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  • MNC DoverMNC Dover Full-time Voice Actor Kirkland, WARegistered User regular
    aggro shaman is seriously making this game not fun.

    how can a deck full of overload cards have a perfect curve. . .like every single time?

    totem golem followed by totem golem and I may as well just concede because the flamewreathed faceless is up next.

    And completely unplayable without a coin.

    Aggro Shaman is tough but winnable. You can do it Das!

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  • DasUberEdwardDasUberEdward Registered User regular
    MNC Dover wrote: »
    aggro shaman is seriously making this game not fun.

    how can a deck full of overload cards have a perfect curve. . .like every single time?

    totem golem followed by totem golem and I may as well just concede because the flamewreathed faceless is up next.

    And completely unplayable without a coin.

    Aggro Shaman is tough but winnable. You can do it Das!

    i just can't find a deck to play with so the annoyance is really high.

  • GoodKingJayIIIGoodKingJayIII Registered User regular
    Shaman are just really good right now. Beatable, but it's the new secret paladin in that it curves out amazing minions between turns 1-5.

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  • CoinageCoinage Heaviside LayerRegistered User regular
    edited May 2016
    I've barely even seen hollazeal on ladder, since why bother when you can win on turn 7 with your ridiculous board? Sighhhhh

    Coinage on
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  • FiendishrabbitFiendishrabbit Registered User regular
    I guess. However, Hallazeal could definitely work as a Reno-esque reset button in the right deck.
    Hallazeal+Elemental destruction? BOOM. Back to 30 health.
    Incidentally he's just the right size to survive elemental destruction.

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  • Sir FabulousSir Fabulous Malevolent Squid God Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    As long as Shamans don't completely botch the early game and are able to Hammer Up on turn 5, you're done.

    Edit: I'm not salty. I love playing aggro shaman. And Miracle Rogue. And Freeze Mage. Am I... Evil?

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  • djFindusdjFindus Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    Nzoth Paladin completely destroys Shaman so play that if you are seeing alot of them. My shiny new Tempo Warrior deck is 3-1 against them and my Dragon Priest was doing good against them too. The key is being able to deal with their early game and punish them when they overload (i e SW:D or Execute for Flamewreathed, Fiery War Axe for Trogg, SW:P for Totem Golem etc etc) because if the overload minions don't stick they are shit out of luck.

    Shamans are also tricky because they are one of the classes with the best single target removal (hex) and burst with Doomhammer+Rock biter

    djFindus on
  • DasUberEdwardDasUberEdward Registered User regular
    I guess. However, Hallazeal could definitely work as a Reno-esque reset button in the right deck.
    Hallazeal+Elemental destruction? BOOM. Back to 30 health.
    Incidentally he's just the right size to survive elemental destruction.

    Happened to me this morning while I dropped 3 ranks.

  • GoodKingJayIIIGoodKingJayIII Registered User regular
    I guess. However, Hallazeal could definitely work as a Reno-esque reset button in the right deck.
    Hallazeal+Elemental destruction? BOOM. Back to 30 health.
    Incidentally he's just the right size to survive elemental destruction.

    It's not that Hallazeal is bad, he's actually quite good. It's just that he doesn't fit into the best shaman lists right now because they don't care about controlling the board as much as getting onto the board and staying way ahead by dropping efficient minions.

    I suspect that a control shaman list could be very strong because of Hallazeal, but why run that when you've got lists with 60-70% win rates and the games are ~5 minutes?

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  • CantidoCantido Registered User regular
    Loran's Shaman is far classier.

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  • CoinageCoinage Heaviside LayerRegistered User regular

    Jesus Christ Reddit.

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  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    Watching Miracle Rogue win makes me so mad.

    That is not a deck that needed to be resurrected.

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  • GoodKingJayIIIGoodKingJayIII Registered User regular
    Is Dreamhack not the Conquest format? Payton just won with his Rogue and he's using it again.

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  • kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    Is Dreamhack not the Conquest format? Payton just won with his Rogue and he's using it again.

    It is not. It is "Last Hero Standing." When the deck loses, it's out.

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  • GoodKingJayIIIGoodKingJayIII Registered User regular
    Interesting. Does LHS have a ban phase as well?

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  • kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    Interesting. Does LHS have a ban phase as well?

    Only watching off and on, but I've heard them talk about bans, yes.

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  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    Hallazeal is in the midrange list I stole from somewhere. have not ever used the card... I hope it proves valuable at some point be it in this deck or another variation. I opened it last week and want it to be good.

    and to be clear I've been playing the deck a pretty good amount for 2-3 days. have never needed to heal and been able to at the same time.


    the biggest hitch with shaman right now I think is the lists getting refined and people getting accustomed to the differences. the two decks I have built, one is face and one is midrange. they SEEM similar, both have doomhammer and a bloodlust and things from the deep, but there are big differences in how they curve out and actually play.

    of course, if you can't deal with an early 7/7 it's a non starter but lots of classes in fact do have ways to deal with that. you basically should be mulliganning for them imo, at this point.

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  • Steel AngelSteel Angel Registered User regular
    As long as Shamans don't completely botch the early game and are able to Hammer Up on turn 5, you're done.

    Edit: I'm not salty. I love playing aggro shaman. And Miracle Rogue. And Freeze Mage. Am I... Evil?

    Look, the rules of Hearthstone clearly state that you have to love either combo, control, or midrange and hate the others plus aggro decks. Get with the program!

    Big Dookie wrote: »
    I found that tilting it doesn't work very well, and once I started jerking it, I got much better results.

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  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    Oh god, I wouldn't wish Jasm's hand and draws on my worst enemy. This is just unimaginably bad.

    Teriferin
  • envoy1envoy1 Registered User regular
    3clipse wrote: »
    Oh god, I wouldn't wish Jasm's hand and draws on my worst enemy. This is just unimaginably bad.

    Yeah I've been watching this and I had to turn it off. It feels very unfair and not really a battle of skill any more.

  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    envoy1 wrote: »
    3clipse wrote: »
    Oh god, I wouldn't wish Jasm's hand and draws on my worst enemy. This is just unimaginably bad.

    Yeah I've been watching this and I had to turn it off. It feels very unfair and not really a battle of skill any more.

    It was...Firebat? I think? Some fairly accomplished pro...who said that skill in Hearthstone is 80-90% deck building. At the top levels pretty much everyone is making the optimal play every turn and it comes down to draw variance. The game has a pretty low skill cap.

    GoodKingJayIIILucedes
  • BeastehBeasteh THAT WOULD NOT KILL DRACULARegistered User regular
    ive been rooting for chakki to do well in this tournament but he has been extremely lucky those last few games

    ps the chat becomes such an awful toxic racist shithole whenever anyone non-white is playing, how on earth can they moderate that, jesus

  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    Beasteh wrote: »
    ive been rooting for chakki to do well in this tournament but he has been extremely lucky those last few games

    ps the chat becomes such an awful toxic racist shithole whenever anyone non-white is playing, how on earth can they moderate that, jesus

    Twitch doesn't moderate their chat, although individual channels can moderate it (some bother, some don't; many use Subscribers-only mode, which solves a lot of the problems). It is a complete cesspool. Like, it's basically 4chan in real time.

    kimeMuffinatronGoodKingJayIII
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    1 in 5 for Terrence to get fucked, so it of course happens.

    Why is Knife Juggler still a card Blizzard -_-

    kime
  • JakarrdJakarrd In the belly of OklahomaRegistered User regular
    kime wrote: »
    Interesting. Does LHS have a ban phase as well?

    Only watching off and on, but I've heard them talk about bans, yes.

    Yeah, each player brings four decks and one gets banned out. Seems most are banning warrior and rogue a lot. Shaman and warlock have been having a great showing this tournament, along with warrior and rogue. I don't think I've seen one Druid or Hunter deck this tournament.

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  • Sir FabulousSir Fabulous Malevolent Squid God Registered User regular
    As long as Shamans don't completely botch the early game and are able to Hammer Up on turn 5, you're done.

    Edit: I'm not salty. I love playing aggro shaman. And Miracle Rogue. And Freeze Mage. Am I... Evil?

    Look, the rules of Hearthstone clearly state that you have to love either combo, control, or midrange and hate the others plus aggro decks. Get with the program!

    I believe that all deck archetypes can live in harmony!

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  • CoinageCoinage Heaviside LayerRegistered User regular
    edited May 2016
    Beasteh wrote: »
    ive been rooting for chakki to do well in this tournament but he has been extremely lucky those last few games

    ps the chat becomes such an awful toxic racist shithole whenever anyone non-white is playing, how on earth can they moderate that, jesus
    It seems like after the Paris attacks the chat of large channels went all in on being racist as fuck. Not that twitch chat was ever readable, but now it's unbearably unreadable. I guess it would be letting the terrorists win, but I really wish twitch would just delete Anele and TriHard.

    Coinage on
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  • DibbyDibby I'll do my best! Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    Ch9lF4lWMAAzcAX.jpg:large

    Holy jesus this game vs a N'Zoth Paladin was INTENSE. Literally came down to the wire. Burned through my EE and Holy Novas keeping his post-fatigue board clear.

    I was at 9 health, and had just hit 7 Fatigue. Next turn would be 8 Fatigue and I would've died. He had two 1/1s on board. Then I realized, wait, I can Entomb a 1/1 and delay Fatigue for one turn, and if he doesn't heal, I'm solid.

    Ballsy plan, but it paid off. He wasn't able to do anything and Fatigue killed him instead.

    I think he misplayed, though. I only had one card left (Entomb, though I dunno if he knew that), and he had 5 cards left. Surely he had some minions in there? Couldn't have all been just spells? Anyway, I think he was only running one Forbidden Healing, or something? Cause I only saw him play one. My Nefarian very clutchly drew a Forbidden Healing for me, and boy did I make use of that earlier. Oh, and my Shifting Shade drew me a Doomsayer, which I used to clear his Cairne/Lightlord.

    Dibby on
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  • CantidoCantido Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    Just give everyone the Legend back, that should stop the salt.
    No it won't.

    Cantido on
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  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    Payton gets double Reno from Elise.

    Only 1 more year until that terrible dumpster fire of an unbelievably bad card design is out of the meta!

    (Elise, not Reno. I love Reno, I think whoever made Elise should be banned from ever creating a card in any TCG for the rest of their life).

    (Payton lost)

    3clipse on
  • hippofanthippofant ティンク Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    3clipse wrote: »
    Beasteh wrote: »
    ive been rooting for chakki to do well in this tournament but he has been extremely lucky those last few games

    ps the chat becomes such an awful toxic racist shithole whenever anyone non-white is playing, how on earth can they moderate that, jesus

    Twitch doesn't moderate their chat, although individual channels can moderate it (some bother, some don't; many use Subscribers-only mode, which solves a lot of the problems). It is a complete cesspool. Like, it's basically 4chan in real time.

    Tournament channels don't have "cultures" or trained mods, so they're essentially unmoderated. "Good" chats are usually enforced by having a lot of mods over time that set a standard of behaviour in the chat, and the occasional use of submode, but it takes a lot of effort on the part of the streamer.

    But yeah. Occasional tournament/convention streams are usually hot garbage if not sub-moded. The PAX streams might be a unique exception.

    hippofant on
  • kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    3clipse wrote: »
    Payton gets double Reno from Elise.

    Only 1 more year until that terrible dumpster fire of an unbelievably bad card design is out of the meta!

    (Elise, not Reno. I love Reno, I think whoever made Elise should be banned from ever creating a card in any TCG for the rest of their life).

    (Payton lost)

    But RNG is fun!

    lol

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  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    let's all take a step back from the edge in here!

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  • The Escape GoatThe Escape Goat but not a real green dress, that's cruel Registered User regular
    Variable wrote: »
    let's all take a step back from the edge in here!

    I've taken enough steps back that I'm just playing overwatch instead of hearthstone

    I feel like I'm a lot happier as a result

    tony danza cuts in line
  • KetherialKetherial Registered User regular
    3clipse wrote: »
    envoy1 wrote: »
    3clipse wrote: »
    Oh god, I wouldn't wish Jasm's hand and draws on my worst enemy. This is just unimaginably bad.

    Yeah I've been watching this and I had to turn it off. It feels very unfair and not really a battle of skill any more.

    It was...Firebat? I think? Some fairly accomplished pro...who said that skill in Hearthstone is 80-90% deck building. At the top levels pretty much everyone is making the optimal play every turn and it comes down to draw variance. The game has a pretty low skill cap.

    i think this is true at almost every level of play, since you have so few playable cards in hand anyway there really aren't that many different plays possible. like even with 6 cards in hand, you may only have 2 to 4 of them actually playable and most of the choices are so clearly wrong or bad that no one does them.

  • CoinageCoinage Heaviside LayerRegistered User regular

    Skip to 8:00 for the mega Gorehowl. I watched it live, a 9/5 Gorehowl is pretty good.

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  • kimekime Queen of Blades Registered User regular
    Ketherial wrote: »
    3clipse wrote: »
    envoy1 wrote: »
    3clipse wrote: »
    Oh god, I wouldn't wish Jasm's hand and draws on my worst enemy. This is just unimaginably bad.

    Yeah I've been watching this and I had to turn it off. It feels very unfair and not really a battle of skill any more.

    It was...Firebat? I think? Some fairly accomplished pro...who said that skill in Hearthstone is 80-90% deck building. At the top levels pretty much everyone is making the optimal play every turn and it comes down to draw variance. The game has a pretty low skill cap.

    i think this is true at almost every level of play, since you have so few playable cards in hand anyway there really aren't that many different plays possible. like even with 6 cards in hand, you may only have 2 to 4 of them actually playable and most of the choices are so clearly wrong or bad that no one does them.

    Disagree. We have people even in this thread that netdeck and can't make it to 15/10/5/Legendary. Nothing wrong with those players, but there is significant skill in playing at most levels.

    It's just at the pro level that flattens and it's mostly the decks. Apparently

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  • BeastehBeasteh THAT WOULD NOT KILL DRACULARegistered User regular
    Chakki won Dreamhack with a disgusting turn 5 win as zoo

  • Steel AngelSteel Angel Registered User regular
    I've only had a few games with it but so far I'm liking the WoG Patron Warrior style more than the Warsong combo style. Instead of trying to set up one killer turn, there are more threats you lay down. Patrons and Frothings are still big threats but even if the opponent removes them Bloodhoof Brave, Ravaging Ghoul, Kokron Elite, the ooze from Blood to Ichor and even Wild Pyromancer are well able to chip away at the opponent to set up a late game Grom or Ragnaros.

    Big Dookie wrote: »
    I found that tilting it doesn't work very well, and once I started jerking it, I got much better results.

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  • UrQuanLord88UrQuanLord88 Registered User regular
    Just lost to a n'zoth reno rogue at rank 18
    thats enough hs for me today

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