I'm surprised you guys are surprised by any of this. Between people finding the most efficient way to ultra grind and people's unbelievable bitching about not getting all of the rewards out of one rally, there was no way they weren't going to dramatically change the way it worked.
Also I'm pledging to FWC in the next one and if I don't get that goddamn scout rifle (the unpronounceable corrector) I will be so mad
Either "PLY-uh-deez" or "PLAY-uh-deez" are acceptable
EDIT: And while we're on the subject, Antiope is "an-TY-oh-pee"
Are you from the UK? At any rate, the first pronunciation there is pliːədiːz.
The "i" in the phonetic is as in ease or see, so I was half right. It's not *not* ply-uhh-deez, but plee-uh-deez is the most common/best/onlycorrect pronunciation. (facetious about the only-correct bit)
PSN: Broodax- battle.net: broodax#1163
+1
Sirialisof the Halite Throne.Registered Userregular
Just to make sure everyone is on the right page. If you're in a fireteam doing Lost Sectors, every individual is getting 3 tokens. Your token amount does not go up because you're in a fireteam.
The real way to increase output as a fireteam is to split up and have each member speedrun a different Sector.
I'm surprised you guys are surprised by any of this. Between people finding the most efficient way to ultra grind and people's unbelievable bitching about not getting all of the rewards out of one rally, there was no way they weren't going to dramatically change the way it worked.
Also I'm pledging to FWC in the next one and if I don't get that goddamn scout rifle (the unpronounceable corrector) I will be so mad
Either "PLY-uh-deez" or "PLAY-uh-deez" are acceptable
EDIT: And while we're on the subject, Antiope is "an-TY-oh-pee"
Are you from the UK? At any rate, the first pronunciation there is pliːədiːz.
The "i" in the phonetic is as in ease or see, so I was half right. It's not *not* ply-uhh-deez, but plee-uh-deez is the most common/best/onlycorrect pronunciation. (facetious about the only-correct bit)
Not only are Strikes pointless, none of them are fun or interesting.
It's just four different iterations of "deal damage to boss! can no longer hurt boss! adds spawn! find way to make boss vulnerable! repeat for several minutes!"
i guess a big problem with this is you have to make something three randos who refuse to talk to each other can also accomplish consistently
Even that can be varied though just through having more variety in the boss being damaged and the terrain of the arena. The Division managed it on release and it was not a good game on release. One mission ended with a sharpshooter boss overlooking a relatively narrow corridor and you had to move through cover while fighting adds trying to flank you and make sure not to leave cover when you were in the boss's sights as you worked your way up to the boss's shooting position or you could try to engage the boss in a sharpshooter duel from range. Another had an arena with a balcony running around the arena that could be used to get high ground at the expense of less cover than the ground level or a team member might choose the greater mobility the ground level afforded. Simple mechanics are fine but there's a lot of variety that can be added from layout.
There's also other super common mechanics like "Don't stand in the stuff" or "Stand in the stuff" that the game seems to be underusing.
Though in general the lack of ability to do a lot of things beyond "shoot the mans in the face with the gun" most of the time really hampers their ability to make interesting encounter design I think. And especially when they have to also balance around PvP.
0
SurfpossumA nonentitytrying to preserve the anonymity he so richly deserves.Registered Userregular
I'm surprised you guys are surprised by any of this. Between people finding the most efficient way to ultra grind and people's unbelievable bitching about not getting all of the rewards out of one rally, there was no way they weren't going to dramatically change the way it worked.
Also I'm pledging to FWC in the next one and if I don't get that goddamn scout rifle (the unpronounceable corrector) I will be so mad
Either "PLY-uh-deez" or "PLAY-uh-deez" are acceptable
EDIT: And while we're on the subject, Antiope is "an-TY-oh-pee"
Are you from the UK? At any rate, the first pronunciation there is pliːədiːz.
The "i" in the phonetic is as in ease or see, so I was half right. It's not *not* ply-uhh-deez, but plee-uh-deez is the most common/best/onlycorrect pronunciation. (facetious about the only-correct bit)
Just to make sure everyone is on the right page. If you're in a fireteam doing Lost Sectors, every individual is getting 3 tokens. Your token amount does not go up because you're in a fireteam.
The real way to increase output as a fireteam is to split up and have each member speedrun a different Sector.
If history of opening chests in different activities holds true, each player has to be present to open the chest. If I am across the map, I won't get loot.
I'm surprised you guys are surprised by any of this. Between people finding the most efficient way to ultra grind and people's unbelievable bitching about not getting all of the rewards out of one rally, there was no way they weren't going to dramatically change the way it worked.
Also I'm pledging to FWC in the next one and if I don't get that goddamn scout rifle (the unpronounceable corrector) I will be so mad
Either "PLY-uh-deez" or "PLAY-uh-deez" are acceptable
EDIT: And while we're on the subject, Antiope is "an-TY-oh-pee"
Are you from the UK? At any rate, the first pronunciation there is pliːədiːz.
The "i" in the phonetic is as in ease or see, so I was half right. It's not *not* ply-uhh-deez, but plee-uh-deez is the most common/best/onlycorrect pronunciation. (facetious about the only-correct bit)
I'm surprised you guys are surprised by any of this. Between people finding the most efficient way to ultra grind and people's unbelievable bitching about not getting all of the rewards out of one rally, there was no way they weren't going to dramatically change the way it worked.
Also I'm pledging to FWC in the next one and if I don't get that goddamn scout rifle (the unpronounceable corrector) I will be so mad
Either "PLY-uh-deez" or "PLAY-uh-deez" are acceptable
EDIT: And while we're on the subject, Antiope is "an-TY-oh-pee"
Are you from the UK? At any rate, the first pronunciation there is pliːədiːz.
The "i" in the phonetic is as in ease or see, so I was half right. It's not *not* ply-uhh-deez, but plee-uh-deez is the most common/best/onlycorrect pronunciation. (facetious about the only-correct bit)
I'm surprised you guys are surprised by any of this. Between people finding the most efficient way to ultra grind and people's unbelievable bitching about not getting all of the rewards out of one rally, there was no way they weren't going to dramatically change the way it worked.
Also I'm pledging to FWC in the next one and if I don't get that goddamn scout rifle (the unpronounceable corrector) I will be so mad
Either "PLY-uh-deez" or "PLAY-uh-deez" are acceptable
EDIT: And while we're on the subject, Antiope is "an-TY-oh-pee"
Are you from the UK? At any rate, the first pronunciation there is pliːədiːz.
The "i" in the phonetic is as in ease or see, so I was half right. It's not *not* ply-uhh-deez, but plee-uh-deez is the most common/best/onlycorrect pronunciation. (facetious about the only-correct bit)
Sev: Your gameplay is the most heavily yomi based around. Usually you look for characters that allow you to force guessing situations for big dmg. Even if the guess is mathematically nowhere near in your favor lol. You're happiest when you have either a 50/50, 33/33/33 or even a 75/25 situation to go crazy with. And you will take big risks to force those situations to come up.
A public event takes let say 5 minutes, if that. A strike takes 15 to 20. Therefore, a strike should offer 3 to 4 times what a public event does. Am I missing something? Is that not a really simple thing to figure out? I mean, a strike does offer some other rewards....that at this point, almost no one fucking cares about.
Also, who didn't learn to pronounce Pleiades 36 years ago?
A public event takes let say 5 minutes, if that. A strike takes 15 to 20. Therefore, a strike should offer 3 to 4 times what a public event does. Am I missing something? Is that not a really simple thing to figure out? I mean, a strike does offer some other rewards....that at this point, almost no one fucking cares about.
I mean seriously. What are they looking at that suggests it should be anything other than that? It sort of blows my mind.
I enjoy this endless discussion of Destiny because I am super interested in what destiny is and why destiny is. but I think there's really two big questions being discussed here that keep getting merged
Is Destiny 2 more or less fun to play than Destiny 1?
Is Destiny 2's progression system more or less engaging than Destiny 1?
The second question is suuuuper fraught. Destiny's progression system is a lot of things. It's a customization system by which we express ourselves through who our character is. It's also the product of years of research into the science of motivation manipulation. But that's fine, it can be two things!
Maybe you enjoy the minute to minute gameplay of running strikes over and over again but you need that little push of guns constantly leveling up and the chance to get a god roll imago loop to do 10 strikes in a week. But how many times a week do you want to run vanguard strikes? Where does the line between reinforcement and manipulation sit?
I have no fucking idea.
So let' move on to the easier question, is Destiny 2 more or less fun to play than Destiny 1?
There's lots of good reasons why people think Crucible is less fun. Crucible clearly has less variety than before. The switch to 4 ppl was probably a mistake. I don't yet know what I think about that. One thing I DO know is that for me I think single player destiny is more fun to play.
Planetary free roam is WAYYY better than it was before. Like seriously go back to the dreadnaught right now and you'll realize how much less is going on. The public events are many many times more fun than they were before. Heroic objective combine with way more variety to create a much better experience. Lost Sectors are some nice, beautiful seasoning. Cayde's chest give you some incentive to explore. Literally the only thing Destiny 1 free roam did better were the collectibles.
The nightfall is WAY better. I don't know if anyone remembers but nightfalls were fucking boring before.
The Strikes are all excellent. I feel like people aren't acknowledging how brilliant the inverted spire strike is. The inverted spire strike is all the good things about destiny distilled into a fantastic 15 minute experience. Dodging the giant drill arms is probably the coolest thing that's ever happened in non-raid destiny. The Pyramidion has a great boss fight. The arcology strike has probably the best art design ever in destiny and is really atmospheric aside from having a boring boss. Exodus crash and Arms Dealer are about on the same level as your average Destiny 1 strike I guess.
so when people say that Destiny 2 single player is less fun than Destiny 1 I honestly have no idea what they are talking about, because to me it seems like every activity is way better than it was before.
I agree that the progression is less compelling than last time though, but I don't really know what the right answer is there.
A public event takes let say 5 minutes, if that. A strike takes 15 to 20. Therefore, a strike should offer 3 to 4 times what a public event does. Am I missing something? Is that not a really simple thing to figure out? I mean, a strike does offer some other rewards....that at this point, almost no one fucking cares about.
I mean seriously. What are they looking at that suggests it should be anything other than that? It sort of blows my mind.
I'm really curious if reward structure is just something Bungie has folks slap together in between other jobs, like their PR strategy.
A public event takes let say 5 minutes, if that. A strike takes 15 to 20. Therefore, a strike should offer 3 to 4 times what a public event does. Am I missing something? Is that not a really simple thing to figure out? I mean, a strike does offer some other rewards....that at this point, almost no one fucking cares about.
I mean seriously. What are they looking at that suggests it should be anything other than that? It sort of blows my mind.
I'm really curious if reward structure is just something Bungie has folks slap together in between other jobs, like their PR strategy.
They use the monkey paw, obvs.
0
Sir Landsharkresting shark faceRegistered Userregular
edited November 2017
I don't miss having to level up guns and armor one bit. Especially not in OG Y1 Destiny where it took like a billion XP for a piece of armor and also you needed enough shards and it was all tied to once a week RNG loot drop so have fun with that.
Sir Landshark on
Please consider the environment before printing this post.
I enjoy this endless discussion of Destiny because I am super interested in what destiny is and why destiny is. but I think there's really two big questions being discussed here that keep getting merged
Is Destiny 2 more or less fun to play than Destiny 1?
Is Destiny 2's progression system more or less engaging than Destiny 1?
The second question is suuuuper fraught. Destiny's progression system is a lot of things. It's a customization system by which we express ourselves through who our character is. It's also the product of years of research into the science of motivation manipulation. But that's fine, it can be two things!
Maybe you enjoy the minute to minute gameplay of running strikes over and over again but you need that little push of guns constantly leveling up and the chance to get a god roll imago loop to do 10 strikes in a week. But how many times a week do you want to run vanguard strikes? Where does the line between reinforcement and manipulation sit?
I have no fucking idea.
So let' move on to the easier question, is Destiny 2 more or less fun to play than Destiny 1?
There's lots of good reasons why people think Crucible is less fun. Crucible clearly has less variety than before. The switch to 4 ppl was probably a mistake. I don't yet know what I think about that. One thing I DO know is that for me I think single player destiny is more fun to play.
Planetary free roam is WAYYY better than it was before. Like seriously go back to the dreadnaught right now and be like and you'll realize how much less is going on. The public events are many many times more fun than they were before. Heroic objective combine with way more variety to create a much better experience. Lost Sectors are some nice, beautiful seasoning. Cayde's chest give you some incentive to explore. Literally the only thing Destiny 1 free roam did better were the collectibles.
The nightfall is WAY better. I don't know if anyone remembers but nightfalls were fucking boring before.
The Strikes are all excellent. I feel like people aren't acknowledging how brilliant the inverted spire strike is. The inverted spire strike is all the good things about destiny distilled into a fantastic 15 minute experience. Dodging the giant drill arms is probably the coolest thing that's ever happened in non-raid destiny. The Pyramidion has a great boss fight. The arcology strike has probably the best art design ever in destiny and is really atmospheric aside from having a boring boss. Exodus crash and Arms Dealer are about on the same level as your average Destiny 1 strike I guess.
so when people say that Destiny 2 single player is less fun than Destiny 1 I honestly have no idea what they are talking about, because to me it seems like every activity is way better than it was before.
I agree that the progression is less compelling than last time though, but I don't really know what the right answer is there.
Bolded. I don't know if it is possible to separate the two. At least for me. I still love the shooting, movement etc of the game. I enjoy the way public events work, I enjoy the strikes (although we obviously need more and some variations like the heroic list), I enjoy the Nightfall when it isn't punch in the dick mode.
The problem is in a game that isn't meant to be "beat" in any real sense (ie they want you to keep playing) they don't have a compelling way to keep me engaging in the above mentioned activities. If you take away that part you have a shooter with a campaign and a weird open world New Game+ mode with no progressions attached to it.
+2
SurfpossumA nonentitytrying to preserve the anonymity he so richly deserves.Registered Userregular
The public events are absolutely baller and I've yet to feel like I wasn't having at least a decent amount of fun running one.
i don't miss having to level up guns and armor one bit. especially not in OG Y1 Destiny where it took like a billion XP for a piece of armor and also you needed enough shards and it was all tied to once a week RNG loot drop so have fun with that
I actually sorta liked the leveling of weapons thing, not the shards bit but the "use this for a bit and see if it's cool" thing. It also caused them to break down into more marks and provided a short term goal with visible progress and a good reason to do the bounties.
I know this was the "Filling Bars" human brain exploit but it's a thing because of the feedback it creates in people.
Posts
well, to certain degrees, varying the token amounts will just change which activity is the most efficient
Are you from the UK? At any rate, the first pronunciation there is pliːədiːz.
The "i" in the phonetic is as in ease or see, so I was half right. It's not *not* ply-uhh-deez, but plee-uh-deez is the most common/best/onlycorrect pronunciation. (facetious about the only-correct bit)
The real way to increase output as a fireteam is to split up and have each member speedrun a different Sector.
XBL: Sans Gravitas, Steam, Destiny, Twitch
Destiny Raid Groups: Team NATBurn, Team Fourth Meal (Disbanded)
ie makes the ee sound
except in cases where that's not the case
words! *vagabond avface*
Okay I guess we're doing this.
/ˈpliːədiːz/ = "PLEE-uh-deez"
/ˈpleɪədiːz/ = "PLAY-uh-deez"
/ˈplaɪədiːz/ = "PLY-uh-deez"
My original post listed them as "acceptable"
We don't need to get hung up on "best" or "correct" or "only" pronunciation.
XBL: Sans Gravitas, Steam, Destiny, Twitch
Destiny Raid Groups: Team NATBurn, Team Fourth Meal (Disbanded)
There's also other super common mechanics like "Don't stand in the stuff" or "Stand in the stuff" that the game seems to be underusing.
Though in general the lack of ability to do a lot of things beyond "shoot the mans in the face with the gun" most of the time really hampers their ability to make interesting encounter design I think. And especially when they have to also balance around PvP.
That doesn't solve the problem though is the point. You up Strikes enough and it just switches what activity you are grinding/"grinding".
If history of opening chests in different activities holds true, each player has to be present to open the chest. If I am across the map, I won't get loot.
Critical Failures - Havenhold Campaign • August St. Cloud (Human Ranger)
What does the Grimoire say?
They only effectively happened once, were way too generous (for Bungie) and were then promptly nerfed into oblivion.
I also am amazed at those token reworkings that ignore some basic math and the fact that nobody is doing strikes.
Orthoepological Weaponry
Xbox Live / Steam
The point of the changes is, I think, clearly to encourage people to do strikes. They seem well aware no one is doing them.
Of course, their solution sucks as I mentioned earlier this page, but it's still the goal.
Future War Cult easily has the best weapons.
Critical Failures - Havenhold Campaign • August St. Cloud (Human Ranger)
I was getting wrecked by one dude with it in the Crucible and it made me furious
XBL: Sans Gravitas, Steam, Destiny, Twitch
Destiny Raid Groups: Team NATBurn, Team Fourth Meal (Disbanded)
Yep, the Grammar Corrector and the handcannon are awesome.
CoD: WW2 comes out tomorrow. I'm gonna play it and Halo until Osiris hits.
Yeah, that'd be the basic math part I was talking about.
I also just had an amazing thought: I may have played more strikes in the beta than I have since release. Almost definitely if I exclude nightfalls.
Also, who didn't learn to pronounce Pleiades 36 years ago?
And the Assault Rifle is the same as Uriels' except it has skip rounds instead of High-Cal.
Critical Failures - Havenhold Campaign • August St. Cloud (Human Ranger)
Fashion
XBL: Sans Gravitas, Steam, Destiny, Twitch
Destiny Raid Groups: Team NATBurn, Team Fourth Meal (Disbanded)
You are ignoring the importance of your space wizard looking dope.
I mean seriously. What are they looking at that suggests it should be anything other than that? It sort of blows my mind.
Xbox Live / Steam
Pls fix hunter boots stats Bunglo
Is Destiny 2 more or less fun to play than Destiny 1?
Is Destiny 2's progression system more or less engaging than Destiny 1?
The second question is suuuuper fraught. Destiny's progression system is a lot of things. It's a customization system by which we express ourselves through who our character is. It's also the product of years of research into the science of motivation manipulation. But that's fine, it can be two things!
Maybe you enjoy the minute to minute gameplay of running strikes over and over again but you need that little push of guns constantly leveling up and the chance to get a god roll imago loop to do 10 strikes in a week. But how many times a week do you want to run vanguard strikes? Where does the line between reinforcement and manipulation sit?
I have no fucking idea.
So let' move on to the easier question, is Destiny 2 more or less fun to play than Destiny 1?
There's lots of good reasons why people think Crucible is less fun. Crucible clearly has less variety than before. The switch to 4 ppl was probably a mistake. I don't yet know what I think about that. One thing I DO know is that for me I think single player destiny is more fun to play.
Planetary free roam is WAYYY better than it was before. Like seriously go back to the dreadnaught right now and you'll realize how much less is going on. The public events are many many times more fun than they were before. Heroic objective combine with way more variety to create a much better experience. Lost Sectors are some nice, beautiful seasoning. Cayde's chest give you some incentive to explore. Literally the only thing Destiny 1 free roam did better were the collectibles.
The nightfall is WAY better. I don't know if anyone remembers but nightfalls were fucking boring before.
The Strikes are all excellent. I feel like people aren't acknowledging how brilliant the inverted spire strike is. The inverted spire strike is all the good things about destiny distilled into a fantastic 15 minute experience. Dodging the giant drill arms is probably the coolest thing that's ever happened in non-raid destiny. The Pyramidion has a great boss fight. The arcology strike has probably the best art design ever in destiny and is really atmospheric aside from having a boring boss. Exodus crash and Arms Dealer are about on the same level as your average Destiny 1 strike I guess.
so when people say that Destiny 2 single player is less fun than Destiny 1 I honestly have no idea what they are talking about, because to me it seems like every activity is way better than it was before.
I agree that the progression is less compelling than last time though, but I don't really know what the right answer is there.
https://medium.com/@alascii
I'm really curious if reward structure is just something Bungie has folks slap together in between other jobs, like their PR strategy.
I like that warlocks can choose between space wizard robes and great coats.
Law and Order ≠ Justice
ACNH Island Isla Cero: DA-3082-2045-4142
Still waiting on Dan "Man of his Word" Ryckert to eat a hat
They use the monkey paw, obvs.
Bolded. I don't know if it is possible to separate the two. At least for me. I still love the shooting, movement etc of the game. I enjoy the way public events work, I enjoy the strikes (although we obviously need more and some variations like the heroic list), I enjoy the Nightfall when it isn't punch in the dick mode.
The problem is in a game that isn't meant to be "beat" in any real sense (ie they want you to keep playing) they don't have a compelling way to keep me engaging in the above mentioned activities. If you take away that part you have a shooter with a campaign and a weird open world New Game+ mode with no progressions attached to it.
Complete Savathun's Song without killing a thrall
Destroy a thresher as an arcstrider
Win clash on Emperor's Respite without capping A
I actually sorta liked the leveling of weapons thing, not the shards bit but the "use this for a bit and see if it's cool" thing. It also caused them to break down into more marks and provided a short term goal with visible progress and a good reason to do the bounties.
I know this was the "Filling Bars" human brain exploit but it's a thing because of the feedback it creates in people.
I like all of them except the Injection Rig. That one is not well designed.