The new forums will be named Coin Return (based on the most recent vote)! You can check on the status and timeline of the transition to the new forums here.
The Guiding Principles and New Rules document is now in effect.
[Wonder Woman] A Swords and Combat Boots Film (tag spoilers)
Dedwrekka
MetalHell adjacentRegistered User regular
MetalHell adjacentRegistered User regular
Wonder Woman is a 1975 TV series that aired on ABC about the adventures of Diana Prince, as she transforms into Wonder Woman, fight Nazis and flies in her invisible jet.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1rBZIzr49k
Wait, let's start again.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gw_o7XUX3fg
Wonder Woman is a 2017 movie about Diana of Themyscira and daughter of Hippolyta, Queen of the Amazons. The movie was directed by Patty Jenkins, written by Allan Heinberg, Zack Snyder, and Jason Fuchs, and stars Gal Gadot at the titular character. The film takes place during World War 1. Also it has an amazing soundtrack.
It is currently sitting at 93% fresh on Rotten Tomatoes.
--Warning, after this point there will be spoilers, so tread carefully, turn around or deal with the consequences.--
Please tag spoilers.
Discus
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J1rBZIzr49kWait, let's start again.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gw_o7XUX3fgWonder Woman is a 2017 movie about Diana of Themyscira and daughter of Hippolyta, Queen of the Amazons. The movie was directed by Patty Jenkins, written by Allan Heinberg, Zack Snyder, and Jason Fuchs, and stars Gal Gadot at the titular character. The film takes place during World War 1. Also it has an amazing soundtrack.
It is currently sitting at 93% fresh on Rotten Tomatoes.
--Warning, after this point there will be spoilers, so tread carefully, turn around or deal with the consequences.--
Please tag spoilers.
Discus
0
Posts
Without delving into spoilers, this movie hit a couple of disappointing (if predictable) potholes, but did everything that I wanted it to do and more. I thought it did a good job of telling a compelling, (relatively) down-to-earth drama while still being a lot of fun to watch. The 3rd act has some promising stuff, but overall it's a narrative mess, and I'm honestly disappointed by how they managed to wrap it all together.
So, yeah. Go see it.
Spoilers for Wonder Woman ahoy. Like, a lot of them.
And I want more Amazons in Wonder Woman 2. More Connie Nielsen, more Robin Wright, just... more Amazons, please, because the entire first act was the best part of the movie, hands down.
I thought the smaller fight scenes worked really well, and I loved when they brought back the "Shield!" thing so Diana could knock down the sniper perch. But a bunch of the more intricate fight scenes clearly suffered from some over-CGI and bad cuts, which was lame. Though I think Diana charging the German trenches to save Veld might be one of my favorite action scenes in a superhero movie, hands down. That entire sequence was exceptionally well handled.
As far as the third act went, I feel like there were some good concepts rattling around in there, but the entire thing was just a mess. Ludendorff not actually being Ares didn't really throw me, but the Sir Patrick twist did catch me off-guard a bit. I thought it was a good move to have Diana facing off against Ares with just the Lasso and the Bracers, since those are uniquely Wonder Woman style weapons, and her decision to spare Doctor Poison was perfect.
Oh, and Diana's rejection of antipathy and nihilism in favor of hope and love? Perfect. Perfect. I needed that, and I'm glad they decided to have her arc conclude there. And Steve's goodbye definitely had me tearing up a bit, especially when he handed her the watch.
"I can save the day. You can save the world." Just... Chris Pine is great. Chris Pine is a great actor, and Wonder Woman wouldn't have been the same with anybody else playing Steve Trevor.
Putting them end to end, though, there was a bunch of tonal dissonance, especially when Diana talks about overcoming hate with love, and then fries Ares with his own lightning. That was the most disappointing thing to me, and I wish they'd handled it differently. I think it would've been way more effective if Diana had beaten Ares, then refused to kill him, or stripped him of his powers and condemned him to live among humanity for the rest of his days.
Or, better yet; no Ares at all. Turns out it was Ludendorff and Doctor Poison the entire time, and that last sequence ends with Steve sacrificing himself to destroy the gas bomber, bringing the war to an end.
I don't know. Like I said, I think the 3rd act had some promising stuff going on, but a lot of it got drowned out in the tonal mess that was created. It didn't actively detract from my enjoyment of the movie, but it's disappointing that such a great film had to stumble while crossing the finish line. But that's a general flaw that most superhero movies seem to struggle from, so I can't say that's exclusively on Wonder Woman.
Either way, everybody working on this film did good, and DC finally put one on the board that I can get behind wholeheartedly. Now I just have to hope that audiences do their part and support the film enough that we get Wonder Woman 2.
I love it.
That's not to say that the action scenes were bad, I thought Diana's rampage at the end was awe-inspiring. Like a wrecking ball of rage and loss. But I think the movie shines with the less bombastic moments, where the real world starts to take some of the shine off of Diana's character, but she tries to power through it.
You are awaited... in Themyscira!
It was good!
Wow this is getting very negative. Here is some positive stuff.
Gal Gadot kills it as does every single actor in the film.
The human bits and WW interacting them works very well.
WW isnt just for feminism. We get a full uncompromised view into the faults of mankinds.
There is a lot of feminist stuff in the film though from gender flipped old tropes to comentary on 20s sexism to good-old fasioned female gaze.
Every single fight scene is put together with more passion and gile then Zack Snyder's entire catalogue combined. Even outside of the comparison each one worthy of comment and puts a lot of work into justifying itself.
The comedy errs a little blue at times but it hits way more than it misses
The music is great.
It feels like a movie outside of its time. In a day and age where exceedingly complex plot has ruin the action adventure movie this plot is streamlined and provides a lot of room for the characters to breath.
https://gofund.me/fa5990a5
Which is a broad genre I know shit up. And I like that genre. But in the end the movies aren't about anything. The absolute worst example is when in the first avenger they do wwii as a bloodless montage scene. Which I hated them and hate more now. Compare that with no man's land here, where everyone is dirty and scared. And soldiers can't act because of ptsd and feel shame over it. And the good guys ain't so good.
Also holy shit. A native American actor who was a actual character. I desperately, from when the picture was first shown in bvs to one of Diana's reasons for giving up on mankind would be because of what the us did to the native population. That wasn't here But at least a reference was made
And he did things and had action scenes and used his culture in a way that wasn't mythicism! And survived!
But hey Im glad people are getting something out of it that Im not and Id really like this movie to succeed so Ill stop shitting up the thread and let the people who enjoyed it more talk about it.
https://gofund.me/fa5990a5
I have no idea why my brain went there. I've never had that thought process in my life!
Also I think the best thing about this movie was that even though there were a lot of 'dark' scenes, everything was very easy to see and parse. There were no 50 smash cut 2 minute long scenes. The combat felt like it had weight, the centering was great, the colors really popped and everything was just visually great. I think that's one of the most important things in a film, and this movie did a very good job of being a movie first and telling a story felt like it was part of that, instead of being more important.
Vivienne and I watched wonder woman.
I really fundamentally feel uncomfortable with one specific thing.
Captain America I feel did it tastefully (as tasteful as you could) where, they didn't end World War II, they fought a bunch of weirdos that needed to be stopped. Here it felt a bit more that all of these lives that actually died were cheapened.
(And as a super minor quibble, whenever she had her whip out it looked kinda ropey. HAH whip pun)
Other than that I legit enjoyed it though. It had solid fun characters.
Satans..... hints.....
I think they kind of dealt with that
I think it opens up a lot more questions about WWII that I'm pretty sure are never going to be dealt with.
{Twitter, Everybody's doing it. }{Writing and Story Blog}
Well no,
Satans..... hints.....
Bullets taking out a huge number of Amazons and catching them off guard was of huge significance. It signals, in both a brutal and action-based way, that the Amazons have fallen behind. Their isolation from the rest of the world has allowed everyone else to progress beyond them. They can train for years and be better combatants in every way with traditional weapons but bullets will still mow them down. They win, which lets them retain their superiority, but simply adding bullets to the mix communicates just how far Diana is stepping outside her comfort zone when she leaves. We know about the bulletproof bracelets, but it's a great way to show rather than tell how irrelevant and insular the Amazons really are.
When Antiope dies, a third woman apart from Hippolyta and Diana has an on-screen visceral emotional reaction to it. I reckon this was implied to have been Antiope's partner, but was actually a missed opportunity. It was REALLY subtle and I felt like I was reading into it. I wish the camera had lingered for another frame or so on her to drive it home. Would've been nice. I liked the dialog about bodily pleasures and the theatre cracked up at it, but I also kinda wanted something more overt and direct. Oh well.
And where you could argue that a lot of the Amazons are scantily clad, well, Chris Pine has a scene where he's basically fully naked so I thought THAT was a fun reversal!
Diana's affection for the baby in the street was endearing. It's something women get shat on constantly - omg a baby our weakness! - and it was really great to see it just as another aspect of her character. She's also never seen a baby before! I really liked that little touch.
The smaller fight scenes were all great. The WW theme kicking in was jarring but I actually kinda liked that it was? I went into the movie knowing I was gonna get to hear the theme but didn't realize I hadn't heard it yet until it popped right up as she dives into combat. Fucking amazing. I loved it. I also liked how the lasso was used in combat and I don't care that it looked janky. It's a uniquely WW weapon and I'm so glad she got to use it.
The entire scene involving the liberation of Veld was, as already mentioned, masterfully handled. Probably one of my favourite standalone scenes in a superhero movie, and one of the most emotional for me. She led the charge. Everyone else just backed her up. And even if the guys in the trenches took a bit longer, they still joined her in the end. That victory was spearheaded by her, and by men who put their trust in her strength. She gets stalled by the big guns and it's only with the support of the men she's with that she's able to keep going. The symbolism is palpable and I don't care if that was intended or not; I adored it.
And Steve's line to her before he dies: "I can save the day. You can save the world." That's part of it, too.
2/3 of the movie is a wonderful metaphor for what can happen if you trust in a woman's strength and support her in achieving her goals. We're capable of so much, we just don't ever get allowed to access it. We need permission to kick ass. But fuck if you back us up, we're superheroes. I know it's a very pro-women message, but it's also enshrined in what makes Wonder Woman such an iconic superhero and feminist symbol.
Diana's oversimplification of the problem as being just one thing added a really important layer to the story. Chief's role was key in this regard: a reminder that it's not just the Germans who are dickheads. And nihilism is tempting in the face of such complex, interwoven problems. But she still chose the loving and caring way. She's the one who chose to save Veldun, after all!
I could've done without the Ares thing all together and I really think the final act was just bad. The narrative was all over the place (love is the answer but I'mma kill my brother anyway? what?) and the CGI got a bit yawny, which was frustrating given that we know they can deliver awesome action sequences, we just saw them earlier in the movie! I think superhero films (both DC and Marvel) equate the final fight to the BIGGEST fight, which means CGI+++++. I personally did not enjoy it, except for Diana realizing her full powers.
Diana's reveal as the Godkiller wasn't really so surprising, but what it DID do was explain Hippolyta's reluctance to let Diana go. Diana was left as a weapon but grew up as a daughter of the queen. Like, what queen wants her kid to realize that kind of destiny? So that slotted in nicely at the end, but some of Hippolyta's logic did struggle in the first act for sure.
Also, WW1 takes place in WW1. Hee.
I am already way more interested in a WW sequel rather than JL. I hope the DCEU is too.
Movie is good
Good movie
This will be here until I receive an apology or Weedlordvegeta get any consequences for being a bully
For decades he gave mankind ideas for new weapons, but he never made them use them.
I think his whole ploy at the beginning where he's pushing for Armistice is his way of gloating about how humanity will never willingly give up war.
He's the world's arms dealer, but he's not their general.
good for DC
I have a very high opinion of the Marvel movies save for Thor 2
And I would still say I liked Wonder Woman better than the vast majority of them, possibly all of them
There's this weird kinetic energy that the DCEU movies have (Snyder's included) that feels...fake, but also fantastical and hard-hitting
Captain America: The First Avenger is near the top of the pile for MCU for me, and Wonder Woman feels like a more fully realized and satisfying take
Especially because
SPOILERS
The Ares stuff in this was fucking fantastic
I think it really benefited from having a woman director, though I'm sure someone that isn't me can better explain why
Spoilery thoughts
I really like this version of Ares. He's like half classic, half Azzarello. Speaking of, I saw his name in the credits, so that was probably on purpose.
I also appreciate not killing Dr. Poison
Also WWI was of course the perfect setting, because it is the best combo of "morally ambiguous" / "why is this happening?" while still being familiar but still allowing for things like charging into battle on horseback
Best version of Steve Trevor yet, mostly by being both the first one I don't hate and also not being just Steve Rogers
Gal Gadot absolutely nailed it; the trailers don't do her performance justice
To sum up, for me this definiely edges out Captain America: The First Avenger, in no small part by not relegating the action to a montage
But that part where Wonder Woman goes absolutely sickhouse on the big bad while her theme song kicks in was actually, genuinely good, and I hope this movie has her theme song in there somewhere
Gonna see this in an hour!
show to me. The action slow-mo is one of my least favourite things in film, and all of the combat felt impact-less and artificial to me.
I'm super over movies being coy and winking at the camera about possible gay characters, and I hate hate hate the EXTRA tired joke that they threw in about "an island of women." On top of that there's a Native American stereotype character, and I agree with Blake that throwing Ares and Wonder Woman into WWI the way they did (as opposed to how it was handled with WWII and Captain America) is... Disrespectful to the actual causes of and suffering during that war. And on top of all of that I felt like they had two possibly interesting enemies that they failed to flesh out or use in a meaningful way, in favour of a super obvious "this guy was Ares all along!"
reveal.
Sigh.
"Sandra has a good solid anti-murderer vibe. My skin felt very secure and sufficiently attached to my body when I met her. Also my organs." HAIL SATAN
Satans..... hints.....
Man I disagree with almost everything here.
That's fine! I really WANTED to like it. :sad:
"Sandra has a good solid anti-murderer vibe. My skin felt very secure and sufficiently attached to my body when I met her. Also my organs." HAIL SATAN
That might be a bit of an exaggeration.
The most recent Marvel film, GotG 2, had plenty of quips but that didn't really compromise its emotional core. In fact, even though I wasn't a big fan of either GotG, I found the character development and interactions to be mostly very genuine. They even make a point about how some of the snarky attitudes and quippy remarks are a cover for real feelings.
I hope it does well enough to get a sequel, and that the script for the sequel is better.
General spoiler
A problem that all female-driven actuon movies seem to face. I wonder if the the production team faces pushback about putting more women in a movie about s woman?
https://gofund.me/fa5990a5
I didn't like:
Switch: SW-7603-3284-4227
My ACNH Wishlists | My ACNH Catalog
The middle of the film felt a lot like that to me, although towards the end I felt things improved a bit.
I will say that's i don't think the movie necessarily NEEDED Ares, but watching Diana cut loose on an enemy that could take the punishment was kind of nice.