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[L5R LCG] All honorless dogs shall perish in Q4 2017!

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Posts

  • cckerberoscckerberos Registered User regular
    PMAvers wrote: »
    I swear, the people who were the worst about that (not conceding so you got blackmailed into giving them a win otherwise you get a tie) always seemed to be freaking Scorpion players.

    Yeah, there was an unfortunately large segment of the Scorpion player base who justified being a dick as "just roleplaying their clan".

    PMAversMikey CTSFeralLucedes
  • Mikey CTSMikey CTS The Fool Registered User regular
    edited April 21
    cckerberos wrote: »
    admanb wrote: »
    They're not flawless designers but one thing they definitely know how to do is get people to engage with the fuckin' conflict mechanics.

    The issue with the CCG wasn't that people didn't want to get into conflict.

    Mmm well... I'm not sure this is one-hundred percent true. Back in Gold edition Sneak Attack + Deadly Ground was a common response to defensive players blocking. This effectively ended the action phase before it every started. And you never, EVER attacked against a military player without a Rallying Cry in hand to unbow your all personality. Basically avoiding conflict was how you won the game. You never attacked unless you knew with certainty it was risk free.

    This got better in Diamond but not by much.
    PMAvers wrote: »
    I swear, the people who were the worst about that (not conceding so you got blackmailed into giving them a win otherwise you get a tie) always seemed to be freaking Scorpion players.

    Mmm well... I'd take offense to that but there were a lot of edgelord shitbags who were attracted to the clan. We mostly chased them off the boards but they still came to events.

    Mikey CTS on
    // PSN: wyrd_warrior //
    Feral
  • FaranguFarangu I am a beardy man With a beardy planRegistered User regular
    So most important question: who here is going to Gencon and can grab a set for me?

    Let me throw money at you.

  • cckerberoscckerberos Registered User regular
    Mikey CTS wrote: »
    cckerberos wrote: »
    admanb wrote: »
    They're not flawless designers but one thing they definitely know how to do is get people to engage with the fuckin' conflict mechanics.

    The issue with the CCG wasn't that people didn't want to get into conflict.

    Mmm well... I'm not sure this is one-hundred percent true. Back in Gold edition Sneak Attack + Deadly Ground was a common response to defensively players blocking. This effectively ended the action phase before it every started. And you never, EVER attacked against a military player without a Rallying Cry in hand to unbow your all personality. Basically avoiding conflict was how you won the game. You never attacked unless you knew with certainty it was risk free.

    This got better in Diamond but not by much.

    You're kind of talking ancient history here, though. Rallying Cry, Deadly Ground, Night Battle (the poor man's Deadly Ground)... none of these cards were legal for the last 10-15 years of the game's existence. CCG design sucked in the late 90's. I mean, you could theoretically win by playing just one card back then, if you were fortunate enough to be facing a Lion player and you drew a Breach of Etiquette in your opening hand. They got much better later (even Diamond is pretty early in the game's history).

    Also, I'm not sure that we're talking about the same thing. Players will always prefer to take the path that most limits their opponents ability to take actions against them, regardless of the game. I kind of consider that different from conflict mechanics, since I always tried to pull off the Sneak Attack + Deadly Ground combo and I *loved* the combat in the game.

  • VisskarVisskar Blam! Murdered you!Registered User regular
    cckerberos wrote: »
    Mikey CTS wrote: »
    cckerberos wrote: »
    admanb wrote: »
    They're not flawless designers but one thing they definitely know how to do is get people to engage with the fuckin' conflict mechanics.

    The issue with the CCG wasn't that people didn't want to get into conflict.

    Mmm well... I'm not sure this is one-hundred percent true. Back in Gold edition Sneak Attack + Deadly Ground was a common response to defensively players blocking. This effectively ended the action phase before it every started. And you never, EVER attacked against a military player without a Rallying Cry in hand to unbow your all personality. Basically avoiding conflict was how you won the game. You never attacked unless you knew with certainty it was risk free.

    This got better in Diamond but not by much.

    You're kind of talking ancient history here, though. Rallying Cry, Deadly Ground, Night Battle (the poor man's Deadly Ground)... none of these cards were legal for the last 10-15 years of the game's existence. CCG design sucked in the late 90's. I mean, you could theoretically win by playing just one card back then, if you were fortunate enough to be facing a Lion player and you drew a Breach of Etiquette in your opening hand. They got much better later (even Diamond is pretty early in the game's history).

    Man, that makes me feel old. While I went through bouts of collecting the game from Anvil of Despair through early Ivory, it was Hidden Emperor/Pearl/Gold era where I was playing in tournaments locally almost every weekend.

    It'll be weird not saving booster packs for koku to turn in, but not having to chase down those expensive rare holdings or actions that everyone wants in their decks is a fair trade.

    steam_sig.png
    PMAvers
  • DarkewolfeDarkewolfe Registered User regular
    cckerberos wrote: »
    PMAvers wrote: »
    I swear, the people who were the worst about that (not conceding so you got blackmailed into giving them a win otherwise you get a tie) always seemed to be freaking Scorpion players.

    Yeah, there was an unfortunately large segment of the Scorpion player base who justified being a dick as "just roleplaying their clan".

    Ok, good. So it was "in character" that I just felt smarter and better than everyone as a Dragon player.

    What is this I don't even.
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    Darkewolfe wrote: »
    cckerberos wrote: »
    PMAvers wrote: »
    I swear, the people who were the worst about that (not conceding so you got blackmailed into giving them a win otherwise you get a tie) always seemed to be freaking Scorpion players.

    Yeah, there was an unfortunately large segment of the Scorpion player base who justified being a dick as "just roleplaying their clan".

    Ok, good. So it was "in character" that I just felt smarter and better than everyone as a Dragon player.

    Shouldn't that be Crane?

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. Now With Ninjas!

    They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
  • cckerberoscckerberos Registered User regular
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    Darkewolfe wrote: »
    cckerberos wrote: »
    PMAvers wrote: »
    I swear, the people who were the worst about that (not conceding so you got blackmailed into giving them a win otherwise you get a tie) always seemed to be freaking Scorpion players.

    Yeah, there was an unfortunately large segment of the Scorpion player base who justified being a dick as "just roleplaying their clan".

    Ok, good. So it was "in character" that I just felt smarter and better than everyone as a Dragon player.

    Shouldn't that be Crane?

    Dunno, "smart and arrogant" is kind of the Phoenix hallmark, I think.

  • admanbadmanb the bored genie Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    Maybe the lesson here is that when your game is about noble houses, most of them are going to see themselves as "smart" and be seen by others as "arrogant."

    italianranmaBrodyDarkewolfeAlbino Bunnytzeentchling
  • OptimusZedOptimusZed Registered User regular
    cckerberos wrote: »
    OptimusZed wrote: »
    Darkewolfe wrote: »
    cckerberos wrote: »
    PMAvers wrote: »
    I swear, the people who were the worst about that (not conceding so you got blackmailed into giving them a win otherwise you get a tie) always seemed to be freaking Scorpion players.

    Yeah, there was an unfortunately large segment of the Scorpion player base who justified being a dick as "just roleplaying their clan".

    Ok, good. So it was "in character" that I just felt smarter and better than everyone as a Dragon player.

    Shouldn't that be Crane?

    Dunno, "smart and arrogant" is kind of the Phoenix hallmark, I think.

    But actually being that arrogant is definitely a Crane thing.

    We're reading Rifts. You should too. You know you want to. Now With Ninjas!

    They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
  • ShortyShorty JUDGE BROSEF Registered User regular
    so as someone who knows almost nothing about L5r, except what I gleaned from reading Oriental Adventures like fifteen years ago, this game looks pretty rad

    also all the clans are neat, they're all really distinct and exciting

    we gonna be alright
  • ShortyShorty JUDGE BROSEF Registered User regular
    also there's a good chance I'm going to gen con this year so I'll be able to get it before Seattle distributors have a chance to not get any copies

    we gonna be alright
    PMAversadmanb
  • Mikey CTSMikey CTS The Fool Registered User regular
    edited April 21
    I Just noticed there is no flavor text on any of the cards we've seen up to now. I guess they must be deliberately holding it back since story is such a major component of the game.

    Mikey CTS on
    // PSN: wyrd_warrior //
  • cckerberoscckerberos Registered User regular
    There's flavor text on Matsu Berserker and Eager Scout, but yeah, there's a lot of empty space on the cards that I hope doesn't go to waste.

  • Mikey CTSMikey CTS The Fool Registered User regular
    I'm sure they'll be fine. Flavor text was one of my favorite bits in Netrunner.

    // PSN: wyrd_warrior //
  • PMAversPMAvers GomorraRegistered User regular
    I bet it's going to be hilarious watching someone accidentally dishonoring themselves out on a 5-0 honor bid for card draw. You just *know* someone is going to get greedy and try to do it.

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  • admanbadmanb the bored genie Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    PMAvers wrote: »
    I bet it's going to be hilarious watching someone accidentally dishonoring themselves out on a 5-0 honor bid for card draw. You just *know* someone is going to get greedy and try to do it.

    Imagine the finals table where one player has a huge incentive to bid five while sitting on five honor and there's this long, mental game of rock-paper-scissors before they finally put down and flip their dials revealing the 5-0 bid.

    That's a damn good mechanic.

    italianranmaShorty
  • AthenorAthenor Who needs lions when you have a battlecruiser? Registered User regular
    I thought it was 1 to 5? But the point remains.

    Slow play is gonna be a thing, but quite juicy.

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  • AthenorAthenor Who needs lions when you have a battlecruiser? Registered User regular
    edited April 26
    Hype train DOES NOT STOP!

    https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2017/4/26/crafting-a-dynasty/

    Summary:

    Yes, the bottom right of a stronghold is influence for the conflict deck.
    You can choose which of your 5 provinces will be put under the stronghold, and the order of the other 4.
    You start the game with 4 conflict cards in hand.
    During the dynasty phase, you take turns playing characters or actions, like SW Destiny or W40K: Conquest. First to pass gets a fate, but cannot play more characters or take any actions that phase.
    Holdings are powerful, but eat up a province, basically - if you have a holding, you can't play characters from there.
    When you play a character from a province, you refill it with a face-down dynasty card without looking at it -- it will be flipped face up next dynasty phase.
    You can only have 1 copy of a unique character in play at a given time. If another copy shows up in a province or your hand, you MAY discard it to add 1 fate to the existing character.
    Draw phase for conflict cards works as previously described, but there is no max hand size for your conflict hand.
    The parable of the Scorpion and the Frog still defines the Scorpion clan.

    l5c01_preview-1_cardfan.png

    l5c01_stronghold-anatomy_diagram.png

    l5c01_way-of-the-unicorn.png

    l5c01_daidoji-nerishma.png

    l5c01_borderlands-fortifications.png

    l5c01_shrewd-yasuki.png

    l5c01_city-of-lies.png

    l5c01_staging-ground.png

    l5c01_bayushi-manipulator.png

    l5c01_i-can-swim.png

    Athenor on
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    Steam & NNID - Athenor // 3DS: 3883-5283-0471
    "Brevity is the soul of getting your shit read." - Tube
    I'm blogging about my experiences purging my toy collection... read about it here!
    italianranmaMikey CTS
  • DarkewolfeDarkewolfe Registered User regular
    I just like the rules text on Way of the Unicorn. Basically, when you would not go first, don't and go first instead.

    What is this I don't even.
  • PMAversPMAvers GomorraRegistered User regular
    edited April 26
    You know, I wonder if with how Holdings now block provinces... I wonder if we could see the return of something like the Four Walls victory condition.

    EDIT: At the end, it mentions a new article next week... I wonder if Wednesday is now going to be the Dedicated L5R Preview Day now.

    PMAvers on
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    Athenor
  • cckerberoscckerberos Registered User regular
    They fixed the title on Yojin no Shiro.

  • italianranmaitalianranma Registered User regular
    洋人の城 Western Castle? What did it say before?

    飛べねぇ豚はただの豚だ。
  • AthenorAthenor Who needs lions when you have a battlecruiser? Registered User regular
    I believe it flipped the word order.

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    Steam & NNID - Athenor // 3DS: 3883-5283-0471
    "Brevity is the soul of getting your shit read." - Tube
    I'm blogging about my experiences purging my toy collection... read about it here!
  • cckerberoscckerberos Registered User regular
    They also added a macron (which doesn't really matter, of course, but shows a nice attention to detail).

    It's 用心の城, incidentally, "Castle of Vigilance" (the same "yojin" as in yojimbo).

    italianranma
  • Mikey CTSMikey CTS The Fool Registered User regular
    Nice to see some good flavor text, too. Gotta love the Scorpion & the Frog story, and its nice to see Bayushi's Lies will still be referenced.

    // PSN: wyrd_warrior //
  • PMAversPMAvers GomorraRegistered User regular
    New article up!

    The Conflicts of Rokugan

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  • AthenorAthenor Who needs lions when you have a battlecruiser? Registered User regular
    Definitely looks like this is becoming a weekly thing.

    https://www.fantasyflightgames.com/en/news/2017/5/3/the-conflicts-of-rokugan/

    Highlights:

    Phoenix screw around with the claimed ring and its orientation in a conflict.

    Honor/dishonor cards are the mini sized tokens, as was speculated.

    The imperial favor will be a full sized card, that will grant a bonus to military or political strength the following turn (and is begging for a custom token)
    Imperial favor is based on a combination of claimed rings and glory on a character.

    When you don't claim a ring for conflict, fate will stack up on it until it is claimed - and the dragon play off this.

    During the regroup phase, you may voluntarily discard cards at your provinces.. unless the province is broken. In that case, you MUST discard whatever card is face-up on the province.

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    Steam & NNID - Athenor // 3DS: 3883-5283-0471
    "Brevity is the soul of getting your shit read." - Tube
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  • PMAversPMAvers GomorraRegistered User regular
    Actually, with the Fate on rings, all you have to do is declare a challenge of that type to get the Fate off it.

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  • AthenorAthenor Who needs lions when you have a battlecruiser? Registered User regular
    PMAvers wrote: »
    Actually, with the Fate on rings, all you have to do is declare a challenge of that type to get the Fate off it.

    I'm very much 3/4 asleep, so I've been missing things all day. :)

    Also saw this in the L5R facebook group, via Reddit:
    Found on Reddit:
    From the Spanish FFG website: http://www.fantasyflightgames.es/…/la_leyenda_de_los_5_anil…
    "7 cartas de Fortaleza, 17 cartas de Provincia, 117 cartas de Dinastía, 98 cartas de Conflicto, 5 cartas de Personalidad, 20 fichas de Estado, 2 cartas de referencia, 40 fichas de Destino, 50 fichas de Honor, 1 carta de Favor Imperial, 1 ficha de Jugador Inicial, 2 diales de Honor, 5 fichas de Anillo, 1 libro Aprende a Jugar. "
    Translation:
    7 Stronghold cards
    17 Province cards
    117 Dynasty cards
    98 Conflict cards
    5 "Personality" (?) cards
    20 status tokens
    2 reference cards
    40 Fate tokens
    50 Honor tokens
    1 Imperial Favor card
    1 First-player token
    2 Honor dials
    5 Ring tokens
    1 Rulebook
    https://www.reddit.com/…/c…/690onf/core_set_contents_leaked/

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    Steam & NNID - Athenor // 3DS: 3883-5283-0471
    "Brevity is the soul of getting your shit read." - Tube
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  • PMAversPMAvers GomorraRegistered User regular
    edited May 3
    Also the Imperial Favor is claimed sort of like Dominance from AGOT, where you total up the total glory on your unbowed characters and add a bonus of the number of rings you claimed that round.

    Which, unlike the old version, means everyone can be interested in it since it's not keying off your family honor being the highest.

    PMAvers on
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  • cckerberoscckerberos Registered User regular
    I'm a little disappointed that, judging by the cards we've seen so far, there doesn't seem to be any real difference between military and political conflicts.

  • AthenorAthenor Who needs lions when you have a battlecruiser? Registered User regular
    cckerberos wrote: »
    I'm a little disappointed that, judging by the cards we've seen so far, there doesn't seem to be any real difference between military and political conflicts.

    Mechanically, no. But there is a lot of design space there. We have already seen effects that play off the conflict type, for instance, as well as the ring.

    So over in reddit land, someone brought up an interesting theory. What if those 5 personality cards are part of a multiplayer mode? While none has been announced, all the templating implies multiplayer compatibility. And I was wondering why the game included so many honor tokens when I can't imagine any way to have that many characters on the field at once... At least, not for two players.

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  • PMAversPMAvers GomorraRegistered User regular
    edited May 4
    I could totally see something like AGOT's title system for multiplayer working for this.

    Voice of the Emperor, Left Hand, Right Hand, Underhand... and I know it hasn't been founded yet at this point of the timeline, but Imperial Treasurer?

    PMAvers on
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  • cckerberoscckerberos Registered User regular
    Athenor wrote: »
    And I was wondering why the game included so many honor tokens when I can't imagine any way to have that many characters on the field at once... At least, not for two players.

    There are 50 honor tokens because you win an honor victory at 25 honor and there are two players.

    Did you perhaps mean fate tokens instead? Even then, 20 fate tokens per player doesn't seem too excessive to me.

  • FryFry Registered User regular
    cckerberos wrote: »
    Athenor wrote: »
    And I was wondering why the game included so many honor tokens when I can't imagine any way to have that many characters on the field at once... At least, not for two players.

    There are 50 honor tokens because you win an honor victory at 25 honor and there are two players.

    Did you perhaps mean fate tokens instead? Even then, 20 fate tokens per player doesn't seem too excessive to me.

    I assumed the honor victory was measured with the honor dials, and the honor tokens were some separate thing.

  • cckerberoscckerberos Registered User regular
    Fry wrote: »
    cckerberos wrote: »
    Athenor wrote: »
    And I was wondering why the game included so many honor tokens when I can't imagine any way to have that many characters on the field at once... At least, not for two players.

    There are 50 honor tokens because you win an honor victory at 25 honor and there are two players.

    Did you perhaps mean fate tokens instead? Even then, 20 fate tokens per player doesn't seem too excessive to me.

    I assumed the honor victory was measured with the honor dials, and the honor tokens were some separate thing.

    The honor dials are the dials that look like lacquerware boxes and are used for duels and showing how many cards you're going to draw from your conflict deck. Their numbers only go from one to five.

  • PMAversPMAvers GomorraRegistered User regular
    Huh, interesting. Apparently they updated the article, and you only discard face-up cards from a broken province. Face-down cards still stick around so you aren't bleeding out as bad.

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  • AthenorAthenor Who needs lions when you have a battlecruiser? Registered User regular
    cckerberos wrote: »
    Athenor wrote: »
    And I was wondering why the game included so many honor tokens when I can't imagine any way to have that many characters on the field at once... At least, not for two players.

    There are 50 honor tokens because you win an honor victory at 25 honor and there are two players.

    Did you perhaps mean fate tokens instead? Even then, 20 fate tokens per player doesn't seem too excessive to me.

    Oh, duh. For some reason I was thinking of the honor/dishonor cards we've seen.

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  • PMAversPMAvers GomorraRegistered User regular
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