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Donald Trump Attacks [The US Military]... Again

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    MorganVMorganV Registered User regular
    Haven't yet visited the District of Columbia, but isn't mid-November (through February) like the worst time of year to hold a parade, weather wise?

    A remembrance when it's cold and wet is kinda fitting. A celebration (which you know Trump wanted this to be), not so much.

    I'm just glad it's been postponed so we don't have to listen to Trump and Sarah Huckabee Sanders go on an on about crowd size and television ratings. Because you KNOW that was on the schedule.

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    Desktop HippieDesktop Hippie Registered User regular
    Hey if any civilians want to make things up to Trump by holding their own Trump parade, London has an amazing balloon you can borrow.
    Mr Ray wrote: »
    Wasn't sure which thread this belongs in, but seeing as it pertains to a former Admiral I guess this fits:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/revoke-my-security-clearance-too-mr-president/2018/08/16/8b149b02-a178-11e8-93e3-24d1703d2a7a_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.f005ca54ae8f
    William H. McRaven, a retired Navy admiral, was commander of the U.S. Joint Special Operations Command from 2011 to 2014. He oversaw the 2011 Navy SEAL raid in Pakistan that killed al-Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden.

    Dear Mr. President:

    Former CIA director John Brennan, whose security clearance you revoked on Wednesday, is one of the finest public servants I have ever known. Few Americans have done more to protect this country than John. He is a man of unparalleled integrity, whose honesty and character have never been in question, except by those who don’t know him.

    Therefore, I would consider it an honor if you would revoke my security clearance as well, so I can add my name to the list of men and women who have spoken up against your presidency.

    Like most Americans, I had hoped that when you became president, you would rise to the occasion and become the leader this great nation needs.

    A good leader tries to embody the best qualities of his or her organization. A good leader sets the example for others to follow. A good leader always puts the welfare of others before himself or herself.

    Your leadership, however, has shown little of these qualities. Through your actions, you have embarrassed us in the eyes of our children, humiliated us on the world stage and, worst of all, divided us as a nation.

    If you think for a moment that your McCarthy-era tactics will suppress the voices of criticism, you are sadly mistaken. The criticism will continue until you become the leader we prayed you would be.

    #MineToo is now a thing on twitter. As usual, don't read the comments.

    That’s a pretty great response. I wonder if it’ll take off? There may be more than a few who want to hang on to their clearance simply because they can’t trust the current administration to keep the US safe.

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    TomantaTomanta Registered User regular
    You know, Trump could just claim he had the parade and it was the biggest ever and 35% of the country would believe it. Fox could find some Soviet or Chinese parade pictures from the 80s to use as a graphic. And I hate this timeline.

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    nexuscrawlernexuscrawler Registered User regular


    Trumps response to cancelling his parade?

    Go to France for their parade instead

    on Veterans day

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    honoverehonovere Registered User regular


    Trumps response to cancelling his parade?

    Go to France for their parade instead

    on Veterans day

    "buy some more jet fighters"...more like almost a single one.

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    QanamilQanamil x Registered User regular


    Trumps response to cancelling his parade?

    Go to France for their parade instead

    on Veterans day

    Expanding on this, he has cancelled the parade citing local DC politicians making it too expensive.

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    MorganVMorganV Registered User regular
    Qanamil wrote: »


    Trumps response to cancelling his parade?

    Go to France for their parade instead

    on Veterans day

    Expanding on this, he has cancelled the parade citing local DC politicians making it too expensive.
    Yeah, the "I broke up with you before you broke up with me" thing is a standard Trump trope.

    Also, how's he intending to get the costs way down? And if it's the DC politicians (and not just a fucking stupid idea on principle), then why not do it in a different location? Fort Bragg (apparently the largest populated military base) isn't far away, and North Carolina voted for Trump. And with Camp Lejune and Pope AFB and a Coast Guard installation (I did googlez!), it seems to cover everything but the Navy (who are arguably the least suited for a military parade showing off military wares like the numbnut wants). And that took like 3 minutes to find a politically tenable location with local access to most of the toys he's wanting to display.

    Because it's a stupid fucking idea. And was ALWAYS going to cost more than the initial quote. And given both Fort Bragg and Pope AFB are celebrating their centenary this year, seems like it'd have been a better idea than sending fucking tanks through the streets of DC.

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    matt has a problemmatt has a problem Points to 'off' Points to 'on'Registered User regular


    VoteVets is a veterans organization.
    FYI: VoteVets has submitted a Letter of Intent, with DC, to do a 5K around the National Mall, for Veterans Day 2019. So, unless he kicks out a veterans race, @realDonaldTrump will not get his ego parade there, on that day next year, either.

    Now that's some good resistance.

    nibXTE7.png
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    Dongs GaloreDongs Galore Registered User regular
    Mr Ray wrote: »
    Wasn't sure which thread this belongs in, but seeing as it pertains to a former Admiral I guess this fits:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/revoke-my-security-clearance-too-mr-president/2018/08/16/8b149b02-a178-11e8-93e3-24d1703d2a7a_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.f005ca54ae8f
    William H. McRaven, a retired Navy admiral, was commander of the U.S. Joint Special Operations Command from 2011 to 2014. He oversaw the 2011 Navy SEAL raid in Pakistan that killed al-Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden.

    Dear Mr. President:

    Former CIA director John Brennan, whose security clearance you revoked on Wednesday, is one of the finest public servants I have ever known. Few Americans have done more to protect this country than John. He is a man of unparalleled integrity, whose honesty and character have never been in question, except by those who don’t know him.

    Therefore, I would consider it an honor if you would revoke my security clearance as well, so I can add my name to the list of men and women who have spoken up against your presidency.

    Like most Americans, I had hoped that when you became president, you would rise to the occasion and become the leader this great nation needs.

    A good leader tries to embody the best qualities of his or her organization. A good leader sets the example for others to follow. A good leader always puts the welfare of others before himself or herself.

    Your leadership, however, has shown little of these qualities. Through your actions, you have embarrassed us in the eyes of our children, humiliated us on the world stage and, worst of all, divided us as a nation.

    If you think for a moment that your McCarthy-era tactics will suppress the voices of criticism, you are sadly mistaken. The criticism will continue until you become the leader we prayed you would be.

    #MineToo is now a thing on twitter. As usual, don't read the comments.

    Adm. McRaven is kind of a big deal. This could dent Trump's military support

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    ArbitraryDescriptorArbitraryDescriptor changed Registered User regular
    edited August 2018


    Trumps response to cancelling his parade?

    Go to France for their parade instead

    on Veterans day
    To be fair, I believe France is recognizing the 100-year aniversary of the armistice, and invited everyone. I'd be more pissed if Trump skipped that

    BUT: Trump's parade was scheduled for the day before (10th), so his claim of "instead" is bullshit on all counts.

    ArbitraryDescriptor on
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    manwiththemachinegunmanwiththemachinegun METAL GEAR?! Registered User regular
    Admiral McRaven is the kind of too cool to exist name everyone would laugh at you for including it in your Star Trek fanfiction.

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    CouscousCouscous Registered User regular

    Why would the local DC politicians be responsible for the costs?

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    Santa ClaustrophobiaSanta Claustrophobia Ho Ho Ho Disconnecting from Xbox LIVERegistered User regular
    Couscous wrote: »

    Why would the local DC politicians be responsible for the costs?

    Democrats

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    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited August 2018
    Mr Ray wrote: »
    Wasn't sure which thread this belongs in, but seeing as it pertains to a former Admiral I guess this fits:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/revoke-my-security-clearance-too-mr-president/2018/08/16/8b149b02-a178-11e8-93e3-24d1703d2a7a_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.f005ca54ae8f
    William H. McRaven, a retired Navy admiral, was commander of the U.S. Joint Special Operations Command from 2011 to 2014. He oversaw the 2011 Navy SEAL raid in Pakistan that killed al-Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden.

    Dear Mr. President:

    Former CIA director John Brennan, whose security clearance you revoked on Wednesday, is one of the finest public servants I have ever known. Few Americans have done more to protect this country than John. He is a man of unparalleled integrity, whose honesty and character have never been in question, except by those who don’t know him.

    Therefore, I would consider it an honor if you would revoke my security clearance as well, so I can add my name to the list of men and women who have spoken up against your presidency.

    Like most Americans, I had hoped that when you became president, you would rise to the occasion and become the leader this great nation needs.

    A good leader tries to embody the best qualities of his or her organization. A good leader sets the example for others to follow. A good leader always puts the welfare of others before himself or herself.

    Your leadership, however, has shown little of these qualities. Through your actions, you have embarrassed us in the eyes of our children, humiliated us on the world stage and, worst of all, divided us as a nation.

    If you think for a moment that your McCarthy-era tactics will suppress the voices of criticism, you are sadly mistaken. The criticism will continue until you become the leader we prayed you would be.

    #MineToo is now a thing on twitter. As usual, don't read the comments.

    This makes me exceptionally happy because, if I had to search for a single human being who was, somehow, even more of a habitual liar and immoral monster than Donald Trump, John Brennan would be at the top of my search. From his instrumental career in the "torturing some folks" days, to the shit he later did to cover it up. And of course there's that awesome drone program he was so instrumental in, the one that had "not a single collateral death", thanks to his highly inventive interpretations of "civilian", "collateral", and "death."

    But instead of happy, I think I mean to say, "angry to the point of mind-numbing rage and seeing spots". I think that's it. And I guess Admiral McRaven is good friends with him. They probably go back a long time.

    Oh, and for good measure, Michael Hayden has the better part of 40 pages of a 2014 Senate report devoted to him personally and debunking the shit he's said in defense of torture and addressing his incredible diligence in its defense. Besides, you know, defense of torture. And James Clapper, the unfaltering champion of undermining the Senate's already inadequate oversight of the country's security bodies as well as being a compulsive liar on pretty much anything regarding domestic surveillance.

    At the end of all of this, I'm genuinely impressed that Donald Trump, of all people, for let's assume entirely self-serving reasons (and thanks to the work of brilliant men like these, we'll have to assume, because we'll probably all be dead before any of this is brought under review), has attempted to sanction three men who are as monstrous or worse than he is (forty goddamn pages). And I'm actually so maddened by it, I'm considering whether or not I'm angry at the revoking of security clearance because it's going to help them get away with that horrific shit if they hadn't already.

    They are, and this is not excluding Donald Trump from this categorization, men for whom I confidently believe this world is substantially worse off for having existed.

    Synthesis on
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    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Yeah fuck Brennan, he deserves a lot worse than losing his clearance.

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    zekebeauzekebeau Registered User regular
    Couscous wrote: »

    Why would the local DC politicians be responsible for the costs?

    DC politicians wanted guarantees that they would get road repairs (because tanks fuck up your streets) and other clean up/repair for the damage, instead of footing the entire bill for the privilege of having a big parade for Trump.

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    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    Solar wrote: »
    Yeah fuck Brennan, he deserves a lot worse than losing his clearance.

    I can only hope I one day become extremely wealthy by promoting war and aggressive defending torture to the point of insinuating people who disagree with my defense of torture don't love America as much as I do, have my war and torture security clearance revoked by a colossal buffoon, and then praising accolades of and people lining up in defense of my career.

    Of torture and killing civilians.

    It'd be pretty awesome, in the most archaic definition of the word.

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    CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    edited August 2018
    Solar wrote: »
    Yeah fuck Brennan, he deserves a lot worse than losing his clearance.

    Selective punishment of people for corrupt reasons is a problem even when the people being punished are completely god awful. Heck, it is pretty normal for them to be pretty god awful in a lot of regimes where people fall out of favor and someone pulls a corruption case out.

    Couscous on
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    enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Solar wrote: »
    Yeah fuck Brennan, he deserves a lot worse than losing his clearance.

    Trump is so terrible he makes you feel sympathy for some monstrous humans. Brennan, Comey, etc.

    Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    edited August 2018
    Solar wrote: »
    Yeah fuck Brennan, he deserves a lot worse than losing his clearance.

    Trump is so terrible he makes you feel sympathy for some monstrous humans. Brennan, Comey, etc.

    I'm sure this is happening.

    I'm also very confident that the vast majority of people have no idea just how fucking monstrously terrible the likes of Brennan and Hayden are. When people throw around terms like "war criminals" in regards to the last 20 years, if literally anyone can be described as such, it's them. And then they decided to criticize Donald Trump, so the decade or more of defending torture, then illegally undermining their own government's weak efforts to maybe stop torture at some point isn't important anymore.

    When people suggest treasonous deception, undermining, and outright obstruction being committed by the highest leaders of the American government, yeah it's these fuckers by literally their own definitions.

    But I also feel literally no sympathy for them, which I'm going to assume is exceptional now. To use the old example, Donald Trump could shoot John Brennan in the middle of Time Square, and I still wouldn't feel sympathy for him. I might actually say that was one of the most ultimately positive acts of his presidency (if not for the inevitable martyrdom of a now beloved defender of torture and murder-via-drone).

    Synthesis on
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    DecomposeyDecomposey Registered User regular
    edited August 2018
    MorganV wrote: »
    Qanamil wrote: »


    Trumps response to cancelling his parade?

    Go to France for their parade instead

    on Veterans day

    Expanding on this, he has cancelled the parade citing local DC politicians making it too expensive.
    Yeah, the "I broke up with you before you broke up with me" thing is a standard Trump trope.

    Also, how's he intending to get the costs way down? And if it's the DC politicians (and not just a fucking stupid idea on principle), then why not do it in a different location? Fort Bragg (apparently the largest populated military base) isn't far away, and North Carolina voted for Trump. And with Camp Lejune and Pope AFB and a Coast Guard installation (I did googlez!), it seems to cover everything but the Navy (who are arguably the least suited for a military parade showing off military wares like the numbnut wants). And that took like 3 minutes to find a politically tenable location with local access to most of the toys he's wanting to display.

    Because it's a stupid fucking idea. And was ALWAYS going to cost more than the initial quote. And given both Fort Bragg and Pope AFB are celebrating their centenary this year, seems like it'd have been a better idea than sending fucking tanks through the streets of DC.

    NC did, but Fort Bragg didn't. In the spoiler is a map of the NC election results by county. I have circled the place where Fort Bragg is in yellow.
    2bv0g7idllyp.jpg

    Decomposey on
    Before following any advice, opinions, or thoughts I may have expressed in the above post, be warned: I found Keven Costners "Waterworld" to be a very entertaining film.
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    Santa ClaustrophobiaSanta Claustrophobia Ho Ho Ho Disconnecting from Xbox LIVERegistered User regular
    Brennan being a shitheel doesn't exactly make this choice to remove his clearance for political reasons any better.

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    SynthesisSynthesis Honda Today! Registered User regular
    Brennan being a shitheel doesn't exactly make this choice to remove his clearance for political reasons any better.

    This is certainly true. The likes of John Brennan having any sort of political access, including security clearance, desperately needed to end because he enabled torture and other horrifying policies. Except now, in doing it this way, it's effectively empowered him in a different venue with the possibility of political advocacy of shit as bad or worse, e.g. being advocated by other political leaders like those in the military.

    (Also institutional corruption, though that isn't new.)

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    CouscousCouscous Registered User regular
    Trump got into a fight with military vets over agent orange in the silliest possible way.

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-and-omarosa-had-a-fcking-weird-fight-with-vietnam-vets
    After some vocal public shaming from military veterans and advocates, Trump, accompanied by Manigault-Newman, met with principals from various vets organizations in the Roosevelt Room on March 17, 2017.

    The event nearly degenerated into a uniquely Trumpian trainwreck.

    During this White House meeting, certain details of which have not been previously reported, the president managed to again annoy and confuse U.S. war veterans, this time by getting into a bizarre, protracted argument with Vietnam War vets present about the movie Apocalypse Now and the herbicide Agent Orange.

    “It was really fucking weird,” one attendee bluntly assessed to The Daily Beast.

    The meeting included President Trump and the envoys of nearly a dozen major vets groups—including the American Legion, Vietnam Veterans of America, American Veterans, Veterans of Foreign Wars, and the right-leaning Concerned Veterans for America—as well as senior staffers such as Stephen Miller, Kellyanne Conway, Sean Spicer, and Manigault-Newman surrounding the large table.
    During the course of the meeting, Weidman brought up the issue of Agent Orange, an extremely notorious component of the U.S. herbicidal warfare on Vietnam. Weidman was imploring the president and his team to permit access to benefits for a broader number of vets who have said they were poisoned by Agent Orange.

    Trump responded by saying, “That’s taken care of,” according to people in the room.

    His reply puzzled the group.

    Attendees began explaining to the president that the VA had not made enough progress on the issue at all, to which Trump responded by abruptly derailing the meeting and asking the attendees if Agent Orange was “that stuff from that movie.”


    He did not initially name the film he was referencing, but it quickly became clear as Trump kept rambling that he was referring to the classic 1979 Francis Ford Coppola epic Apocalypse Now, and specifically the famous helicopter attack scene set to the “Ride of the Valkyries.”

    Source present at the time tell The Daily Beast that multiple people—including Vietnam War veterans—chimed in to inform the president that the Apocalypse Now set piece he was talking about showcased the U.S. military using napalm, not Agent Orange.

    Trump refused to accept that he was mistaken and proceeded to say things like, “no, I think it’s that stuff from that movie.”
    The debate over Apocalypse Now in the Roosevelt Room lasted at least two minutes, according to estimates from those who endured it. The president was not able to call on everyone at the roundtable by the end of the event, in part due to these types of tangents.

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    MorganVMorganV Registered User regular
    edited August 2018
    Couscous wrote: »
    Trump got into a fight with military vets over agent orange in the silliest possible way.

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-and-omarosa-had-a-fcking-weird-fight-with-vietnam-vets
    After some vocal public shaming from military veterans and advocates, Trump, accompanied by Manigault-Newman, met with principals from various vets organizations in the Roosevelt Room on March 17, 2017.

    The event nearly degenerated into a uniquely Trumpian trainwreck.

    During this White House meeting, certain details of which have not been previously reported, the president managed to again annoy and confuse U.S. war veterans, this time by getting into a bizarre, protracted argument with Vietnam War vets present about the movie Apocalypse Now and the herbicide Agent Orange.

    “It was really fucking weird,” one attendee bluntly assessed to The Daily Beast.

    The meeting included President Trump and the envoys of nearly a dozen major vets groups—including the American Legion, Vietnam Veterans of America, American Veterans, Veterans of Foreign Wars, and the right-leaning Concerned Veterans for America—as well as senior staffers such as Stephen Miller, Kellyanne Conway, Sean Spicer, and Manigault-Newman surrounding the large table.
    During the course of the meeting, Weidman brought up the issue of Agent Orange, an extremely notorious component of the U.S. herbicidal warfare on Vietnam. Weidman was imploring the president and his team to permit access to benefits for a broader number of vets who have said they were poisoned by Agent Orange.

    Trump responded by saying, “That’s taken care of,” according to people in the room.

    His reply puzzled the group.

    Attendees began explaining to the president that the VA had not made enough progress on the issue at all, to which Trump responded by abruptly derailing the meeting and asking the attendees if Agent Orange was “that stuff from that movie.”


    He did not initially name the film he was referencing, but it quickly became clear as Trump kept rambling that he was referring to the classic 1979 Francis Ford Coppola epic Apocalypse Now, and specifically the famous helicopter attack scene set to the “Ride of the Valkyries.”

    Source present at the time tell The Daily Beast that multiple people—including Vietnam War veterans—chimed in to inform the president that the Apocalypse Now set piece he was talking about showcased the U.S. military using napalm, not Agent Orange.

    Trump refused to accept that he was mistaken and proceeded to say things like, “no, I think it’s that stuff from that movie.”
    The debate over Apocalypse Now in the Roosevelt Room lasted at least two minutes, according to estimates from those who endured it. The president was not able to call on everyone at the roundtable by the end of the event, in part due to these types of tangents.
    Was John Kelly doing his facepalm?

    I mean, fucking hell. I wasn't born until just before the Vietnam war ended. I've got a passing interest in wartime history, but I'm far from learned. And I still know what Agent Fucking Orange is.

    This man was in military school while Agent Orange was being deployed. He was given five deferments during the period when it was being deployed. His contemporaries suffer from it. And he doesn't appear to know the difference between napalm and Agent Orange.

    The best fucking brain, this guy.

    MorganV on
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    AthenorAthenor Battle Hardened Optimist The Skies of HiigaraRegistered User regular
    He just cannot admit to being wrong.

    And further, I'm sure he has been compared to agent orange before, so maybe he wanted to picture it as something badass.

    He/Him | "A boat is always safest in the harbor, but that’s not why we build boats." | "If you run, you gain one. If you move forward, you gain two." - Suletta Mercury, G-Witch
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    Beef AvengerBeef Avenger Registered User regular
    “It was really fucking weird”, the kindest way we'll be able to describe this era in the future

    Steam ID
    PSN: Robo_Wizard1
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    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Couscous wrote: »
    Solar wrote: »
    Yeah fuck Brennan, he deserves a lot worse than losing his clearance.

    Selective punishment of people for corrupt reasons is a problem even when the people being punished are completely god awful. Heck, it is pretty normal for them to be pretty god awful in a lot of regimes where people fall out of favor and someone pulls a corruption case out.

    I'm not remotely going to defend Trump on anything in the slightest but Brennan should be in a prison cell and I'll not weep for him for the slightest moment. A shit person has done a shit thing to someone equally, arguably even more, awful.

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    SleepSleep Registered User regular
    MorganV wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »
    Trump got into a fight with military vets over agent orange in the silliest possible way.

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-and-omarosa-had-a-fcking-weird-fight-with-vietnam-vets
    After some vocal public shaming from military veterans and advocates, Trump, accompanied by Manigault-Newman, met with principals from various vets organizations in the Roosevelt Room on March 17, 2017.

    The event nearly degenerated into a uniquely Trumpian trainwreck.

    During this White House meeting, certain details of which have not been previously reported, the president managed to again annoy and confuse U.S. war veterans, this time by getting into a bizarre, protracted argument with Vietnam War vets present about the movie Apocalypse Now and the herbicide Agent Orange.

    “It was really fucking weird,” one attendee bluntly assessed to The Daily Beast.

    The meeting included President Trump and the envoys of nearly a dozen major vets groups—including the American Legion, Vietnam Veterans of America, American Veterans, Veterans of Foreign Wars, and the right-leaning Concerned Veterans for America—as well as senior staffers such as Stephen Miller, Kellyanne Conway, Sean Spicer, and Manigault-Newman surrounding the large table.
    During the course of the meeting, Weidman brought up the issue of Agent Orange, an extremely notorious component of the U.S. herbicidal warfare on Vietnam. Weidman was imploring the president and his team to permit access to benefits for a broader number of vets who have said they were poisoned by Agent Orange.

    Trump responded by saying, “That’s taken care of,” according to people in the room.

    His reply puzzled the group.

    Attendees began explaining to the president that the VA had not made enough progress on the issue at all, to which Trump responded by abruptly derailing the meeting and asking the attendees if Agent Orange was “that stuff from that movie.”


    He did not initially name the film he was referencing, but it quickly became clear as Trump kept rambling that he was referring to the classic 1979 Francis Ford Coppola epic Apocalypse Now, and specifically the famous helicopter attack scene set to the “Ride of the Valkyries.”

    Source present at the time tell The Daily Beast that multiple people—including Vietnam War veterans—chimed in to inform the president that the Apocalypse Now set piece he was talking about showcased the U.S. military using napalm, not Agent Orange.

    Trump refused to accept that he was mistaken and proceeded to say things like, “no, I think it’s that stuff from that movie.”
    The debate over Apocalypse Now in the Roosevelt Room lasted at least two minutes, according to estimates from those who endured it. The president was not able to call on everyone at the roundtable by the end of the event, in part due to these types of tangents.
    Was John Kelly doing his facepalm?

    I mean, fucking hell. I wasn't born until just before the Vietnam war ended. I've got a passing interest in wartime history, but I'm far from learned. And I still know what Agent Fucking Orange is.

    This man was in military school while Agent Orange was being deployed. He was given five deferments during the period when it was being deployed. His contemporaries suffer from it. And he doesn't appear to know the difference between napalm and Agent Orange.

    The best fucking brain, this guy.

    I was born in the latter half of the fuckin 80s and I know what agent orange is.

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    PhillisherePhillishere Registered User regular
    Sleep wrote: »
    MorganV wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »
    Trump got into a fight with military vets over agent orange in the silliest possible way.

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-and-omarosa-had-a-fcking-weird-fight-with-vietnam-vets
    After some vocal public shaming from military veterans and advocates, Trump, accompanied by Manigault-Newman, met with principals from various vets organizations in the Roosevelt Room on March 17, 2017.

    The event nearly degenerated into a uniquely Trumpian trainwreck.

    During this White House meeting, certain details of which have not been previously reported, the president managed to again annoy and confuse U.S. war veterans, this time by getting into a bizarre, protracted argument with Vietnam War vets present about the movie Apocalypse Now and the herbicide Agent Orange.

    “It was really fucking weird,” one attendee bluntly assessed to The Daily Beast.

    The meeting included President Trump and the envoys of nearly a dozen major vets groups—including the American Legion, Vietnam Veterans of America, American Veterans, Veterans of Foreign Wars, and the right-leaning Concerned Veterans for America—as well as senior staffers such as Stephen Miller, Kellyanne Conway, Sean Spicer, and Manigault-Newman surrounding the large table.
    During the course of the meeting, Weidman brought up the issue of Agent Orange, an extremely notorious component of the U.S. herbicidal warfare on Vietnam. Weidman was imploring the president and his team to permit access to benefits for a broader number of vets who have said they were poisoned by Agent Orange.

    Trump responded by saying, “That’s taken care of,” according to people in the room.

    His reply puzzled the group.

    Attendees began explaining to the president that the VA had not made enough progress on the issue at all, to which Trump responded by abruptly derailing the meeting and asking the attendees if Agent Orange was “that stuff from that movie.”


    He did not initially name the film he was referencing, but it quickly became clear as Trump kept rambling that he was referring to the classic 1979 Francis Ford Coppola epic Apocalypse Now, and specifically the famous helicopter attack scene set to the “Ride of the Valkyries.”

    Source present at the time tell The Daily Beast that multiple people—including Vietnam War veterans—chimed in to inform the president that the Apocalypse Now set piece he was talking about showcased the U.S. military using napalm, not Agent Orange.

    Trump refused to accept that he was mistaken and proceeded to say things like, “no, I think it’s that stuff from that movie.”
    The debate over Apocalypse Now in the Roosevelt Room lasted at least two minutes, according to estimates from those who endured it. The president was not able to call on everyone at the roundtable by the end of the event, in part due to these types of tangents.
    Was John Kelly doing his facepalm?

    I mean, fucking hell. I wasn't born until just before the Vietnam war ended. I've got a passing interest in wartime history, but I'm far from learned. And I still know what Agent Fucking Orange is.

    This man was in military school while Agent Orange was being deployed. He was given five deferments during the period when it was being deployed. His contemporaries suffer from it. And he doesn't appear to know the difference between napalm and Agent Orange.

    The best fucking brain, this guy.

    I was born in the latter half of the fuckin 80s and I know what agent orange is.

    The level to which Trump has enclosed himself in a bubble of ignorance and privilege for his entire life is pretty spectacular. All the knowledge he has is poorly understood paraphrases of conversations on the golf course and snippets from Fox News.

  • Options
    ForarForar #432 Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    Sleep wrote: »
    I was born in the latter half of the fuckin 80s and I know what agent orange is.

    We should just be happy that he could be kept on the topic of the actual Vietnam conflict, and not his own personal Vietnam.
    “It’s amazing, I can’t even believe it. I’ve been so lucky in terms of that whole world, it is a dangerous world out there. It’s like Vietnam, sort of. It is my personal Vietnam. I feel like a great and very brave solider,” Trump said in the interview when Howard Stern asked how he handled making sure he wasn’t contracting STDs from the women he was sleeping with.

    The business-mogul-turned-politician elaborated on the fact in the interview, calling women’s vaginas “potential landmines” and saying “there’s some real danger there.”

    First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
  • Options
    Skull2185Skull2185 Registered User regular
    Sleep wrote: »
    MorganV wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »
    Trump got into a fight with military vets over agent orange in the silliest possible way.

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-and-omarosa-had-a-fcking-weird-fight-with-vietnam-vets
    After some vocal public shaming from military veterans and advocates, Trump, accompanied by Manigault-Newman, met with principals from various vets organizations in the Roosevelt Room on March 17, 2017.

    The event nearly degenerated into a uniquely Trumpian trainwreck.

    During this White House meeting, certain details of which have not been previously reported, the president managed to again annoy and confuse U.S. war veterans, this time by getting into a bizarre, protracted argument with Vietnam War vets present about the movie Apocalypse Now and the herbicide Agent Orange.

    “It was really fucking weird,” one attendee bluntly assessed to The Daily Beast.

    The meeting included President Trump and the envoys of nearly a dozen major vets groups—including the American Legion, Vietnam Veterans of America, American Veterans, Veterans of Foreign Wars, and the right-leaning Concerned Veterans for America—as well as senior staffers such as Stephen Miller, Kellyanne Conway, Sean Spicer, and Manigault-Newman surrounding the large table.
    During the course of the meeting, Weidman brought up the issue of Agent Orange, an extremely notorious component of the U.S. herbicidal warfare on Vietnam. Weidman was imploring the president and his team to permit access to benefits for a broader number of vets who have said they were poisoned by Agent Orange.

    Trump responded by saying, “That’s taken care of,” according to people in the room.

    His reply puzzled the group.

    Attendees began explaining to the president that the VA had not made enough progress on the issue at all, to which Trump responded by abruptly derailing the meeting and asking the attendees if Agent Orange was “that stuff from that movie.”


    He did not initially name the film he was referencing, but it quickly became clear as Trump kept rambling that he was referring to the classic 1979 Francis Ford Coppola epic Apocalypse Now, and specifically the famous helicopter attack scene set to the “Ride of the Valkyries.”

    Source present at the time tell The Daily Beast that multiple people—including Vietnam War veterans—chimed in to inform the president that the Apocalypse Now set piece he was talking about showcased the U.S. military using napalm, not Agent Orange.

    Trump refused to accept that he was mistaken and proceeded to say things like, “no, I think it’s that stuff from that movie.”
    The debate over Apocalypse Now in the Roosevelt Room lasted at least two minutes, according to estimates from those who endured it. The president was not able to call on everyone at the roundtable by the end of the event, in part due to these types of tangents.
    Was John Kelly doing his facepalm?

    I mean, fucking hell. I wasn't born until just before the Vietnam war ended. I've got a passing interest in wartime history, but I'm far from learned. And I still know what Agent Fucking Orange is.

    This man was in military school while Agent Orange was being deployed. He was given five deferments during the period when it was being deployed. His contemporaries suffer from it. And he doesn't appear to know the difference between napalm and Agent Orange.

    The best fucking brain, this guy.

    I was born in the latter half of the fuckin 80s and I know what agent orange is.

    And you know who almost certainly knows what agent orange is?

    A VETERAN OF THE FUCKING VIETNAM WAR

    AHHH!!!!

    That article made my blood pressure skyrocket I think... I can feel my pulse in my cheekbones.

    Everyone has a price. Throw enough gold around and someone will risk disintegration.
  • Options
    ArbitraryDescriptorArbitraryDescriptor changed Registered User regular
    Brennan being a shitheel doesn't exactly make this choice to remove his clearance for political reasons any better.

    If that person's job requires a clearance, this would also be the president unilaterally having a private citizen fired and barred from future employment in their established career path; all merely for speaking against him.

  • Options
    PhillisherePhillishere Registered User regular
    Brennan being a shitheel doesn't exactly make this choice to remove his clearance for political reasons any better.

    If that person's job requires a clearance, this would also be the president unilaterally having a private citizen fired and barred from future employment in their established career path; all merely for speaking against him.

    Even in the case of a shitheel, an agency director is going to have a ton of institutional knowledge about operations and intelligence that would be difficult to collect independently. That's the kind of position where even an invading army would keep a captured enemy intel chief close as handy reference material.

  • Options
    shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    MorganV wrote: »
    Couscous wrote: »
    Trump got into a fight with military vets over agent orange in the silliest possible way.

    https://www.thedailybeast.com/trump-and-omarosa-had-a-fcking-weird-fight-with-vietnam-vets
    After some vocal public shaming from military veterans and advocates, Trump, accompanied by Manigault-Newman, met with principals from various vets organizations in the Roosevelt Room on March 17, 2017.

    The event nearly degenerated into a uniquely Trumpian trainwreck.

    During this White House meeting, certain details of which have not been previously reported, the president managed to again annoy and confuse U.S. war veterans, this time by getting into a bizarre, protracted argument with Vietnam War vets present about the movie Apocalypse Now and the herbicide Agent Orange.

    “It was really fucking weird,” one attendee bluntly assessed to The Daily Beast.

    The meeting included President Trump and the envoys of nearly a dozen major vets groups—including the American Legion, Vietnam Veterans of America, American Veterans, Veterans of Foreign Wars, and the right-leaning Concerned Veterans for America—as well as senior staffers such as Stephen Miller, Kellyanne Conway, Sean Spicer, and Manigault-Newman surrounding the large table.
    During the course of the meeting, Weidman brought up the issue of Agent Orange, an extremely notorious component of the U.S. herbicidal warfare on Vietnam. Weidman was imploring the president and his team to permit access to benefits for a broader number of vets who have said they were poisoned by Agent Orange.

    Trump responded by saying, “That’s taken care of,” according to people in the room.

    His reply puzzled the group.

    Attendees began explaining to the president that the VA had not made enough progress on the issue at all, to which Trump responded by abruptly derailing the meeting and asking the attendees if Agent Orange was “that stuff from that movie.”


    He did not initially name the film he was referencing, but it quickly became clear as Trump kept rambling that he was referring to the classic 1979 Francis Ford Coppola epic Apocalypse Now, and specifically the famous helicopter attack scene set to the “Ride of the Valkyries.”

    Source present at the time tell The Daily Beast that multiple people—including Vietnam War veterans—chimed in to inform the president that the Apocalypse Now set piece he was talking about showcased the U.S. military using napalm, not Agent Orange.

    Trump refused to accept that he was mistaken and proceeded to say things like, “no, I think it’s that stuff from that movie.”
    The debate over Apocalypse Now in the Roosevelt Room lasted at least two minutes, according to estimates from those who endured it. The president was not able to call on everyone at the roundtable by the end of the event, in part due to these types of tangents.
    Was John Kelly doing his facepalm?

    I mean, fucking hell. I wasn't born until just before the Vietnam war ended. I've got a passing interest in wartime history, but I'm far from learned. And I still know what Agent Fucking Orange is.

    This man was in military school while Agent Orange was being deployed. He was given five deferments during the period when it was being deployed. His contemporaries suffer from it. And he doesn't appear to know the difference between napalm and Agent Orange.

    The best fucking brain, this guy.

    Don't worry guys, veterans will still vote for him by huge margins I'm sure.

  • Options
    DoodmannDoodmann Registered User regular
    “It was really fucking weird”, the kindest way we'll be able to describe this era in the future

    Really fucking weird usually turns into "horrific fucking shitshow" by the time it gets to history books.

    I'm sure a lot of people in Austria thought shit was really fucking weird in the 30s.

    Whippy wrote: »
    nope nope nope nope abort abort talk about anime
    I like to ART
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    ShortyShorty touching the meat Intergalactic Cool CourtRegistered User regular
    Synthesis wrote: »
    Mr Ray wrote: »
    Wasn't sure which thread this belongs in, but seeing as it pertains to a former Admiral I guess this fits:

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/revoke-my-security-clearance-too-mr-president/2018/08/16/8b149b02-a178-11e8-93e3-24d1703d2a7a_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.f005ca54ae8f
    William H. McRaven, a retired Navy admiral, was commander of the U.S. Joint Special Operations Command from 2011 to 2014. He oversaw the 2011 Navy SEAL raid in Pakistan that killed al-Qaeda leader Osama bin Laden.

    Dear Mr. President:

    Former CIA director John Brennan, whose security clearance you revoked on Wednesday, is one of the finest public servants I have ever known. Few Americans have done more to protect this country than John. He is a man of unparalleled integrity, whose honesty and character have never been in question, except by those who don’t know him.

    Therefore, I would consider it an honor if you would revoke my security clearance as well, so I can add my name to the list of men and women who have spoken up against your presidency.

    Like most Americans, I had hoped that when you became president, you would rise to the occasion and become the leader this great nation needs.

    A good leader tries to embody the best qualities of his or her organization. A good leader sets the example for others to follow. A good leader always puts the welfare of others before himself or herself.

    Your leadership, however, has shown little of these qualities. Through your actions, you have embarrassed us in the eyes of our children, humiliated us on the world stage and, worst of all, divided us as a nation.

    If you think for a moment that your McCarthy-era tactics will suppress the voices of criticism, you are sadly mistaken. The criticism will continue until you become the leader we prayed you would be.

    #MineToo is now a thing on twitter. As usual, don't read the comments.

    This makes me exceptionally happy because, if I had to search for a single human being who was, somehow, even more of a habitual liar and immoral monster than Donald Trump, John Brennan would be at the top of my search. From his instrumental career in the "torturing some folks" days, to the shit he later did to cover it up. And of course there's that awesome drone program he was so instrumental in, the one that had "not a single collateral death", thanks to his highly inventive interpretations of "civilian", "collateral", and "death."

    But instead of happy, I think I mean to say, "angry to the point of mind-numbing rage and seeing spots". I think that's it. And I guess Admiral McRaven is good friends with him. They probably go back a long time.

    Oh, and for good measure, Michael Hayden has the better part of 40 pages of a 2014 Senate report devoted to him personally and debunking the shit he's said in defense of torture and addressing his incredible diligence in its defense. Besides, you know, defense of torture. And James Clapper, the unfaltering champion of undermining the Senate's already inadequate oversight of the country's security bodies as well as being a compulsive liar on pretty much anything regarding domestic surveillance.

    At the end of all of this, I'm genuinely impressed that Donald Trump, of all people, for let's assume entirely self-serving reasons (and thanks to the work of brilliant men like these, we'll have to assume, because we'll probably all be dead before any of this is brought under review), has attempted to sanction three men who are as monstrous or worse than he is (forty goddamn pages). And I'm actually so maddened by it, I'm considering whether or not I'm angry at the revoking of security clearance because it's going to help them get away with that horrific shit if they hadn't already.

    They are, and this is not excluding Donald Trump from this categorization, men for whom I confidently believe this world is substantially worse off for having existed.

    so glad people are saying this

    the ease with which elected democrats took this pile of shit into the #resistance fold is embarrassing

  • Options
    nexuscrawlernexuscrawler Registered User regular
    Do you think for a nanosecond Trump has tried to stop torture from the new CIA?

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    ElkiElki get busy Moderator, ClubPA Mod Emeritus
    Brennan losing his security clearance isn’t even close to topical. Stop talking about him here.

    smCQ5WE.jpg
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    FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    edited August 2018
    Do you think for a nanosecond Trump has tried to stop torture from the new CIA?

    Trump wants to increase it for fuck's sake.

    Fencingsax on
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