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[Total War]: 3 Kingdoms loom whilst pirate vampires raid coasts.

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Posts

  • GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    I am playing the Dreadfleet and have two supporting Black Arcs both of which have the sack value additional.

    44,000 gold for sacking a rank 5 settlement.

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  • The BraysterThe Brayster UKRegistered User regular
    Continuing the Wei trend this week:

    Sima Yi
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    Blessed with great intelligence from a young age, Sima Yi is one of China’s greatest strategists. Loyal only to himself, he schemes and plots to outwit the notorious Zhuge Liang and pave the way for his own family to usurp the throne and establish a new dynasty.

    Xu Huang
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    A model of integrity, Xu Huang is both a great warrior and an astute general, having defeated numerous legendary generals in his time under Cao Cao. Extremely respectful, Xu Huang never fails to be courteous to friends and enemies alike.

    So with Xiahou Dun, Xiahou Yuan, Xu Chu, Dian Wei, Yue Jin, Xu Huang and Sima Yi confirmed thus far, Cao Cao is looking pretty tasty.

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  • KruiteKruite Registered User regular
    edited January 9
    Damnit Brayster

    Kruite on
    The Brayster
  • The BraysterThe Brayster UKRegistered User regular
    Kruite wrote: »
    Damnit Brayster

    I'm watching the Total War Twitter like a goddamned hawk until the day this game releases!

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  • SpectrumSpectrum Super High-School Level ??? Hope's Peak AcademyRegistered User regular
    DwjkHgeWwAAo2Py.jpg
    The youngest son of Liu Yan, Liu Zhang ruled over the Yi Province. While he maintained peace in his realm, some viewed him to be a foolish and incapable ruler. He is easily taken in by tricks and deception, and will choose the wellbeing of his subjects over his own ambition.
    Obligatory: RIP this guy

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  • The BraysterThe Brayster UKRegistered User regular
    I mean, this is the guy who had his very valuable, vast land usurped by a peasant-turned-warlord with a terrible track record in regards to war and actually holding land - who also blatantly turned hostile seemingly unprovoked on his own kin for the sake of power*.

    Then, to top it all off, everyone who had served him near immediately exclaimed 'Yeah, we uh, we prefer the new guy*'.

    So yeah, RIP.




    * This is Liu Bei, in case anyone didn't know. There is a bit more to this story but... yeah.

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  • KruiteKruite Registered User regular
    I mean, this is the guy who had his very valuable, vast land usurped by a peasant-turned-warlord with a terrible track record in regards to war and actually holding land - who also blatantly turned hostile seemingly unprovoked on his own kin for the sake of power*.

    Then, to top it all off, everyone who had served him near immediately exclaimed 'Yeah, we uh, we prefer the new guy*'.

    So yeah, RIP.




    * This is Liu Bei, in case anyone didn't know. There is a bit more to this story but... yeah.

    SO Liu Bei players should beeline straight across china to usurp this guy's territory?

  • The BraysterThe Brayster UKRegistered User regular
    Kruite wrote: »
    I mean, this is the guy who had his very valuable, vast land usurped by a peasant-turned-warlord with a terrible track record in regards to war and actually holding land - who also blatantly turned hostile seemingly unprovoked on his own kin for the sake of power*.

    Then, to top it all off, everyone who had served him near immediately exclaimed 'Yeah, we uh, we prefer the new guy*'.

    So yeah, RIP.




    * This is Liu Bei, in case anyone didn't know. There is a bit more to this story but... yeah.

    SO Liu Bei players should beeline straight across china to usurp this guy's territory?

    After a brief pit stop in Liu Biao's lands, absolutely. If you want the correct 3 Kingdoms in your game this would be the optimal (and most historically accurate) way to play.

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  • SpectrumSpectrum Super High-School Level ??? Hope's Peak AcademyRegistered User regular
    Sort of. You want to hang around in the north long enough to steal Zhao Yun, then you want to setup shop in Jing Province first to piss Wu off in the future.

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  • KruiteKruite Registered User regular
    I really want to know more about the mechanics of how you will be recruiting officers/generals, and spying in general. they've mentioned it a little bit but it's still a huge "?"

  • The BraysterThe Brayster UKRegistered User regular
    Spectrum wrote: »
    Sort of. You want to hang around in the north long enough to steal Zhao Yun, then you want to setup shop in Jing Province first to piss Wu off in the future.

    You know in other Total War titles when you have a vassal that sits back and lets you do the heavy lifting, then rushes in and takes the now undefended settlement from under you? Be that vassal.

    Kruite wrote: »
    I really want to know more about the mechanics of how you will be recruiting officers/generals, and spying in general. they've mentioned it a little bit but it's still a huge "?"

    I believe the best source of information on this was in a rally point episode. As you say, there's still a lot we don't know, but the gist of it seems to be:
    • Every character has specific traits that appeal to them, and others that repel them. They will, naturally, only be available in the 'free' pool for those they respect.
    • While all the lords start with a sort of pre-set 'personality', the players behaviour will change this. Your officers, as well as those that are 'free' or serving other lords, will respond in kind.
    • These relationships exist not only between officer and lord, but also between officers. Some will form strong bonds, others will grate on one another, to the point where one may just leave your service.
    • Bonds created between officers persist across borders. If you make an offer for an officer in the 'free' pool to join you, they may request to bring a friend. Conversely, if you recruit an officer with a hostile rival, said rival will likely refuse any offers you make and join a lord opposed to you.

    This also links into the spying. The traditional agents as we know of them are gone, with officers under your command filling their roles. The example given is that you can have an officer infiltrate enemy ranks by 'defecting' alongside another officer they are friendly with who genuinely does want to defect. In the short term, you can order your officer to be disruptive, but the longer you leave them there, the greater the risk vs reward becomes. An officer left with the enemy for a long time may form a bond and decide to stay for real OR they can effectively end the other faction. They gave two examples of this:
    1. An officer left for a long time to form bonds could potentially instigate a civil war scenario.
    2. An officer left for a VERY LONG TIME could earn the faction leaders trust enough to be named heir. If they manage to become Lord unopposed they will hand over the whole territory to you (this was cited as being VERY long term planning, as in, most of the game).

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  • BigityBigity Lubbock, TXRegistered User regular
    Wouldn't that be a hell of a way to close out a game.

    I picture the scene from the Black Company books where Croaker and Blade are hooting and hee hawing in the middle of a battlefield cause Blade just defected after years of subterfuge with the enemies best troops.

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    Elvenshae
  • SpectrumSpectrum Super High-School Level ??? Hope's Peak AcademyRegistered User regular
    AI Officer Diao Chan is gonna kick things off in a big way not too long into the campaign.

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  • The BraysterThe Brayster UKRegistered User regular
    edited January 11
    New trailer time!



    Narration from the perspective of Zhuge Liang, showing off some campaign map landscape and some in-field scenery.

    Also Pandas! Who I will protect with my life!

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  • IblisIblis Registered User regular
    Built a new rig! Oh my god, having an SSD saves me so much goddamn time! And having a much more powerful PC makes the game so much prettier, and makes turn times much faster, so that's quite nice. Decided to start a new Noctilus campaign and go full on pirate. Had planned to do it when they will presumably add Merwyrms, but that's looking fairly far off since they've said they aren't releasing any content aside from the patch until Three Kingdoms drops. It's been going pretty well, with a few minor irritations. One of which is that Amanar keeps fucking wrecking Lothern! Which is hilarious mind, but preventing Tyrion from building up is really hurting my bottom line. The other irritation is that Arkhan, despite good relations, decided to just declare war on me anyway. Which isn't a huge deal, but it's made it harder for me to set up a second army since he keeps sending boatloads of skeletons to harass them once they leave the Galleon's Graveyard, especially since I can't build them up too much since Lothern keeps suffering periodic kaiju attacks.

    So one unforeseen benefit of my upgrade seems to be that my gun lines have a much easier time hitting with larger unit sizes and wrack up a lot more comparative kills. I assume because it's easier to get sight lines a gigantic unwieldy mass of units? It also makes it easier to use offensive magic, with one of my favorite instances being when two squads of silver helms charged Noctilus. So due to the larger size I was still able to hit them with Pit of Shades at that range and I comboed it with Wraith Storm to instantly break both of them.

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  • GoumindongGoumindong Registered User regular
    Its actually that

    1) higher unit depth makes guns significantly more accurate. If they miss something on the first line they're likely to hit something on the second line

    2) ranged units in general scale up on larger unit sizes because they can all fire regardless of the width of the unit. Whereas melee units are width limited. As unit sizes go up depth tends to go up more than width.

    3) on top of that; charge bonuses do not scale up on larger unit sizes so units that meet in melee have more relative HP left to kill after the initial clash.

    Its usually harder to get line of sight in order to deal damage but once you do youre operating at peak efficiency for the remainder of the fight.

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  • FiendishrabbitFiendishrabbit Registered User regular
    Primarily Vampire Coast, Dwarfs, Empire and High Elves gain a lot from increasing unit sizes since it allows them to block more terrain and their ranged units (artillery in particular) hit harder.

    Orcs are the big losers since they get less space to swarm the enemy and their charge bonus matters less. On the other hand Orcs are supposedly pretty strong in multiplayer (and in campaign they're still able to rush&crush).
    Most other melee factions can compensate to some degree. Beastmen, Norsca and Vampire counts for example have a very strong roster of monstrous units (with small units and more mass to smash into enemy formations) and Vampire counts has a really strong flying contingent so they don't really care about battle width to the same degree.

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  • -Loki--Loki- Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining. Registered User regular
    I said it before, they really should be listing an SSD as a recommended spec.

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  • IblisIblis Registered User regular
    Goumindong wrote: »
    Its actually that

    1) higher unit depth makes guns significantly more accurate. If they miss something on the first line they're likely to hit something on the second line

    2) ranged units in general scale up on larger unit sizes because they can all fire regardless of the width of the unit. Whereas melee units are width limited. As unit sizes go up depth tends to go up more than width.

    3) on top of that; charge bonuses do not scale up on larger unit sizes so units that meet in melee have more relative HP left to kill after the initial clash.

    Its usually harder to get line of sight in order to deal damage but once you do youre operating at peak efficiency for the remainder of the fight.

    Ah, makes sense. Also explains some of the problems I had been having with Vampire Coast previously. Felt like I could never get their gun lines to work as well as I saw them working for other people.

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  • BloodySlothBloodySloth Registered User regular
    So my wife got me Warhammer 2 for me as a late christmas present, and some 30 hours(!) of game time later, I beat my first Vortex campaign! The Skaven are hilarious and fun, but shit, that campaign was incredibly stressful near the end. I ended up having to mush two armies together to get Queek a fighting force for the Final Battle (which I didn't even see coming), and a mere 48 individual ratmen walked away from it with victory and their lives. My level 30-something assassin, a barely-alive Abomination, and 46 skavenslaves which I had apparently forgotten about in a corner of the map until I was scanning everywhere for anybody I could mob up in the middle of the field.

    Cutting it pretty close! But yeah, neat game. I find the Vortex ritual stuff a serious pain, though, and something feels very artificial about the way you get mobbed with magic armies from nowhere. I might try a Mortal Empires campaign to dink around in next time, though I'm a bit nervous for the load times.

    Elvenshae
  • stopgapstopgap Registered User regular
    Load times are fine, the turn times though...

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  • BloodySlothBloodySloth Registered User regular
    stopgap wrote: »
    Load times are fine, the turn times though...

    Yeah, sorry, I guess that's what I meant. My laptop is on the lower end as it is, and I definitely don't have an SSD. On the other hand, pitting together all the factions is appealing idea to me, and not having to deal with Vortex rituals is even more appealing, having now been through the wringer myself.

  • SpectrumSpectrum Super High-School Level ??? Hope's Peak AcademyRegistered User regular
    Primarily Vampire Coast, Dwarfs, Empire and High Elves gain a lot from increasing unit sizes since it allows them to block more terrain and their ranged units (artillery in particular) hit harder.

    Orcs are the big losers since they get less space to swarm the enemy and their charge bonus matters less. On the other hand Orcs are supposedly pretty strong in multiplayer (and in campaign they're still able to rush&crush).
    Most other melee factions can compensate to some degree. Beastmen, Norsca and Vampire counts for example have a very strong roster of monstrous units (with small units and more mass to smash into enemy formations) and Vampire counts has a really strong flying contingent so they don't really care about battle width to the same degree.
    Skaven do pretty well also. They just get to sit and clog up more of the battlefield with the same amount of trash while their artillery keeps hammering in the back.

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  • -Loki--Loki- Don't pee in my mouth and tell me it's raining. Registered User regular
    stopgap wrote: »
    Load times are fine, the turn times though...

    Yeah, sorry, I guess that's what I meant. My laptop is on the lower end as it is, and I definitely don't have an SSD. On the other hand, pitting together all the factions is appealing idea to me, and not having to deal with Vortex rituals is even more appealing, having now been through the wringer myself.

    Having an SSD doesn't help the turn times, only the load times. Turn times are all CPU load. Mortal Empires is pretty batshit long. My PC does TWWH 1 and 2 turns at about 20 seconds. Mortal Empire turn times are nearly 1 minute.

  • FiendishrabbitFiendishrabbit Registered User regular
    Spectrum wrote: »
    Primarily Vampire Coast, Dwarfs, Empire and High Elves gain a lot from increasing unit sizes since it allows them to block more terrain and their ranged units (artillery in particular) hit harder.

    Orcs are the big losers since they get less space to swarm the enemy and their charge bonus matters less. On the other hand Orcs are supposedly pretty strong in multiplayer (and in campaign they're still able to rush&crush).
    Most other melee factions can compensate to some degree. Beastmen, Norsca and Vampire counts for example have a very strong roster of monstrous units (with small units and more mass to smash into enemy formations) and Vampire counts has a really strong flying contingent so they don't really care about battle width to the same degree.
    Skaven do pretty well also. They just get to sit and clog up more of the battlefield with the same amount of trash while their artillery keeps hammering in the back.

    Skaven don't gain as much as the previously mentioned factions imho since their artillery is really accurate, their infantry are really good at clogging up the battlefield anyway, it's sort of detrimental to their deathrunners and rat ogres (since rat ogres are pretty fragile and need to break their opponents fast) and they don't have good massed firepower regiments (gutterrunners are more skirmish regiments that need space).
    The only units that really benefit are plagueclaw catapults (but not as much as dwarf, empire and VC artillery) and globadiers. Once they get more skryre units they'll probably benefit more. Their best spells are also pretty accurate, so Warp Lightning or pestilent breath don't get as much out of it as flaming skulls and some of the other more erratic magic spells.

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  • SpectrumSpectrum Super High-School Level ??? Hope's Peak AcademyRegistered User regular
    Closing in on the very end of my Vortex Queek campaign finally. Have 2/3rd of the SE continent, left the rest to Khemri since they were cool and still willing to trade anyway and desert is annoying to deal with. Very large resource lead, hit the final Ritual mark for the first time ever.

    I had my armies somewhat dispersed to try and outguess the Ritual spawns while still having an army or two at each Ritual site proper.

    Of course, naturally they drop all 5 armies literally right on top of a minor settlement in the middle of the continent, right where I had one army hanging out. Unfortunately, they were all clustered up together so I didn't want to try and attack into that.

    Come their turn, HE and DE trigger Intervention as well but well lol @ intervention armies. The HE started a siege on the capital while the DE one attacked the defense army I had sitting outside. Unfortunately for them, the map they gave me had a single choke point and DE Intervention armies have no artillery, so...

    One ritual enemy marches up next to my outside the Wall defender (who was in Ambush but of course was detected), then a second attacked and succeeded their Ambush against me. This also disables the Settlement from reinforcing, so I'm defending 1v2 in an Ambush.

    h82ozYl.jpg

    Nooooo problem. I might start in range of them, but they start in range of me. Plague Priest floods the battle with summons to preserve my real troops and my artillery decimated their troops before their reinforcing army could even make it in, making things very simple. Hilariously, this battle also triggered The Stuff of Legend achievement (win when outnumbered 10-1) for some reason.

    And then, because they aren't done, the AI thought that I had been softened up sufficiently to send their 3rd army to siege the settlement, marched the 4th and 5th armies up, and then started the settlement battle. Bog standard minor settlement garrison defending 2v3.

    I checked my deployment and noticed that my real army was actually coming in as reinforcements because they deployed outside. That meant that I needed to hold the walls for the first stage to give them time to deploy in, then I could fall back off the walls. Skaven towers aren't anything special and there's no reason to stay on the walls with inferior infantry.

    I forward deployed the garrison catapult to shoot their Catapult, then had a unit of Gutter Runners outside the walls to run around and be annoying and stall.

    As my real forces, still injured from the previous battle, made it in, I moved them into a guard position around the inner choke points surrounding the cap, then waited for my artillery. Once they finally trickled in, I pulled what was left of my garrison forces back from the walls and settled in.

    NTiWzvz.jpg

    On both battles, all star generic Warlord Toxide dueled out each of their Grey Seers and I was able to abuse the fact that the AI cannot guard their artillery for anything and has no defense for the Summoned Clan Rat->Suicide Warpstone combo.

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  • KarozKaroz Uguu~ Registered User regular
    -Loki- wrote: »
    stopgap wrote: »
    Load times are fine, the turn times though...

    Yeah, sorry, I guess that's what I meant. My laptop is on the lower end as it is, and I definitely don't have an SSD. On the other hand, pitting together all the factions is appealing idea to me, and not having to deal with Vortex rituals is even more appealing, having now been through the wringer myself.

    Having an SSD doesn't help the turn times, only the load times. Turn times are all CPU load. Mortal Empires is pretty batshit long. My PC does TWWH 1 and 2 turns at about 20 seconds. Mortal Empire turn times are nearly 1 minute.

    There are mods for that.

    FiatilBloodySlothArdol
  • BloodySlothBloodySloth Registered User regular
    Karoz wrote: »
    -Loki- wrote: »
    stopgap wrote: »
    Load times are fine, the turn times though...

    Yeah, sorry, I guess that's what I meant. My laptop is on the lower end as it is, and I definitely don't have an SSD. On the other hand, pitting together all the factions is appealing idea to me, and not having to deal with Vortex rituals is even more appealing, having now been through the wringer myself.

    Having an SSD doesn't help the turn times, only the load times. Turn times are all CPU load. Mortal Empires is pretty batshit long. My PC does TWWH 1 and 2 turns at about 20 seconds. Mortal Empire turn times are nearly 1 minute.

    There are mods for that.

    Wwwwwwelp, now I know my next campaign. Maybe it's a bit of a compromise, but it sounds like a great compromise.

  • PeasPeas Registered User regular
    o total war china is out? Sweet

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    Not for two months

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  • FiendishrabbitFiendishrabbit Registered User regular
    edited January 14
    I never realised how powerful Luthor Harkon is in the campaign. Right now he's mounted on his terrorgheist, has almost 700 weapon strength and has over 100 Defense. Oh, and if he doesn't want to engage in melee he can always use his armorpiercing 480 damage murdergun.

    P.S: He's also a spellcaster on top of that.

    Fiendishrabbit on
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  • TheGerbilTheGerbil Registered User regular
    Isn't he an anti spellcaster? Like the reason he's insane is he's cut off from the winds of magic?


    Fencingsax
  • IblisIblis Registered User regular
    edited January 15
    Yes.
    One of his campaign goals is to fix his mind. It's a little simple unfortunately, but still. Basically you build a structure that gives you massive debuffs for several turns while you build a following structure that removes his shattered mind effect and gives you back his spellcasting (with no point investment). Basically the whole thing is supposed to be a massive undertaking to unearth a lizardman vault. He particularly gets Lore of the Deeps, and officially becomes fucking bananas (just not, you know, mentally anymore) since he's a very powerful melee and ranged unit on a dragon that can drop potent spells wherever he damn well feels like while still being able to debuff enemy casters.

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  • SpectrumSpectrum Super High-School Level ??? Hope's Peak AcademyRegistered User regular
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    Tao Qian is a diligent and sincere governor with an eye for those who have the true interests of the people at heart. Having thwarted an invasion from Cao Cao with help from Liu Bei, the two began a friendship that would influence Liu Bei’s own style of governance.

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  • That_GuyThat_Guy I don't wanna be that guy Registered User regular
    3 Kingdoms has too damn many characters. It took me 2 Warhammer games just to start learning all those characters. I don't know if my brain can keep track of an even more expansive lore set.

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  • KruiteKruite Registered User regular
    That_Guy wrote: »
    3 Kingdoms has too damn many characters. It took me 2 Warhammer games just to start learning all those characters. I don't know if my brain can keep track of an even more expansive lore set.

    Play some Dynasty Warriors; you'll get a hang of the character sets in time for release :P

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  • GONG-00GONG-00 Registered User regular
    The NES game Destiny of an Emperor was my first toe into the pool that is the Three Kingdoms. Koei's Romance of the Three Kingdoms for PC was my deep dive into that lore.

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  • MassenaMassena Registered User regular
    Kruite wrote: »
    That_Guy wrote: »
    3 Kingdoms has too damn many characters. It took me 2 Warhammer games just to start learning all those characters. I don't know if my brain can keep track of an even more expansive lore set.

    Play some Dynasty Warriors; you'll get a hang of the character sets in time for release :P

    One of the real beautiful things about games is that they help you absorb tons of information in digestible chunks pretty quickly. Took me years to get even a basic understanding of the 3 Kingdoms players. Honestly, Dynasty Warriors was super helpful in learning the people beyond the main players.

    Short version though, I would say there are 4 main "sides" to think about, and most of the "story" revolves around the interactions with those sides (two uniting against one, one betraying the other, some kind of rivalry from within, etc.)

    Liu Bei's faction:
    Liu Bei (kind hearted boss who, imo, always has people making excuses for his failures)
    Guan Su (the guy with the long beard and spear, again imo, kind of a prideful ass, imo, but I approached the material as an adult)
    Zhang Fei (the model for every hard drinking hard charging big hairy character in an asian setting)
    Zhuge Liang (Captain Strategy, who works for Liu Bei because of his virtue, and somehow can never beat Cao Cao's people in the mountains despite being omgGenius according to everyone)

    Cao Cao's faction:
    Cao Cao (ruthless strategist type who is portrayed as power hungrier than most even though they all are and he seems to be pretty efficient about things really)
    The 5 Elite Generals: Yue Jin, Yu Jin, Zhang He, Zhang Liao, and Xu Huang (honestly these guys all kind of blend together a bit for me, but the point is that Cao Cao has great generals)
    Sima Yi (who eventually founds the Jin dynasty)

    The Sun faction:
    Sun Jian is the patriarch, but (traditionally) dies early in an ambush and his son, Sun Ce trades the Imperial Seal found by his father before his death to a rival of Cao Cao's in the north (Yuan Shu) in exchange for troops to found a kingdom in the south. Then he dies and his brother Sun Quan takes over. Makes following the Sun faction tough for me.

    The Usurper faction:
    Dong Zhuo takes over the Imperial city which is what finally throws the whole Han empire into collapse. He's the big bad that everyone usually rises up to fight in these stories.
    Lu Bu is the big bad tough guy general who a wise adviser and his beautiful daughter pits against Dong Zhuo.

    There are obviously a LOT more characters, but if you think about it in those terms: the Usurpers, the Liu Bei faction, the Cao Cao faction, and the Sun faction, you're probably going to have an easier time slotting the other players in around them.


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  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    edited January 17
    One of the interesting things with 3 kingdoms is that its essentially a novel about leadership failures. There's several Great Men with the potential to lead China, only to be undercut by critical errors. The winner ends up not so much being noticeably better than his competitors, but rather a patient guy who plays the long game and avoids mistakes.

    Which is one reason why it's such a good cast for video games, everyone has pretty well defined strengths and weaknesses.

    Kana on
    A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
    MassenaGONG-00ElvenshaeEnclaveofGnomesThe BraysterUrQuanLord88
  • The BraysterThe Brayster UKRegistered User regular
    Speak of Cao Cao, and Cao Cao arrives!



    A decent bit of spy and subterfuge gameplay in action. I already MUCH prefer this to agents in previous total wars.

    Steam: TheBrayster
    PSN: TheBrayster_92
    EnclaveofGnomesCorsiniKruiteFiendishrabbitKanaSpectrumMassena
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