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[Oxygen Not Included] Breath of Fresh Air! (DLC in Early Access)

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  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    ...I will try again when I get back home

  • BedlamBedlam Registered User regular
    Plumbing was the hardest thing for me to learn in the game.

    I still can struggle with overloading electric wires if im not careful.

    And also somehow building a hot tub that kept taking heat damage because I used the wrong material :rotate:

  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    Bedlam wrote: »
    Plumbing was the hardest thing for me to learn in the game.

    I still can struggle with overloading electric wires if im not careful.

    And also somehow building a hot tub that kept taking heat damage because I used the wrong material :rotate:

    Yeah i havent touched the game much since the big update for dupe happyness came out that added the hottub. Decided to wait until Spaced Out hit and was out of beta - i've played a little bit though, and it looks fun!

    Ideas hate it when you anthropomorphize them
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  • CaptainPeacockCaptainPeacock Board Game Hoarder Top o' the LakeRegistered User regular
    edited July 2021
    Two tips for beginners:

    Water - the polluted water on the map doesn't actually have germs in it, unlike pee water. You can safely use a sieve to turn it into fresh water and dump it right in your reservoir. Be careful of the temp though. You can use ice in a storage container at the bottom of your reservoir to chill it down when needed.

    Power - once you are on coal and smart batteries, you need to use power transformers to limit the power going out to 1k watts. That's the only way to avoid overloads. You'll need multiple transformers in a bank all feeding out as separate lines to different parts of your base.

    Those were the two biggest things that got me out of the early game. After that, learning hatch ranching + shipping solved my food and coal supply problems.

    CaptainPeacock on
    Cluck cluck, gibber gibber, my old man's a mushroom, etc.
  • CaptainPeacockCaptainPeacock Board Game Hoarder Top o' the LakeRegistered User regular
    Also, never use compost. Use thr new thing that turns polluted dirt into polluted oxygen. Combined with deodorizers over a cess pool for pee water will make oxygen for you. Between the deodorizers in there and over the clean polluted water I slowly turn into freshwater, I get a lot of oxygen to pull into my base. That keeps until I can set up a SPOM (which I'm still learning to do).

    Cluck cluck, gibber gibber, my old man's a mushroom, etc.
  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    Oh, I always use compost next to an outhouse.

    Bedlam
  • CaptainPeacockCaptainPeacock Board Game Hoarder Top o' the LakeRegistered User regular
    I used to, until I discovered the new subliminator. Now I'll never go back. Compost isn't needed and it wastes the dupes time since all you get is dirt. Subliminator is just set it and forget it.

    Cluck cluck, gibber gibber, my old man's a mushroom, etc.
  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    Dirt's actually quite valuable depending on what you're doing though. "Never use X" is a pretty bad approach in this game.

    Also you can (and should) still run heavy wire around the place as your bridge. It's easy enough to work around the decor penalty, and generally a lot more efficient to branch transformers off for each section. (This also lets you silo parts of your power grid very easily if you need to shut something down).

    One thing to learn how to do though is to use smart batteries and automation to shut your power generators down when you dont need the power. This saves a ton of resources AND heat production (and CO2 production from coal generators), which is just a big deal. Sometimes late game setups just ignore those though, like when you're using CO2 from Petrolem generators to feed Slicksters (Who make more oil... and meat, and eggs)

    Ideas hate it when you anthropomorphize them
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  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    I have done a couple attempts at a no compost playthrough and do not want.

    Oxygen is easy to make, even without a SPOM.

  • MvrckMvrck Registered User regular
    @Fencingsax and any beginners:

    Also worth noting that you should pretty much never, ever, ever use a T-Junction in piping and vents. They cause fairly heavy lag later into the game and are inefficient for splitting branches from your main delivery trunk. It's best to learn to avoid them early on, it saves tons of headaches later. If you need to split it, always use a bridge. Bridges take priority (IE, a bridge will suck up every available packet until it's full), so if you need to balance a constant stream of input, use valves just behind the bridge to limit the flow, but for probably 95% of applications, you'll just let it top off and then continue down the main trunk of your pipes.

    PwH4Ipj.jpg
  • MvrckMvrck Registered User regular
    edited July 2021
    An updated post of other useful things I've posted at times but are lost back who knows where and may contain other outdated info. I've spoiled the "Hacky" list altogether, in case people don't want to mess with how the base game mechanics interact. There will be images inside spoiler tags within the respective lists. Don't click if you don't want to see setups!

    Clean Tips (Doesn't exploit game mechanics):
    • Be picky about your Dupes, especially early on. I generally try to avoid going above 6-8 until well past Cycle 100. It takes time for Dupes to accumulate enough skills to be extremely "Time Positive" (IE, how much time they spend doing things not directly keeping themselves alive), and too many too fast will leave your struggling to support them while still expanding at the necessary rate.
    • Liquid and Gas filters are a bullshit trap. This would be the single exception to the "Never say Never" rule above. Never, ever use them. You can achieve the same thing, in the same space, by using a Shutoff Valve directly after an element sensor, and it only takes 10 KW of power to run (and it only draws power while actively filtering out the selected gas, instead of for every packet that travels through the system).
    • Airflow tiles, and the solid doors are not subject to "pressure" from gasses and liquids. If you need to contain large amounts of liquids and don't want to user or don't have the tech/space yet for the appropriate reservoir, use these to build your container to prevent your tiles breaking. Just be sure to lock the doors before filling it up, Dupes don't care one bit if they flood your base if it means getting to their task 5 seconds faster.
    • Wild Pacu will always lay an egg before they die, regardless of conditions. Feel free to sweep all their eggs into a very small fish tank. If you want to breed more, keep one egg seperate in a tank with a feeder. You'll get 3 eggs from a "fed" Pacu before it expires, so sweep 2 into your mass tank (and then those will also continue to forever reproduce themselves). This is less of a big deal now that Pacu can eat seeds, but it's still an incredibly efficient way to breed them, since they eat a LOT.
      03WCKU6.png
    • Use liquid locks early and often to protect your main base's very precious oxygen supply. You can achieve a liquid lock with just a single tile (though this does leave it more prone to the occasional random failure), by dripping a liquid onto a tile that one square above and to the side of a 2 tile gap. This is VERY useful to lock away CO2 producing buildings like Coal Generators. Just be aware that the gases behind the lock may overpressure and lead to popped ear drums if you don't use suits to access it.
    • I always try to put 2 mesh tiles and a liquid pump directly under my suit checkpoints. Any Dupes that have "accidents" while out in their suit deposit all the polluted water when they take the suit off, and this allows it to be cleanly collected, no mopping necessary. Since CO2 produced while in their suits is also expelled when they take it off, adding in a gas pump into that sump area to take care of that as well also keeps your base cleaner of CO2.
      WtKPzaD.png
    • On the default starting map, you can survive an insanely long time just using Mealwood. You need 4 plants per dupe to feed them, though I try to make it a habit of having at least a single dupe buffer of growing plants at all times.
    • When starting out, try really hard to figure out where your nature reserve is going to be, and then put your food storage there. It's an insanely easy +6 moral for basically no work. Similar for your Great Hall. A single potted plant and a water cooler gives you another easy +6 (and you can disable the water cooler to save water while still getting the building bonus).
    • Temp Shift Plates and thermally reactive stone are your friends, especially in farm areas. You can moderate the temperature of a much larger area with a single Wheeze Wort with Temp shift places spaced every other tile.
    • Learn to schedule your Dupes effectively! Bathtime in the schedule can be replaced by Downtime for an extra +1 Moral. Dupes will still shower and go to the bathroom during downtime, they don't need a dedicated slot for it.
    • Following up on the previous point, split your Dupes between multiple shifts. If you stagger their sleep and down time, you can vastly limit the number of toilets and sinks you need. Basically only 1 per active dupe in the schedule, so if you have 4 schedules of 3 Dupes, you only really need 3 toilets.
    • When bridging into loops, always make sure that there is only a single input that your bridge output can travel to. This is especially important on cooling loops with shutoff filters, as the game will happily lock the loop up trying to input from both sides of the shutoff. I always bridge after a shutoff filter to force the 1 way flow of the loop. Generally I do this immediately after the shutoff, but depending on the space constraints it can very. The Input bridge should always come either after the "safety" bridge, or before the shutoff, never between the two.
      Two different examples here. Note on the left I have the safety bridge right after the shutoff, and the input bridge follows it, forcing the one way flow. On the right, my input comes before the shutoff (but since it's a loop, its still technically "after" the safety bridge).l8GnLB2.png


    "Hacky" Tips (Exploits base game mechanics):
    • By submerging air vents in grams of a liquid (my preference is oil or petrol for their high evaporation temps), you can avoid overpressure of the vent, allowing a continuous flow of gas. Combined with the above trick with doors not being subjected to pressure, you can create infinite gas storage containers. I highly recommend either waiting until you have Steel, or if delayed getting it with the newer expac, be sure to run active cooling behind your storage to avoid the gas pumps you put inside breaking (At the very, very least use Gold Amalgam). Once these storages are set up, they are generally pretty annoying to access for changes or repairs, so heavily plan ahead with them for your inputs, outputs and power.
      pmKVHYw.png
    • Ditto on infinite liquid storage, but this is actually much easier (and with gold liquid pumps, you rarely have any temp issues until you get into more exotic materials). This setup is actually a little different, just leave a single tile at the top of your storage for a gas to sit, and place your liquid vent there. Open the top doors of the infinite storage until every lower tile fills with liquid, then shut them when only the liquid vent isn't submerged. The remaining gas tile will have no where to go, letting you forever dump a liquid into the system without overpressuring the vent.
      F5VebwR.png
    • When setting up either infinite storage system, I recommend placing two pumps inside, I've run out of capacity with just a single pump in the past, especially with water.
    • Everyone has their own take on SPOMS, but my preferred method involves using the same liquid submersion trick as the vents to prevent overpressure. This has the benefit of being able to harness how the Electrolyzers deposit their gasses into the world when the 4 tiles of the electrolyzer itself are occupied by other elements. One packet always goes directly above the electrolyzer, and one goes to a side tile. With some careful building and "priming" the respective chambers, you can auto filter the outputs for free, while also allowing the electrolyzers to run forever without overpressuring. This does require two different layers of liquid over the electrolyzer. I typically use Oil and Water since neither will offgas into the chambers, but if you wanted to be really spicy early on, you could go polluted water on the bottom layer.
      nNWMAjV.png
    • As a second part to the above - this is less hacky, but I haven't found a good way to incorporate it into the non hacky SPOM setups - you can actually run a heat negative AC setup for your base with this. By running the incoming water to be electrolyzed through the Hydrogen chamber with some radiant piping, and placing a Thermal Aquatuner inside that chamber for a cooling radiator in the Oxygen chamber, you can actually delete more heat than you generate, because the combined heat capacity of the Hydrogen and Oxygen produced from electrolysis is actually less than that of the water you input. Be sure to use temp shift plates to effectively transfer the head from the Aquatuner to the Radiant piping though, or you will still get overheat spikes on it.
      DdLaAtP.png

    Mvrck on
    PwH4Ipj.jpg
    The Zombie Penguin
  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    On filters: agree, as long as you've got plastic. Irrc there's also an issue where they can break in some fashion or have a less useful failure state than the normal ones. But they're vastly smaller and more power efficient

    Ideas hate it when you anthropomorphize them
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  • MvrckMvrck Registered User regular
    On filters: agree, as long as you've got plastic. Irrc there's also an issue where they can break in some fashion or have a less useful failure state than the normal ones. But they're vastly smaller and more power efficient

    They don't take plastic, just refined metal. I've never had a failure state on them so long as my element sensor is right next to the shutoff, running over thousands of cycles across multiple colonies and patches. I'm not sure what issue you're referring to, and not saying it doesn't exist, just that I've never experienced it.

    PwH4Ipj.jpg
  • Mr RayMr Ray Sarcasm sphereRegistered User regular
    edited July 2021
    I find the thing that kills my bases is usually either running out of coal before I'm able to transition to another power source, or my farm overheating to the point that I can't grow anything. I really want to enjoy this game, but I just find it so stressful how you're always running out of something.

    I also must be doing something drastically wrong in how I layout my bases since I very quickly end up with "long commute times" that I can't get rid of.

    Mr Ray on
  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    edited July 2021
    Mvrck wrote: »
    On filters: agree, as long as you've got plastic. Irrc there's also an issue where they can break in some fashion or have a less useful failure state than the normal ones. But they're vastly smaller and more power efficient

    They don't take plastic, just refined metal. I've never had a failure state on them so long as my element sensor is right next to the shutoff, running over thousands of cycles across multiple colonies and patches. I'm not sure what issue you're referring to, and not saying it doesn't exist, just that I've never experienced it.

    What am i thinking of that requires refined plastic then?

    @Mr Ray Short of some genius layout, you'll always get long commutes. What can help is making sure to specalize your dupes, and later in the game, setting the little buggers to go in a Gym before you let them out in the world.

    For example, i tend to have Builder/Digger dupes (I usually start with a builder and a digger, and they cross train to be the same eventually), Hauler dupes (Strength and atheltics - responsible for tidying and deliveriny), Reasearch/Operator dupes (Research speeds up the rate dupes level up skills), a Cook (Who's often my decrator too), Ranchers (Ranchers are very hard to level up, but a high ranching skill can care for a metric ton of animals providing you with easy meat and other resources), and sometimes Farmers. (Sometimes the ranchers are also farmers). This is all pre Spaced Out, so take with a grain of salt.

    A gym is just a bunch of the hamster wheels in a room that only new dupes are allowed to enter, hooked up to a light... and if you get clever/fancy, there's ways to hook it up to the grid as well so you can harvest the power. Anyway the dupes will run like crazy on the wheels, in the process accumulating a ton of atheltics skil land operator skill, as well as skill points. I usually just force my new dupes into the gym until they cap out on athletics/have enough skill points to train in whatever skills i want them for

    Later on you can use tube systems and the ilk to cut down. But generally it's just smart dupe specialization that saves you the most time. Remember you can also setup doors to control where dupes are allowed to go and why, which really helps with the little idiots deciding they need to go all the way over there to do this one thing. (As a tip, if you're using doors, always make sure that anyone can pass through the door on the way back to things, but only dupes who you want to go in a direction can go that way. This way if a dupe somehow escapes out, they can still get home)

    Farm overheating and coal running out sounds like it's the same problem - you're running your coal generators 100% of the time. (Or you arent collecting hatches to poop coal for you, or both). What you want to do is setup a circuit so that you have a smart battery and all the coal power feeds into that, and then your main grid connects to the battery. Connect up the smart battery to the coal generators with automation wire, and i think you might need to throw a not gate in there? then set the battery to something like 40% and 80%.

    Done right, this means the Smart battery will monitor your entire power grid. When you have less than 40% power stored, the coal generators kick in and keep going until you're at 80% (You go 80% rather than a 100% so there's a buffer and you dont waste power due to the spike). Then they shut off again. This dramatically cuts down on the coal you need, the waste heat, and CO2 that gets dumped into your base. This also makes setting up battery banks a lot more practical - a fun fact is that Smart batteries consider *everything* on the grid, not just themselves. Smart batteries are also the best at not loosing power due to leakage, so i often end up with smart battery banks in the late game.

    Also: You can tweak the settings! Dont be afraid to turn things down and make it easier on yourself, that's why the options are there! and fuck anyone who's like "But this isnt the *real* way to play" that's elitist bullshit.

    The Zombie Penguin on
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  • Casual EddyCasual Eddy The Astral PlaneRegistered User regular
    Mr Ray wrote: »
    I find the thing that kills my bases is usually either running out of coal before I'm able to transition to another power source, or my farm overheating to the point that I can't grow anything. I really want to enjoy this game, but I just find it so stressful how you're always running out of something.

    I also must be doing something drastically wrong in how I layout my bases since I very quickly end up with "long commute times" that I can't get rid of.

    you'll either want to pump cold air into your farms or plant a few wheezeworts alongside your plants

  • FoefallerFoefaller Registered User regular
    Mvrck wrote: »
    On filters: agree, as long as you've got plastic. Irrc there's also an issue where they can break in some fashion or have a less useful failure state than the normal ones. But they're vastly smaller and more power efficient

    They don't take plastic, just refined metal. I've never had a failure state on them so long as my element sensor is right next to the shutoff, running over thousands of cycles across multiple colonies and patches. I'm not sure what issue you're referring to, and not saying it doesn't exist, just that I've never experienced it.

    What am i thinking of that requires refined plastic then?

    @Mr Ray Short of some genius layout, you'll always get long commutes. What can help is making sure to specalize your dupes, and later in the game, setting the little buggers to go in a Gym before you let them out in the world.

    For example, i tend to have Builder/Digger dupes (I usually start with a builder and a digger, and they cross train to be the same eventually), Hauler dupes (Strength and atheltics - responsible for tidying and deliveriny), Reasearch/Operator dupes (Research speeds up the rate dupes level up skills), a Cook (Who's often my decrator too), Ranchers (Ranchers are very hard to level up, but a high ranching skill can care for a metric ton of animals providing you with easy meat and other resources), and sometimes Farmers. (Sometimes the ranchers are also farmers). This is all pre Spaced Out, so take with a grain of salt.

    A gym is just a bunch of the hamster wheels in a room that only new dupes are allowed to enter, hooked up to a light... and if you get clever/fancy, there's ways to hook it up to the grid as well so you can harvest the power. Anyway the dupes will run like crazy on the wheels, in the process accumulating a ton of atheltics skil land operator skill, as well as skill points. I usually just force my new dupes into the gym until they cap out on athletics/have enough skill points to train in whatever skills i want them for

    Later on you can use tube systems and the ilk to cut down. But generally it's just smart dupe specialization that saves you the most time. Remember you can also setup doors to control where dupes are allowed to go and why, which really helps with the little idiots deciding they need to go all the way over there to do this one thing. (As a tip, if you're using doors, always make sure that anyone can pass through the door on the way back to things, but only dupes who you want to go in a direction can go that way. This way if a dupe somehow escapes out, they can still get home)

    Farm overheating and coal running out sounds like it's the same problem - you're running your coal generators 100% of the time. (Or you arent collecting hatches to poop coal for you, or both). What you want to do is setup a circuit so that you have a smart battery and all the coal power feeds into that, and then your main grid connects to the battery. Connect up the smart battery to the coal generators with automation wire, and i think you might need to throw a not gate in there? then set the battery to something like 40% and 80%.

    Done right, this means the Smart battery will monitor your entire power grid. When you have less than 40% power stored, the coal generators kick in and keep going until you're at 80% (You go 80% rather than a 100% so there's a buffer and you dont waste power due to the spike). Then they shut off again. This dramatically cuts down on the coal you need, the waste heat, and CO2 that gets dumped into your base. This also makes setting up battery banks a lot more practical - a fun fact is that Smart batteries consider *everything* on the grid, not just themselves. Smart batteries are also the best at not loosing power due to leakage, so i often end up with smart battery banks in the late game.

    Also: You can tweak the settings! Dont be afraid to turn things down and make it easier on yourself, that's why the options are there! and fuck anyone who's like "But this isnt the *real* way to play" that's elitist bullshit.

    Another possibility I can think of for overheating is making the jump to electrolyzers without keeping the farm in it's own bubble/giving it some way to cool off (even if it's an ice maker and an ICE-E). The oxygen that comes out of an electrolyzer is hot (even if *technically* it has less Themeral energy than the water did, depending on the input temp) and can easily warm your base up to plant-killing levels, so until you can set up a system to cool it while it's still getting pumped through your air vents, you need to keep that fresh oxygen away from your farms.

    steam_sig.png
  • MvrckMvrck Registered User regular
    edited July 2021
    The other thing to mention that wasn't brought up, is make sure you are insulating your living and growing areas, especially from the hotter biomes. Try to move as much as you can heat generation wise outside of your habitation area as quick as possible. That means crushers, generators, batteries, etc. Insulate your base up, vacuum seal the entrance to reduce/prevent heat bleed there. If you do run your oxygen generation setup inside your base, make sure that at the very least the air runs past a cooling radiator before it enters the greater area of your base. It's a lot more efficient to cool a 10 tile channel rapidly than trying to run ducting and piping all over your entire base to bring the temp down.

    As a last ditch "I need this spot to get cold NOW" option, use Ice to build Temp Shift plates behind crops to rapidly cool the body temp. The ice will almost instantly melt, leaving the cold water to soak up a lot of the heat, then you just mop it up and store it/dump it as you want. That's how I save crops if things have gone to hell.

    Super late edit:
    What am i thinking of that requires refined plastic then?

    Maybe the high pressure vents? Those take plastic and refined metals, but aren't required for the DIY filters.

    Mvrck on
    PwH4Ipj.jpg
  • Mr RayMr Ray Sarcasm sphereRegistered User regular
    I think last time around I was attempting to have a "hot" area where I had my electrolysers and was attempting to make a steam power plant, but it never actually worked. I had my hot water from my industry running through some aquatuners to cool the liquid inside and warm the water outside which I hoped would eventually boil it and allow me to harness the steam... but it never actually got hot enough to do that. Also I realised that it was never going to get hot enough to do that, because when using water as a coolant its going to boil and break the pipes at 100 degrees and logically whatever's going into the Aquatuner would need to be above 100 degrees to boil the water outside...

    So then I decided that my hot area could also be used to cool the air from the farm and maybe the extra hot air from the thermo-regulators would push it over 100 and let the water boil... but then of course they overheated and stopped working at 75 degrees.

    I did have a coal farm, I had two maxed-out hatch ranches in fact, they just weren't pooping enough coal to keep my entire base going without top-ups. And by that point my base was a horrible tangle of wire and pipe spaghetti and I just gave up, as is tradition.

  • CaptainPeacockCaptainPeacock Board Game Hoarder Top o' the LakeRegistered User regular
    I found my farms and bedrooms were overheating, so I ran granite pipes through the walls and behind the plants, pumping cold polluted water out of and back into the cistern. Used polluted ice to get it cool and it pretty much stayed that way.

    Cluck cluck, gibber gibber, my old man's a mushroom, etc.
  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    Mvrck wrote: »
    The other thing to mention that wasn't brought up, is make sure you are insulating your living and growing areas, especially from the hotter biomes. Try to move as much as you can heat generation wise outside of your habitation area as quick as possible. That means crushers, generators, batteries, etc. Insulate your base up, vacuum seal the entrance to reduce/prevent heat bleed there. If you do run your oxygen generation setup inside your base, make sure that at the very least the air runs past a cooling radiator before it enters the greater area of your base. It's a lot more efficient to cool a 10 tile channel rapidly than trying to run ducting and piping all over your entire base to bring the temp down.

    As a last ditch "I need this spot to get cold NOW" option, use Ice to build Temp Shift plates behind crops to rapidly cool the body temp. The ice will almost instantly melt, leaving the cold water to soak up a lot of the heat, then you just mop it up and store it/dump it as you want. That's how I save crops if things have gone to hell.

    Super late edit:
    What am i thinking of that requires refined plastic then?

    Maybe the high pressure vents? Those take plastic and refined metals, but aren't required for the DIY filters.

    It might be germ sensors? Because you can use the same setup of sensor and shutoff valve to create a germ filter for your pipes. Super handy with that liquid storage daisy chain for germ management i outlined earlier - if anything gets through that's germy, it just gets routed straight back into the original germy one. (Works best if you've got a chlorine enviroment they're all sitting in ofc).

    Another tip on germ management is that germs follow the same One thing, One tile rule. So if you flood your base with Floral Scents via Buddy Blossoms, then no germs for you! Which is why i avoid the hell out of dupes with Allergies as a downside, as my base is constantly flooded in floral scent when it gets going.

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    Mvrck
  • RightfulSinRightfulSin Registered User regular
    edited July 2021
    @Mvrck Can you maybe put an example of the liquid lock? I have been playing this for a bit and have never used any liquid or gas locks. I do have my base really pressured with Very Breathable oxygen. All the places my Dupes mainly go is bright aquamarine. I have heard of them, and think I have read a thread on them, and they seem like an odd thing that came about due to a wonky game design.

    RightfulSin on
    "If nothing is impossible, than would it not be impossible to find something that you could not do?" - Me
  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    The simplest liquid lock is a t shape with water filling the t. Late game there's actually a special liquid that's designed to let you make liquid locks freely, of the vertical style (just two tiles of liquid)

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  • klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    These are the easiest one liquid locks to make:
    y3uhgcnbke7b.png
    Pros: Easy to make, only need one liquid type, reliable.
    Cons: Takes up a lot of space, uses a lot of liquid, slow to get through, dupes get a debuff from going through water.

    You can simplify the design on the right by just doing one drop of water on one of the side steps, but the other drawbacks still apply.
    I usually use the step design on areas that I don't expect anyone to have to go in except in emergencies, but otherwise don't bother with them.

    This is a two liquid lock (any two liquids will work, but water and polluted water are the first two you'll have available):
    6k4fcbcnfkl6.png
    Pros: Only takes up regular door space, can be made with two liquids you have easy access to.
    Cons: A little more complicated to set up, dupes still get the 'ew, I'm wet' debuff.

    You just need a tiny amount of each liquid, dropping one on top of the other. I find it easiest to make it with holes on either side, so you can mop up spillage while making it without risking clearing the tile you want. Then put the floor in afterwards.

    This is the three-liquid lock, the one I end up using most of the time once it's available:
    j4h9ak0wbpfl.jpg
    Pros: No debuffs.
    Cons: uses a little more space than the two liquid lock, and you obviously need three liquids, which can take a while early on.

    Same principle as the two-liquid lock, but the gap makes dupes jump over it, and the game doesn't apply debuffs to them while they're in the air, so they effectively teleport from one side to the other and don't get wet.
    Can be made with just two liquids, with the bottom one filled to over flowing into the tile above, but much more prone to failure in my experience, so I generally don't bother.

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
    destroyah87Nova_C
  • MvrckMvrck Registered User regular
    edited July 2021
    @RightfulSin There are a pair of liquid locks on either side of the central chamber (which is a vacuum for heat mitigation) in the right of this picture. This is generally how I handle the entrance of my base on most maps.
    WtKPzaD.png

    Basically, as long as one "branch" of the T has a liquid in it, no gasses will transfer across the opening, because you only have a single tile that has a non-gaseous material in it, and only one element may occupy a tile at a time. Preferably use Oil or Petrol, because they are heavier than the various waters and won't get washed out if something else falls into the lock area, as well as having higher/lower temp thresholds (you can still freeze Crude Oil down to liquid carbon if you drop it into a very cold biome though, so beware.

    I prefer to only do a single tile rather than flooding the entire T to make sure dupes never get "sopping wet" from going through the locks, but if you only use them in suit worn situations it shouldn't be a problem either way if you wanna go overboard on how much liquid you fill up.

    Another, more visually distinct, example is below (Warning - Hacky/Exploity Oxygen/Hydrogen generating/filtering build not related to the locks is included in the shot):
    nNWMAjV.png

    You can see the crude tiles keeping the hydrogen chamber isolated from both the oxygen chamber, and the outside atmosphere.

    The other thing to note, is that since you only need a single tile, you don't actually *need* a T. Just a 3 tile inverted "L". T's are safer since you can flood both sides, but if you are especially space constrained in some way, you can get by without one.

    Mvrck on
    PwH4Ipj.jpg
  • FoefallerFoefaller Registered User regular
    I've always found it simpler and more intuitive to take advantage of the stacking nature of gases to keep them from escaping rather than try to set up water locks. Especially if I'm setting up some sort of chlorine tank to kill off germs (because I'm getting water from a polluted geyser or distilling algae from slime) where I can just create a "pool" where automation keeps it from getting full enough to spill out and the storage in question is lifted off the very bottom of the room for any CO2 that gets in from dupes exhaling.

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  • The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    Foefaller wrote: »
    I've always found it simpler and more intuitive to take advantage of the stacking nature of gases to keep them from escaping rather than try to set up water locks. Especially if I'm setting up some sort of chlorine tank to kill off germs (because I'm getting water from a polluted geyser or distilling algae from slime) where I can just create a "pool" where automation keeps it from getting full enough to spill out and the storage in question is lifted off the very bottom of the room for any CO2 that gets in from dupes exhaling.

    Depends what you're doing. Like when i build factories, i like filling them with pressurized hydrogen, as it's a good temp conductor. (This assumes a cold factory, rather than a hot one, in which case you just want everythign filled with steam). Generally, any kind of place where you want to go with dense amounts of gas, water locks are the best approach.

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  • FoefallerFoefaller Registered User regular
    edited July 2021
    Foefaller wrote: »
    I've always found it simpler and more intuitive to take advantage of the stacking nature of gases to keep them from escaping rather than try to set up water locks. Especially if I'm setting up some sort of chlorine tank to kill off germs (because I'm getting water from a polluted geyser or distilling algae from slime) where I can just create a "pool" where automation keeps it from getting full enough to spill out and the storage in question is lifted off the very bottom of the room for any CO2 that gets in from dupes exhaling.

    Depends what you're doing. Like when i build factories, i like filling them with pressurized hydrogen, as it's a good temp conductor. (This assumes a cold factory, rather than a hot one, in which case you just want everythign filled with steam). Generally, any kind of place where you want to go with dense amounts of gas, water locks are the best approach.

    Yeah, it's why I had clhorine pits as my example. No gases usually need to be added or remove once its done (save perhaps the occasional tile's worth of CO2) and it's use as mostly storage makes it perfectly reasonable to build a top entrance or contained conveyor system for access.

    I also try not to let perfect become the enemy of good when it comes to design. So while the temperature of my factory might require an exosuit (one way or another), I won't be bothering to pump gases with better heat properties than Oxygen or CO2 in there, so I don't have to fear some errant gas spreading throughout my base causing issues or annoyances every time a dupe has to enter.

    Foefaller on
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  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    ...how do you move liquids?

  • BedlamBedlam Registered User regular
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    ...how do you move liquids?
    Pipes!

  • klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    Bedlam wrote: »
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    ...how do you move liquids?
    Pipes!
    Or pitcher pumps and bottle emptiers, if it's just for a bit of liquid.

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
    BedlamCaptainPeacock
  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    With the new asteroid layout, I find managing temperatures really easy now.

    Like, space is cold instead of hot, and there's a barrier of super cold rock and ice at the top. My SPOM self-cools from the water tank, because I melt ice in the water tank, so it's usually around 10-15 degrees or so (I actually pump hot water from a metal refinery to help, and melting the ice is my early-mid game source of renewable water).

    Where I'm kinda stuck is transitioning to rocket exploration. I put 1000 hours into this game in vanilla and now I still play like rockets are end game only. In my currently playthrough my one issue is that I don't have access to a liquid that is safe to use for constant refining. Like, there's an end to using a refinery to heat water to melt the ice, and actually, refining steel can push it too far if I don't manage it.

    But, the liquid that needs to run through a steam chamber to cool refineries has to be able to go up into the 300s of degrees without turning to steam, and petroleum was what I used to use, but there's no oil in the base map any longer.

    And the game doesn't really explain the new requirements around building rockets so I'm kinda fumbling my way. And I watch Francis John youtube videos! And I'm still not sure!

    Anyway, this game has it's hooks into me again, so that's great. >.> Up to 1100 hours played now.

  • CaptainPeacockCaptainPeacock Board Game Hoarder Top o' the LakeRegistered User regular
    Nova_C wrote: »
    With the new asteroid layout, I find managing temperatures really easy now.

    Like, space is cold instead of hot, and there's a barrier of super cold rock and ice at the top. My SPOM self-cools from the water tank, because I melt ice in the water tank, so it's usually around 10-15 degrees or so (I actually pump hot water from a metal refinery to help, and melting the ice is my early-mid game source of renewable water).

    Where I'm kinda stuck is transitioning to rocket exploration. I put 1000 hours into this game in vanilla and now I still play like rockets are end game only. In my currently playthrough my one issue is that I don't have access to a liquid that is safe to use for constant refining. Like, there's an end to using a refinery to heat water to melt the ice, and actually, refining steel can push it too far if I don't manage it.

    But, the liquid that needs to run through a steam chamber to cool refineries has to be able to go up into the 300s of degrees without turning to steam, and petroleum was what I used to use, but there's no oil in the base map any longer.

    And the game doesn't really explain the new requirements around building rockets so I'm kinda fumbling my way. And I watch Francis John youtube videos! And I'm still not sure!

    Anyway, this game has it's hooks into me again, so that's great. >.> Up to 1100 hours played now.

    I actually just started last night using a steel thermo auquatuner and steam plant to cool my base and keep the refinery running constantly. Amazingly, it works quite well!

    Cluck cluck, gibber gibber, my old man's a mushroom, etc.
  • CaptainPeacockCaptainPeacock Board Game Hoarder Top o' the LakeRegistered User regular
    Wow, within a couple days I've gone from making my first steel to building and launching 2 rockets! Crazy how things just take off - pun intended.

    Cluck cluck, gibber gibber, my old man's a mushroom, etc.
    chrono_travellerMvrck
  • klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    Trying to get back into this after a year or so away and what the hell deodorizers need power now?
    I guess my old slime biome cleansing strategy of digging out the entire area and filling it with wall to wall deodorizers isn't going to work anymore, huh?

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
  • BedlamBedlam Registered User regular
    edited August 2021
    They take like 5 watts of power. Its pretty negligible.

    Im still annoyed that the AI goes to all the trouble of putting on an oxygen mask and waiting at the airlock, just to dig one or two tiles and then run off to do something else.

    Bedlam on
  • klemmingklemming Registered User regular
    It's not the amount of power, it's the amount of wire I'd need to do what I was gonna do.
    I need a new plan.

    Nobody remembers the singer. The song remains.
  • CaptainPeacockCaptainPeacock Board Game Hoarder Top o' the LakeRegistered User regular
    They do a good enough job if you don't use as many. So far I've cleared quite a few caustic biomes with just a few deoderizers. Takes a lot more time than it used to when you could saturate the area, but that's time you can spend on other projects.

    I tamed a cool steam vent to feed my SPOM for thr first time, thinking that would solve my water problems. Turns out it doesn't make enough. So I had to dip in to a salt water geyser last night to compensate.

    Cluck cluck, gibber gibber, my old man's a mushroom, etc.
  • MvrckMvrck Registered User regular
    Yeah, gas geysers don't actually generate a ton of matter. Gotta high roll the actual liquid geysers.

    PwH4Ipj.jpg
  • CaptainPeacockCaptainPeacock Board Game Hoarder Top o' the LakeRegistered User regular
    I also found a polluted slush geyser that I'm running over to filter and combine with the cool steam and salt. Bringing that temperature right down.

    Cluck cluck, gibber gibber, my old man's a mushroom, etc.
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