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[Hollow Knight] Sequel: Silksong Announced

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Posts

  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    I recently replayed this last week or so. It's still amazing.

    I wonder why it is that I can spend a bunch of time on stuff like the White Palace's Path of Pain and enjoy all of it, but a hard boss that I keep dying on frustrates the hell out of me (Grey Prince, Grimm). I'd love a metroidvania that had no bosses at all, just platforming and exploration.

    Ever played Ori and the Blind Forest? It has combat and some boss fight esque stuff but it's basically just super tight platforming and exploring.

    I mean, I'd take Nick Offerman's spikey cat dick willingly
    Cantido
  • CantidoCantido Registered User regular
    3clipse wrote: »
    Aistan wrote: »
    I recently replayed this last week or so. It's still amazing.

    I wonder why it is that I can spend a bunch of time on stuff like the White Palace's Path of Pain and enjoy all of it, but a hard boss that I keep dying on frustrates the hell out of me (Grey Prince, Grimm). I'd love a metroidvania that had no bosses at all, just platforming and exploration.

    Ever played Ori and the Blind Forest? It has combat and some boss fight esque stuff but it's basically just super tight platforming and exploring.

    Ori and the Blind Forest was described as Super Meatroid here.

    3DS Friendcode 5413-1311-3767
    Fry
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    Cantido wrote: »
    3clipse wrote: »
    Aistan wrote: »
    I recently replayed this last week or so. It's still amazing.

    I wonder why it is that I can spend a bunch of time on stuff like the White Palace's Path of Pain and enjoy all of it, but a hard boss that I keep dying on frustrates the hell out of me (Grey Prince, Grimm). I'd love a metroidvania that had no bosses at all, just platforming and exploration.

    Ever played Ori and the Blind Forest? It has combat and some boss fight esque stuff but it's basically just super tight platforming and exploring.

    Ori and the Blind Forest was described as Super Meatroid here.

    That's basically perfect.

    I mean, I'd take Nick Offerman's spikey cat dick willingly
    Kristmas Kthulhu
  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    I have played The Swapper, it's great. I have not played Ori, I forget why. With Ori 2 coming I should give it a go.

    steam_sig.png
  • Golden YakGolden Yak Burnished Bovine The PIT, level 26Registered User regular
    Ori looks gorgeous, Ori2 even more so. But I've seen some gameplay of the first game and it looks like a series of jumping puzzles. Which is fine if that's what you like, but I do not.

    White Palace was very tough for me. I haven't tried the Path of Pain yet. I saw some videos of it and slide off my chair to the floor, where I lay curled up in a ball for seven minutes.

    pod_banner.jpg
  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    The only reason I like White Palace and Path of Pain is because I used the honey health charm thing. It really makes you take it more methodically that way, as after each fail you sit and wait for your health pip to regenerate. It gives you time to think and plan. Plus they are decent with the checkpointing.

    steam_sig.png
    3clipseDelzhandHeadCreeps
  • HenroidHenroid Radio Demon Internet HellRegistered User regular
    Yo fuck the White Palace, seriously. Platforming hell of that sort is the worst.

    Nobody likes me but that's okay. I'm used to it.
    McMoogle
  • McMoogleMcMoogle Registered User regular
    Henroid wrote: »
    Yo fuck the White Palace, seriously. Platforming hell of that sort is the worst.

    The only thing more infuriating than actually completing the White palace is watching someone else go through it and finding out there are legitimate shortcuts that the developers programmed into it that you didn't see.

    The number of times i said "ok this has to be the last part" could've been interpreted as how i read a comma.

    steam_sig.png
    KoopahTroopah
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    Man I loved the White Palace. You definitely want the hive charm and Grubsong to do it, but I love really intricate platforming like that.

    I mean, I'd take Nick Offerman's spikey cat dick willingly
    Yilias
  • KoopahTroopahKoopahTroopah The koopas, the troopas. Philadelphia, PARegistered User regular
    I thought the White Palace was out of place compared to the rest of the game, yeah you don't have to do it, but in a similar way you don't have to play classic games on Normal instead of Easy. That being said, I was super happy when it was over. Carrying the flower pedal or whatever without taking a hit was frustrating until I pathed out the whole thing and memorized enemy locations and patterns.

    vH0O2se.gif
  • NaphtaliNaphtali Null Registered User regular
    So made my way into four areas so far, and found
    Mothwing Cloak and Mantis Claw

    I found this one vendor in the Fungal area, and they're selling
    "Fragile" charms. Are these charms going to break on death, or do they have some other catch? I'd hate to get them and have to re-buy them every time I die or something.

    B.net: Naphtali#1830 | Steam | Nintendo ID: Naphtali | PSN: EI-Naphtali | Wish List
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    Naphtali wrote: »
    So made my way into four areas so far, and found
    Mothwing Cloak and Mantis Claw

    I found this one vendor in the Fungal area, and they're selling
    "Fragile" charms. Are these charms going to break on death, or do they have some other catch? I'd hate to get them and have to re-buy them every time I die or something.

    That's exactly how they work. Without spoiling too much, the Grimm Troupe DLC adds a way to make unbreakable versions for absolutely ludicrous amounts of coin.

    I mean, I'd take Nick Offerman's spikey cat dick willingly
  • NaphtaliNaphtali Null Registered User regular
    3clipse wrote: »
    Naphtali wrote: »
    So made my way into four areas so far, and found
    Mothwing Cloak and Mantis Claw

    I found this one vendor in the Fungal area, and they're selling
    "Fragile" charms. Are these charms going to break on death, or do they have some other catch? I'd hate to get them and have to re-buy them every time I die or something.

    That's exactly how they work. Without spoiling too much, the Grimm Troupe DLC adds a way to make unbreakable versions for absolutely ludicrous amounts of coin.

    I kind of figured.

    So far I've found:
    The other bug vendor who sells the lantern, charm vendor, the guy who buys collectibles in the city, and the ant selling the fragile stuff

    The lantern is probably important as I think I've hit a few rooms that were just too dark to proceed, but it still seems very expensive with my current collection rates.

    Is there any reason not to sell explorer papers & hollownest crests to the bug collector in the city? besides that he's a rude butt

    B.net: Naphtali#1830 | Steam | Nintendo ID: Naphtali | PSN: EI-Naphtali | Wish List
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    Naphtali wrote: »
    3clipse wrote: »
    Naphtali wrote: »
    So made my way into four areas so far, and found
    Mothwing Cloak and Mantis Claw

    I found this one vendor in the Fungal area, and they're selling
    "Fragile" charms. Are these charms going to break on death, or do they have some other catch? I'd hate to get them and have to re-buy them every time I die or something.

    That's exactly how they work. Without spoiling too much, the Grimm Troupe DLC adds a way to make unbreakable versions for absolutely ludicrous amounts of coin.

    I kind of figured.

    So far I've found:
    The other bug vendor who sells the lantern, charm vendor, the guy who buys collectibles in the city, and the ant selling the fragile stuff

    The lantern is probably important as I think I've hit a few rooms that were just too dark to proceed, but it still seems very expensive with my current collection rates.

    Is there any reason not to sell explorer papers & hollownest crests to the bug collector in the city? besides that he's a rude butt

    Re: darkness, you're correct on the next step

    re: selling stuff, nope, no reason not to sell that stuff

    I mean, I'd take Nick Offerman's spikey cat dick willingly
  • NaphtaliNaphtali Null Registered User regular
    cool cool.

    I'm super digging this game right now. Lost power for a few hours last night so I just dove in hard. Just hells of Super Metroid & Dark Souls vibes all over the place and its wonderful.

    Fungal Vale/Hollownest City spoilers
    Now that I've got the nail upgraded I'm thinking about backtracking to challenge the Mantis leader at the bottom of their village. Probably will get wrecked but should be fun

    B.net: Naphtali#1830 | Steam | Nintendo ID: Naphtali | PSN: EI-Naphtali | Wish List
    3clipse
  • McMoogleMcMoogle Registered User regular
    I thought the White Palace was out of place compared to the rest of the game, yeah you don't have to do it, but in a similar way you don't have to play classic games on Normal instead of Easy. That being said, I was super happy when it was over. Carrying the flower pedal or whatever without taking a hit was frustrating until I pathed out the whole thing and memorized enemy locations and patterns.

    Bad time to tell you enemies don't respawn until you sit at a bench?

    steam_sig.png
    KoopahTroopah
  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    Re: The fragile charms. They very specifically break when equipped on death. Like, when you die and explode and your shade comes out and you have to kill it to get your souls geo back.

    I won't say where, but there are times where you will "die" and instead of exploding/shade you'll simply get booted out of the area you are in. These charms are very useful in those circumstances.

    steam_sig.png
    3clipse
  • The WolfmanThe Wolfman Registered User regular
    I bought it on the Switch, and subsequently beat the hell out of it. Nice little game. Chock full of designs that I wouldn't say are outright bad or wrong, but that would make me say "Hey devs, you should know better than this". Like the entire exploration system that seems positively in love with making you walk around giant areas with no map and precious little save points. Couple that with absolutely no guidance whatsoever, I had literally no idea what I was doing or where to go for almost the entire game. I ended up just downloading some maps and started clearing out all the various collectibles. Also, the combat wasn't much to write home about. I will say god bless the ability to heal whenever you want. Without that this game would have frustrated the fuck out of me and probably would have been put down long ago.

    Thankfully everything else about the game just kinda came together wonderfully. I had this amazing moment where I was beating my head against Nightmare King Grimm, about to come to the conclusion that the fight was simply bullshit and I don't have the ridiculous reaction time they seem to want. And then... I had one of those transcendence moments. Some gear just shifted into place. I went for about a 5 minute stretch where I dodged everything. I was like Neo looking at the code of the Matrix. I sadly didn't win that fight, and I'm sure I was just a few hits away to boot. But I wasn't mad or discouraged, quite the opposite. I knew then and there I had it. Took about 10 more tries (including one infuriating one where I actually won, but also died to a fire wave at the same time, and no it doesn't count) but I eventually got it and felt like a fucking badass.

    "The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
    PSN: TheWolfman64 3DS/Pokemon Y: 0774-4614-4065/NNID: the_wolfman64
    3clipseNoggin
  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    I'm not going to say you were playing the game wrong or anything, because those feelings of being lost and not having any idea where to go are valid if you didn't enjoy them. It wasn't a mistake by the developers though, it's the feeling they intended you to have as you were playing. Each time you go to a new area they wanted you to have to take time exploring, beefing up your spacial awareness and mental map of an area until you progressed far enough in to find the actual map.

    steam_sig.png
    3clipseAuralynxNaphtaliSyphonBlueKristmas Kthulhu
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    McMoogle wrote: »
    I thought the White Palace was out of place compared to the rest of the game, yeah you don't have to do it, but in a similar way you don't have to play classic games on Normal instead of Easy. That being said, I was super happy when it was over. Carrying the flower pedal or whatever without taking a hit was frustrating until I pathed out the whole thing and memorized enemy locations and patterns.

    Bad time to tell you enemies don't respawn until you sit at a bench?

    That's not true, they respawn as soon as you switch screens.

    I mean, I'd take Nick Offerman's spikey cat dick willingly
    Xaquin
  • AistanAistan Tiny Bat Registered User regular
    3clipse wrote: »
    McMoogle wrote: »
    I thought the White Palace was out of place compared to the rest of the game, yeah you don't have to do it, but in a similar way you don't have to play classic games on Normal instead of Easy. That being said, I was super happy when it was over. Carrying the flower pedal or whatever without taking a hit was frustrating until I pathed out the whole thing and memorized enemy locations and patterns.

    Bad time to tell you enemies don't respawn until you sit at a bench?

    That's not true, they respawn as soon as you switch screens.

    Not all of them. Most of the bigger stuff stays gone until you rest. That's how I did the flower on my replay. I got most of the way there then got hit but then instead of warping back I just walked so the majority of the things would stay gone and i'd only have to worry about the environmental stuff or the enemies that die in one hit.

    steam_sig.png
    Naphtali
  • YiliasYilias Registered User regular
    Any tips for ironman 100%? I have the regular speedrum/ironman/100% but this seems like it'll be an order harder.

    Twitch - Steam - BNet: Yilias #1224
  • The WolfmanThe Wolfman Registered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    I'm not going to say you were playing the game wrong or anything, because those feelings of being lost and not having any idea where to go are valid if you didn't enjoy them. It wasn't a mistake by the developers though, it's the feeling they intended you to have as you were playing. Each time you go to a new area they wanted you to have to take time exploring, beefing up your spacial awareness and mental map of an area until you progressed far enough in to find the actual map.

    The problem is their design didn't really foster a sense of exploration. It instead fostered a feeling of "If I die, who knows what bench I'm going to get shunted back to, and I might as well kiss my money combined because I'm not going to remember exactly where I was".

    Personally I would change the mapping system by letting you fill out the map regardless of whether you bought it or not, because this system implies that all you're really buying is the damn scrap of paper to scribble on. Were it up to me I'd also just get rid of having to rest to officially update the map. I mean Grandma Metroid did exactly this, just auto filling the map as you walked, even if you were walking into the complete unknown. But since dying would technically fill in the map upon respawning, I could settle for that. Then I'd know where my soul is, and can also semi deduce from the map where possible save locations are so I'm not having an epic backtrack.

    These games live and die by their mapping system, and given how deceptivally huge this game is, their mapping system fell short.

    "The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
    PSN: TheWolfman64 3DS/Pokemon Y: 0774-4614-4065/NNID: the_wolfman64
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    I think the mapping system is absolutely perfect for what the devs were going for, which was you frequently being lost and having to wander around with no idea where you were. That was 100% a design goal.

    I mean, I'd take Nick Offerman's spikey cat dick willingly
    YiliasNaphtaliGolden YakAlphagaiaKristmas KthulhuEdith Upwards
  • ZundeZunde Registered User regular
    I can't progress because of my joycon's being drifty so while i wait for my new ones to apparently arrive via horseback i have been farming Geo with fragile greed in greenpath you can get about 130 geo per trip killing the moss knights

  • DelzhandDelzhand Hard to miss. Registered User regular
    Aistan wrote: »
    3clipse wrote: »
    McMoogle wrote: »
    I thought the White Palace was out of place compared to the rest of the game, yeah you don't have to do it, but in a similar way you don't have to play classic games on Normal instead of Easy. That being said, I was super happy when it was over. Carrying the flower pedal or whatever without taking a hit was frustrating until I pathed out the whole thing and memorized enemy locations and patterns.

    Bad time to tell you enemies don't respawn until you sit at a bench?

    That's not true, they respawn as soon as you switch screens.

    Not all of them. Most of the bigger stuff stays gone until you rest. That's how I did the flower on my replay. I got most of the way there then got hit but then instead of warping back I just walked so the majority of the things would stay gone and i'd only have to worry about the environmental stuff or the enemies that die in one hit.

    Yeah I was experimenting with this while building my own metroidvania recently. It seems like each enemy type has different respawn triggers. Nuisance enemies like little fliers tend to respawn on screen change (this also resets their location in the screen). Bigger enemies like the knights in the city respawn when you use a bench, and the biggest enemies like the baldur shells never respawn.

    Steam|FFXIV|Switch SW-3472-4893-0802
  • NaphtaliNaphtali Null Registered User regular
    Beat the Mantis Lords. That was a fun ass fight.

    Progression thoughts
    I assume the City of Tears is still main progress? I manged to get into this area up above Greenpath that linked back into Dirttown/tutorial zone and learn a cool spin move from a trainer, and I can't seem to progress anywhere in the misty area between Greenpath/Fungal Zone with the jellyfish due to those black barriers or the boiling water (Cornifer appears to be behind a barrier as well, so can't start on a map).

    I do finally have enough for the lantern and there's also Deepnest but... I assume Deepnest is the real shit.

    B.net: Naphtali#1830 | Steam | Nintendo ID: Naphtali | PSN: EI-Naphtali | Wish List
  • AuralynxAuralynx Darkness is a perspective Watching the ego workRegistered User regular
    Naphtali wrote: »
    Beat the Mantis Lords. That was a fun ass fight.

    Progression thoughts
    I assume the City of Tears is still main progress? I manged to get into this area up above Greenpath that linked back into Dirttown/tutorial zone and learn a cool spin move from a trainer, and I can't seem to progress anywhere in the misty area between Greenpath/Fungal Zone with the jellyfish due to those black barriers or the boiling water (Cornifer appears to be behind a barrier as well, so can't start on a map).

    I do finally have enough for the lantern and there's also Deepnest but... I assume Deepnest is the real shit.
    Yes. It definitely is. There's a lot to be found in the City which needs progression goodies to access as well, IIRC.

    Space... what is the point of it? You have no idea.
    OSvv7zs.png


    3clipse
  • NaphtaliNaphtali Null Registered User regular
    3clipse wrote: »
    I think the mapping system is absolutely perfect for what the devs were going for, which was you frequently being lost and having to wander around with no idea where you were. That was 100% a design goal.

    The only change I would have made is after you have a quill, you should have been able to start making your own map for the area. Even if that meant backtracking to Dirtnap, getting a blank piece of paper and scribbling as you traverse rooms. I get that they want you to start with Conifer's work but it feels kind of silly. I'm more of a cartographer than he is at this point!

    B.net: Naphtali#1830 | Steam | Nintendo ID: Naphtali | PSN: EI-Naphtali | Wish List
    3clipseShenl742Kreutz
  • Road BlockRoad Block Registered User regular
    Ok so the Soul Master fight was a really fun one and seemed challenging but I managed to get through it first try.

    On the other hand
    Holy fuck Soul Tyrant is not messing around. That last phase is just plain mean.

  • GMaster7GMaster7 Chili Dog Enthusiast Registered User regular
    Delzhand wrote: »
    Aistan wrote: »
    I recently replayed this last week or so. It's still amazing.

    I wonder why it is that I can spend a bunch of time on stuff like the White Palace's Path of Pain and enjoy all of it, but a hard boss that I keep dying on frustrates the hell out of me (Grey Prince, Grimm). I'd love a metroidvania that had no bosses at all, just platforming and exploration.

    Check out The Swapper. That game doesn't even give you a weapon.

    I'm a few days late here, and I still haven't started Hollow Knight, but just want to say that the Swapper is excellent. What a good and memorable game. I loved it and always perk up when someone mentions it here.

    PSN: SKI2000G | Steam: GMaster7 | Battle.net: GMaster7#1842 | Twitch: twitch.tv/SKI2000G
    3clipseCantidoKoopahTroopahFawst
  • NaphtaliNaphtali Null Registered User regular
    Oh, hello Soul Sanctuary
    Hello Soul Master, I did not expect a boss fight here but I will take this shiny new traversal move

    B.net: Naphtali#1830 | Steam | Nintendo ID: Naphtali | PSN: EI-Naphtali | Wish List
  • shadowaneshadowane Registered User regular
    Naphtali wrote: »
    Oh, hello Soul Sanctuary
    Hello Soul Master, I did not expect a boss fight here but I will take this shiny new traversal move

    It is so funny watching your progression. You have hit things so much earlier than I did in a bunch of places.

    Rich on Beer - I talk about drinking beer. You read about it.
    3clipse
  • ZundeZunde Registered User regular
    My progression so far has been Crossroads - Greenpath - Fungal wastes "Hey your weapon is crap maybe you should come back later." Npc dialog Then to city of tears
    I killed Soul master and got Deep dive now i have that the claw and dash and i'm at a loss where to go from here.

  • shadowaneshadowane Registered User regular
    Zunde wrote: »
    My progression so far has been Crossroads - Greenpath - Fungal wastes "Hey your weapon is crap maybe you should come back later." Npc dialog Then to city of tears
    I killed Soul master and got Deep dive now i have that the claw and dash and i'm at a loss where to go from here.

    See, that was probably my progression too but I missed the Soul Sanctum completely. After that I've just wandered around a ton and worked on filling out unseen branches of the map.

    Rich on Beer - I talk about drinking beer. You read about it.
  • NaphtaliNaphtali Null Registered User regular
    edited June 2018
    Well I'm kind of trying to constantly backtrack and explore when I unlock new abilities, and fill in each map as much as I can at that time as well. Though I'm super paranoid when moving into an area I don't have a map for.

    After getting the lantern I dipped around in the mining area for a bit since there was a lower entrance than the one up above with the singing miner which is blocked by one of those black barriers. Zero sign of Conifer in 10 ish screens and I had a ton of geo so I noped out of there before getting too disoriented.

    Naphtali on
    B.net: Naphtali#1830 | Steam | Nintendo ID: Naphtali | PSN: EI-Naphtali | Wish List
  • AuralynxAuralynx Darkness is a perspective Watching the ego workRegistered User regular
    I actually found the Soul Sanctum quite late, if I remember right, and had a devil of a time getting around until I did.

    Space... what is the point of it? You have no idea.
    OSvv7zs.png


  • DelzhandDelzhand Hard to miss. Registered User regular
    I go straight from fungal wastes to deepnest. I don't really need the nail upgrade to beat
    the mantis lords

    anymore. It makes the fight faster but their attacks are all telegraphed enough to be avoidable.

    Steam|FFXIV|Switch SW-3472-4893-0802
    Auralynx3clipse
  • 3clipse3clipse I will build a labyrinth to house the cheese Registered User regular
    Delzhand wrote: »
    I go straight from fungal wastes to deepnest. I don't really need the nail upgrade to beat
    the mantis lords

    anymore. It makes the fight faster but their attacks are all telegraphed enough to be avoidable.

    Honestly the best way to beat them is
    get Whirlwind early, charge it while dodging and then let it rip between attacks

    I mean, I'd take Nick Offerman's spikey cat dick willingly
  • NaphtaliNaphtali Null Registered User regular
    edited June 2018
    I really should start using
    whirlwind
    then, huh

    I constantly forget I have it

    I do have one question: are there areas that are simply optional or do you end up going through every area for progression eventually?

    Naphtali on
    B.net: Naphtali#1830 | Steam | Nintendo ID: Naphtali | PSN: EI-Naphtali | Wish List
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