If the Republicans don't independently call for an investigation they should be considered on the take.
This is absolutely nuts that they want to ignore this and sweep it under the rug. This is absolutely fucked.
No the more fucked part is all their followers that don't give two shits
Their followers are probably being told that this is all "fake news" and are furious that a good, upstanding Republican would be booted out of office over lies. In case you forgot, we're in the post-truth era now. Anything that sounds good is truth, and anything that sounds bad is fake news.
Mike Pence pressed repeatedly about contacts with Russia during campaign
"All the contact by the Trump campaign and associates were with the American people," Pence said. "We were fully engaged with taking his message to 'Make America Great Again' all across the country."
Finally, asked by host Chris Wallace on a third try if he had ever asked Donald Trump if there were any contacts in the campaign between Trump or his associates and Russians, Pence answered “of course not.”
I'm hoping now that 2018 swings super hard left and the Democrats immediately start impeachment.
Just pick and choose the issue
At this point they should either stack them together as a sort of massive case of incompetence/Corruption or instead flood the dockets with dozens of impeachment discussions.
I can't bring myself to believe an appointee-to-be made illegal contact with the same shady government that has shady connections to Trump and made policy promises without being directed to do so.
That just doesn't make sense. There's no reason he would do that of his own volition.
I can believe he'd do so of his own volition in that maybe Flynn is himself a source for contact between Trump and the Russians. As in Flynn is heavily influenced by the Russians up to even in bed with them and he then uses his position to push Trump towards policies he wants.
I'm hoping now that 2018 swings super hard left and the Democrats immediately start impeachment.
Just pick and choose the issue
Based on the last month, assuming half the government hasn't collapsed, or republicans managed to pass comprehensive voter "fraud" reforms that make Jim Crowe era laws look quaint; I would prefer a Dem sweep in 2018 focus on rebuilding the wreckage they would inherit and de-legitimize Trump by actively ignoring him entirely and blocking via legislation every thing he tries to do. Not waste time on a procedural action that only carries as much weight as the person at the receiving end gives it. My biggest question for all the people who are clamoring for impeachment now is: what do you think Trump would do if he were impeached? Say "my bad, laters"? Come on. His narrative is already to dismiss any other authority than his own, any other facts than the words from his mouthanus. I can imagine the tweets about the "so-called congress" already.
I'm hoping now that 2018 swings super hard left and the Democrats immediately start impeachment.
Just pick and choose the issue
Based on the last month, assuming half the government hasn't collapsed, or republicans managed to pass comprehensive voter "fraud" reforms that make Jim Crowe era laws look quaint; I would prefer a Dem sweep in 2018 focus on rebuilding the wreckage they would inherit and de-legitimize Trump by actively ignoring him entirely and blocking via legislation every thing he tries to do. Not waste time on a procedural action that only carries as much weight as the person at the receiving end gives it. My biggest question for all the people who are clamoring for impeachment now is: what do you think Trump would do if he were impeached? Say "my bad, laters"? Come on. His narrative is already to dismiss any other authority than his own, any other facts than the words from his mouthanus. I can imagine the tweets about the "so-called congress" already.
He can't do that with actual impeachment. He leaves or he gets dragged out. Moot point mind you since there aren't enough GOPers up for election to convict.
If the Republicans don't independently call for an investigation they should be considered on the take.
This is absolutely nuts that they want to ignore this and sweep it under the rug. This is absolutely fucked.
No the more fucked part is all their followers that don't give two shits
Nah, that's standard for the GOP. That's how authoritarians roll.
The crazy thing is the Republicans with at least one ear out of the bubble, who know better, who are still just playing along.
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AstaerethIn the belly of the beastRegistered Userregular
No, if the Dems take Congress impeachment should be their top 5 priorities. This shit cannot be allowed to stand, and it's vital to the long term survival of the country that we hold Trump responsible for the laws and rules he's broken. Otherwise we simply normalize a political pendulum between persecuted Democratic presidents and criminal Republican presidents who get away with everything. Impeaching Trump is the only way to deter the next Trump (and there will be a next Trump, assuming we get through this one).
The officials said the intercepted communications were not limited to Trump campaign officials, and included other associates of Mr. Trump. On the Russian side, the contacts also included members of the Russian government outside of the intelligence services, the officials said. All of the current and former officials spoke on the condition of anonymity because the continuing investigation is classified.
Would it be easier for the leaks to start saying who Trump knew that didn't have ties with the Russian government?
So is this as fucking incredible as it looks like?
Officials emphasized that communications between campaign staff and representatives of foreign governments are not unusual. However, these communications stood out to investigators due to the frequency and the level of the Trump advisers involved. Investigators have not reached a judgment on the intent of those conversations.
Adding to US investigators' concerns were intercepted communications between Russian officials before and after the election discussing their belief that they had special access to Trump, two law enforcement officials tell CNN. These officials cautioned the Russians could have been exaggerating their access.
Post-election intelligence briefings on Russian meddling in the US elections included details of those communications, which included people involved in Trump's businesses.
The communications were gathered as part of routine US intelligence collection and not because people close to Trump were being targeted.
This is going to result in a lot of "why did the administration bullshit about things it knew were not true" questions that will just result in more lies.
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HedgethornAssociate Professor of Historical Hobby HorsesIn the Lions' DenRegistered Userregular
The officials said the intercepted communications were not limited to Trump campaign officials, and included other associates of Mr. Trump. On the Russian side, the contacts also included members of the Russian government outside of the intelligence services, the officials said. All of the current and former officials spoke on the condition of anonymity because the continuing investigation is classified.
Would it be easier for the leaks to start saying who Trump knew that didn't have ties with the Russian government?
So is this as fucking incredible as it looks like?
There's a lot of smoke billowing around, but no one's found a fire yet. According to CNN and the NY Times, Flynn, Manafort, Carter Page, and Roger Stone were all in correspondence with Russian agents; but both are reporting that US intelligence has not been able to determine the extent or intention of that correspondence.
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AtomikaLive fast and get fucked or whateverRegistered Userregular
Officials emphasized that communications between campaign staff and representatives of foreign governments are not unusual. However, these communications stood out to investigators due to the frequency and the level of the Trump advisers involved. Investigators have not reached a judgment on the intent of those conversations.
Adding to US investigators' concerns were intercepted communications between Russian officials before and after the election discussing their belief that they had special access to Trump, two law enforcement officials tell CNN. These officials cautioned the Russians could have been exaggerating their access.
Post-election intelligence briefings on Russian meddling in the US elections included details of those communications, which included people involved in Trump's businesses.
The communications were gathered as part of routine US intelligence collection and not because people close to Trump were being targeted.
This is going to result in a lot of "why did the administration bullshit about things it knew were not true" questions that will just result in more lies.
Because Trump built his persona upon Bullshit Mountain, and there he will watch it die a bullshit death.
"Yeah, about this guy getting to nominate a justice to SCOTUS before this is sorted out." - Democrats
There needs to be a way that if you can prove that someone in government was colluding with foreign powers in a way found to be illegal or that results in impeachment, that their actions are nullified.
Just to button up one question, did any advisor or anybody in the Trump campaign have any contact with the Russians who were trying to meddle in the election?
Just to button up one question, did any advisor or anybody in the Trump campaign have any contact with the Russians who were trying to meddle in the election?
Of course not. And I think to suggest that is to give credence to some of these bizarre rumors that swirled around the candidacy.
It's honestly 50/50 if Pence is lying here or if they lied to Pence.
whynotboth.gif
Pence isn't a complete imbecile. At least not in the same category as Trump. He's a fucktarded misogynous theocrat who would wreck havoc on rights and liberties and probably get us into the same wars as Trump, just on grounds of actually caring about the bible. But he's also been in the system enough to know how it works, and know when he's being lied to. What is coming out of the white house and intelligence agencies in leaks would be painfully obvious when you were there in the room when conversations are happening, or at the very least able to catch wind from unveiled discussion from what is clearly a bunch of amateurs who believe House of Cards is a documentary.
But he's also separate enough from Trump in the public view that he has to know that even if Trump were taken down from this stuff, he could dodge the bullet of going with him. Obviously that isn't true, in reality, but given how resistant Republicans are now, in the face of all of this information, to go after Trump, when they do they are going to do whatever they can to minimize the damage to try to make it look like it was all Trump, and not one of their own, Pence. We've got to hope that, should proceedings begin against Trump, the floodgates open from leaks and intel agencies that implicate everyone in the administration.
He is generally regarded as a complete imbecile, actually. Dumbest man in Congress and what not.
Living in Utah, I take personal offense at the very notion that anyone is dumber than Chaffetz.
Regardless, I probably worded that poorly.
I just meant that objectively he isn't a blithering baboon. He is definitely an actual idiot, but can at least speak, generally, as a normal human would. Usually. And has at least minimal awareness of reality. Keep in mind I'm comparing him to Trump, not, say...any other human being of at least kindergarten level education.
Though...anyone that refers to their wife as "mother" disturbs the fuck out of me. My wife completely accidentally called me "dad" once and it creeped both of us out for days.
He is generally regarded as a complete imbecile, actually. Dumbest man in Congress and what not.
Living in Utah, I take personal offense at the very notion that anyone is dumber than Chaffetz.
I'm not sure they were ever in Congress at the same time. Pod Save the World crew is trying to get Evan McMullin to go after Chaffetz in the primary, by the way.
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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Waffles or whateverPreviously known as, I shit you not, "Waffen"Registered Userregular
edited February 2017
Problem is though convincing the Republican Majority Congress that this is Treason. They're not about to sabotage their ability to enact Conservative Policy for at least two years through impeachment and crucifying their own party.
Though if we have anyone who was alive during the Nixon era. Has the media gotten to the point where you guys feel that Trump has entered Nixon territory? The evidence of his cabinet being involved with Russian Agents has been proven. We're still in the infancy of connecting the dots. Just a question of when it'll happen.
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This is absolutely nuts that they want to ignore this and sweep it under the rug. This is absolutely fucked.
No the more fucked part is all their followers that don't give two shits
Smoooooooooth.
Oh, you can believe they'll say there should be an investigation. Half heartedly, and when pressed into a corner.
Actually take any action to make an investigation actually happen?
Put anybody on the investigation besides Bob's intern/niece?
Nah.
Just pick and choose the issue
Their followers are probably being told that this is all "fake news" and are furious that a good, upstanding Republican would be booted out of office over lies. In case you forgot, we're in the post-truth era now. Anything that sounds good is truth, and anything that sounds bad is fake news.
Looks like the House is towing the Trump line: Chairman: House intel panel won’t investigate Flynn, will probe leaks
The Senate, not so much: McConnell: Flynn investigation 'highly likely' in Senate committee
Don't assume bad intentions over neglect and misunderstanding.
I'm interested in this. Do you have links or anything?
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
And Trump might have known he was lying.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/post-politics/wp/2017/01/15/mike-pence-denies-contacts-with-russia-during-campaign/ Soooooo when did they learn about it...
At this point they should either stack them together as a sort of massive case of incompetence/Corruption or instead flood the dockets with dozens of impeachment discussions.
I'll believe it when the trial begins and not a moment sooner.
I can believe he'd do so of his own volition in that maybe Flynn is himself a source for contact between Trump and the Russians. As in Flynn is heavily influenced by the Russians up to even in bed with them and he then uses his position to push Trump towards policies he wants.
Apologies, it was July.
Based on the last month, assuming half the government hasn't collapsed, or republicans managed to pass comprehensive voter "fraud" reforms that make Jim Crowe era laws look quaint; I would prefer a Dem sweep in 2018 focus on rebuilding the wreckage they would inherit and de-legitimize Trump by actively ignoring him entirely and blocking via legislation every thing he tries to do. Not waste time on a procedural action that only carries as much weight as the person at the receiving end gives it. My biggest question for all the people who are clamoring for impeachment now is: what do you think Trump would do if he were impeached? Say "my bad, laters"? Come on. His narrative is already to dismiss any other authority than his own, any other facts than the words from his mouthanus. I can imagine the tweets about the "so-called congress" already.
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
He can't do that with actual impeachment. He leaves or he gets dragged out. Moot point mind you since there aren't enough GOPers up for election to convict.
Nah, that's standard for the GOP. That's how authoritarians roll.
The crazy thing is the Republicans with at least one ear out of the bubble, who know better, who are still just playing along.
pleasepaypreacher.net
So is this as fucking incredible as it looks like?
There's a lot of smoke billowing around, but no one's found a fire yet. According to CNN and the NY Times, Flynn, Manafort, Carter Page, and Roger Stone were all in correspondence with Russian agents; but both are reporting that US intelligence has not been able to determine the extent or intention of that correspondence.
Because Trump built his persona upon Bullshit Mountain, and there he will watch it die a bullshit death.
There needs to be a way that if you can prove that someone in government was colluding with foreign powers in a way found to be illegal or that results in impeachment, that their actions are nullified.
It's honestly 50/50 if Pence is lying here or if they lied to Pence.
A Mulligan election would be nicer.
It'll be interesting. Clearly the the FBI is willing to rig presidential elections. Let's see how the other agencies do.
whynotboth.gif
Pence isn't a complete imbecile. At least not in the same category as Trump. He's a fucktarded misogynous theocrat who would wreck havoc on rights and liberties and probably get us into the same wars as Trump, just on grounds of actually caring about the bible. But he's also been in the system enough to know how it works, and know when he's being lied to. What is coming out of the white house and intelligence agencies in leaks would be painfully obvious when you were there in the room when conversations are happening, or at the very least able to catch wind from unveiled discussion from what is clearly a bunch of amateurs who believe House of Cards is a documentary.
But he's also separate enough from Trump in the public view that he has to know that even if Trump were taken down from this stuff, he could dodge the bullet of going with him. Obviously that isn't true, in reality, but given how resistant Republicans are now, in the face of all of this information, to go after Trump, when they do they are going to do whatever they can to minimize the damage to try to make it look like it was all Trump, and not one of their own, Pence. We've got to hope that, should proceedings begin against Trump, the floodgates open from leaks and intel agencies that implicate everyone in the administration.
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
Living in Utah, I take personal offense at the very notion that anyone is dumber than Chaffetz.
Regardless, I probably worded that poorly.
I just meant that objectively he isn't a blithering baboon. He is definitely an actual idiot, but can at least speak, generally, as a normal human would. Usually. And has at least minimal awareness of reality. Keep in mind I'm comparing him to Trump, not, say...any other human being of at least kindergarten level education.
Though...anyone that refers to their wife as "mother" disturbs the fuck out of me. My wife completely accidentally called me "dad" once and it creeped both of us out for days.
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
is it fair to say this might be shit hitting the fan terrritory?
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/02/14/us/politics/russia-intelligence-communications-trump.html
Like, this is legit?
The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
I thought it would be a LEAST over a month before we learned something that had a legitimate chance of ending his presidency.
We're skirting really damn close to Treason with a capital T territory here.
The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
I'm not sure they were ever in Congress at the same time. Pod Save the World crew is trying to get Evan McMullin to go after Chaffetz in the primary, by the way.
Though if we have anyone who was alive during the Nixon era. Has the media gotten to the point where you guys feel that Trump has entered Nixon territory? The evidence of his cabinet being involved with Russian Agents has been proven. We're still in the infancy of connecting the dots. Just a question of when it'll happen.
Edit: is this thread appropriate?