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Vindicated/Vilified by History! Which President was the best?

joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades 地獄のようにかわいいあなたは嫉妬深いかRegistered User regular
edited July 2016 in Debate and/or Discourse
The Bernie thread started talking about ranking the Presidents and so I thought it might be a fun idea to debate and discuss which Presidents are actually the best, and which were incompetent buffoons who were way out of their depth.

But the thread would be kind of boring if it was just a poll over which Presidents you like or hate, so I'd like to open it up to discussion of all politicians. Perhaps some were far ahead of their time but didn't get credit for it in their own day, and perhaps others were lauded at the time but have been shown to be utter cretins. The point of this thread is to learn more about the historical figures that have made our country greater or ultimately perpetuated awfulness -- especially if most people have never heard of them before.

Do you think a politician was underrated? Tell us why! Do you think one gets way too much credit in the public consciousness? Explain your reasoning!

For instance, Dwight D. Eisenhower is commonly seen as an "ehhhh" President. Never ranked terribly highly or in the lowest of lows. But beneath Ike's affable exterior lay the heart of a master politician; someone who ended the Korean War, who balanced the budget by refusing to cut taxes or raise defense spending, who kept us out of conflict with Southeast Asia, and sponsored/signed the first major Civil Rights bill since Reconstruction.

Is he a little bit boring when compared to some of the more visionary Presidents? Maybe. But Ike got shit done and kept America out of war by keeping a cool head, and I say that deserves some recognition.

ジェイムズ・ブラウンの好きな色は何ですか?
青!

Vindicated/Vilified by History! Which President was the best? 207 votes

Franklin D. Roosevelt
21%
necroSYSPsychoLarry1TalkaSyphonBlueRedTideMongrel IdiotGorelabDarkewolfeDarkPrimussilence1186EvigilantAnomeAnarchy Rules!DarlanVishNubzeenyKetBraSurikoHaphazardJammers 44 votes
Abraham Lincoln
29%
ShortyA duck!TheBlackWindElJeffeRiemannLivesJavenDBReedConnAimdispatch.okaleedityDoodmannCantidoSithDrummerchromdomRchanenT-boltEat it You Nasty Pig.Heirenlightenedbum 61 votes
George Washington
12%
BarcardiASimPersonRegina FongVeeveeElendilDasUberEdwardph blakeA Half Eaten OreoDrakeonJeana5ehrenPeenjefe414manwiththemachinegungjaustinObiFetttinwhiskersEmissary42The EnderKrieghund 25 votes
Thomas Jefferson
1%
Dyrwen66Kayne Red RobeCommander Zoom 3 votes
Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
15%
HandgimpGaddezQuidElement BrianHappylilElfBedlamShadowfireBEAST!Capt Howdylunchbox12682NobodyemnmnmefrandelgearslipKhavallHefflingmjn6172EncMrVyngaardSLyMMadCaddy 32 votes
Woodrow Wilson
0%
MichaelLCjungleroomx 2 votes
Barack Obama
8%
Nova_CLoren MichaelTetraRaySeñorAmorFuzzy Cumulonimbus CloudArchAtomikaEl SkidHerrCronYuzakMartini_PhilosopherPreciousBodilyFluidsWinkyTenekrRootageaVanguardPenumbra 17 votes
Ronald Reagan
1%
Mild ConfusionP10Turksonspool32 4 votes
John F. Kennedy
1%
A Dabble Of TheloniusSpace PickleDiorinixPhasen 4 votes
Other
7%
CrayonElkiApothe0sisOptimusZedKnuckle DraggerThe Black HunterKipling217CaptainNemosurrealitycheckJuliusSolomaxwell6Blackhawk1313Jobless AnarchistYoshisummonsFrostwood 15 votes
joshofalltrades on
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Posts

  • joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades 地獄のようにかわいい あなたは嫉妬深いかRegistered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    Also yes, I realize Lincoln is the safe boring pick but I don't even care, he's in most people's top 10 lists for a reason.

    ジェイムズ・ブラウンの好きな色は何ですか?
    青!
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  • ph blakeph blake Registered User regular
    George Washington
    Six foot ten, weighs a fucking ton

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  • tinwhiskerstinwhiskers Registered User regular
    George Washington
    The love of JFK is one of those things that has always baffled me. He brought us to the brink of nuclear war, got us stuck in vietnam, and was a pretty shit human being in his personal life.

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  • joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades 地獄のようにかわいい あなたは嫉妬深いかRegistered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    Sorry Washington lovers, I can't take any President seriously when they look like a bichon frise

    ジェイムズ・ブラウンの好きな色は何ですか?
    青!
    TheBlackWindshrykeSiskaDisruptedCapitalist
  • HachfaceHachface Not the Minister Farrakhan you're thinking of Registered User regular
    Franklin D. Roosevelt
    Washington wasn't that great.

    FDR was easily the best of the 20th century at the very least.

    joshofalltradesSolomaxwell6EvigilantlonelyahavaHeirCptKemzik
  • joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades 地獄のようにかわいい あなたは嫉妬深いかRegistered User regular
    edited July 2016
    Abraham Lincoln
    The love of JFK is one of those things that has always baffled me. He brought us to the brink of nuclear war, got us stuck in vietnam, and was a pretty shit human being in his personal life.

    The space race kind of overshadowed all of that in the public eye, and the guy was maybe the most charismatic President we ever had.

    Also, getting assassinated tends to get some sympathy points.

    But yeah he was kind of a shit.

    joshofalltrades on
    ジェイムズ・ブラウンの好きな色は何ですか?
    青!
    CptKemzik
  • Element BrianElement Brian Peanut Butter Shill Registered User regular
    Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
    hi i'm Teddy Roosevelt and I fucking charged a fortified hill while under fire on horseback

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    Arch,
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  • Knight_Knight_ Dead Dead Dead Registered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    Also yes, I realize Lincoln is the safe boring pick but I don't even care, he's in most people's top 10 lists for a reason.

    Yep. I'm on this train as well.

    I'm very boring with the top of my list, 1. Lincoln 2. Washington 3. FDR

    As for overrated presidents, I think Kennedy is usually pretty overrated. He was good, but I don't know that he was great. Cuban Missile Crisis was obviously a thing, and We choose to go to the moon is still one of my favorite speeches, but he usually gets kicked a bit above his pay grade. Oh also Reagan, Reagan was a bad president at best and he constantly gets shoved into the top 10 which is just absurd.

    aeNqQM9.jpg
  • joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades 地獄のようにかわいい あなたは嫉妬深いかRegistered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    Teddy was undeniably badass but I feel like he's kind of a meme at this point

    ジェイムズ・ブラウンの好きな色は何ですか?
    青!
    HachfaceNobearda5ehrenFencingsaxFlying CouchBlameless ClericSpeed RacerCptKemzikMr Ray
  • joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades 地獄のようにかわいい あなたは嫉妬深いかRegistered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    Knight_ wrote: »
    Also yes, I realize Lincoln is the safe boring pick but I don't even care, he's in most people's top 10 lists for a reason.

    Yep. I'm on this train as well.

    I'm very boring with the top of my list, 1. Lincoln 2. Washington 3. FDR

    As for overrated presidents, I think Kennedy is usually pretty overrated. He was good, but I don't know that he was great. Cuban Missile Crisis was obviously a thing, and We choose to go to the moon is still one of my favorite speeches, but he usually gets kicked a bit above his pay grade. Oh also Reagan, Reagan was a bad president at best and he constantly gets shoved into the top 10 which is just absurd.

    Reagan is actually in my bottom 3, I think. It's tough to top Buchanan's awfulness, but we eventually (sort of) got past it, and we're still dealing with Reagan's bullshit today.

    ジェイムズ・ブラウンの好きな色は何ですか?
    青!
    MegaMek
  • VishNubVishNub Registered User regular
    Franklin D. Roosevelt
    I said FDR for the normal reasons. I forgot about national parks, though....

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  • tinwhiskerstinwhiskers Registered User regular
    George Washington
    Teddy was undeniably badass but I feel like he's kind of a meme at this point

    His best stuff is really the environmentalism and trust busting.

    joshofalltradesJragghenKruiteNobeardHefflingshrykea5ehrenShadowfireDisruptedCapitalistNo-QuarterlonelyahavaSLyMBlameless Cleric38thDoeHeirKrieghundCptKemzikPreciousBodilyFluids
  • ShortyShorty JUDGE BROSEF Registered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    Eisenhower is generally regarded to be in the top 10 presidents by historians

    and I would agree

    I would go so far as to say that he's absolutely the best postwar president

    V1mDoodmannHefflinga5ehrenEvigilantOptimusZedRedTideNo-QuarterLanlaornHeir
  • PhasenPhasen 2020 or bustRegistered User regular
    John F. Kennedy
    F yall. JFK was great. Space is cool. Vote Gingrich.

    psn: PhasenWeeple
    Frankiedarling
  • joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades 地獄のようにかわいい あなたは嫉妬深いかRegistered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    Shorty wrote: »
    Eisenhower is generally regarded to be in the top 10 presidents by historians

    and I would agree

    I would go so far as to say that he's absolutely the best postwar president

    Usually he's lauded by conservatives more than liberals.

    But as the liberalist libby lib that ever libbed, I really like the guy. If modern Republicans were modeled after Ike rather than Reagan, I might consider tossing them a vote once in a while.

    ジェイムズ・ブラウンの好きな色は何ですか?
    青!
    ShortyV1mKnight_JragghentinwhiskersDoctorArchRiemannLivesRozRchanenOptimusZedRedTideNo-QuarterJazzYoshisummonsFiendishrabbit
  • ph blakeph blake Registered User regular
    George Washington
    Thomas Jefferson was a good writer and lucked into the Louisiana purchase, but his actual policy decisions were pretty terrible.

    Probably not the most overrated president just because Reagan and Jackson exist, but putting him anywhere near the top 5 is absurd.

    ShortyKetBraSmrtnik
  • Knight_Knight_ Dead Dead Dead Registered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    Knight_ wrote: »
    Also yes, I realize Lincoln is the safe boring pick but I don't even care, he's in most people's top 10 lists for a reason.

    Yep. I'm on this train as well.

    I'm very boring with the top of my list, 1. Lincoln 2. Washington 3. FDR

    As for overrated presidents, I think Kennedy is usually pretty overrated. He was good, but I don't know that he was great. Cuban Missile Crisis was obviously a thing, and We choose to go to the moon is still one of my favorite speeches, but he usually gets kicked a bit above his pay grade. Oh also Reagan, Reagan was a bad president at best and he constantly gets shoved into the top 10 which is just absurd.

    Reagan is actually in my bottom 3, I think. It's tough to top Buchanan's awfulness, but we eventually (sort of) got past it, and we're still dealing with Reagan's bullshit today.

    Buchanan will forever be the worst, unless a future president ends the union/world and another one doesn't claw it back together. And he's the only President from PA too. Sorry America.

    Reagan is certainly bottom quarter, it gets hard to rank them down there though. Compounded by, as you said, the real effects we are still feeling today from Reagan's presidency. Makes it harder to be impartial.

    aeNqQM9.jpg
    joshofalltradesa5ehren
  • PhasenPhasen 2020 or bustRegistered User regular
    John F. Kennedy
    Also why no LBJ?

    psn: PhasenWeeple
    dispatch.oJebusUDApothe0sisMr KhanEvigilant
  • tinwhiskerstinwhiskers Registered User regular
    George Washington
    Knight_ wrote: »
    Also yes, I realize Lincoln is the safe boring pick but I don't even care, he's in most people's top 10 lists for a reason.

    Yep. I'm on this train as well.

    I'm very boring with the top of my list, 1. Lincoln 2. Washington 3. FDR

    As for overrated presidents, I think Kennedy is usually pretty overrated. He was good, but I don't know that he was great. Cuban Missile Crisis was obviously a thing, and We choose to go to the moon is still one of my favorite speeches, but he usually gets kicked a bit above his pay grade. Oh also Reagan, Reagan was a bad president at best and he constantly gets shoved into the top 10 which is just absurd.

    Reagan is actually in my bottom 3, I think. It's tough to top Buchanan's awfulness, but we eventually (sort of) got past it, and we're still dealing with Reagan's bullshit today.

    Saint Ronnie is a posionous lie, but I don't know that he can really beat out Jackson or Andrew Johnson for a bottom spot.

    I think I'd go with A. Johnson for worst, his abandonment of reconstruction has been fucking us for 150 years.

    Knight_RiemannLivesMegaMekSmrtnik
  • emnmnmeemnmnme Heard about this on conservative radio:Registered User regular
    Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt

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  • joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades 地獄のようにかわいい あなたは嫉妬深いかRegistered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    Phasen wrote: »
    Also why no LBJ?

    I could only pick 10 poll options, because that's all the forums will allow. I would put all of them up if I could.

    I tried to pick a balance of typical top 10 choices with some unconventional ones because it would be weird of me to only put up the ones that I personally think are great.

    The Other option is right there.

    (LBJ was pretty good but by all accounts a total asshole)

    ジェイムズ・ブラウンの好きな色は何ですか?
    青!
  • tinwhiskerstinwhiskers Registered User regular
    George Washington
    Phasen wrote: »
    Also why no LBJ?

    Didn't kill enough kids today?

  • milskimilski Their Will comes, at last, to Earth, to the Neath, as a storm crosses the sea. Registered User regular
    Fuck Buchanan. He was playing "both sides are bad" with the fucking civil war. There's far too much blood on his hands to give him anything but dead last.

    High, cold, eternal, immobile, minuscule. You endure; you burn.
    joshofalltrades
  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    George Washington
    Washington is probably more famous for what happened before and after his tenure... but managing to bind presidents to two terms without any rule or law is damned impressive.

    He managed to be a credible thorn in the side of the reigning superpower.

    A shame his warnings against party were not taken to heart as much as his term limits... but I suspect weariness after eight years helped.

    Lincoln would be my vote some days too though... or most days, if we consider only achievements in office.

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  • PhasenPhasen 2020 or bustRegistered User regular
    edited July 2016
    John F. Kennedy
    Phasen wrote: »
    Also why no LBJ?

    I could only pick 10 poll options, because that's all the forums will allow. I would put all of them up if I could.

    I tried to pick a balance of typical top 10 choices with some unconventional ones because it would be weird of me to only put up the ones that I personally think are great.

    The Other option is right there.

    (LBJ was pretty good but by all accounts a total asshole)



    Being an asshole is a plus in my book. He was the asshole we needed for the time

    Phasen on
    psn: PhasenWeeple
    RedTide
  • ShortyShorty JUDGE BROSEF Registered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    Shorty wrote: »
    Eisenhower is generally regarded to be in the top 10 presidents by historians

    and I would agree

    I would go so far as to say that he's absolutely the best postwar president

    Usually he's lauded by conservatives more than liberals.

    But as the liberalist libby lib that ever libbed, I really like the guy. If modern Republicans were modeled after Ike rather than Reagan, I might consider tossing them a vote once in a while.

    I think that's mainly just because he has an R next to his name

    if they knew anything about his record, or how parties were structured in the 50's, they wouldn't like him

    like I cannot imagine any modern Republican being aware of his farewell address and thinking highly of him

    and yeah, agreed--if the GOP of today was full of people like Ike, I'd be much happier with the state of our government

    joshofalltradesa5ehrenRchanenSmrtnik
  • nexuscrawlernexuscrawler Registered User regular
    Polaritie wrote: »
    Washington is probably more famous for what happened before and after his tenure... but managing to bind presidents to two terms without any rule or law is damned impressive.

    He managed to be a credible thorn in the side of the reigning superpower.

    A shame his warnings against party were not taken to heart as much as his term limits... but I suspect weariness after eight years helped.

    Lincoln would be my vote some days too though... or most days, if we consider only achievements in office.

    Pretty much

    Jefferson Adams and Madison all had more eventful presidencies

    I feel like Adams gets shorted in his contributions

    Doodmanndispatch.o
  • DoodmannDoodmann Registered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    hi i'm Teddy Roosevelt and I fucking charged a fortified hill while under fire on horseback

    And National Parks!

    A Kobold's KoboldHavelock2.0Heir
  • joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades 地獄のようにかわいい あなたは嫉妬深いかRegistered User regular
    edited July 2016
    Abraham Lincoln
    Shorty wrote: »
    Shorty wrote: »
    Eisenhower is generally regarded to be in the top 10 presidents by historians

    and I would agree

    I would go so far as to say that he's absolutely the best postwar president

    Usually he's lauded by conservatives more than liberals.

    But as the liberalist libby lib that ever libbed, I really like the guy. If modern Republicans were modeled after Ike rather than Reagan, I might consider tossing them a vote once in a while.

    I think that's mainly just because he has an R next to his name

    if they knew anything about his record, or how parties were structured in the 50's, they wouldn't like him

    like I cannot imagine any modern Republican being aware of his farewell address and thinking highly of him

    and yeah, agreed--if the GOP of today was full of people like Ike, I'd be much happier with the state of our government

    As we peer into society's future, we – you and I, and our government – must avoid the impulse to live only for today, plundering for, for our own ease and convenience, the precious resources of tomorrow. We cannot mortgage the material assets of our grandchildren without asking the loss also of their political and spiritual heritage. We want democracy to survive for all generations to come, not to become the insolvent phantom of tomorrow.

    Until the latest of our world conflicts, the United States had no armaments industry. American makers of plowshares could, with time and as required, make swords as well. But we can no longer risk emergency improvisation of national defense. We have been compelled to create a permanent armaments industry of vast proportions. Added to this, three and a half million men and women are directly engaged in the defense establishment. We annually spend on military security alone more than the net income of all United States corporations.

    Now this conjunction of an immense military establishment and a large arms industry is new in the American experience. The total influence—economic, political, even spiritual—is felt in every city, every Statehouse, every office of the Federal government. We recognize the imperative need for this development. Yet, we must not fail to comprehend its grave implications. Our toil, resources, and livelihood are all involved. So is the very structure of our society.

    In the councils of government, we must guard against the acquisition of unwarranted influence, whether sought or unsought, by the military-industrial complex. The potential for the disastrous rise of misplaced power exists and will persist. We must never let the weight of this combination endanger our liberties or democratic processes. We should take nothing for granted. Only an alert and knowledgeable citizenry can compel the proper meshing of the huge industrial and military machinery of defense with our peaceful methods and goals, so that security and liberty may prosper together.

    Pretty great stuff. :+1:

    joshofalltrades on
    ジェイムズ・ブラウンの好きな色は何ですか?
    青!
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  • PhasenPhasen 2020 or bustRegistered User regular
    John F. Kennedy
    Phasen wrote: »
    Also why no LBJ?

    Didn't kill enough kids today?

    Never enough

    psn: PhasenWeeple
  • ShortyShorty JUDGE BROSEF Registered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    Knight_ wrote: »
    Also yes, I realize Lincoln is the safe boring pick but I don't even care, he's in most people's top 10 lists for a reason.

    Yep. I'm on this train as well.

    I'm very boring with the top of my list, 1. Lincoln 2. Washington 3. FDR

    As for overrated presidents, I think Kennedy is usually pretty overrated. He was good, but I don't know that he was great. Cuban Missile Crisis was obviously a thing, and We choose to go to the moon is still one of my favorite speeches, but he usually gets kicked a bit above his pay grade. Oh also Reagan, Reagan was a bad president at best and he constantly gets shoved into the top 10 which is just absurd.

    Reagan is actually in my bottom 3, I think. It's tough to top Buchanan's awfulness, but we eventually (sort of) got past it, and we're still dealing with Reagan's bullshit today.

    Saint Ronnie is a posionous lie, but I don't know that he can really beat out Jackson or Andrew Johnson for a bottom spot.

    I think I'd go with A. Johnson for worst, his abandonment of reconstruction has been fucking us for 150 years.

    it wasn't his abandonment which really fucked us, though

    Grant's reconstruction policies were working until the party decided they'd rather have Hayes in office than continue Grant's reconstruction efforts

    Doodmann
  • DoctorArchDoctorArch Curmudgeon Registered User regular
    Teddy was undeniably badass but I feel like he's kind of a meme at this point

    His best stuff is really the environmentalism and trust busting.

    He was also freakishly charismatic, incredibly intelligent, and somehow managed to be a populist without ginning up the negative aspects.

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  • MrMisterMrMister A pup must first get in the water to be successful as a seal!Registered User regular
    Teddy Roosevelt's enthusiasm for the acquisition and (brutal, horrifying) pacification of the Philippines is also a black mark on his record, though it occurred before his presidency.

    joshofalltradesDoctorArchShadowhopeJragghena5ehrenA Kobold's Kobold
  • DoodmannDoodmann Registered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    Shorty wrote: »
    Knight_ wrote: »
    Also yes, I realize Lincoln is the safe boring pick but I don't even care, he's in most people's top 10 lists for a reason.

    Yep. I'm on this train as well.

    I'm very boring with the top of my list, 1. Lincoln 2. Washington 3. FDR

    As for overrated presidents, I think Kennedy is usually pretty overrated. He was good, but I don't know that he was great. Cuban Missile Crisis was obviously a thing, and We choose to go to the moon is still one of my favorite speeches, but he usually gets kicked a bit above his pay grade. Oh also Reagan, Reagan was a bad president at best and he constantly gets shoved into the top 10 which is just absurd.

    Reagan is actually in my bottom 3, I think. It's tough to top Buchanan's awfulness, but we eventually (sort of) got past it, and we're still dealing with Reagan's bullshit today.

    Saint Ronnie is a posionous lie, but I don't know that he can really beat out Jackson or Andrew Johnson for a bottom spot.

    I think I'd go with A. Johnson for worst, his abandonment of reconstruction has been fucking us for 150 years.

    it wasn't his abandonment which really fucked us, though

    Grant's reconstruction policies were working until the party decided they'd rather have Hayes in office than continue Grant's reconstruction efforts

    The Hayes decision was probably the worst policy decision to happen in america post civil war, with internment being a close second of course.

  • ShortyShorty JUDGE BROSEF Registered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    Doodmann wrote: »
    Shorty wrote: »
    Knight_ wrote: »
    Also yes, I realize Lincoln is the safe boring pick but I don't even care, he's in most people's top 10 lists for a reason.

    Yep. I'm on this train as well.

    I'm very boring with the top of my list, 1. Lincoln 2. Washington 3. FDR

    As for overrated presidents, I think Kennedy is usually pretty overrated. He was good, but I don't know that he was great. Cuban Missile Crisis was obviously a thing, and We choose to go to the moon is still one of my favorite speeches, but he usually gets kicked a bit above his pay grade. Oh also Reagan, Reagan was a bad president at best and he constantly gets shoved into the top 10 which is just absurd.

    Reagan is actually in my bottom 3, I think. It's tough to top Buchanan's awfulness, but we eventually (sort of) got past it, and we're still dealing with Reagan's bullshit today.

    Saint Ronnie is a posionous lie, but I don't know that he can really beat out Jackson or Andrew Johnson for a bottom spot.

    I think I'd go with A. Johnson for worst, his abandonment of reconstruction has been fucking us for 150 years.

    it wasn't his abandonment which really fucked us, though

    Grant's reconstruction policies were working until the party decided they'd rather have Hayes in office than continue Grant's reconstruction efforts

    The Hayes decision was probably the worst policy decision to happen in america post civil war, with internment being a close second of course.

    yeah

    although, realistically, Tilden won the popular vote and certainly would have tried to end Reconstruction himself if he'd been elected, but it would have been nice if the GOP had actually fought for it

    RiemannLives
  • RMS OceanicRMS Oceanic Registered User regular
    edited July 2016
    Abraham Lincoln
    milski wrote: »
    Fuck Buchanan. He was playing "both sides are bad" with the fucking civil war. There's far too much blood on his hands to give him anything but dead last.

    He had a curiously endearing nickname however. "The Old Public Functionary".

    I think my top three are kinda boring, but:

    Lincoln: Dealing with what was probably the greatest existential crisis to the US while making a substantial leap forward on a matter of principle
    FDR: I don't think WW2 directly threatened the US like the civil war did, but his determination to oppose the Axis had good benefits for millions of people
    Washington: Because I respect people who go full Cincinnatus

    Bottom Three:

    Jackson: Trail of tears aside, vetoing the National Bank not only helped cause a recession while he was still alive, it helped lay some of the seeds for the Great Depression
    Buchanan: A poster child for the price of inaction in either way
    Nixon: This was a hard one, but I think all the illegal stuff he did didn't help, as well as kinda sending the drug war into overdrive as a way of discrediting his critics has had terrible consequences

    RMS Oceanic on
  • joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades 地獄のようにかわいい あなたは嫉妬深いかRegistered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    I think William Henry Harrison ought to be stricken from any reasonable ranking. He gets put near the bottom of lists just because he died a month after taking office. Though it is funny to see him ranked above Nixon, Coolidge and Pierce on certain lists.

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  • ShadowhopeShadowhope Baa. Registered User regular
    edited July 2016
    Theodore "Teddy" Roosevelt
    hi i'm Teddy Roosevelt and I fucking charged a fortified hill while under fire on horseback
    For me, Lincoln and Teddy are 1a and 1b, but I think that Licoln will get a ton of votes so I showed my appreciation for Teddy.

    Lincoln's achievements are legendary - putting the US back together and ending slavery - but ultimately I think that Teddy's achievements set the stage for the 20th century. His Square Deal broke up the trusts, regulated industry, established standards for food and drugs, created national parks, and some of the things that he tried to push for were higher inheritance taxes to prevent the extremely rich from creating a perpetual de facto aristocracy, postal banking to compete with local banks, he wanted to cut down on injunctions against striking unions, for corporation law to be national rather than by state, a federal income tax, etc. He was the first modern Progressive President, and in some ways he was more of a lefty than politicians today.

    If you're judging a President solely by what they did in office, Teddy was absolutely remarkable,

    Shadowhope on
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  • joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades 地獄のようにかわいい あなたは嫉妬深いかRegistered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    Polaritie wrote: »
    Washington is probably more famous for what happened before and after his tenure... but managing to bind presidents to two terms without any rule or law is damned impressive.

    He managed to be a credible thorn in the side of the reigning superpower.

    A shame his warnings against party were not taken to heart as much as his term limits... but I suspect weariness after eight years helped.

    Lincoln would be my vote some days too though... or most days, if we consider only achievements in office.

    Pretty much

    Jefferson Adams and Madison all had more eventful presidencies

    I feel like Adams gets shorted in his contributions

    Adams at least refused to use slave labor and was outspoken about how he found it abhorrent. Too bad he tried to keep the issue out of national politics because it was "too divisive" or whatever, but he was far more enlightened on the issue than most of his contemporaries.

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    青!
  • RMS OceanicRMS Oceanic Registered User regular
    Abraham Lincoln
    Here's an interesting question: What's the single biggest black mark you'd put on a president's record while still thinking that President's record is overall good?

    This one is difficult for me, but depending on my mood it's either FDR's internment of Japanese-American citizens, or Woodrow Wilson's occupation of Haiti

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