Yeah but if I can lose 15% of damage on my pyromancies in exchange for being able to carry around a Demon Greataxe one-handed at the same soul level....
General consensus seems to be that if you want your spells to do more than tickle enemies, you need to actually invest in caster stats. Pyromancy has an advantage in that since both faith and int count for scaling, you have no wasted points in them like how a sorcerer has no use for faith but still has points in it and you're starting off closer to to the break point at which scaling really kicks in.
So you probably won't be toting around a greataxe one handed as a caster. Well, as an effective caster.
Maybe not the 30 or 50 strength ones, but there are definitely some "great" weapons you can one hand and not gimp your pyro casting (esthetically combined with the rings that effectively increase power by like 50%).
I also can't believe people are still going on about spells being weak early game/mid game.
We're not even at release yet. Expect a lot more griping about spell casting and the investment needed when players that aren't following what's been revealed so far jump in.
I've been purposefully not following stuff because I want to be mostly surprised by the game. Any major mechanical changes/things I should know mechanically about spells/miracles/pyromancy before going in?
Scaling doesn't really kick in until your int, faith, or combined int and faith are around 50 as appropriate for the magic discipline. This is in contrast to previous games where scaling slowed down before you hit those stat values (and physical stats still do. Few builds put more than 40 in strength or dexterity because of diminishing returns).
So DS3 magic is like how Arcane worked in Bloodborne, where arcane 50 was just the baseline for spells and arcane weapons and spells actually started to cap around 70 to 90-99 depending on the spell.
Sounds kind of awful. Guess i won't make a moonlight sword build to begin with.
Edit- though to be fair I find magic in these games to be boring. And I usually love be mages .
Meh, sounds like I might not be going pyro then. If I wanted to spend 40 levels swinging a sword around, before I could cast spells, I would just be a warrior.
People blow things way out of proportion, honestly.
Only in DS2 could you manage to just spew magic at everything from the very start. In DS1 you also needed to fight in melee. As for Pyromancy... it's in the best place out of any of the three magic types, period. Your Int and Faith are combined together to determine the power of your Pyromancies.
Let's look at some of our starting classes for instance.
Knight: Effective Pyro power is 18
Merc: Also 18
Warrior: 17
Herald: 21
Thief: 18
Assassin: 20
Sorc: 23
Pyromancer: 28
Cleric: 23
Deprived: 20
Pyromancer has the best head start for pure flamey goodness power cause they get 14/14 for Int and Faith.
Arcane was badish in BB because tools weren't really all that great until they got buffed. And even then there was only like, one tool that would be equivilent to soul arrow.
And besides Farron flashblade is in so you can turn your staff into a SWORD technically how cool is THAT, I am 100% rolling up a magic knight.
Yeah but if I can lose 15% of damage on my pyromancies in exchange for being able to carry around a Demon Greataxe one-handed at the same soul level....
General consensus seems to be that if you want your spells to do more than tickle enemies, you need to actually invest in caster stats. Pyromancy has an advantage in that since both faith and int count for scaling, you have no wasted points in them like how a sorcerer has no use for faith but still has points in it and you're starting off closer to to the break point at which scaling really kicks in.
So you probably won't be toting around a greataxe one handed as a caster. Well, as an effective caster.
Maybe not the 30 or 50 strength ones, but there are definitely some "great" weapons you can one hand and not gimp your pyro casting (esthetically combined with the rings that effectively increase power by like 50%).
I also can't believe people are still going on about spells being weak early game/mid game.
We're not even at release yet. Expect a lot more griping about spell casting and the investment needed when players that aren't following what's been revealed so far jump in.
I've been purposefully not following stuff because I want to be mostly surprised by the game. Any major mechanical changes/things I should know mechanically about spells/miracles/pyromancy before going in?
Scaling doesn't really kick in until your int, faith, or combined int and faith are around 50 as appropriate for the magic discipline. This is in contrast to previous games where scaling slowed down before you hit those stat values (and physical stats still do. Few builds put more than 40 in strength or dexterity because of diminishing returns).
So DS3 magic is like how Arcane worked in Bloodborne, where arcane 50 was just the baseline for spells and arcane weapons and spells actually started to cap around 70 to 90-99 depending on the spell.
Sounds kind of awful. Guess i won't make a moonlight sword build to begin with.
Edit- though to be fair I find magic in these games to be boring. And I usually love be mages .
Dark Soul sorcerers tend to suffer from the early spells not being very interesting. A single arrow that homes in and does light damage is not the most engaging spell. Later spells tend to be more interesting and pyromancy tends to have more interesting spells at all levels. Add on that most spells are pretty easy to dodge so you're often at a disadvantage if you get invaded and it's not always the most engaging playstyle even if it's traditionally been really effective in PvE.
Wait, what. How is the Farron Greatsword a staff, what.
It is a low cost, low stamina spell that you combo. The blade extends off your catalyst, so the starting one is basically a long sword, and another staff you pick up fairly soon has like double the reach. Only "downside" is it hits for less, but it's clearly there to give sorcery melee, fast casting options.
"Get the hell out of me" - [ex]girlfriend
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FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
People blow things way out of proportion, honestly.
Only in DS2 could you manage to just spew magic at everything from the very start. In DS1 you also needed to fight in melee. As for Pyromancy... it's in the best place out of any of the three magic types, period. Your Int and Faith are combined together to determine the power of your Pyromancies.
Let's look at some of our starting classes for instance.
Knight: Effective Pyro power is 18
Merc: Also 18
Warrior: 17
Herald: 21
Thief: 18
Assassin: 20
Sorc: 23
Pyromancer: 28
Cleric: 23
Deprived: 20
Pyromancer has the best head start for pure flamey goodness power cause they get 14/14 for Int and Faith.
So your fire damage scaling starts cranking up at about 50 fire power? That.... is a bit high, but not too bad. Probably be able to get it going fairly quickly if you focus on it. Hrm...
Don't buy it on GMG. They aren't a legit reseller in most cases, and you can get it for $45 at GamesPlanetUK which is a legit reseller (or $43 if you jump through a hoop of joining their steam group and linking your account).
Wait, when was it decided GMG was bad, they used to be quite popular? I preordered Xcom 2 from them recently without any issues.
@Zxerol Where is that GMG voucher. I can't seem to find it
Movitz on
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Zxerolfor the smaller pieces, my shovel wouldn't doso i took off my boot and used my shoeRegistered Userregular
Don't buy it on GMG. They aren't a legit reseller in most cases, and you can get it for $45 at GamesPlanetUK which is a legit reseller (or $43 if you jump through a hoop of joining their steam group and linking your account).
Wait, when was it decided GMG was bad, they used to be quite popular? I preordered Xcom 2 from them recently without any issues.
@Zxerol Where is that GMG voucher. I can't seem to find it
I don't trust key sites. I personally suspect that they're all connected to money laundering schemes in some obtuse and readily deniable fashion or something.
Yeah I'll be starting off as a Herald just for that awesome spear! Sadly there's a big lack of games that let you actually use spears.
Jediabiwan on
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Casually HardcoreOnce an Asshole. Trying to be better.Registered Userregular
The spear is really good in this game.
Hell, all the weapons are really good.
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HonkHonk is this poster.Registered User, __BANNED USERSregular
I really liked the rifle spear in Bloodborne, it provided for some interesting play. Like the full R2 would kill most things if you could get in a position to afford the huge charge time.
Spears are pretty cool.
PSN: Honkalot
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DemonStaceyTTODewback's DaughterIn love with the TaySwayRegistered Userregular
How are magic and miracles this time around? Are dex/int and str/fth builds viable for PvE? I'm reading a lot of noise about magic being nerfed to the ground.
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FencingsaxIt is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understandingGNU Terry PratchettRegistered Userregular
Herald will be my second playthrough, after Assassin.
Herald will be my second playthrough, after Assassin.
I'm thinking just the same. But I was really bummed out by how DEX was handled in DS2 and would like to not bang my head against the wall like that again.
Herald will be my second playthrough, after Assassin.
I'm thinking just the same. But I was really bummed out by how DEX was handled in DS2 and would like to not bang my head against the wall like that again.
DEX looks great
It has a bunch of awesome weapons
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KalnaurI See Rain . . .Centralia, WARegistered Userregular
I'm just glad Pyro is back. In DS1 it felt like the perfect class to start as when aiming for a catch all build, as it had somewhat even stats. It started with some fairly fine blocking and attack stats, and solid attunement and at least Int, if not Faith, as well as a handle on a close range magic. Provided it's not an eon before you can pick up a staff and some Soul ____ spells, and a pretty good greatsword, it looks the best for my uses.
I make art things! deviantART:Kalnaur ::: Origin: Kalnaur ::: UPlay: Kalnaur
Herald will be my second playthrough, after Assassin.
I'm thinking just the same. But I was really bummed out by how DEX was handled in DS2 and would like to not bang my head against the wall like that again.
Dex was god tier in ds 2 crazy person. Espada ropera, partizan, ice rapier. Dex weapons as a whole formed the vast amount of op weapons .
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GnomeTankWhat the what?Portland, OregonRegistered Userregular
edited April 2016
Yeah, dex was amazing in DaS2. A lot of the completely broken weapons were dex weapons.
Dex is very good in DaS3 as well, I'm almost through my first play through with an Uchigatana build and it's been working great. Having the Sharp infusion helps a lot, allows you to really over-focus dex.
e: Also, it seems patch 1.03 is up on XBox One for the English version. Still no online servers, but we are up to date with the JPN version now.
Posts
Fuck this shit, going to use my cracked red orb to invade Chuck's world.
Steam Profile
3DS: 3454-0268-5595 Battle.net: SteelAngel#1772
Sounds kind of awful. Guess i won't make a moonlight sword build to begin with.
Edit- though to be fair I find magic in these games to be boring. And I usually love be mages .
Only in DS2 could you manage to just spew magic at everything from the very start. In DS1 you also needed to fight in melee. As for Pyromancy... it's in the best place out of any of the three magic types, period. Your Int and Faith are combined together to determine the power of your Pyromancies.
Let's look at some of our starting classes for instance.
Knight: Effective Pyro power is 18
Merc: Also 18
Warrior: 17
Herald: 21
Thief: 18
Assassin: 20
Sorc: 23
Pyromancer: 28
Cleric: 23
Deprived: 20
Pyromancer has the best head start for pure flamey goodness power cause they get 14/14 for Int and Faith.
Arcane was badish in BB because tools weren't really all that great until they got buffed. And even then there was only like, one tool that would be equivilent to soul arrow.
And besides Farron flashblade is in so you can turn your staff into a SWORD technically how cool is THAT, I am 100% rolling up a magic knight.
Dark Soul sorcerers tend to suffer from the early spells not being very interesting. A single arrow that homes in and does light damage is not the most engaging spell. Later spells tend to be more interesting and pyromancy tends to have more interesting spells at all levels. Add on that most spells are pretty easy to dodge so you're often at a disadvantage if you get invaded and it's not always the most engaging playstyle even if it's traditionally been really effective in PvE.
Steam Profile
3DS: 3454-0268-5595 Battle.net: SteelAngel#1772
It is a low cost, low stamina spell that you combo. The blade extends off your catalyst, so the starting one is basically a long sword, and another staff you pick up fairly soon has like double the reach. Only "downside" is it hits for less, but it's clearly there to give sorcery melee, fast casting options.
So your fire damage scaling starts cranking up at about 50 fire power? That.... is a bit high, but not too bad. Probably be able to get it going fairly quickly if you focus on it. Hrm...
Wait, when was it decided GMG was bad, they used to be quite popular? I preordered Xcom 2 from them recently without any issues.
@Zxerol Where is that GMG voucher. I can't seem to find it
APR20
Edit, NVM. It works with other titles, just not DS3 unfortunately.
Armchair: 4098-3704-2012
The issue with GMG is there is no guarantee they'll get you your key in time. People who pre-ordered from GamesPlanet have it preloaded already.
Also @Wyborn Not sure where I said that.
Worked just fine for me :so_raven:
Really? What the hell am I doing wrong then. Works on Fallout 4 but none of the DS3 editions.
I still see the official date is listed at 4-12 for all platforms, right?
Got it from gamesplanet instead, took approx 15 minutes from registration to preloading. Thanks for the tip!
Poisoner's play time
It'll release at about 10am on 12th April for me on Steam.
Maybe it's a worldwide "everyone gets it on or before 12th April in their local time zone" thing?
Looking forward to it, thanks!
Hell, all the weapons are really good.
Spears are pretty cool.
Interesting, where are you located?
New Zealand (GMT+12).
I'm thinking just the same. But I was really bummed out by how DEX was handled in DS2 and would like to not bang my head against the wall like that again.
DEX looks great
It has a bunch of awesome weapons
Dex was god tier in ds 2 crazy person. Espada ropera, partizan, ice rapier. Dex weapons as a whole formed the vast amount of op weapons .
Dex is very good in DaS3 as well, I'm almost through my first play through with an Uchigatana build and it's been working great. Having the Sharp infusion helps a lot, allows you to really over-focus dex.
e: Also, it seems patch 1.03 is up on XBox One for the English version. Still no online servers, but we are up to date with the JPN version now.