I'm not trying to start a war here, but are the people complaining about lack of narrative the ones that haven't played Destiny since Vanilla? TTK was the narrative expansion that you seem to want and that was over a year ago. I guess I'm just confused because I've been heavily invested in Destiny's story for a long while now.
TTK was far better at this than Vanilla, yes, but all of those plot hooks started in Vanilla are still hanging. We know almost nothing about The Traveler, why it came to this system, why "The Dark" follows it, the I-Don't-Have-Time-To-Tell-You Stranger, what the Vex were up to in the Black Garden and why it was important, where the Vex even came from, were the Fallen really a race that The Traveler previously uplifted, what's up with FWC's strange machine that seems to give people visions of apocalyptic futures, etc.
At least it seems we'll likely be getting more info on the Warminds, and life outside the city: stuff like the tale of Thorn and The Last Word were among the best in (outside of) the game, and I want to know more about the world and it's mysteries. I want to see that Bungie's going to deliver some answers, not just say "fuck lore get loot", which is one way to interpret that trailer (the other being "we're working on both".)
A lot of that stuff is explored actually. And not just surface level. Enough to have discussions on it. Is it in the Grimoire? Yes. Would it be better in game? Sure. It's there though. And the definitive answers just aren't going to be there this early. 10 year plan, remember.
I played through TTK, and I don't recall any of that stuff getting resolved.
They're not going to resolve the series-wide story arcs in the first game. Just not gonna happen.
Perhaps "resolve" was the wrong word. I expected more in-game "advancement" of these plots.
I'm a big fan of resolving/advancing some mysteries while opening new questions, and we didn't get a lot of advancement on those early hooks that really dug into me from the earliest closed Alpha days. Which is... disappointing. I don't expect the Traveler's story to be "resolved" in Destiny 1, but I expect to know more about it and have resolved some minor mysteries surrounding it than we do so far.
The Dark Souls style "dig it up in the descriptions" works better there, because each game is fairly self-contained*, and a careful observer could puzzle out most of the answers without the need for a sequel to explain it. We "knew" about 90% of the answers to DS1 after the DS1 DLC. We don't know jack about Destiny's mysteries.
*It also works better because DS is a slower, more methodical game that encourages learning and introspection, not just about the lore, but about the level design and the way you approach obstacles in the game. Everything reinforces that narrative style. Destiny is far more run and gun, iterate over the content in a constant search for new loot, and doesn't thematically mesh with "mine it out of item descriptions cards on the website" approach.
We learned some good stuff from House of Wolves and Taken King grimoire about the Traveler. The Eliksni's "Great Machine" is in fact The Traveler, the Whirlwind was most likely The Darkness and when it came for the Traveler, it abandoned them. Their remnant, The Fallen, followed it to Sol.
From the Book of Shadows we learned that The Traveler arrived in the proto-Hive's system and was blamed by the Worms for creating a syzygy that nearly wiped out the proto-Hive. The Leviathan, another creature of "the Sky" maintained that it was the Worms who did this however. We know that The Traveler, in its battle against The Darkness uplifted the Ammonite, one of the species of Fundament's moons as it later did to the Ecumene, the Eliksni and Humanity. We know that Taox, the proto-Hive "queen" arrived in the Ecumene's space in a "ship" that was possibly The Traveler. We learn that The Traveler passed by a group known as The Harmony and left it something the Hive called "the Gift Mast" which let the Harmony utilize the energy from a black hole to create "relativistic plasma jets" to fight the Hive. We can discern that at least since the Leviathan's defeat on Fundament, the Traveler has been fleeing the Darkness and uplifting species, giving them the power to fight or slow down the Hive before moving on. We can infer that it attempted to do the same with us. There's evidence in the grimoire that Rasputin attacked the Traveler when it was trying to leave, forcing it to stay and protect us.
Sorry for the stream-of-consciousness style post, I'm just trying to illustrate the advancement of certain plot points (such as the origin and MO of the Traveler) since year 1.
This is all cool and good but for it to be really cool and good it has to lead to actual content that impacts the main game story arcs. The Rasputin stuff should lead to Rasputin becoming a fully fledged enemy/ally. The hive stuff should lead to the worms or dragons getting involved. The stranger/vex stuff should lead to more timey wimey stuff and not just in the margins. The black garden should lead to more darkness stuff.
Destiny 1 was hints on hints on hints and teases of cool stuff in the margins. Right now the only thing we know that's getting paid off is the 'oh cabal has an empire somewhere' random mission at the end of taken king. And that was teased so much less than a bunch of other stuff we've got endless grimoire entries about.
When you're telling a puzzle box esque story the interest of the readers is contingent on the assumption that the solutions to the puzzles actually matter and won't just remaining background musings forever.
I'm not trying to start a war here, but are the people complaining about lack of narrative the ones that haven't played Destiny since Vanilla? TTK was the narrative expansion that you seem to want and that was over a year ago. I guess I'm just confused because I've been heavily invested in Destiny's story for a long while now.
TTK was far better at this than Vanilla, yes, but all of those plot hooks started in Vanilla are still hanging. We know almost nothing about The Traveler, why it came to this system, why "The Dark" follows it, the I-Don't-Have-Time-To-Tell-You Stranger, what the Vex were up to in the Black Garden and why it was important, where the Vex even came from, were the Fallen really a race that The Traveler previously uplifted, what's up with FWC's strange machine that seems to give people visions of apocalyptic futures, etc.
At least it seems we'll likely be getting more info on the Warminds, and life outside the city: stuff like the tale of Thorn and The Last Word were among the best in (outside of) the game, and I want to know more about the world and it's mysteries. I want to see that Bungie's going to deliver some answers, not just say "fuck lore get loot", which is one way to interpret that trailer (the other being "we're working on both".)
A lot of that stuff is explored actually. And not just surface level. Enough to have discussions on it. Is it in the Grimoire? Yes. Would it be better in game? Sure. It's there though. And the definitive answers just aren't going to be there this early. 10 year plan, remember.
I played through TTK, and I don't recall any of that stuff getting resolved.
They're not going to resolve the series-wide story arcs in the first game. Just not gonna happen.
Perhaps "resolve" was the wrong word. I expected more in-game "advancement" of these plots.
I'm a big fan of resolving/advancing some mysteries while opening new questions, and we didn't get a lot of advancement on those early hooks that really dug into me from the earliest closed Alpha days. Which is... disappointing. I don't expect the Traveler's story to be "resolved" in Destiny 1, but I expect to know more about it and have resolved some minor mysteries surrounding it than we do so far.
The Dark Souls style "dig it up in the descriptions" works better there, because each game is fairly self-contained*, and a careful observer could puzzle out most of the answers without the need for a sequel to explain it. We "knew" about 90% of the answers to DS1 after the DS1 DLC. We don't know jack about Destiny's mysteries.
*It also works better because DS is a slower, more methodical game that encourages learning and introspection, not just about the lore, but about the level design and the way you approach obstacles in the game. Everything reinforces that narrative style. Destiny is far more run and gun, iterate over the content in a constant search for new loot, and doesn't thematically mesh with "mine it out of item descriptions cards on the website" approach.
We learned some good stuff from House of Wolves and Taken King grimoire about the Traveler. The Eliksni's "Great Machine" is in fact The Traveler, the Whirlwind was most likely The Darkness and when it came for the Traveler, it abandoned them. Their remnant, The Fallen, followed it to Sol.
From the Book of Shadows we learned that The Traveler arrived in the proto-Hive's system and was blamed by the Worms for creating a syzygy that nearly wiped out the proto-Hive. The Leviathan, another creature of "the Sky" maintained that it was the Worms who did this however. We know that The Traveler, in its battle against The Darkness uplifted the Ammonite, one of the species of Fundament's moons as it later did to the Ecumene, the Eliksni and Humanity. We know that Taox, the proto-Hive "queen" arrived in the Ecumene's space in a "ship" that was possibly The Traveler. We learn that The Traveler passed by a group known as The Harmony and left it something the Hive called "the Gift Mast" which let the Harmony utilize the energy from a black hole to create "relativistic plasma jets" to fight the Hive. We can discern that at least since the Leviathan's defeat on Fundament, the Traveler has been fleeing the Darkness and uplifting species, giving them the power to fight or slow down the Hive before moving on. We can infer that it attempted to do the same with us. There's evidence in the grimoire that Rasputin attacked the Traveler when it was trying to leave, forcing it to stay and protect us.
Sorry for the stream-of-consciousness style post, I'm just trying to illustrate the advancement of certain plot points (such as the origin and MO of the Traveler) since year 1.
key word there. none of that is actually in the game. not everyone is going to go to the site or download an app to get that information, and making it a requirement of your player base is just misguided at best. if they'd put the information in the game and people chose to ignore it, fair enough. but they seem to have gone out of their way to put barriers between players and the story.
I know, no one's arguing that the way Bungie has to get this info the the player is great. But they seemingly don't have the capability to add that in to Destiny 1. It's a technical limitation. It should be noted that all of this info is indeed unlocked by playing the game. It's quibbling to suggest that it's so far removed from, say, Mass Effect's Codex, as to be irrelevant. The plot points have been advanced. It's disingenuous to argue otherwise because of an unfortunate UI issue.
I'm not trying to start a war here, but are the people complaining about lack of narrative the ones that haven't played Destiny since Vanilla? TTK was the narrative expansion that you seem to want and that was over a year ago. I guess I'm just confused because I've been heavily invested in Destiny's story for a long while now.
TTK was far better at this than Vanilla, yes, but all of those plot hooks started in Vanilla are still hanging. We know almost nothing about The Traveler, why it came to this system, why "The Dark" follows it, the I-Don't-Have-Time-To-Tell-You Stranger, what the Vex were up to in the Black Garden and why it was important, where the Vex even came from, were the Fallen really a race that The Traveler previously uplifted, what's up with FWC's strange machine that seems to give people visions of apocalyptic futures, etc.
At least it seems we'll likely be getting more info on the Warminds, and life outside the city: stuff like the tale of Thorn and The Last Word were among the best in (outside of) the game, and I want to know more about the world and it's mysteries. I want to see that Bungie's going to deliver some answers, not just say "fuck lore get loot", which is one way to interpret that trailer (the other being "we're working on both".)
A lot of that stuff is explored actually. And not just surface level. Enough to have discussions on it. Is it in the Grimoire? Yes. Would it be better in game? Sure. It's there though. And the definitive answers just aren't going to be there this early. 10 year plan, remember.
I played through TTK, and I don't recall any of that stuff getting resolved.
They're not going to resolve the series-wide story arcs in the first game. Just not gonna happen.
Perhaps "resolve" was the wrong word. I expected more in-game "advancement" of these plots.
I'm a big fan of resolving/advancing some mysteries while opening new questions, and we didn't get a lot of advancement on those early hooks that really dug into me from the earliest closed Alpha days. Which is... disappointing. I don't expect the Traveler's story to be "resolved" in Destiny 1, but I expect to know more about it and have resolved some minor mysteries surrounding it than we do so far.
The Dark Souls style "dig it up in the descriptions" works better there, because each game is fairly self-contained*, and a careful observer could puzzle out most of the answers without the need for a sequel to explain it. We "knew" about 90% of the answers to DS1 after the DS1 DLC. We don't know jack about Destiny's mysteries.
*It also works better because DS is a slower, more methodical game that encourages learning and introspection, not just about the lore, but about the level design and the way you approach obstacles in the game. Everything reinforces that narrative style. Destiny is far more run and gun, iterate over the content in a constant search for new loot, and doesn't thematically mesh with "mine it out of item descriptions cards on the website" approach.
We learned some good stuff from House of Wolves and Taken King grimoire about the Traveler. The Eliksni's "Great Machine" is in fact The Traveler, the Whirlwind was most likely The Darkness and when it came for the Traveler, it abandoned them. Their remnant, The Fallen, followed it to Sol.
From the Book of Shadows we learned that The Traveler arrived in the proto-Hive's system and was blamed by the Worms for creating a syzygy that nearly wiped out the proto-Hive. The Leviathan, another creature of "the Sky" maintained that it was the Worms who did this however. We know that The Traveler, in its battle against The Darkness uplifted the Ammonite, one of the species of Fundament's moons as it later did to the Ecumene, the Eliksni and Humanity. We know that Taox, the proto-Hive "queen" arrived in the Ecumene's space in a "ship" that was possibly The Traveler. We learn that The Traveler passed by a group known as The Harmony and left it something the Hive called "the Gift Mast" which let the Harmony utilize the energy from a black hole to create "relativistic plasma jets" to fight the Hive. We can discern that at least since the Leviathan's defeat on Fundament, the Traveler has been fleeing the Darkness and uplifting species, giving them the power to fight or slow down the Hive before moving on. We can infer that it attempted to do the same with us. There's evidence in the grimoire that Rasputin attacked the Traveler when it was trying to leave, forcing it to stay and protect us.
Sorry for the stream-of-consciousness style post, I'm just trying to illustrate the advancement of certain plot points (such as the origin and MO of the Traveler) since year 1.
key word there. none of that is actually in the game. not everyone is going to go to the site or download an app to get that information, and making it a requirement of your player base is just misguided at best. if they'd put the information in the game and people chose to ignore it, fair enough. but they seem to have gone out of their way to put barriers between players and the story.
I know, no one's arguing that the way Bungie has to get this info the the player is great. But they seemingly don't have the capability to add that in to Destiny 1. It's a technical limitation. It should be noted that all of this info is indeed unlocked by playing the game. It's quibbling to suggest that it's so far removed from, say, Mass Effect's Codex, as to be irrelevant. The plot points have been advanced. It's disingenuous to argue otherwise because of an unfortunate UI issue.
its not a 'UI issue' though. its not cumbersome or awkward, its absent. the Mass Effect Codex is in the game. the info is there to be perused at the players leisure, while they are engaging with the game. it even draws attention to new entries.
the Grimoire on the other hand is non existent beyond its attached score, which has no baring or effect on anything in game. and ok, adding the Grimoire in now seems to be beyond them due to the shitty engine they're using. there are other ways to get the info to players. there isn't even a throw away line from your Ghost about the Traveller possibly having uplifted the Fallen and then abandoned them. all those story missions and strikes and raids and at no point does anyone even muse on the info from the Grimoire or the Book of Shadows. the info isn't just absent for us the players, it seems to be absent for our Guardians as well.
like i said, you can't expect that your player base will go out of their way to get this info. the burden is on Bungie to make this stuff as clear as possible to as much of the player base as it possibly can. if they want to be coy with some things, be a bit vague to allow for speculation and theorizing, that's fine. but putting the info in the actual game, either as an ME style Codex or lines of dialogue or flavour text on weapons/armour/artifacts etc, helps with that and gives people a better idea of the world they're playing in.
Bungie has fucked up with how they've handled a lot of the narrative and i'm not going to let them off that hook just because the mistake can't be fixed at this point.
I'm not trying to start a war here, but are the people complaining about lack of narrative the ones that haven't played Destiny since Vanilla? TTK was the narrative expansion that you seem to want and that was over a year ago. I guess I'm just confused because I've been heavily invested in Destiny's story for a long while now.
TTK was far better at this than Vanilla, yes, but all of those plot hooks started in Vanilla are still hanging. We know almost nothing about The Traveler, why it came to this system, why "The Dark" follows it, the I-Don't-Have-Time-To-Tell-You Stranger, what the Vex were up to in the Black Garden and why it was important, where the Vex even came from, were the Fallen really a race that The Traveler previously uplifted, what's up with FWC's strange machine that seems to give people visions of apocalyptic futures, etc.
At least it seems we'll likely be getting more info on the Warminds, and life outside the city: stuff like the tale of Thorn and The Last Word were among the best in (outside of) the game, and I want to know more about the world and it's mysteries. I want to see that Bungie's going to deliver some answers, not just say "fuck lore get loot", which is one way to interpret that trailer (the other being "we're working on both".)
A lot of that stuff is explored actually. And not just surface level. Enough to have discussions on it. Is it in the Grimoire? Yes. Would it be better in game? Sure. It's there though. And the definitive answers just aren't going to be there this early. 10 year plan, remember.
I played through TTK, and I don't recall any of that stuff getting resolved.
They're not going to resolve the series-wide story arcs in the first game. Just not gonna happen.
Perhaps "resolve" was the wrong word. I expected more in-game "advancement" of these plots.
I'm a big fan of resolving/advancing some mysteries while opening new questions, and we didn't get a lot of advancement on those early hooks that really dug into me from the earliest closed Alpha days. Which is... disappointing. I don't expect the Traveler's story to be "resolved" in Destiny 1, but I expect to know more about it and have resolved some minor mysteries surrounding it than we do so far.
The Dark Souls style "dig it up in the descriptions" works better there, because each game is fairly self-contained*, and a careful observer could puzzle out most of the answers without the need for a sequel to explain it. We "knew" about 90% of the answers to DS1 after the DS1 DLC. We don't know jack about Destiny's mysteries.
*It also works better because DS is a slower, more methodical game that encourages learning and introspection, not just about the lore, but about the level design and the way you approach obstacles in the game. Everything reinforces that narrative style. Destiny is far more run and gun, iterate over the content in a constant search for new loot, and doesn't thematically mesh with "mine it out of item descriptions cards on the website" approach.
We learned some good stuff from House of Wolves and Taken King grimoire about the Traveler. The Eliksni's "Great Machine" is in fact The Traveler, the Whirlwind was most likely The Darkness and when it came for the Traveler, it abandoned them. Their remnant, The Fallen, followed it to Sol.
From the Book of Shadows we learned that The Traveler arrived in the proto-Hive's system and was blamed by the Worms for creating a syzygy that nearly wiped out the proto-Hive. The Leviathan, another creature of "the Sky" maintained that it was the Worms who did this however. We know that The Traveler, in its battle against The Darkness uplifted the Ammonite, one of the species of Fundament's moons as it later did to the Ecumene, the Eliksni and Humanity. We know that Taox, the proto-Hive "queen" arrived in the Ecumene's space in a "ship" that was possibly The Traveler. We learn that The Traveler passed by a group known as The Harmony and left it something the Hive called "the Gift Mast" which let the Harmony utilize the energy from a black hole to create "relativistic plasma jets" to fight the Hive. We can discern that at least since the Leviathan's defeat on Fundament, the Traveler has been fleeing the Darkness and uplifting species, giving them the power to fight or slow down the Hive before moving on. We can infer that it attempted to do the same with us. There's evidence in the grimoire that Rasputin attacked the Traveler when it was trying to leave, forcing it to stay and protect us.
Sorry for the stream-of-consciousness style post, I'm just trying to illustrate the advancement of certain plot points (such as the origin and MO of the Traveler) since year 1.
key word there. none of that is actually in the game. not everyone is going to go to the site or download an app to get that information, and making it a requirement of your player base is just misguided at best. if they'd put the information in the game and people chose to ignore it, fair enough. but they seem to have gone out of their way to put barriers between players and the story.
I know, no one's arguing that the way Bungie has to get this info the the player is great. But they seemingly don't have the capability to add that in to Destiny 1. It's a technical limitation. It should be noted that all of this info is indeed unlocked by playing the game. It's quibbling to suggest that it's so far removed from, say, Mass Effect's Codex, as to be irrelevant. The plot points have been advanced. It's disingenuous to argue otherwise because of an unfortunate UI issue.
You're not listening to me. I don't want to read that stuff in a codex, in game or out. I want that stuff to be revealed to my character in the narrative. I want to play the interesting story, not read about it later. The ME Codex was cool because it filled in backstory, but the important plot stuff was either not in it because it was narrative, or was re-iterated in the narrative, making the Codex entirely optional to understanding the greater universe and the ongoing plotline.
But I'm not here to just shit on Destiny. I only criticize because the good parts were so good that the bad kinda break my heart. I want to see that fixed this time, and hope they learn the right lessons.
@Grifter — You should let BrianRyan know, as he may not be checking the100; he ran with the international crew yesterday, so he understands the basics of Crota.
Oh. guys I'm so excited to step into a new fresh start with all of you guys. Regardless of how good d2 is Those first few weeks are going to feel like a party
+2
Mostlyjoe13Evil, Evil, Jump for joy!Registered Userregular
I'm honestly curious how much migration from the console player base to the PC will happen. With PS4 exclusivity I don't see the PS4 loosing too many folks, but Xbox might have a smaller player base come September.
Ideally it would be done in a subtler way and you can engage with the fluff as much or as little as you like.
Osiris is a good example of where Bungie gets this right. If you don't care about fluff he's just a dead guy you get cool stuff from. If you do then it makes the trip to the lighthouse way more interesting.
All the stuff about Darkness and the true nature of the traveler is an example of it done badly. Pages and pages of fluff that do not intersect with the main narrative in any sensible way.
I'm honestly curious how much migration from the console player base to the PC will happen. With PS4 exclusivity I don't see the PS4 loosing too many folks, but Xbox might have a smaller player base come September.
I don't see why the xbox would feel the hit anymore than the PS4. It's not like I have a PC that's capable of running a newer game, or would want to play the sequel on a different platform.
I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.
So am I going to pre-order on PS4 or PC? Anyone? I have both. I kind of wish there was more information.
As far as anyone knows, PS4-exclusivity is still in place and is presumed to affect PC. And some folks seem doubtful that the PC's PvP scene will be sufficiently protected against cheating.
But there's obviously no reason to pre-order right this second, so just wait for official detailed information.
So am I going to pre-order on PS4 or PC? Anyone? I have both. I kind of wish there was more information.
As far as anyone knows, PS4-exclusivity is still in place and is presumed to affect PC. And some folks seem doubtful that the PC's PvP scene will be sufficiently protected against cheating.
But there's obviously no reason to pre-order right this second, so just wait for official detailed information.
Unless you want to snag a physical collectors edition that seems to be selling out
XBL - Foreverender | 3DS FC - 1418 6696 1012 | Steam ID | LoL
Wraith - The codex not being available in game is indeed a UI issue. There's no interface to read that cards. It's not like Bungie decided, "Y'know what, the best way to get this info to the players in the website. Done and done." It just wasn't - ahem - in the cards for Destiny 1.
Houn - I am listening and I understand and sympathize. The stuff in the Grimoire IS largely backstory, comparable to the ME Codex. It's just that discovering backstory does indeed advance (in my mind) certain plot points/mysteries. Would it have been better to have this stuff be presented to your character specifically? Yes. Absolutely. By all accounts coming from Bungie, however, it just wasn't feasible from a resource standpoint. It's a shame and I hope it changes for Destiny 2.
So am I going to pre-order on PS4 or PC? Anyone? I have both. I kind of wish there was more information.
As far as anyone knows, PS4-exclusivity is still in place and is presumed to affect PC. And some folks seem doubtful that the PC's PvP scene will be sufficiently protected against cheating.
But there's obviously no reason to pre-order right this second, so just wait for official detailed information.
Unless you want to snag a physical collectors edition that seems to be selling out
He's only casually hardcore, so I assumed he wasn't about dat swag.
I regret buying the Dinklebot Edition of Destiny 1. The thing just sits on my desk collecting dust.
I also bought the collector's edition of Infamous 2 back in the day, and that comes with Cole's backpack. I think I used it once, at a PAX? It just hangs in my closet. I certainly don't need another replica bag that I'd never use, both because it's not correctly sized and I wouldn't want to "ruin" it.
Team Motorboat Kitten completed the Deathsinger Challenge in the Age of Triumph Record Book!
Fitocracy: Join us in the SE++ group!
XBox LIVE: Bogestrom | Destiny
PSN: Bogestrom
+21
Casually HardcoreOnce an Asshole. Trying to be better.Registered Userregular
My short subscription with lootcrate gave me enough crap to last a lifetime.
I guess I'll wait and buy the digital deluxe edition later this year.
0
Forever Zefirocloaked in the midnight glory of an event horizonRegistered Userregular
Isn't this how Bungie has always been though? Halo had a ton of cool lore and backstory that was never really presented to you in game. Like all the ilovebees stuff. Maybe it was more acceptable for that since it was more straight shooter?
Honestly it's never bothered me. Maybe I'm weird but I preferred reading the Book of Sorrow. Maybe because "the book is always better than the movie" ya know? Like it just wouldn't have had the same impact to me if we just watched all of it. Plus I like Gene Wolfe's Book of the New Sun which has a similar setting and part of the allure is you never really understand everything, you just have to infer from what's presented and understand that part of the reason this setting is so fun is because you will never truly know all the secrets
Anyway I know that's not how everyone else sees it but oh well
XBL - Foreverender | 3DS FC - 1418 6696 1012 | Steam ID | LoL
+4
Forever Zefirocloaked in the midnight glory of an event horizonRegistered Userregular
I regret buying the Dinklebot Edition of Destiny 1. The thing just sits on my desk collecting dust.
I also bought the collector's edition of Infamous 2 back in the day, and that comes with Cole's backpack. I think I used it once, at a PAX? It just hangs in my closet. I certainly don't need another replica bag that I'd never use, both because it's not correctly sized and I wouldn't want to "ruin" it.
Food for thought.
Would you be willing to let go of Dinklebot???
XBL - Foreverender | 3DS FC - 1418 6696 1012 | Steam ID | LoL
Isn't this how Bungie has always been though? Halo had a ton of cool lore and backstory that was never really presented to you in game. Like all the ilovebees stuff. Maybe it was more acceptable for that since it was more straight shooter?
Honestly it's never bothered me. Maybe I'm weird but I preferred reading the Book of Sorrow. Maybe because "the book is always better than the movie" ya know? Like it just wouldn't have had the same impact to me if we just watched all of it. Plus I like Gene Wolfe's Book of the New Sun which has a similar setting and part of the allure is you never really understand everything, you just have to infer from what's presented and understand that part of the reason this setting is so fun is because you will never truly know all the secrets
Anyway I know that's not how everyone else sees it but oh well
it was more acceptable there because the Halo games had complete stories in their games. you didn't have to follow the ilovebees stuff to understand what was happing in Halo 2. there was always supplemental material that expanded on the universe but non of it was required reading for the games to make sense. hell i think they even retconned some of it when they made Reach and the existing accounts of the Covenant attack didn't mesh with what they wanted to do in game.
Sure, but Halo did introduce things in the earlier games that were not fully explained until later games. Like the Gravemind, the Forerunners, "Reclaimer" etc.
Sure, but Halo did introduce things in the earlier games that were not fully explained until later games. Like the Gravemind, the Forerunners, "Reclaimer" etc.
exactly! those things were fully explained in the games!!!! we know that Destiny is a 10 year, mutil game project. no one is saying that everything should be answered at this point. just that the answers we do get, should be presented in the game(s)! this hasn't been happening, its something that needs to chance going into Destiny 2.
incidentally, i do believe that 343i have been getting a bit of flack of late for having important information for the latest Halo games only appear in supplemental materials(books, comics etc).
Oh Bungie, my faith, what little still lives, crawls across the ruins of my faith for you, like a wing-clipped bat malnourished, skin taught across every jagged edge of bone. And you Google search images of food on your phone and thrust the cold light in front of my crawling faith and expect me to give a shit.
tl;dr bungie being bungie again, nothing has changed
Oh Bungie, my faith, what little still lives, crawls across the ruins of my faith for you, like a wing-clipped bat malnourished, skin taught across every jagged edge of bone. And you Google search images of food on your phone and thrust the cold light in front of my crawling faith and expect me to give a shit.
tl;dr bungie being bungie again, nothing has changed
the gameplay reveal is on May 18th and we'll no doubt see more at E3 a few weeks later. they said we'd get a trailer today and that's exactly what we got.
I'm of the opinion that Halo got away with it because we were only being told one slice of a much bigger story, with most of the important things showing Cheif being a megabadass at everything always. They also start the story at a place where humans still don't understand the Covenant that well so it made sense we were learning things alongside the MC.
In Destiny, Guardians, Light, The Darkness, The Traveller, these have been known quantities. They speak with authority about what's happening but nobody really seems to know what is actually happening. Both the Speak and The Stranger start off acting like they have big news for you, and yet it's "later, we'll get to the good stuff *wink*". I want to run around with Cayde and The Stranger in a strike. I want a raid to involve us actually meeting some of these key players. We get there voices in our ears for just about and campaign activity but then for the raids, it goes quiet.
IMO there's a million things Destiny 2 can do better. Better writing. Better balancing. Better modifiers. Better loot system. Dedicated Servers. Better minigames. Dedicated Servers. Better graffix. DEDICATED. SERVERS.
But if they just manage like, 3 or 4 of those things, imallgoodbruh
Sure, but Halo did introduce things in the earlier games that were not fully explained until later games. Like the Gravemind, the Forerunners, "Reclaimer" etc.
Halo 1 explained the mystery of it's namesake ringworld while opening hooks to those other things for later games.
Destiny explained the mystery of... uh... nope, I got nothing. I know nothing more about the Traveler, the Golden Age, or the Collapse than I did at the start, and nothing we did had any tangible effect on the game world.
i wonder if we'll get a new set of live action trailers for D2. i enjoyed the ones we got for vanilla and TTK, would be nice to see how that fireteam is dealing with the Cabal invasion.
Wraith260 on
+1
Forever Zefirocloaked in the midnight glory of an event horizonRegistered Userregular
Oh Bungie, my faith, what little still lives, crawls across the ruins of my faith for you, like a wing-clipped bat malnourished, skin taught across every jagged edge of bone. And you Google search images of food on your phone and thrust the cold light in front of my crawling faith and expect me to give a shit.
tl;dr bungie being bungie again, nothing has changed
I don't think Toland was much fun at parties.
XBL - Foreverender | 3DS FC - 1418 6696 1012 | Steam ID | LoL
There are implications that the Cabal fleet currently in the Sol system is there because it was attempting to escape The Darkness.
Do you know where / what grimoires these are? I admit I quit after taking down Oryx (repeatedly), just coming back now, but from what I remember, the Cabal is a fleet...but the Cabal empire and Emperor is elsewhere. I don't remember anything about them fleeing. Hell, even in-game Ghost jokes about how if a moon was in their way, they'd just blow up the moon. They're portrayed as a mighty star empire, not a fleeing remnant.
Bizazedo on
XBL: Bizazedo
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
Sure, but Halo did introduce things in the earlier games that were not fully explained until later games. Like the Gravemind, the Forerunners, "Reclaimer" etc.
Halo 1 explained the mystery of it's namesake ringworld while opening hooks to those other things for later games.
Destiny explained the mystery of... uh... nope, I got nothing. I know nothing more about the Traveler, the Golden Age, or the Collapse than I did at the start, and nothing we did had any tangible effect on the game world.
Narrative is not this game's strong suit.
The grimoire ( I know, I know, not in game) for the Iron Lords has some neat short fiction about the pre-City/Golden Age time. With Warlords and whatnot. Also the Rezyl Whatshisname Cards do as well. With a giant spoiler at the end of his story
There are implications that the Cabal fleet currently in the Sol system is there because it was attempting to escape The Darkness.
Do you know where / what grimoires these are? I admit I quit after taking down Oryx (repeatedly), just coming back now, but from what I remember, the Cabal is a fleet...but the Cabal empire and Emperor is elsewhere. I don't remember anything about them fleeing. Hell, even in-game Ghost jokes about how if a moon was in their way, they'd just blow up the moon. They're portrayed as a mighty star empire, not a fleeing remnant.
For all their might and strength, for all that they have dug into Mars and flung up battle walls with the bureaucratic grimness of conquerors, I suspect they are fleeing from something. That within their hard shells and thousand-folded shields is a sharp seed of terror. But of what? Does something follow them? Should we fear it too?
For all their might and strength, for all that they have dug into Mars and flung up battle walls with the bureaucratic grimness of conquerors, I suspect they are fleeing from something. That within their hard shells and thousand-folded shields is a sharp seed of terror. But of what? Does something follow them? Should we fear it too?
The original grimoires were written by random people to do interesting lore and weren't really tied to the story, though, and that one screams unreliable narrator due to the fact that the Cabal are also at war with the Vex when we find them and the whole "I suspect" part. That and a separate Grimoire states " "The sooner we're extinguished, the sooner they can go home." - Commander Zavala. Again, vanilla, though, so doesn't really matter.
Follow on grimoires talk about how they were in communication with the main Empire / Emperor (which again suggests the Sol fleets are not fleeing) and receiving orders. That they were scout legions, not main legions, as they're ordered to attack the Hive flagship (and this was a later Taken King grimoire when they referred to themselves as scout legions).
That really doesn't sound like they're fleeing.
Bizazedo on
XBL: Bizazedo
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
0
Casually HardcoreOnce an Asshole. Trying to be better.Registered Userregular
I don't know why we need a gameplay trailer when we already know Bungie already made a super fun ass game. All I want at this point is more of it.
Posts
This is all cool and good but for it to be really cool and good it has to lead to actual content that impacts the main game story arcs. The Rasputin stuff should lead to Rasputin becoming a fully fledged enemy/ally. The hive stuff should lead to the worms or dragons getting involved. The stranger/vex stuff should lead to more timey wimey stuff and not just in the margins. The black garden should lead to more darkness stuff.
Destiny 1 was hints on hints on hints and teases of cool stuff in the margins. Right now the only thing we know that's getting paid off is the 'oh cabal has an empire somewhere' random mission at the end of taken king. And that was teased so much less than a bunch of other stuff we've got endless grimoire entries about.
When you're telling a puzzle box esque story the interest of the readers is contingent on the assumption that the solutions to the puzzles actually matter and won't just remaining background musings forever.
https://medium.com/@alascii
I know, no one's arguing that the way Bungie has to get this info the the player is great. But they seemingly don't have the capability to add that in to Destiny 1. It's a technical limitation. It should be noted that all of this info is indeed unlocked by playing the game. It's quibbling to suggest that it's so far removed from, say, Mass Effect's Codex, as to be irrelevant. The plot points have been advanced. It's disingenuous to argue otherwise because of an unfortunate UI issue.
XBL: Sans Gravitas, Steam, Destiny, Twitch
Destiny Raid Groups: Team NATBurn, Team Fourth Meal (Disbanded)
This time around it seems to be an Exotic Sword, Cabal Emblems, and maybe sharers? I'd be down for that cosmetic stuff.
According to the EU PSN store, here's the exact content:
https://www.the100.io/game/920662
Emote should be called "Cabals to the wall"
its not a 'UI issue' though. its not cumbersome or awkward, its absent. the Mass Effect Codex is in the game. the info is there to be perused at the players leisure, while they are engaging with the game. it even draws attention to new entries.
the Grimoire on the other hand is non existent beyond its attached score, which has no baring or effect on anything in game. and ok, adding the Grimoire in now seems to be beyond them due to the shitty engine they're using. there are other ways to get the info to players. there isn't even a throw away line from your Ghost about the Traveller possibly having uplifted the Fallen and then abandoned them. all those story missions and strikes and raids and at no point does anyone even muse on the info from the Grimoire or the Book of Shadows. the info isn't just absent for us the players, it seems to be absent for our Guardians as well.
like i said, you can't expect that your player base will go out of their way to get this info. the burden is on Bungie to make this stuff as clear as possible to as much of the player base as it possibly can. if they want to be coy with some things, be a bit vague to allow for speculation and theorizing, that's fine. but putting the info in the actual game, either as an ME style Codex or lines of dialogue or flavour text on weapons/armour/artifacts etc, helps with that and gives people a better idea of the world they're playing in.
Bungie has fucked up with how they've handled a lot of the narrative and i'm not going to let them off that hook just because the mistake can't be fixed at this point.
You're not listening to me. I don't want to read that stuff in a codex, in game or out. I want that stuff to be revealed to my character in the narrative. I want to play the interesting story, not read about it later. The ME Codex was cool because it filled in backstory, but the important plot stuff was either not in it because it was narrative, or was re-iterated in the narrative, making the Codex entirely optional to understanding the greater universe and the ongoing plotline.
But I'm not here to just shit on Destiny. I only criticize because the good parts were so good that the bad kinda break my heart. I want to see that fixed this time, and hope they learn the right lessons.
Osiris is a good example of where Bungie gets this right. If you don't care about fluff he's just a dead guy you get cool stuff from. If you do then it makes the trip to the lighthouse way more interesting.
All the stuff about Darkness and the true nature of the traveler is an example of it done badly. Pages and pages of fluff that do not intersect with the main narrative in any sensible way.
https://medium.com/@alascii
I don't see why the xbox would feel the hit anymore than the PS4. It's not like I have a PC that's capable of running a newer game, or would want to play the sequel on a different platform.
pleasepaypreacher.net
As far as anyone knows, PS4-exclusivity is still in place and is presumed to affect PC. And some folks seem doubtful that the PC's PvP scene will be sufficiently protected against cheating.
But there's obviously no reason to pre-order right this second, so just wait for official detailed information.
Unless you want to snag a physical collectors edition that seems to be selling out
XBL - Foreverender | 3DS FC - 1418 6696 1012 | Steam ID | LoL
Houn - I am listening and I understand and sympathize. The stuff in the Grimoire IS largely backstory, comparable to the ME Codex. It's just that discovering backstory does indeed advance (in my mind) certain plot points/mysteries. Would it have been better to have this stuff be presented to your character specifically? Yes. Absolutely. By all accounts coming from Bungie, however, it just wasn't feasible from a resource standpoint. It's a shame and I hope it changes for Destiny 2.
XBL: Sans Gravitas, Steam, Destiny, Twitch
Destiny Raid Groups: Team NATBurn, Team Fourth Meal (Disbanded)
He's only casually hardcore, so I assumed he wasn't about dat swag.
I regret buying the Dinklebot Edition of Destiny 1. The thing just sits on my desk collecting dust.
I also bought the collector's edition of Infamous 2 back in the day, and that comes with Cole's backpack. I think I used it once, at a PAX? It just hangs in my closet. I certainly don't need another replica bag that I'd never use, both because it's not correctly sized and I wouldn't want to "ruin" it.
Food for thought.
XBox LIVE: Bogestrom | Destiny
PSN: Bogestrom
I guess I'll wait and buy the digital deluxe edition later this year.
Honestly it's never bothered me. Maybe I'm weird but I preferred reading the Book of Sorrow. Maybe because "the book is always better than the movie" ya know? Like it just wouldn't have had the same impact to me if we just watched all of it. Plus I like Gene Wolfe's Book of the New Sun which has a similar setting and part of the allure is you never really understand everything, you just have to infer from what's presented and understand that part of the reason this setting is so fun is because you will never truly know all the secrets
Anyway I know that's not how everyone else sees it but oh well
XBL - Foreverender | 3DS FC - 1418 6696 1012 | Steam ID | LoL
Would you be willing to let go of Dinklebot???
XBL - Foreverender | 3DS FC - 1418 6696 1012 | Steam ID | LoL
it was more acceptable there because the Halo games had complete stories in their games. you didn't have to follow the ilovebees stuff to understand what was happing in Halo 2. there was always supplemental material that expanded on the universe but non of it was required reading for the games to make sense. hell i think they even retconned some of it when they made Reach and the existing accounts of the Covenant attack didn't mesh with what they wanted to do in game.
https://medium.com/@alascii
XBL: Sans Gravitas, Steam, Destiny, Twitch
Destiny Raid Groups: Team NATBurn, Team Fourth Meal (Disbanded)
exactly! those things were fully explained in the games!!!! we know that Destiny is a 10 year, mutil game project. no one is saying that everything should be answered at this point. just that the answers we do get, should be presented in the game(s)! this hasn't been happening, its something that needs to chance going into Destiny 2.
incidentally, i do believe that 343i have been getting a bit of flack of late for having important information for the latest Halo games only appear in supplemental materials(books, comics etc).
Oh Bungie, my faith, what little still lives, crawls across the ruins of my faith for you, like a wing-clipped bat malnourished, skin taught across every jagged edge of bone. And you Google search images of food on your phone and thrust the cold light in front of my crawling faith and expect me to give a shit.
tl;dr bungie being bungie again, nothing has changed
the gameplay reveal is on May 18th and we'll no doubt see more at E3 a few weeks later. they said we'd get a trailer today and that's exactly what we got.
In Destiny, Guardians, Light, The Darkness, The Traveller, these have been known quantities. They speak with authority about what's happening but nobody really seems to know what is actually happening. Both the Speak and The Stranger start off acting like they have big news for you, and yet it's "later, we'll get to the good stuff *wink*". I want to run around with Cayde and The Stranger in a strike. I want a raid to involve us actually meeting some of these key players. We get there voices in our ears for just about and campaign activity but then for the raids, it goes quiet.
IMO there's a million things Destiny 2 can do better. Better writing. Better balancing. Better modifiers. Better loot system. Dedicated Servers. Better minigames. Dedicated Servers. Better graffix. DEDICATED. SERVERS.
But if they just manage like, 3 or 4 of those things, imallgoodbruh
dedicated servers
PS - Local_H_Jay
Sub me on Youtube
And Twitch
Halo 1 explained the mystery of it's namesake ringworld while opening hooks to those other things for later games.
Destiny explained the mystery of... uh... nope, I got nothing. I know nothing more about the Traveler, the Golden Age, or the Collapse than I did at the start, and nothing we did had any tangible effect on the game world.
Narrative is not this game's strong suit.
I don't think Toland was much fun at parties.
XBL - Foreverender | 3DS FC - 1418 6696 1012 | Steam ID | LoL
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).
The grimoire ( I know, I know, not in game) for the Iron Lords has some neat short fiction about the pre-City/Golden Age time. With Warlords and whatnot. Also the Rezyl Whatshisname Cards do as well. With a giant spoiler at the end of his story
Ghost Fragment: Cabal 2. One of the originals from Vanilla.
EDIT: Relevant text:
XBL: Sans Gravitas, Steam, Destiny, Twitch
Destiny Raid Groups: Team NATBurn, Team Fourth Meal (Disbanded)
The original grimoires were written by random people to do interesting lore and weren't really tied to the story, though, and that one screams unreliable narrator due to the fact that the Cabal are also at war with the Vex when we find them and the whole "I suspect" part. That and a separate Grimoire states " "The sooner we're extinguished, the sooner they can go home." - Commander Zavala. Again, vanilla, though, so doesn't really matter.
Follow on grimoires talk about how they were in communication with the main Empire / Emperor (which again suggests the Sol fleets are not fleeing) and receiving orders. That they were scout legions, not main legions, as they're ordered to attack the Hive flagship (and this was a later Taken King grimoire when they referred to themselves as scout legions).
That really doesn't sound like they're fleeing.
PSN: Bizazedo
CFN: Bizazedo (I don't think I suck, add me).