Thoughts on Screen Connect/Connectwise vs. TeamViewer? TV is free for home use. This is for the aforementioned mom assistance. Is there a baked-in W10 "NetMeeting" client that can work?
Use Teamviewer. I use ScreenConnect, and though I like it, I cannot deny the performance difference between the two products. If you're using it just to help your mom out, just use TeamViewer.
I use screen connect to help people I probably won't help again. "Go to this URL. Accept the prompt. Now we're connected. Yes, it's amazing isn't it."
I use team viewer if it's a close friend or family memeber and I built the machine for them and anticipate regular support.
I actually don't do friends and family support anymore and haven't for years. I don't ask my doctor friend to take care of my burst appendix on his free time. You can figure out how to run malwarebytes your fucking self or take it to the Goon Geek Squad like a chump.
MalwareBytes is no longer an approved tool for us. And many of us prefer to do manual removals anyway.
"Luckily," only very few people know I'm savvy enough to solve their problems.
I have a friend whose computer I built for him, and he's still very hesitant to ask me for help. Granted, the thing was running like complete ass for so long that he asked be for help (big surprise, it was HP's "utility" for the family's printer eating up every ounce of free RAM).
He's due for a full rebuild, so I'll likely help him with that; then get TeamViewer installed for when things inevitably shit themselves. He's a bit more open to computer support and proper responsible computer ownership, now that he works from home a lot. In his defense, he asks VERY rarely because he knows it can be a bitch, and he and his wife are quick to offer food and such (my wife and I used to share a house with them before we moved out on our own; fun fact - we bought our first house from his wife's father).
I do my best to keep (other) people at arms length when it comes to this stuff because I understand the slippery slope involved.
I'll fix shit for my kids and sometimes for my parents when I just don't have anything else at all better to do.
Anyone else gets about 20 seconds to explain what the problem is and I'll give them no more than 2 short suggestions. And god help you if that was the only thing you called/came over for.
My Cisco switch replacement project is really pissing me off.
There's a long list of bullshit I have to deal with, but among that list is how...
...Catalyst 3850s stick out from the rack about an inch, which means that a lot of cable management solutions are effectively unusable.
So now I have a bunch of Panduit cable managers that I can't use, and our VAR is fucking slow when shipping new cable management stuff. Getting replacements is just going to slow this project down another week.
My boss is already frustrated with how long it's taking and I'm like... I am literally the only person at this company with a reasonable level of knowledge of basic TCP/IP concepts, our cables are a goddamn rats nest, the VLAN and subnet configurations on our layer 3 switches aren't much better, we have literally everything monitored so I can't unplug a patch cable without alarms and klaxons going off, and occasionally I run into load-bearing posters like the weird spanning-tree configuration I posted about last month.
This mess is going to take a long time to untangle, and, no my coworkers can't help and there's no point in delegating any of this shit.
every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
I'll fix shit for my kids and sometimes for my parents when I just don't have anything else at all better to do.
Anyone else gets about 20 seconds to explain what the problem is and I'll give them no more than 2 short suggestions. And god help you if that was the only thing you called/came over for.
I help my parents because I get fed.
not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
Thoughts on Screen Connect/Connectwise vs. TeamViewer? TV is free for home use. This is for the aforementioned mom assistance. Is there a baked-in W10 "NetMeeting" client that can work?
Use Teamviewer. I use ScreenConnect, and though I like it, I cannot deny the performance difference between the two products. If you're using it just to help your mom out, just use TeamViewer.
I use screen connect to help people I probably won't help again. "Go to this URL. Accept the prompt. Now we're connected. Yes, it's amazing isn't it."
I use team viewer if it's a close friend or family memeber and I built the machine for them and anticipate regular support.
I actually don't do friends and family support anymore and haven't for years. I don't ask my doctor friend to take care of my burst appendix on his free time. You can figure out how to run malwarebytes your fucking self or take it to the Goon Geek Squad like a chump.
My stepmother in law is a doctor, and she does stuff for me all the time for free. This is why she is literally the only person I will do free shit for.
It's also why I don't ask people to help me with things. They'll help me move a couch and then be like, "Oh so hey I was wondering if you could look at my com-"
"Get the fuck out of my house I can do this myself thank you bye!" Yes the 15 seconds it takes you to help me 5-man lift furniture is definitely worth me drinking myself to death in front of your computer for 6 fucking hours. Yes.
I'm not going to post pictures of my data center but when I started here it looked almost exactly like this:
Complete with the fiber trunks that somehow got tangled up with copper.
It looks marginally better now as I've tried to make sure new cables are properly routed and bundled but it's still pretty bad.
I can't just tear it all out and start fresh because trunks and access ports are intermingled. (Gi3/0/32 might be going to a printer, 33 to a router, 34 to a workstation.) Different departments are on different VLANs and none of it is documented.
Well, some of it is documented but the documentation is wrong. The description for some of the ports in our old switch configs reference employees who stopped working here before I was even hired.
every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
then label which port they tie to, then I'd make a makeshift cable organizer since it looks like you don't have room in that rack, and then I'd unravel that rat's nest and hook everything back up to the port that I previously labeled
You could probably get it done in an afternoon and minimally impact server (it'd be down for a few minutes at the most per port).
not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
"Luckily," only very few people know I'm savvy enough to solve their problems.
I have a friend whose computer I built for him, and he's still very hesitant to ask me for help. Granted, the thing was running like complete ass for so long that he asked be for help (big surprise, it was HP's "utility" for the family's printer eating up every ounce of free RAM).
He's due for a full rebuild, so I'll likely help him with that; then get TeamViewer installed for when things inevitably shit themselves. He's a bit more open to computer support and proper responsible computer ownership, now that he works from home a lot. In his defense, he asks VERY rarely because he knows it can be a bitch, and he and his wife are quick to offer food and such (my wife and I used to share a house with them before we moved out on our own; fun fact - we bought our first house from his wife's father).
I do my best to keep (other) people at arms length when it comes to this stuff because I understand the slippery slope involved.
When I was a kid, my parents would love telling other parents that I could fix computers. They were super proud of it. And then I would get recommended to various people to fix their computers, and they would pay me 20 bucks to spend 6 hours in front of their computer. Eventually when I turned 16, I told my parents not to tell other people that I can fix computers anymore. And for a while, until I was 20, I had given up on the industry entirely, because I was convinced people won't pay you for your work and every other computer nerd I had met was a super fucking hyper-competitive asshole.
Here I am at 34, and I'm now convinced once again that people won't pay you for your work and most of my competitors are comprised of hyper-competitive assholes! Fucking goddamn I was smarter at 16 than I gave myself credit.
I get underbird all the time. I've had companies tell me my work is great and they're happy to have me and then someone's nephew comes along and fucks up their entire network because he installs 4 different antiviruses on each computer and gets paid in pizza for it.
It's not really different professionally either. "hey man I'll do that for you for $100" someone will come out and go "hey I'll do it for $70 and I'll give you a handjob too."
I hate bidding on jobs.
not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
+1
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
We have a list of approved tools that we're allowed to use. Anything from internal tools to NPE, CrystalDiskMark, PCDoctor, Trend Micro (ugh), and a shit ton others. A lot of it is based on whether it's useful and if they either have a licensing agreement that would make it ok for us to use, or if the company can make an agreement with the company. Sometimes programs get removed from the approved tools list, like Kaspersky was recently. Another good example is when we stopped using 3DPChip and 3DPNet because they started being bundled with known adware.
MBAM was dropped from this list a few months ago. No one but folks high up know why for sure, but I'd imagine it has to do with a change in licensing that we didn't want to get involved with. A lot of agents definitely used MBAM as a crutch, and I couldn't use it often because of time constraints (limited time for each job since I'm in a home or business, I can't just start a scan and go do something else). But yeah, a good number of us just remove shit manually and use something simple like NPE to double check for anything that might be lurking we may have missed.
Honestly, my favorite tool is still Revo Uninstaller. I still recommend MBAM to friends and family, though, and to clients. Hell, I run it on my own computer. It's great, just not something we use at work anymore.
then label which port they tie to, then I'd make a makeshift cable organizer since it looks like you don't have room in that rack, and then I'd unravel that rat's nest and hook everything back up to the port that I previously labeled
You could probably get it done in an afternoon
and minimally impact server (it'd be down for a few minutes at the most per port).
Already started doing that. It's just slow-going.
I've gotten the first 100 cables traced back and labeled. There's just another 200 or so to go.
I've been correlating that with an arp table dump so I can build a spreadsheet that lists
Patch port - switch port - MAC address - IP address - Hostname
every person who doesn't like an acquired taste always seems to think everyone who likes it is faking it. it should be an official fallacy.
We have a list of approved tools that we're allowed to use. Anything from internal tools to NPE, CrystalDiskMark, PCDoctor, Trend Micro (ugh), and a shit ton others. A lot of it is based on whether it's useful and if they either have a licensing agreement that would make it ok for us to use, or if the company can make an agreement with the company. Sometimes programs get removed from the approved tools list, like Kaspersky was recently. Another good example is when we stopped using 3DPChip and 3DPNet because they started being bundled with known adware.
MBAM was dropped from this list a few months ago. No one but folks high up know why for sure, but I'd imagine it has to do with a change in licensing that we didn't want to get involved with. A lot of agents definitely used MBAM as a crutch, and I couldn't use it often because of time constraints (limited time for each job since I'm in a home or business, I can't just start a scan and go do something else). But yeah, a good number of us just remove shit manually and use something simple like NPE to double check for anything that might be lurking we may have missed.
Honestly, my favorite tool is still Revo Uninstaller. I still recommend MBAM to friends and family, though, and to clients. Hell, I run it on my own computer. It's great, just not something we use at work anymore.
I recently have had to use BitDefender Rescue, which you boot from a CD or flash drive, and I'm very happy with it. It's found things on two recent occasions where neither Windows Defender nor MBAM found anything at all. Plus I love shutting down a Windows PC, booting into Linux, and scaring the shit out of the user.
"Wait is my PC going to be replaced with Linux??"
*without looking at the user* "I mean, probably, but we'll see....."
"GAAAHHH!!! Boss! I'm upset! Hold me! They're taking my Windows away!"
I'll fix shit for my kids and sometimes for my parents when I just don't have anything else at all better to do.
Anyone else gets about 20 seconds to explain what the problem is and I'll give them no more than 2 short suggestions. And god help you if that was the only thing you called/came over for.
I'll fix shit for my kids and sometimes for my parents when I just don't have anything else at all better to do.
Anyone else gets about 20 seconds to explain what the problem is and I'll give them no more than 2 short suggestions. And god help you if that was the only thing you called/came over for.
I help my parents because I get fed.
I'm a grown ass adult and I feed myself.
Also my parents live 1100 miles away.
My parents put 18 years into raising my ass and also sometimes help with other stuff (my house, my kids, etc...).
I never ever say no to helping my parents with computer stuff. Without them, I wouldn't know enough about computer stuff to be able to help them.
So no one's got any good recommendations for web filtering software eh?
Sorry, man, meant to reply earlier. The big problem with what you're wanting to do is that the filter has to know who is trying to get to what site. The way ours works is we have an exe in the login script that points at the web filter IP address. So that's what associates your IP address with your AD account. (I think you can also install some sort of agent on the AD server to do this part. Or you can just have people login via a web page.) Then it sits right next to the internet switch with a mirrored port so that it can see every packet going out to the internet. If it detects a "bad site" it sends a packet to direct the user's traffic to itself and its block page. It can also be setup in bridge mode (as though it is like a firewall sitting in the middle of your traffic), or as a proxy server (I think). It also has daily filter updates and such.
Obviously there is a cost for the hardware and for the user licenses, but *shrug* for me it was better than trying to hack it.
As you have figured out, DNS-based blocking comes with a whole set of issues. I'm sure there are ways to do this with a Squid cache proxy or something, but we can afford a mostly turnkey solution, so nah.
I can PM you some details on pricing and such if you want.
I'll fix shit for my kids and sometimes for my parents when I just don't have anything else at all better to do.
Anyone else gets about 20 seconds to explain what the problem is and I'll give them no more than 2 short suggestions. And god help you if that was the only thing you called/came over for.
So no one's got any good recommendations for web filtering software eh?
Sorry, man, meant to reply earlier. The big problem with what you're wanting to do is that the filter has to know who is trying to get to what site. The way ours works is we have an exe in the login script that points at the web filter IP address. So that's what associates your IP address with your AD account. (I think you can also install some sort of agent on the AD server to do this part. Or you can just have people login via a web page.) Then it sits right next to the internet switch with a mirrored port so that it can see every packet going out to the internet. If it detects a "bad site" it sends a packet to direct the user's traffic to itself and its block page. It can also be setup in bridge mode (as though it is like a firewall sitting in the middle of your traffic), or as a proxy server (I think). It also has daily filter updates and such.
Obviously there is a cost for the hardware and for the user licenses, but *shrug* for me it was better than trying to hack it.
As you have figured out, DNS-based blocking comes with a whole set of issues. I'm sure there are ways to do this with a Squid cache proxy or something, but we can afford a mostly turnkey solution, so nah.
I can PM you some details on pricing and such if you want.
I'm interested in what you're doing, sure. I'd like to avoid the global DNS ones too.
not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
I know at my work we recently got told to nix it cause they came in and did an audit, then charged us a bunch of money
people don't read the licenses on their freeware, shit ain't always free
also our official policy from on high with malware is to nuke the machine, every time, so cleaning tools are unnecessary
life's a game that you're bound to lose / like using a hammer to pound in screws
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
I'll fix shit for my kids and sometimes for my parents when I just don't have anything else at all better to do.
Anyone else gets about 20 seconds to explain what the problem is and I'll give them no more than 2 short suggestions. And god help you if that was the only thing you called/came over for.
I help my parents because I get fed.
I'm a grown ass adult and I feed myself.
Also my parents live 1100 miles away.
My parents put 18 years into raising my ass
I passed 36, we're even.
I am certain they put more time into raising you over those 18 years than you have helping them with their computers over the subsequent 18 years.
Or perhaps not, which explains your attitude toward helping them.
that gets all the computers connected to the domain, finds out all the users logged in or MAC addresses (with ARP) of those computers, and gives me remote access to view their screens, then acts as a HTTP/HTTPS proxy and filters based off the ip address derived from MAC or domain computer.
Easy right?
not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
0
ShadowfireVermont, in the middle of nowhereRegistered Userregular
Is there a domain based website blocking? I want to be able to restrict certain websites from certain users, and for some users, outright block the internet.
Lots of things can do this: things like UTMs, ASAs, fortigates, etc. can do that
Or a proxy like a bluecoat or whatever.
+1
Apothe0sisHave you ever questioned the nature of your reality?Registered Userregular
then label which port they tie to, then I'd make a makeshift cable organizer since it looks like you don't have room in that rack, and then I'd unravel that rat's nest and hook everything back up to the port that I previously labeled
You could probably get it done in an afternoon
and minimally impact server (it'd be down for a few minutes at the most per port).
Already started doing that. It's just slow-going.
I've gotten the first 100 cables traced back and labeled. There's just another 200 or so to go.
I've been correlating that with an arp table dump so I can build a spreadsheet that lists
Patch port - switch port - MAC address - IP address - Hostname
this is a great solution. we hear complaints about the extra length on these switches *all the time* from the customer/folks that actually have to rack and manage them.
Posts
MalwareBytes is no longer an approved tool for us. And many of us prefer to do manual removals anyway.
But, you know...
People got real mad at first but it was one of the better things I have done.
Just because your mechanic friend will fix your car for a case of beer does not mean I will do it for free.
Especially at a family gathering where I came to see people I like and not spend the whole time in your office fixing your shit.
XBL:Phenyhelm - 3DS:Phenyhelm
I have a friend whose computer I built for him, and he's still very hesitant to ask me for help. Granted, the thing was running like complete ass for so long that he asked be for help (big surprise, it was HP's "utility" for the family's printer eating up every ounce of free RAM).
He's due for a full rebuild, so I'll likely help him with that; then get TeamViewer installed for when things inevitably shit themselves. He's a bit more open to computer support and proper responsible computer ownership, now that he works from home a lot. In his defense, he asks VERY rarely because he knows it can be a bitch, and he and his wife are quick to offer food and such (my wife and I used to share a house with them before we moved out on our own; fun fact - we bought our first house from his wife's father).
I do my best to keep (other) people at arms length when it comes to this stuff because I understand the slippery slope involved.
Anyone else gets about 20 seconds to explain what the problem is and I'll give them no more than 2 short suggestions. And god help you if that was the only thing you called/came over for.
There's a long list of bullshit I have to deal with, but among that list is how...
...Catalyst 3850s stick out from the rack about an inch, which means that a lot of cable management solutions are effectively unusable.
So now I have a bunch of Panduit cable managers that I can't use, and our VAR is fucking slow when shipping new cable management stuff. Getting replacements is just going to slow this project down another week.
My boss is already frustrated with how long it's taking and I'm like... I am literally the only person at this company with a reasonable level of knowledge of basic TCP/IP concepts, our cables are a goddamn rats nest, the VLAN and subnet configurations on our layer 3 switches aren't much better, we have literally everything monitored so I can't unplug a patch cable without alarms and klaxons going off, and occasionally I run into load-bearing posters like the weird spanning-tree configuration I posted about last month.
This mess is going to take a long time to untangle, and, no my coworkers can't help and there's no point in delegating any of this shit.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
I help my parents because I get fed.
My stepmother in law is a doctor, and she does stuff for me all the time for free. This is why she is literally the only person I will do free shit for.
It's also why I don't ask people to help me with things. They'll help me move a couch and then be like, "Oh so hey I was wondering if you could look at my com-"
"Get the fuck out of my house I can do this myself thank you bye!" Yes the 15 seconds it takes you to help me 5-man lift furniture is definitely worth me drinking myself to death in front of your computer for 6 fucking hours. Yes.
Complete with the fiber trunks that somehow got tangled up with copper.
It looks marginally better now as I've tried to make sure new cables are properly routed and bundled but it's still pretty bad.
I can't just tear it all out and start fresh because trunks and access ports are intermingled. (Gi3/0/32 might be going to a printer, 33 to a router, 34 to a workstation.) Different departments are on different VLANs and none of it is documented.
Well, some of it is documented but the documentation is wrong. The description for some of the ports in our old switch configs reference employees who stopped working here before I was even hired.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
https://www.monoprice.com/product?p_id=5792
then label which port they tie to, then I'd make a makeshift cable organizer since it looks like you don't have room in that rack, and then I'd unravel that rat's nest and hook everything back up to the port that I previously labeled
You could probably get it done in an afternoon and minimally impact server (it'd be down for a few minutes at the most per port).
When I was a kid, my parents would love telling other parents that I could fix computers. They were super proud of it. And then I would get recommended to various people to fix their computers, and they would pay me 20 bucks to spend 6 hours in front of their computer. Eventually when I turned 16, I told my parents not to tell other people that I can fix computers anymore. And for a while, until I was 20, I had given up on the industry entirely, because I was convinced people won't pay you for your work and every other computer nerd I had met was a super fucking hyper-competitive asshole.
Here I am at 34, and I'm now convinced once again that people won't pay you for your work and most of my competitors are comprised of hyper-competitive assholes! Fucking goddamn I was smarter at 16 than I gave myself credit.
It's not really different professionally either. "hey man I'll do that for you for $100" someone will come out and go "hey I'll do it for $70 and I'll give you a handjob too."
I hate bidding on jobs.
We have a list of approved tools that we're allowed to use. Anything from internal tools to NPE, CrystalDiskMark, PCDoctor, Trend Micro (ugh), and a shit ton others. A lot of it is based on whether it's useful and if they either have a licensing agreement that would make it ok for us to use, or if the company can make an agreement with the company. Sometimes programs get removed from the approved tools list, like Kaspersky was recently. Another good example is when we stopped using 3DPChip and 3DPNet because they started being bundled with known adware.
MBAM was dropped from this list a few months ago. No one but folks high up know why for sure, but I'd imagine it has to do with a change in licensing that we didn't want to get involved with. A lot of agents definitely used MBAM as a crutch, and I couldn't use it often because of time constraints (limited time for each job since I'm in a home or business, I can't just start a scan and go do something else). But yeah, a good number of us just remove shit manually and use something simple like NPE to double check for anything that might be lurking we may have missed.
Honestly, my favorite tool is still Revo Uninstaller. I still recommend MBAM to friends and family, though, and to clients. Hell, I run it on my own computer. It's great, just not something we use at work anymore.
Already started doing that. It's just slow-going.
I've gotten the first 100 cables traced back and labeled. There's just another 200 or so to go.
I've been correlating that with an arp table dump so I can build a spreadsheet that lists
Patch port - switch port - MAC address - IP address - Hostname
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
I recently have had to use BitDefender Rescue, which you boot from a CD or flash drive, and I'm very happy with it. It's found things on two recent occasions where neither Windows Defender nor MBAM found anything at all. Plus I love shutting down a Windows PC, booting into Linux, and scaring the shit out of the user.
"Wait is my PC going to be replaced with Linux??"
*without looking at the user* "I mean, probably, but we'll see....."
"GAAAHHH!!! Boss! I'm upset! Hold me! They're taking my Windows away!"
:biggrin:
I'm a grown ass adult and I feed myself.
Also my parents live 1100 miles away.
I might take a picture later.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
My parents put 18 years into raising my ass and also sometimes help with other stuff (my house, my kids, etc...).
I never ever say no to helping my parents with computer stuff. Without them, I wouldn't know enough about computer stuff to be able to help them.
Other family is an ever-changing situation.
The moment they had access to a resource for computer help they way over used it.
XBL:Phenyhelm - 3DS:Phenyhelm
Obviously there is a cost for the hardware and for the user licenses, but *shrug* for me it was better than trying to hack it.
As you have figured out, DNS-based blocking comes with a whole set of issues. I'm sure there are ways to do this with a Squid cache proxy or something, but we can afford a mostly turnkey solution, so nah.
I can PM you some details on pricing and such if you want.
This is a clickable link to my Steam Profile.
I passed 36, we're even.
I mean, basically everywhere I've ever been has been Barracuda or Palo Alto.
We have forcepoint. It's good, but will be hard to get it settled in. It can also be hard to get knowledgeable help from them.
I'm interested in what you're doing, sure. I'd like to avoid the global DNS ones too.
I know at my work we recently got told to nix it cause they came in and did an audit, then charged us a bunch of money
people don't read the licenses on their freeware, shit ain't always free
also our official policy from on high with malware is to nuke the machine, every time, so cleaning tools are unnecessary
fuck up once and you break your thumb / if you're happy at all then you're god damn dumb
that's right we're on a fucked up cruise / God is dead but at least we have booze
bad things happen, no one knows why / the sun burns out and everyone dies
Not software-based, no.
Appliance based, yeah. Same recommendations I put a little further up. Palo Alto or Websense.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
I am certain they put more time into raising you over those 18 years than you have helping them with their computers over the subsequent 18 years.
Or perhaps not, which explains your attitude toward helping them.
*shrug*
These seem less "help me filter web pages" and more "PLZ HELP ME STOP VIRUSES KTHX"
...Fuck You.
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
I mean, they do both.
I really prefer them for stopping viruses and malware because I couldn't give any fewer shits about whether people use the Internet to good off.
But you can also block by category ("porn") or by URL patterns (*.hampsterdance.com).
the "no true scotch man" fallacy.
just gonna write my own
that gets all the computers connected to the domain, finds out all the users logged in or MAC addresses (with ARP) of those computers, and gives me remote access to view their screens, then acts as a HTTP/HTTPS proxy and filters based off the ip address derived from MAC or domain computer.
Easy right?
Yeah, the licensing doesn't care about home use, but very specifically calls out businesses. We had a contract with them, but I'm sure that exploded.
Lots of things can do this: things like UTMs, ASAs, fortigates, etc. can do that
Or a proxy like a bluecoat or whatever.
http://osb.unveiltech.com
XBL:Phenyhelm - 3DS:Phenyhelm
this is a great solution. we hear complaints about the extra length on these switches *all the time* from the customer/folks that actually have to rack and manage them.