The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
Non-IM Samuro is prolly gonna be trash, yeah, but Mewn is a pretty avid Samuro player and thinks he's got potential, just in different ways than before (ie, he's actually pretty good at sieging buildings now because illusions eat a ton of tower aggro).
How they got rid of the double (triple!?) tank meta: release a few heroes with good % damage, i e. Malthael.
In qm you get whatever, but in draft you get counterpicked if they notice you getting more than 1 beefy hp sponge.
How they should get rid of double support: release some heroes with mortal strike mechanics, in a way that makes it bad for your team if you have two healers and they have a mortal striker, but if you only have one healer it's not as bad. That way, in draft, there is pick and counterpick strategy.
For example: a debuff on healing you can apply on target enemy hero whose duration gets extended each time they get a heal from any source.
Or a heal debuff you apply to a source of heals (can target wells too, lets say) that grows stronger as a quest based on how many times you have applied it. Cannot apply to something that produces no heals or that already has the debuff.
The solution to mortal strike is to have more healers to burn through it though. Mortal Strike destroys single healer comps because if they happen to use their only CD they get in a fight during a MS they lose that fight.
The mechanics would have to be pretty creative, I don't know what the solution is either, it's a hard problem.
re: winter veil skins, the valla one is really good, will probably get that. I am disappointed because the rumors said there was going to be a li li skin and I really want Li Li with a staff that has christmas lights wrapped around it now.
edit:
Eh, the fact that everyone on the team is dinged 600 points for something they had no control over, or NOTHING TO DO WITH IN THE FIRST PLACE, makes zero sense at all.
If someone is a leaver, they'll still leave, they don't care about their rando allies.
The logic in place right now makes literally no sense.
and if it happens because of bad luck connection, EVERYONE gets dinged? That's BS.
Also, @MNC Dover is that right? Soon you'll have your own 4-man pre-made?
Sure is! Kieri is due end of April or early May. If we can teach the dog to play, we'll be rolling a 5-person crew.
probably better than weekend hots
Our team calls dibbs on Daisy for our alternate member.
Careful, Daisy's a bit particular in her hero pool. The early days of Daisy and Abigail teamwork were rough...
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Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051 Steam ID Twitch Page
+12
Inquisitor772 x Penny Arcade Fight Club ChampionA fixed point in space and timeRegistered Userregular
So new Nova (Nuva?) sounds interesting. Since she's my favorite hero, I'm anxious to see how she shakes out.
My thoughts on her changes:
Snipe (Q):
Baseline Snipe damage reduced from 310 to 255, with the quest being built in. 5% damage bonus to a max of 25%.
Doing the math, that means you'd need 4 snipe stacks to be just under her old baseline damage (310 vs 306 at 4 stacks). 5 stacks brings her to 317 damage, a hair over what it used to be.
Overall, it's a pretty big nerf, but removes the stress of taking Snipe Master and missing. Rewards higher skill players with better accuracy though. I'm lukewarm on this, but happy to see it being experimented with. Numbers can always be tweaked.
Pinning Shot (W)
Damage from 110 to 105. No big deal here.
Holo Decoy (E)
Added functionality: Decoys now deal 10% of Nova’s damage.
Oh, I love this! Decoy doing 0 damage made it pretty useless for engaging or misdirecting. If your opponent see their health bar drop even a little, they might snap attack the decoy instead. I think the damage will be enough that people will adapt quickly though. Still a nice touch.
Permanent Cloak (Trait)
Added functionality: Gain 15% movement speed while Stealthed
Love this too! Advanced Cloaking has been my go-to pick at 1 for a while now. With the Talent only adding another 5% movement speed, I might look into one of her other talents at tier 1.
Triple Tap (R)
Damage per shot increased from 338 to 372
Cool, but still probably not enough to make me switch over from Orbital Strike. I'll try it out though.
(New) Ghost Protocol (1)
Activate to instantly cloak, leave a Holo Decoy at your feet, and become unrevealable for .5 seconds.
They added a Decoy with the insta-cloak? Yes please! Combine this with your E to have 3 potential targets to make your enemy choose from. Or 20% extra damage output for squeezing out a kill.
Talents
Level 1 Advanced Cloaking (Trait)
New functionality:
Increase your Stealth movement speed by 5%. While Stealthed, gain 2 additional mana regeneration per second.
I used to take this primarily for the speed buff (25% while cloaked), so the nerf down to 20% with this might not change anything. Plus never having to worry about mana is nice. I'll experiment with the other level 1 talents, but probably default to this one still.
Level 7 Perfect Shot (Q)
Moved from Level 16
Cooldown reduction on Hero hit reduced from 3 to 2 seconds
Hard to compete with One In The Chamber. I'll try a pure Snipe build and see if my aim can keep up. 4 second Snipes sound cool, but ultimately probably not that useful since you'll really only get 2 Snipes in realistically.
Level 13 Psionic Efficiency (Q)
Bonus range increased from 10 to 15%
Has this even changed? I still think this could get pushed out to 20% or 25% more range. Even if it means getting rid of the mana removal part.
(New Talent) Ionic Force Field (Trait)
Gain 25 Armor for 2 seconds after losing stealth
This sounds super solid, especially when combined with her new level 20. It was 3 seconds at Blizzcon, so a slight nerf here. Great against dive heavy comps or if you want to position more aggressively. Tough to compete with Double Tap though for the OITC value.
Level 16 Lethal Decoy (E)
Damage bonus from clones increased from 40 to 50%
So is this a 60% overall damage from Decoy talent? If so, that rocks. The sad, but totally understandable, part is that it competes with Explosive shot at 16. That might have been too strong. Worse is that it competes with Crippling Shot, which is my default pick.
Level 20 (New Talent) Apollo Suit (Trait)
Reduce the cooldown of Permanent Cloak from 3 to 1 second.
Competing with Rewind is almost impossible, but this is tempting. 1-second cloaks allow for faster escapes, chases, ability avoidance, and potential armor applications. I like it though.
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Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051 Steam ID Twitch Page
0
The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
How could the stealth reduction have been 3 seconds? Doesn't it take 3 seconds for stealth to resume normally?
How could the stealth reduction have been 3 seconds? Doesn't it take 3 seconds for stealth to resume normally?
I'm confused. Are you talking about her new level 13 or 20 talent?
The 13 talent gave her 25 armor for 3 seconds at Blizzcon. It seems to have been changed to 2 seconds now though. The 20 talent changes her stealth time from 3 seconds to 1 second.
Hope that clears it up a bit.
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Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051 Steam ID Twitch Page
0
The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
How could the stealth reduction have been 3 seconds? Doesn't it take 3 seconds for stealth to resume normally?
I'm confused. Are you talking about her new level 13 or 20 talent?
The 13 talent gave her 25 armor for 3 seconds at Blizzcon. It seems to have been changed to 2 seconds now though. The 20 talent changes her stealth time from 3 seconds to 1 second.
Hope that clears it up a bit.
Oooh, okay. Got thrown off because you said that right after mentioning the 20 talent.
He's always had a low pick-rate, but Samuro has had the highest win rate among all heroes in the game for many months. His value as a straight-up assassin is pretty limited, for sure, but that's not really the position he plays or the role he fills on a team. At lower MMR, Bladestorm is almost always his ultimate choice --even up into Diamond, Bladestorm is picked three times more often than Illusion Master-- but as soon as you hit the Master Leagues, these statistics are inverted, and Illusion Master sees twice the pick-rate that Bladestorm does. That's because a lot of his value lies in the fact that he can split-push and harass back-line heroes with almost complete impunity. You literally just can't lock him down without going completely out of your way, because he'll park an Illusion in bush or something, far away from the actual teamfight, and then he'll come at you with two other Illusions. He'll stay in as long as he can, but as soon as he's in trouble, he'll just swap back to the Illusion that's nowhere near the enemy team, and continue going about his business. Samuro's actually incredibly strong.
You gain additional hotkeys to help you macro his Illusions: one key to select Samuro, another key to select the first Illusion, another to select the second Illusion, and a final key to select all three.
You gain additional hotkeys to help you macro his Illusions: one key to select Samuro, another key to select the first Illusion, another to select the second Illusion, and a final key to select all three.
I think Smrt is asking how you choose which Illusion to swap with with IM's activatable (or new Samuro's trait). I assume at the least you can select the illusion and hit R(/D) and it'll swap you with it?
He's always had a low pick-rate, but Samuro has had the highest win rate among all heroes in the game for many months. His value as a straight-up assassin is pretty limited, for sure, but that's not really the position he plays or the role he fills on a team. At lower MMR, Bladestorm is almost always his ultimate choice --even up into Diamond, Bladestorm is picked three times more often than Illusion Master-- but as soon as you hit the Master Leagues, these statistics are inverted, and Illusion Master sees twice the pick-rate that Bladestorm does. That's because a lot of his value lies in the fact that he can split-push and harass back-line heroes with almost complete impunity. You literally just can't lock him down without going completely out of your way, because he'll park an Illusion in bush or something, far away from the actual teamfight, and then he'll come at you with two other Illusions. He'll stay in as long as he can, but as soon as he's in trouble, he'll just swap back to the Illusion that's nowhere near the enemy team, and continue going about his business. Samuro's actually incredibly strong.
You can (and should) even do a low-grade version of some of this without IM. Just exploit the illusion AI behaviour. One of the best things to do, if you don't need the illusions in the very near future, is to run into a lane, attack someone, drop your illusions and then just leave. Drop the kids off in the lane and go do something else. As long as the minion wave is not pushed right into the tower, your illusions will hang out pushing the lane for you and fucking with the enemy hero and those bastards last a long time and take a lot of damage to kill. Same thing in a quick harass. Drop the illusions, smack them a few times and walk away, forcing the enemy hero to clear the stupid things while they take free damage.
He's always had a low pick-rate, but Samuro has had the highest win rate among all heroes in the game for many months. His value as a straight-up assassin is pretty limited, for sure, but that's not really the position he plays or the role he fills on a team. At lower MMR, Bladestorm is almost always his ultimate choice --even up into Diamond, Bladestorm is picked three times more often than Illusion Master-- but as soon as you hit the Master Leagues, these statistics are inverted, and Illusion Master sees twice the pick-rate that Bladestorm does. That's because a lot of his value lies in the fact that he can split-push and harass back-line heroes with almost complete impunity. You literally just can't lock him down without going completely out of your way, because he'll park an Illusion in bush or something, far away from the actual teamfight, and then he'll come at you with two other Illusions. He'll stay in as long as he can, but as soon as he's in trouble, he'll just swap back to the Illusion that's nowhere near the enemy team, and continue going about his business. Samuro's actually incredibly strong.
You can (and should) even do a low-grade version of some of this without IM. Just exploit the illusion AI behaviour. One of the best things to do, if you don't need the illusions in the very near future, is to run into a lane, attack someone, drop your illusions and then just leave. Drop the kids off in the lane and go do something else. As long as the minion wave is not pushed right into the tower, your illusions will hang out pushing the lane for you and fucking with the enemy hero and those bastards last a long time and take a lot of damage to kill. Same thing in a quick harass. Drop the illusions, smack them a few times and walk away, forcing the enemy hero to clear the stupid things while they take free damage.
It's irritating as fuck to deal with.
I have played both a shitton OF and AGAINST Sammy, and I can confirm this is highly effective.
Playing against there's been times where his fucking clones literally RAN ME TO MY TOWER GATE ALL THE WAY ACROSS THE LANE because they kept on me and I couldn't kill them fast enough without taking a whole shitton of damage. Those dudes are really, really good at harassing. Maybe a bit less good post-patch, but we'll see.
The Clones are also just good for pushing though. If I don't need the cooldown anytime soon, I'll pop Q walk off to another lane and let my boys do their thing. Can they soak exp? I'm not actually sure! I think they can, right? But it's a good habit to get into either way, especially now that they won't insta-die to Towers anymore! With Burning Blade they're rather effective at just, clearing waves. And they have an extremely long duration!
Also, I know some people say "well all Sammy's good at is just jungling, he's only good for mercing!" BZZZT. Wrong!! I've played Samuro games where I was topping the damage charts. Samuro is an extremely good backline harasser. He's slippery and tricky and hard to kill. And your opponent has to correctly guess the 1-in-3 as to which Sammy is the real one. And that gives you a lot of time to just beef on fools. Also with Press the Attack, he will FUCKING SHRED TANKS. Dead serious. Go open up on that big asshole Stitches that just walked in to frontline and watch his goddamn health bar disappear.
And btw, Mirrored Steel -> Press the Attack is fucking ridiculously good, it's been my go-to for a while now. I think it's straight up better than Shukuchi -> Harsh Winds. Sammy is so utterly reliant on his Mimages that having the cooldown always be up is soooo so strong. It lets you open up with Mimages, then have the button again for when they die OR when you need to disjoint/self-cleanse. And then that massive attack speed buff will get you the cooldown up AGAIN.
I will definitely still try Sammy out when the patch drops... I'm hoping the buffs and new utility outweigh the... rather massive nerfs he recieved. We'll see.
Fuck, though. They really destroyed a lot of his talents by removing Mimage benefits. Ugh. Look Blizzo, if you don't want Illusion Master to be super strong, just make it so picking Illusion Master removes Mimage benefits from talents! Don't kneecap Bladestorm because you tossed too much power behind Illusion Master!!
SIGH.
(this is Kharazim/Iron Fists/W all over again :rotate:)
Edit: Yeah though looking over how I build Sammy... the biggest nerfs are Crit Strike cd 8->10, Way of the Blade no longer buffs Crit damage, and Press the Attack 60%->40%. Those three alone are huge enough nerfs to completely kneecap his damage. Mimages is actually kinda whatever anyway, since like I detailed in the post, you're only losing 10 damage compared to now (I'm sure the actual full cycle is slightly different considering Critical Strike, but). But it's not just losing 10 damage, you're also losing the benefits of two VERY strong talents! Like even just ignoring ALL the other talent nerfs, even if we JUST look at Way of the Blade/Press the Attack, that's enough to make his damage complete shit. Even with Illusion Master.
ALSO, I was reading over Nova's and Valeera's changes too.
I think my preliminary power rankings for the Stealth reworks is...
1. Zeratul
2. Valeera
3. Nova
4. Samuro
I've already talked Zeratul, he's fucking boss city.
So, Nova. Baseline Snipe Master seems good on paper... But that's before you math it out. Without any stacks, New Snipe will hit for 537 at level 20. Old Snipe hit for 653 at 20. New Snipe needs 5 stacks to surpass Old Snipe's damage. Any less and New Snipe deals less damage than Old Snipe. 5 stacks gives you 671 damage, 4 stacks gives you... 644. That's not even accounting for Old Snipe WITH Old Snipe Master.
So realistically, Nova... got nerfed kinda hard in that respect. BUT, she did gain 10% baseline Decoy damage, 15% stealth movespeed baseline, Ghost Protocol baseline, Triple Tap buff (yay? i guess?), an even stronger Lethal Decoy, and a Precision Barrage buff (level 20 talent). But Snipe got hit really, really hard. Also Pinning Shot got nerfed.
Valeera, though. I'm pretty excited about her changes. The one thing I needed to see was the range. What was the range?! They mentioned she had range on her openers, but we didn't know what it was til now. 5 range! That's great. That's very doable. For reference, standard range for a ranged Assassin is 5.5, and Valeera's old Death From Above range was 7. So range aside, she also got:
- 10%->20% movespeed while stealthed
- Baseline Blind on Cheap Shot, albeit coming with a nerf to the Stun duration. But let's be honest, that's a good thing, CS stun was busted af.
- 10 Armor Reduction on Ambush
- Garrote Silence increased by 0.5 seconds
- Blind (the level 13 talent) increases's Cheap Shot's Blind from 2 seconds to 4 seconds. Get absolutely fucking wasted AAers.
- Strangle (level 13 Garrote talent, spell power reduction) buffed from 25% to 40%. This... seems good now. It's... spikier. Got more oomph to it. Helps Valeera fufill her role better as a disabler. 25% wasn't noticeable, 40% seems very beefy. Also you can actually take it now that Garrote will be more inherently appealing.
- Rupture moved to 20 but MEGA buffed. Increases Garrote's damage by 100% IMMEDIATELY, up from 5% stacking to 30%. This is a VERY good level 20 talent, wowee.
So what nerfs did she eat?
- Cheap Shot stun nerfed from 1.25 to 0.75. But it comes with a 2s Blind now too, so that probably evens out?
- Subtlety nerfed from 10 energy per/sec to 8. Ouch.
- Slice and Dice??? It's not clear if they're changing the functionality or if it's additional. If they're removing the attack speed from hitting Evis, nerf. If it's in addition to that, buff. But the wording isn't clear. Even if it replaces the attackspeed, it might not be bad?
- Death From Above? I mean, technically, right? You no longer get 7 range on Ambush, so that's technically a nerf? And the replacement is, meh. I never ran Ambush build anyway though!
- Assassinate. Yeah, okay, this one is actually pretty big. Damage nerfed from 100% to 50%, moved from 7 to 16. But gains an additional 10 Armor Reduction for a total of 20. But, again, I never ran Ambush build anyway. I've always felt it was the inferior build. But a nerf's a nerf.
- Elusiveness moved to level 20... but now it gives you 140% total movespeed, soooo?? Maybe that cancels it out..
- Nightslayer removed. Blaghhh this one stings.
Realistically the big nerfs are to Cheap Shot (but the Blind is still really good, and it also lets you actually utilize Garrote), Ambush build (I think that's dead in the water now...), Subtlety, maybe Slice and Dice, and Nightslayer. Valeera got out pretty scot-free though, all things considered! A slew of very very nice buffs otherwise. The range on openers is siiiick.
Zera and Valeera will come out of this on top. Nova and Samuro, I'm not sure...
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
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The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
edited November 2017
Cheap Shot getting the blind will not even out for the stun loss at all. It's a 40% nerf in the stun, portion, that's huge! That's way less time of holding them still for your team to murderize, which was most of the appeal with Cheap Shot. I think most of the time Valeeras will either be assassinating tanks for the armor debuff or garroting everyone else. Maybe you Cheap Shot like, Illidan and Zul'jin.
Waffles or whateverPreviously known as, I shit you not, "Waffen"Registered Userregular
I think I finally figured out Zul Jin out. The game baits you into trying to do all of your damage via auto attacks. While ZJ does okay auto attack damage, a lot of his power comes through spells. Once I started playing him more cautiously, using his spell damage, I really started to excel with him. Having a much better time with ZJ now as a result.
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The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
I think I finally figured out Zul Jin out. The game baits you into trying to do all of your damage via auto attacks. While ZJ does okay auto attack damage, a lot of his power comes through spells. Once I started playing him more cautiously, using his spell damage, I really started to excel with him. Having a much better time with ZJ now as a result.
At least since his rework, yeah. Don't be fooled, he still does a lot of AA damage, but he does that without needing to build into it, and mage build has been considered overtuned for a while.
Cheap Shot getting the blind will not even out for the stun loss at all. It's a 40% nerf in the stun, portion, that's huge! That's way less time of holding them still for your team to murderize, which was most of the appeal with Cheap Shot. I think most of the time Valeeras will either be assassinating tanks for the armor debuff or garroting everyone else. Maybe you Cheap Shot like, Illidan and Zul'jin.
But that's okay though.
Before it was Cheap Shot like 90% of the time. You almost never used Garrote unless against a specific escape-y target (Medivh, Tass, etc). Ambush only used in Ambush build.
Now you will literally be using all three. In all parts of the game.
CS's stun will still be decent, but more specifically you're gonna use that vs AAers. Garrote is going to be the go-to opener, but not the only one. You'll use it a majority of the time, though. Ambush probably mostly for when you want to open up a Tank? Or when you're gonna be focusing a squishy? But... Ambush will probably be the least used one, I think.
This is literally the healthiest change they've made to Valeera since her inception. A 1.25 sec stun was oppressive, but more over it choked out usage of her other openers. This change opens up her opener usage.
And Garrote is now a 2.75 sec silence, that's fuckin' beefy. Yeah it's not a stun, but it really locks someone out of abilities for a long time.
Dibby on
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
+1
The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
Cheap Shot getting the blind will not even out for the stun loss at all. It's a 40% nerf in the stun, portion, that's huge! That's way less time of holding them still for your team to murderize, which was most of the appeal with Cheap Shot. I think most of the time Valeeras will either be assassinating tanks for the armor debuff or garroting everyone else. Maybe you Cheap Shot like, Illidan and Zul'jin.
But that's okay though.
Before it was Cheap Shot like 90% of the time. You almost never used Garrote unless against a specific escape-y target (Medivh, Tass, etc). Ambush only used in Ambush build.
Now you will literally be using all three. In all parts of the game.
CS's stun will still be decent, but more specifically you're gonna use that vs AAers. Garrote is going to be the go-to opener, but not the only one. You'll use it a majority of the time, though. Ambush probably mostly for when you want to open up a Tank? Or when you're gonna be focusing a squishy? But... Ambush will probably be the least used one, I think.
This is literally the healthiest change they've made to Valeera since her inception. A 1.25 sec stun was oppressive, but more over it choked out usage of her other openers. This change opens up her opener usage.
Oh yes, it's certainly a good change to give her variety in her playstyle! But when you said "even out" I thought that meant "cheap shot is of about the same power level" which is definitely not true.
Cheap Shot getting the blind will not even out for the stun loss at all. It's a 40% nerf in the stun, portion, that's huge! That's way less time of holding them still for your team to murderize, which was most of the appeal with Cheap Shot. I think most of the time Valeeras will either be assassinating tanks for the armor debuff or garroting everyone else. Maybe you Cheap Shot like, Illidan and Zul'jin.
But that's okay though.
Before it was Cheap Shot like 90% of the time. You almost never used Garrote unless against a specific escape-y target (Medivh, Tass, etc). Ambush only used in Ambush build.
Now you will literally be using all three. In all parts of the game.
CS's stun will still be decent, but more specifically you're gonna use that vs AAers. Garrote is going to be the go-to opener, but not the only one. You'll use it a majority of the time, though. Ambush probably mostly for when you want to open up a Tank? Or when you're gonna be focusing a squishy? But... Ambush will probably be the least used one, I think.
This is literally the healthiest change they've made to Valeera since her inception. A 1.25 sec stun was oppressive, but more over it choked out usage of her other openers. This change opens up her opener usage.
Oh yes, it's certainly a good change to give her variety in her playstyle! But when you said "even out" I thought that meant "cheap shot is of about the same power level" which is definitely not true.
No I meant "even out" in terms of "cc duration"
The power level is much lower now, yes. But CS now has 2.75 seconds of combined CC, and will still be extremely potent against AAers.
That goes up to 4.75 secs when you take the Blind talent.
It won't be the same as it was, it is undoubtedly a nerf, but it will have a place still.
Yeah, he just has a lot more options now. Like, I was always a fan of the old Wormhole Q build. Always. And I would argue that it was still a viable build, even before the rework. But the overwhelming majority of players favored the Seeker in the Dark / Rewind build. And I understand why; I mean, it definitely had a ton of burst. So I had to learn that. It was fun, and it was effective, but I always wanted to go Wormhole Q build. It plays a lot like Azmodunk, if you can believe that -- essentially, you're waiting on cooldowns to line up, then you jump in, deal a ton of burst, and jump back out again. That playstyle's definitely back, now, due in equal parts to some nerfs leveled at opposing builds, and because Follow Through is rolled into Might of the Nerazim, and that obviously competes with Void Prison, so you can't really have your cake and eat it too, anymore.
So new Zera can jump in, AA crit, then
if single target, Q W R E , or
if multi-target, W Q R E
bear in mind that the level 20 upgrade to Might of the Nerazim is essentially a Rewind, so you can E W Q R W Q E. Or you can get tricky on people by tossing your baseline Vorpal Blade into the mix, like E W Q walk away 1 R Q W E
Wow this is the first time I reported someone in HotS
I just said they were being a jerk with their abusive chat since I was the healer and kept getting taunted to my death so there was little I could do
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The Escape Goatincorrigible ruminantthey/themRegistered Userregular
Comprehensive list of Overwatch heroes that I give a shit about, and want translated into Hots:
Doomfist
I mean, if you want even more mobility creep and Diablo's level 13 talent on steroids, sure.
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Waffles or whateverPreviously known as, I shit you not, "Waffen"Registered Userregular
edited November 2017
SaintJustice and I had some good duos this evening. Played a few games. Most noticeable ones were double support comp that was kicking our butts on Sky Temple until about level 14. We wiped them out, took away their psychological factor, and then rolled them pretty disgustingly for the rest of the match. (Their Garrosh wasn't pulling people very well and their Cassia was overly aggressive/in front of Garrosh the entire time) Second game, we had another good one in Spider Tomb. Theeeeeeeeeeeen we play our final game game. Even match up until our Sgt. Hammer reveals that hes a troll. I think our medihv did more damage than he did at the end. Sad way to end the night.
Waffles or whatever on
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ArcticLancerBest served chilled.Registered Userregular
There's a 2nd support thing here I believe is relevant but nobody has talked about yet (that I saw): Too many supports don't have mana problems at this point. That actually extends to too much of the cast in general, but things like Lucio are infuriating because you either delete him right then and there or he's back with his team in 10 seconds at full health. The AOE healers should be more
Yeah Nova is getting nerfed super hard. I don't understand why they're reducing her damage - without the eye test cloak she's going to be less effective as a baseline. To be effective they'll either have to increase her range or her damage. Not to mention that snipe master is hot garbage unless they fixed it so that you're allowed to merc without losing your stacks. It's possible clone build will be decent now - I expect it to be the go-to. I'll be Nova-ing it up until they trashcan her!
Yeah Nova is getting nerfed super hard. I don't understand why they're reducing her damage - without the eye test cloak she's going to be less effective as a baseline. To be effective they'll either have to increase her range or her damage. Not to mention that snipe master is hot garbage unless they fixed it so that you're allowed to merc without losing your stacks. It's possible clone build will be decent now - I expect it to be the go-to. I'll be Nova-ing it up until they trashcan her!
For a while now you don't lose snipe stacks for not hitting heroes, only for whiffing completely.
+5
AuralynxDarkness is a perspectiveWatching the ego workRegistered Userregular
Honestly, Moira looks pretty fun as well so far as OW goes.
Posts
Yeah it's pretty awesome
In qm you get whatever, but in draft you get counterpicked if they notice you getting more than 1 beefy hp sponge.
How they should get rid of double support: release some heroes with mortal strike mechanics, in a way that makes it bad for your team if you have two healers and they have a mortal striker, but if you only have one healer it's not as bad. That way, in draft, there is pick and counterpick strategy.
For example: a debuff on healing you can apply on target enemy hero whose duration gets extended each time they get a heal from any source.
Or a heal debuff you apply to a source of heals (can target wells too, lets say) that grows stronger as a quest based on how many times you have applied it. Cannot apply to something that produces no heals or that already has the debuff.
The mechanics would have to be pretty creative, I don't know what the solution is either, it's a hard problem.
re: winter veil skins, the valla one is really good, will probably get that. I am disappointed because the rumors said there was going to be a li li skin and I really want Li Li with a staff that has christmas lights wrapped around it now.
edit:
winter veil scarier than halloween confirmed.
Careful, Daisy's a bit particular in her hero pool. The early days of Daisy and Abigail teamwork were rough...
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
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My thoughts on her changes:
Snipe (Q):
Baseline Snipe damage reduced from 310 to 255, with the quest being built in. 5% damage bonus to a max of 25%.
Doing the math, that means you'd need 4 snipe stacks to be just under her old baseline damage (310 vs 306 at 4 stacks). 5 stacks brings her to 317 damage, a hair over what it used to be.
Overall, it's a pretty big nerf, but removes the stress of taking Snipe Master and missing. Rewards higher skill players with better accuracy though. I'm lukewarm on this, but happy to see it being experimented with. Numbers can always be tweaked.
Pinning Shot (W)
Damage from 110 to 105. No big deal here.
Holo Decoy (E)
Added functionality: Decoys now deal 10% of Nova’s damage.
Oh, I love this! Decoy doing 0 damage made it pretty useless for engaging or misdirecting. If your opponent see their health bar drop even a little, they might snap attack the decoy instead. I think the damage will be enough that people will adapt quickly though. Still a nice touch.
Permanent Cloak (Trait)
Added functionality: Gain 15% movement speed while Stealthed
Love this too! Advanced Cloaking has been my go-to pick at 1 for a while now. With the Talent only adding another 5% movement speed, I might look into one of her other talents at tier 1.
Triple Tap (R)
Damage per shot increased from 338 to 372
Cool, but still probably not enough to make me switch over from Orbital Strike. I'll try it out though.
(New) Ghost Protocol (1)
Activate to instantly cloak, leave a Holo Decoy at your feet, and become unrevealable for .5 seconds.
They added a Decoy with the insta-cloak? Yes please! Combine this with your E to have 3 potential targets to make your enemy choose from. Or 20% extra damage output for squeezing out a kill.
Talents
Level 1
Advanced Cloaking (Trait)
New functionality:
Increase your Stealth movement speed by 5%. While Stealthed, gain 2 additional mana regeneration per second.
I used to take this primarily for the speed buff (25% while cloaked), so the nerf down to 20% with this might not change anything. Plus never having to worry about mana is nice. I'll experiment with the other level 1 talents, but probably default to this one still.
Level 7
Perfect Shot (Q)
Moved from Level 16
Cooldown reduction on Hero hit reduced from 3 to 2 seconds
Hard to compete with One In The Chamber. I'll try a pure Snipe build and see if my aim can keep up. 4 second Snipes sound cool, but ultimately probably not that useful since you'll really only get 2 Snipes in realistically.
Level 13
Psionic Efficiency (Q)
Bonus range increased from 10 to 15%
Has this even changed? I still think this could get pushed out to 20% or 25% more range. Even if it means getting rid of the mana removal part.
(New Talent) Ionic Force Field (Trait)
Gain 25 Armor for 2 seconds after losing stealth
This sounds super solid, especially when combined with her new level 20. It was 3 seconds at Blizzcon, so a slight nerf here. Great against dive heavy comps or if you want to position more aggressively. Tough to compete with Double Tap though for the OITC value.
Level 16
Lethal Decoy (E)
Damage bonus from clones increased from 40 to 50%
So is this a 60% overall damage from Decoy talent? If so, that rocks. The sad, but totally understandable, part is that it competes with Explosive shot at 16. That might have been too strong. Worse is that it competes with Crippling Shot, which is my default pick.
Level 20
(New Talent) Apollo Suit (Trait)
Reduce the cooldown of Permanent Cloak from 3 to 1 second.
Competing with Rewind is almost impossible, but this is tempting. 1-second cloaks allow for faster escapes, chases, ability avoidance, and potential armor applications. I like it though.
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
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I'm confused. Are you talking about her new level 13 or 20 talent?
The 13 talent gave her 25 armor for 3 seconds at Blizzcon. It seems to have been changed to 2 seconds now though. The 20 talent changes her stealth time from 3 seconds to 1 second.
Hope that clears it up a bit.
Legends of Runeterra: MNCdover #moc
Switch ID: MNC Dover SW-1154-3107-1051
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Oooh, okay. Got thrown off because you said that right after mentioning the 20 talent.
He's always had a low pick-rate, but Samuro has had the highest win rate among all heroes in the game for many months. His value as a straight-up assassin is pretty limited, for sure, but that's not really the position he plays or the role he fills on a team. At lower MMR, Bladestorm is almost always his ultimate choice --even up into Diamond, Bladestorm is picked three times more often than Illusion Master-- but as soon as you hit the Master Leagues, these statistics are inverted, and Illusion Master sees twice the pick-rate that Bladestorm does. That's because a lot of his value lies in the fact that he can split-push and harass back-line heroes with almost complete impunity. You literally just can't lock him down without going completely out of your way, because he'll park an Illusion in bush or something, far away from the actual teamfight, and then he'll come at you with two other Illusions. He'll stay in as long as he can, but as soon as he's in trouble, he'll just swap back to the Illusion that's nowhere near the enemy team, and continue going about his business. Samuro's actually incredibly strong.
I think Smrt is asking how you choose which Illusion to swap with with IM's activatable (or new Samuro's trait). I assume at the least you can select the illusion and hit R(/D) and it'll swap you with it?
You can (and should) even do a low-grade version of some of this without IM. Just exploit the illusion AI behaviour. One of the best things to do, if you don't need the illusions in the very near future, is to run into a lane, attack someone, drop your illusions and then just leave. Drop the kids off in the lane and go do something else. As long as the minion wave is not pushed right into the tower, your illusions will hang out pushing the lane for you and fucking with the enemy hero and those bastards last a long time and take a lot of damage to kill. Same thing in a quick harass. Drop the illusions, smack them a few times and walk away, forcing the enemy hero to clear the stupid things while they take free damage.
It's irritating as fuck to deal with.
I have played both a shitton OF and AGAINST Sammy, and I can confirm this is highly effective.
Playing against there's been times where his fucking clones literally RAN ME TO MY TOWER GATE ALL THE WAY ACROSS THE LANE because they kept on me and I couldn't kill them fast enough without taking a whole shitton of damage. Those dudes are really, really good at harassing. Maybe a bit less good post-patch, but we'll see.
The Clones are also just good for pushing though. If I don't need the cooldown anytime soon, I'll pop Q walk off to another lane and let my boys do their thing. Can they soak exp? I'm not actually sure! I think they can, right? But it's a good habit to get into either way, especially now that they won't insta-die to Towers anymore! With Burning Blade they're rather effective at just, clearing waves. And they have an extremely long duration!
Also, I know some people say "well all Sammy's good at is just jungling, he's only good for mercing!" BZZZT. Wrong!! I've played Samuro games where I was topping the damage charts. Samuro is an extremely good backline harasser. He's slippery and tricky and hard to kill. And your opponent has to correctly guess the 1-in-3 as to which Sammy is the real one. And that gives you a lot of time to just beef on fools. Also with Press the Attack, he will FUCKING SHRED TANKS. Dead serious. Go open up on that big asshole Stitches that just walked in to frontline and watch his goddamn health bar disappear.
And btw, Mirrored Steel -> Press the Attack is fucking ridiculously good, it's been my go-to for a while now. I think it's straight up better than Shukuchi -> Harsh Winds. Sammy is so utterly reliant on his Mimages that having the cooldown always be up is soooo so strong. It lets you open up with Mimages, then have the button again for when they die OR when you need to disjoint/self-cleanse. And then that massive attack speed buff will get you the cooldown up AGAIN.
I will definitely still try Sammy out when the patch drops... I'm hoping the buffs and new utility outweigh the... rather massive nerfs he recieved. We'll see.
Fuck, though. They really destroyed a lot of his talents by removing Mimage benefits. Ugh. Look Blizzo, if you don't want Illusion Master to be super strong, just make it so picking Illusion Master removes Mimage benefits from talents! Don't kneecap Bladestorm because you tossed too much power behind Illusion Master!!
SIGH.
(this is Kharazim/Iron Fists/W all over again :rotate:)
Edit: Yeah though looking over how I build Sammy... the biggest nerfs are Crit Strike cd 8->10, Way of the Blade no longer buffs Crit damage, and Press the Attack 60%->40%. Those three alone are huge enough nerfs to completely kneecap his damage. Mimages is actually kinda whatever anyway, since like I detailed in the post, you're only losing 10 damage compared to now (I'm sure the actual full cycle is slightly different considering Critical Strike, but). But it's not just losing 10 damage, you're also losing the benefits of two VERY strong talents! Like even just ignoring ALL the other talent nerfs, even if we JUST look at Way of the Blade/Press the Attack, that's enough to make his damage complete shit. Even with Illusion Master.
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
I think my preliminary power rankings for the Stealth reworks is...
1. Zeratul
2. Valeera
3. Nova
4. Samuro
I've already talked Zeratul, he's fucking boss city.
So, Nova. Baseline Snipe Master seems good on paper... But that's before you math it out. Without any stacks, New Snipe will hit for 537 at level 20. Old Snipe hit for 653 at 20. New Snipe needs 5 stacks to surpass Old Snipe's damage. Any less and New Snipe deals less damage than Old Snipe. 5 stacks gives you 671 damage, 4 stacks gives you... 644. That's not even accounting for Old Snipe WITH Old Snipe Master.
So realistically, Nova... got nerfed kinda hard in that respect. BUT, she did gain 10% baseline Decoy damage, 15% stealth movespeed baseline, Ghost Protocol baseline, Triple Tap buff (yay? i guess?), an even stronger Lethal Decoy, and a Precision Barrage buff (level 20 talent). But Snipe got hit really, really hard. Also Pinning Shot got nerfed.
Valeera, though. I'm pretty excited about her changes. The one thing I needed to see was the range. What was the range?! They mentioned she had range on her openers, but we didn't know what it was til now. 5 range! That's great. That's very doable. For reference, standard range for a ranged Assassin is 5.5, and Valeera's old Death From Above range was 7. So range aside, she also got:
- 10%->20% movespeed while stealthed
- Baseline Blind on Cheap Shot, albeit coming with a nerf to the Stun duration. But let's be honest, that's a good thing, CS stun was busted af.
- 10 Armor Reduction on Ambush
- Garrote Silence increased by 0.5 seconds
- Blind (the level 13 talent) increases's Cheap Shot's Blind from 2 seconds to 4 seconds. Get absolutely fucking wasted AAers.
- Strangle (level 13 Garrote talent, spell power reduction) buffed from 25% to 40%. This... seems good now. It's... spikier. Got more oomph to it. Helps Valeera fufill her role better as a disabler. 25% wasn't noticeable, 40% seems very beefy. Also you can actually take it now that Garrote will be more inherently appealing.
- Rupture moved to 20 but MEGA buffed. Increases Garrote's damage by 100% IMMEDIATELY, up from 5% stacking to 30%. This is a VERY good level 20 talent, wowee.
So what nerfs did she eat?
- Cheap Shot stun nerfed from 1.25 to 0.75. But it comes with a 2s Blind now too, so that probably evens out?
- Subtlety nerfed from 10 energy per/sec to 8. Ouch.
- Slice and Dice??? It's not clear if they're changing the functionality or if it's additional. If they're removing the attack speed from hitting Evis, nerf. If it's in addition to that, buff. But the wording isn't clear. Even if it replaces the attackspeed, it might not be bad?
- Death From Above? I mean, technically, right? You no longer get 7 range on Ambush, so that's technically a nerf? And the replacement is, meh. I never ran Ambush build anyway though!
- Assassinate. Yeah, okay, this one is actually pretty big. Damage nerfed from 100% to 50%, moved from 7 to 16. But gains an additional 10 Armor Reduction for a total of 20. But, again, I never ran Ambush build anyway. I've always felt it was the inferior build. But a nerf's a nerf.
- Elusiveness moved to level 20... but now it gives you 140% total movespeed, soooo?? Maybe that cancels it out..
- Nightslayer removed. Blaghhh this one stings.
Realistically the big nerfs are to Cheap Shot (but the Blind is still really good, and it also lets you actually utilize Garrote), Ambush build (I think that's dead in the water now...), Subtlety, maybe Slice and Dice, and Nightslayer. Valeera got out pretty scot-free though, all things considered! A slew of very very nice buffs otherwise. The range on openers is siiiick.
Zera and Valeera will come out of this on top. Nova and Samuro, I'm not sure...
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
Time to practice Zeratul again, rawr!
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At least since his rework, yeah. Don't be fooled, he still does a lot of AA damage, but he does that without needing to build into it, and mage build has been considered overtuned for a while.
But that's okay though.
Before it was Cheap Shot like 90% of the time. You almost never used Garrote unless against a specific escape-y target (Medivh, Tass, etc). Ambush only used in Ambush build.
Now you will literally be using all three. In all parts of the game.
CS's stun will still be decent, but more specifically you're gonna use that vs AAers. Garrote is going to be the go-to opener, but not the only one. You'll use it a majority of the time, though. Ambush probably mostly for when you want to open up a Tank? Or when you're gonna be focusing a squishy? But... Ambush will probably be the least used one, I think.
This is literally the healthiest change they've made to Valeera since her inception. A 1.25 sec stun was oppressive, but more over it choked out usage of her other openers. This change opens up her opener usage.
And Garrote is now a 2.75 sec silence, that's fuckin' beefy. Yeah it's not a stun, but it really locks someone out of abilities for a long time.
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
Oh yes, it's certainly a good change to give her variety in her playstyle! But when you said "even out" I thought that meant "cheap shot is of about the same power level" which is definitely not true.
No I meant "even out" in terms of "cc duration"
The power level is much lower now, yes. But CS now has 2.75 seconds of combined CC, and will still be extremely potent against AAers.
That goes up to 4.75 secs when you take the Blind talent.
It won't be the same as it was, it is undoubtedly a nerf, but it will have a place still.
Battle.net Tag: Dibby#1582
Yeah, he just has a lot more options now. Like, I was always a fan of the old Wormhole Q build. Always. And I would argue that it was still a viable build, even before the rework. But the overwhelming majority of players favored the Seeker in the Dark / Rewind build. And I understand why; I mean, it definitely had a ton of burst. So I had to learn that. It was fun, and it was effective, but I always wanted to go Wormhole Q build. It plays a lot like Azmodunk, if you can believe that -- essentially, you're waiting on cooldowns to line up, then you jump in, deal a ton of burst, and jump back out again. That playstyle's definitely back, now, due in equal parts to some nerfs leveled at opposing builds, and because Follow Through is rolled into Might of the Nerazim, and that obviously competes with Void Prison, so you can't really have your cake and eat it too, anymore.
So new Zera can jump in, AA crit, then
if single target, Q W R E , or
if multi-target, W Q R E
bear in mind that the level 20 upgrade to Might of the Nerazim is essentially a Rewind, so you can E W Q R W Q E. Or you can get tricky on people by tossing your baseline Vorpal Blade into the mix, like E W Q walk away 1 R Q W E
Doomfist
I just said they were being a jerk with their abusive chat since I was the healer and kept getting taunted to my death so there was little I could do
I mean, if you want even more mobility creep and Diablo's level 13 talent on steroids, sure.
That isn't how you spell Reinhardt.
Perhaps I can interest you in my meager selection of pins?
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Good call.
For a while now you don't lose snipe stacks for not hitting heroes, only for whiffing completely.
Not sure, at BlizzCon they mentioned the gameplay changes having an extensive PTR duration, maybe like 3 weeks?
I hate how they keep reusing names between the different games, this being an example. Now we can't ever get both WoW Moira and OW Moira.