora: Ivellius
League of Legends: Doctor Ivellius
Twitch, probably another place or two I forget: LPIvellius
0
Element BrianPeanut Butter ShillRegistered Userregular
Man I just had a rough game where a teammate was really mean.
I was trying Caitlyn for the first time and laning phase wasn't the best; then coming out of it I was behind in kills (though matching CS) and enemy TF was super duper fed. My support (plat border) was really mean, so I muted him; then later when other teammates were getting nasty I hit /ignore all. We were up 3 towers to 0 and even though enemies'd been securing dragons off big bot dives that went their way, I didn't think we were far behind in gold. We killed 3 of them while sieging top tier 2 (NOT including fed TF or their Rammus jg) and my teammates stupidly decide to go for baron. Of course it goes poorly and TF ults in for some kills and then they get Baron. So they're ahead (because TF and their MF are fed whereas I don't have kill gold) and have Baron, but they can't siege us; we're holding them off of our mid tier 2 and I'm thinking perfect, we wait out Baron buff and we're still in this. Enemies back off and then my whole team starts shoving down mid for their mid inhib turret. I'm thinking wth, and as my team passes river I ping the enemy MF who is in bot lane passing river, shoving with Baron buff. My team pings enemy mid inhib and keeps charging; I can't duel MF so I sigh inside and stick with team. Surprise surprise, they crush us in another teamfight so I finally say "They were ahead of us with Baron, why shove out instead of waiting out the buff safely?".
At that point I learn that apparently ignore all just toggles ignore, so previously muted people get unmuted. >_< Blitzcrank says "it was 4v5" (As if MF can't recall before we take turret?), I'm an idiot, I should shut the fuck up, that I have no place in this game, I'm mechanical garbage, etc. I said, "I'm just trying a new champion, you don't need to be a jerk. This isn't ranked." He just continues with You shouldn't play ADC, go back to bots and so on. I remuted him at that point.
I stopped playing ADC a few weeks ago because it was so frustrating to get annihilated by enemies, especially when behind. I know I'm not great and I had a lot of dumb mechanical mistakes. On the one hand I want to say "well this guy is plat, he probably knows more than me." But on the other hand, he never bought a sightstone, sweeper, or a single pink ward. He died just as much as me, and even though I died way more than I'm okay with, so many of my deaths were instances where the only way I could have survived would have been being completely out of the teamfight. My teammates all died nearly the same amount and weren't squishy ADCs, but they still mocked me in postgame chat. So if anyone wants to watch the replay at 16x speed, I'm kinda curious whether I was the terrible feeder that cost us the game or if I was just along for the ride contributing my 20% to the loss. match history replay.gg
Either way I probably won't go back to ADC again this season =\
I haven't really played summoners rift in a couple years, like when I do play, it's just aram.
I went in last night with a PA group and sucked it up
so what I'm saying is if you'd like someone to duo que with who isn't going to freak out about the game because I'm basically trying to relearn, then I'm down to play sometime
Man I just had a rough game where a teammate was really mean.
I was trying Caitlyn for the first time and laning phase wasn't the best; then coming out of it I was behind in kills (though matching CS) and enemy TF was super duper fed. My support (plat border) was really mean, so I muted him; then later when other teammates were getting nasty I hit /ignore all. We were up 3 towers to 0 and even though enemies'd been securing dragons off big bot dives that went their way, I didn't think we were far behind in gold. We killed 3 of them while sieging top tier 2 (NOT including fed TF or their Rammus jg) and my teammates stupidly decide to go for baron. Of course it goes poorly and TF ults in for some kills and then they get Baron. So they're ahead (because TF and their MF are fed whereas I don't have kill gold) and have Baron, but they can't siege us; we're holding them off of our mid tier 2 and I'm thinking perfect, we wait out Baron buff and we're still in this. Enemies back off and then my whole team starts shoving down mid for their mid inhib turret. I'm thinking wth, and as my team passes river I ping the enemy MF who is in bot lane passing river, shoving with Baron buff. My team pings enemy mid inhib and keeps charging; I can't duel MF so I sigh inside and stick with team. Surprise surprise, they crush us in another teamfight so I finally say "They were ahead of us with Baron, why shove out instead of waiting out the buff safely?".
At that point I learn that apparently ignore all just toggles ignore, so previously muted people get unmuted. >_< Blitzcrank says "it was 4v5" (As if MF can't recall before we take turret?), I'm an idiot, I should shut the fuck up, that I have no place in this game, I'm mechanical garbage, etc. I said, "I'm just trying a new champion, you don't need to be a jerk. This isn't ranked." He just continues with You shouldn't play ADC, go back to bots and so on. I remuted him at that point.
I stopped playing ADC a few weeks ago because it was so frustrating to get annihilated by enemies, especially when behind. I know I'm not great and I had a lot of dumb mechanical mistakes. On the one hand I want to say "well this guy is plat, he probably knows more than me." But on the other hand, he never bought a sightstone, sweeper, or a single pink ward. He died just as much as me, and even though I died way more than I'm okay with, so many of my deaths were instances where the only way I could have survived would have been being completely out of the teamfight. My teammates all died nearly the same amount and weren't squishy ADCs, but they still mocked me in postgame chat. So if anyone wants to watch the replay at 16x speed, I'm kinda curious whether I was the terrible feeder that cost us the game or if I was just along for the ride contributing my 20% to the loss. match history replay.gg
Either way I probably won't go back to ADC again this season =\
Full AP Blitzcrank with no sightstone was trolling/fucking around. This is not your fault.
Also looks like your initial deaths weren't 2v2 but were TF ganks? Like, you can play safe and try to avoid the TF gank, but it happens; not like you were opting into losing 2v2s or anything. I'm not going to watch the replay or anything, but because your support was not taking his job seriously at all, and your mid let her opponent go unchecked, it's really hard to tell how much your personal skill was a factor.
aw, adc is so fun though...don't give up! Jhin is solid; his soundset always untilts me.
Yep, both were. I rewatched beginning and first I was dumb and probably could have escaped but second death was yellow card into bubble (ugh). At 12 minutes I was only 100 gold down on their MF, and 3rd death was Blitz doing a really bad engage that I fell for (if he'd waited 4 seconds for me and our jungler to be there it would have been a double kill for us for sure). Thanks for the reassurance - maybe I'll spend the IP I saved up for MF on her after all.
Element Brian I haven't bothered with ranked yet this season but I'm always down to play normals with nice folk :]
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Element BrianPeanut Butter ShillRegistered Userregular
yah dude, add me. League name is same as my UN here. I never touch Ranked either. I'm probably good tomorrow night or during the day Saturday
it is eminently frustrating to like a character and have people continually say in thread NO FUCK YOU THAT'S A BAD CHARACTER AND YOU'RE A BAD PERSON FOR LIKING THEM
it is a not minor component of why i stopped playing league
your post is completely indistinguishable from a fully sincere post
Like right now, I want to ask about Rengar, but I haven't really because there seems to be a lot of posters who hate him/playing against him and judging by the tone of previous posts on similar subjects I have hesitated because well, what Gnome said above.
Which is kind of disappointing, because I view PA discourse as being on a generally higher level than reddit or what have you. I want to say that when I posted a lot in the PA fighting game threads, there would be the occasional instance of "OMG you play that character? He's so cheap/he sucks/you suck etc". However this would be shut down almost every time by the other posters and even people who play that character will teach you to play vs him. I know I've taught a lot of people how to fight Abel in SF4, especially my own Abel. And a lot of people dislike Abel for his heavy reliance on mixups.
I know that it's meant in a lot of cases to be a joke here, or at least a disparaging jest, but it consistently happens and it's hard to tell if people are being funny or if they actually mean that you are a terrible person for playing that champion because it happens so often.
Generally, we're just ribbing. Most people don't care which champion you love or who you want to play. If you want to play Rengar, GO FOR IT! He's a rock solid champ that deletes people.
There is only one character in the entire game that makes you a terrible person, and that is Shaco. Thankfully, no one here plays Shaco.
0
Element BrianPeanut Butter ShillRegistered Userregular
As far as overall performance, he's a little weak but doing alright this patch. He hasn't been Olaf'd. He's got a couple of build options that let him fill different roles, although he tends to do best as a pure assassin.
Perhaps Rengar's most important phase of the game is the pre-game, picks and bans. Rengar is pretty binary. If he can kill someone, he turns invisible and kills them and then repeats the same thing later because he got 300g and they got a trip to fountain. If he can't kill someone, the only utility he has is a very limited root. Rengar's a very risky early pick because some champions just ruin him completely, and some teams are able to play in a way that Rengar has almost no openings.
Play Rengar if:
The enemy support is a damage mage (Brand, Vel'Koz, Sona)
The enemy jungler isn't very strong pre-6
Your team has a solid teamfight without relying on a jungler to engage (Malphite top, Leona support, etc)
The enemy team has one or more high-threat artillery champions (Jhin, Xerath, Lux).
Avoid Rengar if:
The enemy jungler is a strong, durable duelist that fights well before level 6. Never ever pick Rengar into Udyr, as he beats you early game and beats you late game and can laugh off your ambushes.
The enemy support has strong disengage. Utility / shield Karma, Thresh, and Tahm Kench would all be very happy to protect an ADC against Rengar.
The enemy mid picks Twisted Fate. Nothing ruins "I'm a silent predator here to pick off a vulnerable target" quite like "HEY GUYS RENGAR IS IN THE RIVER MOVING TOWARDS BOTLANE HERE NOW YOU CAN SEE HIM."
Your team needs you to start fights. Rengar excels at jumping into fair fights to make them very unfair, he lacks the durability and crowd control to start a 5v5 fight the same way Amumu or Vi can.
Early game, Rengar's pre-6 ganks are pretty weak, and he has virtually no pressure on mid lane due to the brush placement. You can go after top or bottom if they egregiously overextend, or you can try to sneak into the bushes for an ambush if your lane is pushed up to their tower, but generally Rengar doesn't do very much pre-6. His early clear is not very safe, so you're limited not only by your weak approach, but by the risk of getting into a 2v2 or 3v3 against an enemy jungler who is happy to duel a low-level no-item Rengar.
If you do need to gank a lane pre-6, one of the best ways you can do so if by getting a stack of 4 ferocity charges before approaching the lane. "4" is a magic number for Rengar, because all of his max-rank ferocity abilities are on a special cooldown not shared with his regular abilities. The obvious application of this is Q+ Empowered Q to deal some massive damage, but pre-6 you can use a 4 stack gank with E. Head into lane and cut off the opponent as best you can, try to hit them with your regular E skill shot for the slow. If it hits, they are slowed and you can easily tag them with an empowered E to root them for a powerful 1-2 combo with your laner. If your E misses, you can just abandon the approach entirely or you can try to get your last ferocity stack with a Q or W to get a second attempt with your empowered E. This means that its usually better to gank pre-6 with 4 ferocity instead of full ferocity so you can get two chances to land your E (slow into root is generally more useful than root into slow).
Once you hit level 6, your strategy is pretty straightforward. Farm aggressively and use your ult on any enemy who isn't hugging their tower. Wards and vision of the enemy jungle are ideal. Rengar excels at picking unfair fights, not getting into lane + jungle vs. lane + jungle slugfests. Make sure to aggressively ping for your laner, you'll be relying on their to bait the gank if they can and to follow up to guarantee a kill. Against low health targets, you can rely on the massive damage a Q+Q combo deals to obliterate a target. More durable or evasive opponents likely merit the use of an empowered E to keep them in place while you and your allies take them out.
For build options, you almost always want to go red smite + warrior. The wards from tracker or slow from chilling are tempting, but you really need the extra killing potential and 1v1 potency you get from red smite. Your options after warrior open up considerably, generally into one of three overall Rengar paths:
Kill Everything Quickly Rengar: Standard build for when you're doing well but not hilariously fed, you focus on building sufficient AD to kill someone quickly. Ghostblade is a great pick and is usually a safe first or second item after Warrior. Duskblade is also pretty useful, but generally Ghostblade is better first for the active. Ravenous Hydra grants some useful jungle sustain and extra burst damage with plenty of AD for your combo. At some point you will almost certainly need a Mercurial Scimitar, you need the ability to remove CC and stay on a target, and the item has fantastic stats in addition to the active. You can generally fill in gaps with almost any high-AD item such as Death's Dance, Bloodthirster, or Maw of Malmortius. If you're really pulling ahead you can spring for a Triforce. You generally want to rely on the Merc Scimitar as your only defensive item, its critical you retain high killing power with this build.
Guess I'm a Bruiser Rengar: AKA "I shouldn't have first picked Rengar" Rengar. Not ideal, but sometimes you need to recognize that you won't fill the role of an assassin, and a sub-optimal bruiser is better than an expensive cannon minion who leaps out at the enemy ADC for easy gold. Warrior into Black Cleaver, grab one lifesteal item for extra AD and survivability, and then build tanky. A full build might look like Ravenous / Warrior / Cleaver / Ninja Tabi / Spirit Visage / Randuins. Again, not an ideal build, this is something to fall back on if you are having a bad game or simply can't kill high value targets. You could also swap to this build if you pull ahead aggressively early but suspect the enemy team will be able to lock you down easily in teamfights.
Crit-Gar: By combining the dueling potential of Phantom Dancer and Red Smite, Rengar can become a pretty terrifying 1v1 champion. This build tends to require a fair amount of gold and is a bit niche, but it can be a valuable way to deal with split pushing or t o really really murder an enemy ADC. Warrior with Red Smite, Ghostblade, and an early-ish Phantom Dancer followed by an Infinity Edge. Since you rely on autos for your damage, the IE + PD hits pretty hard, even though you're building attack speed on Rengar. The PD passive combined with Red Smite give you substantial 1v1 durability, especially if you combine it with a Bloodthirster or similar item later. The ability to get a critical Q generally gives this build amazing damage potential, but its somewhat unreliable and tends to be very very gold-thirsty. Until you have the PD and IE together, you aren't going to be hitting very hard.
Late game, you want to control the map by picking on weak targets and generally stay in a position to flank on teamfights. Be very careful about being caught out of position, Rengar is incredibly weak if someone else gets the jump on him, and a smart team will wait for you to pick a risky flank before quickly taking you out. Watch the overall map to pick on vulnerable members, if you see a big minion wave headed to the top tower and suspect the enemy ADC is headed there alone to farm it, that's a free kill. If you know the enemy support is trying to clear dragon wards alone, that's a free kill. If you do your job as Rengar, the enemy team will be terrified to ever send anyone out alone, and you can start abusing this to steal objectives, pressure side lines, or start favorable fights. If the enemy team lets their guard down and sends valuable team members out solo, hunt them for a kill and then force objectives or towers. Rengar can work well with split-pushers because of his ability to traverse the map and set up ambushes. If you have a strong split-pusher, make sure to coordinate with them. If the enemy sends two vulnerable targets after a split pusher, ambush them into an advantageous 2v2. If the enemy sends just one target, you can hunt them in the jungle or threaten them with a 2v1 if they attack your splitpusher. If the enemy sends two strong targets, your split pusher can stall for time or pull back while your team starts a 3v3 that you turn into a very short 4v3.
12/18/0 is usually your best mastery page, the burst from Thunderlords is hard to beat and the pure armor pen from Ferocity isn't very useful for a target who wants to avoid tanks at all costs. Since you have an AA reset in your Q, your best runes are a mix of AD and armor pen for quints and reds, with standard armor / scaling MR yellows and blues.
Fucking cannot wait for my friend to try out Jkin this week. Had him listen to some of his VA and he agreed that yes, this dude sounds amazing. "Places, everyone!"
"Smile! Everyone is watching"
"The only way to get rid of a temptation is to give into it." - Oscar Wilde
"We believe in the people and their 'wisdom' as if there was some special secret entrance to knowledge that barred to anyone who had ever learned anything." - Friedrich Nietzsche
@PotatoNinja
Thanks a lot man, that was super insightful. I guess I'll do the Valkrin clear for a fast level 6 unless top or bot is overpushed. I am running AD/Arpen reds and quints, but probably going to move to scaling Armor yellows. What is your take on Stormraider's instead of TLD?
Sev: Your gameplay is the most heavily yomi based around. Usually you look for characters that allow you to force guessing situations for big dmg. Even if the guess is mathematically nowhere near in your favor lol. You're happiest when you have either a 50/50, 33/33/33 or even a 75/25 situation to go crazy with. And you will take big risks to force those situations to come up.
Huh. So apparently Ziggs is getting a special effect added to his Satchel where if hits a tower under a certain threshold of health (25% in testing), it'll just demolish it.
COME FORTH, AMATERASU! - Switch Friend Code SW-5465-2458-5696 - Twitch
Huh. So apparently Ziggs is getting a special effect added to his Satchel where if hits a tower under a certain threshold of health (25% in testing), it'll just demolish it.
Hearing things like this just makes me think that the mage update is going to be another clusterfuck like the ADC and Juggernaut updates were.
Although I guess it'll have the trade-off where if you use the Satchel to kill a tower, you won't have it to escape when the gank squad shows up on your ass.
Also apparently Rumble's Q is getting buffed so that it does normal damage to minions?
EDIT: Most importantly, Taric's supposed to be coming in the next patch, they're aiming for Tues/Wednesday next week unless it gets delayed for some reason.
PMAvers on
COME FORTH, AMATERASU! - Switch Friend Code SW-5465-2458-5696 - Twitch
Maybe if they gave him a special package like Corki, that he had to pick up in base, that gave his satchel that ability once every N minutes? So he had a tradeoff between using it for safety and using it to hurt the tower.
Man, I had such a nice game last night that I wanted to post as a game with a Rengar in it (toplane, kept running bot to try and kill me--er often successfully tbh, but we won anyway, although my poor 1/11 Janna support was just playing kinda terribly and was quietly and non-toxically tilting "I think I just won't play League again after this " etc--really sad, inwardly directed support tilt) but it's not showing up in my match history. I did get the LP for it though...
There's some midgame power level, maybe lvls 10-15 or so, where even an unfed lane Rengar can just wander off and delete an (equivalently unfed) adc, or at the very least necessitate immediate application of summoner spells.
Posts
Ended up doing ok.
Definitely my favourite moment from the game was when I shot an arrow up to top lane where there was a 2v2 gank/countergank going on to try to turn the tide and ended up...
hitting the 50%-ish mid-lane malzahar completely by accident, whereupon our Vel'Koz just combo+ulted for the instant kill.
Like right now, I want to ask about Rengar, but I haven't really because there seems to be a lot of posters who hate him/playing against him and judging by the tone of previous posts on similar subjects I have hesitated because well, what Gnome said above.
Which is kind of disappointing, because I view PA discourse as being on a generally higher level than reddit or what have you. I want to say that when I posted a lot in the PA fighting game threads, there would be the occasional instance of "OMG you play that character? He's so cheap/he sucks/you suck etc". However this would be shut down almost every time by the other posters and even people who play that character will teach you to play vs him. I know I've taught a lot of people how to fight Abel in SF4, especially my own Abel. And a lot of people dislike Abel for his heavy reliance on mixups.
I know that it's meant in a lot of cases to be a joke here, or at least a disparaging jest, but it consistently happens and it's hard to tell if people are being funny or if they actually mean that you are a terrible person for playing that champion because it happens so often.
You are a bad person for wanting to play cancer-cat.
What do you want to know? (I'm considering myself the expert jungle main, even though I don't play Rengar just a whole lot.) I've gotten better on jungle assassins, but that's still not really my playstyle. I remember you were wondering about the early clear being rough. Right now, you can jungle basically anyone by running tanky masteries, and it makes the clear a lot easier. (Biased because I like tankier people anyway.)
One of the nice things about Rengar is that he can be fairly flexible. You can go assassin "Hey your carry disappeared" Knife-cat, tanky "I'm just here to bola someone important and absorb panicked reactions when I jump in" Knife-cat, or somewhere in-between. Basically, once you get to 6, catch people whenever your ult is up--unless the enemy team is all clumping together, there's not a whole lot they can do. Have your team take advantage and you can take stuff they aren't defending.
Steam, various fora: Ivellius
League of Legends: Doctor Ivellius
Twitch, probably another place or two I forget: LPIvellius
Although now that I think about it, every damn character with stealth is straight terrifying to play against and such a pain in the ass.
I wonder if people think of me as a garbage person when I pick Twitch into lane.
I mean, except for the fact that Twitch is not great right now
"We believe in the people and their 'wisdom' as if there was some special secret entrance to knowledge that barred to anyone who had ever learned anything." - Friedrich Nietzsche
It is always meant to be a joke. I assume? People here are generally adults and presumably do not actually judge others on their champ select, but do enjoy good-natured ribbing. If it's actually hurtful to you and to Evelynn Butt, maybe we can all try to tone it down?
...but I legit have no idea how to play Rengar, like every time I try I just feed uncontrollably and definitely do not delete people in the least, so. I'm missing something very fundamental about his mechanics.
Twitch has a high winrate right now, even though he "feels" weak (to me, anyway.)
Twitch does a ton of damage, he's just squishy. Usually when I play him I get a ton of kills but also have a ton of deaths...
@credeiki Props on landing bubbles! I got fed up with 15 minutes of queue yesterday and went as support with free Nami; couldn't believe how many bubbles I missed haha. Didn't matter thankfully, as her teamfight presence is just bonkers.
(Just noticed my Ezreal ADC built Duskblade of Draktharr that game ... that seems kinda terrible for an ADC, isn't it?)
Yeah, the secret of Nami is that honestly you kinda don't need to land bubbles. Like, you need to at some elo, presumably, to pull your weight. But just healbouncing, speeding people up, slowing people down, initiating teamfights, using bubbles for 'zoning' (er even if you meant to hit them and miss, they can still keep people from walking towards your squishies) is absolutely enough.
Duskblade isn't that bad if you're not crit focused. It's got the highest possible AD and Armor Pen and move speed and it's cheaper than any other full AD option.
It's downside is that it has no lifesteal, crit, or defensive stats. That last part makes it hard to use for traditional ADs or ADs that will auto attack even a decent portion.
But Ezreals q doesn't crit and he likes to shift in for burst then get out again. So extra raw AD and pen is what he needs and the MS lets him kite better.
Now if he bought it first it's bad or if he bought it when the enemy had lots bonus armor instead of a LW item. But otherwise it's comps are maw/mercurial/ghost and its got more damage in general than all of them
I have yet to see a Twitch not go absolutely crazy ever since the update.
What is the combo theory behind his leap combo from stealth? I know that the basic premise is to build 5 Fero, ult, leap then Empowered E for the snare then dump cooldowns when he lands. Is the ult effect of gaining Fero supposed to allow him to do an Empowered E, then end his cooldowns with a Empowered Q or E to finish the job or continue the snare?
Also, I have read that you can also Empowered Q before you leap to start the combo. Does this mean that the leap attack counts as an Empowered Q itself? Or is the leap attack going to activate separately and will be followed by the empowered Q?
Oh I just supported some pretty fail Twitches. And then in my tuesday night game (which has its own special meta) my coworker sometimes picks Twitch and I have consistently obliterated him whenever he has done so. But I believe that Twitch is actually good and I just haven't had the occasion to experience that recently.
At that point I learn that apparently ignore all just toggles ignore, so previously muted people get unmuted. >_< Blitzcrank says "it was 4v5" (As if MF can't recall before we take turret?), I'm an idiot, I should shut the fuck up, that I have no place in this game, I'm mechanical garbage, etc. I said, "I'm just trying a new champion, you don't need to be a jerk. This isn't ranked." He just continues with You shouldn't play ADC, go back to bots and so on. I remuted him at that point.
I stopped playing ADC a few weeks ago because it was so frustrating to get annihilated by enemies, especially when behind. I know I'm not great and I had a lot of dumb mechanical mistakes. On the one hand I want to say "well this guy is plat, he probably knows more than me." But on the other hand, he never bought a sightstone, sweeper, or a single pink ward. He died just as much as me, and even though I died way more than I'm okay with, so many of my deaths were instances where the only way I could have survived would have been being completely out of the teamfight. My teammates all died nearly the same amount and weren't squishy ADCs, but they still mocked me in postgame chat. So if anyone wants to watch the replay at 16x speed, I'm kinda curious whether I was the terrible feeder that cost us the game or if I was just along for the ride contributing my 20% to the loss.
match history
replay.gg
Back in Season 3 when I played a ton of Kha jungle I tried to pick up Rengar as well. Didn't click as well with me but in general if you have 5 Ferocity when you ult you will get back up to 5 almost immediately between your E-Q-W and the ult effect. In general I would think using the empowered E effect would be best both times. Allows for plenty of follow up damage.
Yeah, my point was those were all "supports" that had visual designs that don't indicate support, yet still were. As long as the visual design matches the abilities being tossed out (no unicorns coming from a dark mage), it is fine.
Yeah, if you were seriously turning her into a support, it would require a complete kit rework, which is what the comment sprang from.
Stealth could totally work on a support without being OP, it just requires the focus to be on utility rather than ability. Stealth with a detection range, trap/location based abilities requiring positioning.
Full AP Blitzcrank with no sightstone was trolling/fucking around. This is not your fault.
Also looks like your initial deaths weren't 2v2 but were TF ganks? Like, you can play safe and try to avoid the TF gank, but it happens; not like you were opting into losing 2v2s or anything. I'm not going to watch the replay or anything, but because your support was not taking his job seriously at all, and your mid let her opponent go unchecked, it's really hard to tell how much your personal skill was a factor.
aw, adc is so fun though...don't give up! Jhin is solid; his soundset always untilts me.
These were sort of answered already, but the first one is basically yes. If you dump full Ferocity when you jump out of stealth, you'll get the Ferocity back from your ultimate ending. Depending on what's happened to your target, you can decide whether you need more knifing or them to sit still a minute longer (or, uh, you deleted the person and can get to knifing someone else).
If you leap while Q is up it triggers the Q, yes. If you're not worried about them moving away (say, Jhin or Kog'maw as your target) you'll probably be better served to just knife them a lot.
Steam, various fora: Ivellius
League of Legends: Doctor Ivellius
Twitch, probably another place or two I forget: LPIvellius
I haven't really played summoners rift in a couple years, like when I do play, it's just aram.
I went in last night with a PA group and sucked it up
so what I'm saying is if you'd like someone to duo que with who isn't going to freak out about the game because I'm basically trying to relearn, then I'm down to play sometime
Arch,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_goGR39m2k
Yep, both were. I rewatched beginning and first I was dumb and probably could have escaped but second death was yellow card into bubble (ugh). At 12 minutes I was only 100 gold down on their MF, and 3rd death was Blitz doing a really bad engage that I fell for (if he'd waited 4 seconds for me and our jungler to be there it would have been a double kill for us for sure). Thanks for the reassurance
Element Brian I haven't bothered with ranked yet this season but I'm always down to play normals with nice folk :]
Arch,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_goGR39m2k
Generally, we're just ribbing. Most people don't care which champion you love or who you want to play. If you want to play Rengar, GO FOR IT! He's a rock solid champ that deletes people.
There is only one character in the entire game that makes you a terrible person, and that is Shaco. Thankfully, no one here plays Shaco.
Arch,
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_goGR39m2k
So far i've managed to get Radiant Wukong and Missiletoe Leblanc.
I've been maxed on chests for a good long while now, but I've had a total of 2 keys.
As far as overall performance, he's a little weak but doing alright this patch. He hasn't been Olaf'd. He's got a couple of build options that let him fill different roles, although he tends to do best as a pure assassin.
Perhaps Rengar's most important phase of the game is the pre-game, picks and bans. Rengar is pretty binary. If he can kill someone, he turns invisible and kills them and then repeats the same thing later because he got 300g and they got a trip to fountain. If he can't kill someone, the only utility he has is a very limited root. Rengar's a very risky early pick because some champions just ruin him completely, and some teams are able to play in a way that Rengar has almost no openings.
Play Rengar if:
Avoid Rengar if:
Early game, Rengar's pre-6 ganks are pretty weak, and he has virtually no pressure on mid lane due to the brush placement. You can go after top or bottom if they egregiously overextend, or you can try to sneak into the bushes for an ambush if your lane is pushed up to their tower, but generally Rengar doesn't do very much pre-6. His early clear is not very safe, so you're limited not only by your weak approach, but by the risk of getting into a 2v2 or 3v3 against an enemy jungler who is happy to duel a low-level no-item Rengar.
If you do need to gank a lane pre-6, one of the best ways you can do so if by getting a stack of 4 ferocity charges before approaching the lane. "4" is a magic number for Rengar, because all of his max-rank ferocity abilities are on a special cooldown not shared with his regular abilities. The obvious application of this is Q+ Empowered Q to deal some massive damage, but pre-6 you can use a 4 stack gank with E. Head into lane and cut off the opponent as best you can, try to hit them with your regular E skill shot for the slow. If it hits, they are slowed and you can easily tag them with an empowered E to root them for a powerful 1-2 combo with your laner. If your E misses, you can just abandon the approach entirely or you can try to get your last ferocity stack with a Q or W to get a second attempt with your empowered E. This means that its usually better to gank pre-6 with 4 ferocity instead of full ferocity so you can get two chances to land your E (slow into root is generally more useful than root into slow).
Once you hit level 6, your strategy is pretty straightforward. Farm aggressively and use your ult on any enemy who isn't hugging their tower. Wards and vision of the enemy jungle are ideal. Rengar excels at picking unfair fights, not getting into lane + jungle vs. lane + jungle slugfests. Make sure to aggressively ping for your laner, you'll be relying on their to bait the gank if they can and to follow up to guarantee a kill. Against low health targets, you can rely on the massive damage a Q+Q combo deals to obliterate a target. More durable or evasive opponents likely merit the use of an empowered E to keep them in place while you and your allies take them out.
For build options, you almost always want to go red smite + warrior. The wards from tracker or slow from chilling are tempting, but you really need the extra killing potential and 1v1 potency you get from red smite. Your options after warrior open up considerably, generally into one of three overall Rengar paths:
Kill Everything Quickly Rengar: Standard build for when you're doing well but not hilariously fed, you focus on building sufficient AD to kill someone quickly. Ghostblade is a great pick and is usually a safe first or second item after Warrior. Duskblade is also pretty useful, but generally Ghostblade is better first for the active. Ravenous Hydra grants some useful jungle sustain and extra burst damage with plenty of AD for your combo. At some point you will almost certainly need a Mercurial Scimitar, you need the ability to remove CC and stay on a target, and the item has fantastic stats in addition to the active. You can generally fill in gaps with almost any high-AD item such as Death's Dance, Bloodthirster, or Maw of Malmortius. If you're really pulling ahead you can spring for a Triforce. You generally want to rely on the Merc Scimitar as your only defensive item, its critical you retain high killing power with this build.
Guess I'm a Bruiser Rengar: AKA "I shouldn't have first picked Rengar" Rengar. Not ideal, but sometimes you need to recognize that you won't fill the role of an assassin, and a sub-optimal bruiser is better than an expensive cannon minion who leaps out at the enemy ADC for easy gold. Warrior into Black Cleaver, grab one lifesteal item for extra AD and survivability, and then build tanky. A full build might look like Ravenous / Warrior / Cleaver / Ninja Tabi / Spirit Visage / Randuins. Again, not an ideal build, this is something to fall back on if you are having a bad game or simply can't kill high value targets. You could also swap to this build if you pull ahead aggressively early but suspect the enemy team will be able to lock you down easily in teamfights.
Crit-Gar: By combining the dueling potential of Phantom Dancer and Red Smite, Rengar can become a pretty terrifying 1v1 champion. This build tends to require a fair amount of gold and is a bit niche, but it can be a valuable way to deal with split pushing or t o really really murder an enemy ADC. Warrior with Red Smite, Ghostblade, and an early-ish Phantom Dancer followed by an Infinity Edge. Since you rely on autos for your damage, the IE + PD hits pretty hard, even though you're building attack speed on Rengar. The PD passive combined with Red Smite give you substantial 1v1 durability, especially if you combine it with a Bloodthirster or similar item later. The ability to get a critical Q generally gives this build amazing damage potential, but its somewhat unreliable and tends to be very very gold-thirsty. Until you have the PD and IE together, you aren't going to be hitting very hard.
Late game, you want to control the map by picking on weak targets and generally stay in a position to flank on teamfights. Be very careful about being caught out of position, Rengar is incredibly weak if someone else gets the jump on him, and a smart team will wait for you to pick a risky flank before quickly taking you out. Watch the overall map to pick on vulnerable members, if you see a big minion wave headed to the top tower and suspect the enemy ADC is headed there alone to farm it, that's a free kill. If you know the enemy support is trying to clear dragon wards alone, that's a free kill. If you do your job as Rengar, the enemy team will be terrified to ever send anyone out alone, and you can start abusing this to steal objectives, pressure side lines, or start favorable fights. If the enemy team lets their guard down and sends valuable team members out solo, hunt them for a kill and then force objectives or towers. Rengar can work well with split-pushers because of his ability to traverse the map and set up ambushes. If you have a strong split-pusher, make sure to coordinate with them. If the enemy sends two vulnerable targets after a split pusher, ambush them into an advantageous 2v2. If the enemy sends just one target, you can hunt them in the jungle or threaten them with a 2v1 if they attack your splitpusher. If the enemy sends two strong targets, your split pusher can stall for time or pull back while your team starts a 3v3 that you turn into a very short 4v3.
12/18/0 is usually your best mastery page, the burst from Thunderlords is hard to beat and the pure armor pen from Ferocity isn't very useful for a target who wants to avoid tanks at all costs. Since you have an AA reset in your Q, your best runes are a mix of AD and armor pen for quints and reds, with standard armor / scaling MR yellows and blues.
"Smile! Everyone is watching"
"We believe in the people and their 'wisdom' as if there was some special secret entrance to knowledge that barred to anyone who had ever learned anything." - Friedrich Nietzsche
Thanks a lot man, that was super insightful. I guess I'll do the Valkrin clear for a fast level 6 unless top or bot is overpushed. I am running AD/Arpen reds and quints, but probably going to move to scaling Armor yellows. What is your take on Stormraider's instead of TLD?
no one to blame but yourself.
COME FORTH, AMATERASU! - Switch Friend Code SW-5465-2458-5696 - Twitch
Hearing things like this just makes me think that the mage update is going to be another clusterfuck like the ADC and Juggernaut updates were.
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Also apparently Rumble's Q is getting buffed so that it does normal damage to minions?
EDIT: Most importantly, Taric's supposed to be coming in the next patch, they're aiming for Tues/Wednesday next week unless it gets delayed for some reason.
COME FORTH, AMATERASU! - Switch Friend Code SW-5465-2458-5696 - Twitch
Man, I had such a nice game last night that I wanted to post as a game with a Rengar in it (toplane, kept running bot to try and kill me--er often successfully tbh, but we won anyway, although my poor 1/11 Janna support was just playing kinda terribly and was quietly and non-toxically tilting "I think I just won't play League again after this
There's some midgame power level, maybe lvls 10-15 or so, where even an unfed lane Rengar can just wander off and delete an (equivalently unfed) adc, or at the very least necessitate immediate application of summoner spells.