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Non-Russia related Corruption/Grift/Ethics Violations in the [Trump] Administration

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    SleepSleep Registered User regular
    Couscous wrote: »

    "Particularly of your own party" is very much saying the quiet part out loud.

    Ooh there's the blind rage I've been searching for

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    MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    Though Flynn Gate sounds like something about Glee.

    Or a series of 80s science-fantasy novellas.

    There's no plan, there's no race to be run
    The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
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    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    Recall Rand is a guy that said he only voted for Sessions because democrats called him a racist. His opinion on literally anything should be run through that filter.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
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    HedgethornHedgethorn Associate Professor of Historical Hobby Horses In the Lions' DenRegistered User regular
    Preacher wrote: »
    tbloxham wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    Atomika wrote: »
    GOP is going to blow this chance to get rid of Trump while coming out clean

    They could line up behind Cornyn or Graham, get the FBI and CIA info on Trump, and have him and his team out of office in short order for anything from Logan Act violations to breaking the Emolument Clause to possibly treason.

    And they would still be in power, with Pence and Ryan calling the shots and some semblance of normalcy restored.



    But!

    I bet they whiff.

    Don't even come up to the plate.

    They hope this blows over, or some other not treasonous trump bullshit becomes the real story. And they aren't necessarily wrong.

    But why? Their base may be all about all kinds of evil social issues crap, but they aren't. They don't give a monkeys. They just want more business first/go rich people stuff. Noone loves business first stuff more than Ryan. If they impeach Trump and Pence, and get Ryan in, then it gives them far more opportunity to get their work done with the Democrats happily snoozing away.

    Because Trump is what their hard core voting base want. If they impeach him for liberal reasons (read anything at all) than their base turns on them and they lose elections to the Dave Brats of the world.

    Elected Republicans remember well that Paul Ryan's approval rating among Republicans fell about 30 points in a week when he didn't defend Trump after the pussy tape.

    They can't turn on Trump until their base turns on Trump. Which requires an extremely public and blatant scandal that bears no evidence of being brought to light by the Republican Congress.

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    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    Hedgethorn wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    tbloxham wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    Atomika wrote: »
    GOP is going to blow this chance to get rid of Trump while coming out clean

    They could line up behind Cornyn or Graham, get the FBI and CIA info on Trump, and have him and his team out of office in short order for anything from Logan Act violations to breaking the Emolument Clause to possibly treason.

    And they would still be in power, with Pence and Ryan calling the shots and some semblance of normalcy restored.



    But!

    I bet they whiff.

    Don't even come up to the plate.

    They hope this blows over, or some other not treasonous trump bullshit becomes the real story. And they aren't necessarily wrong.

    But why? Their base may be all about all kinds of evil social issues crap, but they aren't. They don't give a monkeys. They just want more business first/go rich people stuff. Noone loves business first stuff more than Ryan. If they impeach Trump and Pence, and get Ryan in, then it gives them far more opportunity to get their work done with the Democrats happily snoozing away.

    Because Trump is what their hard core voting base want. If they impeach him for liberal reasons (read anything at all) than their base turns on them and they lose elections to the Dave Brats of the world.

    Elected Republicans remember well that Paul Ryan's approval rating among Republicans fell about 30 points in a week when he didn't defend Trump after the pussy tape.

    They can't turn on Trump until their base turns on Trump. Which requires an extremely public and blatant scandal that bears no evidence of being brought to light by the Republican Congress.

    Even fucking then, he admitted he sexually assaults women and gets away with it because he's famous and he still got elected. There is literally nothing Trump can do that would dissuade the GOP base from voting for him save becoming an actual democrat.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
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    enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    He could sign a new version of the Voting Rights Act... I mean, theoretically.

    Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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    So It GoesSo It Goes We keep moving...Registered User regular
    1. We are going a little afield of the OP topic (I know, it's kind a huge topic with this administration, but still)
    2. Please direct Flynn stuff to the Cabinet thread or Russia thread so it doesn't overwhelm all the threads.


    Thanks!

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    The EnderThe Ender Registered User regular
    Atomika wrote: »
    GOP is going to blow this chance to get rid of Trump while coming out clean

    They could line up behind Cornyn or Graham, get the FBI and CIA info on Trump, and have him and his team out of office in short order for anything from Logan Act violations to breaking the Emolument Clause to possibly treason.

    And they would still be in power, with Pence and Ryan calling the shots and some semblance of normalcy restored.



    But!

    I bet they whiff.

    I was thinking Trump getting caught here and/or being blown out of the water in court might shorten the shelf life of his Presidency.


    But then I considered... if you're in Ryan's position, Trump basking in corruption while implementing both your own policy goals as well as his pants-on-head crazy projects that you don't care about gives you what you want while also providing a layer of plausible deniability. 'Not my fault things wen down the shitter - you crazy plebs voted-in the clown! Next time, don't vote in the clown!'

    If they take the governorship and it turns out they're terrible governors in their own right, 4-8 years of cut programs & economic cave-in are blamed on them. There's not anyone else to finger for the end result. If they let Trump run the ship aground, they can simply distance themselves from him the same way they did with GWB, blame the corruption instead of the fundamental policy objectives and hope that this time around the contrast between the old guard srs bsns white guys vs the Breitbart crowd is sufficient that the voters don't lump one in with the other.

    With Love and Courage
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    OghulkOghulk Tinychat Janitor TinychatRegistered User regular
    Gotta say

    if Flynn ends up going to jail for lying to FBI investigators and violating the enoulments clause

    I'll believe in karma

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    Mr KhanMr Khan Not Everyone WAHHHRegistered User regular
    edited February 2017
    Damnit, always coming late to these tangents.

    Mr Khan on
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    Knight_Knight_ Dead Dead Dead Registered User regular
    edited February 2017
    As usually happens, I kinda have to turn my brain off when reading quotes from people like Chaffez and Ryan.

    But that Ryan quote about investigations is maybe as close as I've ever been to just screaming at the ceiling of my office. Like, I could make a pithy comment, or even break down how stupid it is, but what's the point. The Oversight committee has become a political body to attack democrats with, and that is all.

    The intelligence community lifers leaking more information to force a watergate like journalism attack is pretty much the only way we're going to get any movement on the corruption in the white house in the next 4 years, and that's terrifying.

    edit: My mistake, it was Rand Paul and not Paul Ryan in that quote. I get my objectivists backwards sometimes I suppose.

    Knight_ on
    aeNqQM9.jpg
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    Commander ZoomCommander Zoom Registered User regular
    edited February 2017
    Preacher wrote: »
    Hedgethorn wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    tbloxham wrote: »
    Preacher wrote: »
    Atomika wrote: »
    GOP is going to blow this chance to get rid of Trump while coming out clean

    They could line up behind Cornyn or Graham, get the FBI and CIA info on Trump, and have him and his team out of office in short order for anything from Logan Act violations to breaking the Emolument Clause to possibly treason.

    And they would still be in power, with Pence and Ryan calling the shots and some semblance of normalcy restored.



    But!

    I bet they whiff.

    Don't even come up to the plate.

    They hope this blows over, or some other not treasonous trump bullshit becomes the real story. And they aren't necessarily wrong.

    But why? Their base may be all about all kinds of evil social issues crap, but they aren't. They don't give a monkeys. They just want more business first/go rich people stuff. Noone loves business first stuff more than Ryan. If they impeach Trump and Pence, and get Ryan in, then it gives them far more opportunity to get their work done with the Democrats happily snoozing away.

    Because Trump is what their hard core voting base want. If they impeach him for liberal reasons (read anything at all) than their base turns on them and they lose elections to the Dave Brats of the world.

    Elected Republicans remember well that Paul Ryan's approval rating among Republicans fell about 30 points in a week when he didn't defend Trump after the pussy tape.

    They can't turn on Trump until their base turns on Trump. Which requires an extremely public and blatant scandal that bears no evidence of being brought to light by the Republican Congress.

    Even fucking then, he admitted he sexually assaults women and gets away with it because he's famous and he still got elected. There is literally nothing Trump can do that would dissuade the GOP base from voting for him save becoming an actual democrat.

    Yeah, they're never gonna turn on him because, essentially, he is them. He's the man they would be, wish they were, if they finally won the lottery and/or had been born rich, like they all know they deserve.
    He is the loud, crass guy camped out on his regular stool in every small-town pub, making clumsy passes at the barmaid and telling anyone who'll listen how it's someone else's fault. Everybody's racist, sexist uncle. The American id made manifest. He can do and say and think whatever he likes, and no one can tell him "no" or "that's not politically correct"; he's living their dream.

    Of course he cheats on his taxes and is always looking out for himself; that's "smart." Of course he's gonna put his own buddies in power; that's how it goes in every little town where if the mayor isn't also the sheriff, they're brothers (in law).

    Hell, as long as he can tell a halfway convincing lie about it and other people seem to be getting it worse, they won't even mind too much if he shits on the poor, because that's what they'd do if they were not-poor.

    Commander Zoom on
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    ZephiranZephiran Registered User regular
    Gonna feel a bit sad about no longer having Flynn around, you don't get clowns that funny and openly incompetent all that often.

    But I guess this administration abounds with them anyway, I have faith it will probably find some nice hellhole from which to exhume another similarly decrepit ghoul.

    Alright and in this next scene all the animals have AIDS.

    I got a little excited when I saw your ship.
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    skippydumptruckskippydumptruck begin again Registered User regular
    Atomika wrote: »
    GOP is going to blow this chance to get rid of Trump while coming out clean

    They could line up behind Cornyn or Graham, get the FBI and CIA info on Trump, and have him and his team out of office in short order for anything from Logan Act violations to breaking the Emolument Clause to possibly treason.

    And they would still be in power, with Pence and Ryan calling the shots and some semblance of normalcy restored.



    But!

    I bet they whiff.

    I have no idea what trump voters think

    but I think the gop lawmakers are going to have to be backed into a pretty hard corner to consider impeaching, as they view him as a ready pen
    “Conservatives do and should view him as their current best chance to get conservative policy enacted into law because that was the grand bargain made,” said Rory Cooper, a Republican strategist who opposed Trump’s candidacy for president. “The idea was they would overlook certain behaviors and distractions from President Trump in anticipation of being able to have a willing signature on the other end of conservative legislation.”

    Rep. Mark Meadows (R-N.C.), chairman of the Freedom Caucus, a conservative group of House members, put it this way: “I would rather accomplish something with distractions than not accomplish anything with smooth sailing.”

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/powerpost/as-trump-stumbles-hill-republicans-find-it-harder-to-defend-him/2017/02/14/767beb2a-f29f-11e6-a9b0-ecee7ce475fc_story.html

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    Panda4YouPanda4You Registered User regular
    Oghulk wrote: »
    Gotta say

    if Flynn ends up going to jail for lying to FBI investigators and violating the enoulments clause

    I'll believe in karma
    Ahahaha, in this timeline? America will never touch a hair on his head. :wink: The emperor wills it.

    Someone said that Putin might do something peculiar though, in order to make an example of him for being such an obvious fuckup and putting a careful scheme under notice? But even that's pretty damn unlikely. I mean, even if federal food regulations will be but a memory in a few years, we'll still have to wait a little while to see polonium brought to industrial usage in sarnie toppings?

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    Santa ClaustrophobiaSanta Claustrophobia Ho Ho Ho Disconnecting from Xbox LIVERegistered User regular
    So It Goes wrote: »
    1. We are going a little afield of the OP topic (I know, it's kind a huge topic with this administration, but still)
    2. Please direct Flynn stuff to the Cabinet thread or Russia thread so it doesn't overwhelm all the threads.


    Thanks!

    Elki says Flynn stuff is Russia only, now.

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    So It GoesSo It Goes We keep moving...Registered User regular
    edited February 2017
    So It Goes wrote: »
    1. We are going a little afield of the OP topic (I know, it's kind a huge topic with this administration, but still)
    2. Please direct Flynn stuff to the Cabinet thread or Russia thread so it doesn't overwhelm all the threads.


    Thanks!

    Elki says Flynn stuff is Russia only, now.

    Alrighty then. No further Flynn posts or responses here please.

    Go to this thread to discuss it http://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/209074/russia-the-musical

    So It Goes on
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    shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Couscous wrote: »

    "Particularly of your own party" is very much saying the quiet part out loud.

    Perhaps they have just genuinely forgotten that investigations are meant to have the appearance of being in the pursuit of truth and/or justice.

    Nah, he just knows he doesn't have to give a shit anymore.

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    DiannaoChongDiannaoChong Registered User regular
    edited February 2017
    edit: whoops missed the mod message.

    DiannaoChong on
    steam_sig.png
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    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    Sleep wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »

    "Particularly of your own party" is very much saying the quiet part out loud.

    Ooh there's the blind rage I've been searching for

    I strangely agree with Rand Paul, if there was an investigation every time a republican did something wrong, literally nothing else would ever get done.

    Eventually, one would run out of Republicans to investigate, don't you think?

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    enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Sleep wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »

    "Particularly of your own party" is very much saying the quiet part out loud.

    Ooh there's the blind rage I've been searching for

    I strangely agree with Rand Paul, if there was an investigation every time a republican did something wrong, literally nothing else would ever get done.

    Eventually, one would run out of Republicans to investigate, don't you think?

    Their voters do not give a shit about ethics.

    Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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    M-VickersM-Vickers Registered User regular
    Dedwrekka wrote: »
    TryCatcher wrote: »
    If Flynn had told Pence the truth on the first place he would still have his job.

    That's...a generous reading of the situation.

    Another is that it was leaking out that Flynn was kompromised and the White House couldn't maintain even a whiff of distance from him anymore, so they let him go in order to maintain distance and try to head of investigation into how much the White House knew.
    Which they undermined almost immediately.




    Both Donald and Kellyanne's responses to this makes it pretty clear that when the DOJ told them about him being compromised that they already knew. Kellyanne's comments about the White House still having confidence in Flynn after being warned by the DOJ make sense if the White House already knew about the contents of the phone calls. They all knew already and continued to lie about them, but once the phone calls were leaked the White House claimed that they were lied to by Flynn.

    In that video, Kellyanne looks like a woman who has been getting by on four hours sleep a night for quite a while.

    I can only imagine how stressful her job is. Before Trump was elected, her job was to go on talk shows and try to turn Trumps word salad into English. Now they've actually got policies and scandals to answer to, which she has to spin so they're not a bunch of lying, corrupt shitbags, she looks like she's praying for 8 hours of peace so she can collapse somewhere.

    3 years and 49 weeks to go !

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    SleepSleep Registered User regular
    While right, the conclusions he draws from that, that we just shouldn't do the investigations, is totally fucking idiotic.

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    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    Sleep wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »

    "Particularly of your own party" is very much saying the quiet part out loud.

    Ooh there's the blind rage I've been searching for

    I strangely agree with Rand Paul, if there was an investigation every time a republican did something wrong, literally nothing else would ever get done.

    Eventually, one would run out of Republicans to investigate, don't you think?

    Their voters do not give a shit about ethics.

    My statement was under the implication that investigations would necessarily lead to consequences for those who violated rules.

    Which is, of course, too much to ask for these days.

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    fightinfilipinofightinfilipino Angry as Hell #BLMRegistered User regular
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    XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular

    fancy way of saying we can't do anything, but .... I'm sure you can take care of it because we don't even have enough teeth to say what would happen if you didn't 'discipline' her (it would be nothing)

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    The EnderThe Ender Registered User regular


    giphy.gif


    It is too perfect. The shameless nepotism, the embrace of tokenism over real progress, the use of that office for product placement, the suggestion that strictly aesthetic photo ops are the equivalent of real political business...


    I would print & frame this tweet that is so much a microcosm of politics to come if I could.

    With Love and Courage
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    ForarForar #432 Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    edited February 2017
    Plus, hey, a woman behind the desk. Unlike, say, his former opponent who won't be sitting back there.

    Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but Trump is petty enough that a photo op with his daughter in the big chair feels like the kind of thing he'd find appealing as a shot at Clinton.

    Forar on
    First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
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    monikermoniker Registered User regular
    The Ender wrote: »



    It is too perfect. The shameless nepotism, the embrace of tokenism over real progress, the use of that office for product placement, the suggestion that strictly aesthetic photo ops are the equivalent of real political business...


    I would print & frame this tweet that is so much a microcosm of politics to come if I could.

    ...she literally doesn't have a title or office to give her a seat at any table.

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    Commander ZoomCommander Zoom Registered User regular
    moniker wrote: »
    The Ender wrote: »



    It is too perfect. The shameless nepotism, the embrace of tokenism over real progress, the use of that office for product placement, the suggestion that strictly aesthetic photo ops are the equivalent of real political business...


    I would print & frame this tweet that is so much a microcosm of politics to come if I could.

    ...she literally doesn't have a title or office to give her a seat at any table.

    "Princess Ivanka".

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    MuddBuddMuddBudd Registered User regular
    moniker wrote: »
    The Ender wrote: »



    It is too perfect. The shameless nepotism, the embrace of tokenism over real progress, the use of that office for product placement, the suggestion that strictly aesthetic photo ops are the equivalent of real political business...


    I would print & frame this tweet that is so much a microcosm of politics to come if I could.

    ...she literally doesn't have a title or office to give her a seat at any table.

    I'm sure in short order she'll have a line of Ivanka brand office tables.

    There's no plan, there's no race to be run
    The harder the rain, honey, the sweeter the sun.
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    The EnderThe Ender Registered User regular
    The tokenism, while tangential, is just fucking phenomenal. Mind blowing.

    'HEY WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE IMPORTANCE OF WOMEN BEING BEHIND A DESK! ~TEE HEE HEE!~'


    Not a woman who can actually shape the world or anything, of course. Not a woman with any actual power (other than the power to kind of sadly hawk her fashion products).


    More on point, though, is the fact those earrings so prominently on display are from her own damn fashion line. Probably the top as well, though honestly it's just some generic black top so it's not as egregious as the jewelry.

    With Love and Courage
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    Metzger MeisterMetzger Meister It Gets Worse before it gets any better.Registered User regular
    So, assuming that grounds for impeachment are found, and assuming that the case proceeds to the point where impeachment actually happens, there needs to be a 2/3rds majority vote to actually remove the president from office, which hasn't happened yet in either case of impeachment in the history of the US.

    Anyway, assuming all this happens, what the hell happens next? I'm sorry if this isn't an appropriate question for the thread but I'm super curious.

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    The EnderThe Ender Registered User regular
    So, assuming that grounds for impeachment are found, and assuming that the case proceeds to the point where impeachment actually happens, there needs to be a 2/3rds majority vote to actually remove the president from office, which hasn't happened yet in either case of impeachment in the history of the US.

    Anyway, assuming all this happens, what the hell happens next? I'm sorry if this isn't an appropriate question for the thread but I'm super curious.

    Tangential:
    You move down the line of succession, same as with any other circumstance where the President is taken out of the picture.

    So, Pence is up next, followed by Ryan.

    With Love and Courage
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    wazillawazilla Having a late dinner Registered User regular
    I mean, Ivanka is realistically one of the most powerful women in the world right now regardless of official title or position...

    Psn:wazukki
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    The EnderThe Ender Registered User regular
    edited February 2017
    wazilla wrote: »
    I mean, Ivanka is realistically one of the most powerful women in the world right now regardless of official title or position...

    Tangential:
    Yes she is. I mean, Merkel is more powerful in real terms - but certainly, Ivanka belongs on a Top 5 or Top 10 list in that category.


    ...But think about what that says about what it means to be even one of the most powerful women in the world. One of the world's most powerful women is just the daughter of a world leader, with no position, no authority, no office, no ability to create or change laws. Just a stereotypically feminine business that she leverages her position to increase the footprint of.

    She's one of the most powerful women in the world... and she has almost zero actual power.

    The Ender on
    With Love and Courage
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    wazillawazilla Having a late dinner Registered User regular
    I'm not sure it's tangential as it is directly a result of grossly unethical nepotism

    Psn:wazukki
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    Desktop HippieDesktop Hippie Registered User regular
    The Ender wrote: »
    The tokenism, while tangential, is just fucking phenomenal. Mind blowing.

    'HEY WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE IMPORTANCE OF WOMEN BEING BEHIND A DESK! ~TEE HEE HEE!~'


    Not a woman who can actually shape the world or anything, of course. Not a woman with any actual power (other than the power to kind of sadly hawk her fashion products).


    More on point, though, is the fact those earrings so prominently on display are from her own damn fashion line. Probably the top as well, though honestly it's just some generic black top so it's not as egregious as the jewelry.

    You know I don't think it's actually been mentioned in this thread given we all have a hard enough time keeping up with the grift, theft and ethics violations committed by her father and his staff, but it's worth noting that many of Ivanka's "designs" are in fact stolen from other designers.

    A quick Google will bring up more than enough examples of this. She's pretty notorious for it by now.

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    HakkekageHakkekage Space Whore Academy summa cum laudeRegistered User regular
    The Ender wrote: »
    The tokenism, while tangential, is just fucking phenomenal. Mind blowing.

    'HEY WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE IMPORTANCE OF WOMEN BEING BEHIND A DESK! ~TEE HEE HEE!~'


    Not a woman who can actually shape the world or anything, of course. Not a woman with any actual power (other than the power to kind of sadly hawk her fashion products).


    More on point, though, is the fact those earrings so prominently on display are from her own damn fashion line. Probably the top as well, though honestly it's just some generic black top so it's not as egregious as the jewelry.

    You know I don't think it's actually been mentioned in this thread given we all have a hard enough time keeping up with the grift, theft and ethics violations committed by her father and his staff, but it's worth noting that many of Ivanka's "designs" are in fact stolen from other designers.

    A quick Google will bring up more than enough examples of this. She's pretty notorious for it by now.

    Omg...wait...*digs through Imgur*

    OMG

    so apparently 11 months ago is when I was in Marshalls and snapped a shot of these two identical dresses that were the same in every way except for the fabric and branding. One of them--the black one--was branded Ivanka Trump but literally everything about the design was the same as the white one by Carmen (not familiar with this line). I took a pic and posted it in chat at the time cause I thought that was weird!

    iwEmuXml.jpg

    3DS: 2165 - 6538 - 3417
    NNID: Hakkekage
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    I ZimbraI Zimbra Worst song, played on ugliest guitar Registered User regular


    I just can't believe this crack team of trust fund fuckups, third-tier political hacks, and racist webmasters is losing their fight with the US intelligence apparatus.

This discussion has been closed.