Larry Nassar, USA Gymnastics, and Michigan State : Sports Abuse Scandals

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  • mRahmanimRahmani DetroitRegistered User regular
    I listened to Denhollander's full statement on the way in to work today. Jesus Christ.

    That woman is braver than I will ever be.

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  • AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    Apparently, Geddert threatened Lindsey Lemke after she named him in her statement. This isn't surprising, given the man's history as a tyrant in his gyms, but you'd think he'd be smart enough to realize that he doesn't really have any friends left to cover for him.

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  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    To be filed in the "burn it all down" folder...

    https://deadspin.com/athletic-trainer-who-worked-alongside-larry-nassar-for-1822375797
    Yesterday, 2010 world championships silver medalist Mattie Larson read her victim impact statement at Larry Nassar’s sentencing. Larson related a litany of horrors from her time as a member of the national team—the coaching staff shunning her at the 2010 world championships after she made a mistake, how she harmed herself in order to avoid going to the national team training center, and the years of sexual abuse she was subjected to at the hands of Nassar.

    Larson also mentioned that at times there was a female athletic trainer in the room while she was being sexually abused under the guise of medical treatment, a woman named Debbie Van Horn. Larson noted that this woman still works for USA Gymnastics. Victim 178, who wished to remain anonymous, also invoked Van Horn’s name in her statement that was read in court. She said that Van Horn often would leave the room when gymnasts were being treated or would turn a blind eye to what was happening.

    Last spring, I reached out to USA Gymnastics to request an interview with Van Horn. Nassar mentioned her by name to me when I interviewed him in 2014. Not that I needed him to make me aware of Van Horn’s existence; the fact that they worked together with the gymnasts on the national team was well-known. Nassar also mentioned Van Horn when he posted his “retirement” message to Facebook in September 2015. (He actually been fired by USA Gymnastics and reported to the FBI but had been allowed to say publicly that he was leaving the organization.)

    At the time, USA Gymnastics said I could send questions to Van Horn and they’d see if she would be able to answer them. I sent a fairly lengthy list of question to USA Gymnastics to be directed toward Van Horn. Some of the questions were quite general and not specific to Nassar, things like “What is the most common type of medical treatment performed at the Ranch?” and what kind of medical forms do parents have to sign before their kids go there? I also sent more Nassar-centric questions, such as “Were there any rules regarding girls being alone with members of the medical staff?” and “Do you recall any red flags or suspicious behavior [from Nassar]?” I was told that due to pending litigation, Van Horn would be unable to respond to any of my questions.

    Later in the summer of 2017, I wrote to USA Gymnastics again, asking if Van Horn was still employed by the organization because I couldn’t seem to find her name listed on the website, as it had been previously. I was told by a spokeswoman that she was still employed by USA Gymnastics.

    It seems that this is no longer case. When Larson said that Van Horn was still working, it seems that she might’ve been off by just one day. Van Horn, who had worked for USA Gymnastics since 1988 and whose last job title was “director of sports medicine services,” was no longer with the organization. In an email sent to USA Today, Mark McCreary, the chief administrative officer at USA Gymnastics, wrote: “Effective, January 22, 2018, Debbie Van Horn is no longer employed with USA Gymnastics.

    This news comes on the heels of three members USA Gymnastics’ board of directors resigning and the USOC’s demands that the rest of the board members go, too.

    Sooo US gymnastics continued to employ this woman but removed her name from their website, and didn't fire her until the media firestorm from athlete's testimonies calls her out specifically.

    A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
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  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    Kipling217 wrote: »
    Fairchild wrote: »
    Smurph wrote: »
    I can't believe she's trying to play it off like this was a planned thing. Just days after she and one of her board members said she's not resigning. She should never have been allowed to resign, she should have been publicly shit canned as soon as the news broke that she knew about the Title IX and criminal investigations in 2014.

    If she's fired for cause, that looks real bad in all the lawsuits. MSU is still trying to limit their liability.

    Yes, which also explains her mealy-mouthed statement about "trusting an evil person". Michigan State and perhaps her personally face a deluge of lawsuits.

    Honestly wouldn't firing her for cause limit MSUs liability? You can't really blame MSU if the person responsible for overseeing the rules willfully neglected to enforce them.

    What I am saying is; throw her under the bus and see if she bounces.

    The board endorsed her for leadership, right? I can definitely blame MSU's bureaucracy for going along with what she did, from the looks of it she was given little or no resistance at every step. She's merely a symptom of a larger problem in the institution.

  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Oh right, also Simon gets to keep all her perks. Because of course she does.

    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
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  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    They sent the survivors a god damn form letter

    DUbg8NaWkAAka5q.jpg

    That's Lindsey Lemke's.

    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
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  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    edited January 2018

    motherFUCKER
    Michigan State University, under U.S. Department of Education oversight since 2014 because of its mishandling of sexual assault and gender discrimination cases, asked federal officials last fall to end their monitoring of the university because administrators had been acting in "good faith" and had "gone above and beyond" in meeting standards laid out by federal officials, according to documents obtained by Outside the Lines.

    The Oct. 10 request was rejected outright by federal officials for several reasons, but in large part because of how the university has handled sexual assault allegations against former MSU athletics physician Larry Nassar. The documents obtained by Outside the Lines show:

    Michigan State administrators in 2014 did not notify federal officials that the university had dual Title IX and campus police investigations of Nassar underway even though federal investigators were on campus that year scrutinizing how MSU dealt with sexual assault allegations.

    MSU administrators still have not provided to federal officials all documents related to the Nassar allegations.


    The Department of Education first became involved with Michigan State in 2010, when its Office for Civil Rights offered informal guidance to university administrators as they came under media scrutiny after a female student reported that she had been raped by two Michigan State basketball players. The woman filed a federal complaint about MSU's handling of her case in 2011.

    In 2014, another female student alleged that MSU had mishandled a sexual assault allegation she had made, and she, too, filed a federal complaint. Based upon both complaints, the Office for Civil Rights opened a formal investigation.

    Federal investigators visited the campus and reviewed documents in 2014. That year, a recent MSU graduate reported that Nassar had assaulted her under the guise of medical treatment. MSU campus police and Title IX investigations began. Federal investigators were not told of the allegations at the time, according to the correspondence obtained by Outside the Lines. Nassar was cleared in both investigations.

    Even without knowledge of the Nassar allegations, the Office for Civil Rights investigation into how MSU handled sexual assault and gender discrimination cases ended with findings that MSU had fostered a "sexually hostile environment" on campus. Under terms of a 2015 agreement with the Office for Civil Rights to settle the findings, MSU administrators faced a litany of requirements and continuing federal oversight. One of those requirements mandated that the university provide the Office for Civil Rights notification and documentation of all prior complaints of sexual assault and harassment by a January 2016 deadline.

    The records obtained by Outside the Lines show that MSU did not do so until almost a year later. Among the documents not provided by the deadline: reports made against Nassar.

    On Dec. 14, 2016 -- almost three months after accusations against Nassar had been reported in the media and after MSU had fired him from his position as an associate professor in the College of Osteopathic Medicine -- an attorney from the Michigan State general counsel's office wrote to federal officials and pointed out an "unfortunate oversight": University officials had reviewed everything they had been sending federal investigators and had determined that "we could not locate the [Nassar] file on the list. I do not know how it was missed."

    The attorney, whose name is redacted from the documents obtained by Outside the Lines, apologized and speculated that the missing file could have been the result of a staff transition within the MSU Title IX office.

    So MSU wanted to act like they were just the victim of an evil lone individual, even as they knew perfectly fucking well that they were already being forced into reforms because of their culture of enabling sexual abuse!

    Gosh why does that sound so familiar?
    An IndyStar investigation uncovered multiple examples of children suffering the consequences, including a Georgia case in which a coach preyed on young female athletes for seven years after USA Gymnastics dismissed the first of four warnings about him.

    In a 2013 lawsuit filed by one of that coach’s victims, two former USA Gymnastics officials admitted under oath that the organization routinely dismissed sexual abuse allegations as hearsay unless they came directly from a victim or victim’s parent.

    Legal experts and child advocates expressed alarm about that approach, saying the best practice is to report every allegation to authorities. Laws in every state require people to report suspected child abuse.

    “USAG failed at this,” said Lisa Ganser, whose daughter filed the Georgia lawsuit, which is still being argued. “USA Gymnastics had enough information, I think, to have done something about this. It didn't have to happen to my daughter, and it didn't have to happen to other little girls.
    [...]
    records show the organization compiled complaint dossiers on more than 50 coaches and filed them in a drawer in its executive office in Indianapolis. The contents of those files remain secret, hidden under seal in the case filed by Ganser’s daughter. IndyStar, as part of the USA TODAY Network, filed a motion seeking to make the files public. The judge in that case has not yet ruled.

    But even without access to those files, IndyStar tracked down four cases in which USA Gymnastics was warned of suspected abuse by coaches but did not initiate a report to authorities.

    Those coaches went on, according to police and court records, to abuse at least 14 underage gymnasts after the warnings:
    • USA Gymnastics received a detailed complaint in 2011 about Marvin Sharp, who was named 2010 national Women’s Coach of the Year. It described inappropriate touching of minors and warned that he shouldn’t be around children. Four years later, USA Gymnastics reported Sharp to police — but only after it was confronted with another disturbing allegation about him. This one led to Sharp being accused of touching a gymnast’s vagina, trimming her pubic hair and taking sexually explicit pictures of her beginning when she was 12 years old. Shortly after he was charged in federal court in Indianapolis last year, he killed himself in jail.
    • USA Gymnastics had compiled a thick file of complaints about coach Mark Schiefelbein years before he was charged with molesting a Tennessee girl when she was 10 years old. The girl’s family contacted police in 2002. Schiefelbein penetrated her with his finger multiple times, according to police records. He also videotaped her exposed vagina for what he called “training purposes, so he would know where not to touch her.” The girl’s family was shocked to discover the history of complaints against Schiefelbein, which came to light only after prosecutors subpoenaed records from USA Gymnastics. A jury in Williamson County, Tennessee, convicted him in 2003 of seven counts of aggravated sexual battery and one count of aggravated sexual exploitation of a minor. He is serving a 36-year prison sentence.
    • USA Gymnastics had a sexual misconduct complaint file on James Bell at least five years before his 2003 arrest for molesting three young gymnasts in Rhode Island. It’s unclear what allegations were contained in that file. But IndyStar found prior police reports on Bell in Oregon. In 1990, an underage gymnast told police that Bell had climbed on top of her and told her he wanted to take off her pants. In 1991, a 10-year-old gymnast said Bell stuck his hand inside her shirt and pinched her breast. Bell wasn't charged and continued coaching until his former employer reported him to police in Middletown, Rhode Island. He went on the run in 2004 and wasn’t rearrested until last year. Bell pleaded guilty in December in Newport County, Rhode Island, to three counts of child molestation and is serving eight years in prison.
    • USA Gymnastics received at least four complaints about coach William McCabe as early as 1998. One gym owner warned the organization in 1998 that McCabe “should be locked in a cage before someone is raped.” USA Gymnastics never reported the allegations to police and, according to federal authorities, he began molesting an underage girl in 1999. McCabe continued to coach children for nearly seven more years, until Lisa Ganser went to the FBI with concerns about emails to her then-11-year-old daughter. McCabe was charged with molesting gymnasts, secretly videotaping girls changing clothes and posting their naked pictures on the internet. He pleaded guilty in 2006 in Savannah, Georgia, to federal charges of sexual exploitation of children and making false statements. He is serving a 30-year sentence.

    USA Gymnastics, in response to questions from IndyStar, defended its handling of child abuse complaints. It said it follows reporting laws and is doing enough to protect children.

    Steve Penny, the organization’s president, declined to be interviewed, citing privacy issues of those involved and the ongoing lawsuit in the McCabe case. But he released this statement: “USA Gymnastics has a long and proactive history of developing policy to protect its athletes and will remain diligent in evaluating new and best practices which should be implemented. We recognize our leadership role is important and remain committed to working with the entire gymnastics community and other important partners to promote a safe and fun environment for children.”

    Steve fucking Penny, the dude who told a Nassar abuse victim that "We need to keep this quiet. It's very sensitive. We don't want this to get out." and tried to control the FBI's access to her.

    Fucking burn it all down and throw everyone in jail, fuck all of them.

    Kana on
    A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
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  • MvrckMvrck Registered User regular
    Couldn't even be bothered to write a script to fill in their names. Jesus.

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  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    And now I think I have to take a break from this stuff for a while

    I used to work with kids and I'm hoping to be a teacher eventually and this is too upsetting to keep reading about

    A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Kana wrote: »
    And now I think I have to take a break from this stuff for a while

    I used to work with kids and I'm hoping to be a teacher eventually and this is too upsetting to keep reading about

    More important for mandatory reporters to make sure to read these stories, as far as I'm concerned.

    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
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  • So It GoesSo It Goes We keep moving...Registered User regular
    edited January 2018
    They sent the survivors a god damn form letter

    shitty form letter

    That's Lindsey Lemke's.

    This is just

    There really aren't fucking words for this bullshit

    So It Goes on
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  • Phoenix-DPhoenix-D Registered User regular
    Kana wrote: »
    And now I think I have to take a break from this stuff for a while

    I used to work with kids and I'm hoping to be a teacher eventually and this is too upsetting to keep reading about

    More important for mandatory reporters to make sure to read these stories, as far as I'm concerned.

    That's..not really a helpful comment.Burnout on this sort of thing is real.

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  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Phoenix-D wrote: »
    Kana wrote: »
    And now I think I have to take a break from this stuff for a while

    I used to work with kids and I'm hoping to be a teacher eventually and this is too upsetting to keep reading about

    More important for mandatory reporters to make sure to read these stories, as far as I'm concerned.

    That's..not really a helpful comment.Burnout on this sort of thing is real.

    I am a mandatory reporter, for what it's worth.

    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
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  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    Kana wrote: »
    And now I think I have to take a break from this stuff for a while

    I used to work with kids and I'm hoping to be a teacher eventually and this is too upsetting to keep reading about

    More important for mandatory reporters to make sure to read these stories, as far as I'm concerned.

    ugh, dude
    I've been reading way too much about this. It's really gotten to me, I've cried two or three times this week just reading about it.

    It's not emotionally healthy for me to keep reading this stuff right now, it's affecting me too much and I'm spending too much time reading about it.

    There's times when you have to take a break.

    A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
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  • Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    Every time I think this has hit rock bottom another chasm opens up. Burn it to the ground.

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  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    I'm not sure we've mentioned that to the best of anyone's knowledge, Larry Nassar was not licensed to practice medicine in Texas. Where the Karolyi Ranch was. Where USAG mandated gymnasts receive "treatment" from him.

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  • KanaKana Registered User regular
    edited January 2018
    Oops well I was going to stop reading stuff but then Jake Tapper retweeted this as I was browsing twitter



    US olympic committee had already suggested this, but now they're setting out a timeline that US gymnastics must follow for reform or get nuked.

    Kana on
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  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    USOC at least knows that it needs to look like it's ripping out the corruption root and branch, because they probably knew some of what was going on as well.

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  • SmurphSmurph Registered User regular
    MSU Athletic Director Mark Hollis is resigning:

    https://lansingstatejournal.com/story/sports/college/msu/2018/01/26/michigan-state-athletic-director-mark-hollis-resign-nassar-sexual-assault/1069003001/

    I assume this is due to the cover up article because all of those decisions would have had a lot more to do with his office than Simon's.

  • Jealous DevaJealous Deva Registered User regular
    edited January 2018
    Jebus314 wrote: »
    I'm still super confused by the medical side of this. There are several people, and apparently several associated doctors, who are claiming that there are legitimate medical reasons for Nassar to put his hands inside women's vaginas to help with sore backs/legs/apparently everything.

    He apparently did not do anything correctly in terms of ethics, like wearing gloves, informing patients/guardians what the fuck was going on, having other doctors present to oversee, but still. How in the fuck is this seen as legitimate at all? I played sports and had injuries, and no one ever suggested I rub the inside of my body to help out. Am I crazy or is this like homeopathy levels of BS.

    Just saw this, know it was a few days ago but it never really got addressed.

    Intravaginal pelvic floor therapy via massage is a legitimate thing. However, there are a lot of caveats here. Such work should be done only by someone with appropriate training (which would usually be a physical therapist with post-grad training, not a random doc.). Contact should be limited specifically to areas being targeted for treatment (note pelvic FLOOR is a key word here) which should be discussed with the patient and guardian if a minor beforehand, there should be chaperones present (even with adult patients and female therapists), gloves should be worn at all times, etc. Basically should be treated similarly to any sensitive procedure such as a pelvic, breast or rectal exam. Also it is not generally a first-line procedure nor something with universal application.

    There are muscles there that can have pain and respond to massage or heat treatment, especially in pregnant patients but also in pulled groin muscle type situations. Nothing at all like what was done here though.

    Jealous Deva on
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  • manwiththemachinegunmanwiththemachinegun METAL GEAR?! Registered User regular
    So It Goes wrote: »
    They sent the survivors a god damn form letter

    shitty form letter

    That's Lindsey Lemke's.

    This is just

    There really aren't fucking words for this bullshit

    Is there any avenue for legal prosecution? Because this is bullshit.

  • Doctor DetroitDoctor Detroit Registered User regular
    edited January 2018
    Smurph wrote: »
    MSU Athletic Director Mark Hollis is resigning:

    https://lansingstatejournal.com/story/sports/college/msu/2018/01/26/michigan-state-athletic-director-mark-hollis-resign-nassar-sexual-assault/1069003001/

    I assume this is due to the cover up article because all of those decisions would have had a lot more to do with his office than Simon's.

    Technically, he’s retiring. Because of course he is.

    Doctor Detroit on
  • AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    And here's the gripping shoe dropping:
    But an Outside the Lines investigation has found a pattern of widespread denial, inaction and information suppression of such allegations by officials ranging from campus police to the Spartan athletic department, whose top leader, Mark Hollis, announced his retirement on Friday. The actions go well beyond the highly publicized case of former MSU athletic physician Larry Nassar.

    Over the past three years, MSU has three times fought in court -- unsuccessfully -- to withhold names of athletes in campus police records. The school has also deleted so much information from some incident reports that they were nearly unreadable. In circumstances in which administrators have commissioned internal examinations to review how they have handled certain sexual violence complaints, officials have been selective in releasing information publicly. In one case, a university-hired outside investigator claimed to have not even generated a written report at the conclusion of his work. And attorneys who have represented accusers and the accused agree on this: University officials have not always been transparent, and often put the school's reputation above the need to give fair treatment to those reporting sexual violence and to the alleged perpetrators.

    Even MSU's most-recognizable figures, football coach Mark Dantonio and basketball coach Tom Izzo, have had incidents involving their programs, Outside the Lines has found.

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  • So It GoesSo It Goes We keep moving...Registered User regular
    So It Goes wrote: »
    They sent the survivors a god damn form letter

    shitty form letter

    That's Lindsey Lemke's.

    This is just

    There really aren't fucking words for this bullshit

    Is there any avenue for legal prosecution? Because this is bullshit.

    It will depend on state laws about reporting child abuse most likely, and I'm not versed in those for Michigan, but I hope prosecutors do what they can

    Civil liability is definitely on the table for the school and everyone who neglected to help these girls once they knew about what was going on

    I mean honestly there are so many it's almost feeling like it should be a class action lawsuit

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  • SyphonBlueSyphonBlue Registered User regular
    And here's the gripping shoe dropping:
    But an Outside the Lines investigation has found a pattern of widespread denial, inaction and information suppression of such allegations by officials ranging from campus police to the Spartan athletic department, whose top leader, Mark Hollis, announced his retirement on Friday. The actions go well beyond the highly publicized case of former MSU athletic physician Larry Nassar.

    Over the past three years, MSU has three times fought in court -- unsuccessfully -- to withhold names of athletes in campus police records. The school has also deleted so much information from some incident reports that they were nearly unreadable. In circumstances in which administrators have commissioned internal examinations to review how they have handled certain sexual violence complaints, officials have been selective in releasing information publicly. In one case, a university-hired outside investigator claimed to have not even generated a written report at the conclusion of his work. And attorneys who have represented accusers and the accused agree on this: University officials have not always been transparent, and often put the school's reputation above the need to give fair treatment to those reporting sexual violence and to the alleged perpetrators.

    Even MSU's most-recognizable figures, football coach Mark Dantonio and basketball coach Tom Izzo, have had incidents involving their programs, Outside the Lines has found.

    Yeah Simon definitely didn't have any idea this was going down *jerk off motion*

    And if she really didn't, then holy shit what the hell was she actually doing for eight-hundred-and-fifty-thousand-US-dollars a year? Plus benefits.

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  • Captain InertiaCaptain Inertia Registered User regular
    Here’s what she was doing-
    Saying that it’s impossible to stop a determined predator. And then cultivating the manifestation of that attitude.

    Fucking evil ball sacks, goddamnit

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  • GONG-00GONG-00 Registered User regular
    This catastrophic failure should be Michigan State's own Battle of Leuctra.

    Black lives matter.
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  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    And here's the gripping shoe dropping:
    But an Outside the Lines investigation has found a pattern of widespread denial, inaction and information suppression of such allegations by officials ranging from campus police to the Spartan athletic department, whose top leader, Mark Hollis, announced his retirement on Friday. The actions go well beyond the highly publicized case of former MSU athletic physician Larry Nassar.

    Over the past three years, MSU has three times fought in court -- unsuccessfully -- to withhold names of athletes in campus police records. The school has also deleted so much information from some incident reports that they were nearly unreadable. In circumstances in which administrators have commissioned internal examinations to review how they have handled certain sexual violence complaints, officials have been selective in releasing information publicly. In one case, a university-hired outside investigator claimed to have not even generated a written report at the conclusion of his work. And attorneys who have represented accusers and the accused agree on this: University officials have not always been transparent, and often put the school's reputation above the need to give fair treatment to those reporting sexual violence and to the alleged perpetrators.

    Even MSU's most-recognizable figures, football coach Mark Dantonio and basketball coach Tom Izzo, have had incidents involving their programs, Outside the Lines has found.

    Knew the Payne/Appling case would circle back at some point.

    Anyway, the other thing is that the Lansing State Journal got a hold of both versions of the Title IX report in the Amanda Thomashaw case. She was a Nassar victim. Her version of the report concluded thusly:
    "We cannot find that the conduct was of a sexual nature. Thus, it did not violate the Sexual Harassment Policy. However, we find the claim helpful in that it allows us to examine certain practices at the MSU Sports Medicine Clinic."

    The internal one:
    "We cannot find that the conduct was of a sexual nature. Thus, it did not violate the Sexual Harassment Policy. However, we find the claim helpful in that it brought to light some significant problems that the practice will want to address.

    "We find that whether medically sound or not, the failure to adequately explain procedures such as these invasive, sensitive procedures, is opening the practice up to liability and is exposing patients to unnecessary trauma based on the possibility of perceived inappropriate sexual misconduct. In addition, we find that the failure to obtain consent from patients prior to the procedure is likewise exposing the practice to liability. If procedures can be performed skin-on-skin or over clothes in the breast or pelvic floor area, it would seem patients should have the choice between the two. Having a resident, nurse or someone in the room during a sensitive procedure protects doctors and provides patients with peace of mind. If 'touching is what DO’s do' and that is not commonly known, perhaps the practice will want to consider a disclaimer or information sheet with that information provided to the patient up front.

    Finally, we believe the practice should consider whether its procedure for intake of complaints about physicians’ behavior is adequate. Ms. Thomashow claims she tried to file a complaint with the front desk receptionist, telling her that she was cancelling her appointment because she felt 'violated.' Whether this triggers a reporting protocol should be examined by the practice."

    Lawsuit over. They knew, they knew there was liability they were exposed to, and they did nothing.

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  • So It GoesSo It Goes We keep moving...Registered User regular
    Ha, holy shit.

    Did they think that just wasn't going to come out or?

    Jesus.

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  • Nova_CNova_C I have the need The need for speedRegistered User regular
    Jesus, it's like a John Grisham novel.

    ElvenshaejungleroomxmanwiththemachinegunHarry DresdenGiggles_Funsworth
  • FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    We're never going to find out, but someone inside must have wanted all of this to come out.

    torchlight-sig-80.jpg
  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    edited January 2018
    Michigan AG has called a press conference about MSU. No leak on what that's about yet.

    Also, State has a home game tonight. It's the teal out game at the Breslin, which is going ahead, they're handing t-shirts out at the doors. How they react to Izzo given the OTL report will be interesting.

    enlightenedbum on
    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
    Warren 2020
  • lwt1973lwt1973 King of Thieves SyndicationRegistered User regular
    Michigan AG has called a press conference about MSU. No leak on what that's about yet.

    Also, State has a home game tonight. It's the teal out game at the Breslin, which is going ahead, they're handing t-shirts out at the doors. How they react to Izzo given the OTL report will be interesting.

    He wants to be governor so he has to balance being tough and not ruffling the feathers of the big donors from MSU.

    "He's sulking in his tent like Achilles! It's the Iliad?...from Homer?! READ A BOOK!!" -Handy
  • enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    lwt1973 wrote: »
    Michigan AG has called a press conference about MSU. No leak on what that's about yet.

    Also, State has a home game tonight. It's the teal out game at the Breslin, which is going ahead, they're handing t-shirts out at the doors. How they react to Izzo given the OTL report will be interesting.

    He wants to be governor so he has to balance being tough and not ruffling the feathers of the big donors from MSU.

    One of the GOP bigwigs and major MSU donors said some awful shit this morning.

    Herbert Hoover got 40% of the vote in 1932. Friendly reminder.
    Warren 2020
    Giggles_Funsworth
  • Doctor DetroitDoctor Detroit Registered User regular
    lwt1973 wrote: »
    Michigan AG has called a press conference about MSU. No leak on what that's about yet.

    Also, State has a home game tonight. It's the teal out game at the Breslin, which is going ahead, they're handing t-shirts out at the doors. How they react to Izzo given the OTL report will be interesting.

    He wants to be governor so he has to balance being tough and not ruffling the feathers of the big donors from MSU.

    One of the GOP bigwigs and major MSU donors said some awful shit this morning.

    Basically echoing what Turd Ferguson said the other day.

    At this point, I’m leaning toward nuking East Lansing from orbit. It’s the only way to be sure.

    BlackDragon480
  • LostNinjaLostNinja Registered User regular
    USAG board resigns

    USOC fortunately didn't give them a real choice in the matter, resign, or become irrelevant anyway, but it's still nice to see. Curious as to who all knew at the USOC because there's no way someone didn't with something this wide spread. They need to be found out and exiled as well.


    As for MSU, is there any way to just revoke all of their state funding or better yet just shut them down and allow all of its students to transfer without losing credits or degree progress?

  • Jebus314Jebus314 Registered User regular
    LostNinja wrote: »
    USAG board resigns

    USOC fortunately didn't give them a real choice in the matter, resign, or become irrelevant anyway, but it's still nice to see. Curious as to who all knew at the USOC because there's no way someone didn't with something this wide spread. They need to be found out and exiled as well.


    As for MSU, is there any way to just revoke all of their state funding or better yet just shut them down and allow all of its students to transfer without losing credits or degree progress?

    I know this situation is fucked, but that is completely unnecessary. There is only a handful of people that are even tangentially involved. And there are thousands of people that would be unnecessarily affected by being overly harsh in the punishments.

    "The world is a mess, and I just need to rule it" - Dr Horrible
    jungleroomxGiggles_FunsworthSyphonBlueBullhead
  • SummaryJudgmentSummaryJudgment Today we will paint a mountain that owes us nothing. Registered User regular
    edited January 2018
    Jebus314 wrote: »
    LostNinja wrote: »
    USAG board resigns

    USOC fortunately didn't give them a real choice in the matter, resign, or become irrelevant anyway, but it's still nice to see. Curious as to who all knew at the USOC because there's no way someone didn't with something this wide spread. They need to be found out and exiled as well.


    As for MSU, is there any way to just revoke all of their state funding or better yet just shut them down and allow all of its students to transfer without losing credits or degree progress?

    I know this situation is fucked, but that is completely unnecessary. There is only a handful of people that are even tangentially involved. And there are thousands of people that would be unnecessarily affected by being overly harsh in the punishments.

    MSU alum and East Lansing resident here.

    SummaryJudgment on
    I'm at your feet
    I'm at your command
    Hail holy queen of the sea
    You're whirling in rags
    You're vast and you're sad
  • So It GoesSo It Goes We keep moving...Registered User regular
    Jebus314 wrote: »
    LostNinja wrote: »
    USAG board resigns

    USOC fortunately didn't give them a real choice in the matter, resign, or become irrelevant anyway, but it's still nice to see. Curious as to who all knew at the USOC because there's no way someone didn't with something this wide spread. They need to be found out and exiled as well.


    As for MSU, is there any way to just revoke all of their state funding or better yet just shut them down and allow all of its students to transfer without losing credits or degree progress?

    I know this situation is fucked, but that is completely unnecessary. There is only a handful of people that are even tangentially involved. And there are thousands of people that would be unnecessarily affected by being overly harsh in the punishments.

    MSU alum and East Lansing resident here.

    What do you think should happen?

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