[WoW]: The portal's always greener on the fel side.

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  • SteevLSteevL What can I do for you? Registered User regular
    Lars wrote: »
    [People were so sure we'd be going back there (and that Gilneas would be used for something).

    I didn't read more than the bare minimum about Cataclysm before it came out. One of the first things I did with my level 80 character was visit Gilneas, expecting a new capital city.

    Nope! That's all phased content. How disappointing.

  • LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    It's crazy. There's all kinds of new assets for buildings and terrain that look fucking awesome, and we never see them outside of the starting zone. I really love the Worgen starting area and I'd really like to see more of that kind of zone.

    Smrtnik
  • EnigmedicEnigmedic Registered User regular
    There are a bunch of unused assets in the game. I mean, when was the last time dwarves or tauren were really used in any way? It's pretty much been a human, orc, and a little undead show for a long time. The elves are going to have a little more presence in legion since demon hunters have to be elves. The only troll that has ever mattered is voljin, and gnomes have never had their day in the sun. Pretty tired of the white brick and tents with spike aesthetic that we have every expansion.

    3ds FC: 0645 - 7166 - 9801
    Smrtnik
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. 5386-8443-8937Registered User regular
    Whole Tauren zone in Legion, and presumably a strong Forsaken and Gilnean bend as well.

    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
  • SteevLSteevL What can I do for you? Registered User regular
    LD50 wrote: »
    It's crazy. There's all kinds of new assets for buildings and terrain that look fucking awesome, and we never see them outside of the starting zone. I really love the Worgen starting area and I'd really like to see more of that kind of zone.

    The only other place I can think of that has the Gilnean architecture is in the Blasted Lands, in the southern end.

    Smrtnik
  • RT800RT800 Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    I too wish they had more Gilnean architecture in the game.

    But I've always kinda hated Gnomish, Tauren, and Goblin areas.

    And Night Elves have plenty of architecture strewn throughout the game. Their shit's all over Ashenvale, Darkshore, Felwood, Hyjal, Azshara, Silithus, Feralas, Desolace, and Teldrassil.

    RT800 on
  • EnigmedicEnigmedic Registered User regular
    RT800 wrote: »
    I too wish they had more Gilnean architecture in the game.

    But I've always kinda hated Gnomish, Tauren, and Goblin areas.

    And Night Elves have plenty of architecture strewn throughout the game. Their shit's all over Ashenvale, Darkshore, Felwood, Hyjal, Azshara, Silithus, Feralas, Desolace, and Teldrassil.

    You just listed basically every zone no one ever goes to, also most of those have some sort of legion presence too actually. I would say the blood/high elves have more stuff throughout the game.

    3ds FC: 0645 - 7166 - 9801
  • JavenJaven Registered User regular
    The Highborne/Night Elf stuff is also so dated and low res too unless they went back and changed it all. Just blurry grey blocks everywhere

  • LD50LD50 Registered User regular
    Enigmedic wrote: »
    RT800 wrote: »
    I too wish they had more Gilnean architecture in the game.

    But I've always kinda hated Gnomish, Tauren, and Goblin areas.

    And Night Elves have plenty of architecture strewn throughout the game. Their shit's all over Ashenvale, Darkshore, Felwood, Hyjal, Azshara, Silithus, Feralas, Desolace, and Teldrassil.

    You just listed basically every zone no one ever goes to, also most of those have some sort of legion presence too actually. I would say the blood/high elves have more stuff throughout the game.

    There's also more advanced examples of NE architecture in Northrend. I remember there being quite a bit of it scattered along the southern coast of the continent, and some in crystalsong.

  • MorkathMorkath Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    Whole Tauren zone in Legion, and presumably a strong Forsaken and Gilnean bend as well.

    You know, we could probably end the whole war between horde and alliance, if we just got a Tauren warchief for the horde, and a Night Elf leader on the alliance side.

  • EnigmedicEnigmedic Registered User regular
    Just put the druids in charge and everything will be solved. There are already a few cenarion X factions. Probably another one in legion with the emerald dream being an instance. Im not really sure the night elves are paragons of good though. Really all the alliance races are kind of fickle. The night elves could have made good with both the naga and blood elves and they didnt. Probably not the group thats going to reconcile the horde and alliance. Goblins and gnomes could probably work together if the goal was to blow up something big, but theyd fight about how to best blow it up. Not really sure whats up with the dwarves nowadays, but I miss when IF was the main city. Humans are humans and do stupid things all the time.

    Best chance for peace is probably with tauren and trolls, but trolls havent exactly had a great track record on that outside of voljin.

    To be honest I dont think the alliance could stand up to even the undead in a fight. The undead have been engineering some crazy stuff. They razed southshore, invaded gilneas, the wrath gate in wotlk. Theyd just unleash their stuff in a fight and itd be over.

    3ds FC: 0645 - 7166 - 9801
  • I needed a gnome to post.I needed a gnome to post. boom Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    Morkath wrote: »
    Whole Tauren zone in Legion, and presumably a strong Forsaken and Gilnean bend as well.

    You know, we could probably end the whole war between horde and alliance, if we just got a Tauren warchief for the horde, and a Night Elf leader on the alliance side.

    fandral staghelm for nelf leader

    peace in our time
    Enigmedic wrote: »
    Just put the druids in charge and everything will be solved. There are already a few cenarion X factions. Probably another one in legion with the emerald dream being an instance. Im not really sure the night elves are paragons of good though. Really all the alliance races are kind of fickle. The night elves could have made good with both the naga and blood elves and they didnt. Probably not the group thats going to reconcile the horde and alliance. Goblins and gnomes could probably work together if the goal was to blow up something big, but theyd fight about how to best blow it up. Not really sure whats up with the dwarves nowadays, but I miss when IF was the main city. Humans are humans and do stupid things all the time.

    Best chance for peace is probably with tauren and trolls, but trolls havent exactly had a great track record on that outside of voljin.

    To be honest I dont think the alliance could stand up to even the undead in a fight. The undead have been engineering some crazy stuff. They razed southshore, invaded gilneas, the wrath gate in wotlk. Theyd just unleash their stuff in a fight and itd be over.

    the alliance has the superior standing army still, after the horde civil war, but military action against a force like the undead is something you have to be extremely careful with

    they have powerful mass destruction tools and the ability to turn your losses into their reinforcements

    it's basically a war you don't want to have when the matchup is like 60-40, you want that to be a 95-5 matchup

    I needed a gnome to post. on
    liEt3nH.png
    Morkath
  • EnigmedicEnigmedic Registered User regular
    They would basically have to theramore type bomb undercity before even thinking of taking the fight.

    3ds FC: 0645 - 7166 - 9801
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    They would also have to alienate the Forsaken from the rest of the Horde. Even alone, the Undead are formidable, but if it wasn't a justified war, the rest of the Horde would still support them.

  • I needed a gnome to post.I needed a gnome to post. boom Registered User regular
    the existence of the undead is honestly the most believable reason to keep things in a cold war state

    liEt3nH.png
  • TakelTakel Registered User regular
    Morkath wrote: »
    Whole Tauren zone in Legion, and presumably a strong Forsaken and Gilnean bend as well.

    You know, we could probably end the whole war between horde and alliance, if we just got a Tauren warchief for the horde, and a Night Elf leader on the alliance side.

    fandral staghelm for nelf leader

    peace in our time
    Enigmedic wrote: »
    Just put the druids in charge and everything will be solved. There are already a few cenarion X factions. Probably another one in legion with the emerald dream being an instance. Im not really sure the night elves are paragons of good though. Really all the alliance races are kind of fickle. The night elves could have made good with both the naga and blood elves and they didnt. Probably not the group thats going to reconcile the horde and alliance. Goblins and gnomes could probably work together if the goal was to blow up something big, but theyd fight about how to best blow it up. Not really sure whats up with the dwarves nowadays, but I miss when IF was the main city. Humans are humans and do stupid things all the time.

    Best chance for peace is probably with tauren and trolls, but trolls havent exactly had a great track record on that outside of voljin.

    To be honest I dont think the alliance could stand up to even the undead in a fight. The undead have been engineering some crazy stuff. They razed southshore, invaded gilneas, the wrath gate in wotlk. Theyd just unleash their stuff in a fight and itd be over.

    the alliance has the superior standing army still, after the horde civil war, but military action against a force like the undead is something you have to be extremely careful with

    they have powerful mass destruction tools and the ability to turn your losses into their reinforcements

    it's basically a war you don't want to have when the matchup is like 60-40, you want that to be a 95-5 matchup

    Or they could just make Exorcism always crit/deal double damage against the Forsaken again

    Steam | PSN: MystLansfeld | 3DS: 4656-6210-1377 | FFXIV: Lavinia Lansfeld
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  • MorkathMorkath Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    the existence of the undead is honestly the most believable reason to keep things in a cold war state

    Honestly the existence of the undead is a reason the alliance should be trying to turn the other horde races to their side.

    "Yeah orcs are kind of violent, but they don't DIG UP MY GRANDMOTHER'S CORPSE TO TURN INTO A FOOTSOLDIER."

  • BrainleechBrainleech 機知に富んだコメントはここにあります Registered User regular
    Well would you go back to the living knowing the fear and rejection you would receive from your family and friends?

  • BrainleechBrainleech 機知に富んだコメントはここにあります Registered User regular
    I have a question about boosting.
    I have not used my level 100 boost yet so since I have no idea what happens this time
    Do you get a garrison? Do you have the same gear you would get if you boosted at 90? Do you have to do quests to get your skills back?

  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    Brainleech wrote: »
    I have a question about boosting.
    I have not used my level 100 boost yet so since I have no idea what happens this time
    Do you get a garrison? Do you have the same gear you would get if you boosted at 90? Do you have to do quests to get your skills back?

    level 3 garrison, a collection of decent followers, ilvl 640 green gear, and you have to do Tanaan intro with limited unlocking skills.

  • BrainleechBrainleech 機知に富んだコメントはここにあります Registered User regular
    So pet battling again was the way I cheesed it last time

  • RT800RT800 Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    I've always been a bit confused about Theramore.

    It was originally founded by survivors from Lordaeron, right? So now that Lordaeron is pretty much gone, what kingdom are they part of? I mean, I'm sure they're allied with Stormwind, but are they considered part of Stormwind or are they just their own little city-state now?

    RT800 on
  • EnigmedicEnigmedic Registered User regular
    Theramore is a crater.

    I don't think any of the human kingdoms were allied in any way for quite a while. That was part of the reason the orcs dominated the shit out of them for so long. I'm not really as read up on the lore as I could be, but I sort of remember that from other people giving synopses.

    3ds FC: 0645 - 7166 - 9801
    Smrtnik
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    A much more reasonable take on WoW nostalgia

    https://medium.com/@rhoark/the-past-is-prologue-ab6269991b9a#.3ropcqa5i
    We don’t need Vanilla servers. We need new content built on Vanilla philosophy.
    Expansion by expansion, the WoW team has made decisions that were reasonable in the moment but have compounded other problems.
    The downside that would eventually become apparent was that when you don’t have to do anything, it no longer matters whether you do anything. The patch rolls around and the old raid is finished fait accompli, like a little pantomime in a cuckoo clock.
    This wasn’t immediately clear until the other shoe dropped: catch-up gear. Finding geared recruits was a big problem in the later days of both Vanilla and BC, so its not unreasonable that something was done. The problem was that it was done with the same philosophy as was applied to attunements, which was essentially: everything but the latest tier is dead. Don’t bother progressing — just grind points in the most accessible content. This paradigm was honed to a point when the Trial of the Crusader arrived before the mass of mid-core raiders had even killed Yogg-Saron.
    The number one cause of declining subs has been the content droughts between expansions. The only time this wasn’t a problem was at the ends of Vanilla and BC. World-first guilds may have had a different experience, but everyone I knew in Naxx or Sunwell was racing against the expansion, not waiting for it.

    And this is my favourite quote of the lot
    The most damaging thing to WoW has been to get everyone moving up a tier in lockstep with every patch.

    Bobble
  • MorkathMorkath Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    You mean vanilla raid gearing, where you had to attend 16 raids in order to get enough dkp in order to get a single gear upgrade?

    That isn't content, it is grinding. There is a reason it is gone.

    EnclaveofGnomes
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited May 2016
    I'm sick of feeling like I'm finished with the game. The only way to keep people truly busy for months on end is grinds. That's what MMOs are about, that's what they've always been about, and if you remove time sinks then you have the problem now where people effectively are done with an expansion or patch months before the next one. Catch up mechanics need to go. If you come into WoW in the middle of an expansion, you shouldn't be leaping directly into the latest raid within a week and yet that's exactly what happens.

    Bring back the grind. Do whatever needs to be done to make it not mindless grinding, but bring back the grind. Kind of seems like that's what they're doing with world legendaries and artifact power in Legion, but we don't really know how that's going to play out in the real world yet.

    Dhalphir on
  • LorahaloLorahalo Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    I don't think that the whole catch-up mechanic is the entire problem, but that the catch up mechanics just completely outclass the previous tier. Ideally I'd like to see whichever mechanic they go with (whether it be badge/valour style or timeless/tanaan style) be slightly worse than heroic gear from the previous tier. There's no reason why Tanaan gear should be close to equaling BRF Mythic gear. Mythic dungeons make it even more ridiculous, with the luckiest getting gear that even outclasses early Mythic HFC gear. Now that is ridiculous.

    That's the issue imo, not that catch up exists. Without those catchup mechanics, the raiding population would shrink dramatically. I certainly would have quit raiding this expansion if I hadn't been able to get my monk up to scratch for pugging when I realised just how little I was enjoying my mage. Returning to absolute progression would give expansions a longer life span, but I don't think it would be worth it.

    One of those guys is right though, that the biggest problem is and always has been content droughts. A year or more of the final patch is just straight up ridiculous, and always has been.

    Lorahalo on
    I have a podcast about Digimon called the Digital Moncast, on Audio Entropy.
    MorkathArthilSmrtnik
  • MorkathMorkath Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    edited May 2016
    You have every mount? Every toy? Every heirloom to 100? Every battle pet rare and max level? Every achievement?

    Morkath on
  • CaedwyrCaedwyr Registered User regular
    I would argue that it isn't the catch-up mechanic that causes problem, but that there is so little content released for the game. I am playing FFXIV right now, and while it has it's own set of issues, the catchup gear issue is not one of them. It has an even smaller gap between the high end raiders and the non-raiders, gearwise. The biggest difference is that the game gets a large patch roughly every 3-4 months that features in addition to new raid content a large amount of new side-content and things for people to progress towards. It doesn't have as much raid content as each of WoW's major patches, but it replaces a lot of that content with material that is targeted at a broader range of playstyles. There is some subscription drop off between each patch, but so far it seems to bounce back each major patch and keep people engaged.

    Ishtaar
  • TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    Catch-up mechanics are a good thing, the actual problem is the old Wrath problem of tier inflation. Also, the crux of the argument:
    Only something like 1% of players did Vanilla Naxxramas, but that didn’t make it a waste of resources.
    Blizzard simply disagrees with that notion, since the whole point of bothering to put resources into making content is to have most of the playerbase consume it. Blizzard decided that they didn't want to have to cough up a raid like they did with Sunwell Plateau (or, for that matter, Trial of the Crusader).

    TryCatcher on
    ArthilEnclaveofGnomesSmrtnik
  • MorkathMorkath Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    The obvious answer is just divorce specific gear from the raid, that way no raid content in that expansion ever becomes obsolete.

  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited May 2016
    Morkath wrote: »
    You have every mount? Every toy? Every heirloom to 100? Every battle pet rare and max level? Every achievement?

    Content that I don't care about is not content, especially not with how dull it is. In vanilla and TBC, there was enough raiding and dungeon content to keep someone busy. That is no longer the case, and while there's less raids and dungeons than there used to be, the dropoff in the amount of time taken to complete all the content is much larger than the actual dropoff in content.

    Dhalphir on
  • AngryAngry The glory I had witnessed was just a sleight of handRegistered User regular
    What are we talking about here? You want long drawn out attunements again?

  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    Angry wrote: »
    What are we talking about here? You want long drawn out attunements again?

    Not for raids. It's too annoying having to go back and attune recruits.

    But for other stuff, absolutely. Reputation for unlocking heroics was great.

  • TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    Yeah, that was the worse bit. Catch-up mechanics and the elimination of attunements are there because they make the lives of raid guild officers easier. With catch-up, you don't have to wait long to have a new recruit in the roster, which is important since raid teams rotate because either life gets on the way and/or people get burn out. And attunements made having mid-core guilds harder, since everybody that was attuned could and did just jump ship to the guilds that had more bosses down, which created mega-guilds, and that isn't fun for anybody.

    TryCatcher on
    LorahaloEnclaveofGnomesAssuran
  • DhalphirDhalphir don't you open that trapdoor you're a fool if you dareRegistered User regular
    edited May 2016
    TryCatcher wrote: »
    Yeah, that was the worse bit. Catch-up mechanics and the elimination of attunements are there because they make the lives of raid guild officers easier. With catch-up, you don't have to wait long to have a new recruit in the roster, which is important since raid teams rotate because either life gets on the way and/or people get burn out. And attunements made having mid-core guilds harder, since everybody that was attuned could and did just jump ship to the guilds that had more bosses down, which created mega-guilds, and that isn't fun for anybody.

    But is making life easier for a few raid officers worth sacrificing the relevance of all but the latest content patch?

    Karazhan was relevant throughout the life of The Burning Crusade. How relevant is Highmaul now?

    That's the point this article makes. Yes, all of these quality of life changes are good in a vacuum, but they have implications that go beyond the actual changes themselves. And in many cases, you can make a solid argument that the negative consequences outweigh the positive changes.

    Completing dungeons, for example, is easier than ever with the dungeon finder auto queue. But it also makes your groups intangible, fleeting, and anonymous. Is that worth the tradeoff? Being able to complete dungeons more easily in exchange for losing all satisfaction associated with completing one?

    Dhalphir on
  • StericaSterica Yes Registered User, Moderator mod
    Fandral Staghelm: Why choose between the lesser of two evils when you can have both?

    YL9WnCY.png
  • MorkathMorkath Registered User, __BANNED USERS regular
    Fandral Staghelm: Why choose between the lesser of two evils when you can have both?

    Fandral Staghelm: Night elves crazy old racist grandpa.

  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. 5386-8443-8937Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    Enigmedic wrote: »
    Theramore is a crater.

    I don't think any of the human kingdoms were allied in any way for quite a while. That was part of the reason the orcs dominated the shit out of them for so long. I'm not really as read up on the lore as I could be, but I sort of remember that from other people giving synopses.

    I mean what human kingdoms are left? Its basically just Stormwind and its outlying cities isn't it? Dalaran I guess?
    Dhalphir wrote: »
    Morkath wrote: »
    You have every mount? Every toy? Every heirloom to 100? Every battle pet rare and max level? Every achievement?

    Content that I don't care about is not content

    This is super goosey.

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
    ArthilBobbleIshtaar
  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. 5386-8443-8937Registered User regular
    edited May 2016
    double post

    Styrofoam Sammich on
    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
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