Most peoples' problem with Jade is that it auto-beats every single other control style. Auto-wins shouldn't be a thing.
It only auto-wins if your win condition is "go to fatigue, reno" which IMO is a failure of a deck.
It auto beats any Reno deck, and fatigue deck, probably beats Control Warrior unless they get super lucky and can get an extremely early Alex + Grom combo...
Any deck that can't go beatdown and be in a game winning position by turn 9 or 10 is almost always dead. That's basically every single control deck.
The thing is, this just isn't true. Going by vs data cause that's what we have:
Jade Druid is 70% vs reno mage which is an amazing rate, but not "auto". It's 57% against Reno Lock which is just really good, not out of the norm at all.
Jade Shaman is 49% against Reno Mage and 43% against Reno Lock. I guess you are probably just talking about Jade Druid, but, yeah.
hot take: the big design problem with the gadgetzan expansion (other than the numerous development problems) is that they went smaller for factions instead of larger
it's time to USE MAGIC THE GATHERING AS AN EXAMPLE AGAIN
so magic has 5 colours innately right, White Blue Black Red Green
it's had several worlds that focus on multi-colour themes, the most famous three being Ravnica, Alara, and Tarkir
Ravnica is focused on 10 guilds - the Boros (R/W), the Orzhov (W/B), the Azorius (W/U (blue is U)), Selesnya (G/W), Dimir (U/B), Izzet (U/R), Simic (U/G), Rakdos (R/B), Golgari (B/G), and Gruul (R/G)
Alara focuses on 5 worlds - Bant (G/W/U), Esper (W/U/B), Grixis (U/B/R), Jund (B/R/G), and Naya (R/G/W)
Tarkir focuses on 5 clans - Abzan (W/B/G), Jeskai (U/R/W), Sultai (B/G/U), Mardu (R/W/B), and Temur (G/U/R)
Meanwhile Hearthstone has 9 classes...but focused on 3 gangs. This shrinks the focus and variety. When Magic does these multicolours, bare minimum they have the same amount of focus on individual colours as a mono-colour set. And that's not even getting into how that variety allows cards to mean different things to different factions. Rakdos likes the black card that says "When this comes into play, sacrifice it unless you discard a card" because it wants to have an empty hand for its Hellbent mechanic. Whereas Golgari likes that card because they want cards in the graveyard for all their mechanics! Meanwhile in Hearthstone, everyone likes the neutral/triclass cards for the exact same reasons. Aya Blackpaw and Kazakus are the exact same value engines in every class that plays them. Small-Time Buccaneer is just Hello, I'm Aggro for every deck. Basically the only exception to this out of all the neutrals in Gadgetzan is Dopplegangster, who means something different for Evolve decks than it does for handbuff decks, and that's Cool. But it's one cool thing.
I had intended to save all of my dusk for Aya Blackpaw. But I already have two Small Time Buccaneers, and most of the Pirates needed to build a pirate deck are common. I figured hey, I can spend the little bit of dust that I have and build an OK pirate deck.
And now I feel both invincible and somewhat dirty.
Civics is not a consumer product that you can ignore because you don’t like the options presented.
I had intended to save all of my dusk for Aya Blackpaw. But I already have two Small Time Buccaneers, and most of the Pirates needed to build a pirate deck are common. I figured hey, I can spend the little bit of dust that I have and build an OK pirate deck.
And now I feel both invincible and somewhat dirty.
I played Face Hunter since it was my only semi-decent deck for a long time. Felt the same way then realized that I only feel that way since the Internet said people playing Aggro decks are jerks. Thank the Internet for making people feel dirty.
I don't understand how the ping hit the sheep and not the taunt.
+1
AegisFear My DanceOvershot Toronto, Landed in OttawaRegistered Userregular
edited February 2017
The only thing that I can think of is that it it spawned the Sheep in the 5th minion position, except didn't relay that information right away on her screen, so when she pinged the taunt, she was actually pinging the new sheep.
Long Live the Minion Repositioning Bug
Edit: Reddit says it's an old, rare bug where if you target an effect on the very same frame that a minion is transformed, it targets the transformed minion instead of what you're trying to target.
GrobianWhat's on sale?Pliers!Registered Userregular
The transform animation takes over the whole screen for a single frame so if you release a targeting arrow while that specific frame is displayed you target the sheep regardless of where you pointed.
I see a lot of people making careless mistakes because they play too fast. Like throwing out a different card because they didn't wait for a discover card to generate in their hand, or attacking a minion before another is spawned (say from an Imp Gang Boss), or the like.
Slow down people! You don't earn bonus stars by playing faster*.
*Well given the shitty ladder system, you technically can earn stars faster by playing more games quickly, but I digress...
Need a voice actor? Hire me at bengrayVO.com
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051 Steam ID Twitch Page
AegisFear My DanceOvershot Toronto, Landed in OttawaRegistered Userregular
League related, but there's a Ghostcrawler video going around today that has some pretty informative general insights on game design and patch/tweaking/change philosophy.
Haha. J4ckiechan's meme shaman control deck (with madam goya) is hilarious. It's very expensive but surprisingly effective. I went something like 5-1 with it. Only loss came to reno mage.
Haha. J4ckiechan's meme shaman control deck (with madam goya) is hilarious. It's very expensive but surprisingly effective. I went something like 5-1 with it. Only loss came to reno mage.
VanguardBut now the dream is over. And the insect is awake.Registered User, __BANNED USERSregular
I've been toying around with this demon deck for the last week or so. It's a ton of fun. Unlicensed Apothecary is ridiculously good value and few decks have a way to deal with him on turn 2 or turn 3. His downside is easy to play around--you either pump him up with potions or demonfire or drop Violet Illusionist. The ideal play is turn 3 Apothecary, turn 4 Illusionist + Malch' Imp, followed by turn 5 Doomguard. No matter what your opponent chooses to remove on turn 4, you always come out ahead, even if you have to eat 5 damage for the Doomguard.
The only deck this struggles against is Shaman. If you can slow your opponent down or get them to overplay before dropping Hellfire it can win but the odds are still against you. There is probably a little bit more room to tech in anti-shaman cards, but I'm not sure what this needs. More AOE and I'd be tempted to run Sergeant Sally; more taunts and I think I would run either Defender of Argus or Second-rate Bruiser. Beyond that don't know.
0
The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
I've been toying around with this demon deck for the last week or so. It's a ton of fun. Unlicensed Apothecary is ridiculously good value and few decks have a way to deal with him on turn 2 or turn 3. His downside is easy to play around--you either pump him up with potions or demonfire or drop Violet Illusionist. The ideal play is turn 3 Apothecary, turn 4 Illusionist + Malch' Imp, followed by turn 5 Doomguard. No matter what your opponent chooses to remove on turn 4, you always come out ahead, even if you have to eat 5 damage for the Doomguard.
The only deck this struggles against is Shaman. If you can slow your opponent down or get them to overplay before dropping Hellfire it can win but the odds are still against you. There is probably a little bit more room to tech in anti-shaman cards, but I'm not sure what this needs. More AOE and I'd be tempted to run Sergeant Sally; more taunts and I think I would run either Defender of Argus or Second-rate Bruiser. Beyond that don't know.
@Vanguard holy fuck I think you just played against reynad on stream
edit: he said "I like this guy, he's having fun. That's what Blizzard thought of when they designed Violet Illusionist"
The Escape Goat on
+4
VanguardBut now the dream is over. And the insect is awake.Registered User, __BANNED USERSregular
I've been toying around with this demon deck for the last week or so. It's a ton of fun. Unlicensed Apothecary is ridiculously good value and few decks have a way to deal with him on turn 2 or turn 3. His downside is easy to play around--you either pump him up with potions or demonfire or drop Violet Illusionist. The ideal play is turn 3 Apothecary, turn 4 Illusionist + Malch' Imp, followed by turn 5 Doomguard. No matter what your opponent chooses to remove on turn 4, you always come out ahead, even if you have to eat 5 damage for the Doomguard.
The only deck this struggles against is Shaman. If you can slow your opponent down or get them to overplay before dropping Hellfire it can win but the odds are still against you. There is probably a little bit more room to tech in anti-shaman cards, but I'm not sure what this needs. More AOE and I'd be tempted to run Sergeant Sally; more taunts and I think I would run either Defender of Argus or Second-rate Bruiser. Beyond that don't know.
@Vanguard holy fuck I think you just played against reynad on stream
edit: he said "I like this guy, he's having fun. That's what Blizzard thought of when they designed Violet Illusionist"
I was literally just coming here to post it. Yep, it was definitely him. I got fucking rolled.
+12
AegisFear My DanceOvershot Toronto, Landed in OttawaRegistered Userregular
It's satisfying, beating a beast druid that got me to 4 hp and had Hunter Hero Power, but never drew swipe, and couldn't get past the Great Earthen Wall, solely by finally drawing Elemental Destruction and healing right back up to full.
I enjoyed the back and forth that was "I play a 7/7 or 7/8, you reduce its attack to 1 or make it a 3/3".
As a Control Paladin player I was like...let's see how many answers he draws. You drew all of them :P
I didn't draw Enter the Coliseum!
The Escape Goat on
0
AegisFear My DanceOvershot Toronto, Landed in OttawaRegistered Userregular
I don't like not having at least one Wild Pyro. Honestly might just cut one of the Mana Tide Totems and put him back in. I have been managing to get down into single digit cards left in library fairly consistently, so I don't think I need that much card draw.
This was my favorite end to a game so far. No top decking needed to survive a bad situation; I had lost board control around turn six, had the Mortal Strike in hand from turn three or four, and for once had the patience to hold onto it.
Shadowhope on
Civics is not a consumer product that you can ignore because you don’t like the options presented.
+3
KoopahTroopahThe koopas, the troopas.Philadelphia, PARegistered Userregular
Haha. J4ckiechan's meme shaman control deck (with madam goya) is hilarious. It's very expensive but surprisingly effective. I went something like 5-1 with it. Only loss came to reno mage.
It's actually really good, no joke. It's got an aggressive early game that curves out into chunky midrange minions that leads into multiple lategame options for closing out the game. Also comes with lots of cycle, several potent removal spells, and Reno. Obviously N'Zoth is your prime wincon, but you can also win via CotW (IT'S STILL GOOD) or just via board. Finley is surprisingly the MVP for me. Finding a ping or Life Tap can win you the game on the spot. I mean, not on the spot, but it will lead to a win.
There's also enough deathrattles in the deck where you don't need to wait to draw into every deathrattle; just drop N'Zoth if he's gonna give you a sizeable board, plain and simple.
Like, Hunter has a LOT of good cards, is the thing, and this list lets you cram everything in there. I've tried building/tweaking a normal Midrange Hunter list and I just cannot fit everything in that I want to. A Reno list allows for that!
It's fun. I'm honestly surprised by how versatile and, well, good this list is. But there you go. I was beating the crap out of Reno Mages with it. No idea on Shaman yet! I wasn't running into them outside of a slower one, which I ended up beating anyway.
Edit: Oh yeah, every card in here feels pretty vital, the only thing I would maybe think about changing would be Loot Hoarder for Thalnos if you maaaybe wanted another source of Spellpower, but it's less power on board.
It's actually really good, no joke. It's got an aggressive early game that curves out into chunky midrange minions that leads into multiple lategame options for closing out the game. Also comes with lots of cycle, several potent removal spells, and Reno. Obviously N'Zoth is your prime wincon, but you can also win via CotW (IT'S STILL GOOD) or just via board. Finley is surprisingly the MVP for me. Finding a ping or Life Tap can win you the game on the spot. I mean, not on the spot, but it will lead to a win.
There's also enough deathrattles in the deck where you don't need to wait to draw into every deathrattle; just drop N'Zoth if he's gonna give you a sizeable board, plain and simple.
Like, Hunter has a LOT of good cards, is the thing, and this list lets you cram everything in there. I've tried building/tweaking a normal Midrange Hunter list and I just cannot fit everything in that I want to. A Reno list allows for that!
It's fun. I'm honestly surprised by how versatile and, well, good this list is. But there you go. I was beating the crap out of Reno Mages with it. No idea on Shaman yet! I wasn't running into them outside of a slower one, which I ended up beating anyway.
Edit: Oh yeah, every card in here feels pretty vital, the only thing I would maybe think about changing would be Loot Hoarder for Thalnos if you maaaybe wanted another source of Spellpower, but it's less power on board.
So this is the deck list I have been playing against lately. Thanks for posting it so now I know what is in there.
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Currently DMing: None
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[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
what does winston have to do with this
The thing is, this just isn't true. Going by vs data cause that's what we have:
Jade Druid is 70% vs reno mage which is an amazing rate, but not "auto". It's 57% against Reno Lock which is just really good, not out of the norm at all.
Jade Shaman is 49% against Reno Mage and 43% against Reno Lock. I guess you are probably just talking about Jade Druid, but, yeah.
it's time to USE MAGIC THE GATHERING AS AN EXAMPLE AGAIN
so magic has 5 colours innately right, White Blue Black Red Green
it's had several worlds that focus on multi-colour themes, the most famous three being Ravnica, Alara, and Tarkir
Ravnica is focused on 10 guilds - the Boros (R/W), the Orzhov (W/B), the Azorius (W/U (blue is U)), Selesnya (G/W), Dimir (U/B), Izzet (U/R), Simic (U/G), Rakdos (R/B), Golgari (B/G), and Gruul (R/G)
Alara focuses on 5 worlds - Bant (G/W/U), Esper (W/U/B), Grixis (U/B/R), Jund (B/R/G), and Naya (R/G/W)
Tarkir focuses on 5 clans - Abzan (W/B/G), Jeskai (U/R/W), Sultai (B/G/U), Mardu (R/W/B), and Temur (G/U/R)
Meanwhile Hearthstone has 9 classes...but focused on 3 gangs. This shrinks the focus and variety. When Magic does these multicolours, bare minimum they have the same amount of focus on individual colours as a mono-colour set. And that's not even getting into how that variety allows cards to mean different things to different factions. Rakdos likes the black card that says "When this comes into play, sacrifice it unless you discard a card" because it wants to have an empty hand for its Hellbent mechanic. Whereas Golgari likes that card because they want cards in the graveyard for all their mechanics! Meanwhile in Hearthstone, everyone likes the neutral/triclass cards for the exact same reasons. Aya Blackpaw and Kazakus are the exact same value engines in every class that plays them. Small-Time Buccaneer is just Hello, I'm Aggro for every deck. Basically the only exception to this out of all the neutrals in Gadgetzan is Dopplegangster, who means something different for Evolve decks than it does for handbuff decks, and that's Cool. But it's one cool thing.
ohhhh boy
this post is TOO REAL and it makes me REAL SAD
i never thought about it like that until someone put it in perspective but yeesh
released in 2014, only has had 6 balance patches, ~1000 cards out and only 20 have been changed since launch.
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
I had intended to save all of my dusk for Aya Blackpaw. But I already have two Small Time Buccaneers, and most of the Pirates needed to build a pirate deck are common. I figured hey, I can spend the little bit of dust that I have and build an OK pirate deck.
And now I feel both invincible and somewhat dirty.
I played Face Hunter since it was my only semi-decent deck for a long time. Felt the same way then realized that I only feel that way since the Internet said people playing Aggro decks are jerks. Thank the Internet for making people feel dirty.
Steam: betsuni7
Spooky
notlikethis.jpg
Long Live the Minion Repositioning Bug
Edit: Reddit says it's an old, rare bug where if you target an effect on the very same frame that a minion is transformed, it targets the transformed minion instead of what you're trying to target.
Currently DMing: None
Characters
[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
Slow down people! You don't earn bonus stars by playing faster*.
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
Steam ID
Twitch Page
Currently DMing: None
Characters
[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
Dont play nozdormu pls
Ancestral spirit x2
Devolve x2
Lava shock x2
Maelstrom Portal x2
Elemental Destruction x2
Far sight x2
Healing wave x2
Hex x2
Lightning Storm x2
Barnes
Earth Elemental x2
White eyes
Madam Goya
Ragnaros
Soggoth
Ysera
Deathwing
Y'Shaarj
Barnes can pull some absolute blinders in this deck, and combined with ancestral spirit gives some early power.
Currently DMing: None
Characters
[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
I want a Nozdormu giving out to everyone every set. Or a game mode with his effect. Or you earn points for speed. Something.
"Design Space" was amazing
3DS Friend Code: 3110-5393-4113
Steam profile
This deck is garbage. I'm 3-0 with it so far.
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
Steam ID
Twitch Page
On a related note, anyone think there is the remotest chance in hell of Hobart Grapplehammer being nerfed? I like him, but I have two copies.
They'll nerf weapons before they nerf Hobart.
Currently DMing: None
Characters
[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
I've been toying around with this demon deck for the last week or so. It's a ton of fun. Unlicensed Apothecary is ridiculously good value and few decks have a way to deal with him on turn 2 or turn 3. His downside is easy to play around--you either pump him up with potions or demonfire or drop Violet Illusionist. The ideal play is turn 3 Apothecary, turn 4 Illusionist + Malch' Imp, followed by turn 5 Doomguard. No matter what your opponent chooses to remove on turn 4, you always come out ahead, even if you have to eat 5 damage for the Doomguard.
The only deck this struggles against is Shaman. If you can slow your opponent down or get them to overplay before dropping Hellfire it can win but the odds are still against you. There is probably a little bit more room to tech in anti-shaman cards, but I'm not sure what this needs. More AOE and I'd be tempted to run Sergeant Sally; more taunts and I think I would run either Defender of Argus or Second-rate Bruiser. Beyond that don't know.
"Too bad your Han'cho buffed the same minion twice."
@Vanguard holy fuck I think you just played against reynad on stream
edit: he said "I like this guy, he's having fun. That's what Blizzard thought of when they designed Violet Illusionist"
I was literally just coming here to post it. Yep, it was definitely him. I got fucking rolled.
Currently DMing: None
Characters
[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
I enjoyed the back and forth that was "I play a 7/7 or 7/8, you reduce its attack to 1 or make it a 3/3".
As a Control Paladin player I was like...let's see how many answers he draws. You drew all of them :P
Currently DMing: None
Characters
[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
I didn't draw Enter the Coliseum!
I don't like not having at least one Wild Pyro. Honestly might just cut one of the Mana Tide Totems and put him back in. I have been managing to get down into single digit cards left in library fairly consistently, so I don't think I need that much card draw.
Currently DMing: None
Characters
[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
I wanna try this but so many TGT cards that I don't have.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
have u tried
zalae's reno n'zoth hunter: http://www.hearthpwn.com/decks/726715-zalaes-reno-nzoth-hunter
It's actually really good, no joke. It's got an aggressive early game that curves out into chunky midrange minions that leads into multiple lategame options for closing out the game. Also comes with lots of cycle, several potent removal spells, and Reno. Obviously N'Zoth is your prime wincon, but you can also win via CotW (IT'S STILL GOOD) or just via board. Finley is surprisingly the MVP for me. Finding a ping or Life Tap can win you the game on the spot. I mean, not on the spot, but it will lead to a win.
There's also enough deathrattles in the deck where you don't need to wait to draw into every deathrattle; just drop N'Zoth if he's gonna give you a sizeable board, plain and simple.
Like, Hunter has a LOT of good cards, is the thing, and this list lets you cram everything in there. I've tried building/tweaking a normal Midrange Hunter list and I just cannot fit everything in that I want to. A Reno list allows for that!
It's fun. I'm honestly surprised by how versatile and, well, good this list is. But there you go. I was beating the crap out of Reno Mages with it. No idea on Shaman yet! I wasn't running into them outside of a slower one, which I ended up beating anyway.
Edit: Oh yeah, every card in here feels pretty vital, the only thing I would maybe think about changing would be Loot Hoarder for Thalnos if you maaaybe wanted another source of Spellpower, but it's less power on board.
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
So this is the deck list I have been playing against lately. Thanks for posting it so now I know what is in there.
Steam: betsuni7
So, you were getting wrecked half the time.
There's nothing more magical than a hunter with Tank Up!