To be honest the cooldown conversation never takes into account the fact we have a new skill that is on a shorter cd than all skills on d1. And in both warlock and Titan case it's way more useful than a melee and probably a nade. Especially for pve.
Edit: Like yes your other skills might take longer in d2 but you likely are using skills more often cause you have 3 not 2
So. Yeah folks are looking to complain a bit imo
The warlock's rift cooldown is 60 seconds, compared to the titan's 30ish for the barrier and the hunters 15ish for the dodge-roll
so at least for warlocks it not on a shorter cooldown than anything else.
and of course people are going to complain, they went from 25 seconds on a grenade, to 75 seconds. Baseline D1 is like 60 seconds for a grenade, but its only that long while you play the early missions that were designed around that. I suspect in the full game we won't be as hobbled by bad armor once people get to the level/power cap.
All of that being said, not getting a super during a pvp match at least once just feels bad. They kept the same super build rate as D1, but the matches are literally 2-4 minutes shorter and with less targets to build energy.
While it's true the warlock cooldown isn't shorter than base d1 nade/melee keep in mind it also lasts a while. So the cooldown from when it's done to when it's ready again is shorter. Quite a bit shorter.
But my point is more folks are complaining it's just CoD guns because there's a 20% increase in cooldowns. But there's a whole third skill to use on its own cooldown. So you have a skill available more often and more skills to strategize around.
Even if you have your nade less and your melee less you have a class skill to make up for it
And again, final build will be different from beta build, so the base cooldowns are probably already lower
I doubt it. Like people have said, they aren't too far off of baseline D1 cooldowns, just without any way to shorten them. Everyone got used to stuff like ashes to assets, cooldown reduction on kill perks, whole bunch of other things. If they bring back some of those "performance" based modifiers that might be all it needs.
I don't know, like even the guns don't feel as good to me as Destiny's. I was using a full auto scout and it just, didn't have the satsifying crack/followup that scouts in D1 have. The pulse rifle feels like garbage. This combined with abilities being on absurd cooldowns and I feel like it's a different, worse game than Destiny 1. At the very least I'm canceling my special edition preorder, we'll see how I feel in September.
I agree that Melee and Grenade could charge faster, but I'm spoiled by 13 second grenades with Frostees and we don't know what end game exotics and stats will look like.
Supers being able to wipe a team easily now means they dominate more. And with orbs it would be all too easy to chain super enemies into oblivion. I agree that kills in PvP should award a bit more super energy, but as is you still get your super first if you are kicking ass. It also encourages you to be more careful about timing the super. Do you pop it first, hoping no one else has it? Should you wait for others to use theirs first? It's slower but a much more fair experience for average players.
Yeah, and if the gunplay were better I'd be mostly okay with it. But worse gunplay AND worse cooldowns? It feels like I'm spending a lot of time to not have as much fun.
As someone who's wiped a team with the new Fist a few times, I can say that getting that thing twice in a match would be dicey.
But also if people aren't careful you can team shoot someone in a super down with energy weapons pretty easily, so I guess I'm not sure what my argument is.
I do want hit registration across the board to be better, I played a few matches tonight where shots were just disappearing into the ether and I honestly wonder if that's contributing to some people's feelings about ttk and feeling less powerful overall.
That I can play an entire PVP match and never get to use my super is ridiculous
Yeah supers should be quicker. But keep in mind that's more about the length of matches than the cooldown. But kills should do more towards it to quicken them and spread out the usage a bit. Right now they are clumped and it ruins it a bit
Yeah, and if the gunplay were better I'd be mostly okay with it. But worse gunplay AND worse cooldowns? It feels like I'm spending a lot of time to not have as much fun.
Can you elaborate on gunplay being worse? I'm not seeing it so I'm curious to what you mean
I feel like that's all down to preference. I was initally unimpressed with Better Devils, but I started really pacing my shots and getting in closer. I can reliably 4 shot people if one or two land as headshots. It feels great.
Most of the guns don't feel as good to use. I have a real hard time explaining it because how good it feels in Destiny is probably a bunch of little things that are hard to explain to begin with, but the feedback I get from shooting guns in Destiny 2 doesn't feel right. The guns pitch in weird ways, the bullets don't arrive where I think they're going to arrive when I think they're going to arrive.
I'm not asking for every gun to feel like Vision of Confluence or Doom of Chelchis, but it feels like I'm getting an entire armory full of The Distant Stars. And that gun sucks.
Most of the guns don't feel as good to use. I have a real hard time explaining it because how good it feels in Destiny is probably a bunch of little things that are hard to explain to begin with, but the feedback I get from shooting guns in Destiny 2 doesn't feel right. The guns pitch in weird ways, the bullets don't arrive where I think they're going to arrive when I think they're going to arrive.
I'm not asking for every gun to feel like Vision of Confluence or Doom of Chelchis, but it feels like I'm getting an entire armory full of The Distant Stars. And that gun sucks.
You did, in fact, get an armory full of guns for D2 which were all literally guns to which the devs said, "We can show this to beta players. That's fine. It sucks enough overall that we're not spoiling anyone."
Quick aside about super that doesn't have to do with cooldowns:
Why the hell does voidwalker still only get 1 nova bomb shot? It's literally the only non-roaming super of the 6 classes we've seen so far, and now it doesn't necessarily kill someone else in super form either (and sentinel can literally block to eat the whole thing).
It might make for good PVP balance, but PVE would suffer greatly.
Honestly that seems to be the theme of Destiny 2, which sucks because I buy competitive shooters twice a year, but co-operative shooters aren't nearly as common. Please Bungie, do not disappoint.
Most of the guns don't feel as good to use. I have a real hard time explaining it because how good it feels in Destiny is probably a bunch of little things that are hard to explain to begin with, but the feedback I get from shooting guns in Destiny 2 doesn't feel right. The guns pitch in weird ways, the bullets don't arrive where I think they're going to arrive when I think they're going to arrive.
I'm not asking for every gun to feel like Vision of Confluence or Doom of Chelchis, but it feels like I'm getting an entire armory full of The Distant Stars. And that gun sucks.
I will say that to me, and some of the other guys, it seems to be an opposite opinion. Guns feel just as good, maybe better in some cases, than D1 guns. I feel they really cranked the audio feedback up a notch. But beyond even that the recoil and trails the bullets leave now give a more tactile experience. I honestly haven't played with the Scouts too much since outside of covering Market in Countdown I feel like there are better choices because of the maps we have but the pulses both felt good. Nergal was a little squirrely but all the super fast fire pulses can be until you get used to them and both of the Autos felt as good as the best autos from D1 to me (maybe even better) as far as recoil and range.
+4
ObiFettUse the ForceAs You WishRegistered Userregular
Quick aside about super that doesn't have to do with cooldowns:
Why the hell does voidwalker still only get 1 nova bomb shot? It's literally the only non-roaming super of the 6 classes we've seen so far, and now it doesn't necessarily kill someone else in super form either (and sentinel can literally block to eat the whole thing).
Based on commentary back before the first D2 videos I was fully expecting Voidwalker's subclass equivalent to have some kind of roving, mini-nova-bomb-flinging Super. The skeet-shoot super-axion-bolt Super is pretty disappointing. Like, it's not awful and I might well pick that in D1 for some content if it were an option but it doesn't seem to stack up with the other Supers.
Keep in mind the skill trees posted from the e3 reveal ended up way different than the beta. So there's a chance we see some big changes before launch
I would be shocked if one of those were changing the nova to roaming. It seems the skeet shoot was their version of that but nobody likes it at all
The problem with one choice being roaming is that it has to be bad to avoid being the obvious choice. You don't need to "choose" roaming on Striker, you just get that and then make decisions from there.
And regarding the supers being less often because of match length... Uh how is that an excuse? Increase the Super gain on kill or passive growth until we get them in the middle of the shorter match. It's not like they're forced into D1 Super paradigm and had to sacrifice getting them at a fun point in the match (the middle) in order to accomplish their other goals.
And I get it's a beta build, but you know the beta is going to be your first public impression. Why you'd be okay with that impression being "slower and less exciting" blows my mind.
Because supers chaos wasn't good pvp? And the current pvp is much much much much better in a lot of folks opinion? It's not less exciting. It's more strategic.
Because supers chaos wasn't good pvp? And the current pvp is much much much much better in a lot of folks opinion? It's not less exciting. It's more strategic.
I'm avoiding the beta PvP because I'd rather see it at release and not face sweaty folks who see a chance to fight on one map with low-ability-availability.
That said, there are enough people who enjoy ability/super chaos that Inferno became a thing two years into D1. Sure there are people who really enjoy just fighting it out Primary vs Primary but there are a lot of people who enjoy chucking 'nades and supering left and right (and being on the receiving end of that) as well.
Right but it's not just promise vs primary. You literally have a whole new ability. For both pvp and pve. I feel like folks are taking that for granted just because it doesn't give kills instantly.
Because supers chaos wasn't good pvp? And the current pvp is much much much much better in a lot of folks opinion? It's not less exciting. It's more strategic.
Supers chaos IS the current build because people get them at the end of the round and all turn them on at once. And I would describe this "more strategic" as boring as fuck. If they want to do a Pro, not Pro split like Gears 4 did, I'd be totally fine with that. But the two modes in there currently are not different feeling at all.
Right but it's not just promise vs primary. You literally have a whole new ability. For both pvp and pve. I feel like folks are taking that for granted just because it doesn't give kills instantly.
Well, yeah. being able to put up a thing that heals me or a big wall or an dodge-roll every 30 seconds isn't all that exciting compared to supers/grenades/melee.
Right but it's not just promise vs primary. You literally have a whole new ability. For both pvp and pve. I feel like folks are taking that for granted just because it doesn't give kills instantly.
Having not played the beta PvP and having only played Warlock, I don't feel like the puddles mean much in PvP unless you're playing with a fireteam.
For a fireteam then, yeah, having a heal or +dmg puddle can mean a lot.
Playing with randos and no team chat? Basically meaningless.
The gunplay is still Destiny, very satisfying to pop enemy heads. Movement, aim, and shoot are still top notch. The darth maul super for hunter is...interesting.
Yet, I still have found nothing that screams that it couldn't be done in the first Destiny.
Destiny 1 couldn't handle scale like D2 seems to be able to.
The size of the patrol area before the strike is easily double that of patrol areas in D1.
Also, the size of some of the arena in the Strike are bigger than anything I've ever seen in Destiny.
They are also working off a completely rebuilt engine that, for one, let's them tweak individual gun stats.
Destiny 1 was a great start, but we are getting plenty of stuff in D2 that the first just could not handle, mainly due to the engine the first was running on.
Oh, I didn't see where I could patrol in the beta? Did I miss it?
Like, I believe you. None of these improvements come across in the beta though.
Bigger size could just be attributed to them dropping lastgen support, but again, I didn't see that reflected in the open beta. As someone who doesn't follow the blogs or insider spec sheets, doesn't seem that different.
The gunplay is still Destiny, very satisfying to pop enemy heads. Movement, aim, and shoot are still top notch. The darth maul super for hunter is...interesting.
Yet, I still have found nothing that screams that it couldn't be done in the first Destiny.
Destiny 1 couldn't handle scale like D2 seems to be able to.
The size of the patrol area before the strike is easily double that of patrol areas in D1.
Also, the size of some of the arena in the Strike are bigger than anything I've ever seen in Destiny.
They are also working off a completely rebuilt engine that, for one, let's them tweak individual gun stats.
Destiny 1 was a great start, but we are getting plenty of stuff in D2 that the first just could not handle, mainly due to the engine the first was running on.
Oh, I didn't see where I could patrol in the beta? Did I miss it?
Like, I believe you. None of these improvements come across in the beta though.
Bigger size could just be attributed to them dropping lastgen support, but again, I didn't see that reflected in the open beta. As someone who doesn't follow the blogs or insider spec sheets, doesn't seem that different.
There's not a patrol in the beta but they've said the European Dead Zone patrol is the largest open area Bungie has implemented to date.
The gunplay is still Destiny, very satisfying to pop enemy heads. Movement, aim, and shoot are still top notch. The darth maul super for hunter is...interesting.
Yet, I still have found nothing that screams that it couldn't be done in the first Destiny.
Destiny 1 couldn't handle scale like D2 seems to be able to.
The size of the patrol area before the strike is easily double that of patrol areas in D1.
Also, the size of some of the arena in the Strike are bigger than anything I've ever seen in Destiny.
They are also working off a completely rebuilt engine that, for one, let's them tweak individual gun stats.
Destiny 1 was a great start, but we are getting plenty of stuff in D2 that the first just could not handle, mainly due to the engine the first was running on.
Oh, I didn't see where I could patrol in the beta? Did I miss it?
Like, I believe you. None of these improvements come across in the beta though.
Bigger size could just be attributed to them dropping lastgen support, but again, I didn't see that reflected in the open beta. As someone who doesn't follow the blogs or insider spec sheets, doesn't seem that different.
You could wander around the area you spawn into on Nessus when doing the strike. It appears to be part of the patrol area, though probably not the entire thing. I would agree that the part we had access to is huge compared to any single "chunk" of the old patrol area's, but it's not quite as big as the entire maps. If this is just one of like 3-5 chunks, and we have 4 total maps this will be a decent bit bigger than D1.
+3
ObiFettUse the ForceAs You WishRegistered Userregular
The gunplay is still Destiny, very satisfying to pop enemy heads. Movement, aim, and shoot are still top notch. The darth maul super for hunter is...interesting.
Yet, I still have found nothing that screams that it couldn't be done in the first Destiny.
Destiny 1 couldn't handle scale like D2 seems to be able to.
The size of the patrol area before the strike is easily double that of patrol areas in D1.
Also, the size of some of the arena in the Strike are bigger than anything I've ever seen in Destiny.
They are also working off a completely rebuilt engine that, for one, let's them tweak individual gun stats.
Destiny 1 was a great start, but we are getting plenty of stuff in D2 that the first just could not handle, mainly due to the engine the first was running on.
Oh, I didn't see where I could patrol in the beta? Did I miss it?
Like, I believe you. None of these improvements come across in the beta though.
Bigger size could just be attributed to them dropping lastgen support, but again, I didn't see that reflected in the open beta. As someone who doesn't follow the blogs or insider spec sheets, doesn't seem that different.
You couldn't patrol, but if you wandered around the area before entering the strike, it becomes obvious that is a patrol area. And the area you can wander around in without getting into a loading area is huge compared to Destiny 1.
And they couldn't just drop last gen support in Destiny 1 and still be able to do what they are doing like they are in Destiny 2. They needed a whole new engine and back-end support to solve many of the problems that screwed up Destiny 1. So thats why we are getting a new game.
edit: well that and contractually they are supposed to release a new game right now. Had they developed their engine and back-end correctly the first time, we might be having a different conversation right now and maybe seeing more marked improvements in their second entry in the series. But as is, they had to spend time practically remaking major parts of the original game from scratch. Hopefully they got it right this time, which will let them just focus on improvements rather than rebuilds and we will see a major upgrade in Destiny 3.
Basically, I get where you are coming from in thinking that stuff we saw in the beta could be done in D1, but an expansion wouldn't have covered any of the improvements they are laying foundationally that will allow them to continue to improve the game past certain inherent Destiny 1 barriers.
Because supers chaos wasn't good pvp? And the current pvp is much much much much better in a lot of folks opinion? It's not less exciting. It's more strategic.
Supers chaos IS the current build because people get them at the end of the round and all turn them on at once. And I would describe this "more strategic" as boring as fuck. If they want to do a Pro, not Pro split like Gears 4 did, I'd be totally fine with that. But the two modes in there currently are not different feeling at all.
your stance on the current strategic pvp is exactly how I feel about destiny 1 one hit kill ability weapon and super spam. Especially when their net code couldn't handle it and melees would be all over the place and lag would cause you to die to things randomly. It was fun but absolutely awful at times. Especially once they switched to more sbmm and things got laggier.
Chances are they will still have some sort of Mayham playlist that will be more fun for you. But for a lot of players who have been bungie fans through the halo series this pvp is amazing.
That being said, I do agree with the current state of supers in pvp. I have said before that I feel kills should give more so that it can spread them out more and also allow for 2 in one game if you dominate which would give orbs more of a role.
I'm not sure anyone can defend the current super charge rate. But it gets wrapped in a very defensible ability charge rate discussion.
Also the two modes don't feel anything alike to me at all. Control is way faster and mobile and countdown is trials with an objective to keep everything a bit centered and moving along.
I'm gonna get real defensive, real fast if you equate "liking these settings" with "being a long term Halo fan" so I urge you not to do that. I will respect your general viewpoint that the current settings appeal to you in some ways. I will of course be giving it more of a shot in retail to see how it turns out.
Right but it's not just promise vs primary. You literally have a whole new ability. For both pvp and pve. I feel like folks are taking that for granted just because it doesn't give kills instantly.
Having not played the beta PvP and having only played Warlock, I don't feel like the puddles mean much in PvP unless you're playing with a fireteam.
For a fireteam then, yeah, having a heal or +dmg puddle can mean a lot.
Playing with randos and no team chat? Basically meaningless.
Well I think warlock is the hardest to take advantage of solo. But with the focus on team shooting and poking, imagine you pop out and fire a burst at a player. You miss. He hits his burst in you. You fire again and hit but so does he. You're hurting bad. You duck behind cover and he pushes. You throw your rift down and now when he comes around you have regen going and are back full and potentially an overshield.
You murder him.
Or maybe you set regen going then run off to regroup with teammates. Or maybe you show up late to a fight and see your team won but they are all hurting, throw down the rift.
It's the hardest to use solo but it's still a useful ability. but the main point is it gives another dimension of the game to use, so it's less just primary shooting than even d1 cause ability use and countering that is important. (see a guy rift in a corner? Nade him?
which you saved because you have adapted to the new Gabe and realize blind throwing them is a super bad idea in d2
Quick aside about super that doesn't have to do with cooldowns:
Why the hell does voidwalker still only get 1 nova bomb shot? It's literally the only non-roaming super of the 6 classes we've seen so far, and now it doesn't necessarily kill someone else in super form either (and sentinel can literally block to eat the whole thing).
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I love this Warlock tree's Nova bomb. It's super weird, which is how I like my void abilities, you can airburst it now, and airbursting it spawns a bunch of seeking projectiles. It's super good.
Because supers chaos wasn't good pvp? And the current pvp is much much much much better in a lot of folks opinion? It's not less exciting. It's more strategic.
Supers chaos IS the current build because people get them at the end of the round and all turn them on at once. And I would describe this "more strategic" as boring as fuck. If they want to do a Pro, not Pro split like Gears 4 did, I'd be totally fine with that. But the two modes in there currently are not different feeling at all.
your stance on the current strategic pvp is exactly how I feel about destiny 1 one hit kill ability weapon and super spam. Especially when their net code couldn't handle it and melees would be all over the place and lag would cause you to die to things randomly. It was fun but absolutely awful at times. Especially once they switched to more sbmm and things got laggier.
Chances are they will still have some sort of Mayham playlist that will be more fun for you. But for a lot of players who have been bungie fans through the halo series this pvp is amazing.
That being said, I do agree with the current state of supers in pvp. I have said before that I feel kills should give more so that it can spread them out more and also allow for 2 in one game if you dominate which would give orbs more of a role.
I'm not sure anyone can defend the current super charge rate. But it gets wrapped in a very defensible ability charge rate discussion.
Also the two modes don't feel anything alike to me at all. Control is way faster and mobile and countdown is trials with an objective to keep everything a bit centered and moving along.
I thought countdown was kind of boring, tbh... and I was disappointed there were no chickens to shoot on the map. Or maybe there were and I never found them. really just felt too much like counter-strike variant, imo...
Have to say that 4v4 control was more interesting than I thought it would be.
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While it's true the warlock cooldown isn't shorter than base d1 nade/melee keep in mind it also lasts a while. So the cooldown from when it's done to when it's ready again is shorter. Quite a bit shorter.
But my point is more folks are complaining it's just CoD guns because there's a 20% increase in cooldowns. But there's a whole third skill to use on its own cooldown. So you have a skill available more often and more skills to strategize around.
Even if you have your nade less and your melee less you have a class skill to make up for it
I doubt it. Like people have said, they aren't too far off of baseline D1 cooldowns, just without any way to shorten them. Everyone got used to stuff like ashes to assets, cooldown reduction on kill perks, whole bunch of other things. If they bring back some of those "performance" based modifiers that might be all it needs.
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Yeah supers should be quicker. But keep in mind that's more about the length of matches than the cooldown
Supers being able to wipe a team easily now means they dominate more. And with orbs it would be all too easy to chain super enemies into oblivion. I agree that kills in PvP should award a bit more super energy, but as is you still get your super first if you are kicking ass. It also encourages you to be more careful about timing the super. Do you pop it first, hoping no one else has it? Should you wait for others to use theirs first? It's slower but a much more fair experience for average players.
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But also if people aren't careful you can team shoot someone in a super down with energy weapons pretty easily, so I guess I'm not sure what my argument is.
I do want hit registration across the board to be better, I played a few matches tonight where shots were just disappearing into the ether and I honestly wonder if that's contributing to some people's feelings about ttk and feeling less powerful overall.
Yeah supers should be quicker. But keep in mind that's more about the length of matches than the cooldown. But kills should do more towards it to quicken them and spread out the usage a bit. Right now they are clumped and it ruins it a bit
Can you elaborate on gunplay being worse? I'm not seeing it so I'm curious to what you mean
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I'm not asking for every gun to feel like Vision of Confluence or Doom of Chelchis, but it feels like I'm getting an entire armory full of The Distant Stars. And that gun sucks.
You did, in fact, get an armory full of guns for D2 which were all literally guns to which the devs said, "We can show this to beta players. That's fine. It sucks enough overall that we're not spoiling anyone."
Why the hell does voidwalker still only get 1 nova bomb shot? It's literally the only non-roaming super of the 6 classes we've seen so far, and now it doesn't necessarily kill someone else in super form either (and sentinel can literally block to eat the whole thing).
Honestly that seems to be the theme of Destiny 2, which sucks because I buy competitive shooters twice a year, but co-operative shooters aren't nearly as common. Please Bungie, do not disappoint.
I will say that to me, and some of the other guys, it seems to be an opposite opinion. Guns feel just as good, maybe better in some cases, than D1 guns. I feel they really cranked the audio feedback up a notch. But beyond even that the recoil and trails the bullets leave now give a more tactile experience. I honestly haven't played with the Scouts too much since outside of covering Market in Countdown I feel like there are better choices because of the maps we have but the pulses both felt good. Nergal was a little squirrely but all the super fast fire pulses can be until you get used to them and both of the Autos felt as good as the best autos from D1 to me (maybe even better) as far as recoil and range.
Agree with this wholeheartedly.
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I would be shocked if one of those were changing the nova to roaming. It seems the skeet shoot was their version of that but nobody likes it at all
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The problem with one choice being roaming is that it has to be bad to avoid being the obvious choice. You don't need to "choose" roaming on Striker, you just get that and then make decisions from there.
And regarding the supers being less often because of match length... Uh how is that an excuse? Increase the Super gain on kill or passive growth until we get them in the middle of the shorter match. It's not like they're forced into D1 Super paradigm and had to sacrifice getting them at a fun point in the match (the middle) in order to accomplish their other goals.
And I get it's a beta build, but you know the beta is going to be your first public impression. Why you'd be okay with that impression being "slower and less exciting" blows my mind.
I'm avoiding the beta PvP because I'd rather see it at release and not face sweaty folks who see a chance to fight on one map with low-ability-availability.
That said, there are enough people who enjoy ability/super chaos that Inferno became a thing two years into D1. Sure there are people who really enjoy just fighting it out Primary vs Primary but there are a lot of people who enjoy chucking 'nades and supering left and right (and being on the receiving end of that) as well.
Supers chaos IS the current build because people get them at the end of the round and all turn them on at once. And I would describe this "more strategic" as boring as fuck. If they want to do a Pro, not Pro split like Gears 4 did, I'd be totally fine with that. But the two modes in there currently are not different feeling at all.
Well, yeah. being able to put up a thing that heals me or a big wall or an dodge-roll every 30 seconds isn't all that exciting compared to supers/grenades/melee.
Having not played the beta PvP and having only played Warlock, I don't feel like the puddles mean much in PvP unless you're playing with a fireteam.
For a fireteam then, yeah, having a heal or +dmg puddle can mean a lot.
Playing with randos and no team chat? Basically meaningless.
Oh, I didn't see where I could patrol in the beta? Did I miss it?
Like, I believe you. None of these improvements come across in the beta though.
Bigger size could just be attributed to them dropping lastgen support, but again, I didn't see that reflected in the open beta. As someone who doesn't follow the blogs or insider spec sheets, doesn't seem that different.
There's not a patrol in the beta but they've said the European Dead Zone patrol is the largest open area Bungie has implemented to date.
You could wander around the area you spawn into on Nessus when doing the strike. It appears to be part of the patrol area, though probably not the entire thing. I would agree that the part we had access to is huge compared to any single "chunk" of the old patrol area's, but it's not quite as big as the entire maps. If this is just one of like 3-5 chunks, and we have 4 total maps this will be a decent bit bigger than D1.
You couldn't patrol, but if you wandered around the area before entering the strike, it becomes obvious that is a patrol area. And the area you can wander around in without getting into a loading area is huge compared to Destiny 1.
And they couldn't just drop last gen support in Destiny 1 and still be able to do what they are doing like they are in Destiny 2. They needed a whole new engine and back-end support to solve many of the problems that screwed up Destiny 1. So thats why we are getting a new game.
edit: well that and contractually they are supposed to release a new game right now. Had they developed their engine and back-end correctly the first time, we might be having a different conversation right now and maybe seeing more marked improvements in their second entry in the series. But as is, they had to spend time practically remaking major parts of the original game from scratch. Hopefully they got it right this time, which will let them just focus on improvements rather than rebuilds and we will see a major upgrade in Destiny 3.
Basically, I get where you are coming from in thinking that stuff we saw in the beta could be done in D1, but an expansion wouldn't have covered any of the improvements they are laying foundationally that will allow them to continue to improve the game past certain inherent Destiny 1 barriers.
Xbox Live / Steam
Chances are they will still have some sort of Mayham playlist that will be more fun for you. But for a lot of players who have been bungie fans through the halo series this pvp is amazing.
That being said, I do agree with the current state of supers in pvp. I have said before that I feel kills should give more so that it can spread them out more and also allow for 2 in one game if you dominate which would give orbs more of a role.
I'm not sure anyone can defend the current super charge rate. But it gets wrapped in a very defensible ability charge rate discussion.
Also the two modes don't feel anything alike to me at all. Control is way faster and mobile and countdown is trials with an objective to keep everything a bit centered and moving along.
Well I think warlock is the hardest to take advantage of solo. But with the focus on team shooting and poking, imagine you pop out and fire a burst at a player. You miss. He hits his burst in you. You fire again and hit but so does he. You're hurting bad. You duck behind cover and he pushes. You throw your rift down and now when he comes around you have regen going and are back full and potentially an overshield.
You murder him.
Or maybe you set regen going then run off to regroup with teammates. Or maybe you show up late to a fight and see your team won but they are all hurting, throw down the rift.
It's the hardest to use solo but it's still a useful ability. but the main point is it gives another dimension of the game to use, so it's less just primary shooting than even d1 cause ability use and countering that is important. (see a guy rift in a corner? Nade him?
Every Titan whose bubble was ever destroyed by a Nova bomb cried out in unison for vengeance. A chorus of fury and spite. "If we are not allowed to have our wall, you shall not have your lance."
Also I ordered the shirt, proudly emblazoned with Pax Arcadia.
Have you seen him? Now you have
Have you seen him? Now you have
I thought countdown was kind of boring, tbh... and I was disappointed there were no chickens to shoot on the map. Or maybe there were and I never found them. really just felt too much like counter-strike variant, imo...
Have to say that 4v4 control was more interesting than I thought it would be.