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The Battle Over Voting Rights (also Gerrymandering)

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  • jothkijothki Registered User regular
    It's the kind of thing that would be useful to know and would be mostly harmless if the government wasn't being run by modern Republicans.

    Gnome-Interruptus
  • VeeveeVeevee WisconsinRegistered User regular
    edited January 15
    chrisnl wrote: »
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    So what happens if they just... put the question on the census anyway?

    In this all too likely scenario, then the courts probably rule that people cannot be punished for not answering the question. This, of course, would do very little because the people most likely impacted by such a question are unlikely to be informed that the question is not mandatory, and would be likely to just not fill out the form instead of risking deportation or imprisonment, resulting in them not being counted and accomplishing the primary goal of the question.

    No one is required to answer even a single census question and there is no penalty for not answering any question, but if you don't answer then the census taker will make their best guest as to the make up of a residence. Edit: The worker was supposed to ask neighbors and could even go as far as staking out the place to come up with their best guess so that it wasn't a random guess, but I also had no real way of verifying the information the census worker turned in. Technically, once the form was submitted it was illegal for me to even approach the household again. I was told there was a group that made random follow up phone calls to verify the information, so at least there was that.

    That is what I was instructed to tell my census crew when I worked the 2010 Census, and I doubt the 2020 will be different in that respect.

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  • MillMill Registered User regular
    I'm wondering how much of a movement there will be to leave the citizenship question blank and not help census workers figure it out. I mean if one forms soon and organizes well enough, they could in theory render the question useless and likely created a scenario that fucks over red districts and states that have a sizable population of undocumented non-citizens.

    As for myself, if this shitty thing ends up on the census. I'm going to refuse to fill it out and encourage my roommates to do the same.

  • MayabirdMayabird Pecking at the keyboardRegistered User regular
    New York state should soon be seeing some major voting reforms, such as allowing early voting (including two full weekends), allowing 16 and 17 year olds to pre-register so they'll be automatically registered at 18, and holding federal and state primaries on the same day. No Republican state senate to stop it now. There's also a bill introduced for automatic voter registration, but that might take longer to pass if it does (though it should.)

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  • DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    Mayabird wrote: »
    New York state should soon be seeing some major voting reforms, such as allowing early voting (including two full weekends), allowing 16 and 17 year olds to pre-register so they'll be automatically registered at 18, and holding federal and state primaries on the same day. No Republican state senate to stop it now. There's also a bill introduced for automatic voter registration, but that might take longer to pass if it does (though it should.)

    I wanted more permissive early voting than that but it's a solid start. You also skipped the no reason absentee ballot thing. Currently you have to swear to be out of your county for the entire day to get an absentee.

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  • monikermoniker Registered User regular
    Mayabird wrote: »
    New York state should soon be seeing some major voting reforms, such as allowing early voting (including two full weekends), allowing 16 and 17 year olds to pre-register so they'll be automatically registered at 18, and holding federal and state primaries on the same day. No Republican state senate to stop it now. There's also a bill introduced for automatic voter registration, but that might take longer to pass if it does (though it should.)

    Good. There is no reason the Northeast is as terrible as it is to vote in.

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  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    So what happens if they just... put the question on the census anyway?

    Getting a question on the census doesn't happen overnight. There's a lot of like physical work to do to get censuses made and such. I imagine what happens is they try and then the court stamps on their dick before anything even starts going to the printers.

    moniker
  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    I know it says Cuomo plans on signing it, but I don't trust that bastard til he puts pen to paper.

    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
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  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. 5386-8443-8937Registered User regular
    Finally, god that was an embarrassment.

    Cauld
  • DevoutlyApatheticDevoutlyApathetic Registered User regular
    I know it says Cuomo plans on signing it, but I don't trust that bastard til he puts pen to paper.

    No, no, no. Didn't you hear? He's a Progressive now. The most progressive. Super progressive. Ultra progressive in no way linked to his desperate desire to be President.

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  • VargVarg Registered User regular
    Cuomo has always been a calculating opportunist but thankfully we finally have a significant Democratic majority in the Senate and got rid of most of the IDC in primaries. The legislature also passed the gender equality act that has been DOA in the senate for well over a decade and a ban on conversion therapy. Amazing what New York can get done in a day when we finally got over the Republican gerrymander.

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  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Varg wrote: »
    Cuomo has always been a calculating opportunist but thankfully we finally have a significant Democratic majority in the Senate and got rid of most of the IDC in primaries. The legislature also passed the gender equality act that has been DOA in the senate for well over a decade and a ban on conversion therapy. Amazing what New York can get done in a day when we finally got over the Republican gerrymander.

    I mean... he kinda helped create the IDC.

    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
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  • Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. 5386-8443-8937Registered User regular
    Yeah Cuomo was as big a problem as anyone else, he just lost a lot of power.

  • VargVarg Registered User regular
    He helped perpetuate the power grab and I am not disagreeing that he preferred a state of deadlock and politics as usual in Albany. I'm not seeing how calculating opportunist is considered a flattering description?

    I am saying that there are enough Democrats in the legislative body and having Trump in office that he saw the writing on the wall and a new strategy emerged. When it was Obama, it was all about how 'gosh, Democrats won't reach across the aisle to just work with Republicans, but look at me, Andrew Cuomo, I not only work with Republicans but we have a greaaaat working relationship in the NY Senate!' and now that Trump is in office, it's 'Fight the power! Protect New Yorkers! Look we passed GENDA after 17 years! That was me, Cuomo!'.

    Things that needed to get done are getting done thanks to voters putting in a good sized democratic majority and getting rid of IDC members in primaries. Voters did a great job and just because Cuomo will take credit, we shouldn't discount that New Yorkers turned out to get this done and the Democrats are delivering rather than letting things languish.

    I prefer this version of Cuomo but I certainly won't forget what he did in general to keep the IDC going. I vote Working Families line almost all the time and Cuomo went around threatening liberal groups over listing their own governor candidates the last time he was up for election and I most definitely did not appreciate the strong arm tactics he employs in general. I think that shows in the fact that he gets primary challengers and I wish we got one that stood a chance to beat him.

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  • AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    NC Judge: No certification for you!
    A judge in North Carolina ruled on Tuesday that he would not order the executive director of the state elections board to certify Republican Mark Harris as the winner of the disputed U.S. House in the state's 9th Congressional District.

    During a Tuesday hearing in Raleigh, Wake County Superior Court Judge Paul Ridgeway heard arguments from lawyers of Harris and Democrat Dan McCready about the Republican's lawsuit which sought to have him certified as the winner despite an ongoing investigation into alleged elections fraud.

    "Certification is not appropriate until the investigation is concluded," Ridgeway said when delivering his ruling.

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  • AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    So, remember when a judge ordered now former Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach to attend continuing law education because he had no idea how to behave in court?

    Yeah, he was so corrupt that he paid for the course with state funds:
    Former Secretary of State Kris Kobach used state funds to pay for continuing law education ordered by a federal court judge for his performance in a voter rights trial last year.

    Kobach notified the court last week he had completed a six-hour course on civil trial basics through the National Business Institute.

    Katie Koupal, spokeswoman for the secretary of state’s office, confirmed Kobach made the $359 payment for the audio version of the class through the office.

    Previously, Kobach paid a $1,000 fine for misleading the federal court with a state-issued card left behind by an employee who was deployed to Ukraine with the Oklahoma Army National Guard.

    What a thoroughly corrupt goose.

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  • Captain InertiaCaptain Inertia Registered User regular
    edited January 23
    So, remember when a judge ordered now former Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach to attend continuing law education because he had no idea how to behave in court?

    Yeah, he was so corrupt that he paid for the course with state funds:
    Former Secretary of State Kris Kobach used state funds to pay for continuing law education ordered by a federal court judge for his performance in a voter rights trial last year.

    Kobach notified the court last week he had completed a six-hour course on civil trial basics through the National Business Institute.

    Katie Koupal, spokeswoman for the secretary of state’s office, confirmed Kobach made the $359 payment for the audio version of the class through the office.

    Previously, Kobach paid a $1,000 fine for misleading the federal court with a state-issued card left behind by an employee who was deployed to Ukraine with the Oklahoma Army National Guard.

    What a thoroughly corrupt goose.

    He’s unemployed now. He was only 2 for 4 in elections as a Republican in Kansas in his polical career.

    Thoroughly corrupt and so bad he lost to Democrats 50% of his runs in Kansas

    Captain Inertia on
  • SyphonBlueSyphonBlue Registered User regular
    So, remember when a judge ordered now former Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach to attend continuing law education because he had no idea how to behave in court?

    Yeah, he was so corrupt that he paid for the course with state funds:
    Former Secretary of State Kris Kobach used state funds to pay for continuing law education ordered by a federal court judge for his performance in a voter rights trial last year.

    Kobach notified the court last week he had completed a six-hour course on civil trial basics through the National Business Institute.

    Katie Koupal, spokeswoman for the secretary of state’s office, confirmed Kobach made the $359 payment for the audio version of the class through the office.

    Previously, Kobach paid a $1,000 fine for misleading the federal court with a state-issued card left behind by an employee who was deployed to Ukraine with the Oklahoma Army National Guard.

    What a thoroughly corrupt goose.

    He’s unemployed now. He was only 2 for 4 in elections as a Republican in Kansas in his polical career.

    Thoroughly corrupt and so bad he lost to Democrats 50% of his runs in Kansas

    He should be in jail

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  • DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    I'm sorry but... what was the Oklahoma Army National Guard doing being deployed in Ukraine?

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  • ArbitraryDescriptorArbitraryDescriptor Registered User regular
    edited January 23
    So, remember when a judge ordered now former Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach to attend continuing law education because he had no idea how to behave in court?

    Yeah, he was so corrupt that he paid for the course with state funds:
    Former Secretary of State Kris Kobach used state funds to pay for continuing law education ordered by a federal court judge for his performance in a voter rights trial last year.

    Kobach notified the court last week he had completed a six-hour course on civil trial basics through the National Business Institute.

    Katie Koupal, spokeswoman for the secretary of state’s office, confirmed Kobach made the $359 payment for the audio version of the class through the office.

    Previously, Kobach paid a $1,000 fine for misleading the federal court with a state-issued card left behind by an employee who was deployed to Ukraine with the Oklahoma Army National Guard.

    What a thoroughly corrupt goose.

    To be fair, it would seem to be in the state's financial interest to ensure that their then-current AG understood civil trial basics.

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  • FoefallerFoefaller Registered User regular
    So, remember when a judge ordered now former Kansas Secretary of State Kris Kobach to attend continuing law education because he had no idea how to behave in court?

    Yeah, he was so corrupt that he paid for the course with state funds:
    Former Secretary of State Kris Kobach used state funds to pay for continuing law education ordered by a federal court judge for his performance in a voter rights trial last year.

    Kobach notified the court last week he had completed a six-hour course on civil trial basics through the National Business Institute.

    Katie Koupal, spokeswoman for the secretary of state’s office, confirmed Kobach made the $359 payment for the audio version of the class through the office.

    Previously, Kobach paid a $1,000 fine for misleading the federal court with a state-issued card left behind by an employee who was deployed to Ukraine with the Oklahoma Army National Guard.

    What a thoroughly corrupt goose.

    To be fair, it would seem to be in the state's financial interest to ensure that their then-current AG understood civil trial basics.

    Think the better course is to make sure the next/current SoS doesn't have his head so far up his ass that he thinks he can represent himself in court.

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  • AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    More good news from NC - the Republican Chief Justice has resigned:
    North Carolina Chief Justice Mark Martin said Friday he’s leaving the state’s Supreme Court after 20 years to become a Virginia law school dean.

    The resignation means Democratic Gov. Roy Cooper gets to decide who fills the Republican’s seat on the court and who the next chief justice will be. Five of the seven current Supreme Court members are registered Democrats.

    Martin told The Associated Press of his decision to resign the chief justice’s post at the end of February. He’s held the post since 2014 and will become dean of Regent University law school in Virginia Beach, Virginia.

    This will make the court 6-1 Dem, and even more likely to rule against gerrymandering.

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  • TaramoorTaramoor Registered User regular


    I’m going to take a wild guess that Fox is getting him wound up to do something hyper-stupid.

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  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    It's also all bullshit, like usual. WEAK (in all caps) matches in a database. Probably citizens whose first and last names are the same as non-citizens.



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  • CelestialBadgerCelestialBadger Registered User regular
    When I got my driver's license in NYC, the lady behind the counter automatically asked if I wanted to register to vote. I told her I wasn't a citizen (I am now), and she said "I guess not then" but I had to be clued up that this disqualified me. A person who was not educated might say "OK" to that question and end up registered without the ability to vote, and possibly in big trouble in Texas. They should probably add "If you are a citizen, would you like to register to vote?" to their spiel rather than just "Would you like to register to vote?"

  • Captain CarrotCaptain Carrot Alexandria, VARegistered User regular
    I don't think that process would actually complete voter registration for a non-citizen, just get it going until that question is reached on the form.

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  • Anarchy Rules!Anarchy Rules! Registered User regular
    Just out of curiousity, are non-citizens allowed to vote in any elections in the US?

    In the UK you don't have to be a citizen to vote in many elections, particularly local ones.

  • daveNYCdaveNYC Why universe hate Waspinator? Registered User regular
    Just out of curiousity, are non-citizens allowed to vote in any elections in the US?

    In the UK you don't have to be a citizen to vote in many elections, particularly local ones.

    There's a few. Wikipedia

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  • a5ehrena5ehren AtlantaRegistered User regular
    edited January 28
    I don't think that process would actually complete voter registration for a non-citizen, just get it going until that question is reached on the form.

    It would depend on how they do it in the back-end...a lot of the REAL ID requirements would make it pretty obvious to the clerk if someone is a non-citizen anyway.

    Also, Texas does not appear to have motor-voter, so you likely can't register at a DMV office anyway.

    a5ehren on
  • EinzelEinzel Registered User regular
    More good news from NC - the Republican Chief Justice has resigned:
    North Carolina Chief Justice Mark Martin said Friday he’s leaving the state’s Supreme Court after 20 years to become a Virginia law school dean.

    The resignation means Democratic Gov. Roy Cooper gets to decide who fills the Republican’s seat on the court and who the next chief justice will be. Five of the seven current Supreme Court members are registered Democrats.

    Martin told The Associated Press of his decision to resign the chief justice’s post at the end of February. He’s held the post since 2014 and will become dean of Regent University law school in Virginia Beach, Virginia.

    This will make the court 6-1 Dem, and even more likely to rule against gerrymandering.

    Not at all suspicious given that iirc we voted to disallow a change to how the NC supreme Court nominees get decided last November.

  • Martini_PhilosopherMartini_Philosopher Registered User regular
    This shouldn't come as a surprise to anyone paying attention, but McConnell doesn't think that the day we vote on should be a federal paid holiday.

    There's not a whole lot more to comment on. The proposal comes as part of HR1, the Democrat's sweeping anti-corruption bill they passed earlier in the session. I don't know why McConnell felt compelled to comment on it, as his current strategy seems to depend on him not opening his mouth or taking a position on anything. Personally, it's far past time for the US to join most other democracies in celebrating and securing that particular day for the people to vote on.

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  • Commander ZoomCommander Zoom Registered User regular
    edited January 30
    You're right - it's not surprising at all.

    I'd even say it's an open secret that the GOP can't win in fair elections; McConnell and the rest of the party leadership know this; and their entire electoral strategy going forward is to make sure we don't have any.

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  • Gnome-InterruptusGnome-Interruptus Registered User regular
    I disagree that having an election day be a paid holiday will help as much as people are hoping.

    But I think it will improve things some small amount, and I won't let the perfect be the enemy of improvement.

    Better changes would be to legislative specify ratios and distances for polling places and distances you can force a community to travel to reach them and the hours they are open.

    Also increase early voting to the entire week prior to election night.

    Add in some mail in voting if you trust election officials in the state to not invalidate large amounts of them from certain areas on some thin pretext.

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  • monikermoniker Registered User regular
    Before I got a good "real" job I worked every Federal holiday except Thanksgiving and Christmas because that was back when retail didn't start Black Friday until Friday. I'm not exactly opposed to doing it, but it won't actually help the people who need assistance in getting to the polls. Particularly compared to something like no-excuse postal balloting.

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  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    There would definitely be a knock-on effect as giving it that status creates pressure for businesses to make it a holiday for their employees. But while a lot of white-collar stuff can close for a day without real impact, retail and all wants to be open even more on holidays, so... it's complicated?

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  • PeccaviPeccavi Registered User regular
    I mean, I have a pretty good job and I still dont get most federal holidays. The only people I know who get them are government employees and bankers (not even all bankers).

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  • SelnerSelner Registered User regular
    I disagree that having an election day be a paid holiday will help as much as people are hoping.

    But I think it will improve things some small amount, and I won't let the perfect be the enemy of improvement.

    Better changes would be to legislative specify ratios and distances for polling places and distances you can force a community to travel to reach them and the hours they are open.

    Also increase early voting to the entire week prior to election night.

    Add in some mail in voting if you trust election officials in the state to not invalidate large amounts of them from certain areas on some thin pretext.

    Early (or multi-day) voting just needs to be a national standard. This focus on a single day is just crazy. It doesn't really need to be a holiday, as long as there is ample time to vote. Let people vote on the weekends.

    And another important part for some areas of the country is ample voting locations. But hopefully the multi-day aspect would cut down on the huge lines.

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  • Captain InertiaCaptain Inertia Registered User regular
    Peccavi wrote: »
    I mean, I have a pretty good job and I still dont get most federal holidays. The only people I know who get them are government employees and bankers (not even all bankers).

    Yo

  • davidsdurionsdavidsdurions Your Trusty Meatshield Panhandle NebraskaRegistered User regular
    It’s be great to get a discount on some shopping on voting holiday if you can present your “I Voted” sticker.

    Just trying to think of ways to make the idea work for more people. Really should just do mandatory registering and mail-in ballots.

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