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[Camp Comic] Friday, January 19, 2018 - Why We’re Here

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Posts

  • BrobBrob Registered User regular
    *Lurks and wants crumpets*

    Sarge
  • SabariSabari Registered User regular
    *Lurks with the power of a thousand dark shadows... or a couple of dimly lit rooms... or something like that anyway*

  • CandlewhisperCandlewhisper Registered User regular
    Thanks for linking the patreon.

    Would be happy to throw a chunk of money in a pot as a one-off, but not really keen on the ongoing payment concept.

    Gotta say, much as I love Katie's work, the stated goal seems a little bit unambitious. To want $1500 a month to produce one comic a month is pretty high pay by web-cartoonist standards, isn't it?

  • briguybriguy Registered User regular
    That’s not something I can answer, I believe it was more of a goal in being able to continue multiple comics (Camp W, Skadi, and some other projects) in lieu of taking freelance work and not one single comic (which, unless supplemented with an actual full time job, that’s essentially minimum wage monthly without benefits and a higher tax rate). Patreon is more of a collective crowdsource to independently fund creators. There’s no obligation, you can give once and cancel or support as long as you want for however much you’re comfortable with. It’s a fairly cool system, I support a few artists through it and it lets works that otherwise wouldn’t exist, exist.

    It’s just a system I find neat. I didn’t mean to cause any disruption.

  • Peter RoganPeter Rogan Registered User regular
    Living by art is a fraught process. Always was, always shall be. I begrudge no artist their means to earn a living; God knows it's hard enough singing for your supper. My magazine couldn't afford to pay our artists much, which is why I supported and encouraged their outside efforts, was happy to add to their portfolio and did not begrudge their leaving for greener pastures. It was a privilege to help such talents move on.

  • Smitty86Smitty86 Kelowna, BCRegistered User new member
    Cubicle Gopher approves of this comic in it's entirety. That is all.

  • XastionXastion Registered User regular
    Glancing at Katie’s Patreon it appears the last entry was 10 months ago. Or is that only what they show for non-subscribers?

  • DeyevinDeyevin Registered User regular
    I still can't believe the whole thing with the animatic being rejected. I guessed from the beginning that this was drawn with simple composition, tropes/gags and lore for the explicit intent of animation. If they're still bummed out about that, who can blame 'em?

  • BrobBrob Registered User regular
    *Still lurking* :) I enjoy popping in to see the snowfall in the last panel.

  • SabariSabari Registered User regular
    Does anybody else keep checking back to see if anyone has commented something?

  • briguybriguy Registered User regular
    Sabari wrote: »
    Does anybody else keep checking back to see if anyone has commented something?

    Yes.
    *slinks back into the shadows*

  • StonefootStonefoot Registered User regular
    No, I never check back to check for new comments.

    And I never, ever, ever lie.
    What never?
    No never!
    What never?
    Well hardly ever.
    And he hardly ever, ever lies!

    So, give three cheers and one cheer more for the hearty captain of the....

    Hold on! Hold on! Someone turned two pages and ended up back in H. M. S. Pinafore.... (book by W. S. Gilbert, music by Sir Arthur Sullivan - credit where credit is due)

    ;-}}

    hajen
  • jlbjlb Registered User regular
    Just thought to get back to reading this a few days ago. Started at the beginning. Having a lot of feels about the whole thing.

    I really hope there's more. <3

  • VegalocityVegalocity Registered User new member
    I was just finishing up rereading the series (insofar) and, anyone else notice that Linus' entrance and exit in the series was book-ended(heh) by Seventeen's literacy? The first time they go into the library is when we find out she can't read, and in the chapter where he leaves Malachi begins to teach her.

    Funny how that worked

    hajen
  • jlbjlb Registered User regular
    Does anyone have links to the first comic in each of the backstories that have been told?

  • AIR1013AIR1013 Registered User new member
    "Sabari wrote: »
    Does anybody else keep checking back to see if anyone has commented something?"

    Not like EVERYday. Like Monday through Saturday tops.

  • SargeSarge Registered User regular
    AIR1013 wrote: »
    "Sabari wrote: »
    Does anybody else keep checking back to see if anyone has commented something?"

    Not like EVERYday. Like Monday through Saturday tops.

    That's week.


    .

    .

    .

    .

    .

    .

    .

    .

















    I'll show myself out

  • cmgreenecmgreene Registered User regular
    = )

  • Ilze123Ilze123 Registered User regular
    edited March 15
    I lurk, therefor I am. So where is the kickstarter for volume 2 (bundled with volume 1)?

    Ilze123 on
  • Cabbage JackCabbage Jack Registered User new member
    So I'm about to voice what will probably be an unpopular opinion.

    In the past, absences from the strip were matched with a "hey, we're taking this time off for these reasons." Since you're providing entertainment, that's cool. But this hiatus is different because it's matched with cryptic statements about not being able to sell the comic as a toon, and promises, not even of a comic, but of a post explaining the absence, that go unmet.

    If you were to post "The comic isn't financially viable, so when we realized it would never be monetized as a cartoon, we focused our energies on different things. We may revisit this world we love again, but we did try to give you a really nice wrap-up arc," that's okay, I think everyone would respect that, but the radio silence is starting to border on disrespect of your customers. If you want to say "check back in May/June/2019" I will, because your work is amazing, but just expecting people to check in weekly, but never say anything isn't very nice.

  • BrobBrob Registered User regular
    Cabbage scroll down and you will see that Katie is starting a new job and there will be an update once they figure things out. There's nothing cryptic or nefarious here. If you are feeling upset as a "customer" there are hundreds of comics out there (I personally have 44 I follow). If you feel the creators owe you something I think you're missing the point of webcomics...

    Sarge
  • Peter RoganPeter Rogan Registered User regular
    Hear, hear! BROB, you've stated the problem in a nutshell. We consumers of FREE webcomics are the privileged viewers of new talent getting a start in a much larger world. When they gain traction, and their work finally pays off, they may not have the time to come back to their original work. This is how the game is played, CABBAGE JACK. Take it from somebody who played this game professionally.

    One of the artists published in my magazine is now a successful mural painter -- he can transform your drab wall into a breathtaking visual. Another left our circle to draw bank signs -- you know, the posters they stick in the lobby saying 'Borrow From Us!' or 'Restroom Under Construction - Sorry For The Inconvenience.' They paid quite a good deal more than we could. It was our task to find new (and cheap!) talent and give them a start while getting good (and cheap) work from them, and keep doing that as they seized and went on to new and more lucrative opportunities. Our role here (besides getting the magazine out the door) was as a steppingstone for new, and really good, talent. Once they left us, they did not come back, and that was expected. And we got pretty good at canvassing the local high schools for talent. People who jumped at the opportunity had that other great advantage of ambition, and were willing if not eager to leap from Sixth Period Art to an actual magazine illo they could put in their portfolios (we did not keep the originals, alas). Today, I guess we'd be combing the net looking for artists from wherever, just to give them a shot, a boost, and a mutually-rewarding relationship. And so we helped people like Katie and Adam reach new and bigger audiences, who could pay them what they're worth. That's the way it's SPOZED to work.

    You want to help? Keep looking for more new talents, more webcomics, and subscribe to them or join their Patreon or whatever. Then you, too, can become a supporter of The Arts and help springboard young talent to stardom. Few things are more rewarding than giving a hand up to people the world really should be seeing more of. Camp Weedonwantcha and Skadi are the baby steps of a much more lucrative career. Cherish them for what they are, and cheer them on to better. Believe me, the world needs more Katies and Adams in it. And you can help.

    Sarge
  • Cabbage JackCabbage Jack Registered User new member
    Any art that is used to generate revenue (and I presume they make money from the advertising, merchandising, and other elements) by definition has customers, whether patrons, newspaper readers, or just eyes on the webpage. While it is cool that we get to read this for free, I also read Penny-Arcade for free, Dinosaur Comics, and literally all newspaper comics for free. We're still the customers - the audience they want to reach/develop and the possible/actual revenue stream for future endeavors. Leonardo daVinci had customers - his patrons - and Adam and Katie have customers - the people who read their webcomics.

    Skadi led to Weedonwantcha which will lead to something else. I'm not attacking their career paths, like I said, its completely reasonable that they would focus on different things and if Camp isn't paying the bills, that's cool, if it ended here, its nicely tied up and the exposure on PA for the last few years will doubtless have a positive impact on their careers. However, I don't feel it is too much to expect, as someone who has followed Katie since Skadi, a post on the comic's site saying "Hiatus. Check back on this specific date for an update on where we are going," so I know when to check back and not waste my time. It's just courtesy.

    AdamRW
  • bandizzzlebandizzzle Registered User regular
    I agree with cabbage jack. I had to read through dozens of comments to find out what the hell was going on. Instead of, you know, clicking on the news section designed for those kind of announcements.

  • briguybriguy Registered User regular
    Unfortunately between the illnesses and work, they’ve probably got a little behind on the blogpost. I’m sure it’ll be up soon.

  • MarcinMNMarcinMN Registered User regular
    edited March 16
    Meh, I think we can govern ourselves as far as how often we should check back. I don't need them to say "Come back on this date for news." Most likely they would make such a deadline with no idea if they would have anything to report or not, so when said update arrives it might be nothing but "Life is still crazy busy. We don't know when we'll be back. Sorry."

    If you feel you're wasting your time by checking the site every few days, then just don't check it for a month or two. If the comic starts up again in your absence, it's not like it's hard to get caught up.

    Realistically though, how much time do you really waste even if you check the site every day. All it takes is a few seconds to click/tap on a bookmark and see that it's still the same comic that was there last time you checked. I suppose you could scour the site for news of when they might return, but it looks to me like they used Twitter and such more than their "news" section even before this break. This is why all I usually do is click the bookmark, see the same comic, and then move on to the other comics I follow.

    EDIT: I see that one person said they had to read through dozens of comments to figure out what was going on. I guess I can understand that point of view a little bit. But still, you had a one-time session of reading comments and now you know what's going on. Not everything in life is optimized perfectly to our individual convenience.

    MarcinMN on
  • Peter RoganPeter Rogan Registered User regular
    We don't get to choose when and how success finds us. You toil away at something for years, you get a little recognition, and suddenly you have an offer for a book, or three, a collaboration appears, or, in at least one instance I know of, a curator dream job opens up and absorbs your energy and time completely. Demands on your time shift, often radically. Dylan Meconis ("Bite Me!") has had to set aside her weekly updates to her new tale, "Family Man." Karl Kerschl, creator of "The Abominable Charles Christopher," an amazing work by an undersung talent, has been forced to leave it aside as he pursues work that feeds his family; he's been at this twenty years.

    Frankly, I wouldn't trust the instincts or sensibilities of an artist who abandoned greater rewards and wider recognition to keep updating a webcomic, however entertaining or involving. This is a cradle, not a mansion, and you cannot expect to live in a cradle forever. I do not expect a beloved webcomic, whose creators are busy elsewhere earning more, to continue past that point. It's served its purpose, and lies like the fragments of eggshell in a nest. However pretty the egg was.... this bird has flown.

  • metfanscmetfansc Registered User regular
    Yeah I check in weekly. I get what cabbage is saying I would love more info, but they did say that they are trying to figure things out and will let us know when they have. The fact that they have not posted means they have not figured things out. I follow Katie on Twitter so I really figure that is how I will hear about them restarting, yet I still come check here anyway /shrug

  • SargeSarge Registered User regular
    I kickstartered (is that a word?) Vol. 1 (in hardcover and with the posters and pin and cards) and if there was a Vol. 2 I would seriously consider kickstartering that too. This even though I've already read all the comics up on the website. Why? Because as an artist myself I appreciate good art when i see it.

  • AdamRWAdamRW Registered User regular
    edited March 20
    You are all absolutely right. We haven't been as communicative or clear as we should have been. We honestly didn't mean to be cryptic. It really was just more of a "We don't have it all figured out yet" thing.

    We seriously will do a blog post soon (I personally don't have access to the blog post section of this site. But maybe Katie will let me if I ask nicely...)
    because having to sift through the comments for info is some B.S. that nobody should be forced to do. Even though I think the Camp Weedonwantcha comment section is about as good as it gets on the internet.

    Here are a couple quick tidbits:

    -Yes, the hiatus from the actual Camp comics is going to be long. Like, between-seasons-of-a-TV-show long. And not a network sitcom. Think more like a basic cable show. It sucks for us to take such a long break and we feel crappy if it sucks for you too.

    -Katie will be shutting down her Patreon. Don't pledge to it! The support she's gotten till now has been incredible and we won't ever forget it. This doesn't mean that we won't ever make comics again. It just means that when (WHEN!) we make comics again, we'll fortunately be in a situation where we won't need a Patreon to be able to pay for rent. Anybody who is owed anything from the Patreon will get their rewards (is that what they're called on Patreon?) and hopefully some bonuses for being so cool.

    We do really wish that the Camp show could have happened. We were really excited by the idea of getting to make more stories with these characters, whilst having neat things like health insurance and hot food. It's really hard to make the kind of living that a mid-30s married couple needs from a webcomic alone, so ultimately the focus did need to be moved to more gainful employment. But Katie and I are really happy that when the comic does return, we won't have the thought of it being a cartoon in the back of our minds. It'll just be the comic. The way it was originally intended. We really hope that you all will be there to read it and talk about it with us.

    AdamRW on
    briguySatsumomohajenRILMSCabbage Jack
  • Peter RoganPeter Rogan Registered User regular
    Thanks for the update, Adam. And good luck to you and Katie as you master this art thing. You'll always have us.

    MichaelLChajenAdamRW
  • BrobBrob Registered User regular
    Big thank you for the update and congratz on hot food and insurance, it's the little things amiright? I know that I enjoy getting insight into the lives of the creators of works I love.
    I for one still say that you don't actually owe us anything and shouldn't feel bad for keeping readers hanging. Life happens and sometimes some people get a little overzealous and feel entitled but that's just my 2 cents on the subject. :)
    You two do what you've gotta do and I'll patiently wait here. I've gotten rather good at the patient wait for a webcomic since Jon Rosenberg went on hiatus back in August for family medical reasons. - take care of #1 and we'll be here when you get back. <3

    AdamRW
  • SabariSabari Registered User regular
    *plants self firmly and begins to take root*
    I am now prepared to do the waiting.

    Jokes aside, the update is appreciated and I, for one, totally get the needing to eat food and live indoors thing. Being alive is expensive. Being comfortable and well-fed is even more so.

    AdamRW
  • briguybriguy Registered User regular
    Sorry, I didn’t know she was shutting the Patreon down. Just wanted you guys to get money.
    I’ve survived waiting for cool stuff before, I can survive waiting again.

  • XastionXastion Registered User regular
    I appreciate the update as well. Not all of us follows Twitter (not sure how anyone does and not get angry after two minutes, seems it’s where anger goes to live) and it’s nice to see info.

    And I can always be patient if I know there’s a plan. I don’t think any creator owes anything to their non-paying audience, but we’re a species who relies frequently on communication. When we don’t get it, even if it’s just a couple sentences, we start jumping to conclusions and filling in the blanks. Some people’s conclusions are rationale while others are more fear driven.

    Waiting for the typical time between television seasons is perfectly acceptable and a more welcome scenario than the comic ending. I’m just going to be in the crowd requesting if the hiatus stretches to between seasons like Westworld between seasons that we’re just given an fyi that the hiatus is taking longer before more conclusions are incorrectly drawn.

    It’s a fantastic comic with great characters, stories, and art. It’s a joy to read.

  • Ilze123Ilze123 Registered User regular
    edited March 22
    Thank you for the update.

    I will lurk patiently, quietly, in the corner upon your return.



    Ilze123 on
  • jlbjlb Registered User regular
    Have there been any updates about publishing Volume 2?

  • TrueLinkTrueLink Registered User regular
    Thank you for the update, Adam.

  • XastionXastion Registered User regular
    edited March 24
    No JLB, and truthfully I don’t think there’s any plans - or if there are it hasn’t ever been mentioned. It is one of those things that will eventually happen.

    Xastion on
  • SargeSarge Registered User regular
    ::lurks::

    hajen
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