The new Rogue Legendary is bad enough that it actually makes me sad.
First of all, they printed it as a 3-drop. Not like there's any Rogue 3-drops vying for that spot in decks, right? Edwin VanCleef, SI7: Agent, Fan of Knives, Shadow Strike. Secondly, it's lazy design. They basically just put stats on Burgle... and I don't know how that's good enough to justify the Legendary rarity. Third, what Rogue needs is some heal or some clear... like we used to have with pre-nerf Blade Flurry (which has still not been justified via card releases) and Antique Healbot. And finally, probably not the biggest issue, but I can't help but feel irked that, like Xaril, Poisoned Mind, they made the toughness too low. At least with 4-toughness it wouldn't be susceptible to Lightning Storm from Shaman... which is ALL OVER ladder right now. Is this card even better than Unearthed Raptor? The "steal cards from your opponents class" gimmick stinks, IMO. If I wanted to play that class, I would just play that class. This just adds RNG to the process... and I hate it.
Swashburglar sees play because it's a 1-drop and Rogue doesn't really have any. Undercity Huckster sees some play because it has Deathrattle, so you get value even if it dies and it's not a dead draw from Barnes. This guy has to compete with other 3-drops, AND attack to get what Burglar gives you for free and Huckster gives you for dying and I don't think Stealth makes up for that. Like is this guy going to spiral out of control & attack so many times he snowballs the game in your favor with all the value? No, he's not.
Well, whatever. At least Priest won't be trash tier anymore. It'll only take a couple of weeks for people to start complaining about how OP Priest is.
Coffey on
0
The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
i don't like adding "For this to be good you ALSO have to have played a 6 mana card you have one copy of in your deck" to the qualifiers of good
I mean, it's not bad it you didn't play justicar
armor gain is armor gain, it's all valuable to warrior. sure, it's not super 8 armor value, but you're still getting value. Dog was running Tournament Medic for a while, this works in a similar vein (less reliable, but useful when at full health).
i don't like adding "For this to be good you ALSO have to have played a 6 mana card you have one copy of in your deck" to the qualifiers of good
I mean, it's not bad it you didn't play justicar
armor gain is armor gain, it's all valuable to warrior. sure, it's not super 8 armor value, but you're still getting value. Dog was running Tournament Medic for a while, this works in a similar vein (less reliable, but useful when at full health).
Why isn't control warrior playing Garrison Commander then
i don't like adding "For this to be good you ALSO have to have played a 6 mana card you have one copy of in your deck" to the qualifiers of good
I mean, it's not bad it you didn't play justicar
armor gain is armor gain, it's all valuable to warrior. sure, it's not super 8 armor value, but you're still getting value. Dog was running Tournament Medic for a while, this works in a similar vein (less reliable, but useful when at full health).
Why isn't control warrior playing Garrison Commander then
Actually yeah putting it that way I don't see it having much use.
Granted that could just be me not wanting to imagine warriors getting more god damn armor gain.
i don't like adding "For this to be good you ALSO have to have played a 6 mana card you have one copy of in your deck" to the qualifiers of good
I mean, it's not bad it you didn't play justicar
armor gain is armor gain, it's all valuable to warrior. sure, it's not super 8 armor value, but you're still getting value. Dog was running Tournament Medic for a while, this works in a similar vein (less reliable, but useful when at full health).
Why isn't control warrior playing Garrison Commander then
i don't like adding "For this to be good you ALSO have to have played a 6 mana card you have one copy of in your deck" to the qualifiers of good
I mean, it's not bad it you didn't play justicar
armor gain is armor gain, it's all valuable to warrior. sure, it's not super 8 armor value, but you're still getting value. Dog was running Tournament Medic for a while, this works in a similar vein (less reliable, but useful when at full health).
Why isn't control warrior playing Garrison Commander then
you clearly haven't seen my control warrior lists
(also a 2/3 is a lot worse than a 3/4)
Sure but they are both on curve bodies for the cost and garison commander is significantly easier to play and make use of his effect. Since he's both low cost and doesn't need an activator.
i don't like adding "For this to be good you ALSO have to have played a 6 mana card you have one copy of in your deck" to the qualifiers of good
I mean, it's not bad it you didn't play justicar
armor gain is armor gain, it's all valuable to warrior. sure, it's not super 8 armor value, but you're still getting value. Dog was running Tournament Medic for a while, this works in a similar vein (less reliable, but useful when at full health).
Why isn't control warrior playing Garrison Commander then
you clearly haven't seen my control warrior lists
(also a 2/3 is a lot worse than a 3/4)
it's a lot better if you need 4 mana to cast a spell instead of 3!
The new Rogue Legendary is bad enough that it actually makes me sad.
First of all, they printed it as a 3-drop. Not like there's any Rogue 3-drops vying for that spot in decks, right? Edwin VanCleef, SI7: Agent, Fan of Knives, Shadow Strike. Secondly, it's lazy design. They basically just put stats on Burgle... and I don't know how that's good enough to justify the Legendary rarity. Third, what Rogue needs is some heal or some clear... like we used to have with pre-nerf Blade Flurry (which has still not been justified via card releases) and Antique Healbot. And finally, probably not the biggest issue, but I can't help but feel irked that, like Xaril, Poisoned Mind, they made the toughness too low. At least with 4-toughness it wouldn't be susceptible to Lightning Storm from Shaman... which is ALL OVER ladder right now. Is this card even better than Unearthed Raptor? The "steal cards from your opponents class" gimmick stinks, IMO. If I wanted to play that class, I would just play that class. This just adds RNG to the process... and I hate it.
Swashburglar sees play because it's a 1-drop and Rogue doesn't really have any. Undercity Huckster sees some play because it has Deathrattle, so you get value even if it dies and it's not a dead draw from Barnes. This guy has to compete with other 3-drops, AND attack to get what Burglar gives you for free and Huckster gives you for dying and I don't think Stealth makes up for that. Like is this guy going to spiral out of control & attack so many times he snowballs the game in your favor with all the value? No, he's not.
Well, whatever. At least Priest won't be trash tier anymore. It'll only take a couple of weeks for people to start complaining about how OP Priest is.
If they printed the stuff rogue needs on their legendary I would be pissed, because I would only be able to have one in my deck and it would be basically a 1600 dust "wanting to play rogue" tax.
My friend is working on a roguelike game you can play if you want to. (It has free demo)
+2
3cl1ps3I will build a labyrinth to house the cheeseRegistered Userregular
Man, I get mad every time I see Thing from Below. The only deck I play ever that is not priest is beast druid. And here lies Knight of the Wild, stillborn champion of the archetype, doing absolutely jack shit with the same mechanic, only wearing a ball and chain.
And a 3 mana 3/4 is absolutely fine even before you take the text into account. You don't need to use the ability to get value early game, it already provides that with stats. However, unlike other early drops, he's got a use if you happen to draw him late. I'm not seeing how this card sucks. Unless we're judging from the shaman point of view, where it blows chunks if it isn't completely broken. Then it sucks.
if your legendary's text is basically "i'm a marginally better fairly-statted creature with edge cases," you're going to be a bit disappointed when you open him.
Ah, if you are only concerned with Warrior, I imagine he's not too impressive. As a priest, he's good on curve, which is 90% of the battle for us. Late game, he makes minion combat profitable. 2 hero powers and a power word: shield is +6 health and draw a card for 5 mana, 8 if you play him from hand. He's a solid, no frills early drop with late game value. I'd be happy to gets this guy.
The 3/7 epic is a really good priest 3 drop, this I'm not sure about. I feel like priest never found a spot for the Valkyrie sister's even when Velen's was in rotation and we have Pfeast now for spell based healing.
E: Also the Rogue leggo is super bad, for real.
EE: Dang, the Pally cannondick card is it's leggo? That is tragic.
Shen on
3DS: 2234-8122-8398 | Battle.net (EU): Ladi#2485
+1
GrobianWhat's on sale?Pliers!Registered Userregular
The rogue legendary is worse than huckster. The auctioneer is at least interesting but not fitting into any current decks.
"People are having incredible trouble playing priest on ladder!"
"Hmm, how can we buff priest?"
"I know, let's buff dragons so priest can have a play-on-curve minion deck! Those decks are really popular on the ladder, everyone must love them!"
"Excellent, that is exactly what people love about playing priest!"
I wouldn't really call Drakonid "just playing on curve." Yeah it's a 5 mana 5/6 but it's a 5 mana 5/6 with a better version of Thoughtsteal attached, which IS what people love about priest.
And it requires dragons to do so, which means saturating a deck with dragons, most of which are stat-cards aimed at playing on curve.
So yes, it's stupid, and if their approach to making classes viable is just to give them well-stat'd drops for each mana cost from 1 to 6 so that they can play a tempo game, they have totally fucking missed the point.
There are nine tri-class cards in the set. Each faction has three.
There will be more pirates in the set.
Getting rid of things that are good just because they're good isn't a fun experience for players.
Not too much I found interesting there but ymmv.
Lotus Agents: (5) 5/3 - Battlecry: Discover a druid, shaman or rogue card
Kabal Courier: (3) 2/2 - Battlecry: Discover a mage, warlock or priest card
Kazakus: (4) 3/3 - Battlecry: If your deck has no duplicates, create a custom card
Grimestreet Informant: (2) 1/1 - Battlecry: Discover a hunter, paladin or warrior card
Only five more to see, and I imagine each faction will get a legendary? But yes, those are some mediocre bodies.
The 3/7 epic is a really good priest 3 drop, this I'm not sure about. I feel like priest never found a spot for the Valkyrie sister's even when Velen's was in rotation and we have Pfeast now for spell based healing.
E: Also the Rogue leggo is super bad, for real.
EE: Dang, the Pally cannondick card is it's leggo? That is tragic.
The sisters would also be good priest picks, assuming we get more good 2's. They just can't deliver when you turn 2 pass. 3/4's for 3 become more powerful the more consistently you are able to play a 1 or 2 drop.
There are nine tri-class cards in the set. Each faction has three.
There will be more pirates in the set.
Getting rid of things that are good just because they're good isn't a fun experience for players.
Not too much I found interesting there but ymmv.
Lotus Agents: (5) 5/3 - Battlecry: Discover a druid, shaman or rogue card
Kabal Courier: (3) 2/2 - Battlecry: Discover a mage, warlock or priest card
Kazakus: (4) 3/3 - Battlecry: If your deck has no duplicates, create a custom card
Grimestreet Informant: (2) 1/1 - Battlecry: Discover a hunter, paladin or warrior card
Only five more to see, and I imagine each faction will get a legendary? But yes, those are some mediocre bodies.
Whoof, some of those answers are... not good.
Dean wasn't sure if there would be any quests at the start of the expansion release that would give out free card packs like Old Gods.
The freebies in Old Gods were more there to promote Standard, and C'Thun was given to players to make sure if you got C'Thun's worshippers, you could actually play them.
Why the fuck are they so stingy on giving out freebies. Like, wow, would it kill them to hand out a few free packs? The OG packs had a GREAT reception. Ughhh.
Molten Giant was nerfed mainly because Handlock was using too many evergreen cards. They wanted to see that change up.
"Handlock is too strong and is using too many evergreens, guys. Let's nerf Molten Giant into the ground and change it all up."
*Handlock is now a dead deck and no longer sees any play*
Great job!
It is hard to balance cards which could cost 0 mana, but sometimes you have to take the risk and it can make for some very exciting cards.
UGGGHHHH
Waiting to see how things evolve when something powerful appears is important as it lets players figure out how to counter it on their own.
Getting rid of things that are good just because they're good isn't a fun experience for players.
"Midrange Shaman is too good." "Should we... nerf it?" "Nahhh, that won't be a fun experience for players." "Yes, you're right, we shouldn't get rid of something that's good just because it's good."
UGGGHHHGHGHGHH
It's painful sometimes to read threads where people think the team isn't listening to feedback; they are always looking at feedback.
Why the fuck do you think people say that? Gee, maybe it's because you guys aren't communicating with us??? Wow!
I love Hearthstone and everything, but whenever we get a chance to talk shop with Team 5 it's fucking infuriating because they seem so goddamn out of touch with the playerbase. Man.
So been looking on reddit at some of the dev's comments to see what clues there are.
From what mike donais has said about Kazakus the potions/spells he generates are of 3 possible costs, then there are 10 different effects that can be pulled into the discover pool for the second and third effects (they aren't separate pools for each) and you can't have the same effect twice.
Ordering of those pools is done in the best order for the player (the example Mike Donais uses is you'll turn the minion into a sheep before doing damage that kills it), so it isn't quite as simple as saying 3 x 10 x 9 = 270. When Ben Brode invaded Trump's review video he said 120, Mike Donais says around 135 possible options.
Hearthpwn have listed the options they've seen, it looks like there are 10 effects that are then scaled to the 3 costs, though no confirmation and it's possible that there are some effects that are only for certain tiers:
Kingsblood – Draw 1 / 2 / 3 card(s).
Powerful Mojo – Put a copy of 1 / 2 / 3 card(s) from your opponents deck into your hand.
Felbloom – Deal ? / ? / 6 damage to all minions (potentially only Tier 3).
Ichor of Undeath – Summon 1 / 2 / 3 friendly minion(s) that died this game.
Mystic Wool – Transform a random minion / all minions into 1/1 Sheep (potentially only Tier 2 & 3).
Stonescale Oil – Gain 4 / 7 / 10 Armor.
Shadow Oil – Add 1 / 2 / 3 random Demon(s) to your hand.
Heart of Fire – Deal 3 / ? / 8 damage.
Goldthorn – Give your minions +2 / +? / +? Health.
Netherbloom – Summon a ? / 5/5 / 8/8 Demon.
Also Blizzard released artwork for the other faction leaders (legendaries):
Don Hancho (may not be correct spelling), leader of the goons.
Aya Blackpaw (leader) and White Eyes (bodyguard) – Jade Lotus leader.
Muffinatron on
PSN: Holy-Promethium
+8
The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
The people saying Dragonfire Potion is better than Lightbomb are getting way too far ahead of themselves, if only for the fact that it doesn't kill Rag (and Azure Drake).
+9
Kevin CristI make the devil hit his kneesand say the 'our father'Registered Userregular
I wonder if the other Triclass legends will be "Create a custom weapon" for GG and "Create a custom minion" for Lotus.
VariableMouth CongressStroke Me Lady FameRegistered Userregular
4 straight freeze mage games lost to rag coming down on turn 8. just so few comfortable ways to deal with that card. I had a super fun game on friday I think it was where I outlasted a rag but in your average game it's not possible.
Posts
the number of times you'd actually want to cast your hero power twice don't line up easily with "I also have a 3/4 on board and a spell in hand"
Yea! I love playing the steal your cards Rogue! And I really want Poison Dagger + Auctionmaster Beardo to be the new Miracle Rogue.
Hearthstone - Webber #1330
3DS: 0920-3235-4071
it's a bit finicky but it's essentially a third ironforge portal
Or even Tank Up, Auction Master, Shield Block, Tank Up for a 13 armor gain.
Lots of cheap, good spells in Warrior.
Steam: Elvenshae // PSN: Elvenshae // WotC: Elvenshae
Wilds of Aladrion: [https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/comment/43159014/#Comment_43159014]Ellandryn[/url]
First of all, they printed it as a 3-drop. Not like there's any Rogue 3-drops vying for that spot in decks, right? Edwin VanCleef, SI7: Agent, Fan of Knives, Shadow Strike. Secondly, it's lazy design. They basically just put stats on Burgle... and I don't know how that's good enough to justify the Legendary rarity. Third, what Rogue needs is some heal or some clear... like we used to have with pre-nerf Blade Flurry (which has still not been justified via card releases) and Antique Healbot. And finally, probably not the biggest issue, but I can't help but feel irked that, like Xaril, Poisoned Mind, they made the toughness too low. At least with 4-toughness it wouldn't be susceptible to Lightning Storm from Shaman... which is ALL OVER ladder right now. Is this card even better than Unearthed Raptor? The "steal cards from your opponents class" gimmick stinks, IMO. If I wanted to play that class, I would just play that class. This just adds RNG to the process... and I hate it.
Swashburglar sees play because it's a 1-drop and Rogue doesn't really have any. Undercity Huckster sees some play because it has Deathrattle, so you get value even if it dies and it's not a dead draw from Barnes. This guy has to compete with other 3-drops, AND attack to get what Burglar gives you for free and Huckster gives you for dying and I don't think Stealth makes up for that. Like is this guy going to spiral out of control & attack so many times he snowballs the game in your favor with all the value? No, he's not.
Well, whatever. At least Priest won't be trash tier anymore. It'll only take a couple of weeks for people to start complaining about how OP Priest is.
I mean, it's not bad it you didn't play justicar
armor gain is armor gain, it's all valuable to warrior. sure, it's not super 8 armor value, but you're still getting value. Dog was running Tournament Medic for a while, this works in a similar vein (less reliable, but useful when at full health).
Why isn't control warrior playing Garrison Commander then
Actually yeah putting it that way I don't see it having much use.
Granted that could just be me not wanting to imagine warriors getting more god damn armor gain.
you clearly haven't seen my control warrior lists
(also a 2/3 is a lot worse than a 3/4)
Sure but they are both on curve bodies for the cost and garison commander is significantly easier to play and make use of his effect. Since he's both low cost and doesn't need an activator.
it's a lot better if you need 4 mana to cast a spell instead of 3!
If they printed the stuff rogue needs on their legendary I would be pissed, because I would only be able to have one in my deck and it would be basically a 1600 dust "wanting to play rogue" tax.
instead of topdecking, you can TURBO TOPDECK! ultimate greed!
lock and load DOUBLE HUNTER?? double hero power would be good in hunter.
that's it, that's basically everything you could do with it. it's not great.
And a 3 mana 3/4 is absolutely fine even before you take the text into account. You don't need to use the ability to get value early game, it already provides that with stats. However, unlike other early drops, he's got a use if you happen to draw him late. I'm not seeing how this card sucks. Unless we're judging from the shaman point of view, where it blows chunks if it isn't completely broken. Then it sucks.
if your legendary's text is basically "i'm a marginally better fairly-statted creature with edge cases," you're going to be a bit disappointed when you open him.
not bad like boogeymonster, just not exciting.
that is a competitive slot for them
ravaging ghoul, acolyte of pain, taunt monkey, frothing berserker, even bloodsail cultist is playable, not to mention having access to bash t3 as well
Steam: YOU FACE JARAXXUS| Twitch.tv: CainLoveless
E: Also the Rogue leggo is super bad, for real.
EE: Dang, the Pally cannondick card is it's leggo? That is tragic.
but also i mean, it's a rogue legendary
you knew it was going to be bad before we started
So yes, it's stupid, and if their approach to making classes viable is just to give them well-stat'd drops for each mana cost from 1 to 6 so that they can play a tempo game, they have totally fucking missed the point.
I'd be surprised if the ones we've seen are constructed playable. Not ruling out similar effects on more appealingly-statted minions, but as is, eh
Not too much I found interesting there but ymmv.
Lotus Agents: (5) 5/3 - Battlecry: Discover a druid, shaman or rogue card
Kabal Courier: (3) 2/2 - Battlecry: Discover a mage, warlock or priest card
Kazakus: (4) 3/3 - Battlecry: If your deck has no duplicates, create a custom card
Grimestreet Informant: (2) 1/1 - Battlecry: Discover a hunter, paladin or warrior card
Only five more to see, and I imagine each faction will get a legendary? But yes, those are some mediocre bodies.
The sisters would also be good priest picks, assuming we get more good 2's. They just can't deliver when you turn 2 pass. 3/4's for 3 become more powerful the more consistently you are able to play a 1 or 2 drop.
Whoof, some of those answers are... not good.
Why the fuck are they so stingy on giving out freebies. Like, wow, would it kill them to hand out a few free packs? The OG packs had a GREAT reception. Ughhh.
"Handlock is too strong and is using too many evergreens, guys. Let's nerf Molten Giant into the ground and change it all up."
*Handlock is now a dead deck and no longer sees any play*
Great job!
UGGGHHHH
"Midrange Shaman is too good." "Should we... nerf it?" "Nahhh, that won't be a fun experience for players." "Yes, you're right, we shouldn't get rid of something that's good just because it's good."
UGGGHHHGHGHGHH
Why the fuck do you think people say that? Gee, maybe it's because you guys aren't communicating with us??? Wow!
I love Hearthstone and everything, but whenever we get a chance to talk shop with Team 5 it's fucking infuriating because they seem so goddamn out of touch with the playerbase. Man.
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
Feeling pretty proud of myself right now.
From what mike donais has said about Kazakus the potions/spells he generates are of 3 possible costs, then there are 10 different effects that can be pulled into the discover pool for the second and third effects (they aren't separate pools for each) and you can't have the same effect twice.
Ordering of those pools is done in the best order for the player (the example Mike Donais uses is you'll turn the minion into a sheep before doing damage that kills it), so it isn't quite as simple as saying 3 x 10 x 9 = 270. When Ben Brode invaded Trump's review video he said 120, Mike Donais says around 135 possible options.
Hearthpwn have listed the options they've seen, it looks like there are 10 effects that are then scaled to the 3 costs, though no confirmation and it's possible that there are some effects that are only for certain tiers:
Kingsblood – Draw 1 / 2 / 3 card(s).
Powerful Mojo – Put a copy of 1 / 2 / 3 card(s) from your opponents deck into your hand.
Felbloom – Deal ? / ? / 6 damage to all minions (potentially only Tier 3).
Ichor of Undeath – Summon 1 / 2 / 3 friendly minion(s) that died this game.
Mystic Wool – Transform a random minion / all minions into 1/1 Sheep (potentially only Tier 2 & 3).
Stonescale Oil – Gain 4 / 7 / 10 Armor.
Shadow Oil – Add 1 / 2 / 3 random Demon(s) to your hand.
Heart of Fire – Deal 3 / ? / 8 damage.
Goldthorn – Give your minions +2 / +? / +? Health.
Netherbloom – Summon a ? / 5/5 / 8/8 Demon.
Also Blizzard released artwork for the other faction leaders (legendaries):
Don Hancho (may not be correct spelling), leader of the goons.
Aya Blackpaw (leader) and White Eyes (bodyguard) – Jade Lotus leader.
Steam: YOU FACE JARAXXUS| Twitch.tv: CainLoveless
i made a fun and interactive rogue deck
Steam: YOU FACE JARAXXUS| Twitch.tv: CainLoveless
WOW THAT'S GOOD
"And yes, it buffed it to a 5/9" THAT'S DOUBLE GOOD
fuckkkk
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582